@Vaimes if you're going to defend yours on basis of narrowing down then it's a bit disingenuous to pressure me for it when in my list I talk about howshin and [redacted] are purely mechanical and I've been asking for opinions and I stated that I want more from Proph despite a good entrance.
@Vaimes if you're going to defend yours on basis of narrowing down then it's a bit disingenuous to pressure me for it when in my list I talk about howshin and [redacted] are purely mechanical and I've been asking for opinions and I stated that I want more from Proph despite a good entrance.
Mindreaver, I don't really understand you complaining about there being nothing [to analyze], but criticizing me for my conviction (which implies I have content to dig through) and Quickhoodies for being a "tryhard."
Like...you say there's nothing, yet you have two pretty detailed scum/FOS reads. Barely on page two. No, that's too much conviction, etc.
That sure is three posts after one person scumreading you
Ok, caught up. Ummm, I'm not excited by anything so far... I mean besides the flavor posts which are GREAT! People aren't doing anything eye popping yet. I'll check back later and start some fires.
Also I've decided to officially make Grapefruit my first townread.
Now to read the QH wall.
I nearly got fooled
Unvote, Vote: Vaimes
Says that Shinichi is town (kind of confused on the pronouns there, but since he called my slot scum in the previous post, not really sure why he'd change his reads like that). Asks a question to QH, says that Terry is town, then votes Vaimes.
If you read this and think "hey, this is mostly all summary", well... that's what most of Wheat's posts, so far, boil down to? I'm not really seeing much here; not many insights into his thought process, just basically all stances with little reasoning to back it up.
In his next post he does the multiquote thing again where he townreads Grape, explains why JT is town for surface-level reasoning, and pushes Vaimes for semantics.
Though I'm mulling it over and does scum ever actually say this:
Quote from Wheat »
I did misread it like that.
That's okay, because you're probably still town anyway.
Does scum!Wheat admits that he misread a post, yet says "you're still probably town anyways"? This kiiind of feels Too Scummy To Be Scum to me (like I don't think scum!Wheat just admits this) but we'll see. I'll keep reading his posts.
I like Wheat's next post, where he explains his issues with Vaimes, even if I disagree with almost all of it. It shows critical insight into Wheat's mindset, which is something that has been pretty lacking from him.
Quote from Wheat »
Why is Vaimes STILL talking about me if he thinks I'm town?? He seems very concerned about what I think, and is very interested in talking about it all the time. His other reads are extremely superficial, with no hard scum reads, which further drives home the fact that he *does not care* about hunting scum right now. He only cares about currying favor from me.
This point in particular is something that I disagree with. I know how Vaimes plays, he rarely chases down hard scumreads as town, he mostly just finds a winning PoE and lynches wolves due to that. Plus how do you actually have hard scum reads by post 200?
The "Why is Vaimes STILL talking about me if he thinks I'm town??" line feels fairly savvy for scum!Wheat to make, though, and I get the slightest feeling that he actually believes in his scumread on Vaimes despite it being wrong. I dunno.
He continues to push Vaimes and interact with him, which is a positive in my book. I have to say I went into this ISO expecting Wheat to be scum but I am probably looking for things that are not there.
Quote from Wheat »
I don't recall that playstyle from you. That said, I also don't mind being wrong. I'll reread Titanic Ultimatum soon. If you do play like that, then I'll reconsider the read. But if you don't play like that, it's the last nail in the coffin because it means you're trying to play like you think you do when you're town
This is a pretty matter of fact response that also gives me the lightest of town vibes but I could be confirmation biasing here.
The thing that gives me a little pause about Wheat though is that his reads are just so.. foreign. Like, I sort of understand where he is getting them but they're just the complete opposite of my reads, ish? Just like, why do you think Vaimes is scum? You're quoting posts that I like from Vaimes and going "I'm not moving my vote today" and I'm like, ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Quote from Wheat »
I've been accused of not making any sense
WELCOME TO THE MIND OF THE GRINDER
Oh my god this is a ISO mindmeld. He literally does not make sense to me.
Then Wheat votes shadow for this reason...
Quote from Wheat »
Really dislike shadow's response to Grape asking to be sold on shadow. To me it doesn't really feel like shadow thinks Grape is scum, but is trying to get Grape to back off.
