@Last: Can you please use the quote function properly? The tags get lost when you quote one of your posts formatted the way it is and we can't click on the link to go directly to the post you are referring to.
Honestly, I just don’t want to RE to focus on me, she is good at catching scum imo, and by causing her to focus on me, I am doing exactly what I said I didn’t want to do in my earlier post…
Also her meta read on me is wrong, so meh
I'm not even reading you on meta... You're neutral. I like it when I can strongly read you as town because that means you're town (this is the only part where meta comes in), but if you're neutral, it's going to be very hard for me to get anywhere with you.
It was a simple suggestion, you're right. But it was also clearly one that Vezok truly believed in. This was obvious from his posts.
Suggests Cyan and vez are unaligned (not S/S, I suspect S/T), to me. Cyan also attacked Togs for attacking vez, I don't understand the strong defense of vez here.
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@Last: Can you please use the quote function properly? The tags get lost when you quote one of your posts formatted the way it is and we can't click on the link to go directly to the post you are referring to.
is there a rule saying I cant quote this way? if not then I will quote as I plz... and if the parent quote is of enough importance, then why not take the time to find it, this thread isnt moving at a pace that makes it hard to find them at this moment..
quoting large posts, is irritating, grape fruits post was large so I broke it up...
It was a simple suggestion, you're right. But it was also clearly one that Vezok truly believed in. This was obvious from his posts.
Suggests Cyan and vez are unaligned (not S/S, I suspect S/T), to me. Cyan also attacked Togs for attacking vez, I don't understand the strong defense of vez here.
Cyan has played a lot of games with me and probably knows my meta better than anyone here. It's true that he townread me in Prison Block mafia where I was scum, but that was because I specifically tried to buddy up to him all game.
Cyan appears to have read parts of the thread, which means he is almost surely town. He would've probably replaced out by now if he was scum.
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RE
Good, I'd rather be neutral than anything else right now, but I still don't know how you can say that meta isn't a strong point in your argument towards me...
Whats your opinion on Vez
Everyone
I as well would like your opinions on Cyan... his posts seem too out of touch with the game, and the ones he chooses to focus on are even worse
@Last: why are you answering a question directed to Iso? And then make conclusions about me that have nothing to do with what i wrote?
no idea, probably got lost in my quotes, can you point me to where I did this? That post got mangled somewhere, and I had a hard time rebuilding it, which is why I removed a lot of the quotes, and just bolded the particular statements I wanted to answer
Vez Cyan appears to have read parts of the thread, which means he is almost surely town. He would've probably replaced out by now if he was scum. wot...
It was a simple suggestion, you're right. But it was also clearly one that Vezok truly believed in. This was obvious from his posts.
Suggests Cyan and vez are unaligned (not S/S, I suspect S/T), to me. Cyan also attacked Togs for attacking vez, I don't understand the strong defense of vez here.
Cyan has played a lot of games with me and probably knows my meta better than anyone here. It's true that he townread me in Prison Block mafia where I was scum, but that was because I specifically tried to buddy up to him all game.
Cyan appears to have read parts of the thread, which means he is almost surely town. He would've probably replaced out by now if he was scum.
That kind of changes things. I find the last part hard to believe, but also not something you'd directly lie about. Hmmmmmmmmmmmmm.
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scum = Shadow/Grape/Wuffles? there should be a lurker in the mix, maybe Cyan
I expressed minor suspicion of him so of course he includes me.
This is like textbook basic scum play. Unvote, Vote Last
lmao... And this is a text book omgus vote, sit down plz...
I had even't read your last couple of posts when I made this statement. But all it really does is reinforce my point. You saw that people were unsure of me and jumped on it as an opportunity to get rid of someone that had expressed suspicion toward you. That is scum play(bad scum play, but what can you do), through and through.
scum = Shadow/Grape/Wuffles? there should be a lurker in the mix, maybe Cyan
I expressed minor suspicion of him so of course he includes me.
This is like textbook basic scum play. Unvote, Vote Last
lmao... And this is a text book omgus vote, sit down plz...
I had even't read your last couple of posts when I made this statement. But all it really does is reinforce my point. You saw that people were unsure of me and jumped on it as an opportunity to get rid of someone that had expressed suspicion toward you. That is scum play(bad scum play, but what can you do), through and through.
I don't need any reinsurance of my votes, I vote where I want, when I want...
scum = Shadow/Grape/Wuffles? there should be a lurker in the mix, maybe Cyan
I expressed minor suspicion of him so of course he includes me.
This is like textbook basic scum play. Unvote, Vote Last
lmao... And this is a text book omgus vote, sit down plz...
