So this is interesting because IF DBS controlled the Kraken, it was released in response to Tom, Rod, and DV pressure, which would imply that they are not scum. The other interesting thing is that the only people NOT on that Lynch was ME (Town), Rhand (Town 99%), Kazin (Town 80%), Az (Neutral 90%), DBS (???) and Grape (50-50). With so much green outside of that list there has to be red inside it. So seeming more likely that DBS may have been town...
I just don't comprehend why I am a good Lynch. It seems stupid when we have 3 living protection roles and two claimed protection roles dead. What have I done that was so scummy besides hammer DOTA? Which is retrospect isn't even that scummy and we still have people postulating that he was scum. My Lynch is garbage. Get over it.
I've never seen a more obvious caught scum post in my entire mafia career.
In just 3 rows you manage to deflect your lynch onto others by modgaming, defending your scummy actions by calling them not scummy and ended by telling everyone your lynch is bad.
DBS is pretty much just always town despite tom's claim to the opposite. DotA I'm torn on, because independent of connections I have them as scummy, but I also read you (Terry) as scummy and I see no world where you are scum with DotA and AE. Which you and AE being scum together is the only way I see him getting vanilla'd as you're getting run up.
I guess he theoretically could have been vanilla'd by buddies while town!Terry is being run up but that seems less likely to me as I feel scum would be worried about that jeopardising their mislynch on town!Terry. But that's all wine. And that's the problem with this game... It's all wine.
DBS is pretty much just always town despite tom's claim to the opposite. DotA I'm torn on, because independent of connections I have them as scummy, but I also read you (Terry) as scummy and I see no world where you are scum with DotA and AE. Which you and AE being scum together is the only way I see him getting vanilla'd as you're getting run up.
I guess he theoretically could have been vanilla'd by buddies while town!Terry is being run up but that seems less likely to me as I feel scum would be worried about that jeopardising their mislynch on town!Terry. But that's all wine. And that's the problem with this game... It's all wine.
Dude, Grape, I'm town. I"m doing more work than half this thread. What do you think about DBS controlling the Kraken though?
And I don't know if you (Terry) are town. Look good in some respects (role analysis assuming truth), but in others I've found you scummy. You're pushing anything that moves and are focusing on role analysis in a way that only lightly includes the roles of dead peeps and somehow implicates tom (who imo looks great via role analysis). I also don't love the way you completely flipped your stance on DotA and didn't explain it till pressed, that to me feels like a mindset lapse. Aka you knew DotA was town and mentally was playing that way without justifying your change in opinion. And yes I know you did later, but not until pressed over it. Also not loving your repeated assurances that you're town. I've found that comes much more from scum than townies, but that is very minor.
And effort is great and all, but it can come from scum or town. I'm not clearing tom and Shadow for being high posters either.
2011: Best Mafia Performance (Individual) - Best Newcomer
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
Figured I'd try to do percentages that everyone is town
99 rhand
95 DV
95 Kami
92 grape
90 kazin
82 vezok
80 shadow
75 rodemy
60 dota
40 dawn
35 arch
25 joe
0 az (but 95% neutral)
Doing the math that's only 868, and there should be 900% worth of townies. Or slightly more because the AZ scumchance.
But there's no one who i want to add percentage points to. Maybe those top couple of people should just be hundreds but I'm just never that certain on principal
Why sure there be 900%? If it's you assigning confidence to individual players there's no reason it should come to an even number. Being under doesn't seem like it should be a problem (unlike being over which would be one).
Anyway I've been busier than expected. My gut is telling me to vote Terry but I haven't done the due diligence yet. And the fact that he's claiming not to see factional abilities does make me think it's much more likely to be a town role (because seeing NK's makes it a full cop). Could be standard templating for either alignment, but that combined with Az claiming his entire role is factional abilities makes me think his rolecop is a town one. But he's not done anything (except give stellar effort) to prove that he's town. All his efforts are within his scum range. And his play seems really reminiscent of Priso mafia
Why sure there be 900%? If it's you assigning confidence to individual players there's no reason it should come to an even number. Being under doesn't seem like it should be a problem (unlike being over which would be one).
because there's ~9 town players and that's how percentages work
Oh and I already mentioned this but the scum rolecop in horsemen (The only iso game I could find with ~factional abilities) specifically said it couldn't see horsemen abilities even though only the scum had them, so that's standard templating.
