In the meantime, any chance of a delivery for someone associated with Decapod 10?
Also, if Cythare turns out to be telling the truth about being a doc, especially if she flips town, I think it wouldn't be a bad idea for DCIII to check out iRebels claim and clear up that matter.
This is not an accusation of iRebel being scum.
That said, we are in a Futurama game here, so I'd expect an odd role or two.
I don't have any hard numbers on this, but I'm targeted more often than a black guy driving a beat-up sedan with a broken tail-light and no license plate, and Cy's well aware of that.
I don't have any hard numbers on this, but I'm targeted more often than a black guy driving a beat-up sedan with a broken tail-light and no license plate, and Cy's well aware of that.
"Robot Satan! I didn't know you come when we beckon." The look on iRebel's face betrayed his surprise.
"I don't, you fools. I just recognize a good opportunity when I see one." Robot Satan looked around. "Now which soul do I get to keep?"
"Whaaaa? That's crazy talk. Besides you owe us after that whole Idle Hands thing..." Cythare looked deadly serious. "Now back down to where you came from."
"Or what?"
"Or I revoke the contracts that you had with us." Anything to gain the upperhand.
"Contracts. I'm Robot Satan! You think I'm worried about your contracts? I have a whole team of LawyerBots to write mine."
"Listen, there's no need to get hostile, you dolt. What your lawyerbots didn't tell you is they work for me! Where do you think they were created, you fool?" With a slip of the finger, Cythare flipped a switch that he had hidden under his belt. "You didn't honestly think that I would work for this dump, did you? I OWN IT NOW!"
With the exception of Robot Satan, every robot dropped what they were programmed to do and began the approach to Planet Express.
"EVERY ROBOT ON THIS PLANET OWES ME IT'S GRATITUDE! I CAN'T HAVE THIS RINKY DINK OPERATION STANDING IN MY WAY!"
It was at this point that everyone realized that hiring Cythare had been a mistake, regardless of the sob story.
"Mark. My. Words. My robot army will tear this building to the ground." The rage was becoming apparent now. "The Zombies were my idea. The robo-puppy was my idea. You can't stop what has been set in motion. Even if you get rid of me, my legacy will live on forever!"
"I wouldn't worry about that. The reception where you're going isn't that great." Robot Satan lunged for Cythare and before he could fight back had him restrained. Robot Satan looked back over his shoulder. "We'll call this even. Once I have him down there the robots should return to whatever they were doing."
"Oh, I almost forgot." Robot Satan pulled out a crinkly old piece of paper that most assuredly Cythare had long forgotten about. "You signed your soul over to me a long time ago. I've just come back to collect what's mine."
And with that Cythare and Robot Satan disappeared.
Cythare has died. He was:
Mom the Mafia Doctor.
You are Mom, the Chief Executive Officer of MomCorp. Owning 99.7% of the company as well as it’s subsidiaries such as “Mom’s Friendly Robot Company” has made you one of the richest people in the universe.
You’ve always been evil, so this is nothing new for you. Your next target? Planet Express.
“Amazing. Some dumb bastard has nearly a million other dumb bastards following his every twit.” –Mom
Abilities:
You are the Doctor. Each night you may choose a player and that player will be protected from kills.
That being said, I targeted FIGHTING with a role cop last night and was unsuccessful in my action.
Before going into the Night I advertised that I would this. If Shock delayed Idle, then a roleblock from him on me shouldn't have worked.
I'll leave for discussion as other night actions are claimed, but I wouldn't be shocked to see a three man scum team. If it's just two, I don't think that Idle can be the counterpart to Cythare. If it's three, it could be Idle and someone else, but if it's just two, I don't think it can be him alone if Shock did what he said he would.
Barring other information, my vote will likely be on FIGHTING. Both roles she claimed knowledge of were also scum roles Cythare as doc and roleblocker (which could be true or could be made up.
I did target Idle last night so that clears him of being the roleblocker.
FIGHTING is possible under your scenario.
But just before the the Day closed I suggested targeting iRebel to check the validity of the Inventor/Doctor combo, so that is another thing to look into, but we do have evidence of at least half of that combo being true.
What I can't figure out is why Roleblock and don't carry through a NK when the action would likely clearly clear a player if they were delayed (Idle)? This creates another layer of WIFOM that confuses things further.
A bit of order of opperations that we don't know? NK and other night action can't happen at the same time? Or is it a case of a player mixing up signals based on WIFOM?
That being said, I targeted FIGHTING with a role cop last night and was unsuccessful in my action.
Before going into the Night I advertised that I would this. If Shock delayed Idle, then a roleblock from him on me shouldn't have worked.
I'll leave for discussion as other night actions are claimed, but I wouldn't be shocked to see a three man scum team. If it's just two, I don't think that Idle can be the counterpart to Cythare. If it's three, it could be Idle and someone else, but if it's just two, I don't think it can be him alone if Shock did what he said he would.
Barring other information, my vote will likely be on FIGHTING. Both roles she claimed knowledge of were also scum roles Cythare as doc and roleblocker (which could be true or could be made up.
