Two things: 1 I'm not convinced. I've seen you and Shin banter and the difference I'm seeing here is you kind of address his points rather than brushing them off. I'd expect you to just call them weak and poke at him over something he did.
2 I have no idea how KJ who doesn't know your meta can have you as his strongest town read when that post is there. Even if you want to say that's normal brotherly banter for the two of you, KJ town reading you despite that is a reach.
I dont poke at shin, I yell at him for his forced behavior, and if you think me and killjoy are possible W/W then place your vote there first... lol
and killjoy has played a game with me, Im pretty sure I was the one of the people that actively got him lynched in Zero Escape
"Here. Oh - I see somebody else has already provided you with this information."
Iso quickly puts the notebook back away.
"As for empty votes...while it's a tactic I will utilize, myself, to see if people are actually reading the game, it perturbs me when others employ such a methodology, as I prefer transparency when investigating the motives of others. Mister Grapefruit's votes are particularly non-sequitur, as I mentioned, which leads me to believe he is utilizing this tactic to avoid throwing down solid reasoning for his accusations so that he may wiggle out of pressure later.
The interaction between Misters Atog and Vezok was very forced in that Mister Atog confronted Mister Vezok about not expressing an early opinion on him. Why on earth would a member of the town care about another seemingly-random member of the town doing such? It does not mesh.
I believe that Lady Dawn and Mister Vezok are town and mafia, respectively, of their own merits - not necessarily directly related to their interactions.
My means of solving mysteries such as this typically require I generate associations between associates early on. I have gone into depth about this a myriad of times; review the minutes of the last Invitational I was a part of for more details."
Iso scratches his eyebrow.
"Mister Vezok, I find it difficult to grok that your entire read on me was based on my history prior to you actually becoming aware of my history, especially when my presentation of information is NOTABLY different in this medium than in past experiences. Furthermore, attempting to discredit me is a laughable tactic at best, and I should hope that nobody here is foolish enough to fall prey to such an obvious smear job."
With a flourish, Iso stands up and paces the study, again. The sky is darkening, and the lamps are dim outside. A wind blows through the streets, causing the lightposts to sway like tentacles...tentacles...not again...Iso puts his hand to his temple and closes his eyes, a headache threatening to burst into existence against his skull.
"Sir Proph, while Sir Shadow's statements in question are not terribly in-depth, I do not see this as necessarily indicative of nefariousness. I believe Mister Shadow feigns a greater understanding of the state of affairs than he would be, now, were he to be ill-intentioned. No, rather, I simply believe he is having difficulty with attaining a solid footing on the subject at hand. And really - who can blame him?"
Iso makes a sweeping gesture with his arm and shakes his head slowly.
"Madness is about.
Mister Grapefruit, I do not see the point in a massclaim prior to such being necessary. I have noticed, additionally, that you are not addressing my queries regarding your voting mannerisms. Would you care to illuminate the situation for me, or shall I continue to assume the worst of you?"
Eyes lighting up, Iso addresses the newcomer.
"Ah, Miss Gwen - I see you are finally beginning to partake in our, ah, 'soirée', here. Once you've established your grasp on the situation, I'd be interested in hearing your thoughts on the matter. On that note, I believe there are some others that have lacked any form of major participation, as well...namely, Misters(?) DisplayName and Yurkin. I believe we are also awaiting a grand opening from Mister Cantrip."
2011: Best Mafia Performance (Individual) - Best Newcomer
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
@Iso I already stated that I intend to keep voting as I am. None of my votes have been reasonless. Vezok was voted for his proposal. Yurkin for his awful questioning. And KJ for his horrible read on Wisp. Well my vote on DisplayName was reasonless, just got Yurkin and DisplayName mixed up because the post of Yurkin that pinged me also had a vote on DisplayName in it. And that was the name I remembered at the time of typing.
@Wisp Yes he's played with you. And given the game you played in ZE and the way you engaged with Shin no one should be town reading you for being "casual and relaxed". As for if I think you're W/W; I suspect KJ regardless of your alignment. You could be town KJ is trying to pocket or a scum buddy being towned for bad reasons. I'm inclined to believe the latter just because of that one interaction with Shin which strikes me as off for your town meta.
On the topic of a mass claim I don't include roles in that, just bid numbers. I believe that it will be a valuable scum hunting resource at some stage. Though D3 maybe too soon. Any scum lynch eould have me happily push that date back a day.
"In the lone silence of that hoary and deserted city of the dead, my mind conceived the most ghastly phantasies and illusions; and the grotesque shrines and monoliths seemed to assume a hideous personality—a half-sentience. Amorphous shadows seemed to lurk in the darker recesses of the weed-choked hollow and to flit as in some blasphemous ceremonial procession past the portals of the mouldering tombs in the hillside; shadows which could not have been cast by that pallid, peering crescent moon."
"Mister Grapefruit, do you believe Mister Vezok's proposal is the sole reason to interpret his actions as antitown? Given that his idea was nearly identical to yours (albeit a few Days sooner), how do you reconcile that seeming cognitive dissonance? What are your thoughts on his approach to me thus far?"
2011: Best Mafia Performance (Individual) - Best Newcomer
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
"Mister Grapefruit, do you believe Mister Vezok's proposal is the sole reason to interpret his actions as antitown? Given that his idea was nearly identical to yours (albeit a few Days sooner), how do you reconcile that seeming cognitive dissonance? What are your thoughts on his approach to me thus far?"
No not the only. His read on you being detailed enough to draw from mulitple other games, but sloppy enough to think he was your only push stinks of an agenda. Wanting to find evidence differences to your town game to paint you as scum more than a desire to read you here. On it's own the proposal was neutral, but combined with scummy behavior it paints an anti-town picture.
As for the proposal differences, I think there is a massive value in A having our bids be secret so scum can't easily shut items off and B analyzing voting and bidding patterns to find scum. So I'm in a spot where I see the value of keepjng it secret but wanting to get claims before the waters are too muddied with bid numbers owned by corpses that could provide cover.
@Proph: see my response to Rhand with regards to why I asked about Iso
@Iso: I don’t know, are you bringing your A game? What I do know is that I’ve played with the shell of Iso several times now, and so far you’ve already outshined what I’ve come to (disappointedly) expect from you because of this.Who wants to help me poke at lurkers?
Vote DisplayName
(@Cantrip: I expect some gripping catchup, I’m giving you the benefit of the doubt for the time being.)
"I think that information relevant to auctions will come to light as time passes. Also, while Mister Killjoy's reads are uncompelling to me, I do not see anything explicitly wrong with his content. Could you elaborate on why you believes he needs pressure, Mister Grapefruit?
Sir Shadow, I do believe I have Misters Vezok and Atog dead to rights. While I am admittedly not reviewing the minutes as of yet, I do not believe I will refrain from doing so once such information becomes pertinent.
