What if Iso knew your ability was formatted poorly and made a fake claim gambit so when this was discovered you wouldn't try again.
SHOOT HIM AGAIN.
Also I am voting Iso, but ##vote:Iso
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Your top 3 feel a little easy. Tordeck... I guess? Feels a little like you're kind of pushing the heat he's getting without really pushing it, by listing him that high. Plowshares got flack for his literally one post, but it's tough to believe that's your top scumread after reading the whole game. I do not understand CitricBase as your 3rd highest scumread. Elaborate?
The entire bottom chunk is unorganized. I feel much more confident in townreading people than scumreading them (whether or not I'm correctly reading them is a different matter entirely!), so. Townreads are organized, non-townreads were dumped at the bottom of the list. No specific ordering.
As far as CitricBase goes, I think I remember seeing some people listing him as town when I'm 90% sure he hasn't done anything that isn't super easy to fake. He has maybe...five posts? Eh. I'll double check later.
@Vaimes How am I looking these days? <3
I'll let you know once I've gone over your posts again!
Have to say, though, you actually asking for my opinion on you feels, uh. New.
I also noticed the "Ambassadors" vote is gone. S.C. is the only one of the three that aren't currently voting. So unless there is some strange stuff going on it would appear that S.C. has a double vote, which makes him town?
Nah, there is no way he knew, I'm not shooting him again. The formatting is crazy specific in a weird way, and I'm surprising that Taredas didn't just punish me for being sloppy honestly. This is like the reprieve of a lifetime for me, and I think I'll keep it in my pants for awhile this time. Also buddy, I think you need some sleep.
Anyway. I guess we need to be super specific about our votes. Vote:Iso
I actually think Iso might be some kind of Cult Leader or something, because when he threw out that breadcrumb early in the game, the first thought that came to mind for me was, "What, are you Hathor?"
Also not to be that guy but Hathor was dead by the time this game's episodes aired so... it's strange she'd be in to start <_<.
Also I was kidding about shooting him again, you're no fun.
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Also not to be that guy but Hathor was dead by the time this game's episodes aired so... it's strange she'd be in to start <_<.
Also I was kidding about shooting him again, you're no fun.
It's supposed to be a mirror universe or some *****, right? I'm sure they took some creative liberties with flavor.
I'm actually having a hard time justifying lynching a Hathor claim, honestly. Though at the same time, Ascetic Plus is a pretty absurd role for a townie to have. Feels like some kind of scum aligned neutral. And Iso's behavior feels completely anti-town. So **** it, all aboard let's go.
Ok, now that the invitational is over, I can finally explain why Chris is scum. I was afraid of compromising that gane where he was still alive as scum, because during the Night I was killed, the same thing made me realise he was scum there too.
Town!Chris has declared me sure town every time I attacked him in the early game. Without exception. The reason being that I wouldn't choose him as target if I were scum.
He's not doing that here. He is way more cautious with his read on me and doesn't go further than 'lean town', and only when explicitly asked for a read.
In the invitational, he acted the same: he never called me town while I was trying to get him lynched early game.
That is such a sharp contrast from his town!play, that I'm sure he's scum.
Ok, now that the invitational is over, I can finally explain why Chris is scum. I was afraid of compromising that gane where he was still alive as scum, because during the Night I was killed, the same thing made me realise he was scum there too.
Town!Chris has declared me sure town every time I attacked him in the early game. Without exception. The reason being that I wouldn't choose him as target if I were scum.
He's not doing that here. He is way more cautious with his read on me and doesn't go further than 'lean town', and only when explicitly asked for a read.
In the invitational, he acted the same: he never called me town while I was trying to get him lynched early game.
That is such a sharp contrast from his town!play, that I'm sure he's scum.
Lol like..have you read any of his posts this game? Literally a single one? They are so different from his posts in the Invitational that they might as well be made by a different person. He is not scum.
What's more, he is pretty clearly the Double Voter.(that cat is out of the bag now that tordeck and tapping are voting and the ambassadors vote is missing) You know. The double voter whose identity that you wanted to stay hidden because you were certain it was a town role?
Just go compared Predator Mafia to this game, then compare the Invitation to this game and/or to Avant Garde. Chris is a great player, but meta is a thing, no matter how much NotVoxx doesn't want it to be. Chris is town. Or at least, he isn't mafia. He could be SK or something I guess, I can't promise anything there, because I don't have any experience with him in that capacity. But he's not mafia.
Well if it makes you feel better it would be strange for a scum to use that logic to attack me, so...! Okay, so that's besides the point.
That type of town tell has an expiration date, Rhand. I am not so foolish as to say game after game "well you attacked me, you're town" and expect for a scum player to never catch on. I move on from stuff like that after awhile, Rhand. When is the last time we were town together? I think it's been quite some time.