Going a bit into Mod gaming territory here, but not necessarily. It would depend on how EtR is resolving Night actions. If a delayer is treated like a roleblocker, then we may have this chain of actions:
Shockwave delays Idle; Idle roleblocks DC; DC role cops FIGHTING.
If EtR resolves them in a fashion to minimise conflicts, then Shockwave would delay Idle, thus blocking Idle from roleblocking you.
If EtR resolves all roleblocks simultaneously, then Shockwave would delay Idle as Idle roleblocks you, which would end up with you being roleblocked.
That said, three scum plus a Hitman in a 12 man is hard for me to believe because it flat out means the town doesn't get the unwritten 3 mislynches before losing.
I don't have any hard numbers on this, but I'm targeted more often than a black guy driving a beat-up sedan with a broken tail-light and no license plate, and Cy's well aware of that.
I don't have any hard numbers on this, but I'm targeted more often than a black guy driving a beat-up sedan with a broken tail-light and no license plate, and Cy's well aware of that.
I don't have any hard numbers on this, but I'm targeted more often than a black guy driving a beat-up sedan with a broken tail-light and no license plate, and Cy's well aware of that.
Also: This whole poisoner theory just doesn't make any sense to me. Why would the scum have both a factional Night kill and another kill skill? In a 12 man, to boot?
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I don't have any hard numbers on this, but I'm targeted more often than a black guy driving a beat-up sedan with a broken tail-light and no license plate, and Cy's well aware of that.
But iRebel brings up a good point. How does a double kill follow a no kill? And the potential order of opperations with the abilities. We can speculate and try to outguess the mod, but it is something that explain what's going on.
But do want everyone to check in and see what they have to add.
If Idle Muse isn't scum, then the only thing I can think of is that the scum had (has?) an ability similar to Arcadic from Majora's Mask. This ability, specifically:
Passive Abilities:
Letter Bomb (triggered, one-shot) – Once during the game, while performing the Mafia kill, you may elect to send your bomb to the target via the mail system. If you do, that player will not die at the end of the night, but instead die at the end of the following day (at the same time as the lynch). When using this ability, you cannot be roleblocked or redirected, and a kill delayed in this way bypasses many (but not all!) protective abilities.
It works to explain the double NK. But there's one issue with it: FIGHTING was correct that we had a stand alone doctor in Cythare. It's fair to assume, from there, that FIGHTING is correct about a roleblocker, which is traditionally a scum role. So either:
- Idle is scum and a roleblocker, or;
- X (probably FIGHTING) is a roleblocker and the Mafia has a communal "letter bomb" skill
I'm just not seeing any scenario outside these two, and Occam's Razor says it's Idle.
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I don't have any hard numbers on this, but I'm targeted more often than a black guy driving a beat-up sedan with a broken tail-light and no license plate, and Cy's well aware of that.
My night was quiet.
I'm down for an Idle vote unless someone comes forward with something unusual.
A rb taking precedence over a delay makes sense. He may even be able to do 2 actions at night if iRebel's doc+gift is any sort of precedent.
My night was quiet.
I'm down for an Idle vote unless someone comes forward with something unusual.
A rb taking precedence over a delay makes sense. He may even be able to do 2 actions at night if iRebel's doc+gift is any sort of precedent.
Vote Idle Muse
For what it is worth, it is not unheard of for two man scum teams to be able to perform both Night Kills and actions. See Dr. Polyopticon for a recent reference where the roleblocker could perform both, but the JoAT could not.*
* note that the roleblocker could, if his instrument was confirmed in the game thread, lose the ability to do both at Night. But the default was the capability to perform both.
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I don't have any hard numbers on this, but I'm targeted more often than a black guy driving a beat-up sedan with a broken tail-light and no license plate, and Cy's well aware of that.
My idea of how a mafia poisoner could work is pretty simple, and follows what I've read in other games; if the poisoner performs the night kill, they may use their poison ability to make that kill be delayed by one night. I'm guessing that on N2 Cythare did the kill rather than the poisoner.
I believe the poisoner is Shockwave. He hasn't targetted anyone this game other than me, a vanilla with no role, so we have no mechanical evidence that he has that ability at all! Poisoner would make MORE sense with his flavour than delayer. Delayer is a GREAT fake claim for a mafia poisoner because he can use it to explain double kills. It all just fits together. Even looking at his interaction with Cythare; the main one that springs to mind is D2; everyone pretty much followed Shockwave's delayer claim into a voting for me but Cythare came out strongly AGAINST my lynch, and would havev got major townpoints when I flipped town.
Vote Shockwave07
If there's a third mafioso it's Void.
Except, if you read Cythare's role PM, it says he can perform a standard Mafia kill. So much for that eh?
I want dibs on Idle's hammer.
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I don't have any hard numbers on this, but I'm targeted more often than a black guy driving a beat-up sedan with a broken tail-light and no license plate, and Cy's well aware of that.