I am admittedly disappointed with your choice to pressure lurkers rather than solidify your current reads; was I wrong in that you are having difficulty finding a springboard in this game? If not, why not question those who are actively contributing to the game?"
2011: Best Mafia Performance (Individual) - Best Newcomer
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
I'll come back tomorrow afternoon when I actually get some sleep, dudes and dudettes.
And FTR I have actually played with Last in Zero Escape. I went from wanting to lynch him to thinknig he was town during the course of it. IIRC Dawn just kept being like "If you're scumreading him for that, then you're wrong" and it turned out dawn was right. So I don't know what Grape is on about.
KoolKoal: Feel free to take this with a grain of salt since self meta isn't particularly helpful, but I think I get scumread mostly for style over substance, but also for a certain lack of substance over style. It's not so much what I AM posting most of the time (though sometimes that can seem bad) but what I'm NOT posting. I've been told I come to non-obvious conclusions a lot, so when I post, quite a bit of the time there's jumps in logic that people can't follow and they think that's scummy. I get that accusation about a lot of questions I ask specifically. People call them "busy work" when the questions are legit etc.
As far as things to ignore, I can't think of anything. I would suggest you focus less on what I'm doing and more on how I'm doing it. That's probably more likely to be accurate. Like I've just said, what I do tends to come off a little weird, but if you look for how I do it, mindset comes into play and maybe you figure out something useful.
OK so I have an R project due tomorrow and an rough draft of an essay due Friday morning so I wanted to catch up more but I let real life get to me.
I plan on fully dedicating Saturday evening to this game but for now declare V/LA. I have a lot of stuff I want to get down regarding my reads on players and my thoughts but I simply don't have the time to write them all up now. If there's anything I absolutely /NEED/ to address then let me know and I'll give you a response.
I'll come back tomorrow afternoon when I actually get some sleep, dudes and dudettes.
And FTR I have actually played with Last in Zero Escape. I went from wanting to lynch him to thinknig he was town during the course of it. IIRC Dawn just kept being like "If you're scumreading him for that, then you're wrong" and it turned out dawn was right. So I don't know what Grape is on about.
She was right about him that game, but nothing about his play is causal or relaxed. So choosing those adjectives as your reasons to town read him seems to be wildly off base to me. If your read was Wisp is as rambunctious and reactive as ever then I wouldn't be pushing you, but you called him casual and relaxed which isn't a description that fits his town or scum games.
@DBS I did later seek out who said it (Togs) and agreed with him. As for highlighting why I voted KJ that quoted explained it. I thought his read on Wisp was very fake. He's looking for someone to trust, but using "fake" reasoning to find them. Which is what makes KJ scummy.
On reading Wisp I think I have a better idea of how to read him now than I did in ZE. Still not confident, but more than I used to be.
thanks for the clarification. but I disagree that Killjoy was faking it, especially to townread someone. scum generally do not like to give free townreads, and they would rather fake scumreads if they have to fake anything. if scum are trying to townread each other, I would expect their reads to be less 'shallow' than what Killjoy has posted.
@Iso I already stated that I intend to keep voting as I am. None of my votes have been reasonless. Vezok was voted for his proposal. Yurkin for his awful questioning. And KJ for his horrible read on Wisp.
may I know what Yurkin wrote to make you vote that slot? I haven't seen you address that slot much, but Killjoy and Vezok plenty.
I'll come back tomorrow afternoon when I actually get some sleep, dudes and dudettes.
And FTR I have actually played with Last in Zero Escape. I went from wanting to lynch him to thinknig he was town during the course of it. IIRC Dawn just kept being like "If you're scumreading him for that, then you're wrong" and it turned out dawn was right. So I don't know what Grape is on about.
She was right about him that game, but nothing about his play is causal or relaxed. So choosing those adjectives as your reasons to town read him seems to be wildly off base to me. If your read was Wisp is as rambunctious and reactive as ever then I wouldn't be pushing you, but you called him casual and relaxed which isn't a description that fits his town or scum games.
hmm I see. maybe you should also keep in mind that I mentioned he isn't an optimal choice to pocket. so if you're implying that Killjoy wants to whiteknight Last, I won't believe it haha. Last is casual and relaxed here though, see #132.
end of this post: Vote: shadowlancerx
since Vaimes is gone and I have no new players to poke at (outside of Cyan who I have no real impression of).
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"I still remember the days I prayed for the things I have now.
@DBS I see you got to my clarification on KJ. But I'd hardly call 132 casual or relaxed (though maybe I'm not calibrating those words appropriately for Wisp). But more importantly it also came well after KJ called last town. As for your assessment of the value of pocketing him that really doesn't have much bearing on whether KJ would try it or not. I kind of feel like he's the sort of player who is very valuable to have town read you if you're scum. He's likely to either be mislynched or survive a long time without anyone wondering why he's alive if he's town. So yes I'm implying that KJ is faking a town read to pocket him. I wouldn't call it white knighting because wisp is under no real lynch pressure at this point and white knight implies he was under pressure.
As for scum focusing on town reading people that's basically my go to move as scum because it's my go to move as town. My early game in pirates was full of reachy but real-ish town reads (i.e. tom being town for breaking gimmick). Everyone scums differently. It's the context of this town read that makes me think it comes from scum.
On Yurkin I've been intentionally playing coy, but he only has a 3 post ISO so it shouldn't be hard to guess. I'm actually really curious to here why you think I'm scum reading him.
KoolKoal: Feel free to take this with a grain of salt since self meta isn't particularly helpful, but I think I get scumread mostly for style over substance, but also for a certain lack of substance over style. It's not so much what I AM posting most of the time (though sometimes that can seem bad) but what I'm NOT posting. I've been told I come to non-obvious conclusions a lot, so when I post, quite a bit of the time there's jumps in logic that people can't follow and they think that's scummy. I get that accusation about a lot of questions I ask specifically. People call them "busy work" when the questions are legit etc.
As far as things to ignore, I can't think of anything. I would suggest you focus less on what I'm doing and more on how I'm doing it. That's probably more likely to be accurate. Like I've just said, what I do tends to come off a little weird, but if you look for how I do it, mindset comes into play and maybe you figure out something useful.
What do you think I think about Last? It almost feels like you're saying I'm townclearing him? Am I wrong?
I'm saying giving him credit for being specifically relaxed and casual feels fake. I'm assuming it's a moderate town read given how early we are, but it is the context that strikes me as wrong.
Sir Shadow, I do believe I have Misters Vezok and Atog dead to rights. While I am admittedly not reviewing the minutes as of yet, I do not believe I will refrain from doing so once such information becomes pertinent.