..which I once again, disagree with, because this was the post in question:
Quote from shadowlancerx »
-_-
Excuse me? You want to be sold on it? I don't think so.
*sigh* I'm gonna have to reread you aren't I?
I think this is actually a pretty townie response from shadow, because in the Champs game I was constantly paranoid about when people were super opportunistic about getting on me/voting me. I often said something along the lines of "[PLAYER1] townreading me but suddenly scumreading me skeeves me out". I feel like shadow is getting similar vibes here, which is why I think he is probably town?
Quote from Wheat »
Proph's catch up posts seem pretty good. I like post 659 in particular.
Question for you, Wheat - what do you think is the most likely scenario I presented in 659? You think that Vaimes and shadow are likely scum?
Quote from Wheat »
aaaaaaah hahaha
i love being right
Honestly this feels more like an off the cuff townie tonal tell.
OK so like I said, I went into this ISO expecting Wheat to possibly be scum, but he looks pretty good when I ISO'd him, which is not what I expected. I don't really understand his read on Vaimes but his posts feel like he actually believes that Vaimes is scum. The "aaaaaaah hahaha i love being right" thing I think is something that I have a hard time scum!Wheat saying when he's pushing Vaimes KNOWING that Vaimes is town. If Wheat/Vaimes are scum/scum then lol rip me (also probably a losing play from Wheat here).
Vaimes what do you think? Am I going deep into the confirmation bias realm or what?
I feel like I'm townreading too many people and someone is pocketing me :/
Also I got interrupted multiple times while writing this and it's 1 AM so I will talk about recent thread happenings tomorrow, just wanted to get this ISO out.
I am getting increasingly nervous about Shinichi/AG claiming provable/townie roles because I have a list of people on one hand that I'm townreading via behavior, while I have a list of people on the other hand who are being townread because mechanics.
I am always willing to lynch people who are being townread because mechanics over people who I am townreading because behavior. If Shinichi/AG ARE indeed town then I want them to participate more and get themselves cleared via behavior. Also, I need to meta dive Cantrip for this but I think he follows a similar design philosophy to me where the scum typically have one role that is townie/fake-claimable.
Quote from Grapefruit21 »
But yeah I made a partial claim but not my own. Would town ever have both a crier and a neighborizor type role?
I don't really think those two roles contradict each other? Again I can try to meta dive Cantrip to check to see if he has multiple communication type roles, but I've never really seen a crier in a setup before aside from the one Eido hosted on DLP (Battle School).
This is why the Wheat pressure today is skeeving me out. They were earning town reads for their convictions yesterday and I can't figure out what changed toDay.
At this stage I wouldn't mind hearing more opinions on AG's role and what can be gleaned from it.
Unvote because without a recent VC I don't remember where my vote is.
This is why the Wheat pressure today is skeeving me out. They were earning town reads for their convictions yesterday and I can't figure out what changed toDay.
How do you feel about him asking AG to answer questions when he hasn't answered many himself? Also I don't really know how to respond to the change because I didn't know why people were townreading him to begin with. What he pointed out about Vaimes was true, but I didn't understand why it was scummy, and so I thought, starting on day 1, that he was making an effort to be busy. This meta of scum reading people then finding evidence or something I don't understand either. Did WG actually ask AG any questions? I don't think so. So #887 is a weird post.
Another thing I don't understand is why Vaimes did a 180 on WG. That is what bothers me (one of the things holding me back from voting WG). It feels really bad. Everyone else who townread WG kind of just faded in my mind.
(also your vote was on me, which I thought was weird since you also said you weren't that interested in lynching me, but I ignored it...)
AG's role is probably Inventor. Which can come from either alignment. I think more commonly town. I think it's not worth it to lynch him today and wait for him to give out more abilities. Or get night killed. Which is basically what Vaimes said, but at the time, I really thought AG was scum heh.
Private Mod Note
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Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
When the point of no return appears, it is already behind you.
I think the cfd, needs to be discussed heavily today, since it basically cost us a lynch. I'm sorry I wasnt there at end of day and for the record I probably would have voted for a kpaca lynch over a no lynch. I thought I had more into the day, but since I'm in a new time zone I missed. I'm not dure, but I also would have voted shin over no lynch too. We need to lynch people before the deadline. Cfds are super suspect. Who started it?