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Just go compared Predator Mafia to this game, then compare the Invitation to this game and/or to Avant Garde. Chris is a great player, but meta is a thing, no matter how much NotVoxx doesn't want it to be. Chris is town. Or at least, he isn't mafia. He could be SK or something I guess, I can't promise anything there, because I don't have any experience with him in that capacity. But he's not mafia.
I understand that meta reads are not going to just going to go away. It's a tool, for sure. And one I even think can be helpful. It's just not at all to me personally in this situation, and it is one tool of many. Like. Rhand is casing Chris entirely on meta and you're clearing him entirely on meta. Don't you see the problem with that?
Just go compared Predator Mafia to this game, then compare the Invitation to this game and/or to Avant Garde. Chris is a great player, but meta is a thing, no matter how much NotVoxx doesn't want it to be. Chris is town. Or at least, he isn't mafia. He could be SK or something I guess, I can't promise anything there, because I don't have any experience with him in that capacity. But he's not mafia.
I understand that meta reads are not going to just going to go away. It's a tool, for sure. And one I even think can be helpful. It's just not at all to me personally in this situation, and it is one tool of many. Like. Rhand is casing Chris entirely on meta and you're clearing him entirely on meta. Don't you see the problem with that?
I understand where you are coming from. And I accept what you're saying. But at the same time, I'm comfortable with my assessment for the time being. Of course, I reserve the right to change my mind later if Chris is leading the charge and a bunch of town bodies start piling up. But I'll be pretty hard-pressed to do so as long as I think he's the double voter too. And despite what..some random person that I can't remember said..I haven't seen alot of double voters that can vote for 2 separate people(I HAVE seen this, but it is pretty rare, and the vote was not allowed to be a 'hidden' vote).
Ehh... best just to clarify this: I am not the double voter.
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oh, so remember that thing where i didnt have any work until new years? well i got a call a couple hours ago to work a ballet tomorrow. 3 hour drive, 16 hour day, probably sleep in a hotel, drive home.
annnnndddddd.....i leave in ~5 hours.
hopefully ill have some downtime, but its entirely possible yall wont have to put up with my inane bull***** until friday morning PST
Oh. So it is someone that can just place their extra vote where ever they want. Hmm, interesting stuff.
We'll miss you tom. I didn't like you you in predator, and your posting was part of why I didn't post and then replaced out, but you've been tons of fun in this game. Hope everything goes well at the ballet.
I question your town read on Vaimes though.
Most likely I'll just end up shooting whomever we decide to lynch today, that way we can actually have 2 lynches today. So really, we should try to lynch a non-Iso person first. And then lynch Iso second.
Poor Tom, I think I was the only person who liked him in Predator =(.
Geesh just looking over the list we have so many people who are gone for awhile still. Game won't even begin properly for awhile yet.
Good thing Iso has given up the goat.
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If/when the doublevoter is ever revealed, I won't be assigning them additional TownPoints (TM). The only other game I've played here was Vanillaville 2, where I replaced into an outed double-voter slot that turned out to be mafia, because of course it did :/
If/when the doublevoter is ever revealed, I won't be assigning them additional TownPoints (TM). The only other game I've played here was Vanillaville 2, where I replaced into an outed double-voter slot that turned out to be mafia, because of course it did :/
Oh. So it is someone that can just place their extra vote where ever they want. Hmm, interesting stuff.
We'll miss you tom. I didn't like you you in predator, and your posting was part of why I didn't post and then replaced out, but you've been tons of fun in this game. Hope everything goes well at the ballet.
I question your town read on Vaimes though.
Most likely I'll just end up shooting whomever we decide to lynch today, that way we can actually have 2 lynches today. So really, we should try to lynch a non-Iso person first. And then lynch Iso second.
I'm thinking something like a "hawk/Iso" or "Plowshares/Iso" looks like a fine day one.
When you make it back, I request elaboration on the following reads:
town!Vaimes. I'm interested in this one for Reasons which I'll elaborate on later.
town!ActualVoxx. The only reason I'm reading Voxx town AT ALL is a very specific, very meta "thing I predicted he'd do as scum that he kind of did try but in a way that I don't think he'd try as scum." Which is, you know, not exactly "lock clear." And also not something I'd expect anyone else to read him town for, so what are you reading him town for?
town!pengo. I feel like my read has kind of stagnated on him? But I feel very strongly that he's "active lurking" - having a thread presence, asking questions, but dancing away from stances, opinions, gamesolving, etc. IIRC you said something about his gimmick account identity and what he was doing with it made him town, or something? and obviously that's useless to me. So... anything else? Do you think he's making a sincere effort to solve the game? Because I think it only looks like he is.
Poor Tom, I think I was the only person who liked him in Predator =(.
Geesh just looking over the list we have so many people who are gone for awhile still. Game won't even begin properly for awhile yet.
Good thing Iso has given up the goat.
To be fair he isn't super annoying here. But I will readily admit that might be due to him not tunneling me. I really hated him ignoring the tell tale signs I was town and calling thinks like "his hunch" for scum reading me. Plus his post count isn't outrageous.
