Still waiting for cantrip to check in, but the reason I think there are two scum on Kill is because he was, ummmm, basically dead weight. It seemed like he was having difficulty keeping up in the thread, would have been suspected throughout the game, and while it was just day 1, there was a nice counterwagon on GJ to pin the blame on.
@Dan
Why did you feel that was a bonus for me if it redirected all actions but killing onto you?
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Still waiting for cantrip to check in, but the reason I think there are two scum on Kill is because he was, ummmm, basically dead weight. It seemed like he was having difficulty keeping up in the thread, would have been suspected throughout the game, and while it was just day 1, there was a nice counterwagon on GJ to pin the blame on.
@Dan
Why did you feel that was a bonus for me if it redirected all actions but killing onto you?
how do you parse this with Tom's assessment of the wagon overnight? super curious
What do you make of Kill's inaccurate comment on vez - that he was "jumping wagons" or something like that?
How about the fact vez soft cc'd a flipped town role? Do you think scum!vez would do that?
I will add that nothing has yet happened with Dan's ability as far as I have been notified.
I don't read a lot into Killma's comment about vez - if they're wolves together it was p obvious at that point that the only play was to crossbus/distance and it wasn't a very strong anti associative comment so I'm pretty comfortable with that.
and yes, the way he cc'd was really shaky. like "there's a part of my role which proves he doesn't exist" and then proceeding to the actual claim which....... does no such thing........ is really wolfy. it's more like he was trying to drive a final nail into GJ's coffin than actually counterclaim from a solving point of view if that makes sense?
I'm inclined to see it the other way. I think the chance that scum!Vezok floats such an odd "counterclaim" to try and get Mikey/GJ lynched is extremely slim. Vezok's been pretty low profile all game; he sticks his neck out to try to push over the last few votes on a town wagon? Vezok's in my townreads.
Echoing the sentiments by the town liking KA’s analysis. This strongly aligns with my current reads.
I THINK SCUMDAN JUST MISREAD SARCASM AND SAW TOWNKAMI MAKE A LOT OF EFFORT THAT SOME TOWNIES RESPONDED POSITIVELY TO AND PRAISED IT.
Top three and bottom three match my reads exactly. Not sure what you're on about.
Bottom three of Kami's being...who, exactly?
I originally felt like Dan was town for making it clear that he had a Day ability, as I think Day abilities are less likely to be on scum (because they're less blockable. I still feel like the way he went about that whole process is more town than scum, even if the lightning rod doesn't include kills. If RE had died, I'd be all over Dan, but I feel like Dan was, in essence, making RE a less viable target. Again, I could see scum!Dan doing that to make it more likely that RE was available for a kill, but if that were the case, why not kill RE? Why go out of his way to highlight "hey I'm targeting a town role. During the Day, none the less"?
I liked The Worst's night posts with Tom. I don't think he's scum unless he's scum with Tom.
I see a few people drive-by shading me, but not asking any questions or giving specifics. No questions, no responses.
Currently at:
Town
RE
Vezok
Dan
Tom
The Worst
Kpaca
Albertino
Kami
Manasi
Scum
Albertino's posts thus far have felt bland and vague. Not a fan.
Kami's interaction analysis feels like "hey, look at me helping" busywork. As Tom mentioned, Kami's conclusions feel pretty shallow.
Manasi's 601, especially, pings me several times. Pats herself on the back for being right about Mikey, celebrates the scumwagon and says she'd have joined if she had the chance, and takes a moment to establish an out for not reading Tom. I still don't like 114, either. 399's vote on Tom feels forced, especially when she barely commented on the Mikey/Vezok drama that was playing out. And then in 463, after quoting a vote by Tom (who she's voting) and saying she doesn't like it, she switches her vote to Vezok, apparently on the strength of liking Mikey's claim over Vezok's claim...when the two weren't in conflict. @Manasi am I reading that vote correctly?
Vote Manasi
Looking forward to hearing something from the kpaca slot.
Haven't read any of D2 yet. But based on Killa's flip and D1 I'm convinced tom is scum and that RE, GJ, and (to a much lesser extent) Cantrip are town.
Also tom despite the scum PM this is excellent Dynne flavor play.
