Alright, now I do see what you are talking about, and good to note you are keeping track of activity levels. But not sure how that helps determine alignment.
Also that wasn't what I was talking about. I was talking total post count like the one in you info panel next to each of your posts.
And if that came across wrong earlier I apologize. I was just trying to note fact, not belittle you. I can't say for certain your true skill level. And I'll reiterate, we still don't have much to go on.
Also my post count is not that low. As of now it is above Antny, Shockwave, Kraj, Void and nny.
Why does how much you've post matter? Most of the posts so far have been short and, not to sound cruel, insignificant. Just having more actual posts than players that have provided real content doesn't show anything.
Also my post count is not that low. As of now it is above Antny, Shockwave, Kraj, Void and nny.
Why does how much you've post matter? Most of the posts so far have been short and, not to sound cruel, insignificant. Just having more actual posts than players that have provided real content doesn't show anything.
Also what your response to my post 155?
This is not fully true. Newb Scum are less likely to post due to confidence issues or other things.
Another thing about having a low post count is that it interferes with how that player interacts with another. A Scum tell, for me, is using an Interaction Chart to find out which Scum communicated with other players the least since Scum members are less likely to talk to themselves than to the Town.
In other words: It shows a lot more than what you are thinking. Even if the posts may be insignificant.
@Rhand - But you haven't voted for TMCT and you even said that he skipped over your argument because you didn't vote for him. So, if you think he's scum and ignoring your case, why wouldn't you pressure him more with a vote rather than having AE take up the cause? The slap fight thing I don't really buy because, if he's as strong of a read as you say, I can't see putting vote pressure on him being a bad thing for town. I also don't see where that's AE's main focus; I still think he's voting for you so saying that you're leaving it to him to push that case also seems odd.
Your convictions seem strongest about TMCT and TMCT is the most experienced player of your suspects, but your votes have gone to the newer players.
I'm struggling to reconcile that mindset.
/barn
I don't know if this is a town or scum mindset. Rhand should know from experience with me that I just don't get lynched, and never have been, as any alignment. So is this town-Rhand recognizing that a slapfight with me would be distracting to the town since it wouldn't lead to me being lynched, or scum-Rhand recognizing that I'm not and will never be a mislynch candidate and steering away to newer players?
My gut is telling me town-Rhand. I also have scum-Rhand from Astarte in my head and he's softer around the edges.
He /barns my read on B_E but doesn't include him later on in the same post when he asks someone (I forgot who and am too lazy to look it up) about his scumread.
It was Kraj. I asked him about ME because he didn't say a word about him in #62 -- but he did comment on Burning_Earth.
I agree with waiting until Nny contributes til you lynch me.
If you are town this is no way to contribute. You have to put yourself out there and decide who you think is mafia and push for their lynch. Don't just sit around and wait for your lynch, unless you are scum.
/barn Kraj on ME. The worst thing about him in my opinion is when he said my posts were bad but did not back that up with a vote. Talk about not wanting to offend.
Vote mirrorentity
Earlier you said you weren't voting because none of the existing cases were strong enough, even though the case on ME had been well established. So... what made you change your mind?
However, I have issues with your post. You mention that Prophylaxis introduced the idea of avoiding RVS voting as a Scum tell you and that is fine. One issue is that you are taking your newly learned information and throwing it aside because others just happen to disagree with you. The other issue is that B_E is new. Since B_E is new he is more likely to commit to Scum tells that don't others normally wouldn't because he doesn't know the game. This looks like you trying to bus a Scum member and then realizing that you would be caught because others don't share the same opinion as yours.
Vote: dkingsland967
Why do you prefer voting dkingsland here over B_E?
I agree with waiting until Nny contributes til you lynch me.
If you are town this is no way to contribute. You have to put yourself out there and decide who you think is mafia and push for their lynch. Don't just sit around and wait for your lynch, unless you are scum.
Word.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
The Golden Rule of forums: If you're going to be rude, be right. If you might be wrong, be polite.
@DK - I went back and read your mentor chat with Proph and it does check out with your actions - but Void's point is a good one in that you then backed down very quickly when you saw that others didn't agree that no RVS vote was always a tell. You also did include Rhand's semantic argument in your initial vote and I'm not convinced that you checked to see if anyone else had done that - which makes me think that you were looking for things to add to the case when you first made it.
In WWE and Smalltown, I was called out for posting a few weak newbscum tells, but some of the experienced players preferred to focus elsewhere and give some time to let my alignment flesh itself out through more posting. I'd prefer to extend the same courtesy to another new player.
as reasoning that you haven't abandoned your case on BE altogether, but your initial vote on him was based primarily on no RVS, which you viewed as a tell - so it seems like you're contradicting yourself here because you weren't willing to give him the benefit of the doubt initially but you are now. Wouldn't both your initial RVS read and then your more recent reads make you feel like you had a stronger case than you did when you weren't willing to give him the benefit of the doubt?