I had even't read your last couple of posts when I made this statement. But all it really does is reinforce my point. You saw that people were unsure of me and jumped on it as an opportunity to get rid of someone that had expressed suspicion toward you. That is scum play(bad scum play, but what can you do), through and through.
I don't need any reinsurance of my votes, I vote where I want, when I want...
Goddamnit why can I never get this to show properly on this site ugh.
@Last: Can you please use the quote function properly? The tags get lost when you quote one of your posts formatted the way it is and we can't click on the link to go directly to the post you are referring to.
is there a rule saying I cant quote this way? if not then I will quote as I plz... and if the parent quote is of enough importance, then why not take the time to find it, this thread isnt moving at a pace that makes it hard to find them at this moment..
quoting large posts, is irritating, grape fruits post was large so I broke it up...
There's no rules, but it makes it harder for everyone else. Are you trying to be difficult?
scum = Shadow/Grape/Wuffles? there should be a lurker in the mix, maybe Cyan
I expressed minor suspicion of him so of course he includes me.
This is like textbook basic scum play. Unvote, Vote Last
lmao... And this is a text book omgus vote, sit down plz...
I had even't read your last couple of posts when I made this statement. But all it really does is reinforce my point. You saw that people were unsure of me and jumped on it as an opportunity to get rid of someone that had expressed suspicion toward you. That is scum play(bad scum play, but what can you do), through and through.
I don't need any reinsurance of my votes, I vote where I want, when I want...
Dawn called it. seen 2 scumgames from him by now to get an idea. but, he's not budging so there's not much I can do about it.
Remind you of anyone :P? I mean I did it in Penta’s game, and I did end up being horribly wrong, but I also changed my reads so many times that game… scum = Shadow/Grape/Wuffles? there should be a lurker in the mix, maybe Cyan
Idk about Wuffles, but I can agree with Shadow/Grape, and Cyan has been making some weird posts as of late
Town Iso doesn't say "no u", while it's almost a catchphrase for scum Iso.
I almost want to believe that you can play this badly as town.
Almost.
-
Unrelatedly, what in the hell is going on in this thread? Why are people voting tom? Why are people voting LW? Just, what?
I do not want to be a part of this trainwreck.
As bad as his posts may be, I am more inclined to believe that its just bad town play
Honestly don’t know why people are voting me or even Tom (I feel like if I read to into his posts then I will just tunnel onto him, because his posts can be frustrating at times), but I do want to know why you believe with out a doubt that I am town, meta wise I am nothing like I was in ZE, so what exactly do you see?
Rhand Last: answer my question please
I mean with sufficient enough reason sure? But like when has differences in opinions mean someone is scummy? I just vote whoever anyways, you telling me my vote is *****, wont make me believe my vote is any less *****
Why would a game with a bad D1 lynch automatically become a trainwreck?
I mean doesn’t this question already answer itself? I mean 90% D1 lynches are mislynches, but if someone thinks the lynch is going towards a mislynch, should they not speak their mind, regardless if you think it means nothing? And this almost seems you are ok with lynching solely for information… tsk tsk
So, Grape. I am continuing to stare at your argument and it still doesn't make much sense.
So, I claim that I believe Last is town due to his tone being casual and relaxed or whatever. I'm gonna ignore the part of my argument that he was being sincere since you apparently missed it. So I say that Last has qualities that you disagree with... So, therefore, I'm scum. I don't understand what lying about effectively Last's personality (which is outwardly apparent and visible to everyone) gains me.
And once my tone stops being relaxed, would you scum read me then? My tone being relaxed at this current time means nothing, I will get heated at dumb stuff regardless of my alignment, I just don’t see why you want to focus so early on whos town, rather than who it possible scum… That always baffles me when people on day 1 be like, “this guy is town,” was ur early post even needed? The only person I ever follow is Dawn anyways, so if you are trying to pocket me, its not working.
What is your opinion on Dawn’s scum choices? scum = Shadow/Grape/Wuffles? there should be a lurker in the mix, maybe Cyan
P.S… I still have a slight townish lean on you, I just still don’t see the point of calling me out for being town so early on
Sorry for disappearing,OOG meatworld stuff got in the way. I'm several pages behind but will catch up asap. Right now though I need sleep, have to drive 400km's back home first thing tomorrow.
@wisp no time again this morning but two quick replies. You don't get to unilaterally declare my post a mess because tom thought it was (tom doesn't either but that's literally been his whole stance on the issue so *shrug*). If you think it's over the top and a pile of contradictions point them out please.