Manasi's 601, especially, pings me several times. Pats herself on the back for being right about Mikey, celebrates the scumwagon and says she'd have joined if she had the chance, and takes a moment to establish an out for not reading Tom. I still don't like 114, either. 399's vote on Tom feels forced, especially when she barely commented on the Mikey/Vezok drama that was playing out. And then in 463, after quoting a vote by Tom (who she's voting) and saying she doesn't like it, she switches her vote to Vezok, apparently on the strength of liking Mikey's claim over Vezok's claim...when the two weren't in conflict. @Manasi am I reading that vote correctly?
I mean, I was right on someone atleast like 4 people were wrong on. FeelsGoodMan. You're basically not allowed to say that's scummy. Sorry kid them's the rules. It was my only super strong day 1 read.
If y'all are reading tom's posts I'm sorry for your misfortune, but I'm not doing it.
You described it as "Mikey/Vezok" drama yet later say that the two weren't in conflict at all. I think one claim was claimed under no sort of pressure to be towny (vezok) and in a kinda weird place whereas Mikey just seemed to claim because of pressure (he was getting wagoned). If one of them is likely to be scum (and other ppl's discussions btwn the two kinda pointed to that anyway), I thought it was going to be vezok.
But ya that's basically how you should be reading that vote. I didn't have a scum read on anyone super strongly at the time so I figured I might as well vote the scummiest claim.
Vezok's claim is more NAI than GJ's was as well. I think a neighborizer is morelikely to be town than essentially somesort of nerfer or w/e.
Did you add the bit about the worst to kinda cover the softclaim in case it stuck out on its own or do you also have some sort of info about them?
I added worst because I actually felt like he made sense as a buddy to Cantrip. Cantrip's casing of him just felt artificial. It reminded me of when Prophylaxis asked me and another player in Arkham Horror what we thought about shadow, and him and shadow were buddies. It just felt like awkward distancing, but mostly on cantrip's part. the worst also had a couple conclusions that felt off too. When I had that team in mind, I chose to track Cantrip over the worst because he was getting way more townread.
So, to play it safe, I'm probably gonna take a closer look at the worst, but yeh
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Albertino: vezok was a major factor in Killmatronix going down. How do you reconcile that with your suspicion on vezok?
were they? how do you figure?
Vezok caught Killma on the "jumping wagons" lie. That started the snowball. Are you saying vezok wasn't a factor there? Tell me how you think the Killma wagon went.
Someone tell me what tom thinks of cantrip because I can't read his posts.
Beginning of the phase, town lean. Purely based on wagon, he thinks Cantrip is least likely to buss.
Read is swayed towards scum later on, after I suggest the possibility of a Cantrip/worst team. Think currently a neutral/lower neutral area.
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OH THAT'S COOL. GUESS I'LL CLAIM MY MECHANICAL INFORMATION TOO...
CANTRIP AND GJ BOTH OPENED CHATS WITH ME LAST NIGHT.
GJ'S YOU CAN ALREADY SEE HOW THAT WORKS. ONLY LASTED A COUPLE HOURS UNTIL HE DIED THOUGH
CANTRIPS HE GOT TO ASK QUESTIONS BUT I COULD ONLY ANSWER YES OR NO. SO I ANSWERED HERE (HE'S "COMRADE QUESTIONS")
SO YES THAT'S A THIRD ROLE THAT ALLOWS EXTRA COMMUNICATION. I'M TOWN AND GJ FLIPPED TOWN, SO...
AND YEAH THAT ALONG WITH THE TRACK RESULTS...
THE THINGS HOLDING ME BACK WERE THE KILLMA VOTE, WHICH WAS FOR SURE "INTENT TO LYNCH" AND... OK SO OVERNIGHT HE ASKED ME ABOUT GJ'S CLAIM ALONG WITH HIS AND MINE AND I'M NOT REALLY SURE WHY HE WOULD ASK THAT IF HE WAS KILLING GJ BUT IT'S MEH
Haven't read any of D2 yet. But based on Killa's flip and D1 I'm convinced tom is scum and that RE, GJ, and (to a much lesser extent) Cantrip are town.
Also tom despite the scum PM this is excellent Dynne flavor play.
GRAPE ARE YOU SCUM AGAIN? BECAUSE THIS IS A TERRIBLE START.
Haven't read any of D2 yet. But based on Killa's flip and D1 I'm convinced tom is scum and that RE, GJ, and (to a much lesser extent) Cantrip are town.