Quick two cents - what's the point of a delayer if they can't delay the attempted role block? No, no, someone who isn't Idle had to have role blocked me unless Shockwave's ability doesn't work the way he says it does.
I'm leaning toward FIGHTING since I was role blocked and indicated that I was going to target FIGHTING, not iRebel.
Quick two cents - what's the point of a delayer if they can't delay the attempted role block? No, no, someone who isn't Idle had to have role blocked me unless Shockwave's ability doesn't work the way he says it does.
I'm leaning toward FIGHTING since I was role blocked and indicated that I was going to target FIGHTING, not iRebel.
As I said earlier, if a Delayer is considered a form of roleblocking, and EtR resolves all role blocks simultaneously, it makes sense.
If he doesn't, then we have to have some kind of delayed kill mechanic. Which, as far as we can discern, makes no sense in this game because there aren't any other complex roles.
I maintain that Occam's Razor says it has to be Idle.
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I don't have any hard numbers on this, but I'm targeted more often than a black guy driving a beat-up sedan with a broken tail-light and no license plate, and Cy's well aware of that.
Quick two cents - what's the point of a delayer if they can't delay the attempted role block? No, no, someone who isn't Idle had to have role blocked me unless Shockwave's ability doesn't work the way he says it does.
I'm leaning toward FIGHTING since I was role blocked and indicated that I was going to target FIGHTING, not iRebel.
Quick two cents - what's the point of a delayer if they can't delay the attempted role block? No, no, someone who isn't Idle had to have role blocked me unless Shockwave's ability doesn't work the way he says it does.
I'm leaning toward FIGHTING since I was role blocked and indicated that I was going to target FIGHTING, not iRebel.
So you know the mod's order of operations?
Waiting to hear back from EtR to see if he can share that but don't see much of a point in a delayer if he can't actually delay actions that another player makes.
Also, why would Idle block me for saying I was going to role cop FIGHTING?
Quick two cents - what's the point of a delayer if they can't delay the attempted role block? No, no, someone who isn't Idle had to have role blocked me unless Shockwave's ability doesn't work the way he says it does.
I'm leaning toward FIGHTING since I was role blocked and indicated that I was going to target FIGHTING, not iRebel.
So you know the mod's order of operations?
Waiting to hear back from EtR to see if he can share that but don't see much of a point in a delayer if he can't actually delay actions that another player makes.
Also, why would Idle block me for saying I was going to role cop FIGHTING?
Because WIFOM.
"DCIII said he was going to target FIGHTING. Would he really telegraph his real intent? Or is he trying to next level logic me? If the former, then I [Idle] should use my roleblock somewhere else; but! if he's trying to next level me, then I have to use it on him, because he'll then find out I am scum. But surely he has to know that I would catch onto such a plan... but if he knows that I'd catch onto such a plan, then would he role cop me knowing that I'd know he'd know that I should catch on"?
Except, if you read Cythare's role PM, it says he can perform a standard Mafia kill. So much for that eh?
I want dibs on Idle's hammer.
What?? That doesn't contradict anything of what I said?? Cythare could perform the standard mafia kill, instead of Shockwave or Void, who can perform a special mafia kill instead? I don't understand your train of thought at all.
I completely read it as you saying Cythare was the poisoner. I can't read it seems.
That said I've already explained why it is HIGHLY unlikely there's three scum plus a neutral hit man. And explained why it's also unlikely that anyone but you is the final scum.
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I don't have any hard numbers on this, but I'm targeted more often than a black guy driving a beat-up sedan with a broken tail-light and no license plate, and Cy's well aware of that.
He uses Seppel's order of operations and a "Delayer" if one existed would be considered a Replacement Effect, which would resolve prior to a roleblock.
Idle isn't roleblocking.
I got blocked trying to rolecop FIGHTING. Both roles that FIGHTING claimed to know were scum roles.
Alright so while I have a moment from the hospital, considering EtR's updated order of operations we can operate under the following:
Idle Muse is not the scum roleblocker unless Shockwave did not do the action that he said he did.
I either got roleblocked or FIGHTING has some aspect to her role that she did not share that returns unsuccessful results when investigated.
I can't think of a scenario where Idle could be scum alone right now. So, either we're dealing with a three man team OR Idle is not scum (or both).
This is a little flavorgaming here, but it makes sense to me that iRebel's role is the one that Miss Blue's character was backing up since Fry is slated to inherit Planet Express from Prof. Farnsworth. Also, why would a scum role give pro town benefits to other players? Also, why would iRebel counterclaim his scum buddy also leaving the only town protective role in a set up with TK's character as Rezombied's bulletproof?
iRebel is town.
Rezombied had all of those reactions toward the delayer saying that there could be other explanations and wouldn't vote for iRebel. I believe his role and I believe it fits with the game. I also think Rezombied has been genuine all game.
Rezombied is town.
Unless the scum are a three man team, I can't see Void being scum either (and still very unlikely then). There are vanillas needed to fill out the game and many PRs have been claimed.
Void is very, very likely to be town.
So, to me, since Idle can't be scum alone, there HAS to be scum within FIGHTING and Shockwave.