Second I can call DBS's vote on atog bad. It was objectively not true. She voted him for sheeping me on KJ which didn't happen. It just wasn't even remotely true. So it was a bad vote. Especially since sheeping in the early game isn't particularly scummy to begin with.
@Last: Can you please use the quote function properly? The tags get lost when you quote one of your posts formatted the way it is and we can't click on the link to go directly to the post you are referring to.
is there a rule saying I cant quote this way? if not then I will quote as I plz... and if the parent quote is of enough importance, then why not take the time to find it, this thread isnt moving at a pace that makes it hard to find them at this moment..
quoting large posts, is irritating, grape fruits post was large so I broke it up...
well...
I clicked around your iso a little this morning thinking about making a town case on you and I'm not going to because it would too much work because my reasons for thinking you're town are mostly context-based and the way you're posting makes it impossible to track or effectively quote your posts
Jsyk
I have decided to accept cyan's pocket even though he's trying to mislynch last.
Because let's be honest last is exactly the kind of player towncyan would mislynch
@Mod (and FYI for everyone else): Please see this post in my other ongoing game. If you feel like you need to replace me, I completely understand, but if I can be allowed to limp along a little bit longer, I'm really hopeful that I can resume regular activity soon. I don't know how realistic that hope is, but it's my intent.
I have decided to accept cyan's pocket even though he's trying to mislynch last.
Because let's be honest last is exactly the kind of player towncyan would mislynch
I have decided to accept cyan's pocket even though he's trying to mislynch last.
Because let's be honest last is exactly the kind of player towncyan would mislynch
@Tom: Why do you think it's a mislynch?
tldr is his approach to the people he knows best and what he's choosing to react to
I think I've got a bead on how he thinks
I have decided to accept cyan's pocket even though he's trying to mislynch last.
Because let's be honest last is exactly the kind of player towncyan would mislynch
@Tom: Why do you think it's a mislynch?
tldr is his approach to the people he knows best and what he's choosing to react to
I think I've got a bead on how he thinks
I trust you in this game currently, and I don't know last very well, so I'll give you the benefit of the doubt here. Unvote last
OK so apparently I am going to GP Hartford tomorrow so I'm going to try and dash this post off before then.
Quote from Wuffles »
Also, @EVERYONE - I got terry and Tom mixed up in that post where o said that the role was a good townie role but a crazy Mafia one. I already clarified this. Don't worry, Tom hasn't done anything to distinguish himself as super town this game. Wink
Thanks for clarifying this, should have been obvious to me but wanted to ask you anyways.
Quote from JoeTerry »
Cantrip/Vaimes: This slot has been flying under my radar, I have a town lean, but need to keep an eye on it
Can you explain why you have a town lean on this slot? Cantrip has posted nothing of value so far and Vaimes replaced out pretty early so.
Quote from JoeTerry »
I'm really happy with Proph this game. Good effort, good quality, lots of mind melds with me. Please be town Proph
Quote from Grapefruit21 »
@Proph your mechanics talk defense of me is super bad. As is the effort based on really.
Gun to head <- scum!Grape probably doesn't have the fortitude to call arguments that defend him bad.
Why do you think my reasoning for reading you is bad, Grape? Expand on it further?
Quote from Iso »
I'll admit that once I decided you were town I stopped reading your posts as closely, so I don't actually know what your opinions are on Togs/Grape.
Wait wait wait. How did you "decide" I was town? I feel like your read on me has been null up until this point when you randomly decided that I was town. Can you walk me through your thought process WRT your read on me? This seems super abrupt.
Fair enough regarding Grape, I didn't read Pirates Mafia (just saw his comments in postgame about how much he struggled to post as scum).
Quote from Iso »
LW's felt natural [for LW] all game long; I've seen nothing that feels out of place after I harangued him for almost the entirety of Day 1 in Zero Escape, which gave me a pretty good feel for how he plays.
Mmm okay. I don't have much experience playing with him outside of one game where I was scum and he called our scumteam correctly after we powerwolfed for most of the game, so.
Might just try and continue to bug him since he and I haven't interacted much this game.
@Lastwhisper yooooo pls respond to my questions I asked a while back por favor
Quote from JoeTerry »
Rhand? Proph? Kami? DOTA? Give me some feedback on Killjoy.
I've been putting killjoy on my backburner because 1) he seems to have trouble getting into the game and 2) he has a history of being mislynch bait as town (he got lynched Day 2 of.. ZE mafia as town for not great reasons IMO?) He could certainly be scum, but I want to wait a while here and see what he produces.