Also tom despite the scum PM this is excellent Dynne flavor play.
GRAPE ARE YOU SCUM AGAIN? BECAUSE THIS IS A TERRIBLE START.
It may or may not be terrible, but I'm town.
Looks like I was wrong about Cantrip. And if he flips something that makes the yes/no chat you described I am likely wrong about you. Did that chat open at the start of the night?
OH THAT'S COOL. GUESS I'LL CLAIM MY MECHANICAL INFORMATION TOO...
CANTRIP AND GJ BOTH OPENED CHATS WITH ME LAST NIGHT.
GJ'S YOU CAN ALREADY SEE HOW THAT WORKS. ONLY LASTED A COUPLE HOURS UNTIL HE DIED THOUGH
CANTRIPS HE GOT TO ASK QUESTIONS BUT I COULD ONLY ANSWER YES OR NO. SO I ANSWERED HERE (HE'S "COMRADE QUESTIONS")
SO YES THAT'S A THIRD ROLE THAT ALLOWS EXTRA COMMUNICATION. I'M TOWN AND GJ FLIPPED TOWN, SO...
AND YEAH THAT ALONG WITH THE TRACK RESULTS...
THE THINGS HOLDING ME BACK WERE THE KILLMA VOTE, WHICH WAS FOR SURE "INTENT TO LYNCH" AND... OK SO OVERNIGHT HE ASKED ME ABOUT GJ'S CLAIM ALONG WITH HIS AND MINE AND I'M NOT REALLY SURE WHY HE WOULD ASK THAT IF HE WAS KILLING GJ BUT IT'S MEH
Were the two chats or just one? Basically, the two were unaware of each other's chats?
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NOT IMMEDIATELY AT THE START BUT, LIKE, WITHIN A REASONABLE AMOUNT OF TIME AFTER START THAT IT WAS PROBABLY JUST WAITING FOR HIM TO CHOOSE/OSI TO START IT. I KNOW I COULD CHOOSE AFTER LYNCH BUT BEFORE FLIP, BUT I JUST PICKED THE WORST AS A QUEUED ACTION FOR KILLMA LYNCH (WOULD HAVE BEEN MANASI IF GJ LYNCH, IF ANYONE IS CURIOUS)
OH THAT'S COOL. GUESS I'LL CLAIM MY MECHANICAL INFORMATION TOO...
CANTRIP AND GJ BOTH OPENED CHATS WITH ME LAST NIGHT.
GJ'S YOU CAN ALREADY SEE HOW THAT WORKS. ONLY LASTED A COUPLE HOURS UNTIL HE DIED THOUGH
CANTRIPS HE GOT TO ASK QUESTIONS BUT I COULD ONLY ANSWER YES OR NO. SO I ANSWERED HERE (HE'S "COMRADE QUESTIONS")
SO YES THAT'S A THIRD ROLE THAT ALLOWS EXTRA COMMUNICATION. I'M TOWN AND GJ FLIPPED TOWN, SO...
AND YEAH THAT ALONG WITH THE TRACK RESULTS...
THE THINGS HOLDING ME BACK WERE THE KILLMA VOTE, WHICH WAS FOR SURE "INTENT TO LYNCH" AND... OK SO OVERNIGHT HE ASKED ME ABOUT GJ'S CLAIM ALONG WITH HIS AND MINE AND I'M NOT REALLY SURE WHY HE WOULD ASK THAT IF HE WAS KILLING GJ BUT IT'S MEH
Were the two chats or just one? Basically, the two were unaware of each other's chats?
SEPARATE CHATS. THEY COULDN'T TALK TO EACH OTHER, AND I COULD ONLY SAY YES OR NO IN CANTRIPS
#2/5/6 I DON'T THINK MOST SCUM THINK THAT WAY. LIKE, I CAN SEE YOUR THINKING THAT THEY WOULDN'T DO THIS BECAUSE THIS THAT. BUT MAN PEOPLE JUST DO STUFF FOR WEIRD REASONS AND YOU'RE TRYING TO NARROW IT TO ONE OVERARCHING "WOULD THEY" AND... THE WORLD JUST DON'T BE LIKE THAT.
IN MY OPINION.