But, the more I think about it, either FIGHTING or Shockwave as a solo scum would mean that they'd need to have both a roleblock and a way to delay a kill.
All of this makes me think it's pretty likely that there are still two scum left since that would be a lot of power that would have to be consolidated into one role.
If there is only one scum left than it probably has to be Shockwave, though... but that means that his role would have to be delaying kills one night AND also capable of roleblocking and since FIGHTING said that her role confirmed that there are no partial roles found out with her ability (i.e. why the doc had to be Cythare and not iRebel), then there wouldn't be able to be a sole roleblocker in the game and have it be Shock.
So, if the team was Shock and Idle - why would Shock frame Idle heading into D2? That doesn't make sense, either.
FIGHTING should be the lynch today and if the game's not over, then Idle is probably her teammate, but it could also be Shock still.
If she's somehow innocent, then is has to be Shock with a teammate, and that teammate really could only be Void in that case.
That's my case for voting FIGHTING. Please follow suit!
The last scum role very well could be a JoAT, which fits in nicely with having a two man scum team that is very strong. I guess I can see a scenario where a scum JoAT could have a delayed kill, a role block, and X.
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I don't have any hard numbers on this, but I'm targeted more often than a black guy driving a beat-up sedan with a broken tail-light and no license plate, and Cy's well aware of that.
Void, yesterDay you said you had a reason for wanting FIGHTING to claim earlier in the process. What was that reason?
FIGHTING was my only null read and it's not based on behavior. Everything FIGHTING has done is not memorable to me. It really bothered me that I had nothing on FIGHTING, but reads on everyone else.
Thanks for the gift. I will keep the gift hidden for now. No need to out this information for the last Scum to try and utilize it to their advantage. And that's if we don'y lynch the last Scum toDay.
Quick two cents - what's the point of a delayer if they can't delay the attempted role block? No, no, someone who isn't Idle had to have role blocked me unless Shockwave's ability doesn't work the way he says it does.
I'm leaning toward FIGHTING since I was role blocked and indicated that I was going to target FIGHTING, not iRebel.
Very much what DCIII is saying here. This is good supporting evidence that FIGHTING may be the last Scum rather than Idle. This does not guarntee that either are the last Scum though. The post is riddled with WIFOM.
He uses Seppel's order of operations and a "Delayer" if one existed would be considered a Replacement Effect, which would resolve prior to a roleblock.
Idle isn't roleblocking.
I got blocked trying to rolecop FIGHTING. Both roles that FIGHTING claimed to know were scum roles.
Vote: FIGHTING
All aboard!
We have to be careful here. We have supporting evidence for both Idle and FIGHTING, but there is the chance that someone not involved Blocked you instead to paint them as Scum. We can't rule this out.
Please do not vote hastily. We have already Mass Claimed so running someone up to L-2 is pointless. The Town has nothing but time on there hands. Town, take your time and read through the game. Use Cythare's interactions with others and see if an interaction sticks out like a sore thumb due to awkwardness of some sort or if an interaction abruptly stopped at a time when an interaction wouldn't.
I will be working on interaction chart to use as supportive evidence. My focus will be on Cythare's interactions with others.
The way the interaction chart works is that you take the amount of times a certain player (Cythare) has used quotes of other players and using the “@” symbol at another player. This indicates an interaction with another player. Once we have the number from another player we take that number and divide that number by the total amount of posts that dead player (Cythare) made.
Once the numbers are shown in percentage form we will be able to read the chart. Reading chart is simple as we are looking for a player that Cythare would have minimal interaction with, since it is easier for Scum to communicate with Town rather than their own Scum buddy, or we are looking for another interaction percentage that is higher than the others by a significant amount since an experienced player like Cythare would know to communicate with Scum buddy more often.
Based on these stats we have supporting evidence being given to Idle and Shockwave07 being Scum. This is a good place to start looking at interactions for anything that may be out of the normal. Looking back at Cythare’s posts there are a few posts that stick out as questionable. One with Asenion/Shockwave and the others with Idle Mude. Those posts are these here:
No, stop that Cythare. If I keep getting Night Killed after the first phase I'm going to have to ditch this account and start over again. Just think of me as a noob. I'm worthless and not valuable and clearly lynch bait.
i thought you were unlynchable
Defeated by my own ego.
While this post is questionable it is not as strong as I would like it to be and therefore Idle will be push for the lynch toDay when I get done showing you the posts from Cythare involving Idle.
The only other questionable thing we have from Asenion/Shockwave07 is the claim of the delayer, but the ability has at least been proven to an extent. The only scenario where the ability is faked is if Shockwave07/Cythare did not perform an NK that Night to try and get out a delayer claim. But that is stretching it quiet a bit for me. Occam's says that Shockwave is Town.
Without there being any other logical reason for no NK Night 1 that is.
How do you know there is no other logical reason?
Indeed, I find it exceptionally unlikely that our only protective role is a delayer, especially given we already know the setup contained a 2xVig on top of the mafia.