I am admittedly disappointed with your choice to pressure lurkers rather than solidify your current reads; was I wrong in that you are having difficulty finding a springboard in this game? If not, why not question those who are actively contributing to the game?"
Your assessment is correct, I’m not feeling the magic of this game at all. I didn’t jump on Vezok because I just feel so lukewarm about him. Atog I like don’t remember anything he’s said.
Vote Atog, What do you make of Iso’s assessment of you? Give me your top 3 town reads and why.
What do you think I think about Last? It almost feels like you're saying I'm townclearing him? Am I wrong?
I'm saying giving him credit for being specifically relaxed and casual feels fake. I'm assuming it's a moderate town read given how early we are, but it is the context that strikes me as wrong.
KoolKoal: Feel free to take this with a grain of salt since self meta isn't particularly helpful, but I think I get scumread mostly for style over substance, but also for a certain lack of substance over style. It's not so much what I AM posting most of the time (though sometimes that can seem bad) but what I'm NOT posting. I've been told I come to non-obvious conclusions a lot, so when I post, quite a bit of the time there's jumps in logic that people can't follow and they think that's scummy. I get that accusation about a lot of questions I ask specifically. People call them "busy work" when the questions are legit etc.
As far as things to ignore, I can't think of anything. I would suggest you focus less on what I'm doing and more on how I'm doing it. That's probably more likely to be accurate. Like I've just said, what I do tends to come off a little weird, but if you look for how I do it, mindset comes into play and maybe you figure out something useful.
@Atog: KJ and last are seperate and light reads. In that post you quoted KJ diminishes his own read on last, so I guess they could be scum together. It might simply be fear of commiting to a townread on a buddy. But they don’t have to be, and of the two I think KJ is definitely the better lead right now.
It’s pretty strange that KJ doesn’t jump on me calling him possible scum too. As town he usually gets frustrated when I think he’s scum (and vice versa )
Ok, thanks for the response. To be honest that still doesn’t really jive with my view, because like what seemed weird to me about KJ’s early play was the fact he had little reads except this one strong townread and it was one that I couldn’t follow his basis for, I think it’s a little.. ballsy ? as scum trying to get established that you would just list a buddy as a townread and that would be it. Your info about him not jumping on you is noted though.
My good feelings for you dissipated a bit when I was informed the posting restriction was planned in pregame. I do have good feelings about you, but not as strongly as towards the others. Iso's entrance is better than yours, but yours isn't bad.
As for KJ over Last, I have a few niggling doubts about Last that I want other opinions on, while Tog's 223 made a good case about KJ.
Glad you like my post but I must note the difference in opinion here, do you follow my reasoning above why I think Last would more likely be town in a world where KJ is scum ? What’s your experience with Last too ? Personally even though his opening was a fluff-fest I’ve been liking his more recent posts.
Quote from Shinichi »
Togs #221 & #223
-There goes my first contradiction XD, i should say it doesnt strike me as odd as i would like cause i did the same as town during zero escape mafia
-I agree I normally find someone to argue with and then i procede to tunnel them, it just hasnt happened yet just you wait.
-Why am i a town lean I dont get it?
Your questions seem genuinely insightful and I like your thread presence. For some reason I have a waay easier time reading your posts than normal but I’m sure if that’s you getting clearer or me getting used to it : v
-Also whats ur take on karote and yurkin?
No take atm sadly. I wanna see more out of Yurkin because I know she can do it, but I never really had hope for Karote. This is a reminder to myself to try to get Yurkin more engaged later.
As well as shadow and iso?
I honestly don’t know about Shadow, I have no experience with him, he is definitely putting effort into the game but he isn’t making himself obviously town. That’s a place I’ll have to look more.
As for Iso, I think he’s wrong about a lot of things but probably actually town. He sounds really really sure of his own opinions which is towny but maybe I’m just underestimating his ego as scum.
Quote from Prophylaxis »
Ah ok, I thought you were more acquainted with Last than I was because I think my only experience with him was.. the roller coaster of a scum game where we power wolfed and Last just was very very right at the end there.
I swear that this is the third time people have asked me this question.
I now see what Iso means when he says he hates people asking him the same question multiple times
(will get to this, please have patience. Though I am interested as to exactly /why/ people are asking me for my thoughts on dawningbluesky?)
Ok lol sorry I didn’t see the other times it was asked for some reason. But the basic reason is that I usually remember Phraze being hyper-active and having a much larger thread presence, but at the same time maybe she is just posting about completely different topics then me so I’m skewed by not paying enough attention. Which is why I wanted your take.
I’ll give you an alternate question then, why did you list Dota as a town lean earlier ?
Quote from Proph »
I like how Iso is playing so far (his roleplaying + his general approach to things seems less self-centered than what I normally expect out of him). I feel like he's also being more transparent with his thoughts and actions. Why are you asking me about.. Iso?
I think he’s probably town too but is this really less self-centered, it’s literally just a fanfiction describing his every action in the third person. The other roleplay in contrast I actually like reading from a literally standpoint.
Quote from Iso »
The interaction between Misters Atog and Vezok was very forced in that Mister Atog confronted Mister Vezok about not expressing an early opinion on him. Why on earth would a member of the town care about another seemingly-random member of the town doing such? It does not mesh.
I said this but I would assume he would react in some way at all to me both being the only one to agree with him and softclaiming. He didn’t and it’s been both perplexing and annoying (plus he’s still ignoring me lol)
Sir Shadow, I do believe I have Misters Vezok and Atog dead to rights. While I am admittedly not reviewing the minutes as of yet, I do not believe I will refrain from doing so once such information becomes pertinent.
I am admittedly disappointed with your choice to pressure lurkers rather than solidify your current reads; was I wrong in that you are having difficulty finding a springboard in this game? If not, why not question those who are actively contributing to the game?"
Your assessment is correct, I’m not feeling the magic of this game at all. I didn’t jump on Vezok because I just feel so lukewarm about him. Atog I like don’t remember anything he’s said.
Vote Atog, What do you make of Iso’s assessment of you? Give me your top 3 town reads and why.
Uh, I think it’s bad ? Top town read is Terry for claim followed by I guess Shinichi and Grape for being present and open to conversing with me.
Grape
I am always around and reading if u want to poke me... I am always caught up, and personally I'd rather be more of an active lurker day 1, Ill post here and there and comment on posts that interest me, but if you are trying to find a correlation in my activity between my town games and this one, you surely will be disappointed. I;d just rather not have a repeat of Zero Escape mafia, where I spend most of the days defending myself and getting even more scum read for my lack of clarity, and contradictions...
1. I am bad at defending myself as scum or town
2. Me posting just leads to people focusing to much on me, I'd rather not have people fighting to defend me, when they can focus elsewhere on actual scum. Its a cycle that repeats itself game after game for me.
