For what its worth, I'm going to be away from keyboard and mobile access for the next several hours, possibly past 8 or 9 pm tonight(currently 10:40 am my time).
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Quote from Vaimes »
We see the wild Zenzao going about his natural routine, almost like clockwork: lurking around the savanna (his desktop) and occasionally moseying up to other gentle creatures; until around sundown, at which point he packs up and makes for his tree (goes mobile) where he will spend the rest of the evening alone and undisturbed. A healthy Zenzao will prefer not sleep for some time, and their precise waking time is currently unknown.
Zenzao, I don't need your ******* help to survive to endgame. I'm more than capable of doing it by myself, thanks. I don't even like endgames where I feel like it's on me to make the win or lose decision.
I'm defending you because it's MyLo and I need to believe in my townreads or I'm going to go insane with indecision.
Be back during my break, in like, a couple hours or something.
Eh, the stress isn't worth it. Might as well hammer now rather than later and we can either be done for good or move on to Night. I can't imagine shadow will say anything mind-blowing that'll change my mind.
Everyone not voting shadow cannot be scum with 2 people on the wagon so shadow is probably just scum.
Vote shadow
I'd say gg tom/Zenzao/Rod team, but from the way Rod egged on Zenzao a couple times idk if I can see them being buddies.
In the abstract, that looks exactly like the kind of post scum makes to a townie. Because they (usually) don't really mean it, they're just trying to get the townie to back off. Scarbo made similar posts in Trigger Happy, if I recall correctly.
~snip~
~snip~
TL;DR - Yes, I'm going to come after you if you poke me and call me scum or dodge around me. The former is Titus/Mathblade(and I have dropped out of a game before upon seeing Titus /in as well) now Seppel, the latter is Fonti now Eco. I felt Eco's avoidance of dealing with me was a little too similar to Mimefia!Fonti.
But the question is would you do that as scum? Like. Vaimes doesn't think you would. Last time you were scum was like two years ago? and you've been in some games since then. I'm not as confident as Vaimes that your scum game would just stay the same even if you've not rolled scum since then.
Either the scum are Silver/Shadow/X and they've played terribly and have managed to escape lynches basically through luck, or the team is Vaimes/Tom/Zen and they've just hung back and let the town run over themselves. Why is no-one interested in trying to work it out and just picking the easy option?
Half of them are scum (tom/rod/zen probably) and the rest are tunneling because shadow has been their scumspect since D1.
Either the scum are Silver/Shadow/X and they've played terribly and have managed to escape lynches basically through luck, or the team is Vaimes/Tom/Zen and they've just hung back and let the town run over themselves. Why is no-one interested in trying to work it out and just picking the easy option?
How have they been playing terribly? If they're 2/3rds of the scumteam they've done brilliantly in allowing us to hang ourselves the past three Days and its only here in MyLo that they're on the chopping block. Scum!miner and scum!Citrus pulled it off in HPM despite scum!Jarizok's lynch D2.
shadow at L-1 in mylo.
anyone still think hes town?
He sure could be! If the team is you/Rodemy/Zen. If he were scum, wouldn't one of his buddies off wagon have hammered instead of letting him case you to spew you clear? *cough*
They have irrevocably tied themselves together, and only survived D1 because of a CFD and D2 because I joined the game and made a strong case on Mindreaver. Why are you trying to defend how well they've played when Shadow is moments away from the lynch right now?
Look, the only possible game-ending scumhammer could have come from Silver or Eco, and nether of them did it. So either shadow is scum, or the exact scumteam is tom/Rod/Zenzao. And I'm sorry, but I just don't believe that.
So if that's the team, **** me. I'll get over it but it would still be ridiculously embarrassing getting duped like that.
I had some lingering paranoia that tom was faking not knowing who Zenzao was when he first replaced in, but that's about it.
We see the wild Zenzao going about his natural routine, almost like clockwork: lurking around the savanna (his desktop) and occasionally moseying up to other gentle creatures; until around sundown, at which point he packs up and makes for his tree (goes mobile) where he will spend the rest of the evening alone and undisturbed. A healthy Zenzao will prefer not sleep for some time, and their precise waking time is currently unknown.
Also, back for intermission. Will be gone again after 4-ish. Nice job hammering bros.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Quote from Vaimes »
We see the wild Zenzao going about his natural routine, almost like clockwork: lurking around the savanna (his desktop) and occasionally moseying up to other gentle creatures; until around sundown, at which point he packs up and makes for his tree (goes mobile) where he will spend the rest of the evening alone and undisturbed. A healthy Zenzao will prefer not sleep for some time, and their precise waking time is currently unknown.
Nah, I just never had the right opportunity to post those last game and I figured the first is apropos to MyLo and the second is going to either make me celebrate(scum flip) or continue down my streak of depression (town flip) but at least the game will be done with and I can thus move on.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Quote from Vaimes »
We see the wild Zenzao going about his natural routine, almost like clockwork: lurking around the savanna (his desktop) and occasionally moseying up to other gentle creatures; until around sundown, at which point he packs up and makes for his tree (goes mobile) where he will spend the rest of the evening alone and undisturbed. A healthy Zenzao will prefer not sleep for some time, and their precise waking time is currently unknown.