But, like I said before, any such protective role shouldn't claim anyway. It is my understanding that docs can't generally self-target, and giving this kind of info to the mafia is just stupid.
Had Idle waited to see that Shock wasn't responding me, then he would not have made that post above and attacked Shock for it. This screams to me that Idle was looking for a reason to find a way to jump onto a Shock wagon that may have been forming at the time.
Would you mind telling me why you think Idle is Town? I see you mentioned fast wagon and that he may not have made the kill, but what other reasons do you have?
Without there being any other logical reason for no NK Night 1 that is.
How do you know there is no other logical reason?
Indeed, I find it exceptionally unlikely that our only protective role is a delayer, especially given we already know the setup contained a 2xVig on top of the mafia.
But, like I said before, any such protective role shouldn't claim anyway. It is my understanding that docs can't generally self-target, and giving this kind of info to the mafia is just stupid.
Had Idle waited to see that Shock wasn't responding me, then he would not have made that post above and attacked Shock for it. This screams to me that Idle was looking for a reason to find a way to jump onto a Shock wagon that may have been forming at the time.
Would you mind telling me why you think Idle is Town? I see you mentioned fast wagon and that he may not have made the kill, but what other reasons do you have?
That's a fair assessment. Also, I apparently glossed over that post. Do we even know that there are 2x Vig? One was TK-421. Who is the other? If this hasn't been divulged in thread, then I'm definitely on board with lynching Idle Muse.
Also, it isn't so much that I think Idle Muse is town - his play hasn't been particularly compelling. It's more that I think that iRebel, Rhand and Paper/Shockwave were more scummy D1, and since I haven't been a fan of Paper, I was wary to trust his claim here. That said, I can't actually think of a scenario where it makes sense for scum!Shockwave's team to *not* perform a NK and then try to trade 1 for 1 with a town player, and it makes similarly little sense (although maybe slightly more?) in a scenario where Shockwave and Idle Muse are scum together.
Also, in terms of being "fast", I'm always wary of someone being run up into claim range within 24 hours of the Day starting if it's an early day, unless it involves definitive proof like a Cop or Watcher result.
I'll spend some time this weekend rereading Idle Muse, since the only sense of him I have is "not particularly compelling". I'll also look to see if we actually *do* know that there are two vigs. If we don't, he can hang barring a *really good* explanation.
Cythare avoids the Idle wagon because of the speed of the wagon, but when I challenge Cythare on this and show how it gets washed away, Cythare sees how my post as a fair assessment, but then does nothing with vote. It just sits there.
Without there being any other logical reason for no NK Night 1 that is.
How do you know there is no other logical reason?
Indeed, I find it exceptionally unlikely that our only protective role is a delayer, especially given we already know the setup contained a 2xVig on top of the mafia.
But, like I said before, any such protective role shouldn't claim anyway. It is my understanding that docs can't generally self-target, and giving this kind of info to the mafia is just stupid.
Had Idle waited to see that Shock wasn't responding me, then he would not have made that post above and attacked Shock for it. This screams to me that Idle was looking for a reason to find a way to jump onto a Shock wagon that may have been forming at the time.
Would you mind telling me why you think Idle is Town? I see you mentioned fast wagon and that he may not have made the kill, but what other reasons do you have?
With TK flipping neutral, pursuing Void for defending him is nonsense.
I'm pretty sure there is scum in the Fighting - Rezombied - Miss Blue cluster.
Voting me for wanting to use TK's nightkill to help town is bollocks.
I'm being treated like an easy mislynch now.
My gut says it's Blue. She knows me well and should realize that I am not auto-scum for that. She also posted after Shock's action claim without switching her vote to Idle Muse.
Is it really that unreasonable that you got these votes? He claimed non-town, which was contrary to our wincon. I really don't see what's so hard about that. You were under scrutiny (at the time of this quote, you were at L-3), and saying you're "being treated like an easy mislynch" seems like an attempt to fearmonger, coupled with a light slinging of mud on Blue.
This looks a lot like OMGUS ("she is scum for calling me scum"), and using the timing of Shockwave's post against her seems ridiculous. Even in the now very likely event that Idle Muse is scum, is it that unreasonable that she kept her vote on you - another player that she had a scumread on? It's not like you voted Idle on your first post after Shockwave shared his info.
I also don't like that you vote Idle Muse here and then immediately focus on yourself again rather than talk at all about the player you just placed your vote on and switch to who you want to lynch next.
"and both Rhand, BlueElectric, and Guardman pretty much /barned there way onto this"
I think this is a slip that your comrade is among Mister Rhand, Mister Dog, and myself. "Both" indicates two people - this suggests to me that you added your comrade at the last minute to this list of three without remembering to change your "both", meaning 2 of the people you named here are town and the third is not; you wished to make a blanket discrediting statement and decided you should include your comrade for the sake of making them look more like town.
But you dun goofed, Mister Muse. ^^
Good catch.