Man I thought I had a good grasp on this game due to the reread but like.. these past couple of pages have blown it all away. I need to read the conversation between Grape/tom/shadow when it's not 1 AM in the morning and see if there's anything there. I need to take a deeper dive into Last's posts and figure out if he is actually interested in hunting the bad guys or not. I want to take a look at Iso/vezok because Cyan told me to but I've been stupid busy this week.
----
@JoeTerry @Cyan @RE1031 - can you guys take a look at shadow's recent posts and tell me if I'm onto something here? Still haven't really seen much signs of towniness from him and.. most of the thread has not talked about him I feel?
I have a large to do list WRT this game and I will get to it later this weekend.
@JoeTerry @Cyan @RE1031 - can you guys take a look at shadow's recent posts and tell me if I'm onto something here? Still haven't really seen much signs of towniness from him and.. most of the thread has not talked about him I feel?
That's going to be tough... I don't think scum!shadow is someone you catch through individual posts.
The only issue I see in his ISO is his questions early on were not game-specific and so I don't see how they would help him catch scum. The "top 3 scum reads + why" question seems a bit lazy, but they are necessary at some point. But his other questions are good and specific. I'd say he's other upper side of neutral.
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@tery: Silver makes few posts and the ones that are made don't really reflect anything about what he thinks. He only pops in to respond to questions talk about me. I'm not really seeing any drive to try to scum hunt.
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@KJ sure so why I jumped to scum reading you is because the reasoning was delayed and I disagreed with it. If your original post had included it I wouldn't think it was scummy. But because it was a later justification and I felt it was brazenly untrue that it made you scum.
That was magnified by the fact that most of the posts that could be described using the tone you used happened after your post where you expressed the town read. I thought his earliest posts were his most manic. Now granted that could easily be read as sincere.
Anyway as you said ne misunderstanding your wording isn't your problem. It's mine. And I've moved you back to my null pile. I'm still slightly pinged by your early town read on Wisp but nothing like I was earlier.
I... don't believe you. I don't think you had that read.You jumped up my ass way to quick without doing the due diligence trying to figure out my motives.
@Shadow: Yeah, I'm thinking I'm going to ISO Grape for sure. It won't be a PBPA Osie-style because NEVER AGAIN but it'll be thorough.
KoolKoal: Feel free to take this with a grain of salt since self meta isn't particularly helpful, but I think I get scumread mostly for style over substance, but also for a certain lack of substance over style. It's not so much what I AM posting most of the time (though sometimes that can seem bad) but what I'm NOT posting. I've been told I come to non-obvious conclusions a lot, so when I post, quite a bit of the time there's jumps in logic that people can't follow and they think that's scummy. I get that accusation about a lot of questions I ask specifically. People call them "busy work" when the questions are legit etc.
As far as things to ignore, I can't think of anything. I would suggest you focus less on what I'm doing and more on how I'm doing it. That's probably more likely to be accurate. Like I've just said, what I do tends to come off a little weird, but if you look for how I do it, mindset comes into play and maybe you figure out something useful.
@tery: Silver makes few posts and the ones that are made don't really reflect anything about what he thinks. He only pops in to respond to questions talk about me. I'm not really seeing any drive to try to scum hunt.
This is like, borderline outright lying.
(1) I've been in the game for like four days and I'm closing in on Proph for post count. Saying that I "make few posts" when I have so many posts that I'm passing semi-active players who have been posting for two weeks after only four days is a bit, well. Insulting. It isn't like I'm just posting one liners and asking meaningless questions. I've made a joke here or there, but I've produced quite a bit of content and at least something of my thought process and play style ought to be evident therein.
(Note: this isn't a jab at anyone with fewer posts than me or anyone I might pass in the future, we all have life etcetera, I'm just irritated that I'm being accused of not/low posting.)
(2) I'm pretty sure I have more posts about Togs than I have about you, and I've definitely talked about other players. Rhand, Grapefruit, tom/shadow, Killjoy off the top of my head. If it feels like I'm focusing on you, well, I am. I think you have the scummiest behavior, by far, of any player in the game at the moment. If you're actually somehow town, your flip immediately tells me that my view of the game is wrong and I need to reevaluate, while if you're scum, obviously, I've successfully lynched scum and can start looking for partner interactions. You're also active in the thread and doing things that I think need to be talked about, like magic bagging, while half the playerbase is off in their own little tunnels seemingly ignoring the rest of thread. Maddening, but I don't know what to do about it other than try to make them talk about what I think is important.