3. Not to say this wont eventually happen, its inevitable that I will do something that looks scummy, its built into my genes.
For now I will poke what I want, and continue reading till something catches my eye...
Why? Please explain both why you placed that vote and why whisper is town.
I did my meta reading on you and read your ISO in this game and I'm inclined to think you are town, but still have a couple blips on my radar. Most of your post seem genuine solvish, but I didn't like your push to claim numbers, your knee-jerk reaction to ISO's suspicion and this seemingly naked vote on Atog. However, I also don't think scum puts in a lot of meta leg work at this point of the game. I probably need to isolate a few more players in this game. Give me a reason to look into Atog more next.
@KJ in your first post you nakedly call wisp your strongest town read. I asked you why and your reply was that he was relaxed and casual. I believe it was your third post. Can't check atm.
@Wisp your reasons are why I'm taking a bit of a wait and see approach rather than directly questioning you. I want to see what you do this phase. Nothing you say is going to remove the pung that your opening gave me. I want to see what you do when you aren't being directed by self defense.
@atog I agree scum!KJ makes scum!Wisp less likely, but not enough that I'm likely to change my opinion on Wisp. It's a minor point.
Why? Please explain both why you placed that vote and why whisper is town.
I did my meta reading on you and read your ISO in this game and I'm inclined to think you are town, but still have a couple blips on my radar. Most of your post seem genuine solvish, but I didn't like your push to claim numbers, your knee-jerk reaction to ISO's suspicion and this seemingly naked vote on Atog. However, I also don't think scum puts in a lot of meta leg work at this point of the game. I probably need to isolate a few more players in this game. Give me a reason to look into Atog more next.
I wanted to explain why Wisp is town, but I was drunk and couldn't form a good sentence. It's because of his post explaining his town meta in detail. Scum don't usually do that as it just puts more obstacles in their play.
As for your problems with me, the mass-claim auction numbers idea is NAI. I feel that both options have their pros and cons, but obviously people feel different about it.
My knee-jerk reaction to Iso's suspicion is standard for me, both as town or scum. It's a lot easier to suspect someone who votes for you, as you know he is for town so it's easier to analyse if it's agenda driven or not.
Atog's last post makes me think he is scum as it says almost nothing and appeared right after suspicion started mounting on him.
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I honestly don’t know about Shadow, I have no experience with him, he is definitely putting effort into the game but he isn’t making himself obviously town. That’s a place I’ll have to look more.
I’m not sure Atog is actually reading the game. Much as I would like it to be true, I’ve not really put all that much effort into the game, so making that specific comment feels like he’s just giving a fake, generic read.
Sir Shadow, I do believe I have Misters Vezok and Atog dead to rights. While I am admittedly not reviewing the minutes as of yet, I do not believe I will refrain from doing so once such information becomes pertinent.
I am admittedly disappointed with your choice to pressure lurkers rather than solidify your current reads; was I wrong in that you are having difficulty finding a springboard in this game? If not, why not question those who are actively contributing to the game?"
Your assessment is correct, I’m not feeling the magic of this game at all. I didn’t jump on Vezok because I just feel so lukewarm about him. Atog I like don’t remember anything he’s said.
Vote Atog, What do you make of Iso’s assessment of you? Give me your top 3 town reads and why.
Uh, I think it’s bad ? Top town read is Terry for claim followed by I guess Shinichi and Grape for being present and open to conversing with me.
What about it is bad?
Do you think scum are less likely to make themselves present in the thread? I’m open to conversing with you, did that make you think I’m town too?
Actively working on catchup, but wanted to mention that I asked DV if Auction House bids were retractable and he said they are NOT, so I'd like to recommend caution and patience when bidding on items to ensure that bidding (and subsequent prices) don't get out of control. Not sure how much discussion has occurred on this topic, so sorry if I'm rehashing something that's already been discussed/decided, but I think we should talk about bidding before actual bidding occurs, if possible. I'll try to be caught up soon so that I can be part of that discussion.
@DBS I see you got to my clarification on KJ. But I'd hardly call 132 casual or relaxed (though maybe I'm not calibrating those words appropriately for Wisp). But more importantly it also came well after KJ called last town. As for your assessment of the value of pocketing him that really doesn't have much bearing on whether KJ would try it or not. I kind of feel like he's the sort of player who is very valuable to have town read you if you're scum. He's likely to either be mislynched or survive a long time without anyone wondering why he's alive if he's town. So yes I'm implying that KJ is faking a town read to pocket him. I wouldn't call it white knighting because wisp is under no real lynch pressure at this point and white knight implies he was under pressure.
As for scum focusing on town reading people that's basically my go to move as scum because it's my go to move as town. My early game in pirates was full of reachy but real-ish town reads (i.e. tom being town for breaking gimmick). Everyone scums differently. It's the context of this town read that makes me think it comes from scum.
On Yurkin I've been intentionally playing coy, but he only has a 3 post ISO so it shouldn't be hard to guess. I'm actually really curious to here why you think I'm scum reading him.
let me get this straight..
so you think that my description means that Last is always excited as scum? from the way you phrased "casual and relaxed" yet disagreed on #132, it looks like you interpreted 'nervous' as 'excited'. if that is what you meant, then you're reading it wrong, I said 'nervous', not 'energetic' or 'excited'.
(I guess I still have a way to go with words seeing even this much requires more clarification.)
if you say it's all in context, why don't you ask Killjoy about his methods? everyone should be evaluated according to their own capabilities, not yours. this is the issue I have with scum!Grapes in Pirates mafia, so I wonder if this is a tell for you. (not shading, just stating my observations.)
why would you vote Yurkin if you didn't scumread her? you've brought up Vezok and Killjoy as scum, so I assumed you also felt something about Yurkin (2/3 is self-explanatory). if you didn't scumread her, but just placed a vote on an inactive, I'm curious why you wanted to vote there at that point of time, instead of DisplayName.
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Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
"I still remember the days I prayed for the things I have now.
The auctioneer's gong signaled that the auction proper was beginning. I joined the crowd in the next room. Reviewing the list, I allowed myself a measure of hope. Several of these would be quite useful in my inquiries. The gun worried me if placed in the hands of a madman or cultist, but at least its ammunition was limited. Already some plans were forming in my mind.
I encourage everyone to review the objects that have just been put up for sale. Most interesting, I believe, is the "potion of truth", which is described thus:
Day Action — Consume the Potion of Truth.
Lose vote for day. Gain 1 Sanity. Reveal your alignment publicly.
Naturally, whoever drinks it will be at great risk - but it is to the benefit of the greater community to ensure that someone does so. I have thought on the option of having someone buy it and delay its use, as there might be a time some days hence when such information is more critical - but now is the time when we have the least knowledge, and providing unquestionable evidence this early would be a rare boon. So I suggest that we ensure it is used this very day.