Yeah, I think that cleared you(Vaimes) and maybe Eco, but not Silver.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Quote from Vaimes »
We see the wild Zenzao going about his natural routine, almost like clockwork: lurking around the savanna (his desktop) and occasionally moseying up to other gentle creatures; until around sundown, at which point he packs up and makes for his tree (goes mobile) where he will spend the rest of the evening alone and undisturbed. A healthy Zenzao will prefer not sleep for some time, and their precise waking time is currently unknown.
Yeah, I think that cleared you(Vaimes) and maybe Eco, but not Silver.
I mean if Shadow is scum, I don't really see how Silver can be Town anyway.
Yeah. And also for what its worth, I apologize for swearing at you 1416. This game has been a disaster for an introduction of my character to your site and player base and frankly I'm not sure I'm going to stick around after GameEnd to try and salvage things.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Quote from Vaimes »
We see the wild Zenzao going about his natural routine, almost like clockwork: lurking around the savanna (his desktop) and occasionally moseying up to other gentle creatures; until around sundown, at which point he packs up and makes for his tree (goes mobile) where he will spend the rest of the evening alone and undisturbed. A healthy Zenzao will prefer not sleep for some time, and their precise waking time is currently unknown.
We see the wild Zenzao going about his natural routine, almost like clockwork: lurking around the savanna (his desktop) and occasionally moseying up to other gentle creatures; until around sundown, at which point he packs up and makes for his tree (goes mobile) where he will spend the rest of the evening alone and undisturbed. A healthy Zenzao will prefer not sleep for some time, and their precise waking time is currently unknown.
Should I just suck it up and let you mislynch me? Like. I guess I could fake claim scum and let you feel better until I flip. Or I could self-vote and lurk it out to make you feel better. Or I could lolcat.
I've said all I have to say. No one's listening anyway because I'm lock scum so the game is over. I'm not fear mongering, I'm done arguing about it.
Should I just suck it up and let you mislynch me? Like. I guess I could fake claim scum and let you feel better until I flip. Or I could self-vote and lurk it out to make you feel better. Or I could lolcat.
I've said all I have to say. No one's listening anyway because I'm lock scum so the game is over. I'm not fear mongering, I'm done arguing about it.
What's funny about this is that you're so utterly convinced that the game will go on after shadow's flip that I can't view you as anything other than scum right now.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Quote from Vaimes »
We see the wild Zenzao going about his natural routine, almost like clockwork: lurking around the savanna (his desktop) and occasionally moseying up to other gentle creatures; until around sundown, at which point he packs up and makes for his tree (goes mobile) where he will spend the rest of the evening alone and undisturbed. A healthy Zenzao will prefer not sleep for some time, and their precise waking time is currently unknown.
The thing is. If it's you/tom/rod you would have just won, and if it's not then it's shadow/tom/rod and I'm dead tomorrow regardless. Because I'm pretty sure it isn't eco or vaimes.
If shadow is scum then who eats it tonight is going to set the table for tomorrow's banquet.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Quote from Vaimes »
We see the wild Zenzao going about his natural routine, almost like clockwork: lurking around the savanna (his desktop) and occasionally moseying up to other gentle creatures; until around sundown, at which point he packs up and makes for his tree (goes mobile) where he will spend the rest of the evening alone and undisturbed. A healthy Zenzao will prefer not sleep for some time, and their precise waking time is currently unknown.
Vaimes/Tom/Rodemy will death tunnel me. Rod already started backing off his town read on me to set it up.
They just need to convince you or zomg that I'm shadow's buddy to win.
Eh. I'll vote where the wind guides my sails at this wayward junction of the journey.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Quote from Vaimes »
We see the wild Zenzao going about his natural routine, almost like clockwork: lurking around the savanna (his desktop) and occasionally moseying up to other gentle creatures; until around sundown, at which point he packs up and makes for his tree (goes mobile) where he will spend the rest of the evening alone and undisturbed. A healthy Zenzao will prefer not sleep for some time, and their precise waking time is currently unknown.
Alright Silver, start talking. Let's skip past the "woe is me, you guys are going to lynch me and lose the game" bit, and you actually try and work out who the scum and are tell us why we shouldn't lynch you.
Alright Silver, start talking. Let's skip past the "woe is me, you guys are going to lynch me and lose the game" bit, and you actually try and work out who the scum and are tell us why we shouldn't lynch you.
Oh i am gonna give you a few reasons to actually lynch her. (Gasp!) That flip put you as prime suspect. And the fact you called me out for "setting you up for a mislynch" EOD "if shadow is scum" raises a lot of flags.
Changing my read on you for continueously townclearing my #1 scum read is NOT scummy. For you to make it seem like a scum move is grade a fear mongering.
Also want to look at vaimes for toMorrow. I think I figured this out :>
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Thank you for choosing
Rodemy Pizza
It’s not the best choice, but it’s a choice nonetheless
Please read shadow's mentions of DoTA and DoTA's mentions of shadow and tell me with a straight face that it doesn't set off every alarm bell under the sun.
Vaimes/Tom/Rodemy will death tunnel me. Rod already started backing off his town read on me to set it up.
They just need to convince you or zomg that I'm shadow's buddy to win.
Also, why did you rank Eco next to a town PR as equally likely to die last Night?
Yeah, I tunneled Silver all game and now I'm going to magically try and save him. 'Cause we're scumbuddies.
If scum No Kill and we No Lynch, the mod will probably just RNG a kill or something. It's not a waste if we force scum to give us a townflip and narrow down the lynch pool further.
You cannot see it as an option because you think about things very superficially.