(3) If you can't see my thought process in my posts... I mean, if you really can't because of my writing style or because I haven't been explicit enough or something, it's not like I'm ignoring questions directed at me. As you yourself pointed out. But I have to wonder if you're even reading them. I've given a reads list and if you think something on it doesn't match the way I've handled a player or you want me to elaborate on it, you should ask me. That's the whole reason I made it without providing immediate explanations. I wanted people to ask me about it and engage with my reads instead of just glossing over it and ignoring me. Like, right now, I'm apparently supposed to believe that you're a town player who is scum reading me because you don't understand how I've arrived at my conclusions, but you've only asked me one barely-even-a-question without even explaining how my answer to it fits in to your read.
(4) You're saying the connection I made between you and Grape is "nonsense," but you're also supposed to be town (from your own point of view) and Grape is (apparently) not on your scum list. If my connection says that Grape is town if you are town, how is that nonsense? It should be *true* from where you're sitting, and at least that much matches up with your view of the game state exactly -- except that I'm wrong about your alignment.
Moreover (wine incoming) it's a really stupid connection for me to make if you're town and I'm scum trying to mislynch you, because when you flip town I can't push Grape without looking super sketchy. Now, I suppose you could say that I'm already planning on killing Grape so closing off his mislynch doesn't matter, but really there aren't many situations where I would bother to make that connection as scum. It's just not a good read for me to have, so I wouldn't have it.
(Well, if Grape is actually my partner it would be a good read to have, I guess. )
I mean, we have multiple choice here:
(a) you think my connection must be nonsense because you know it's wrong, i.e. you're a wolf and grape is town.
(b) you're a mudslinging wolf and calling the connection nonsense because you want to mislynch me or discredit the connection.
(c) you're somehow town and disagree with some premise I used to reach my conclusion but aren't pointing out what the "wrong" premise is because...
(d) you're somehow town and didn't understand what I said but didn't ask me for clarification because...
Gonna go with (b), I think.
(5) I guess as far as the charge that I'm not really trying to scum hunt, I'm guilty and would never deny it. I don't scum hunt heavily on day 1 and very rarely even get a lean scum read much less a hard one. I find and build a town circle, look for preflip associations, and will basically shrug and vote to lynch anyone outside of my town circle at the end of the Day. Often I'll have a preferred lynch, but I'm not really charismatic or persuasive enough to get my way most of the time so I don't even bother. At the end of the Day, I'll be happy if I have ~7 solid townreads I can trust, none of my townreads were lynched, and I get a flip with a long counter wagon. The day 1 lynch is generally a crap shoot, anyway, and I don't have enough information to work with to really scum hunt the way I prefer to. I need wagons and night actions to catch scum.
Usually.
But nearly every word in this post *screams* that you don't actually care what my alignment is. You haven't tried to figure out why I might do the things you're "scum reading" me for, or asked anyone about my meta, or even explained how the things you just said add up to a scum read. And really, that's the meat of my scum read on you. Because even beyond the magic bag, the push on Iso, and all the rest, I don't think you're playing like someone who lacks information about the players around him.
@Proph I know you and I know you give town credit to people who push away town reads. It's something I'd do as either alignment.
As for mechanics I played a game as scum where I focused on mechanics and people's reactions to them semi recently.
Activity-wise I just love the board game and find lovecraftian stuff fascinating even if I don't actually enjoy his writing.
@KJ I don't really expect you to believe me. I pushed hard and pretty much was no brakes.
@Vezok why Killjoy and why now?
@Silver this is a winey answer but I think the most likely answer to your worlds for Vezok is either A with an outside chance of D. B seems unlikely given the amount of momentum on my wagon today. If he's scum he knows I'm flipping town so if it wasn't a knee jerk you're clearly wrong reaction it indicates he's town. Because to you at least my flip (which is probably happening either by lynch or by tommy gun) is really good for him.
So you have any strong feeling on him or is it purely just following Terry?
Nope. I'm feeling pretty null about him. I really want to start a wagon on nearly anyone at this point. Seems like a good one.
Then why didn't you vote me? There is more momentum (Iso, KJ, tom, DBS, Silver, and Wisp have all expressed interest there) there and earlier you had expressed scum leanings towards me. So why not me? Why would you follow Terry on a wagon you're meh on rather than the flow of the thread onto one you had previously liked?
So you have any strong feeling on him or is it purely just following Terry?
Nope. I'm feeling pretty null about him. I really want to start a wagon on nearly anyone at this point. Seems like a good one.
Then why didn't you vote me? There is more momentum (Iso, KJ, tom, DBS, Silver, and Wisp have all expressed interest there) there and earlier you had expressed scum leanings towards me. So why not me? Why would you follow Terry on a wagon you're meh on rather than the flow of the thread onto one you had previously liked?