#7 IT WAS INCLUDED BUT OBVIOUSLY I JUST NOW GOT THAT THIRD PIECE OF INFORMATION. DON'T GET ME WRONG IT'S WEIRD. HONESTLY, KNOCKS YOU BOTH DOWN A PEG.
THIS IS ME RESPONDING TO CANTRIP.
#7 WAS ASKING ME IF I HAD CONSIDERED CANTRIPS ROLE IN MY GJ TOWNREAD.
IN RETROSPECT, PRETTY LOL
SEPARATE CHATS. THEY COULDN'T TALK TO EACH OTHER, AND I COULD ONLY SAY YES OR NO IN CANTRIPS
Cool. Okay, then yes, I think this makes it really likely Cantrip is scum. I was a little worried because of the apparent redirector abilities in this game, and tracker is not as efficient as watcher or cop, and theoretically Cantrip could have targeted GJ as town... But if this is his ability, then it makes it more likely that the visit was as a faction kill. And I'm guessing his chat ability may be selected during the day and activated at night (because I was only returned a result that Cantrip visited GJ).
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*****! I don't know if I should read into this but... If the worst mistook your responses to Cantrip in-thread as replies to him, then maybe they aren't scum together? The way he answered it felt pretty unaware of the possibility you were talking to someone else.
Lmao, Idk.
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Lofs of quotewalls I'm not thoroughly reading at this hour, but I figured the odds of preventing you from being rolecopped/blocked/redirected/vanillafied/watched/tracked were worth the odds of you potentially getting boosted or something.
My role was called town booster, so it made me fairly confident that there was no other motivation/improvement type effect. But now Vezok has removed variance and some degree of play from my ability, so perhaps gaming the setup wasn't the most productive line of thought in hindsight. It still seemed like the highest RV play for the town.
Well, I don't know what's going on. Either RE's lying scum (which seems really unlikely both because he's been so town and also because why would he trade 1:1 for me when I haven't even claimed), or I got framed. I did NOT target GJ last night.
Regardless, I'll claim so that I'm not holding anything up. I'm Officer Shrift. I'm a jailer who can also ask 20 questions of the people I jail. I targeted Tom to protect him because I figured he was high on the hit list. I'd love to be able to point to me targeting Tom and be like "see! I couldn't have targeted GJ because I targeted Tom!" but I can't because my targeting is a Day ability. But I promise, I didn't do *anything* last Night other than chat with Tom.
I'll be on for a little bit, but then probably won't be able to post again until tomorrow afternoon. In case I get lynched before then, my reads remain pretty much what they were in 618.
Yeah lol at that claim. Sorry cantrip you got caught.
vote Cantripmancer
@KA: Osie confirmed it was a mod mistake due to similar avatars. I just brought it up in case it wasn't, but now that the situation is resolved the best explanation is that was a mistake.
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Well, I don't know what's going on. Either RE's lying scum (which seems really unlikely both because he's been so town and also because why would he trade 1:1 for me when I haven't even claimed), or I got framed. I did NOT target GJ last night.
Then you are scum, or there exists some kind of redirector role that can force a player to target another player even if the player lacks the ability to visit (which I think only would exist in my insane mind...). I was told specifically that you targeted GJ, and that information is not false.
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Lofs of quotewalls I'm not thoroughly reading at this hour, but I figured the odds of preventing you from being rolecopped/blocked/redirected/vanillafied/watched/tracked were worth the odds of you potentially getting boosted or something.
My role was called town booster, so it made me fairly confident that there was no other motivation/improvement type effect. But now Vezok has removed variance and some degree of play from my ability, so perhaps gaming the setup wasn't the most productive line of thought in hindsight. It still seemed like the highest RV play for the town.
Makes sense, okay.
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*****! I don't know if I should read into this but... If the worst mistook your responses to Cantrip in-thread as replies to him, then maybe they aren't scum together? The way he answered it felt pretty unaware of the possibility you were talking to someone else.
Lmao, Idk.
I THINK I'M GONNA NOT READ INTO THAT TOO MUCH SINCE CANTRIP ASKED THOSE QUESTIONS WHILE I WAS AT WORK AND I RESPONDED IN THE DISCORD QUICKLY AND THEN CLARIFIED IN THREAD HOURS LATER.