I'd like to understand your thought process there. In the meantime:
/barn Kraj on ME. The worst thing about him in my opinion is when he said my posts were bad but did not back that up with a vote. Talk about not wanting to offend.
can't give more than gut right now but my current feelings
town
Shockwave
TMCT
DCIII
AE
scum
B_E, especially found his OMGUS vote particularly amusing and not going to change my vote currently.
more reading later, I will be going V/LA during Tuesday - important university assignment to finish. But will be back after that is done
Explaining it away as OMGUS? Well explain away the other votes on you.
Will loop back to this quote but notice how the driving factor behind this case is based on Kraj's points then, when his vote is called into question, he doesn't defend the logic or the stance, he instead points at all of the other people voting for ME. He's confident in his vote because that's where other votes are.
Self-conscious tally of all of the players who have posted less than he has, all the while stringing out multiple short posts to up his post count. Attempt to appear active without actually adding content.
Earlier you said you weren't voting because none of the existing cases were strong enough, even though the case on ME had been well established. So... what made you change your mind?
Explaining it away as OMGUS? Well explain away the other votes on you.
BE was uncomfortable making a case, offered no real new content to the case on ME when he barned Kraj, and then simply leaned on the fact that his vote rested with multiple others when his vote was questioned.
To respond to Kraj's question - I think what changed was that more people hopped on the ME wagon so BE felt more comfortable doing so.
Well, if ME explained away my vote as OMGUS, he should absolutely explain the other votes on him. I'm sorry, but I can't see what is wrong with asking him to do so.
In WWE and Smalltown, I was called out for posting a few weak newbscum tells, but some of the experienced players preferred to focus elsewhere and give some time to let my alignment flesh itself out through more posting. I'd prefer to extend the same courtesy to another new player.
as reasoning that you haven't abandoned your case on BE altogether, but your initial vote on him was based primarily on no RVS, which you viewed as a tell - so it seems like you're contradicting yourself here because you weren't willing to give him the benefit of the doubt initially but you are now. Wouldn't both your initial RVS read and then your more recent reads make you feel like you had a stronger case than you did when you weren't willing to give him the benefit of the doubt?
I did not realize B_E was a new player when I voted him. I was actually operating under suspicion that he was a gimmick... there was something about his post in which he stated no desire to participate in RVS that read to me like he is fairly familiar with the game.
Another note: My activity level will be low over the next week or so. Work is going to keep me very much tied up until Tuesday or Wednesday.
He /barns my read on B_E but doesn't include him later on in the same post when he asks someone (I forgot who and am too lazy to look it up) about his scumread.
It was Kraj. I asked him about ME because he didn't say a word about him in #62 -- but he did comment on Burning_Earth.
Oh god... why did you wait until now to give me this? I have repeatedly said that this was my problem with you and you have a simple explanation for it
In other news, I think BE just outed himself and ME as scum.
The distancing in his last post is awkward and reminds me of my own first game as scum (which was my first game period).
@Kraj: Thanks. That clears up a big misunderstanding I had reading your posts. Suspicion has dropped for now.
And I think B_E is trying to deflect, and poorly. (Could be a scum bus attempt, but ME is such a background player at this time l, I am not confident enough to say for sure at this juncture. And yes I have had my vote on him this whole time. Kind of hoped a little pressure would get him going on something, but all we have is a claim of vanilla town. He maybe a case of too kinky to torture. Look it up on tvtropes.)
This reeks of a counterwagon; votes are shifting over way too quickly. I haven't liked Burning_Earth's posting but it's statistically improbable that both him and ME are scum. Hm...
/barn Kraj on ME. The worst thing about him in my opinion is when he said my posts were bad but did not back that up with a vote. Talk about not wanting to offend.
Vote mirrorentity
Please explain to me exactly what happened between these two posts. What you did in the game, what you read, your thought processes, etc.
It was Kraj. I asked him about ME because he didn't say a word about him in #62 -- but he did comment on Burning_Earth.
Oh god... why did you wait until now to give me this? I have repeatedly said that this was my problem with you and you have a simple explanation for it
Oh and I am pretty much prepared to put my vote behind Burning_Earth at this time, but not if the wrong moment to lynch. Full post will either be after Poirot or tommorrow morning if I feel too tired....