Half the thread has expressed they wanted to join my wagon? Guess who did it? Almost nobody. As long as people aren't voting interest is moot. I voted killjoy cause terry is already voting for him and I hope that will move things. I'm not completely opposed to wagoning you, but your play has been different from both Pirates and Prison Block mafia. I'm not really townreading you, but also not quite scumreading. The thing is that if you are town, you're going to a valuable asset and if you scum, I believe that someone will investigate you. Not a good day 1 lynch in my opinion.
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I didn't have the time in my "free" days to do a full reread
I hope to get at least a read of Vezok in. I'm warming up to his lynch with that recent vote madness he's displaying, and this:
I just read Vezok's ISO, and that gave me a whole different look than what I thought I saw earlier.
His reads are not fleshed out, and while I remembered him asking good questions, that apparently was just 1 post. Apart from that he hasn't done much but fighting with Iso and calling Atog / Silver scum without really explaining why. He also has been townclearing some people.
The scumreads and townclears he voiced earlier completely don't mesh with the statement I just quoted.
@Vezok: how do you go from having scum- and townreads to wanting to wagon nearly anyone?
vote: Vezok
I still think Wuffles is scum. Leaning scum on Last and KJ, and have my eye on Shadow and Iso.
Townreading Terry and Kami, town leaning Proph, RE (because of Shinichi), Grape, Dota, tom and Silver.
Neutral on Cyan, Cantrip, Atog and DBS (who I think is town if Wuffles is scum, otherwise still lean scum)
I wished Vezok's flip would give info on Iso, but with his tendency to bus, he should really get passed that potion no matter what Vezok flips (if we lynch Vezok that is).
Cause Atog, silver and Iso are higher on my scumlist. Even Wuffles is higher, but for the sake of it I'll see what happens.
vote Atog
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@Cyan
Can you respond to my #457?
@Iso
What's your read on Cyan? Seems like in your #751 you accuse him of not paying attention, but are still treating him as town? I'm not sure why.
Also, this post: Suggests Cyan and vez are unaligned (not S/S, I suspect S/T), to me. Cyan also attacked Togs for attacking vez, I don't understand the strong defense of vez here.
quoting large posts, is irritating, grape fruits post was large so I broke it up...
Cyan has played a lot of games with me and probably knows my meta better than anyone here. It's true that he townread me in Prison Block mafia where I was scum, but that was because I specifically tried to buddy up to him all game.
Cyan appears to have read parts of the thread, which means he is almost surely town. He would've probably replaced out by now if he was scum.
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Good, I'd rather be neutral than anything else right now, but I still don't know how you can say that meta isn't a strong point in your argument towards me...
Whats your opinion on Vez
Everyone
I as well would like your opinions on Cyan... his posts seem too out of touch with the game, and the ones he chooses to focus on are even worse
vote: Cyan
P.S. Work time, will be back later
Cyan appears to have read parts of the thread, which means he is almost surely town. He would've probably replaced out by now if he was scum. wot...
I expressed minor suspicion of him so of course he includes me.
This is like textbook basic scum play. Unvote, Vote Last
I had even't read your last couple of posts when I made this statement. But all it really does is reinforce my point. You saw that people were unsure of me and jumped on it as an opportunity to get rid of someone that had expressed suspicion toward you. That is scum play(bad scum play, but what can you do), through and through.
Goddamnit why can I never get this to show properly on this site ugh.
Woo figured it out!
The trainwreck part of this post
Second I can call DBS's vote on atog bad. It was objectively not true. She voted him for sheeping me on KJ which didn't happen. It just wasn't even remotely true. So it was a bad vote. Especially since sheeping in the early game isn't particularly scummy to begin with.
I clicked around your iso a little this morning thinking about making a town case on you and I'm not going to because it would too much work because my reasons for thinking you're town are mostly context-based and the way you're posting makes it impossible to track or effectively quote your posts
Jsyk
Because let's be honest last is exactly the kind of player towncyan would mislynch
@Tom: Why do you think it's a mislynch?
I think I've got a bead on how he thinks
I trust you in this game currently, and I don't know last very well, so I'll give you the benefit of the doubt here. Unvote last
Thanks for clarifying this, should have been obvious to me but wanted to ask you anyways.
Can you explain why you have a town lean on this slot? Cantrip has posted nothing of value so far and Vaimes replaced out pretty early so.
Gun to head <- scum!Grape probably doesn't have the fortitude to call arguments that defend him bad.
Why do you think my reasoning for reading you is bad, Grape? Expand on it further?
Wait wait wait. How did you "decide" I was town? I feel like your read on me has been null up until this point when you randomly decided that I was town. Can you walk me through your thought process WRT your read on me? This seems super abrupt.