The smaller of the two portions here is the interaction with Rhand. It shows that Cythare is willing to vote Rhand, but holds onto his vote with Rhand being L-3. The bigger issue of this post is how Cythare agrees with Iso on the slip that Idle made by saying “Nice catch”. While the “Nice catch” is WIFOM it is still a questionable interaction and, yet again, we have a lack of vote. If it was indeed a catch like Cythare said it was, then his vote should have followed as well.
The Rhand wagon is now looking like a counter wagon to Scum Idle after this post. There is no reason for Cythare to not include Idle here. With Rhand being Scummy at the time it made it easy to allow this counter wagon to happen.
[QUOTE=Cythare;/comments/12811008]TL;DR: I would rather lynch Rhand than Idle Muse.
Vote Rhand
Now Cythare includes Idle in his post, but prior to this Cythare had not mentioned lynching Idle. He had only mentioned not wanting to vote him because of the delayed ability.
With all of this being presented I believe that lynching Idle Muse is the correct course of action for toDay.
We have supporting evidence for both Idle and FIGHTING, but there is the chance that someone not involved Blocked you instead to paint them as Scum. We can't rule this out.
If Idle was delayed, who do you think roleblocked DCIII?
We have supporting evidence for both Idle and FIGHTING, but there is the chance that someone not involved Blocked you instead to paint them as Scum. We can't rule this out.
If Idle was delayed, who do you think roleblocked DCIII?
I confess that I overlooked Shockwave07's post prior to doing the interaction chart.
I'm going to lay everything out as I presently am seeing it:
1. Cythare (Mafia Doctor)
2. DC (Vanilla)
3. FIGHTING (Town Role Cop)
4. Guardman (Town Tracker)
5. Idle Muse (Vanilla)
6. iRebel (Town Doctor + Inventor)
7. Miss Blue (Town Backup)
8. Rez (Town Bulletproof)
9. Rhand (Vanilla)
10. Shockwave (Town Delayer)
11. TK Baha 421 (Neutral Hitman)
12. Void (Vanilla)
(coloured = confirmed or all but confirmed, imo)
What we know:
1. Somehow two Night Kills happened Night Two. Scenarios include:
a. Mafia has access to some sort of delayed kill, be it a Mafia Poisoner, Letter Bomb style kill, or an unlikely communal kill/roleblock + kill
b. Shockwave's claim is true, which incriminates Idle Muse.
c. Miss Blue received a one shot kill from me and for reasons I'm not even sure God knows, decided to use it on Guardman. This is, in my opinion, highly unlikely.
2. A Mafia roleblocker OR Mafia JoAT with a rolebock exists; DC claims to be roleblocked. Scenarios include:
a. Someone besides myself being the scum roleblocker/JoAT and blocking DC.
b. DC is scum. This is, in my opinion, highly unlikely, for reasons below.
3. Shockwave delayed Idle Night 3. I protected DC. No NK occurred. Scenarios include:
a. Shockwave is a delayer and Idle is scum
b. Shockwave is a delayer and Idle is town.
c. Shockwave is scum and Idle is town
d. FIGHTING is a JoAT, roleblocked DC and no NK happened because the Mafia cannot perform both an action and a NK.
e. FIGHTING is a Roleblocker, somehow has a delayed kill (be it communal or weaved into his roleblock skill), roleblocked DC and no NK happened because the Mafia cannot perforn both an action and a NK.
f. FIGHTING is a Roleblocker, somehow has a delayed kill (be it communal or weaved into his roleblock skill), roleblocked and NK'd DC.
g. FIGHTING/Shockwave roleblocked DC and Y NK'd DC. This is unlikely, as I have explained before, because is requires three scum.
===
So let's work with this a little.
1. DC cannot be scum (I know no one thinks he is, but indulge me) because none of the Night actions from N3 make any sense from that perspective. Why wouldn't scum!DC NK me? Or FIGHTING? The only answer would be is he cannot use both an ability and perform the NK in the same night. I was successful in my Night actions, so clearly I wasn't targeted. So the only logical target for scum!DC would be to roleblock FIGHTING. But that doesn't pan out either, because he claimed to be roleblocked, and if he roleblocked FIGHTING it sets up a dichotomy between those two. It would be better for scum!DC to not claim I gave him a one-shot role cop if he was going to try and frame FIGHTING. Killing FIGHTING would've made more sense for scum!DC.
So that eliminates 2(b) from the list of scenarios, making 2(a) true. DC was roleblocked. That clears Idle Muse, thus removing 1(b) from the scenario list, meaning that 1(a) has to be true and 3(a) cannot be true.
2. If 1(a) is true, then the Mafia has a JoAT with no less than the following or a communal delayed kill ability or a roleblocker that also kills, but is delayed:
- Delayed Kill
- Roleblock
3. There's a fringe argument to be made that Rez is scum, but honestly, I don't consider it likely. His claim makes sense given the Neutral hitman. I cannot see a reason for him to roleblock DC when he can just kill FIGHTING or I. I suppose there's an argument to be made that he wanted to pour a ton of WIFOM into the thread? It seems like a less than ideal plan of action, as allowing DC to rolecop FIGHTING and killing FIGHTING essentially time walks DC, removing the ability to have FIGHTING somehow condemn Rez.