A lot of people are barely participating though.
Oh and Chris if you're not the double vote then what's happening here? Does someone else have "double-vote" and "secret-second vote"? Seems sketchy. Would you mind placing your vote randomly on me until the next vote count so we can confirm you are not the double voter?
...Why would I lie about not being a role often assumed as town? O_o. What a weird request, TS.
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...Why would I lie about not being a role often assumed as town? O_o. What a weird request, TS.
Who said you would lie? I just asked you to put your vote on me until the next vote count. It's weird for me to want to try and town clear you? I'm new but double vote, secret scum seems like a pretty crappy thing to put into a game.
Oh, you think I could be a double voter without knowing it? I'm not, I promise.
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If someone wants Chris to look like the double voter, they can just make the Ambassador vote follow him around, heh.
I do agree that tom's 'lean town' read of 'actualvoxx' is weird. If anything, I think that people should have a 'leanscum' read on actualvoxx, or a null read on him at best. He hasn't had much to say, and what he has said..well..hasn't said much.
I liked pengo for a bit, but I feel like when someone called him out on active lurking, he started to appear less, which is a bit telling. I don't know, it's hard to accuse people of much there, because of the holiday season.
Oh, you think I could be a double voter without knowing it? I'm not, I promise.
If you're scum we are going to have a nice little duel this game. I don't mind being David.
Why do I have a feeling we wont see that "Ambassador" vote again for a long time?
TS maybe this is just me being tired or something, but I have to admit I have no earthly idea what you're even on about, TS. Like what are you trying to say? Your words are holding no meaning to me right now.
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I really don't want to V/LA until after Christmas because it feels like half the ******* game is, and that's not fair to the mod or the players for me to do so too, but I have company from hell staying at my place for the rest of the month, and have no free time to think, let alone sit down and play this game properly.
On a completely unrelated note, does anyone know a guy who knows a guy who can hide some bodies?
So I got to thinking, because I know I have used the "you're attacking me, you're good" line a lot (I
even did this to clear my scumbuddy in the invitational) and I wondered aloud.... "Have I ever done it to
clear a town rhand as town?"
Castlevania: No Rhand
Celestial: Town Chris, Town Rhand (He calls me town here very early on and never suspects me)
Wu Tang: Chris Scum, Town Rhand
XKCD: Town Chris, Scum Rhand
Animal: no Rhand
Wall: no Rhand
AG: Scum Chris, town Rhand
Bravely Default: We're both town here and I placed you as town for putting me 4th on your scum list. You
Exactly, Rhand! If you were scum you would have made up another name there. I am confident of
that.
So it was in fact not for voting me or placing suspicion on me, but the fact that you were so casual in
throwing out my name in a spot that could be disastrous as scum.
thought this was odd and here is what I said:
Final Fantasy: you replaced in after the early game
Predator: Town Chris, Scum Rhand
Invitational: scum Chris, town Rhand
In Summary: we have been town together twice, and only one time you showed suspicion of me, and it was because of the needlessness of your suspicion of me, rather than a direct attack on me.
So unless I missed something the foundation of your tell is largely fabricated, and ironically I think it is more likely for a town to make this screwup rather than scum. I mean you build up to this big moment and everything and then when examined its all wrong. I'd hope a scum Rhand would at least try a little better, but I mean you have screwed up claims before so maybe.
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I saved that in a notepad and the formatting is a bit off, but you should get the gist.
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I did notice that, and commented on it. It seems almost like too obvious of a mistake, but maybe this is like Predator Mafia where I'm just giving people too much credit.
@Hawk: Please explain why you advocating vigging a person that you previously declared town(Tom).
Because iso claimed power and you vigged him without a claim. That's pretty risky. Also my opinions of Tom has recently changed while talking to Iso.
Also he seems like a liability to town and the outcome of vigging him would either be him flipping scum, which would be great and cleat iso. Or he flips town and you can actually get iso in to claim range/lynched.
Also with what he's been saying I don't think he will be able to prevent his own lynch in the mid to late game.
Okay, the other game is over I assume we can have a calm discussion about why I am town/scum now!
Oh did you finally win?
Now I can talk. ******* finally. I caught scum Chris after one post in that game. One. One ******* Post. Granted, eventually I got distracted by Iso's stupid mass claim that made it seem like Iso had to be scum because the town had a Bodyguard, Vig, Cop(me) and Iso(Redirector), and Chris was able to level his play out and I never looked back and just let him play the 'wah I ****ed up woe is me card' and then play nice with me and coast his way to victory. but the point stands that I realized instantly in the Invitational that Chris was scum. And his behavior in this game already has been literally NOTHING like it was in that game. Holy ***** it literally could not be more different. He has been snarky and hostile and mistrustful and just radically different. And there was no reason for him to act any differently. Just look at how Chris himself reacted earlier to me declaring him town. If he were scum, he would not even bother, he would just take it in stride. I guarantee it. He is town in this game. I would bet my life on it.