I wrote this up over Night. Was hoping for a bit more time to look for stuff, but. This is what I have so far.
I fully expect to be lynched. No hard feelings on my part. I thought about it for a long time and my conscience won’t let me roll over and take it. At least this way I can honestly say I tried. My apologies for my behavior up to this point. I've said this before, but it bears repeating: my heart’s not really in this game and I’ve been dealing with some real life stuff. You get this instead of self-voting/lurking/feel-bads because I’m not willing to let the game end like this because of me. I like most of the players I’ve played with here and don’t want to burn bridges, so consider this a sort of combination olive branch/desperate plea/last ditch effort/apology/swan song/love letter.
Let’s get on with it. This is my self-defense. Apologies for the wine in advance, but it doesn't seem like anyone else is going to say it and it needs to be said.
Recall that AG thought I was either amazing scum or just town (#627). The CFD onto him was my idea (pages 15-16) and after it occurred he said not to lynch me. Not worth anything really on its own, but he still believed I was town after I got him lynched.
Mete0rShower was townreading me and shadow when he died on N1 (#673).
Then I helped lynch Mindreaver, who also thought we both might be town.
And then I supposedly killed Seppel who also also thought I was town.
Basically, to say shadow and I are buddies is to say that we literally killed or I helped to lynch everyone that defended us while leaving everyone who thought we were scum together alive.
Even if you disagree with that argument, my true alignment should be plain from my thought processes. I’ve been as transparent as I can. There’s not even a real case against me in the thread except that everyone thinks I’m scum with shadow because shadow mentioned DoTA without talking to him on the bottom of like the second page and I defended shadow after we were already tied together by tom, when I should have tried to distance from him instead while I still had a chance. I had a bad read and I defended shadow because I thought he was town. It happens.
Anyway. Now the stuff I actually want to talk about. The remaining scum are tomsloger and Rodemy.
The two of them make sense as scum specifically together and with shadow:
1) Tom and Rodemy’s lover fake claim is exactly the kind of thing tom would do with a scum buddy, and the kicker is it’s also not really fake. Like, tom literally said they had a private chat about them scum reading me and shadow together. Right after Rodemy made a waffly post about me and concluded I might not be scum and he didn’t want to lynch me:
Rodemy, why do we agree on nothing but shadow?
What happened to our talk in mason chat?
So they probably have day chat. Or at least they did for D1.
2) I’m also guessing they used day chat to coach shadow into buddying me to make the alignment between us stronger when I came in defending him. He did a pretty abrupt 180 after I made that big post defending him, which could have been that. I guess maybe he just thought “*****, I can’t act suspicious of him any more because it’ll look bad.” But this was definitely the plan starting on N1 if it wasn’t the plan before that.
4) shadow RVS’d tom. That’s a scumtell, right? I mean, it was. Proph said it was anyway. No? Ok. I guess you have to trust me that tom/rod/shadow set me up. Tom/shadow interactions range from pretty soft to non-existent and shadow/rod interactions consistent entirely of rod waffling hard and behaving extremely erratically until the whole game wanted shadow dead, at which point he turbodeathtunnels him (to death) for the towncred.
Tom’s progression on Mindreaver/Huntz:
First, he scumreads Huntzilla for scumreading him for doing math someone else asked for. (Shadow asked for, in fact). He supposedly actually believes in this read even though it’s basically OMGUS, but then when he makes a scum list Huntzilla is no where to be seen. A while later, he tells Vaimes this nonsense: “we read huntz the same way. you can always find scummy things from him, so you have to look for townie things instead. i thought he had several.” But then he goes on to say that Mindreaver could be powerwolfing by throwing out buzzwords and asks if Vaimes thinks Mindreaver could be scum! Then Mindreaver says something about how #dazzling I will be which tom construes as a potential TMI slip, and rather than pushing his new scum read and considering I might be town, he continues to push his shadow/silver world and keeps Mindreaver’s TMI in his pocket. Probably so he can use that to lynch Mindreaver after I flip town.
Tom’s lack of anything:
Since the game got onto the course that would win him the game (lynch me/shadow/mindreaver) he’s done basically nothing but coast. No attempt to reevaluate, no townie waffling like Vaimes and Eco did. But, he didn’t push his scum reads either! He just sat back and let others choose the lynches while saying they could be town. He didn’t even consider for a single minute that shadow would flip town. He doesn't even have a third plausible scum for me/shadow!
Misc Tom Thoughts:
He’s been openly wolfing all game. He buddied Vaimes hard, fake claimed lovers then used it to talk about scum chat in thread, pushed the me/shadow alignment with Mindreaver on the side to score two mislynches for one bus, and was fine scumreading shadow without actively pushing his wagon.
Rodemy’s D1 waffle:
When Huntz first reaction-baits shadow, Rodemy pounces on him, then waffles hard. Like. Just read the post at the top of page 10 of Rodemy’s iso and then the ninth page from bottom to top. Actually, scratch that. Just read this in light of shadow’s scum flip:
So now i can't take back my vote on shadow because "oh ***** he is very scum keel naow plz" will happen
I am legit worried. Shadow screamed scum to me. But theb he makes very tiny points that make me question that read as well.
Like, him calling me out as scum makes me want to re read him? Is that normal? Maybe i am drilling down a townie and poor guy will get mislynched.
Or maybe i am actually right in my scum read and he is just ****in with my head.
Hete is my free flow thought process, from brain to keyboard
It's odd that shadow is calling me scum for calling him scum. Yes, maybe calling him out on taking a step back was low.