1. I clicked on the 'number of posts for this thread (that links to a post count and search by player). I saw ME's number of posts (large) and was suprised as I didn't remember him posting any real content. Well, he still hadn't. I was already going to vote him before I saw
I have to go back and look things over. I quickly skimmed. The first post is early on, DK suspected ME. From what I looked over in my skim DC doesn't say anything about or to ME. This last post is recently and is the only thing I saw regarding ME. ME was on the verge of a lynch and DC changed that. It's impossible to do an analysts without having an alignment to go off of but there's a few things I want to consider. ME/BE, DCIII and any motivation, and the speed of this wagon.
/barn Kraj on ME. The worst thing about him in my opinion is when he said my posts were bad but did not back that up with a vote. Talk about not wanting to offend.
1. I clicked on the 'number of posts for this thread (that links to a post count and search by player). I saw ME's number of posts (large) and was suprised as I didn't remember him posting any real content. Well, he still hadn't. I was already going to vote him before I saw
2. Kraj's post
BE's case against MirrorEntity continues to sound forced. In particular, I didn't like the fact that BE went from haven't no reads on anyone in posts 106 and 134 but when Kraj decided that ME was a decent target, he suddenly decided that early posts against BE were bad. With Nny back I am comfortable putting BE at L-1.
vote Burning_Earth
@Burning_Earth I would start taking the advice your giving to ME and defend yourself. Other than Mirror_Entity what reads do you have?
MirrorEntity is also looking suspicious but I have a hard time putting him in league with Burning_Earth. I think there's little reason for BE to go after ME when he did if both were scum, since ME wasn't in any real danger yet. That said if I start reading BE as town this is probably where my vote is heading back to, as ME is still in my top three scumreads.
FYI my activity level is likely to be low the next few days. I should be able to keep an eye on things, but don't expect bountiful content from me until next week.
Unless I'm mistaken the case against B_E is that he's not contributed and just barned people, particularly me. That's fair but it doesn't make me want to move my vote off of M_E.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
The Golden Rule of forums: If you're going to be rude, be right. If you might be wrong, be polite.
@Burning_Earth I would start taking the advice your giving to ME and defend yourself. Other than Mirror_Entity what reads do you have?
MirrorEntity is also looking suspicious but I have a hard time putting him in league with Burning_Earth. I think there's little reason for BE to go after ME when he did if both were scum, since ME wasn't in any real danger yet. That said if I start reading BE as town this is probably where my vote is heading back to, as ME is still in my top three scumreads.
unvote B_E to avoid a quicklynch.
Any reason in particular you don't want to give Nny the chance to weigh in before the hammer Antny?
I have to agree with this. Nny has only posted saying he'd have a t/s list by tomorrow. Not something I'd really call involved. Why do you feel his is in because of that post?
This reeks of a counterwagon; votes are shifting over way too quickly. I haven't liked Burning_Earth's posting but it's statistically improbable that both him and ME are scum. Hm...
Do you think a double-bus is possible here? Mirror's post where he voted B_E had virtually no content or reasoning behind it, and B_E's vote of mirror was just a /barn of Kraj and had a bit of an OMGUS smell.
I do agree that the wagon picked up momentum extremely fast, but seriously, there is good casing against B_E and he has done no scumhunting at all. I am perfectly willing to lynch him in the face of the possibility of a counterwagon. If he flips scum, awesome! ToMorrow, we get to work on figuring out who was bussing. If he flips town, we still eliminated a player we thought was scummy, mirror is pretty much confirmed scum, and we can examine the votes and try to figure out who were the opportunistic scum on the B_E wagon.
Unless I'm mistaken the case against B_E is that he's not contributed and just barned people, particularly me.
Mostly, yes. Also the change of mindset from saying there wasn't a votable case and then voting for ME after there were more votes on him when the case itself hadn't evolved much from when he said there wasn't a votable case. Also, the self-conscious behavior around the post count and stringing singlet posts along to up his tally. More recently, deflecting onto ME as well.
@AE - Fair caution, but what do you think of the BE case itself and what is your read on BE?
To clarify my read on ME - I don't think he's posted much of worth and it's been hard to get content out of him. When I said that it looked like he's rushing to cover tracks and he admitted that he was doing so, that didn't feel very scummy to me, that seemed pretty open book. But when I asked him for his reads, I didn't care for the fact that he basically gave all positive reads except for one player. He has seemed to be going out of his way not to irk anyone this game, I do agree with that.
I am suspicious of him but I think that the case on BE is much stronger. From a scum hunting perspective, they're both not doing much of anything and BE's actions and behavior are much worse, in my opinion.
@DK - I went back and read your mentor chat with Proph and it does check out with your actions - but Void's point is a good one in that you then backed down very quickly when you saw that others didn't agree that no RVS vote was always a tell. You also did include Rhand's semantic argument in your initial vote and I'm not convinced that you checked to see if anyone else had done that - which makes me think that you were looking for things to add to the case when you first made it.