Anyone who does use it will naturally also tie their name to their number. Thus, perhaps, we could vote on who we most wish to unmask, and have that person bid the minimum amount for the potion. No one else will bid on it.
If they bid, and win, and drink it, we will have at least one confirmed upstanding citizen - and their mind will be bolstered to help defend them against the horrors that may yet be coming.
If they refuse to buy it, that would be strong evidence of their guilt.
If they bid, but some other number does not go along with our plan, then that other number can be presumed guilty; and we can work on putting a name to the number.
In any case, we will see something worth seeing; and at little cost, for we need not engage in a bidding war.
forgot to add that I've read the entire setup thoroughly (late I know) and noticed a lot of mechanics are different from the usual, like Wills and passing them in case you should die. as for the Auction House, I'm not quite sure about that but anything interesting will have my vote....I guess?
@KamikazeArchon
what if scum buys the Potion of Truth and isn't put on the spot to use it? can it be passed on without a Will? I'd say whoever buys it should use it by an appointed time, like say D3 - whoever doesn't use it around that time should be sought out and hanged. the nice part of a Will, at least that I've read, is that we can pass the item over to someone else should the person get nightkilled.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
"I still remember the days I prayed for the things I have now.
forgot to add that I've read the entire setup thoroughly (late I know) and noticed a lot of mechanics are different from the usual, like Wills and passing them in case you should die. as for the Auction House, I'm not quite sure about that but anything interesting will have my vote....I guess?
@KamikazeArchon
what if scum buys the Potion of Truth and isn't put on the spot to use it?
That is why we should put them on the spot to use it.
can it be passed on without a Will? I'd say whoever buys it should use it by an appointed time, like say D3 - whoever doesn't use it around that time should be sought out and hanged. the nice part of a Will, at least that I've read, is that we can pass the item over to someone else should the person get nightkilled.
What do you think I think about Last? It almost feels like you're saying I'm townclearing him? Am I wrong?
I'm saying giving him credit for being specifically relaxed and casual feels fake. I'm assuming it's a moderate town read given how early we are, but it is the context that strikes me as wrong.
@Grape: My read on last kinda started in post 11. Vezok proposes a plan on how to get the game going.
Last responds to this is kind of a casual, sincere way. I feel like he continues this tone with Shin in 30. It's not like, super telling... but it's going in a good direction that I'm seeing there.
This is the read we’re grilling you about because it’s both not very descriptive of how Last actually is and is your only real read stated in the thread so far. If you want to talk to grape and me, then catch up, answer my questions from #223 and give us a reads list.
@KJ in your first post you nakedly call wisp your strongest town read. I asked you why and your reply was that he was relaxed and casual. I believe it was your third post. Can't check atm.
@Wisp your reasons are why I'm taking a bit of a wait and see approach rather than directly questioning you. I want to see what you do this phase. Nothing you say is going to remove the pung that your opening gave me. I want to see what you do when you aren't being directed by self defense.
@atog I agree scum!KJ makes scum!Wisp less likely, but not enough that I'm likely to change my opinion on Wisp. It's a minor point.
I honestly don’t know about Shadow, I have no experience with him, he is definitely putting effort into the game but he isn’t making himself obviously town. That’s a place I’ll have to look more.
I’m not sure Atog is actually reading the game. Much as I would like it to be true, I’ve not really put all that much effort into the game, so making that specific comment feels like he’s just giving a fake, generic read.
Sir Shadow, I do believe I have Misters Vezok and Atog dead to rights. While I am admittedly not reviewing the minutes as of yet, I do not believe I will refrain from doing so once such information becomes pertinent.
I am admittedly disappointed with your choice to pressure lurkers rather than solidify your current reads; was I wrong in that you are having difficulty finding a springboard in this game? If not, why not question those who are actively contributing to the game?"
Your assessment is correct, I’m not feeling the magic of this game at all. I didn’t jump on Vezok because I just feel so lukewarm about him. Atog I like don’t remember anything he’s said.
Vote Atog, What do you make of Iso’s assessment of you? Give me your top 3 town reads and why.
Uh, I think it’s bad ? Top town read is Terry for claim followed by I guess Shinichi and Grape for being present and open to conversing with me.
What about it is bad?
Do you think scum are less likely to make themselves present in the thread? I’m open to conversing with you, did that make you think I’m town too?
Look Shadow, you are being technically correct but you are misinterpreting the way I am saying things. When I say “putting effort into the game” I don’t mean compared to your normal meta, because I literally have never seen you before. Obviously I mean that you are making posts and talking at a fairly average rate, in other words not lurking. I don’t see how the interpretation you are trying to spin there makes sense because the meaning of my post was essentially “I see him around but he doesn’t stick out to me.” Whether you consider yourself as putting in effort is something arbitrary that I can’t know.
Do I think scum are less likely to make themselves present in the thread, yes I do, because I mean PRESENCE in the sense of contributing to the game rather than just talking.
When I say that Shinichi and Grape are open to conversing with me, I mean conversing in the sense that were are bouncing questions and reads off of each other in an effort to solve the game. Again this meaning should be obvious by context. If you’re serious about trying to figure out my alignment, then be serious about trying to understand the meaning of my words.
I took a quick look at the auctions. I think the potion of truth should be bought by anyone for 1 silver and kept until we think it’s lylo, and then whoever holds it uses it.
In our wills we pass it to who we think is scum.
The auctioneer's gong signaled that the auction proper was beginning. I joined the crowd in the next room. Reviewing the list, I allowed myself a measure of hope. Several of these would be quite useful in my inquiries. The gun worried me if placed in the hands of a madman or cultist, but at least its ammunition was limited. Already some plans were forming in my mind.
I encourage everyone to review the objects that have just been put up for sale. Most interesting, I believe, is the "potion of truth", which is described thus:
Day Action — Consume the Potion of Truth.
Lose vote for day. Gain 1 Sanity. Reveal your alignment publicly.
Naturally, whoever drinks it will be at great risk - but it is to the benefit of the greater community to ensure that someone does so. I have thought on the option of having someone buy it and delay its use, as there might be a time some days hence when such information is more critical - but now is the time when we have the least knowledge, and providing unquestionable evidence this early would be a rare boon. So I suggest that we ensure it is used this very day.
Anyone who does use it will naturally also tie their name to their number. Thus, perhaps, we could vote on who we most wish to unmask, and have that person bid the minimum amount for the potion. No one else will bid on it.
If they bid, and win, and drink it, we will have at least one confirmed upstanding citizen - and their mind will be bolstered to help defend them against the horrors that may yet be coming.
If they refuse to buy it, that would be strong evidence of their guilt.