Man I am glad to finally be able to get this off of my chest.
This is oddly reassuring. Iso what are your thoughts on this since you view chris as scum?
Hi hawk. I have accused you of the high crime of being scum. Please reply.
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Okay, 7hawk77, there appears to be a misunderstanding. I want you to find my post about you and for you to explain why the things that make you look like scum are in fact things which you have said as town. That is called playing mafia. If I want to be treated to year old meta arguments I'll lock myself in a room with a mirror and have better company. Is this more clear? Respond to my accusations properly in your next reply.
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On my way to work so no time to expand. Cyan, look at Chris' play in the Classic and compare it to the Invite and Pred and here. What you see and what I see are the same tells, only I am seeing them as scum while you are caught up in thinking he is town.
Tordeck I am writing your name right next to Iso and Rhand on my list of 'arguments against Sir Chris that are going to end badly.' You may fill in your appointment whenever is convenient for you.
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Okay, 7hawk77, there appears to be a misunderstanding. I want you to find my post about you and for you to explain why the things that make you look like scum are in fact things which you have said as town. That is called playing mafia. If I want to be treated to year old meta arguments I'll lock myself in a room with a mirror and have better company. Is this more clear? Respond to my accusations properly in your next reply.
Man, Hawk's style of "let's say a ton of post #s and small blurbs" is so hard on my eyes right now. Hard to really make anything he says actually gel. Like his first thing he says is "tom read the rules" like... this was somehow noteworthy!? This isn't even about alignment, I am just annoyed he bothered to say it. It's hard to really get anything from this type of post, but the thing about me jumps out because of how silly it is:
#40 Chris seems like he's openly coaching tom? (Possibly scum together)
Except we know at this point that scum chat was still open, so why would a member of town think I was coaching a buddy in topic? That just don't make no sense. He also softballs Iso's terrible tom vote ("I wonder if he has a meta read?" without...actually asking Iso about his tom read. Will see if he ever follows up on this)
In fact funnily enough he says scum and town a lot in this first post, but his three mentions of iso gain a singular null. Other people he is trying to problem solve in theory, but Iso he is just saying stuff.
Moving on to his second horrible post of post #s...
Again the thing that catches my eye is his Iso and me stuff. He says Iso is really hard to read even though he called him... candid in this series of posts. Usually if you think someone is candid you believe them.
As for me, at the end of this post he says this:
I currently think SirChris is town. The good news is he looks so town because hee's great at killing scum via bussing or finding so I'm ok with this initial assumption.
Aside from the chris/tom thing he mentioned earlier, here is what he had to say to be on pages 3 and 4:
#140 Sir chris seems to be rationalizing a policy lynch on iso, uhh what? Asks cyan why he is town reading sir chris. Self aware. (Seems self absorbed so not sure if scum tell)
#147 Chris asks tom why he is reading chris as scum. Also paints Iso as scum by saying he doesn't explain himself (not exactly true thus far)
Where's the town read? Hawks what posts of mine did you read in the first four pages that made you go 'Chris is town.' Was it the possible coaching of buddy Tom or me not stating things accurately in your view point towards Iso.
Okay so TS seems to have been doing good scum hunting on his own, good job. Mind you I have been making up for my good health by skipping large swaths of this game and by the sound of it you think hawk is scum for reasons other than this, but seeming to think I am scum in his point by point and then going 'oh yeah he's town' is probably better than what you had anyway.
Welcome back, I have been nice and quoted the post I want you to respond to ie your read on me makes no sense (you also later on appear to backtrack on this read just as randomly)
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Hum, I agree with both those actually. Sort of. I'm not sure I see Hawk as scum. His post had a ton of IIoA, but if you look at what he was giving + town and + scum to, it seems to show a consistent, if kind of ... limited? mindset of trying to figure things out. I would say I'm raising an eyebrow in Hawk's general direction more than I'm scumreading him.
@Seppel, can you expand on why you think Tordeck is town? If all you have is a meta read, is it simply an overall feeling, or do you have a smoking gun where "scum!Tordeck would never do X"?
Tordeck is a hard meta read and I agree that Hawk isn't as bad as Atog and Plow, but he's still bad.
You mentioned penguin and I had nothing on him, but then he comes in 2 posts later and complains about having to catch up. This is great.
Regarding that last line, I have a question.
The timestamps between my post calling Tom out and his response where he pointed out the mod post were two minutes apart. Two minutes. I find it hard to believe that scumTom saw my post, freaked out that he had just slipped hard, and then had the wherewithal to scroll through the OP and find Taredas's post about the pregame chats within two minutes (on mobile no less, or so I believe). It seems much more likely that he, in fact, already knew about it.
...
By way of explaining your future posts about this, let me address your read on me. Post for reference.