I'm a little baffled. I mean, scum have an open invitation to lynch me without ANY chance of repercussion, and reasonable town should be voting me too...but thread dies for 9 hours? I don't want to be lynched, but I don't think there's much of an option. I'm a huge question mark that has to be resolved. Most surprised that Dan didn't vote when he was on.
I'm not buying a framer when we've already seen a scum Hider. With only 3 scum, two of them having fake-info abilities is highly implausible. And there's no way RE is scum here; if Cantrip somehow flips town, that would confirm RE as lying, and they would be the obvious and immediate next lynch; scum doesn't want to 1:1 here.
I need to resolve my ability. No more games: who do we want as an ascetic? I assume RE is not the correct choice, because she's either dying toNight if Cantrip is scum, or getting heavy scrutiny if Cantrip flips town.
I need to resolve my ability. No more games: who do we want as an ascetic? I assume RE is not the correct choice, because she's either dying toNight if Cantrip is scum, or getting heavy scrutiny if Cantrip flips town.
OH IS THE NIGHTKILL NOT EFFECTED BY THE DELAY? WAS WONDERING THAT EARLIER
vote: cantrip
i'm awake, but i have classes and stuff to do ^^
i don't believe RE will die tbh, she could be wrong about her reads and scum could try to bait her lynch by not killing her, i would do it
THIS IS A HAMMER I BELIEVE.
AND LOOKS LIKE A STRAIGHT UP SCUM CLAIM IF CANTRIP WERE TO FLIP TOWN TBH
This is suuuuuper wolfy tho
@Dan
Why did you feel that was a bonus for me if it redirected all actions but killing onto you?
how do you parse this with Tom's assessment of the wagon overnight? super curious
I'm inclined to see it the other way. I think the chance that scum!Vezok floats such an odd "counterclaim" to try and get Mikey/GJ lynched is extremely slim. Vezok's been pretty low profile all game; he sticks his neck out to try to push over the last few votes on a town wagon? Vezok's in my townreads.
Bottom three of Kami's being...who, exactly?
I originally felt like Dan was town for making it clear that he had a Day ability, as I think Day abilities are less likely to be on scum (because they're less blockable. I still feel like the way he went about that whole process is more town than scum, even if the lightning rod doesn't include kills. If RE had died, I'd be all over Dan, but I feel like Dan was, in essence, making RE a less viable target. Again, I could see scum!Dan doing that to make it more likely that RE was available for a kill, but if that were the case, why not kill RE? Why go out of his way to highlight "hey I'm targeting a town role. During the Day, none the less"?
I liked The Worst's night posts with Tom. I don't think he's scum unless he's scum with Tom.
I see a few people drive-by shading me, but not asking any questions or giving specifics. No questions, no responses.
Currently at:
Town
RE
Vezok
Dan
Tom
The Worst
Kpaca
Albertino
Kami
Manasi
Scum
Albertino's posts thus far have felt bland and vague. Not a fan.
Kami's interaction analysis feels like "hey, look at me helping" busywork. As Tom mentioned, Kami's conclusions feel pretty shallow.
Manasi's 601, especially, pings me several times. Pats herself on the back for being right about Mikey, celebrates the scumwagon and says she'd have joined if she had the chance, and takes a moment to establish an out for not reading Tom. I still don't like 114, either. 399's vote on Tom feels forced, especially when she barely commented on the Mikey/Vezok drama that was playing out. And then in 463, after quoting a vote by Tom (who she's voting) and saying she doesn't like it, she switches her vote to Vezok, apparently on the strength of liking Mikey's claim over Vezok's claim...when the two weren't in conflict. @Manasi am I reading that vote correctly?
Vote Manasi
Looking forward to hearing something from the kpaca slot.
Do NOT discuss the circumstances around this replacement.
Also tom despite the scum PM this is excellent Dynne flavor play.
I mean, I was right on someone atleast like 4 people were wrong on. FeelsGoodMan. You're basically not allowed to say that's scummy. Sorry kid them's the rules. It was my only super strong day 1 read.
If y'all are reading tom's posts I'm sorry for your misfortune, but I'm not doing it.
You described it as "Mikey/Vezok" drama yet later say that the two weren't in conflict at all. I think one claim was claimed under no sort of pressure to be towny (vezok) and in a kinda weird place whereas Mikey just seemed to claim because of pressure (he was getting wagoned). If one of them is likely to be scum (and other ppl's discussions btwn the two kinda pointed to that anyway), I thought it was going to be vezok.