If they bid, but some other number does not go along with our plan, then that other number can be presumed guilty; and we can work on putting a name to the number.
In any case, we will see something worth seeing; and at little cost, for we need not engage in a bidding war.
I’d be down for this, the next person to get to L-2 has to buy the potion and drink it ?
Here’s where my head is at right now. Too many people in that null pile though : / And maybe I haven’t played on mtgs in a while but this game feels way slower than normal. I have some free time so gonna try to think of some questions to engage with these people.
Ah... I apologize, it seems I've misunderstood the auction's rules somewhat. I thought the auction for today would close before the end of the day itself; but I was wrong.
Thus the objects cannot be used today at all. Noted.
I dislike Number 77's immediate bid for the potion of truth, given these discussions. Let the record stand that I am not 77. I am tempted to suggest that no one else should bid on the potion, and we should demand that 77 drinks it and reveals themselves as soon as possible.
Ah... I apologize, it seems I've misunderstood the auction's rules somewhat. I thought the auction for today would close before the end of the day itself; but I was wrong.
Thus the objects cannot be used today at all. Noted.
I dislike Number 77's immediate bid for the potion of truth, given these discussions. Let the record stand that I am not 77. I am tempted to suggest that no one else should bid on the potion, and we should demand that 77 drinks it and reveals themselves as soon as possible.
Hm okay I didn't realize the items didn't work D1 either. Is it technically possible to pass items to other players, like sell for 0 gold or something ? I do think it's the best item available and we should pressure someone to use it if they're heading for a lynch D2.
forgot to add that I've read the entire setup thoroughly (late I know) and noticed a lot of mechanics are different from the usual, like Wills and passing them in case you should die. as for the Auction House, I'm not quite sure about that but anything interesting will have my vote....I guess?
@KamikazeArchon
what if scum buys the Potion of Truth and isn't put on the spot to use it?
That is why we should put them on the spot to use it.
can it be passed on without a Will? I'd say whoever buys it should use it by an appointed time, like say D3 - whoever doesn't use it around that time should be sought out and hanged. the nice part of a Will, at least that I've read, is that we can pass the item over to someone else should the person get nightkilled.
We should have it used immediately. Why wait?
what if an important role gets it? should they reveal themselves to be killed for nothing?
I'd say at least wait until D2, when it can be used to support someone's Night results. if someone gets killed, they can pass it on to another player for the same purpose (support their case).
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
"I still remember the days I prayed for the things I have now.
and killjoy has played a game with me, Im pretty sure I was the one of the people that actively got him lynched in Zero Escape
"Sir Shadow, do you believe I am bringing my A game to the table in this investigation?"
Pulling out a flask, Iso downs a mouthful of what he assures you is "definitely not whiskey". You're skeptical, but have no reason to doubt his word.
"Sir Lastwhisper, I see you're interested in a discourse with me. Let us talk, then! I will address you, point by point:
* Pushing to see what I want to see? What ever do you mean?"
Iso pulls out an older, battered notepad with strange, Eldritch symbols carved into the cover and drops it on the table for Lastwhisper's persual.
"Here. Oh - I see somebody else has already provided you with this information."
Iso quickly puts the notebook back away.
"As for empty votes...while it's a tactic I will utilize, myself, to see if people are actually reading the game, it perturbs me when others employ such a methodology, as I prefer transparency when investigating the motives of others. Mister Grapefruit's votes are particularly non-sequitur, as I mentioned, which leads me to believe he is utilizing this tactic to avoid throwing down solid reasoning for his accusations so that he may wiggle out of pressure later.
The interaction between Misters Atog and Vezok was very forced in that Mister Atog confronted Mister Vezok about not expressing an early opinion on him. Why on earth would a member of the town care about another seemingly-random member of the town doing such? It does not mesh.
I believe that Lady Dawn and Mister Vezok are town and mafia, respectively, of their own merits - not necessarily directly related to their interactions.
My means of solving mysteries such as this typically require I generate associations between associates early on. I have gone into depth about this a myriad of times; review the minutes of the last Invitational I was a part of for more details."
Iso scratches his eyebrow.
"Mister Vezok, I find it difficult to grok that your entire read on me was based on my history prior to you actually becoming aware of my history, especially when my presentation of information is NOTABLY different in this medium than in past experiences. Furthermore, attempting to discredit me is a laughable tactic at best, and I should hope that nobody here is foolish enough to fall prey to such an obvious smear job."
With a flourish, Iso stands up and paces the study, again. The sky is darkening, and the lamps are dim outside. A wind blows through the streets, causing the lightposts to sway like tentacles...tentacles...not again...Iso puts his hand to his temple and closes his eyes, a headache threatening to burst into existence against his skull.
"Sir Proph, while Sir Shadow's statements in question are not terribly in-depth, I do not see this as necessarily indicative of nefariousness. I believe Mister Shadow feigns a greater understanding of the state of affairs than he would be, now, were he to be ill-intentioned. No, rather, I simply believe he is having difficulty with attaining a solid footing on the subject at hand. And really - who can blame him?"
Iso makes a sweeping gesture with his arm and shakes his head slowly.
"Madness is about.
Mister Grapefruit, I do not see the point in a massclaim prior to such being necessary. I have noticed, additionally, that you are not addressing my queries regarding your voting mannerisms. Would you care to illuminate the situation for me, or shall I continue to assume the worst of you?"
Eyes lighting up, Iso addresses the newcomer.
"Ah, Miss Gwen - I see you are finally beginning to partake in our, ah, 'soirée', here. Once you've established your grasp on the situation, I'd be interested in hearing your thoughts on the matter. On that note, I believe there are some others that have lacked any form of major participation, as well...namely, Misters(?) DisplayName and Yurkin. I believe we are also awaiting a grand opening from Mister Cantrip."
{мы, тьма}
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
@Wisp Yes he's played with you. And given the game you played in ZE and the way you engaged with Shin no one should be town reading you for being "casual and relaxed". As for if I think you're W/W; I suspect KJ regardless of your alignment. You could be town KJ is trying to pocket or a scum buddy being towned for bad reasons. I'm inclined to believe the latter just because of that one interaction with Shin which strikes me as off for your town meta.
"In the lone silence of that hoary and deserted city of the dead, my mind conceived the most ghastly phantasies and illusions; and the grotesque shrines and monoliths seemed to assume a hideous personality—a half-sentience. Amorphous shadows seemed to lurk in the darker recesses of the weed-choked hollow and to flit as in some blasphemous ceremonial procession past the portals of the mouldering tombs in the hillside; shadows which could not have been cast by that pallid, peering crescent moon."