1. I wasn't white knighting tom. As notvoxx (i think) very astutely noticed, I was playing dumb with this opening... to a point. I actually haven't been playing or even following most games for a while. However, I always read postgames and I have seen consistently that people don't like Tom's play. Having not played with him ever I was mostly curious about why it seems like everybody hates him. Tom's opener was a really, really silly post to make IMO. It's kind of hollow and meaningless. "Nobody give scum information!!!!" Ok, cool. But I wanted to get an idea for what the baseline expectation for Tom is before I go chasing down the low-hanging fruit. Iso's doing that anyway.
Well, that certainly answered my "with little aim or direction" issue re: prowlingpengolin.
To be clear: you're saying your initial series of posts "playing dumb" was a deliberate strategy? If so, what were you trying to get out of it, and what do you think you actually did get out of it?
"JOKES ON THEM I WAS JUST PRETENDING" is a real scumtell. See KamikazeArchon from some game I was in a few months ago.
Hey guys, just popping in to say that I'm V/LA until next Monday (Dec. 21). I'll try to keep up throughout the week whenever I have internet access, but I don't know how often this will be.
Oh, you think I could be a double voter without knowing it? I'm not, I promise.
If you're scum we are going to have a nice little duel this game. I don't mind being David.
Why do I have a feeling we wont see that "Ambassador" vote again for a long time?
TS maybe this is just me being tired or something, but I have to admit I have no earthly idea what you're even on about, TS. Like what are you trying to say? Your words are holding no meaning to me right now.
You are Goliath. Watch out for flying pebbles, etc.
Hawk's explanation indicates shallow thinking, but I'm pretty sure it's shallow town thinking? At the least, it's extremely basic thinking that, if he IS scum, is liable to trip him up later and make him easy to catch, but I don't know if he's a a good suspect now.
Alright so chris you have a problem with my notes on the game starting off.
I did that more for my own personal use just so I could get my head in the game. Secondly I posted them because I have nothing to hide. They are my thoughts, my ideas even if they are right or wrong. You don't have to agree with any of it but as I read through the game, those were my thoughts on those posts.
I'm no longer using that style because I now have a good understanding of most the players in this game.
Also I honestly didn't read the rules/votes closely enough to know that there was a double voter or that scum chat was still going. So I'm not sure how you can possibly interpret my ignorance as scummy unless you think I'm faking. Which if so, maybe you should go look at my last scum game.
Okay, wow, it wasn't enough to just quote the post you literally commented on everything but the core problem, I almost think that's a town tell for how innocent it is.
Hawk you posted negative things about me and then declared me town. What made you decide I was town after you posted things about me that wouldn't indicate that read?
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2014 - Best Mafia Performance (Individual)(Wu Tang) 2014 - Best Mafia Newcomer 2015 - Best Town Performance (Individual) (Predator) 2015 - Best Town Performance (Group) - Predator Mafia 2015 - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - 2015 Invitational 2015 - Best Town Player 2015 - Best Mafia Player 2015 - Best Overall Player
Ive said that I've never played a game where you are town so I only have seen scum games to compare your play. I use meta heavily and if I only have your scum play, I can't accurately read you.
I've already said earlier that my best strategy for someone like you or rhand is to identify a town I can trust and use their read.
Also I can change my opinion of anyone at any time. Especially on day 1
What if Iso knew your ability was formatted poorly and made a fake claim gambit so when this was discovered you wouldn't try again.
SHOOT HIM AGAIN.
Also I am voting Iso, but ##vote:Iso
2014 - Best Mafia Performance (Individual)(Wu Tang)
2014 - Best Mafia Newcomer
2015 - Best Town Performance (Individual) (Predator)
2015 - Best Town Performance (Group) - Predator Mafia
2015 - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - 2015 Invitational
2015 - Best Town Player
2015 - Best Mafia Player
2015 - Best Overall Player
I'll let you know once I've gone over your posts again!
Have to say, though, you actually asking for my opinion on you feels, uh. New.
@Cyan- That's a pretty sweet turn of events.
I also noticed the "Ambassadors" vote is gone. S.C. is the only one of the three that aren't currently voting. So unless there is some strange stuff going on it would appear that S.C. has a double vote, which makes him town?
Anyway. I guess we need to be super specific about our votes. Vote:Iso
I actually think Iso might be some kind of Cult Leader or something, because when he threw out that breadcrumb early in the game, the first thought that came to mind for me was, "What, are you Hathor?"
Also I was kidding about shooting him again, you're no fun.
2014 - Best Mafia Performance (Individual)(Wu Tang)
2014 - Best Mafia Newcomer
2015 - Best Town Performance (Individual) (Predator)
2015 - Best Town Performance (Group) - Predator Mafia
2015 - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - 2015 Invitational
2015 - Best Town Player
2015 - Best Mafia Player
2015 - Best Overall Player
Our previous interactions ended prematurely. I'm not always like that.