What? We No Lynched because there were only like, five players around at deadline and everyone kept pussyfooting around killing someone.
---
Someone gave me a one-shot Vanilla Cop ability. I couldn't decide between using it on Rhand or Shinichi, since both claimed power, so I used it on Rhand. Oh well.
Seems like we're stalling, let me see if I can get this recapped here:
Yesterday, we failed and no lynched. Seriously, that's the worst. It's my fault as much as any one else, but it doesn't change the fact that it pretty much wasted day 1.
(REMINDER 1: Go back and look at EOD and see who could have voted to make a Lynch happen)
Rhand was killed at Night, Rhand replaced Roger. Rhand, Death's Head Moth, Town Deathguard was his flip. Looking at who voted for Roger/Rhand won't really help much but worth a try.
(REMINDER 2: Go back and look at people pushing Rhand/Roger)
Day 2, AG was pushed to L-2 and claimed to have given Vaimes a "Vanilla Cop" ability, but he didn't claim at L-2 Day 1. This doesn't feel right. Vaimes claimed to have received the ability and targeted Rhand.
(REMINDER 3: Go back and re-read, AG's claim)
Shin has claimed some sort of Announcer Role, which does not seem to have been used in a malicious way at all. I am starting to have a hard to figuring out what the usefulness of that role would be for town, other than as an IC. I can definitely see how it could be abused by scum.
Grapefruit has claimed Neighborizer. This concerns me a bit. I know this has been discussed a bit, but I don't think Neighborizer and Announcer on the same team makes a lot of sense. I have to say, it brings the concern of a cult into my mind.
(REMINDER 4: Someone mentioned the possibility of a cult or third party earlier, double check that)
If we're still debating the alignment of neighborizer/announcer, then I think that neighborizer has a higher chance of being scum. Well, you should also know that in the one game I was in where that role existed, it was scum and I was pocketed, but the role had a chance of going to anyone of any alignment.
I did give a cult game as an example not a possibility, however, it's not completely impossible for cult to exist in this game. But it does sound rather unbalanced if that is the case.
Private Mod Note
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Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
When the point of no return appears, it is already behind you.
And honestly, I expected scum!Wheat to tunnel me even harder after I claimed to have used an ability on Rhand. I don't think he even acknowledged it outside of pushing a me/AG narrative.
Something like "this is a scumclaim kill kill kill" or w/e. And now he isn't tunneling on me, so I'm ???.
I'd like to hear those who haven't already comment on the whole AG claiming business. That's a big deal, and I don't think it's getting the attention it deserves.
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When the point of no return appears, it is already behind you.
RE (not RE1031, but Regarding): Reminder #1: So Shin was on his way to be the Lynch at T-Minus 1 hour. He got to L-3. Vaimes makes a really good plea to get a Lynch (#608). I like that, I can't see this coming from scum. AG refuses to Lynch Shin. Mindreaver refuses to Lynch Shin.
Shin's peak VC was:
Shinichi (4): Grapefruit21, Rhand, Vaimes, shadowlancerx
Not Voting for Shin at T-minus 1 minute: AtheistGod, Shinichi, RE1031, TheRealStinkyJoeTerry, Mindreaver, Quickhoodies, Wheat_Grinder, kpaca
When the Kpaca wagon starts, he is at 0 votes, but it's at 8:59am (for whatever timezone I'm in). The final VC on Kpaca is:
kpaca (6): Vaimes, Grapefruit21, AtheistGod, shadowlancerx, Mindreaver, RE (for sake of this analysis)
Not voting for Kpaca at EOD: Shinichi, Rhand, RE1031, TheRealStinkyJoeTerry, Quickhoodies, Wheat_Grinder, kpaca
Keep in mind, if we were to have followed a strict deadline, it would have looked like this:
kpaca (3): Vaimes, Grapefruit21, AtheistGod
We know that Mindreaver and AG, were present and refused to vote for Shin. That immediately draws my attention.