In WWE and Smalltown, I was called out for posting a few weak newbscum tells, but some of the experienced players preferred to focus elsewhere and give some time to let my alignment flesh itself out through more posting. I'd prefer to extend the same courtesy to another new player.
as reasoning that you haven't abandoned your case on BE altogether, but your initial vote on him was based primarily on no RVS, which you viewed as a tell - so it seems like you're contradicting yourself here because you weren't willing to give him the benefit of the doubt initially but you are now. Wouldn't both your initial RVS read and then your more recent reads make you feel like you had a stronger case than you did when you weren't willing to give him the benefit of the doubt?
I'd like to understand your thought process there. In the meantime:
/barn Kraj on ME. The worst thing about him in my opinion is when he said my posts were bad but did not back that up with a vote. Talk about not wanting to offend.
can't give more than gut right now but my current feelings
town
Shockwave
TMCT
DCIII
AE
scum
B_E, especially found his OMGUS vote particularly amusing and not going to change my vote currently.
more reading later, I will be going V/LA during Tuesday - important university assignment to finish. But will be back after that is done
Explaining it away as OMGUS? Well explain away the other votes on you.
Will loop back to this quote but notice how the driving factor behind this case is based on Kraj's points then, when his vote is called into question, he doesn't defend the logic or the stance, he instead points at all of the other people voting for ME. He's confident in his vote because that's where other votes are.
Self-conscious tally of all of the players who have posted less than he has, all the while stringing out multiple short posts to up his post count. Attempt to appear active without actually adding content.
Earlier you said you weren't voting because none of the existing cases were strong enough, even though the case on ME had been well established. So... what made you change your mind?
Explaining it away as OMGUS? Well explain away the other votes on you.
BE was uncomfortable making a case, offered no real new content to the case on ME when he barned Kraj, and then simply leaned on the fact that his vote rested with multiple others when his vote was questioned.
To respond to Kraj's question - I think what changed was that more people hopped on the ME wagon so BE felt more comfortable doing so.
Unvote: DK, Vote: Burning_Earth
Your case on me rests on
1: Me making short double-posts. I'm sorry about those, but I forgot to say things. Should I have not said them instead?
2: I wagoned on to ME after Kraj also did. I'm sorry, but I have explained this. If you want a full PBPA analysis on ME to explain why I think his/her posts are bad, fine. I will do so if you ask
3 I said "Explaining it away as OMGUS? Well explain away the other votes on you." and it was interpreted as that I was just 'resting on the fact that other people had voted ME'. Well what I was saying was that ME was trying to explain away the case on him/her by crying "HEY! HIS VOTE IS INVALID AND OMGUS!"
Any reason in particular you don't want to give Nny the chance to weigh in before the hammer Antny?
If your going to be so focused on me you should at least read my posts. I said clearly I was just going to vote BE as soon as Nny ceased being V/LA so it shouldn't be a surprise to you. Did any those posts say I was waiting because I wanted Nny to state a case against BE? No, they didn't, but I guess any chance to throw a loaded question that me is too good to miss, right
I had no interest in what he said as the case was pretty clear already in my mind (and obviously yours since you weren't interested in waiting for Nny at all I might add) but I didn't want to end the day while a player is V/LA. If we end the day it's night one, and if Nny doesn't get back to Sunday - by which point day 2 has started that could be bad for town. Imagine Nny is cop and loses a chance to investigate. Also I wasn't the only guy against ending the day before Nny got back, just my vote was in the position to get us closer to there than I liked.
Finally it's L-1, there's still plenty of time for Nny to post before days end and even if he didn't what benefit is there to me stopping him?
Hope that answers your concerns as well Shockwave.
@Antny:
What kind of catch up post is that? You have nothing else to say on anything?
Focusing on the two lynch candidates is not the way to do a catch up post.
What more do you want here exactly? I have three real targets at this point and it seems almost counter productive to repeat why I think Rhand is scum. I said all needed to say. You take the rest as town right now in my book. Sorry if that's too short buts it's about the same length as most of your posts and I really can't understand what you think I should have added.
I get the feeling that Antny may be trying to bus someone here.
And yet my vote is in the exact same place as yours is.
Also my post count is not that low. As of now it is above Antny, Shockwave, Kraj, Void and nny.
Why does how much you've post matter? Most of the posts so far have been short and, not to sound cruel, insignificant. Just having more actual posts than players that have provided real content doesn't show anything.
Also what your response to my post 155?
This is not fully true. Newb Scum are less likely to post due to confidence issues or other things.