It's supposed to be a mirror universe or some *****, right? I'm sure they took some creative liberties with flavor.
I'm actually having a hard time justifying lynching a Hathor claim, honestly. Though at the same time, Ascetic Plus is a pretty absurd role for a townie to have. Feels like some kind of scum aligned neutral. And Iso's behavior feels completely anti-town. So **** it, all aboard let's go.
Town!Chris has declared me sure town every time I attacked him in the early game. Without exception. The reason being that I wouldn't choose him as target if I were scum.
He's not doing that here. He is way more cautious with his read on me and doesn't go further than 'lean town', and only when explicitly asked for a read.
In the invitational, he acted the same: he never called me town while I was trying to get him lynched early game.
That is such a sharp contrast from his town!play, that I'm sure he's scum.
Lol like..have you read any of his posts this game? Literally a single one? They are so different from his posts in the Invitational that they might as well be made by a different person. He is not scum.
What's more, he is pretty clearly the Double Voter.(that cat is out of the bag now that tordeck and tapping are voting and the ambassadors vote is missing) You know. The double voter whose identity that you wanted to stay hidden because you were certain it was a town role?
Just go compared Predator Mafia to this game, then compare the Invitation to this game and/or to Avant Garde. Chris is a great player, but meta is a thing, no matter how much NotVoxx doesn't want it to be. Chris is town. Or at least, he isn't mafia. He could be SK or something I guess, I can't promise anything there, because I don't have any experience with him in that capacity. But he's not mafia.
That type of town tell has an expiration date, Rhand. I am not so foolish as to say game after game "well you attacked me, you're town" and expect for a scum player to never catch on. I move on from stuff like that after awhile, Rhand. When is the last time we were town together? I think it's been quite some time.
2014 - Best Mafia Performance (Individual)(Wu Tang)
2014 - Best Mafia Newcomer
2015 - Best Town Performance (Individual) (Predator)
2015 - Best Town Performance (Group) - Predator Mafia
2015 - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - 2015 Invitational
2015 - Best Town Player
2015 - Best Mafia Player
2015 - Best Overall Player
I understand that meta reads are not going to just going to go away. It's a tool, for sure. And one I even think can be helpful. It's just not at all to me personally in this situation, and it is one tool of many. Like. Rhand is casing Chris entirely on meta and you're clearing him entirely on meta. Don't you see the problem with that?
I understand where you are coming from. And I accept what you're saying. But at the same time, I'm comfortable with my assessment for the time being. Of course, I reserve the right to change my mind later if Chris is leading the charge and a bunch of town bodies start piling up. But I'll be pretty hard-pressed to do so as long as I think he's the double voter too. And despite what..some random person that I can't remember said..I haven't seen alot of double voters that can vote for 2 separate people(I HAVE seen this, but it is pretty rare, and the vote was not allowed to be a 'hidden' vote).
2014 - Best Mafia Performance (Individual)(Wu Tang)
2014 - Best Mafia Newcomer
2015 - Best Town Performance (Individual) (Predator)
2015 - Best Town Performance (Group) - Predator Mafia
2015 - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - 2015 Invitational
2015 - Best Town Player
2015 - Best Mafia Player
2015 - Best Overall Player
annnnndddddd.....i leave in ~5 hours.
hopefully ill have some downtime, but its entirely possible yall wont have to put up with my inane bull***** until friday morning PST
ill leave you with my current reads
town: cyan, iso, notvoxx, vaimes
lean town: pengo, rhand, tapping, voxxicus
null: citricbase, seppel, sir chris
lean scum: nacho, plowshares, tordeck
scum: hawk
anyone with fewer posts than taredas doesnt make it on my list.
except plowshares, whos single post was just terrible.
cyan, dont shoot anyone while im gone. not even hawk.
We'll miss you tom. I didn't like you you in predator, and your posting was part of why I didn't post and then replaced out, but you've been tons of fun in this game. Hope everything goes well at the ballet.
I question your town read on Vaimes though.
Most likely I'll just end up shooting whomever we decide to lynch today, that way we can actually have 2 lynches today. So really, we should try to lynch a non-Iso person first. And then lynch Iso second.
Geesh just looking over the list we have so many people who are gone for awhile still. Game won't even begin properly for awhile yet.
Good thing Iso has given up the goat.
2014 - Best Mafia Performance (Individual)(Wu Tang)
2014 - Best Mafia Newcomer
2015 - Best Town Performance (Individual) (Predator)
2015 - Best Town Performance (Group) - Predator Mafia
2015 - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - 2015 Invitational
2015 - Best Town Player
2015 - Best Mafia Player
2015 - Best Overall Player
Ah, I like you new guy.
I'm thinking something like a "hawk/Iso" or "Plowshares/Iso" looks like a fine day one.