But hunts ideas were so good. Why worry about what a no lynch does? Math does nothing. Focusing on his rvs no lynch vote is just.. dumb. So dumb. Ugggggghhhh.
But shadow says he was honestly confused.
And now i am scum with DoTA in his mind.
Which is weird because i was just trying to make sense of him and hunts banter.
I am just gonna keep my vote and hope for the best.
I think i am overthinking.
I sided with hunt, i will stick with hunt. In hunt i trust.
****.
**** ****.
You better be scum or imma feel bad.
Feeling bad is bad
So, initially I thought the emotion here was real. It was part of my town case for Rodemy a while back when shadow asked for it. But read the bolded. It perfectly encapsulates Rodemy's entire read. "So now i can't take back my vote on shadow because "oh ***** he is very scum keel naow plz" will happen" He’s worried that if he backs off of shadow he will be scum read. "I sided with hunt, i will stick with hunt." He's sticking with Hunt because he already took Huntz' side, not because he actually came to the conclusion that the read is accurate.
He thought his buddy shadow was going to get lynched, but he couldn't decide whether to bus or not. Once he starts bussing hard, Huntz replaces out and Mindreaver, who is the Huntz slot, starts saying shadow’s wagon is bad and it looks like shadow might get off because the wagon pusher is gone. But Rodemy sticks with Huntz’ case. Why? because he #1 knows the read is correct, #2 doesn’t want to be seen backing off shadow weakly when shadow flips scum, and #3 has already committed to agreeing with Huntz. He even asks Mindreaver if he is aware that his slot was pushing the wagon! He’s confused because Huntz replaced out, his replacement didn’t start pushing shadow even though Rodemy knew it was correct for him to do so, and he doesn’t know whether he should let shadow slide or not.
The “Rodemy knew Mindreaver was going to flip town” slip:
Due to wagon speed, there's probably already one scum on him. Also, Tordeck missed shadow's vote on Zen but this is the official vote count. I'm manually tracking votes from this count forward.
There's some back and forth between me and eco mostly where he thinks I should be bussing Mindreaver (lol). Rodemy votes shadow for not voting his scum read then unvotes entirely when he realizes shadow's vote was missed. Vaimes tries to convince me and shadow to either scum read each other or Mindreaver.
shadow makes a long~ish post of his reads and says tom is most likely scum, then votes him. Current vote count:
Then Rodemy votes shadow for voting tom? Then immediately goes back to Mindreaver, putting Mind at L-1. So I unvote to get a reads list and stuff from Mind, and this happens...
You could've stayed on him.
Like. That's why I unvoted.
If you want to lynch him go ahead.
I'd just rather not have him at L-1 until he says some stuff.
Otherwise he could self-hammer or something.
I don't remember, but don't normally scum self-hammer?
I don't see why he would if he were town.
I would be more concerned about scum throwing down the hammer real fast. I have seen that happen before.
Nah, my vote is staying on shadow. I wanted to see if anyone jumped at the quick hammer. Testing waters, ya know? "fun" as I called it. (remember i am the man who would shoot first in RVS if i had a vig shot)
This whole exchange reads really weirdly to me. Especially the last post. Like Rodemy knew Mind was town, almost? He says "don't normally scum self-hammer? I don't see why he would if he were town" like he believed Mind wouldn't self-hammer. And then "I would be more concerned about scum throwing down the hammer real fast. I have seen that happen before." But that's only a concern if Mindreaver is town. And Rodemy thinks he is scum, doesn't he? Also, how could he bait the quick hammer if he actually thought Mind was scum? Scum wouldn't quick hammer their buddy, and even if they did quick hammering scum is usually NAI. It certainly wouldn't out them if they quick hammered a buddy.
Moving on from there, we got silver who needs to really reassess shadow or i'm gonna have to switch my sights a bit. I do not like how after so many town flips you have yet to change your view in him.
Why is it more likely shadow than tom? Why are you now creating a narrative that I'm not "reevaluating" when no one else seems to be either? What makes my failure to reevaluate worse than yours, or Vaimes', or tom's? Are you even trying to view the game through my reads or are you just trying to pressure me into flipping on shadow?
The last one.
I want a scum flip, god damnit.
He knew shadow was scum and I’m town. He was trying to get me to flip my read on shadow by threatening me. He outright admitted it.
Anyway, that’s all I’ve got. It’s tom/Rodemy or I’ll eat my hat. I challenge anyone to draw up an alignment between me and someone else in the game still that is plausible scum. Go ahead.Final Thoughts:
Lolme.
GG Rodemy and shadow, the pair that completely snowed me. I won’t be making that mistake again.
One day I’ll get scum!tom lynched. Hopefully it’s toDay. I’m mildly infuriated that he had the gall to tell me I wasn’t my town!self on D1 while knowing my alignment the entire time, but that’s whatever I guess. GG regardless, though I had you nailed on D1 and just couldn’t get you lynched.
Apologies again to the game as a whole for my negativity. I probably shouldn’t have been playing Mafia, especially at the time I replaced in, but I had already signed up to replace and didn’t want the game to suffer a modkill. I figured I would just replace in, force some interactions, get lynched, flip town, and be on my way, but I dodged the noose and it turned into an extra stressor that I couldn’t really handle. I’m a ~bit better now that exams are over and I’ve had a night to cool off but this is probably my last real sign up for a while.