Another thing about having a low post count is that it interferes with how that player interacts with another. A Scum tell, for me, is using an Interaction Chart to find out which Scum communicated with other players the least since Scum members are less likely to talk to themselves than to the Town.
In other words: It shows a lot more than what you are thinking. Even if the posts may be insignificant.
Also looking your over your posts again reminded me of this post. You defend BE for the lack of content in his post and even say it doesn't matter if the post appears insignificant because it shows what someone is thinking.
Well I have clearly stated what I am thinking so why it is such an issue with me, yet something that I shouldn't be concerned about BE doing exactly?
Any reason in particular you don't want to give Nny the chance to weigh in before the hammer Antny?
If your going to be so focused on me you should at least read my posts. I said clearly I was just going to vote BE as soon as Nny ceased being V/LA so it shouldn't be a surprise to you. Did any those posts say I was waiting because I wanted Nny to state a case against BE? No, they didn't, but I guess any chance to throw a loaded question that me is too good to miss, right
I had no interest in what he said as the case was pretty clear already in my mind (and obviously yours since you weren't interested in waiting for Nny at all I might add) but I didn't want to end the day while a player is V/LA. If we end the day it's night one, and if Nny doesn't get back to Sunday - by which point day 2 has started that could be bad for town. Imagine Nny is cop and loses a chance to investigate. Also I wasn't the only guy against ending the day before Nny got back, just my vote was in the position to get us closer to there than I liked.
Finally it's L-1, there's still plenty of time for Nny to post before days end and even if he didn't what benefit is there to me stopping him?
Hope that answers your concerns as well Shockwave.
I want him to weigh in on everything before hitting Night.
I didn't imply I only want his input on BE.
Putting someone at L-1 enables a self-hammer. You don't know how much time there will be for Nny to post when you do that.
You obviously don't care for what he has to say.
The thing you put between brackets is a smear. I did not put BE in hammer range and I unvoted when you did.
The pink part is another smear. You ask yourself a question I didn't pose to then smear me with your answer.
You pretend it's smear all you like, I'm pretty much reading every post you make as attempt to put from of a lynch queue. You might as well ask when I stopped beating my wife.
In the brackets I pointed out that you did the same as me. You voted for BE without needing Nny input, why should I not be allowed the same.
And I don't get what your saying about a self hammer. Doesn't hammer mean that we vote for someone or have I got that wrong? If not why would someone self hammer? I'm really confused.
Finally just because I don't need his input doesn't mean I'm not interested in what he's saying. There's still time post either today or day 2. Stop putting words in my mouth!
Despite your attempts to push back into a slapfight with you, the vote is staying on BE for now.
Hm, looks like what I see as scum mindset might well be just newb mindset.
Scum often self-hammers (votes for themselves as final vote) to end discussion.
That's why there is a huge difference between the L-2 and L-1 vote.
And that's what I was accusing you of: you're opening the self-hammer and thus the end of the day while Nny hasn't had the chance to post his reads.
@Antny:
That was not a defense of BE. That's me showing that if BE is Scum that we would be able to use his posting against him using an interaction chart. Good twist on what I was actually trying to say.
@void In that case please replace the word defend with explain in post 227. It just looked like one rule for one player a different rule for another in my eyes. Will you please now address my other questions.
I was expecting more content from you rather than just focusing on the main wagons of toDay. There is more going on than just those wagons. This is answer was quite obvious considering I mentioned how you focused on those wagons in a previous post.
"Well I have clearly stated what I am thinking so why it is such an issue with me, yet something that I shouldn't be concerned about BE doing exactly?"
Please rephrase this one.
I'm not seeing any other questions addressed to me.
1) I'm afraid those three are the only reads I have void. If it's not enough I don't have any more right now, sorry.
2) What I was trying to say is that you said it didn't matter that it looked like you were saying that Burning_Earth didn't have much content in his posts because it showed where he his thinking was directed if nothing else. I found it odd the same courtesy wasn't extended to me. I feel I'm being fairly open with where my targets are and don't see why you need a long post or anything from me and not for Burning_Earth. Really that's all I'm looking for an explanation on.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
To post a comment, please login or register a new account.
Also that wasn't what I was talking about. I was talking total post count like the one in you info panel next to each of your posts.
And if that came across wrong earlier I apologize. I was just trying to note fact, not belittle you. I can't say for certain your true skill level. And I'll reiterate, we still don't have much to go on.
Thanks to Heroes of the Plane Studios for the sigpic.
Spider-Man Mafia 3 (Off-Site: NGA)
Metroid Mafia (Off-Site: Mafia Universe)
Why does how much you've post matter? Most of the posts so far have been short and, not to sound cruel, insignificant. Just having more actual posts than players that have provided real content doesn't show anything.