Why sure there be 900%? If it's you assigning confidence to individual players there's no reason it should come to an even number. Being under doesn't seem like it should be a problem (unlike being over which would be one).
Anyway I've been busier than expected. My gut is telling me to vote Terry but I haven't done the due diligence yet. And the fact that he's claiming not to see factional abilities does make me think it's much more likely to be a town role (because seeing NK's makes it a full cop). Could be standard templating for either alignment, but that combined with Az claiming his entire role is factional abilities makes me think his rolecop is a town one. But he's not done anything (except give stellar effort) to prove that he's town. All his efforts are within his scum range. And his play seems really reminiscent of Priso mafia
Whatever, I’m going to take a time out and be an arrogant prick right now:
I played Prison really hard and think I did a stellar job. Probably my best Scum game since I’ve been back. I had a good game with Tom in Low Fantasy, but it was easier because I had a partner at the end. Prison was rough and I played hard and well, but was alone until the very end and pushed a lot of mislynches. That’s why I hate being scum, because when you have a good game no one ever trusts you for at least the next game. I like the challenge of being town and have to deal with stuff like this. You are seeing I’m town but you are paranoid because of prison. My play really closer to my play in mistbirn than it is prison. I think I hammered two townies in a row that game. How many did I hammer in mistborn (I actually don’t remember the answer)?
None of this will matter if you are scum but oh well.
I'm paranoid because of prison. That is a fact, but I'm also questioning because you are pushing at anything that will move. You're moving around from idea to idea and looking like you're trying to find something that will stick rather than solve the game. You're flitting around so much that it feels like you're dropping idea's when they don't gain traction rather than fighting for something you found and believe in.
Also after prison I'm going to be paranoid of you in 1 specific way for forever; you know how to exploit your own meta. This feels different to the way you did it with your big catch up post there, but it's a similar idea. Also hammering isn't about meta. It's about timing and opportunity more than anything else. And your hammer was scummy while Kazin's D1 wasn't.
As for Rhand speculating about early NK's has never gotten me anywhere. I remember he was pretty widely town read because I got no traction when I started pushing him as scum; so probably that.
Is Terry using one game to establish meta of not hammering as scum?
I think the only other hammer I did as scum was on you my first game here and you were scum too, but I might be wrong. How about instead of being a tunnel minded, cotton headed ninnymugin you start looking at some other options? I seriously feel like anything I say this game, you are going to be “Pbbbbt bruh, that’s totally what scum says”. You have jack for a case on me. You can park your vote on me all game but stop being a meathead about it. I’m kind of done with this crap. If I get lynched I’ll be relieved then immediately go yell at iso on discord and he’ll say something smart to make me feel better about suffering through this game that had the potential to be fun but ruined by the fact that there aren’t flips so far.
So I’ll say this one time DV, be constructive of your case on me, Park your vote if you want, but if you keep antagonizing me I’ll be happy to entertain myself with a flame war for the remainder of the day.
I'm paranoid because of prison. That is a fact, but I'm also questioning because you are pushing at anything that will move. You're moving around from idea to idea and looking like you're trying to find something that will stick rather than solve the game. You're flitting around so much that it feels like you're dropping idea's when they don't gain traction rather than fighting for something you found and believe in.
Also after prison I'm going to be paranoid of you in 1 specific way for forever; you know how to exploit your own meta. This feels different to the way you did it with your big catch up post there, but it's a similar idea. Also hammering isn't about meta. It's about timing and opportunity more than anything else. And your hammer was scummy while Kazin's D1 wasn't.
As for Rhand speculating about early NK's has never gotten me anywhere. I remember he was pretty widely town read because I got no traction when I started pushing him as scum; so probably that.
Well I’m town on the chopping block and I have a role that needs to be addressed if I live in to the night. Like if I live until tonight who is scum going to shoot? They tried hard as hell to lynch me today and I lived, you think they want to fight that fight again after I survive the night and can out one of them? And if shadow jails me tonight burn him alive. I want results or death.