To AG, if you’re reading this:
I normally hate CFDs and I won’t be spearheading another again. I should have stuck to Shockwave or hammered shadow if we couldn’t agree.
To Mindreaver, with love:
I should’ve trusted my read on Huntz and not let tom/Vaimes talk me into lynching you. I wanted to give you additional time to respond but then they lynched you while I was gone.
Also, a direct apology to Vaimes.
You bore the brunt of my negativity and you didn’t deserve it. I’m sorry.
Some of this should probably have been shelved until post game but I needed to get it off my chest.
If any of the other town players have questions I’ll answer them. Questions/comments from tom will receive eyerolls unless they're substantial. I'll talk to Rodemy if he has a defense. But now at least I can honestly say that, to the best of my ability, I have articulated all of the thoughts in my head, in what I hope is a grokable fashion, in a single place for you to see. Ask me anything, I’m an open book. Oh, one more thing.
Because I am currently the default lynch, I know who the scum team is, and I believe in my sovereign right to have and choose my own counterwagon...
I will start the voting.
vote: tomsloger
It’s you or me now, bud. Good luck, and may the scum player lose.
Yeah, I tunneled Silver all game and now I'm going to magically try and save him. 'Cause we're scumbuddies.
If scum No Kill and we No Lynch, the mod will probably just RNG a kill or something. It's not a waste if we force scum to give us a townflip and narrow down the lynch pool further.
You cannot see it as an option because you think about things very superficially.
That is assuming a lot from the mod in order to tell me i am wrong.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Thank you for choosing
Rodemy Pizza
It’s not the best choice, but it’s a choice nonetheless
Nono silver. You are not gonna try and pin me as scum.
Believe it or not, i am actually fairly good at this game. Look at BRB. I figured out 3/4ths of the scum team. I wanted to actually stick with my gut and hey, i was right.
This time i took a more bold route and stuck to shadow. Yes, i went between hunt and shadow, only because i wasn't sure. That was a very hard interaction to analyzze. But i stuck with shadow. And hey, shadow flipped scum.
How is sticking to my read scummy?
Re: mindreaver. Yeah, that was me jumping the gun. I wanted to lynch scum, the case on him was very good. I was wrong, happens.
Toms post doesn't strike me as alignment indicitive.
You purposefully are misunderstanding what i meant.
You said that you didnt want him to self hammer, i did not see that as a bad thing concidering i thought he was scum.
I was questioning why him self hammering wad a bad thing. That is all.
I wanted to see if he was quick hammmered and he flips scum, who did it and why.
My brain works weird. Can't really apologize for that.
Re you on shadow, i wanted you to reevaluate shadow because he was my biggest scum read. Tom wasn't in danger of getting lynched so why would i care if you flipped your read in him.
I was as adement in my scum read of him as you were in your town read.
Guess who was right.
Tom never pinged my radar and i disagreed with you on that read, but since tom wasnt getting lynched, i didn't bother to concider asking you to switch on him.
You were one of the people constantly veering us away from shadows lynch and it got frustrating.
I can't see you as anything but scum now.
vote silver
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Thank you for choosing
Rodemy Pizza
It’s not the best choice, but it’s a choice nonetheless
Nono silver. You are not gonna try and pin me as scum.
But you are. Are you going to sit there with a straight face and tell me it's Vaimes or Eco? Or are you going to try to tell Vaimes/Eco that it's me/Zen? Good luck.
Believe it or not, i am actually fairly good at this game. Look at BRB. I figured out 3/4ths of the scum team. I wanted to actually stick with my gut and hey, i was right.
I didn't believe it before. I know better now. Your tone and mannerisms fooled me completely.
This time i took a more bold route and stuck to shadow. Yes, i went between hunt and shadow, only because i wasn't sure. That was a very hard interaction to analyzze. But i stuck with shadow. And hey, shadow flipped scum.
But you knew he was going to. It's part of my case.
How is sticking to my read scummy?
It was never your read, though. It was Huntz' read that led you to death tunnel shadow. It all fits.
Re: mindreaver. Yeah, that was me jumping the gun. I wanted to lynch scum, the case on him was very good. I was wrong, happens.
Toms post doesn't strike me as alignment indicitive.
Can't afford to bus your other buddy, after all.
You purposefully are misunderstanding what i meant.
You said that you didnt want him to self hammer, i did not see that as a bad thing concidering i thought he was scum.
I was questioning why him self hammering wad a bad thing. That is all.
Because if he had been scum, he'd either have to scum claim/lolcat/etc. or give reads that could spew or eliminate possible scumspects if he can't self hammer.
I wanted to see if he was quick hammmered and he flips scum, who did it and why.
Scum wouldn't quick hammer their buddy. That's the whole point. If he flips scum there's no data at all. The only way you could get something out of the potential quickhammer is if he flips town.
Re you on shadow, i wanted you to reevaluate shadow because he was my biggest scum read. Tom wasn't in danger of getting lynched so why would i care if you flipped your read in him.
You literally said you wanted me to flip on shadow because you wanted a scum flip. You knew. It's in the case.
I was as adement in my scum read of him as you were in your town read. Guess who was right.
Yeah, see, even this is pinging me because if I'm scum with shadow, my read is fake, not wrong. If my read is wrong I'm town. And even now you're trying to get the towncred by taking credit for being right about shadow.
Tom never pinged my radar and i disagreed with you on that read, but since tom wasnt getting lynched, i didn't bother to concider asking you to switch on him.