Here are the rest of the people I need to look at (I removed myself and Rhand from the list since I know we are both town):
Shinichi: While I don't fault them for not voting themselves it was worth looking at if there was any reason they would not Lynch kpaca and post #582, specifically clarifies that he thinks Kpaca is a terrible Lynch, which I don't get, because he wasn't. Though for the record, Shin was not active, as far as I can tell, during the CFD at EOD1 RE1031: Was present at EOD1, but missed the deadline with a vote on Kpaca, who earlier that day RE offered to start a counter wagon for (#520). He also slipped that Kpaca was a mislynch twice, but wouldn't vote for Shin. I need to look closely at RE's statements regarding Shin. Quickhoodies: Stated he didn't like the Kpaca Lynch several times, but looking through his very few posts this games, he actually looks very buddy-buddy with Shin. I'm starting to see something here. Wheat_Grinder: Explicitly stated that he didn't like the Kpaca Lynch a couple times (#534, #571). Says he'll vote AG, Vaimes, RE or Shadow. Has also stated being against lynching Shinichi. I need to look at WG and Shin interactions too. kpaca: Nothing here. Wasn't around and was trolling this game.
Looking at this carefully, I came up with a reason that Shin might be scum. I've stated several times that he hasn't used this ability in a malicious way, but I forgot about the possibility of him using it to town clear himself.
Day 2, AG was pushed to L-2 and claimed to have given Vaimes a "Vanilla Cop" ability, but he didn't claim at L-2 Day 1. This doesn't feel right. Vaimes claimed to have received the ability and targeted Rhand.
(REMINDER 3: Go back and re-read, AG's claim)
Just realized that it was Kpaca at L-2 Day 1 not AG. Did AG get wagoned Day 1? I need to go back.
Vaimes shouldn't have been able to get a result on Rhand and therefore targeted someone else.
For reals? Dang o_O vote: Vaimes
Unless someone can offer another explanation to this, I don't see a better place to put my vote atm
Also, why do you assume that he targeted someone else? Well, actually, I'd probably do the same, but he could have still targeted Rhand and did the thing Terry suggested to cover up his tracks.
Private Mod Note
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When the point of no return appears, it is already behind you.
Vaimes shouldn't have been able to get a result on Rhand and therefore targeted someone else.
For reals? Dang o_O vote: Vaimes
Unless someone can offer another explanation to this, I don't see a better place to put my vote atm
Also, why do you assume that he targeted someone else? Well, actually, I'd probably do the same, but he could have still targeted Rhand and did the thing Terry suggested to cover up his tracks.
If he targeted Rhand he would have the correct answer. He either didn't use the shot or targeted someone else with it.
Vaimes shouldn't have been able to get a result on Rhand and therefore targeted someone else.
For reals? Dang o_O vote: Vaimes
Unless someone can offer another explanation to this, I don't see a better place to put my vote atm
Also, why do you assume that he targeted someone else? Well, actually, I'd probably do the same, but he could have still targeted Rhand and did the thing Terry suggested to cover up his tracks.
If he targeted Rhand he would have the correct answer. He either didn't use the shot or targeted someone else with it.
Because I've received multiple inquiries, information gathering on a target that was living at the start of a phase but dead at the end of that phase will still occur. If you feel like this conflicts with the game rules, please take it up with me post-game.
Last time I town read someone for doing something like that they were scum and I looked like an idiot.
Vote: AG
Yes I get all the arguments that he's a claimed PR and force scum to deal with him, but it's just not likely to be a town ability and AG has dome approximately nothing that is townie.
*Quick aside I love that RE and Terry put aside their differences to jump at Vaimes there. After each other all game but putting it aside like that gives me a fresh t/t vibe.
*Quick aside I love that RE and Terry put aside their differences to jump at Vaimes there. After each other all game but putting it aside like that gives me a fresh t/t vibe.
You're totally going to jinx it.
...
I'm really torn on the whole AG thing, which is why I want to hear from other people.
Private Mod Note
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Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
When the point of no return appears, it is already behind you.
I need to wrap my head around things. I feel like there is something significant about how this played out with people PMing Cantrip instead of posting in thread. I get if Cantrip made a mistake and sent Vaimes results, it doesn't trap Vaimes like I had hoped to, but it may have scared scum into PMing Cantrip for a correction, which could mean that either they were concerned it outed him as scum or automatically would town-clear him if he was town.
I shouldn't think about this anymore, it's getting shotty.