Also what your response to my post 155?
This is not fully true. Newb Scum are less likely to post due to confidence issues or other things.
Another thing about having a low post count is that it interferes with how that player interacts with another. A Scum tell, for me, is using an Interaction Chart to find out which Scum communicated with other players the least since Scum members are less likely to talk to themselves than to the Town.
In other words: It shows a lot more than what you are thinking. Even if the posts may be insignificant.
I don't know, but there's nothing to suggest he did. The only player, me included, whose posts suggest they got it from their role PM was DCIII.
Noted.
Which is why you voted me when you started questioning me...?
/barn
I don't know if this is a town or scum mindset. Rhand should know from experience with me that I just don't get lynched, and never have been, as any alignment. So is this town-Rhand recognizing that a slapfight with me would be distracting to the town since it wouldn't lead to me being lynched, or scum-Rhand recognizing that I'm not and will never be a mislynch candidate and steering away to newer players?
My gut is telling me town-Rhand. I also have scum-Rhand from Astarte in my head and he's softer around the edges.
With ME this game you need to specify "scum reads"!
It was Kraj. I asked him about ME because he didn't say a word about him in #62 -- but he did comment on Burning_Earth.
Why did you make this comment?
Because I want ME dead and would otherwise be content with ending the Day with his lynch.
I guess it would be wise for me to do a reread in the future.
If you are town this is no way to contribute. You have to put yourself out there and decide who you think is mafia and push for their lynch. Don't just sit around and wait for your lynch, unless you are scum.
They hate us cause they ain't us.
Earlier you said you weren't voting because none of the existing cases were strong enough, even though the case on ME had been well established. So... what made you change your mind?
I didn't say his content was good, I said I liked his content level, i.e., that he was posting regularly.
Why do you prefer voting dkingsland here over B_E?
Word.
Current New Favorite Person™: Mallory Archer
She knows why.
I voted ME because
1. I reread and thought it was the best case
2. You made good points.
You also say:
as reasoning that you haven't abandoned your case on BE altogether, but your initial vote on him was based primarily on no RVS, which you viewed as a tell - so it seems like you're contradicting yourself here because you weren't willing to give him the benefit of the doubt initially but you are now. Wouldn't both your initial RVS read and then your more recent reads make you feel like you had a stronger case than you did when you weren't willing to give him the benefit of the doubt?
I'd like to understand your thought process there. In the meantime:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Will loop back to this quote but notice how the driving factor behind this case is based on Kraj's points then, when his vote is called into question, he doesn't defend the logic or the stance, he instead points at all of the other people voting for ME. He's confident in his vote because that's where other votes are.
Self-conscious tally of all of the players who have posted less than he has, all the while stringing out multiple short posts to up his post count. Attempt to appear active without actually adding content.
This is a very good question.
And this explanation still offers no independent thought, which brings me back to this, previously quoted:
BE was uncomfortable making a case, offered no real new content to the case on ME when he barned Kraj, and then simply leaned on the fact that his vote rested with multiple others when his vote was questioned.
To respond to Kraj's question - I think what changed was that more people hopped on the ME wagon so BE felt more comfortable doing so.
Unvote: DK, Vote: Burning_Earth
Town Win % = 75%
Mafia Win % = 75%
Overall Win % = 75%
Completed Game Log
2014: Best Mafia Performance (Group)
2014: Most Improved Player
2014: Best Town Player
2014: Best Overall Player
ME, defend yourself.
Or we could, you know, not lynch you. That's what you want isn't it? This is really bad, you wouldn't be resigned like this as town.
I did not realize B_E was a new player when I voted him. I was actually operating under suspicion that he was a gimmick... there was something about his post in which he stated no desire to participate in RVS that read to me like he is fairly familiar with the game.
Another note: My activity level will be low over the next week or so. Work is going to keep me very much tied up until Tuesday or Wednesday.
I did not have a comfortable enough read on B_E to vote him. That has changed though.
It's hard to ignore a case like the one DCIII put forward...
unvote
Vote: Burning_Earth
I will try to get more out later today.
Like I said, I only have one vote
Oh god... why did you wait until now to give me this? I have repeatedly said that this was my problem with you and you have a simple explanation for it
In other news, I think BE just outed himself and ME as scum.
The distancing in his last post is awkward and reminds me of my own first game as scum (which was my first game period).
unvote Antny, vote B_E
And I think B_E is trying to deflect, and poorly. (Could be a scum bus attempt, but ME is such a background player at this time l, I am not confident enough to say for sure at this juncture. And yes I have had my vote on him this whole time. Kind of hoped a little pressure would get him going on something, but all we have is a claim of vanilla town. He maybe a case of too kinky to torture. Look it up on tvtropes.)