Hmm? I never said you wanted me to flip on tom. Could you quote that so I know what you're talking about? preview edit: actually, I guess you're talking about when I asked you why it was more likely shadow than tom? I asked that because there was never a good case on shadow and I wanted you to make one. I opposed the shadow lynch solely on those grounds because lynches after bad cases are bad lynches. I will always oppose bad cases and make town cases on people who have bad cases against them in order to force good cases.
You were one of the people constantly veering us away from shadows lynch and it got frustrating.
I can't see you as anything but scum now.
vote silver
Of course not. But you were always going to vote me because you have to in order to win. The post isn't really directed at you. I'm more interested in Vaimes, Zen, and Eco's thoughts to be honest - but everyone deserves their day in court, so to speak.
I'm defending you because it's MyLo and I need to believe in my townreads or I'm going to go insane with indecision.
Be back during my break, in like, a couple hours or something.
>not even one mentions Rodemy's potential slip
>shadow wants to make a big post Sunday
>no one is waiting
>tom is outed scum
>no one believes me
You people make me want to hammer him myself just to get it over with.
There's no real interest in discussion.
If you don't have anything else to say and aren't going to talk about what other people are saying, dragging this out is a waste of time.
Hammer him and get it over with. I hope I'm wrong but if he's town we deserve it, frankly.
shadowlancerx - Rodemy, ZenzaoDLP, tomsloger, zomgarcwind
tomsloger - shadowlancerx, Silvercrys3467
With 8 alive the threshold is 5.
Deadline is set for 2369 GMT-6 January 2nd.
The Family
Everyone not voting shadow cannot be scum with 2 people on the wagon so shadow is probably just scum.
Vote shadow
I'd say gg tom/Zenzao/Rod team, but from the way Rod egged on Zenzao a couple times idk if I can see them being buddies.
So you reread and think tom might be scum, but want to lynch shadow first... why? Inertia? Do you think they could be scum buddies?
Half of them are scum (tom/rod/zen probably) and the rest are tunneling because shadow has been their scumspect since D1.
He sure could be! If the team is you/Rodemy/Zen. If he were scum, wouldn't one of his buddies off wagon have hammered instead of letting him case you to spew you clear? *cough*
I guess no big post for me.
So if that's the team, **** me. I'll get over it but it would still be ridiculously embarrassing getting duped like that.
I had some lingering paranoia that tom was faking not knowing who Zenzao was when he first replaced in, but that's about it.
r u scum doe?
Going to make us wait for the flip?
Then everything doesn't suck, maybe.
I mean if Shadow is scum, I don't really see how Silver can be Town anyway.
If shadow is scum, you'll lynch me tomorrow and regret everything.
Doesn't matter. Game is over regardless. I'll just get quick lynched because I don't think anyone is actually reading my posts.
Yeah. And also for what its worth, I apologize for swearing at you 1416. This game has been a disaster for an introduction of my character to your site and player base and frankly I'm not sure I'm going to stick around after GameEnd to try and salvage things.
Only the best for you, my dear
watsonVaimes!I've said all I have to say. No one's listening anyway because I'm lock scum so the game is over. I'm not fear mongering, I'm done arguing about it.
What's funny about this is that you're so utterly convinced that the game will go on after shadow's flip that I can't view you as anything other than scum right now.
So... yeah.
Regardless of who is scum, if shadow is town we lose.
If shadow is scum I'm dead.
Vaimes/Tom/Rodemy will death tunnel me. Rod already started backing off his town read on me to set it up.
They just need to convince you or zomg that I'm shadow's buddy to win.
Unless he's scum and trolling for revenge for me modkilling him.
shadowlancerx - Rodemy, ZenzaoDLP, tomsloger, zomgarcwind, Vaimes
tomsloger - shadowlancerx, Silvercrys3467
shadowlancerx has been lynched.. He was Mafia Goon.
It is now Night 3.
Deadline is set for 2369 GMT-6 December 20th.
The Family
With 6 alive the threshold is 4.
Day 4 deadline is set for 2359 GMT-6 on January 2nd
The Family
Oh i am gonna give you a few reasons to actually lynch her. (Gasp!) That flip put you as prime suspect. And the fact you called me out for "setting you up for a mislynch" EOD "if shadow is scum" raises a lot of flags.
Changing my read on you for continueously townclearing my #1 scum read is NOT scummy. For you to make it seem like a scum move is grade a fear mongering.
Also want to look at vaimes for toMorrow. I think I figured this out :>
Silver, why do i think you are female ._.
But it's probably just Silver.
---
Silver, remember when you reread DoTA? Do that again, and give your honest opinion on his shadow read.
Problem: scum can do a no kill at night and we would have just wasted a day. Nice try tho.
Or, it takes away one town toNight and no scum toDay.
I can't see a No Lynch as an option today.
You suggesting that is a poor town play.
Why sacrifice a townie? Postponing silvers lynch are we?
If scum No Kill and we No Lynch, the mod will probably just RNG a kill or something. It's not a waste if we force scum to give us a townflip and narrow down the lynch pool further.
You cannot see it as an option because you think about things very superficially.
NL is a totally fine option. I imagine I'd probably die, but the kill after that would be very enlightening.