But ya that's basically how you should be reading that vote. I didn't have a scum read on anyone super strongly at the time so I figured I might as well vote the scummiest claim.
Vezok's claim is more NAI than GJ's was as well. I think a neighborizer is morelikely to be town than essentially somesort of nerfer or w/e.
Not really. Don't really feel like voting this early.
So. What now?
POG CHAMP
POGCHAMP
P O G C H A M P
w ooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo w
So, to play it safe, I'm probably gonna take a closer look at the worst, but yeh
Read is swayed towards scum later on, after I suggest the possibility of a Cantrip/worst team. Think currently a neutral/lower neutral area.
CANTRIP AND GJ BOTH OPENED CHATS WITH ME LAST NIGHT.
GJ'S YOU CAN ALREADY SEE HOW THAT WORKS. ONLY LASTED A COUPLE HOURS UNTIL HE DIED THOUGH
CANTRIPS HE GOT TO ASK QUESTIONS BUT I COULD ONLY ANSWER YES OR NO. SO I ANSWERED HERE (HE'S "COMRADE QUESTIONS")
SO YES THAT'S A THIRD ROLE THAT ALLOWS EXTRA COMMUNICATION. I'M TOWN AND GJ FLIPPED TOWN, SO...
AND YEAH THAT ALONG WITH THE TRACK RESULTS...
THE THINGS HOLDING ME BACK WERE THE KILLMA VOTE, WHICH WAS FOR SURE "INTENT TO LYNCH" AND... OK SO OVERNIGHT HE ASKED ME ABOUT GJ'S CLAIM ALONG WITH HIS AND MINE AND I'M NOT REALLY SURE WHY HE WOULD ASK THAT IF HE WAS KILLING GJ BUT IT'S MEH
It may or may not be terrible, but I'm town.
Looks like I was wrong about Cantrip. And if he flips something that makes the yes/no chat you described I am likely wrong about you. Did that chat open at the start of the night?
#7 WAS ASKING ME IF I HAD CONSIDERED CANTRIPS ROLE IN MY GJ TOWNREAD.
IN RETROSPECT, PRETTY LOL
Vote: Cantrip
Lmao, Idk.
My role was called town booster, so it made me fairly confident that there was no other motivation/improvement type effect. But now Vezok has removed variance and some degree of play from my ability, so perhaps gaming the setup wasn't the most productive line of thought in hindsight. It still seemed like the highest RV play for the town.
Regardless, I'll claim so that I'm not holding anything up. I'm Officer Shrift. I'm a jailer who can also ask 20 questions of the people I jail. I targeted Tom to protect him because I figured he was high on the hit list. I'd love to be able to point to me targeting Tom and be like "see! I couldn't have targeted GJ because I targeted Tom!" but I can't because my targeting is a Day ability. But I promise, I didn't do *anything* last Night other than chat with Tom.
I'll be on for a little bit, but then probably won't be able to post again until tomorrow afternoon. In case I get lynched before then, my reads remain pretty much what they were in 618.
Do not discuss the circumstances around this replacement.
vote Cantripmancer
@KA: Osie confirmed it was a mod mistake due to similar avatars. I just brought it up in case it wasn't, but now that the situation is resolved the best explanation is that was a mistake.
Thanks to DNC at Heroes of the plane studios for this awesome sig and SGT_Chubbz for the awesome avy.
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IT'S NOT A TERRIBLE THOUGHT BUT IT'S MEH.
GUESS I'LL LEAVE THIS HERE
VOTE: CANTRIP
@Dan: Why no vote?
@Cantrip: Can you at least leave us a legacy of your reads and ideas? You're making it awfully hard to even entertain the idea that you aren't scum.
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You got replaced dude.
Thanks to DNC at Heroes of the plane studios for this awesome sig and SGT_Chubbz for the awesome avy.
Check out the Shop Thread
vote Cantrip
(all these years and we never got the dodgy emoji)
AND LOOKS LIKE A STRAIGHT UP SCUM CLAIM IF CANTRIP WERE TO FLIP TOWN TBH
But Albertino had to go and not read the thread, so that's dandy. Not like my ability does that much when it's public knowledge, but still.