I need to wrap my head around things. I feel like there is something significant about how this played out with people PMing Cantrip instead of posting in thread. I get if Cantrip made a mistake and sent Vaimes results, it doesn't trap Vaimes like I had hoped to, but it may have scared scum into PMing Cantrip for a correction, which could mean that either they were concerned it outed him as scum or automatically would town-clear him if he was town.
I shouldn't think about this anymore, it's getting shotty.
Yeah, let's not bring this type of thing up. It sort of goes against the spirit of the game.
@Shinichi I am confirming someone had a chat with me last night. That chat made me more confident this individual is town which is why I'm asking design people if having a town crier and town neighborizor makes sense from a design perspective. Because to me it doesn't. But I'm not asking if they are both in the game because from my seat I have close to mod confirmed proof both are. Depending on your opinion of Cantrip proving there is a crier in this game.
Ok makes sense Ive seen roles like that before, ive never used a neighborizor before so i cant provide much input seeing as how i hate that role with a passion. Are you implying that those announcements are just random post from the host and that im just taking credit for them. Im just confused.
@Shinichi I am confirming someone had a chat with me last night. That chat made me more confident this individual is town which is why I'm asking design people if having a town crier and town neighborizor makes sense from a design perspective. Because to me it doesn't. But I'm not asking if they are both in the game because from my seat I have close to mod confirmed proof both are. Depending on your opinion of Cantrip proving there is a crier in this game.
If you're asking if we shouldn't lynch Shinichi because he is a crier, then no. It shouldn't clear him by itself. Same goes for the neighborizer. The only thing I'm getting from this is worry that we may not actually have a cop.
Sigh, and this is why I can't deal with Terry. Somehow I manage to be more scummy than someone who has never pursued a scum read in this game, and actually unvoted a scum read. I really have nothing to say about you being persuaded that easily by things applicable to other players, including you.
After my encounter with a mafia neighborizor ill never just confirm alignment based on that role alone, and same goes for my own role since i've given it to a scum before. We may not have a direct cop, it could be possible that the cop ability is given to someone every night more or less do to another player. This is obviously only based on 1 account that was given by vaimes.
So what is the plan if AG survives the night, and the next night, and the night after?
If he's town, the scumteam can't roleblock* him, so I doubt they'd let him live that long.
*always assume there's a Roleblocker
Not trying to say your wrong, but doesnt assuming theres a roleblocker hinder our movements and abilities? Isn't it better to think everything through assuming no one can stop your action.
Eh. Shinichi's play has been scummy as *****, but the way he's been using his role is. I don't really know how scum would handle it, but he seems unconcerned? Agenda-less? He basically outed himself as soon as he could, which seems more careless than calculated. Plus, announcement-type roles tend to be town waaay more often than not.
Some of these roles are probably going to be red herrings. Such is life.
Well you caught me due to my grammar before that, and i rather out myself now then have to counterclaim. I won't be able to prove a role is mine as easily as others. Also i always play with an unconcerned attitude.
1.This is just a game.
2.Overreacting gives away to much alignment information so i just stay calm.
@Shinichi I am confirming someone had a chat with me last night. That chat made me more confident this individual is town which is why I'm asking design people if having a town crier and town neighborizor makes sense from a design perspective. Because to me it doesn't. But I'm not asking if they are both in the game because from my seat I have close to mod confirmed proof both are. Depending on your opinion of Cantrip proving there is a crier in this game.
Ok makes sense Ive seen roles like that before, ive never used a neighborizor before so i cant provide much input seeing as how i hate that role with a passion. Are you implying that those announcements are just random post from the host and that im just taking credit for them. Im just confused.
I think either can be scum. I see scum potential for both roles, but don't think both are town. Doesn't make sense mechanically to have both be town and it seems to be a very good opportunity to have a balance of roles with one of each side.
So what is the plan if AG survives the night, and the next night, and the night after?
If he's town, the scumteam can't roleblock* him, so I doubt they'd let him live that long.
*always assume there's a Roleblocker
Not trying to say your wrong, but doesnt assuming theres a roleblocker hinder our movements and abilities? Isn't it better to think everything through assuming no one can stop your action.
I don't think AG's ability is actually useful at all for town, that's my biggest issue with his claim. What does a townie do with vanilla or not vanilla results? Out a power role? Its basically mod confirmed to exist.