I fully expect to be lynched. No hard feelings on my part. I thought about it for a long time and my conscience won’t let me roll over and take it. At least this way I can honestly say I tried. My apologies for my behavior up to this point. I've said this before, but it bears repeating: my heart’s not really in this game and I’ve been dealing with some real life stuff. You get this instead of self-voting/lurking/feel-bads because I’m not willing to let the game end like this because of me. I like most of the players I’ve played with here and don’t want to burn bridges, so consider this a sort of combination olive branch/desperate plea/last ditch effort/apology/swan song/love letter.
Let’s get on with it.
This is my self-defense. Apologies for the wine in advance, but it doesn't seem like anyone else is going to say it and it needs to be said.
Recall that AG thought I was either amazing scum or just town (#627). The CFD onto him was my idea (pages 15-16) and after it occurred he said not to lynch me. Not worth anything really on its own, but he still believed I was town after I got him lynched.
Mete0rShower was townreading me and shadow when he died on N1 (#673).
Then I helped lynch Mindreaver, who also thought we both might be town.
And then I supposedly killed Seppel who also also thought I was town.
Basically, to say shadow and I are buddies is to say that we literally killed or I helped to lynch everyone that defended us while leaving everyone who thought we were scum together alive.
Even if you disagree with that argument, my true alignment should be plain from my thought processes. I’ve been as transparent as I can. There’s not even a real case against me in the thread except that everyone thinks I’m scum with shadow because shadow mentioned DoTA without talking to him on the bottom of like the second page and I defended shadow after we were already tied together by tom, when I should have tried to distance from him instead while I still had a chance. I had a bad read and I defended shadow because I thought he was town. It happens.
Anyway. Now the stuff I actually want to talk about.
The remaining scum are tomsloger and Rodemy.
The two of them make sense as scum specifically together and with shadow:
1) Tom and Rodemy’s lover fake claim is exactly the kind of thing tom would do with a scum buddy, and the kicker is it’s also not really fake. Like, tom literally said they had a private chat about them scum reading me and shadow together. Right after Rodemy made a waffly post about me and concluded I might not be scum and he didn’t want to lynch me: So they probably have day chat. Or at least they did for D1.
2) I’m also guessing they used day chat to coach shadow into buddying me to make the alignment between us stronger when I came in defending him. He did a pretty abrupt 180 after I made that big post defending him, which could have been that. I guess maybe he just thought “*****, I can’t act suspicious of him any more because it’ll look bad.” But this was definitely the plan starting on N1 if it wasn’t the plan before that.
3) Presented without comment: 4) shadow RVS’d tom. That’s a scumtell, right? I mean, it was. Proph said it was anyway. No? Ok. I guess you have to trust me that tom/rod/shadow set me up. Tom/shadow interactions range from pretty soft to non-existent and shadow/rod interactions consistent entirely of rod waffling hard and behaving extremely erratically until the whole game wanted shadow dead, at which point he turbodeathtunnels him (to death) for the towncred.
Tom’s progression on Mindreaver/Huntz:
First, he scumreads Huntzilla for scumreading him for doing math someone else asked for. (Shadow asked for, in fact). He supposedly actually believes in this read even though it’s basically OMGUS, but then when he makes a scum list Huntzilla is no where to be seen. A while later, he tells Vaimes this nonsense: “we read huntz the same way. you can always find scummy things from him, so you have to look for townie things instead. i thought he had several.” But then he goes on to say that Mindreaver could be powerwolfing by throwing out buzzwords and asks if Vaimes thinks Mindreaver could be scum! Then Mindreaver says something about how #dazzling I will be which tom construes as a potential TMI slip, and rather than pushing his new scum read and considering I might be town, he continues to push his shadow/silver world and keeps Mindreaver’s TMI in his pocket. Probably so he can use that to lynch Mindreaver after I flip town.
Tom’s lack of anything:
Since the game got onto the course that would win him the game (lynch me/shadow/mindreaver) he’s done basically nothing but coast. No attempt to reevaluate, no townie waffling like Vaimes and Eco did. But, he didn’t push his scum reads either! He just sat back and let others choose the lynches while saying they could be town. He didn’t even consider for a single minute that shadow would flip town. He doesn't even have a third plausible scum for me/shadow!
Misc Tom Thoughts:
He’s been openly wolfing all game. He buddied Vaimes hard, fake claimed lovers then used it to talk about scum chat in thread, pushed the me/shadow alignment with Mindreaver on the side to score two mislynches for one bus, and was fine scumreading shadow without actively pushing his wagon.
Rodemy’s D1 waffle:
When Huntz first reaction-baits shadow, Rodemy pounces on him, then waffles hard. Like. Just read the post at the top of page 10 of Rodemy’s iso and then the ninth page from bottom to top. Actually, scratch that. Just read this in light of shadow’s scum flip:
He thought his buddy shadow was going to get lynched, but he couldn't decide whether to bus or not. Once he starts bussing hard, Huntz replaces out and Mindreaver, who is the Huntz slot, starts saying shadow’s wagon is bad and it looks like shadow might get off because the wagon pusher is gone. But Rodemy sticks with Huntz’ case. Why? because he #1 knows the read is correct, #2 doesn’t want to be seen backing off shadow weakly when shadow flips scum, and #3 has already committed to agreeing with Huntz. He even asks Mindreaver if he is aware that his slot was pushing the wagon! He’s confused because Huntz replaced out, his replacement didn’t start pushing shadow even though Rodemy knew it was correct for him to do so, and he doesn’t know whether he should let shadow slide or not.