Also, DV should learn from grape. Grape called me scum in a very polite, constructive way, he’s wrong, but so is DV and Grape doesn’t make me want slap him in the back of the head.
Well I’m town on the chopping block and I have a role that needs to be addressed if I live in to the night. Like if I live until tonight who is scum going to shoot? They tried hard as hell to lynch me today and I lived, you think they want to fight that fight again after I survive the night and can out one of them? And if shadow jails me tonight burn him alive. I want results or death.
This just screams cognitive dissonance. First off your wagon is mainly one person you've rolecopped and are voting (Tom), one person you've considered checking and is your main push (but not your vote, in Vezok), and Kazin who has claimed to be vanilla'd (and probably has been since AE has claimed to be vanilla'd after the same flavor).
So if you want to sit here and say that scum are gunning for your mislynch to prevent you from checking them but propose a team that is Tom, DBS, and Vezo why not just push Vezok instead of tom now and skip the need to check? The reason the jumps out to me is you're not trying to solve the game, but instead trying to prevent your own lynch. You feel for whatever reason that tom is an easier mislynch than Vezok today (or maybe Vezok is a buddy, building teams is really hard right now). And that's what I was getting at with saying you're scum for seeing what can stick to the wall. Your play doesn't feel like you're critically thinking about it, more just reacting to the recent stimulus and trying to find a path that keeps you alive. To town!Terry staring at his own mislynch proposing a team of Tom, DBS, and Vezok and never just saying "hey let's lynch Vezok today if you're not going to trust my result. Here's reason X, Y, and Z to do so" just doesn't add up. Especially given the legit effort you're putting into this game. And I think it's the cognitive dissonance of you being scum and knowing town want you alive to check one of Az/Vezo so you're not going to seriously push that today.
Same thing with his burn shadow if he blocks me remarks, he's playing this day largely by painting how valuable he is for his check tonight and how afraid scum are of it when half of his proposed living scum team has been checked and the other he hasn't pushed today. He shouldn't be urging a lynch mob on Shadow (presuming he is JK'd) if he really believes scum is afraid of him. Because for Shadow to block him he'd have to be true claiming (again he's voting Tom who he's already checked) and his check wouldn't catch him anyway. None of this adds up.
AE's probably lying about his interaction with Terry too, but I can't get any traction there and Terry is just openly scummy at this point so AE can wait.
Damnit grape unvote me. I’m doing this because all the crap against me is baseless and certain people are pushing this Lynch very hard. If I don’t get lynched today I change the game. I’m trusting shadows claim because I’ve read his play as town... but I could be wrong because you know I’m town. The one thing that would change that is if he jails me. No other claimed role has the ability to stop me getting a read tonight. Lynching me is the 100% wrong play here. I would be happy to move to vezo today, I’ve been pushing him as scum since day 1.
Vote: vezo see?
I already told you I’m starting to doubt dbs was scum but still think he had the kraken.
I’m fighting this Lynch to the end. I hope some gets a hold of them selves and unvotes me. If I get hammered look at the people that parked on me. I’m going to bed. I’ve really demonstrated several times I’m trying to solve this game and calling it cognitive dissonance is just a cop out. It just seems like I’m pissing into the wind here and no one is really reading what I ssy
Thinking DBS was town and rushed to fire the kraken before being lynched is absurd.
Refusing to point who is so adamant to lynch you and leaving the as a faceless them (It's tom who I am strongly town reading and ???) feels like an AtE.
Claiming you can change the game with one more target, when you've already hit one of the people you're pushing as scum and not been swayed by your result when you should have, feels like trying to stay alive over solving.
Voting Vezok now feels like you're trying to appease me. N.B. I don't think Vezok is particullary scummy just a little worryingly on the lurky side, just was making a point that from your theoretical town perspective you should have been pushing him.
I'm going to futsal now and going to be off for the night, but I'm happy with my vote. I think you're playing a pretty good scum game Terry, but you're still scum.
@azrael should be stealing a soul tonight from someone unlikely to be the NK so more than one person confirms his ability imo.
Since we don't have any other roles that want to target him really
(I kind of disagree that Az should be stealing a soul tonight, but I won’t auto lynch him if he did. Also, I don’t think I’d be a good target for that anyway, because as much as scum can try and push my lynch, I’m still the most dangerous PR left and could see them killing me.)