When you make it back, I request elaboration on the following reads:
town!Vaimes. I'm interested in this one for Reasons which I'll elaborate on later.
town!ActualVoxx. The only reason I'm reading Voxx town AT ALL is a very specific, very meta "thing I predicted he'd do as scum that he kind of did try but in a way that I don't think he'd try as scum." Which is, you know, not exactly "lock clear." And also not something I'd expect anyone else to read him town for, so what are you reading him town for?
town!pengo. I feel like my read has kind of stagnated on him? But I feel very strongly that he's "active lurking" - having a thread presence, asking questions, but dancing away from stances, opinions, gamesolving, etc. IIRC you said something about his gimmick account identity and what he was doing with it made him town, or something? and obviously that's useless to me. So... anything else? Do you think he's making a sincere effort to solve the game? Because I think it only looks like he is.
To be fair he isn't super annoying here. But I will readily admit that might be due to him not tunneling me. I really hated him ignoring the tell tale signs I was town and calling thinks like "his hunch" for scum reading me. Plus his post count isn't outrageous.
A lot of people are barely participating though.
Oh and Chris if you're not the double vote then what's happening here? Does someone else have "double-vote" and "secret-second vote"? Seems sketchy. Would you mind placing your vote randomly on me until the next vote count so we can confirm you are not the double voter?
2014 - Best Mafia Performance (Individual)(Wu Tang)
2014 - Best Mafia Newcomer
2015 - Best Town Performance (Individual) (Predator)
2015 - Best Town Performance (Group) - Predator Mafia
2015 - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - 2015 Invitational
2015 - Best Town Player
2015 - Best Mafia Player
2015 - Best Overall Player
Who said you would lie? I just asked you to put your vote on me until the next vote count. It's weird for me to want to try and town clear you? I'm new but double vote, secret scum seems like a pretty crappy thing to put into a game.
2014 - Best Mafia Performance (Individual)(Wu Tang)
2014 - Best Mafia Newcomer
2015 - Best Town Performance (Individual) (Predator)
2015 - Best Town Performance (Group) - Predator Mafia
2015 - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - 2015 Invitational
2015 - Best Town Player
2015 - Best Mafia Player
2015 - Best Overall Player
If you're scum we are going to have a nice little duel this game. I don't mind being David.
Why do I have a feeling we wont see that "Ambassador" vote again for a long time?
If someone wants Chris to look like the double voter, they can just make the Ambassador vote follow him around, heh.
I do agree that tom's 'lean town' read of 'actualvoxx' is weird. If anything, I think that people should have a 'leanscum' read on actualvoxx, or a null read on him at best. He hasn't had much to say, and what he has said..well..hasn't said much.
I liked pengo for a bit, but I feel like when someone called him out on active lurking, he started to appear less, which is a bit telling. I don't know, it's hard to accuse people of much there, because of the holiday season.
TS maybe this is just me being tired or something, but I have to admit I have no earthly idea what you're even on about, TS. Like what are you trying to say? Your words are holding no meaning to me right now.
2014 - Best Mafia Performance (Individual)(Wu Tang)
2014 - Best Mafia Newcomer
2015 - Best Town Performance (Individual) (Predator)
2015 - Best Town Performance (Group) - Predator Mafia
2015 - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - 2015 Invitational
2015 - Best Town Player
2015 - Best Mafia Player
2015 - Best Overall Player
I really don't want to V/LA until after Christmas because it feels like half the ******* game is, and that's not fair to the mod or the players for me to do so too, but I have company from hell staying at my place for the rest of the month, and have no free time to think, let alone sit down and play this game properly.
On a completely unrelated note, does anyone know a guy who knows a guy who can hide some bodies?
even did this to clear my scumbuddy in the invitational) and I wondered aloud.... "Have I ever done it to
clear a town rhand as town?"
Castlevania: No Rhand
Celestial: Town Chris, Town Rhand (He calls me town here very early on and never suspects me)
Wu Tang: Chris Scum, Town Rhand
XKCD: Town Chris, Scum Rhand
Animal: no Rhand
Wall: no Rhand
AG: Scum Chris, town Rhand
Bravely Default: We're both town here and I placed you as town for putting me 4th on your scum list. You
So it was in fact not for voting me or placing suspicion on me, but the fact that you were so casual in
throwing out my name in a spot that could be disastrous as scum.
thought this was odd and here is what I said:
Final Fantasy: you replaced in after the early game
Predator: Town Chris, Scum Rhand
Invitational: scum Chris, town Rhand
In Summary: we have been town together twice, and only one time you showed suspicion of me, and it was because of the needlessness of your suspicion of me, rather than a direct attack on me.
So unless I missed something the foundation of your tell is largely fabricated, and ironically I think it is more likely for a town to make this screwup rather than scum. I mean you build up to this big moment and everything and then when examined its all wrong. I'd hope a scum Rhand would at least try a little better, but I mean you have screwed up claims before so maybe.
