I've seen a few posts saying that Shadow's reads don't seem to be solid? But I'm not seeing that at all from the pages I have read. Shadow's push on Roz feels like he is genuinely frustrated with her, he seems like he is annoyed people are giving Roz a pass for what isn't outside of Roz's wolf range. Post #1002 and Post #1020 demonstrate this attitude. And I can see where Shadow is coming from - I don't think this sort of "i'm not claiming, why would I bring attention to myself" attitude has to be town, and Roz's posts do look like grandstanding. I'm not convinced Roz is scum, but I do think that Shadow's insistence there makes sense since he already scumread her - and nothing she's posted should really be enough to change that.
I also like Shadow's aggressiveness in other areas. Post #1007 with the supporting for vig to shoot Nancy. Gemma has been dancing around her Shadow read for a while, and I don't think Shadow as scum just blatantly tries to sheep her on the Nancy thing - there's pocketing, and then there's... whatever that would be. Another thing: ##Post 1044 , again showing his annoyance at people avoiding Roz, but he's annoyed at Gemma most of all. This is consistent with how Gemma has been the player he's interacted with the most (from what I've read at least). I think if Shadow was scum, he'd be handling Gemma differently. (See Post #147 as well which Gemma previously highlighted - I think Gemma is town, and I think she has the correct read on how Shadow would handle her if he's scum)
I've also noticed that Shadow seems to have a wolfread on Wisp, which I like. See Post #924, I think this shows a realistic worry about Wisp - not trying to subtly shade him or push him as a mislynch, but Shadow is actually wary of him. (Also evidenced by this post lol) I'm wary of Wisp as well, so I understand this, and think Shadow's reads make sense.
Ultimately, I don't think Shadow's pushes anywhere feel like an agenda. I think he really is annoyed at Roz, really is trying to win over Gemma because they are both town, and is pursuing real scumreads.
I do agree that what Roz is doing right now isn't outside of scum range. I don't know Roz, but I just don't think it's a good read to say "Oh, scum wouldn't play like this"
Yes, Roz refused to claim, and played the "I wouldn't draw attention like this as scum" angle, but... eh. I've been in the situation of being a townie playing so weird that I couldn't possibly be scum, and, well, I don't think Roz is in that range? I've ISO'd Roz and even though I don't really know why Roz got votes, her play doesn't seem that outlandish. The only weird thing was the refusal to claim, but I don't think that's enough to justify a "I've drawn so much attention that I never would as scum" stance. Post #981 lacks conviction to me. I think if a townie really believes they're playing so attention-grabby they couldn't be scum, they'd be a lot more... uh... "crazy" about it? They'd be more incredulous, not able to believe it, etc. Roz sounds more... dismissive.
Also I am not understanding why Roz first said that claiming would make their role pointless (Post #1024) and then says in post #1083 that no one would miss it...?
I think townies absolutely can play like Roz does here. But I wouldn't townread for it.
I was gonna say that I'd vote Roz over Shadow, but it appears there's some other wagons coming up (CFD?) and I honestly have not read enough from Rhand or Nancy to have any idea there, so I'll try to do that now.
I am not voting wheat today, I am not voting roz, I want shadow dead, and I will compromise for nancy
Last, you’re basically saying you will force a no lynch if you don’t get your way. Stop. I’m town, we don’t have enough for Nancy. If you actively let a no lynch occur, I will take that as a scum claim.
I'm currently still for Wheat, willing to jump to Rhand. MAYBE shadow. His posts near EOD have been feeling off to me. Might consider Lissa? Probably not though.
KoolKoal: Feel free to take this with a grain of salt since self meta isn't particularly helpful, but I think I get scumread mostly for style over substance, but also for a certain lack of substance over style. It's not so much what I AM posting most of the time (though sometimes that can seem bad) but what I'm NOT posting. I've been told I come to non-obvious conclusions a lot, so when I post, quite a bit of the time there's jumps in logic that people can't follow and they think that's scummy. I get that accusation about a lot of questions I ask specifically. People call them "busy work" when the questions are legit etc.
As far as things to ignore, I can't think of anything. I would suggest you focus less on what I'm doing and more on how I'm doing it. That's probably more likely to be accurate. Like I've just said, what I do tends to come off a little weird, but if you look for how I do it, mindset comes into play and maybe you figure out something useful.
I find Wisp's stances on Roz over the last few pages to be really weird. Wisp is basically townreading Roz (which I noticed Roz claims is without any clear reasons), but keeps finding ways to shade her anyway.
I also just think Wisp more than anyone else has been coasting through this EoD period and doesn't seem as invested as the rest? He seems to default to wanting to lynch Shadow, but also has this list of people he's okay lynching, and I'm not seeing any real effort to sort that list more efficiently than just "Lynch Shadow but the others are fine". Like he suggests (jokingly?) to CFD Vaimes here. Then here it seems like Wheat is his next best choice? And just now he's gone on Nancy. I'm really not getting it, and overall I've had the sense he has just been around throwing around comments but he doesn't have the same level of either investment (aka townie with conviction) or confusedness (aka lost townie) as the rest.