That’s what I would say too if I were scum hammering the cop
See you keep saying that, but you’re (as claimed) a rolecop, which is distinctly different from an actual cop. Like, you’re lynched so it’s a moot point but for real that’s not the same.
So reading the that page and the page before it you see these vote:
Tom votes DBS (#656)
Rod votes DBS (#659)
DV votes DBS (#674)
DBS votes DV (#689)
SJT votes Nancy (#697)
Rod votes DBS again (#731)
KRAKEN ATTACK!
Here's the final VC for that day:
Vote Count:
Nancy Drew 39 (2): TheRealStinkyJoeTerry, Rhand
D_V (2): Kazin Drake, dawningbluesky
dawningbluesky (8): vezokpiraka, tomsloger, Rodemy, D_V, Archmage Eternal, KamikazeArchon, shadowlancerx, Kazin Drake
TheRealStinkyJoeTerry (1): Azrael
Rhand (1): Grapefruit21
So this is interesting because IF DBS controlled the Kraken, it was released in response to Tom, Rod, and DV pressure, which would imply that they are not scum. The other interesting thing is that the only people NOT on that Lynch was ME (Town), Rhand (Town 99%), Kazin (Town 80%), Az (Neutral 90%), DBS (???) and Grape (50-50). With so much green outside of that list there has to be red inside it. So seeming more likely that DBS may have been town...
I guess he theoretically could have been vanilla'd by buddies while town!Terry is being run up but that seems less likely to me as I feel scum would be worried about that jeopardising their mislynch on town!Terry. But that's all wine. And that's the problem with this game... It's all wine.
Kazin hammered.
vote terry.
This.. feels good?
Wait... that votecount is wrong.
*****.
Um... UM....
Um?
Well, correct
"Right" would be joe hammered
And I don't know if you (Terry) are town. Look good in some respects (role analysis assuming truth), but in others I've found you scummy. You're pushing anything that moves and are focusing on role analysis in a way that only lightly includes the roles of dead peeps and somehow implicates tom (who imo looks great via role analysis). I also don't love the way you completely flipped your stance on DotA and didn't explain it till pressed, that to me feels like a mindset lapse. Aka you knew DotA was town and mentally was playing that way without justifying your change in opinion. And yes I know you did later, but not until pressed over it. Also not loving your repeated assurances that you're town. I've found that comes much more from scum than townies, but that is very minor.
And effort is great and all, but it can come from scum or town. I'm not clearing tom and Shadow for being high posters either.
{мы, тьма}
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
Ohhh as in Terry was saying Kazin was off wagon but the quote VC shows them as them hammer? Yeah that's a weird look.
Kazin was on there twice.
So unless kazin is a double voter...
Either way, kazin hammered. So your point is kinda invalidated.
Also i like how it goes down from highest to lowest percent of towniness as you go down the list. (Az doesnt count)
Saying this because Iso said he corrected a vote count so I'm assuming it was to remove Kazin from DV.
99 rhand
95 DV
95 Kami
92 grape
90 kazin
82 vezok
80 shadow
75 rodemy
60 dota
40 dawn
35 arch
25 joe
0 az (but 95% neutral)
Doing the math that's only 868, and there should be 900% worth of townies. Or slightly more because the AZ scumchance.
But there's no one who i want to add percentage points to. Maybe those top couple of people should just be hundreds but I'm just never that certain on principal
I don't think Rodemy does that play if it was a scum slip.
Maybe hes got me fooled though
Unvote Vote Terry
Anyway I've been busier than expected. My gut is telling me to vote Terry but I haven't done the due diligence yet. And the fact that he's claiming not to see factional abilities does make me think it's much more likely to be a town role (because seeing NK's makes it a full cop). Could be standard templating for either alignment, but that combined with Az claiming his entire role is factional abilities makes me think his rolecop is a town one. But he's not done anything (except give stellar effort) to prove that he's town. All his efforts are within his scum range. And his play seems really reminiscent of Priso mafia
I played Prison really hard and think I did a stellar job. Probably my best Scum game since I’ve been back. I had a good game with Tom in Low Fantasy, but it was easier because I had a partner at the end. Prison was rough and I played hard and well, but was alone until the very end and pushed a lot of mislynches. That’s why I hate being scum, because when you have a good game no one ever trusts you for at least the next game. I like the challenge of being town and have to deal with stuff like this. You are seeing I’m town but you are paranoid because of prison. My play really closer to my play in mistbirn than it is prison. I think I hammered two townies in a row that game. How many did I hammer in mistborn (I actually don’t remember the answer)?