Unvote: Mirrorentity, Vote: Burning Earth
Thanks to Heroes of the Plane Studios for the sigpic.
Spider-Man Mafia 3 (Off-Site: NGA)
Metroid Mafia (Off-Site: Mafia Universe)
Please explain to me exactly what happened between these two posts. What you did in the game, what you read, your thought processes, etc.
Okay. On second thought I'm being unfair there.
I didn't think anything of it until #165.
Burning Earth (5): mirrorentity, DCIII, Void, Rhand, Shockwave07
mirrorentity (3): The Most Curious Thing, Kraj, Burning Earth
Rhand (2): Archmage Eternal, Antny223
Not Voting (2): dkingsland967, Nny
With 12 alive, it's 7 votes to lynch.
Day One will end no later than 11:59PM EST, Wednesday, November 27th.
@Everyone Are we looking to hold off ending the day till Nny is back?
1. I clicked on the 'number of posts for this thread (that links to a post count and search by player). I saw ME's number of posts (large) and was suprised as I didn't remember him posting any real content. Well, he still hadn't. I was already going to vote him before I saw
2. Kraj's post
@Nny, how about now?
They hate us cause they ain't us.
I have to go back and look things over. I quickly skimmed. The first post is early on, DK suspected ME. From what I looked over in my skim DC doesn't say anything about or to ME. This last post is recently and is the only thing I saw regarding ME. ME was on the verge of a lynch and DC changed that. It's impossible to do an analysts without having an alignment to go off of but there's a few things I want to consider. ME/BE, DCIII and any motivation, and the speed of this wagon.
They hate us cause they ain't us.
Quotes from BE:
BE's case against MirrorEntity continues to sound forced. In particular, I didn't like the fact that BE went from haven't no reads on anyone in posts 106 and 134 but when Kraj decided that ME was a decent target, he suddenly decided that early posts against BE were bad. With Nny back I am comfortable putting BE at L-1.
vote Burning_Earth
@Burning_Earth I would start taking the advice your giving to ME and defend yourself. Other than Mirror_Entity what reads do you have?
MirrorEntity is also looking suspicious but I have a hard time putting him in league with Burning_Earth. I think there's little reason for BE to go after ME when he did if both were scum, since ME wasn't in any real danger yet. That said if I start reading BE as town this is probably where my vote is heading back to, as ME is still in my top three scumreads.
Unless I'm mistaken the case against B_E is that he's not contributed and just barned people, particularly me. That's fair but it doesn't make me want to move my vote off of M_E.
Current New Favorite Person™: Mallory Archer
She knows why.
unvote B_E to avoid a quicklynch.
Any reason in particular you don't want to give Nny the chance to weigh in before the hammer Antny?
I have to agree with this. Nny has only posted saying he'd have a t/s list by tomorrow. Not something I'd really call involved. Why do you feel his is in because of that post?
Thanks to Heroes of the Plane Studios for the sigpic.
Spider-Man Mafia 3 (Off-Site: NGA)
Metroid Mafia (Off-Site: Mafia Universe)
What kind of catch up post is that? You have nothing else to say on anything?
Focusing on the two lynch candidates is not the way to do a catch up post. I get the feeling that Antny may be trying to bus someone here.
Do you think a double-bus is possible here? Mirror's post where he voted B_E had virtually no content or reasoning behind it, and B_E's vote of mirror was just a /barn of Kraj and had a bit of an OMGUS smell.
I do agree that the wagon picked up momentum extremely fast, but seriously, there is good casing against B_E and he has done no scumhunting at all. I am perfectly willing to lynch him in the face of the possibility of a counterwagon. If he flips scum, awesome! ToMorrow, we get to work on figuring out who was bussing. If he flips town, we still eliminated a player we thought was scummy, mirror is pretty much confirmed scum, and we can examine the votes and try to figure out who were the opportunistic scum on the B_E wagon.
Thoughts?
Mostly, yes. Also the change of mindset from saying there wasn't a votable case and then voting for ME after there were more votes on him when the case itself hadn't evolved much from when he said there wasn't a votable case. Also, the self-conscious behavior around the post count and stringing singlet posts along to up his tally. More recently, deflecting onto ME as well.
@AE - Fair caution, but what do you think of the BE case itself and what is your read on BE?
To clarify my read on ME - I don't think he's posted much of worth and it's been hard to get content out of him. When I said that it looked like he's rushing to cover tracks and he admitted that he was doing so, that didn't feel very scummy to me, that seemed pretty open book. But when I asked him for his reads, I didn't care for the fact that he basically gave all positive reads except for one player. He has seemed to be going out of his way not to irk anyone this game, I do agree with that.