Fair enough regarding Grape, I didn't read Pirates Mafia (just saw his comments in postgame about how much he struggled to post as scum).
Mmm okay. I don't have much experience playing with him outside of one game where I was scum and he called our scumteam correctly after we powerwolfed for most of the game, so.
Might just try and continue to bug him since he and I haven't interacted much this game.
I've been putting killjoy on my backburner because 1) he seems to have trouble getting into the game and 2) he has a history of being mislynch bait as town (he got lynched Day 2 of.. ZE mafia as town for not great reasons IMO?) He could certainly be scum, but I want to wait a while here and see what he produces.
Man I thought I had a good grasp on this game due to the reread but like.. these past couple of pages have blown it all away. I need to read the conversation between Grape/tom/shadow when it's not 1 AM in the morning and see if there's anything there. I need to take a deeper dive into Last's posts and figure out if he is actually interested in hunting the bad guys or not. I want to take a look at Iso/vezok because Cyan told me to but I've been stupid busy this week.
----
@JoeTerry @Cyan @RE1031 - can you guys take a look at shadow's recent posts and tell me if I'm onto something here? Still haven't really seen much signs of towniness from him and.. most of the thread has not talked about him I feel?
I have a large to do list WRT this game and I will get to it later this weekend.
Cause I'm ******* dumb. Don't vote when tired people.
unvote atog
vote killjoy
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The only issue I see in his ISO is his questions early on were not game-specific and so I don't see how they would help him catch scum. The "top 3 scum reads + why" question seems a bit lazy, but they are necessary at some point. But his other questions are good and specific. I'd say he's other upper side of neutral.
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He's had some fine questions I guess
I... don't believe you. I don't think you had that read.You jumped up my ass way to quick without doing the due diligence trying to figure out my motives.
@Shadow: Yeah, I'm thinking I'm going to ISO Grape for sure. It won't be a PBPA Osie-style because NEVER AGAIN but it'll be thorough.
(1) I've been in the game for like four days and I'm closing in on Proph for post count. Saying that I "make few posts" when I have so many posts that I'm passing semi-active players who have been posting for two weeks after only four days is a bit, well. Insulting. It isn't like I'm just posting one liners and asking meaningless questions. I've made a joke here or there, but I've produced quite a bit of content and at least something of my thought process and play style ought to be evident therein.
(Note: this isn't a jab at anyone with fewer posts than me or anyone I might pass in the future, we all have life etcetera, I'm just irritated that I'm being accused of not/low posting.)
(2) I'm pretty sure I have more posts about Togs than I have about you, and I've definitely talked about other players. Rhand, Grapefruit, tom/shadow, Killjoy off the top of my head. If it feels like I'm focusing on you, well, I am. I think you have the scummiest behavior, by far, of any player in the game at the moment. If you're actually somehow town, your flip immediately tells me that my view of the game is wrong and I need to reevaluate, while if you're scum, obviously, I've successfully lynched scum and can start looking for partner interactions. You're also active in the thread and doing things that I think need to be talked about, like magic bagging, while half the playerbase is off in their own little tunnels seemingly ignoring the rest of thread. Maddening, but I don't know what to do about it other than try to make them talk about what I think is important.
(3) If you can't see my thought process in my posts... I mean, if you really can't because of my writing style or because I haven't been explicit enough or something, it's not like I'm ignoring questions directed at me. As you yourself pointed out. But I have to wonder if you're even reading them. I've given a reads list and if you think something on it doesn't match the way I've handled a player or you want me to elaborate on it, you should ask me. That's the whole reason I made it without providing immediate explanations. I wanted people to ask me about it and engage with my reads instead of just glossing over it and ignoring me. Like, right now, I'm apparently supposed to believe that you're a town player who is scum reading me because you don't understand how I've arrived at my conclusions, but you've only asked me one barely-even-a-question without even explaining how my answer to it fits in to your read.
(4) You're saying the connection I made between you and Grape is "nonsense," but you're also supposed to be town (from your own point of view) and Grape is (apparently) not on your scum list. If my connection says that Grape is town if you are town, how is that nonsense? It should be *true* from where you're sitting, and at least that much matches up with your view of the game state exactly -- except that I'm wrong about your alignment.
Moreover (wine incoming) it's a really stupid connection for me to make if you're town and I'm scum trying to mislynch you, because when you flip town I can't push Grape without looking super sketchy. Now, I suppose you could say that I'm already planning on killing Grape so closing off his mislynch doesn't matter, but really there aren't many situations where I would bother to make that connection as scum. It's just not a good read for me to have, so I wouldn't have it.