4. We know these are true:
1(a): a. Mafia has access to some sort of delayed kill, be it a Mafia Poisoner, Letter Bomb style kill, or an unlikely communal kill/roleblock + kill
2(a): a. Someone besides myself being the scum roleblocker/JoAT and blocking DC.
We know these are not or cannot be true:
1(b): b. Shockwave's claim is true, which incriminates Idle Muse.
2(b): b. DC is scum.
3(a): a. Shockwave is a delayer and Idle is scum.
I believe this to be highly, highly, highly, unlikely:
3(g): FIGHTING/Shockwave roleblocked DC and Y NK'd DC. This is unlikely, as I have explained before, because is requires three scum.
It doesn't matter whether we lynch FIGHTING or Shockwave toDay. If we lynch Shockwave, either 3(b) or 3(c) will be true. If 3(b), then one of 3(d)(e)(f) is true; if it's 3(c), then 3(d)(e)(f) are all false. If we lynch FIGHTING and he flips town, then 3(c) has to be true, whereas a scum FIGHTING means 3(b) has to be true.
If, somehow, 3(b) is true whilst 3(d)(e)(f) are false, then I have no idea what the hell is going on. Though I have to admit, having four Vanillas seems... off, to me, but I can't rationalise any of the living vanillas (DC, Idle, and Void) being scum.
Whilst I will support either a FIGHTING or Shockwave lynch toDay, I believe we should lynch Shockwave. It will resolve the existing dichotomy between Shockwave and Idle and provide us more information than FIGHTING, I think.
Vote: Shockwave
Private Mod Note
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Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
EDH UUU Azami, Lady of Scrolls RRR Diaochan, Artful Beauty UR(U/R) Tibor, Lumia, & Melek (WIP)
I don't have any hard numbers on this, but I'm targeted more often than a black guy driving a beat-up sedan with a broken tail-light and no license plate, and Cy's well aware of that.
I've been following along, but work has been pretty intense (2 jobs, up to 16-hour days), PLUS I usually don't have access to my computer after 11PM or so... so yeah. I've nicked off tonight to take care of this though.
The shockwave wagon confused me as I was watching it develop because it didn't make sense. The other scum is a roleblocker, but for Shockwave to be scum he has to have a delay kill. But then I thought back to something:
I can learn about scum roles, but I can't ask about the mafia Night kill. There's some amount of leeway with this, but this game doesn't appear to have very complicated roles.
I said that I "can't ask" about the mafia Night kill, but the more accurate statement is that that the mafia Night kill isn't factored into my ability at all. Meaning, if etr treats this delay kill as a modified factional kill (for instance, as a communal ability), I wouldn't have learned about it when I learned about the roleblocker. So it all fits nicely.
I'm down to lynch shock. That should be game over. If he's not it, though, we can pretty much just POE from here. I suspect either I or iRebel will be killed Tonight and the other blocked, but there's only one scum and not a lot of room to hide.
I checked DCIII last Night. He is what he says. At the time he was the only living player other than rezombied that isn't either mechanically confirmed or Void, and if I lose to scumVoid this game I will stop playing mafia.
DCIII definitely made the right move trying to target me, but the roleblocker finally reared its head. Just an FYI, I'm not scum, and if you want to try and lynch me you need more than "oh I got roleblocked after saying I was going to target FIGHTING," which is 100% WIFOM. I'm guessing that the scum are trying to keep their options open in terms of mislynch fodder going forward, which is why they did that.
I'm sorry that I don't have more time to put into this game. I like this direction and feel pretty confident in this wagon.
If I'm alive Tomorrow I'll commit to a full reread, no matter what I have to do. My schedule is crammed this week though.
I don't have any hard numbers on this, but I'm targeted more often than a black guy driving a beat-up sedan with a broken tail-light and no license plate, and Cy's well aware of that.
I don't have any hard numbers on this, but I'm targeted more often than a black guy driving a beat-up sedan with a broken tail-light and no license plate, and Cy's well aware of that.
I don't have any hard numbers on this, but I'm targeted more often than a black guy driving a beat-up sedan with a broken tail-light and no license plate, and Cy's well aware of that.
So... The smart thing for me to do as scum!Shock would be to fake a delay on a player that may or may not be a power role and either a) Delay the real NK or B) Poison someone, say I did nothing the following Day as well as point out a call for a lynch from a town player before their death, then Roleblock someone that would notice it after saying he would use a gift ability when for all intents and purposes no one had any doubts at that point that was the last scum was my claimed target?
Guys think about it for a second. Does this logic add up even in the most hair brained version of a scheme?
So... The smart thing for me to do as scum!Shock would be to fake a delay on a player that may or may not be a power role and either a) Delay the real NK or B) Poison someone, say I did nothing the following Day as well as point out a call for a lynch from a town player before their death, then Roleblock someone that would notice it after saying he would use a gift ability when for all intents and purposes no one had any doubts at that point that was the last scum was my claimed target?