Also, and I know this is silly, but Wisp has Reg and Shadow as his top two scumreads, and I think Shadow is town, and I've been seeing Reg's posts as I read back and I honestly think they seem really towny, so I'm just not a fan at all of the directions he is pushing.
And this is what gives me a reason to trust Roz, because Roz seems to suspect Wisp too for reasons that read to me as making total sense, even though she doesn't believe he's scum ultimately, she has the same doubts. I haven't read, but it sounds like Wisp gave Roz the townread too easily and is now sticking with it? Wisp's defense of Roz and push on Shadow feel like the only real strong reads he has.
So if I had to pick a vote today, that would be it. I understand that CFD isn't a thing and if it's between Roz/Shadow, I will vote Roz. I'll look at Rhand now. Sorry, wish I could do more to help.
KoolKoal: Feel free to take this with a grain of salt since self meta isn't particularly helpful, but I think I get scumread mostly for style over substance, but also for a certain lack of substance over style. It's not so much what I AM posting most of the time (though sometimes that can seem bad) but what I'm NOT posting. I've been told I come to non-obvious conclusions a lot, so when I post, quite a bit of the time there's jumps in logic that people can't follow and they think that's scummy. I get that accusation about a lot of questions I ask specifically. People call them "busy work" when the questions are legit etc.
As far as things to ignore, I can't think of anything. I would suggest you focus less on what I'm doing and more on how I'm doing it. That's probably more likely to be accurate. Like I've just said, what I do tends to come off a little weird, but if you look for how I do it, mindset comes into play and maybe you figure out something useful.
I really want a Shadow claim, but somehiw his wagon keeps dissipating. I am not lynching him without claim.
I have no idea what to think about Wheat anymore, but am not opposed to his lynch. With claim.
The only lynch Imcan support without claim, amd given the time that’s what we will end up doing, is Roz.
Not much else I can do but the only other read I can give from what I've read is that I think Gemma is town. So many posts, they all make sense, lots of process and doubt shown, etc. It's all good stuff, and I love her conviction about her townreads, I love that she came around on Reg being town (which I know is correct, though I know others don't) when it was totally possible for her to scumread him for activity. (Literally, she had that door wide open - hedging on him all day, but she closed it when she didn't need to) and her process on Shadow (who I also townread) makes total sense.
I think Wheat is town too, and I'm slightly townreading Vaimes because he made a few posts I like.
Ur haven't read enough into to understand why I do the things I do Dels... And I want Roz to claim because that's what he should do, because that's how people here play, do I particularly care for it? No
Also go look at my leanlist a couple pages back, to see where I stand
I think we're down to roz, shadow, and rhand. All votes off those wagons should move onto those wagons.
Worst case, I'll help vote roz so that we have A lynch but it's a mistake
that is totally fine, I understand that I have a) no foundation to make a good read and b) no time for it, just feel its my job to give my authentic reads when I can.
i swear there was one other post where he shaded roz despite townreading her, but i didn't save it and couldn't find it and i didn't wanna waste time finding it
That also means lynchimg without a claim
this isn't really a response to the push portion (my answer to that is: generally not that simple ime)
but doesn't nancy being not around actually change nothing. threshold 1 less, 1 less vote available
I've seen a few posts saying that Shadow's reads don't seem to be solid? But I'm not seeing that at all from the pages I have read. Shadow's push on Roz feels like he is genuinely frustrated with her, he seems like he is annoyed people are giving Roz a pass for what isn't outside of Roz's wolf range. Post #1002 and Post #1020 demonstrate this attitude. And I can see where Shadow is coming from - I don't think this sort of "i'm not claiming, why would I bring attention to myself" attitude has to be town, and Roz's posts do look like grandstanding. I'm not convinced Roz is scum, but I do think that Shadow's insistence there makes sense since he already scumread her - and nothing she's posted should really be enough to change that.
I also like Shadow's aggressiveness in other areas. Post #1007 with the supporting for vig to shoot Nancy. Gemma has been dancing around her Shadow read for a while, and I don't think Shadow as scum just blatantly tries to sheep her on the Nancy thing - there's pocketing, and then there's... whatever that would be. Another thing: ##Post 1044 , again showing his annoyance at people avoiding Roz, but he's annoyed at Gemma most of all. This is consistent with how Gemma has been the player he's interacted with the most (from what I've read at least). I think if Shadow was scum, he'd be handling Gemma differently. (See Post #147 as well which Gemma previously highlighted - I think Gemma is town, and I think she has the correct read on how Shadow would handle her if he's scum)
I've also noticed that Shadow seems to have a wolfread on Wisp, which I like. See Post #924, I think this shows a realistic worry about Wisp - not trying to subtly shade him or push him as a mislynch, but Shadow is actually wary of him. (Also evidenced by this post lol) I'm wary of Wisp as well, so I understand this, and think Shadow's reads make sense.