I am suspicious of him but I think that the case on BE is much stronger. From a scum hunting perspective, they're both not doing much of anything and BE's actions and behavior are much worse, in my opinion.
Town Win % = 75%
Mafia Win % = 75%
Overall Win % = 75%
Completed Game Log
2014: Best Mafia Performance (Group)
2014: Most Improved Player
2014: Best Town Player
2014: Best Overall Player
Your case on me rests on
1: Me making short double-posts. I'm sorry about those, but I forgot to say things. Should I have not said them instead?
2: I wagoned on to ME after Kraj also did. I'm sorry, but I have explained this. If you want a full PBPA analysis on ME to explain why I think his/her posts are bad, fine. I will do so if you ask
3 I said "Explaining it away as OMGUS? Well explain away the other votes on you." and it was interpreted as that I was just 'resting on the fact that other people had voted ME'. Well what I was saying was that ME was trying to explain away the case on him/her by crying "HEY! HIS VOTE IS INVALID AND OMGUS!"
If your going to be so focused on me you should at least read my posts. I said clearly I was just going to vote BE as soon as Nny ceased being V/LA so it shouldn't be a surprise to you. Did any those posts say I was waiting because I wanted Nny to state a case against BE? No, they didn't, but I guess any chance to throw a loaded question that me is too good to miss, right
I had no interest in what he said as the case was pretty clear already in my mind (and obviously yours since you weren't interested in waiting for Nny at all I might add) but I didn't want to end the day while a player is V/LA. If we end the day it's night one, and if Nny doesn't get back to Sunday - by which point day 2 has started that could be bad for town. Imagine Nny is cop and loses a chance to investigate. Also I wasn't the only guy against ending the day before Nny got back, just my vote was in the position to get us closer to there than I liked.
Finally it's L-1, there's still plenty of time for Nny to post before days end and even if he didn't what benefit is there to me stopping him?
Hope that answers your concerns as well Shockwave.
What more do you want here exactly? I have three real targets at this point and it seems almost counter productive to repeat why I think Rhand is scum. I said all needed to say. You take the rest as town right now in my book. Sorry if that's too short buts it's about the same length as most of your posts and I really can't understand what you think I should have added.
And yet my vote is in the exact same place as yours is.
Also looking your over your posts again reminded me of this post. You defend BE for the lack of content in his post and even say it doesn't matter if the post appears insignificant because it shows what someone is thinking.
Well I have clearly stated what I am thinking so why it is such an issue with me, yet something that I shouldn't be concerned about BE doing exactly?
I want him to weigh in on everything before hitting Night.
I didn't imply I only want his input on BE.
Putting someone at L-1 enables a self-hammer. You don't know how much time there will be for Nny to post when you do that.
You obviously don't care for what he has to say.
The thing you put between brackets is a smear. I did not put BE in hammer range and I unvoted when you did.
The pink part is another smear. You ask yourself a question I didn't pose to then smear me with your answer.
In the brackets I pointed out that you did the same as me. You voted for BE without needing Nny input, why should I not be allowed the same.
And I don't get what your saying about a self hammer. Doesn't hammer mean that we vote for someone or have I got that wrong? If not why would someone self hammer? I'm really confused.
Finally just because I don't need his input doesn't mean I'm not interested in what he's saying. There's still time post either today or day 2. Stop putting words in my mouth!
Despite your attempts to push back into a slapfight with you, the vote is staying on BE for now.
Scum often self-hammers (votes for themselves as final vote) to end discussion.
That's why there is a huge difference between the L-2 and L-1 vote.
And that's what I was accusing you of: you're opening the self-hammer and thus the end of the day while Nny hasn't had the chance to post his reads.
That was not a defense of BE. That's me showing that if BE is Scum that we would be able to use his posting against him using an interaction chart. Good twist on what I was actually trying to say.
"What more were you expecting?"
I was expecting more content from you rather than just focusing on the main wagons of toDay. There is more going on than just those wagons. This is answer was quite obvious considering I mentioned how you focused on those wagons in a previous post.
"Well I have clearly stated what I am thinking so why it is such an issue with me, yet something that I shouldn't be concerned about BE doing exactly?"
Please rephrase this one.
I'm not seeing any other questions addressed to me.
2) What I was trying to say is that you said it didn't matter that it looked like you were saying that Burning_Earth didn't have much content in his posts because it showed where he his thinking was directed if nothing else. I found it odd the same courtesy wasn't extended to me. I feel I'm being fairly open with where my targets are and don't see why you need a long post or anything from me and not for Burning_Earth. Really that's all I'm looking for an explanation on.