Catching up now.
First two votes are RVS votes, on RE and Shinichi, plus complaining about MTGS emails.
Says that my slot is probably scum, with zero reasoning.
Says that Shinichi is town (kind of confused on the pronouns there, but since he called my slot scum in the previous post, not really sure why he'd change his reads like that). Asks a question to QH, says that Terry is town, then votes Vaimes.
If you read this and think "hey, this is mostly all summary", well... that's what most of Wheat's posts, so far, boil down to? I'm not really seeing much here; not many insights into his thought process, just basically all stances with little reasoning to back it up.
In his next post he does the multiquote thing again where he townreads Grape, explains why JT is town for surface-level reasoning, and pushes Vaimes for semantics.
Though I'm mulling it over and does scum ever actually say this:
Does scum!Wheat admits that he misread a post, yet says "you're still probably town anyways"? This kiiind of feels Too Scummy To Be Scum to me (like I don't think scum!Wheat just admits this) but we'll see. I'll keep reading his posts.
I like Wheat's next post, where he explains his issues with Vaimes, even if I disagree with almost all of it. It shows critical insight into Wheat's mindset, which is something that has been pretty lacking from him.
This point in particular is something that I disagree with. I know how Vaimes plays, he rarely chases down hard scumreads as town, he mostly just finds a winning PoE and lynches wolves due to that. Plus how do you actually have hard scum reads by post 200?
The "Why is Vaimes STILL talking about me if he thinks I'm town??" line feels fairly savvy for scum!Wheat to make, though, and I get the slightest feeling that he actually believes in his scumread on Vaimes despite it being wrong. I dunno.
He continues to push Vaimes and interact with him, which is a positive in my book. I have to say I went into this ISO expecting Wheat to be scum but I am probably looking for things that are not there.
This is a pretty matter of fact response that also gives me the lightest of town vibes but I could be confirmation biasing here.
The thing that gives me a little pause about Wheat though is that his reads are just so.. foreign. Like, I sort of understand where he is getting them but they're just the complete opposite of my reads, ish? Just like, why do you think Vaimes is scum? You're quoting posts that I like from Vaimes and going "I'm not moving my vote today" and I'm like, ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Oh my god this is a ISO mindmeld. He literally does not make sense to me.
Then Wheat votes shadow for this reason...
..which I once again, disagree with, because this was the post in question:
I think this is actually a pretty townie response from shadow, because in the Champs game I was constantly paranoid about when people were super opportunistic about getting on me/voting me. I often said something along the lines of "[PLAYER1] townreading me but suddenly scumreading me skeeves me out". I feel like shadow is getting similar vibes here, which is why I think he is probably town?
Question for you, Wheat - what do you think is the most likely scenario I presented in 659? You think that Vaimes and shadow are likely scum?
Honestly this feels more like an off the cuff townie tonal tell.
OK so like I said, I went into this ISO expecting Wheat to possibly be scum, but he looks pretty good when I ISO'd him, which is not what I expected. I don't really understand his read on Vaimes but his posts feel like he actually believes that Vaimes is scum. The "aaaaaaah hahaha i love being right" thing I think is something that I have a hard time scum!Wheat saying when he's pushing Vaimes KNOWING that Vaimes is town. If Wheat/Vaimes are scum/scum then lol rip me (also probably a losing play from Wheat here).
Vaimes what do you think? Am I going deep into the confirmation bias realm or what?
I feel like I'm townreading too many people and someone is pocketing me :/
I am getting increasingly nervous about Shinichi/AG claiming provable/townie roles because I have a list of people on one hand that I'm townreading via behavior, while I have a list of people on the other hand who are being townread because mechanics.
I am always willing to lynch people who are being townread because mechanics over people who I am townreading because behavior. If Shinichi/AG ARE indeed town then I want them to participate more and get themselves cleared via behavior. Also, I need to meta dive Cantrip for this but I think he follows a similar design philosophy to me where the scum typically have one role that is townie/fake-claimable.
I don't really think those two roles contradict each other? Again I can try to meta dive Cantrip to check to see if he has multiple communication type roles, but I've never really seen a crier in a setup before aside from the one Eido hosted on DLP (Battle School).
Either way I'll post more tomorrow.