None of this will matter if you are scum but oh well.
Also after prison I'm going to be paranoid of you in 1 specific way for forever; you know how to exploit your own meta. This feels different to the way you did it with your big catch up post there, but it's a similar idea. Also hammering isn't about meta. It's about timing and opportunity more than anything else. And your hammer was scummy while Kazin's D1 wasn't.
As for Rhand speculating about early NK's has never gotten me anywhere. I remember he was pretty widely town read because I got no traction when I started pushing him as scum; so probably that.
So I’ll say this one time DV, be constructive of your case on me, Park your vote if you want, but if you keep antagonizing me I’ll be happy to entertain myself with a flame war for the remainder of the day.
Terry just stop.
But in a cute way
This just screams cognitive dissonance. First off your wagon is mainly one person you've rolecopped and are voting (Tom), one person you've considered checking and is your main push (but not your vote, in Vezok), and Kazin who has claimed to be vanilla'd (and probably has been since AE has claimed to be vanilla'd after the same flavor).
So if you want to sit here and say that scum are gunning for your mislynch to prevent you from checking them but propose a team that is Tom, DBS, and Vezo why not just push Vezok instead of tom now and skip the need to check? The reason the jumps out to me is you're not trying to solve the game, but instead trying to prevent your own lynch. You feel for whatever reason that tom is an easier mislynch than Vezok today (or maybe Vezok is a buddy, building teams is really hard right now). And that's what I was getting at with saying you're scum for seeing what can stick to the wall. Your play doesn't feel like you're critically thinking about it, more just reacting to the recent stimulus and trying to find a path that keeps you alive. To town!Terry staring at his own mislynch proposing a team of Tom, DBS, and Vezok and never just saying "hey let's lynch Vezok today if you're not going to trust my result. Here's reason X, Y, and Z to do so" just doesn't add up. Especially given the legit effort you're putting into this game. And I think it's the cognitive dissonance of you being scum and knowing town want you alive to check one of Az/Vezo so you're not going to seriously push that today.
Vote: Terry
That should be L-1.
AE's probably lying about his interaction with Terry too, but I can't get any traction there and Terry is just openly scummy at this point so AE can wait.
Vote: vezo see?
I already told you I’m starting to doubt dbs was scum but still think he had the kraken.
I’m fighting this Lynch to the end. I hope some gets a hold of them selves and unvotes me. If I get hammered look at the people that parked on me. I’m going to bed. I’ve really demonstrated several times I’m trying to solve this game and calling it cognitive dissonance is just a cop out. It just seems like I’m pissing into the wind here and no one is really reading what I ssy
Refusing to point who is so adamant to lynch you and leaving the as a faceless them (It's tom who I am strongly town reading and ???) feels like an AtE.
Claiming you can change the game with one more target, when you've already hit one of the people you're pushing as scum and not been swayed by your result when you should have, feels like trying to stay alive over solving.
Voting Vezok now feels like you're trying to appease me. N.B. I don't think Vezok is particullary scummy just a little worryingly on the lurky side, just was making a point that from your theoretical town perspective you should have been pushing him.
I'm going to futsal now and going to be off for the night, but I'm happy with my vote. I think you're playing a pretty good scum game Terry, but you're still scum.
tomsloger (1): Archmage Eternal
shadowlancerx (1): Azrael
Vezok (1): joeterry
Not voting (2): Rodemy, shadowlancerx
Hammer when ready imo
@azrael should be stealing a soul tonight from someone unlikely to be the NK so more than one person confirms his ability imo.
Since we don't have any other roles that want to target him really
Maybe shadow, but eh
*fingers crossed*
As you’ve pointed out, no flip means we unfortunately won’t know unless you control the flips anyway.
I definitely think the lack of flips kind of makes this not really a logical exercise, but a wine exercise.
No scum would hammer like that.