Ultimately, I don't think Shadow's pushes anywhere feel like an agenda. I think he really is annoyed at Roz, really is trying to win over Gemma because they are both town, and is pursuing real scumreads.
As of now, I would not vote Shadow today.
Rhand would be bad
vote eevee
if there's no majority at deadline, a new majority threshold is calculated that excludes people not voting
While I didn't develop a nancy read my teammate who is good at reading nancy developed a strong town read. No interest in lynching nancy.
I don’t know what to think anymore :/
I think Roz is still a lynch I’d like to see, and it’s better than this floundering leading to a no lynch.
vote Roz
Can someone remind me who wheats team is
vote Roz
I feel completely clueless
Also yeah, roz disappeared again, but that doesn't change the math to me. Still town.
Yes, Roz refused to claim, and played the "I wouldn't draw attention like this as scum" angle, but... eh. I've been in the situation of being a townie playing so weird that I couldn't possibly be scum, and, well, I don't think Roz is in that range? I've ISO'd Roz and even though I don't really know why Roz got votes, her play doesn't seem that outlandish. The only weird thing was the refusal to claim, but I don't think that's enough to justify a "I've drawn so much attention that I never would as scum" stance. Post #981 lacks conviction to me. I think if a townie really believes they're playing so attention-grabby they couldn't be scum, they'd be a lot more... uh... "crazy" about it? They'd be more incredulous, not able to believe it, etc. Roz sounds more... dismissive.
Also I am not understanding why Roz first said that claiming would make their role pointless (Post #1024) and then says in post #1083 that no one would miss it...?
I think townies absolutely can play like Roz does here. But I wouldn't townread for it.
I was gonna say that I'd vote Roz over Shadow, but it appears there's some other wagons coming up (CFD?) and I honestly have not read enough from Rhand or Nancy to have any idea there, so I'll try to do that now.
meh
I'm almost sure Last is town though.
I find Wisp's stances on Roz over the last few pages to be really weird. Wisp is basically townreading Roz (which I noticed Roz claims is without any clear reasons), but keeps finding ways to shade her anyway.
Wisp wants Roz to claim, even though he townreads her, but his followup posts indicate he still... doesn't think Roz is scum.
I also just think Wisp more than anyone else has been coasting through this EoD period and doesn't seem as invested as the rest? He seems to default to wanting to lynch Shadow, but also has this list of people he's okay lynching, and I'm not seeing any real effort to sort that list more efficiently than just "Lynch Shadow but the others are fine". Like he suggests (jokingly?) to CFD Vaimes here. Then here it seems like Wheat is his next best choice? And just now he's gone on Nancy. I'm really not getting it, and overall I've had the sense he has just been around throwing around comments but he doesn't have the same level of either investment (aka townie with conviction) or confusedness (aka lost townie) as the rest.
Also, and I know this is silly, but Wisp has Reg and Shadow as his top two scumreads, and I think Shadow is town, and I've been seeing Reg's posts as I read back and I honestly think they seem really towny, so I'm just not a fan at all of the directions he is pushing.
And this is what gives me a reason to trust Roz, because Roz seems to suspect Wisp too for reasons that read to me as making total sense, even though she doesn't believe he's scum ultimately, she has the same doubts. I haven't read, but it sounds like Wisp gave Roz the townread too easily and is now sticking with it? Wisp's defense of Roz and push on Shadow feel like the only real strong reads he has.
So if I had to pick a vote today, that would be it. I understand that CFD isn't a thing and if it's between Roz/Shadow, I will vote Roz. I'll look at Rhand now. Sorry, wish I could do more to help.
Unvote, vote Rhand
However lw isn't happening.
I think we're down to roz, shadow, and rhand. All votes off those wagons should move onto those wagons.
Worst case, I'll help vote roz so that we have A lynch but it's a mistake
I have no idea what to think about Wheat anymore, but am not opposed to his lynch. With claim.
The only lynch Imcan support without claim, amd given the time that’s what we will end up doing, is Roz.
I think Wheat is town too, and I'm slightly townreading Vaimes because he made a few posts I like.
No reads on anyone else.
Off to ISO Rhand and/or follow in realtime.
needs to just be exactly Vote: Name or Vote Name in bold
Also go look at my leanlist a couple pages back, to see where I stand
that is totally fine, I understand that I have a) no foundation to make a good read and b) no time for it, just feel its my job to give my authentic reads when I can.
ok now i'm really off to look at rhand
i do think this is a bit weird, though
I thinkkk I’d rather kill Rhand and let the roz thing work itself out.
Unvote, vote Rhand
Earlier one was invalid
i swear there was one other post where he shaded roz despite townreading her, but i didn't save it and couldn't find it and i didn't wanna waste time finding it
vote dels
Read his post about LW to know why.
A dels lynch is like, not even close to feasible. I hope you’re just scum.
No. I wasn’t a wagon either since you started saying this. You made me into a thing with that.
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I actually still want the Reg slot dead, but replacement courtesy and junk. Plus I want to get Del’s take on the game as a whole come D2.