(Well, if Grape is actually my partner it would be a good read to have, I guess. )
I mean, we have multiple choice here:
(a) you think my connection must be nonsense because you know it's wrong, i.e. you're a wolf and grape is town.
(b) you're a mudslinging wolf and calling the connection nonsense because you want to mislynch me or discredit the connection.
(c) you're somehow town and disagree with some premise I used to reach my conclusion but aren't pointing out what the "wrong" premise is because...
(d) you're somehow town and didn't understand what I said but didn't ask me for clarification because...
Gonna go with (b), I think.
(5) I guess as far as the charge that I'm not really trying to scum hunt, I'm guilty and would never deny it. I don't scum hunt heavily on day 1 and very rarely even get a lean scum read much less a hard one. I find and build a town circle, look for preflip associations, and will basically shrug and vote to lynch anyone outside of my town circle at the end of the Day. Often I'll have a preferred lynch, but I'm not really charismatic or persuasive enough to get my way most of the time so I don't even bother. At the end of the Day, I'll be happy if I have ~7 solid townreads I can trust, none of my townreads were lynched, and I get a flip with a long counter wagon. The day 1 lynch is generally a crap shoot, anyway, and I don't have enough information to work with to really scum hunt the way I prefer to. I need wagons and night actions to catch scum.
Usually.
But nearly every word in this post *screams* that you don't actually care what my alignment is. You haven't tried to figure out why I might do the things you're "scum reading" me for, or asked anyone about my meta, or even explained how the things you just said add up to a scum read. And really, that's the meat of my scum read on you. Because even beyond the magic bag, the push on Iso, and all the rest, I don't think you're playing like someone who lacks information about the players around him.
As for mechanics I played a game as scum where I focused on mechanics and people's reactions to them semi recently.
Activity-wise I just love the board game and find lovecraftian stuff fascinating even if I don't actually enjoy his writing.
@KJ I don't really expect you to believe me. I pushed hard and pretty much was no brakes.
@Vezok why Killjoy and why now?
@Silver this is a winey answer but I think the most likely answer to your worlds for Vezok is either A with an outside chance of D. B seems unlikely given the amount of momentum on my wagon today. If he's scum he knows I'm flipping town so if it wasn't a knee jerk you're clearly wrong reaction it indicates he's town. Because to you at least my flip (which is probably happening either by lynch or by tommy gun) is really good for him.
@Silver: I was thinking of responding to you, but then I thought it would be more fun if I didn't
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Nope. I'm feeling pretty null about him. I really want to start a wagon on nearly anyone at this point. Seems like a good one.
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Then why didn't you vote me? There is more momentum (Iso, KJ, tom, DBS, Silver, and Wisp have all expressed interest there) there and earlier you had expressed scum leanings towards me. So why not me? Why would you follow Terry on a wagon you're meh on rather than the flow of the thread onto one you had previously liked?
Half the thread has expressed they wanted to join my wagon? Guess who did it? Almost nobody. As long as people aren't voting interest is moot. I voted killjoy cause terry is already voting for him and I hope that will move things. I'm not completely opposed to wagoning you, but your play has been different from both Pirates and Prison Block mafia. I'm not really townreading you, but also not quite scumreading. The thing is that if you are town, you're going to a valuable asset and if you scum, I believe that someone will investigate you. Not a good day 1 lynch in my opinion.
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@Mods
so I got a lot of stuff coming up that needs to be done, so I wont be posting again till Monday evening. o/
vote: Proph
Don't think this: Is reasoning town uses to townread someone.
I didn't have the time in my "free" days to do a full reread
I hope to get at least a read of Vezok in. I'm warming up to his lynch with that recent vote madness he's displaying, and this:
is almost too scummy to be scum (which I don't think really is a thing)
His reads are not fleshed out, and while I remembered him asking good questions, that apparently was just 1 post. Apart from that he hasn't done much but fighting with Iso and calling Atog / Silver scum without really explaining why. He also has been townclearing some people.
The scumreads and townclears he voiced earlier completely don't mesh with the statement I just quoted.
@Vezok: how do you go from having scum- and townreads to wanting to wagon nearly anyone?
vote: Vezok
I still think Wuffles is scum. Leaning scum on Last and KJ, and have my eye on Shadow and Iso.
Townreading Terry and Kami, town leaning Proph, RE (because of Shinichi), Grape, Dota, tom and Silver.
Neutral on Cyan, Cantrip, Atog and DBS (who I think is town if Wuffles is scum, otherwise still lean scum)
I wished Vezok's flip would give info on Iso, but with his tendency to bus, he should really get passed that potion no matter what Vezok flips (if we lynch Vezok that is).