At this stage I wouldn't mind hearing more opinions on AG's role and what can be gleaned from it.
Unvote because without a recent VC I don't remember where my vote is.
And thanks.
How do you feel about him asking AG to answer questions when he hasn't answered many himself? Also I don't really know how to respond to the change because I didn't know why people were townreading him to begin with. What he pointed out about Vaimes was true, but I didn't understand why it was scummy, and so I thought, starting on day 1, that he was making an effort to be busy. This meta of scum reading people then finding evidence or something I don't understand either. Did WG actually ask AG any questions? I don't think so. So #887 is a weird post.
Another thing I don't understand is why Vaimes did a 180 on WG. That is what bothers me (one of the things holding me back from voting WG). It feels really bad. Everyone else who townread WG kind of just faded in my mind.
(also your vote was on me, which I thought was weird since you also said you weren't that interested in lynching me, but I ignored it...)
AG's role is probably Inventor. Which can come from either alignment. I think more commonly town. I think it's not worth it to lynch him today and wait for him to give out more abilities. Or get night killed. Which is basically what Vaimes said, but at the time, I really thought AG was scum heh.
Hot cross buns!
One a penny, two a penny,
Hot cross buns!
Once you have no daughters,
then I'll take your sons.
One a penny two a penny,
Hot cross buns!
Votecount 2.2 - With 11 alive, it's 6 to lynch.
Shinichi (1): shadowlancerx
AtheistGod (2): Prophylaxis, Wheat_Grinder
Wheat_Grinder (2): Quickhoodies, AtheistGod
Not Voting: Grapefruit21, Mindreaver, RE1031, Shinichi, TheRealStinkyJoeTerry, Vaimes
Mindreaver has been prodded.
Please inform me of any errors.
Deadline is Friday, July 21st, at 9am MDT.
Yesterday, we failed and no lynched. Seriously, that's the worst. It's my fault as much as any one else, but it doesn't change the fact that it pretty much wasted day 1.
(REMINDER 1: Go back and look at EOD and see who could have voted to make a Lynch happen)
Rhand was killed at Night, Rhand replaced Roger. Rhand, Death's Head Moth, Town Deathguard was his flip. Looking at who voted for Roger/Rhand won't really help much but worth a try.
(REMINDER 2: Go back and look at people pushing Rhand/Roger)
Day 2, AG was pushed to L-2 and claimed to have given Vaimes a "Vanilla Cop" ability, but he didn't claim at L-2 Day 1. This doesn't feel right. Vaimes claimed to have received the ability and targeted Rhand.
(REMINDER 3: Go back and re-read, AG's claim)
Shin has claimed some sort of Announcer Role, which does not seem to have been used in a malicious way at all. I am starting to have a hard to figuring out what the usefulness of that role would be for town, other than as an IC. I can definitely see how it could be abused by scum.
Grapefruit has claimed Neighborizer. This concerns me a bit. I know this has been discussed a bit, but I don't think Neighborizer and Announcer on the same team makes a lot of sense. I have to say, it brings the concern of a cult into my mind.
(REMINDER 4: Someone mentioned the possibility of a cult or third party earlier, double check that)
And for the record I was invited to the neighborhood, not doing the inviting.
I did give a cult game as an example not a possibility, however, it's not completely impossible for cult to exist in this game. But it does sound rather unbalanced if that is the case.
JT, seriously? As either alignment I'm going to answer "not vanilla."
Something like "this is a scumclaim kill kill kill" or w/e. And now he isn't tunneling on me, so I'm ???.
Shin's peak VC was:
Shinichi (4): Grapefruit21, Rhand, Vaimes, shadowlancerx
Not Voting for Shin at T-minus 1 minute: AtheistGod, Shinichi, RE1031, TheRealStinkyJoeTerry, Mindreaver, Quickhoodies, Wheat_Grinder, kpaca
When the Kpaca wagon starts, he is at 0 votes, but it's at 8:59am (for whatever timezone I'm in). The final VC on Kpaca is:
kpaca (6): Vaimes, Grapefruit21, AtheistGod, shadowlancerx, Mindreaver, RE (for sake of this analysis)
Not voting for Kpaca at EOD: Shinichi, Rhand, RE1031, TheRealStinkyJoeTerry, Quickhoodies, Wheat_Grinder, kpaca
Keep in mind, if we were to have followed a strict deadline, it would have looked like this:
kpaca (3): Vaimes, Grapefruit21, AtheistGod
We know that Mindreaver and AG, were present and refused to vote for Shin. That immediately draws my attention.