Grapefruit21 (2) - Shinichi, DoTArchon
Shadowlancerx (2) - Prophylaxis, Rhand
Cantripmancer (2) - Atogaholic, dawningbluesky
vezokpiraka (2) - Iso, Grapefruit21
Atogaholic (1) - Cyan
DisplayName (1) - yurkin
Iso (1) - vezokpiraka
Lastwhisper (1) - Gwendolly
Prophylaxis (1) - Cantripmancer
yurkin (1) - DisplayName
Not voting: Killjoy, shadowlancerx, TheRealStinkyJoeTerry
Day 1 ends on April 20th at 12:00 PM PST
With 19 players alive, it takes 10 votes to lynch.
{мы, тьма}
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
No not the only. His read on you being detailed enough to draw from mulitple other games, but sloppy enough to think he was your only push stinks of an agenda. Wanting to find evidence differences to your town game to paint you as scum more than a desire to read you here. On it's own the proposal was neutral, but combined with scummy behavior it paints an anti-town picture.
As for the proposal differences, I think there is a massive value in A having our bids be secret so scum can't easily shut items off and B analyzing voting and bidding patterns to find scum. So I'm in a spot where I see the value of keepjng it secret but wanting to get claims before the waters are too muddied with bid numbers owned by corpses that could provide cover.
@Iso: I don’t know, are you bringing your A game? What I do know is that I’ve played with the shell of Iso several times now, and so far you’ve already outshined what I’ve come to (disappointedly) expect from you because of this.
Who wants to help me poke at lurkers?
Vote DisplayName
(@Cantrip: I expect some gripping catchup, I’m giving you the benefit of the doubt for the time being.)
Sir Shadow, I do believe I have Misters Vezok and Atog dead to rights. While I am admittedly not reviewing the minutes as of yet, I do not believe I will refrain from doing so once such information becomes pertinent.
I am admittedly disappointed with your choice to pressure lurkers rather than solidify your current reads; was I wrong in that you are having difficulty finding a springboard in this game? If not, why not question those who are actively contributing to the game?"
{мы, тьма}
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
And FTR I have actually played with Last in Zero Escape. I went from wanting to lynch him to thinknig he was town during the course of it. IIRC Dawn just kept being like "If you're scumreading him for that, then you're wrong" and it turned out dawn was right. So I don't know what Grape is on about.
I plan on fully dedicating Saturday evening to this game but for now declare V/LA. I have a lot of stuff I want to get down regarding my reads on players and my thoughts but I simply don't have the time to write them all up now. If there's anything I absolutely /NEED/ to address then let me know and I'll give you a response.
She was right about him that game, but nothing about his play is causal or relaxed. So choosing those adjectives as your reasons to town read him seems to be wildly off base to me. If your read was Wisp is as rambunctious and reactive as ever then I wouldn't be pushing you, but you called him casual and relaxed which isn't a description that fits his town or scum games.
may I know what Yurkin wrote to make you vote that slot? I haven't seen you address that slot much, but Killjoy and Vezok plenty.
Yurkin again? why?
hmm I see. maybe you should also keep in mind that I mentioned he isn't an optimal choice to pocket. so if you're implying that Killjoy wants to whiteknight Last, I won't believe it haha. Last is casual and relaxed here though, see #132.
end of this post:
Vote: shadowlancerx
since Vaimes is gone and I have no new players to poke at (outside of Cyan who I have no real impression of).
Be grateful, always."
As for scum focusing on town reading people that's basically my go to move as scum because it's my go to move as town. My early game in pirates was full of reachy but real-ish town reads (i.e. tom being town for breaking gimmick). Everyone scums differently. It's the context of this town read that makes me think it comes from scum.
On Yurkin I've been intentionally playing coy, but he only has a 3 post ISO so it shouldn't be hard to guess. I'm actually really curious to here why you think I'm scum reading him.
What do you think I think about Last? It almost feels like you're saying I'm townclearing him? Am I wrong?
I'm saying giving him credit for being specifically relaxed and casual feels fake. I'm assuming it's a moderate town read given how early we are, but it is the context that strikes me as wrong.
Vote Atog, What do you make of Iso’s assessment of you? Give me your top 3 town reads and why.
Ok, thanks for the response. To be honest that still doesn’t really jive with my view, because like what seemed weird to me about KJ’s early play was the fact he had little reads except this one strong townread and it was one that I couldn’t follow his basis for, I think it’s a little.. ballsy ? as scum trying to get established that you would just list a buddy as a townread and that would be it. Your info about him not jumping on you is noted though.
Glad you like my post but I must note the difference in opinion here, do you follow my reasoning above why I think Last would more likely be town in a world where KJ is scum ? What’s your experience with Last too ? Personally even though his opening was a fluff-fest I’ve been liking his more recent posts.
Your questions seem genuinely insightful and I like your thread presence. For some reason I have a waay easier time reading your posts than normal but I’m sure if that’s you getting clearer or me getting used to it : v
No take atm sadly. I wanna see more out of Yurkin because I know she can do it, but I never really had hope for Karote. This is a reminder to myself to try to get Yurkin more engaged later.
I honestly don’t know about Shadow, I have no experience with him, he is definitely putting effort into the game but he isn’t making himself obviously town. That’s a place I’ll have to look more.
As for Iso, I think he’s wrong about a lot of things but probably actually town. He sounds really really sure of his own opinions which is towny but maybe I’m just underestimating his ego as scum.
Ok lol sorry I didn’t see the other times it was asked for some reason. But the basic reason is that I usually remember Phraze being hyper-active and having a much larger thread presence, but at the same time maybe she is just posting about completely different topics then me so I’m skewed by not paying enough attention. Which is why I wanted your take.
I’ll give you an alternate question then, why did you list Dota as a town lean earlier ?
I think he’s probably town too but is this really less self-centered, it’s literally just a fanfiction describing his every action in the third person. The other roleplay in contrast I actually like reading from a literally standpoint.
I said this but I would assume he would react in some way at all to me both being the only one to agree with him and softclaiming. He didn’t and it’s been both perplexing and annoying (plus he’s still ignoring me lol)
Uh, I think it’s bad ? Top town read is Terry for claim followed by I guess Shinichi and Grape for being present and open to conversing with me.
I am always around and reading if u want to poke me... I am always caught up, and personally I'd rather be more of an active lurker day 1, Ill post here and there and comment on posts that interest me, but if you are trying to find a correlation in my activity between my town games and this one, you surely will be disappointed. I;d just rather not have a repeat of Zero Escape mafia, where I spend most of the days defending myself and getting even more scum read for my lack of clarity, and contradictions...
1. I am bad at defending myself as scum or town
2. Me posting just leads to people focusing to much on me, I'd rather not have people fighting to defend me, when they can focus elsewhere on actual scum. Its a cycle that repeats itself game after game for me.