The “Rodemy knew Mindreaver was going to flip town” slip:
Rodemy slipped again yesterDay:
He knew shadow was scum and I’m town. He was trying to get me to flip my read on shadow by threatening me. He outright admitted it.
Anyway, that’s all I’ve got. It’s tom/Rodemy or I’ll eat my hat. I challenge anyone to draw up an alignment between me and someone else in the game still that is plausible scum. Go ahead.
Final Thoughts:
Lolme.
GG Rodemy and shadow, the pair that completely snowed me. I won’t be making that mistake again.
One day I’ll get scum!tom lynched. Hopefully it’s toDay. I’m mildly infuriated that he had the gall to tell me I wasn’t my town!self on D1 while knowing my alignment the entire time, but that’s whatever I guess. GG regardless, though I had you nailed on D1 and just couldn’t get you lynched.
Apologies again to the game as a whole for my negativity. I probably shouldn’t have been playing Mafia, especially at the time I replaced in, but I had already signed up to replace and didn’t want the game to suffer a modkill. I figured I would just replace in, force some interactions, get lynched, flip town, and be on my way, but I dodged the noose and it turned into an extra stressor that I couldn’t really handle. I’m a ~bit better now that exams are over and I’ve had a night to cool off but this is probably my last real sign up for a while.
To AG, if you’re reading this:
I normally hate CFDs and I won’t be spearheading another again. I should have stuck to Shockwave or hammered shadow if we couldn’t agree.
To Mindreaver, with love:
I should’ve trusted my read on Huntz and not let tom/Vaimes talk me into lynching you. I wanted to give you additional time to respond but then they lynched you while I was gone.
Also, a direct apology to Vaimes.
You bore the brunt of my negativity and you didn’t deserve it. I’m sorry.
Some of this should probably have been shelved until post game but I needed to get it off my chest.
If any of the other town players have questions I’ll answer them. Questions/comments from tom will receive eyerolls unless they're substantial. I'll talk to Rodemy if he has a defense. But now at least I can honestly say that, to the best of my ability, I have articulated all of the thoughts in my head, in what I hope is a grokable fashion, in a single place for you to see. Ask me anything, I’m an open book.
Oh, one more thing.
Because I am currently the default lynch, I know who the scum team is, and I believe in my sovereign right to have and choose my own counterwagon...
I will start the voting.
vote: tomsloger
It’s you or me now, bud. Good luck, and may the scum player lose.
That is assuming a lot from the mod in order to tell me i am wrong.
Believe it or not, i am actually fairly good at this game. Look at BRB. I figured out 3/4ths of the scum team. I wanted to actually stick with my gut and hey, i was right.
This time i took a more bold route and stuck to shadow. Yes, i went between hunt and shadow, only because i wasn't sure. That was a very hard interaction to analyzze. But i stuck with shadow. And hey, shadow flipped scum.
How is sticking to my read scummy?
Re: mindreaver. Yeah, that was me jumping the gun. I wanted to lynch scum, the case on him was very good. I was wrong, happens.
Toms post doesn't strike me as alignment indicitive.
You purposefully are misunderstanding what i meant.
You said that you didnt want him to self hammer, i did not see that as a bad thing concidering i thought he was scum.
I was questioning why him self hammering wad a bad thing. That is all.
I wanted to see if he was quick hammmered and he flips scum, who did it and why.
My brain works weird. Can't really apologize for that.
Re you on shadow, i wanted you to reevaluate shadow because he was my biggest scum read. Tom wasn't in danger of getting lynched so why would i care if you flipped your read in him.
I was as adement in my scum read of him as you were in your town read.
Guess who was right.
Tom never pinged my radar and i disagreed with you on that read, but since tom wasnt getting lynched, i didn't bother to concider asking you to switch on him.
You were one of the people constantly veering us away from shadows lynch and it got frustrating.
I can't see you as anything but scum now.
vote silver
But you are. Are you going to sit there with a straight face and tell me it's Vaimes or Eco? Or are you going to try to tell Vaimes/Eco that it's me/Zen? Good luck. I didn't believe it before. I know better now. Your tone and mannerisms fooled me completely. But you knew he was going to. It's part of my case. It was never your read, though. It was Huntz' read that led you to death tunnel shadow. It all fits. Can't afford to bus your other buddy, after all. Because if he had been scum, he'd either have to scum claim/lolcat/etc. or give reads that could spew or eliminate possible scumspects if he can't self hammer. Scum wouldn't quick hammer their buddy. That's the whole point. If he flips scum there's no data at all. The only way you could get something out of the potential quickhammer is if he flips town. You literally said you wanted me to flip on shadow because you wanted a scum flip. You knew. It's in the case. Yeah, see, even this is pinging me because if I'm scum with shadow, my read is fake, not wrong. If my read is wrong I'm town. And even now you're trying to get the towncred by taking credit for being right about shadow. Hmm? I never said you wanted me to flip on tom. Could you quote that so I know what you're talking about?
preview edit: actually, I guess you're talking about when I asked you why it was more likely shadow than tom? I asked that because there was never a good case on shadow and I wanted you to make one. I opposed the shadow lynch solely on those grounds because lynches after bad cases are bad lynches. I will always oppose bad cases and make town cases on people who have bad cases against them in order to force good cases. Of course not. But you were always going to vote me because you have to in order to win. The post isn't really directed at you. I'm more interested in Vaimes, Zen, and Eco's thoughts to be honest - but everyone deserves their day in court, so to speak.