Here are the rest of the people I need to look at (I removed myself and Rhand from the list since I know we are both town):
Shinichi: While I don't fault them for not voting themselves it was worth looking at if there was any reason they would not Lynch kpaca and post #582, specifically clarifies that he thinks Kpaca is a terrible Lynch, which I don't get, because he wasn't. Though for the record, Shin was not active, as far as I can tell, during the CFD at EOD1
RE1031: Was present at EOD1, but missed the deadline with a vote on Kpaca, who earlier that day RE offered to start a counter wagon for (#520). He also slipped that Kpaca was a mislynch twice, but wouldn't vote for Shin. I need to look closely at RE's statements regarding Shin.
Quickhoodies: Stated he didn't like the Kpaca Lynch several times, but looking through his very few posts this games, he actually looks very buddy-buddy with Shin. I'm starting to see something here.
Wheat_Grinder: Explicitly stated that he didn't like the Kpaca Lynch a couple times (#534, #571). Says he'll vote AG, Vaimes, RE or Shadow. Has also stated being against lynching Shinichi. I need to look at WG and Shin interactions too.
kpaca: Nothing here. Wasn't around and was trolling this game.
Looking at this carefully, I came up with a reason that Shin might be scum. I've stated several times that he hasn't used this ability in a malicious way, but I forgot about the possibility of him using it to town clear himself.
I WIN!!!!!!
See Order of Actions:
Killing Actions take place BEFORE gathering information!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
VOTE: Vaimes
I don't get it. Why is that significant?
Vaimes shouldn't have been able to get a result on Rhand and therefore targeted someone else.
For reals? Dang o_O
vote: Vaimes
Unless someone can offer another explanation to this, I don't see a better place to put my vote atm
Also, why do you assume that he targeted someone else? Well, actually, I'd probably do the same, but he could have still targeted Rhand and did the thing Terry suggested to cover up his tracks.
If he targeted Rhand he would have the correct answer. He either didn't use the shot or targeted someone else with it.
That was silly. I still stand by my #920 post. I don't know what to make of the people who haven't said anything about it.
Vote: AG
Yes I get all the arguments that he's a claimed PR and force scum to deal with him, but it's just not likely to be a town ability and AG has dome approximately nothing that is townie.
*Quick aside I love that RE and Terry put aside their differences to jump at Vaimes there. After each other all game but putting it aside like that gives me a fresh t/t vibe.
You're totally going to jinx it.
...
I'm really torn on the whole AG thing, which is why I want to hear from other people.
I shouldn't think about this anymore, it's getting shotty.
Also can you get to this?
I still think that the best place to scumhunt would be on my wagon:
kpaca (5): Vaimes, Grapefruit21, AtheistGod, shadowlancerx, Mindreaver
I think Vaimes is town.
I think Grape is town.
I think shadow is town, though with his non-participation Today that is sortt of dropping off?
I'm fairly sure that scum is in between (AG/Mind) but I haven't looked at AG's most recent posts so I will go ahead and do that.
Ok makes sense Ive seen roles like that before, ive never used a neighborizor before so i cant provide much input seeing as how i hate that role with a passion. Are you implying that those announcements are just random post from the host and that im just taking credit for them. Im just confused.
I'm sorry but that whole thing took a lot of wind out of my sails.
After my encounter with a mafia neighborizor ill never just confirm alignment based on that role alone, and same goes for my own role since i've given it to a scum before. We may not have a direct cop, it could be possible that the cop ability is given to someone every night more or less do to another player. This is obviously only based on 1 account that was given by vaimes.
Not trying to say your wrong, but doesnt assuming theres a roleblocker hinder our movements and abilities? Isn't it better to think everything through assuming no one can stop your action.
Well you caught me due to my grammar before that, and i rather out myself now then have to counterclaim. I won't be able to prove a role is mine as easily as others. Also i always play with an unconcerned attitude.
1.This is just a game.
2.Overreacting gives away to much alignment information so i just stay calm.
Hold on while I catch up and place a vote.