3. Not to say this wont eventually happen, its inevitable that I will do something that looks scummy, its built into my genes.
For now I will poke what I want, and continue reading till something catches my eye...
vote atog
I'm not ignoring you anymore.
Thanks to DNC at Heroes of the plane studios for this awesome sig and SGT_Chubbz for the awesome avy.
Check out the Shop Thread
I did my meta reading on you and read your ISO in this game and I'm inclined to think you are town, but still have a couple blips on my radar. Most of your post seem genuine solvish, but I didn't like your push to claim numbers, your knee-jerk reaction to ISO's suspicion and this seemingly naked vote on Atog. However, I also don't think scum puts in a lot of meta leg work at this point of the game. I probably need to isolate a few more players in this game. Give me a reason to look into Atog more next.
@Wisp your reasons are why I'm taking a bit of a wait and see approach rather than directly questioning you. I want to see what you do this phase. Nothing you say is going to remove the pung that your opening gave me. I want to see what you do when you aren't being directed by self defense.
@atog I agree scum!KJ makes scum!Wisp less likely, but not enough that I'm likely to change my opinion on Wisp. It's a minor point.
I wanted to explain why Wisp is town, but I was drunk and couldn't form a good sentence. It's because of his post explaining his town meta in detail. Scum don't usually do that as it just puts more obstacles in their play.
As for your problems with me, the mass-claim auction numbers idea is NAI. I feel that both options have their pros and cons, but obviously people feel different about it.
My knee-jerk reaction to Iso's suspicion is standard for me, both as town or scum. It's a lot easier to suspect someone who votes for you, as you know he is for town so it's easier to analyse if it's agenda driven or not.
Atog's last post makes me think he is scum as it says almost nothing and appeared right after suspicion started mounting on him.
Thanks to DNC at Heroes of the plane studios for this awesome sig and SGT_Chubbz for the awesome avy.
Check out the Shop Thread
Do you think scum are less likely to make themselves present in the thread? I’m open to conversing with you, did that make you think I’m town too?
so you think that my description means that Last is always excited as scum? from the way you phrased "casual and relaxed" yet disagreed on #132, it looks like you interpreted 'nervous' as 'excited'. if that is what you meant, then you're reading it wrong, I said 'nervous', not 'energetic' or 'excited'.
(I guess I still have a way to go with words seeing even this much requires more clarification.)
if you say it's all in context, why don't you ask Killjoy about his methods? everyone should be evaluated according to their own capabilities, not yours. this is the issue I have with scum!Grapes in Pirates mafia, so I wonder if this is a tell for you. (not shading, just stating my observations.)
why would you vote Yurkin if you didn't scumread her? you've brought up Vezok and Killjoy as scum, so I assumed you also felt something about Yurkin (2/3 is self-explanatory). if you didn't scumread her, but just placed a vote on an inactive, I'm curious why you wanted to vote there at that point of time, instead of DisplayName.
Be grateful, always."
I encourage everyone to review the objects that have just been put up for sale. Most interesting, I believe, is the "potion of truth", which is described thus:
Naturally, whoever drinks it will be at great risk - but it is to the benefit of the greater community to ensure that someone does so. I have thought on the option of having someone buy it and delay its use, as there might be a time some days hence when such information is more critical - but now is the time when we have the least knowledge, and providing unquestionable evidence this early would be a rare boon. So I suggest that we ensure it is used this very day.
Anyone who does use it will naturally also tie their name to their number. Thus, perhaps, we could vote on who we most wish to unmask, and have that person bid the minimum amount for the potion. No one else will bid on it.
If they bid, and win, and drink it, we will have at least one confirmed upstanding citizen - and their mind will be bolstered to help defend them against the horrors that may yet be coming.
If they refuse to buy it, that would be strong evidence of their guilt.
If they bid, but some other number does not go along with our plan, then that other number can be presumed guilty; and we can work on putting a name to the number.
In any case, we will see something worth seeing; and at little cost, for we need not engage in a bidding war.
@KamikazeArchon
what if scum buys the Potion of Truth and isn't put on the spot to use it? can it be passed on without a Will? I'd say whoever buys it should use it by an appointed time, like say D3 - whoever doesn't use it around that time should be sought out and hanged. the nice part of a Will, at least that I've read, is that we can pass the item over to someone else should the person get nightkilled.
Be grateful, always."
Effective immediately tomsloger replaces DisplayName.
Yurkin has asked for replacement.
That’s fair.
Just because you don’t read my posts doesn’t mean they don’t say anything.
Look Shadow, you are being technically correct but you are misinterpreting the way I am saying things. When I say “putting effort into the game” I don’t mean compared to your normal meta, because I literally have never seen you before. Obviously I mean that you are making posts and talking at a fairly average rate, in other words not lurking. I don’t see how the interpretation you are trying to spin there makes sense because the meaning of my post was essentially “I see him around but he doesn’t stick out to me.” Whether you consider yourself as putting in effort is something arbitrary that I can’t know.
Do I think scum are less likely to make themselves present in the thread, yes I do, because I mean PRESENCE in the sense of contributing to the game rather than just talking.
When I say that Shinichi and Grape are open to conversing with me, I mean conversing in the sense that were are bouncing questions and reads off of each other in an effort to solve the game. Again this meaning should be obvious by context. If you’re serious about trying to figure out my alignment, then be serious about trying to understand the meaning of my words.
I took a quick look at the auctions. I think the potion of truth should be bought by anyone for 1 silver and kept until we think it’s lylo, and then whoever holds it uses it.
In our wills we pass it to who we think is scum.
Shinichi
Grapefruit21
Iso
Rhand
KamikazeArchon
shadowlancerx
Lastwhisper
Cantripmancer
Prophylaxis
Cyan
Dawningbluesky
DoTArchon
Gwendolly
Tom
Yurkin
vezokpiraka
Killjoy
Here’s where my head is at right now. Too many people in that null pile though : / And maybe I haven’t played on mtgs in a while but this game feels way slower than normal. I have some free time so gonna try to think of some questions to engage with these people.
Thus the objects cannot be used today at all. Noted.
I dislike Number 77's immediate bid for the potion of truth, given these discussions. Let the record stand that I am not 77. I am tempted to suggest that no one else should bid on the potion, and we should demand that 77 drinks it and reveals themselves as soon as possible.
what if an important role gets it? should they reveal themselves to be killed for nothing?
I'd say at least wait until D2, when it can be used to support someone's Night results. if someone gets killed, they can pass it on to another player for the same purpose (support their case).
Be grateful, always."
Just assume I have well reasoned reads on everyone and am keeping them to myself for reasons
don't remember he pushed Killjoy by himself. if anything, it seems built on Grape's reasoning.
Be grateful, always."
wow. talk about a bad reason to vote someone.
vote dawningbluesky