2014 - Best Mafia Performance (Individual)(Wu Tang)
2014 - Best Mafia Newcomer
2015 - Best Town Performance (Individual) (Predator)
2015 - Best Town Performance (Group) - Predator Mafia
2015 - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - 2015 Invitational
2015 - Best Town Player
2015 - Best Mafia Player
2015 - Best Overall Player
2014 - Best Mafia Performance (Individual)(Wu Tang)
2014 - Best Mafia Newcomer
2015 - Best Town Performance (Individual) (Predator)
2015 - Best Town Performance (Group) - Predator Mafia
2015 - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - 2015 Invitational
2015 - Best Town Player
2015 - Best Mafia Player
2015 - Best Overall Player
Because iso claimed power and you vigged him without a claim. That's pretty risky. Also my opinions of Tom has recently changed while talking to Iso.
Also he seems like a liability to town and the outcome of vigging him would either be him flipping scum, which would be great and cleat iso. Or he flips town and you can actually get iso in to claim range/lynched.
Also with what he's been saying I don't think he will be able to prevent his own lynch in the mid to late game.
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This is oddly reassuring. Iso what are your thoughts on this since you view chris as scum?
Outdated Mafia Stats
2014 - Best Mafia Performance (Individual)(Wu Tang)
2014 - Best Mafia Newcomer
2015 - Best Town Performance (Individual) (Predator)
2015 - Best Town Performance (Group) - Predator Mafia
2015 - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - 2015 Invitational
2015 - Best Town Player
2015 - Best Mafia Player
2015 - Best Overall Player
Well that seems like you've messed up somewhere. Maybe go relook at the league game we were both scum. Spoiler alert, I'm town this game.
Outdated Mafia Stats
2014 - Best Mafia Performance (Individual)(Wu Tang)
2014 - Best Mafia Newcomer
2015 - Best Town Performance (Individual) (Predator)
2015 - Best Town Performance (Group) - Predator Mafia
2015 - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - 2015 Invitational
2015 - Best Town Player
2015 - Best Mafia Player
2015 - Best Overall Player
The Family
@rhand
Can you elaborate on why you disagree with cyan on chris?
Like go through what cyan said and point out what exactly you disagree with.
Outdated Mafia Stats
2014 - Best Mafia Performance (Individual)(Wu Tang)
2014 - Best Mafia Newcomer
2015 - Best Town Performance (Individual) (Predator)
2015 - Best Town Performance (Group) - Predator Mafia
2015 - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - 2015 Invitational
2015 - Best Town Player
2015 - Best Mafia Player
2015 - Best Overall Player
This is my first game back in a year.
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Welcome back, I have been nice and quoted the post I want you to respond to ie your read on me makes no sense (you also later on appear to backtrack on this read just as randomly)
2014 - Best Mafia Performance (Individual)(Wu Tang)
2014 - Best Mafia Newcomer
2015 - Best Town Performance (Individual) (Predator)
2015 - Best Town Performance (Group) - Predator Mafia
2015 - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - 2015 Invitational
2015 - Best Town Player
2015 - Best Mafia Player
2015 - Best Overall Player
Tordeck is a hard meta read and I agree that Hawk isn't as bad as Atog and Plow, but he's still bad.
You mentioned penguin and I had nothing on him, but then he comes in 2 posts later and complains about having to catch up. This is great. Plowshares and Atogaholic are scum.
Iso I don't fully believe so, but I was just going along with you. "JOKES ON THEM I WAS JUST PRETENDING" is a real scumtell. See KamikazeArchon from some game I was in a few months ago.
I like you as town.
I had the same thought.
You are Goliath. Watch out for flying pebbles, etc.
Hawk's explanation indicates shallow thinking, but I'm pretty sure it's shallow town thinking? At the least, it's extremely basic thinking that, if he IS scum, is liable to trip him up later and make him easy to catch, but I don't know if he's a a good suspect now.
I did that more for my own personal use just so I could get my head in the game. Secondly I posted them because I have nothing to hide. They are my thoughts, my ideas even if they are right or wrong. You don't have to agree with any of it but as I read through the game, those were my thoughts on those posts.
I'm no longer using that style because I now have a good understanding of most the players in this game.
Also I honestly didn't read the rules/votes closely enough to know that there was a double voter or that scum chat was still going. So I'm not sure how you can possibly interpret my ignorance as scummy unless you think I'm faking. Which if so, maybe you should go look at my last scum game.
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Hawk you posted negative things about me and then declared me town. What made you decide I was town after you posted things about me that wouldn't indicate that read?
2014 - Best Mafia Performance (Individual)(Wu Tang)
2014 - Best Mafia Newcomer
2015 - Best Town Performance (Individual) (Predator)
2015 - Best Town Performance (Group) - Predator Mafia
2015 - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - 2015 Invitational
2015 - Best Town Player
2015 - Best Mafia Player
2015 - Best Overall Player
I've already said earlier that my best strategy for someone like you or rhand is to identify a town I can trust and use their read.
Also I can change my opinion of anyone at any time. Especially on day 1
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