Guys think about it for a second. Does this logic add up even in the most hair brained version of a scheme?
There's only six lynch options, Shockwave, and after examining everything, your lynch makes some of the most sense.
If you're town though, then take this time in twilight go give us a T/S list, your thoughts on FIGHTING, and whatever else you think may be relevant.
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I don't have any hard numbers on this, but I'm targeted more often than a black guy driving a beat-up sedan with a broken tail-light and no license plate, and Cy's well aware of that.
Also, don't you think that it is odd that when the "thank post" warning came up, especially since it was on one of Cythare's posts that I wasn't mod killed on the spot?
Also, don't you think that it is odd that when the "thank post" warning came up, especially since it was on one of Cythare's posts that I wasn't mod killed on the spot?
No.
Private Mod Note
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EDH UUU Azami, Lady of Scrolls RRR Diaochan, Artful Beauty UR(U/R) Tibor, Lumia, & Melek (WIP)
I don't have any hard numbers on this, but I'm targeted more often than a black guy driving a beat-up sedan with a broken tail-light and no license plate, and Cy's well aware of that.
I don't have any hard numbers on this, but I'm targeted more often than a black guy driving a beat-up sedan with a broken tail-light and no license plate, and Cy's well aware of that.
:censored: and I thought I had my first scum catch by ability use in this game going too...
Alright guess I should get my thoughts out there.
There are two ways this roleblock could be looked at. A) The option everyone is already thinking, it could be someone looking to hide their role. Very likely, as a caught roleblocker after a mass claim like that would be fast tracked to our sci-fi version of a gallows. Or B) Could be a scum taking a very oppertunistic move to create some misdirecting WIFOM.
Or maybe a combo of the two.
At the moment the most likely to be implicated would be FIGHTING or iRebel, even if half of his ability is proven.
DCIII is unlikely as we already had a mislynch lined up and claiming that now serves little purpose. As is Idle Muse who I delayed twice, as you will at least get proof of my role soon.
That leaves us with Void and Rezombied as the least likely to be noticed. And of the two I am at the moment leaning Rez for scum. During Day 3 when FIGHTING presses a Cythare lynch, he did vote Idle Muse as if to push that lynch through instead, but once Cythare got into hammer range he switched on the spot.
On top of that he tried to say during Day 2 that maybe it was a Doc that caused the no NK instead of my now unlikely NK delay. And I am beginning to think that was him leaking mafia information...
And while toDay wasn't very long, I don't remember Rezombied doing anything of note. Void at least made an effort.
In the meantime, any chance of a delivery for someone associated with Decapod 10?
Also, if Cythare turns out to be telling the truth about being a doc, especially if she flips town, I think it wouldn't be a bad idea for DCIII to check out iRebels claim and clear up that matter.
This is not an accusation of iRebel being scum.
That said, we are in a Futurama game here, so I'd expect an odd role or two.
Thanks to Heroes of the Plane Studios for the sigpic.
Spider-Man Mafia 3 (Off-Site: NGA)
Metroid Mafia (Off-Site: Mafia Universe)
UUU Azami, Lady of Scrolls
RRR Diaochan, Artful Beauty
UR(U/R) Tibor, Lumia, & Melek (WIP)
Mafia Stats
Draft my cube! (630 cards)
Thanks to Heroes of the Plane Studios for the sigpic.
Spider-Man Mafia 3 (Off-Site: NGA)
Metroid Mafia (Off-Site: Mafia Universe)
UUU Azami, Lady of Scrolls
RRR Diaochan, Artful Beauty
UR(U/R) Tibor, Lumia, & Melek (WIP)
Mafia Stats
I couldn't find a picture with a kitten that said that and didn't feel like making my own.
Draft my cube! (630 cards)
Draft my cube! (630 cards)
"I don't, you fools. I just recognize a good opportunity when I see one." Robot Satan looked around. "Now which soul do I get to keep?"
"Whaaaa? That's crazy talk. Besides you owe us after that whole Idle Hands thing..." Cythare looked deadly serious. "Now back down to where you came from."
"Or what?"
"Or I revoke the contracts that you had with us." Anything to gain the upperhand.
"Contracts. I'm Robot Satan! You think I'm worried about your contracts? I have a whole team of LawyerBots to write mine."
"Listen, there's no need to get hostile, you dolt. What your lawyerbots didn't tell you is they work for me! Where do you think they were created, you fool?" With a slip of the finger, Cythare flipped a switch that he had hidden under his belt. "You didn't honestly think that I would work for this dump, did you? I OWN IT NOW!"
With the exception of Robot Satan, every robot dropped what they were programmed to do and began the approach to Planet Express.
"EVERY ROBOT ON THIS PLANET OWES ME IT'S GRATITUDE! I CAN'T HAVE THIS RINKY DINK OPERATION STANDING IN MY WAY!"
It was at this point that everyone realized that hiring Cythare had been a mistake, regardless of the sob story.
"Mark. My. Words. My robot army will tear this building to the ground." The rage was becoming apparent now. "The Zombies were my idea. The robo-puppy was my idea. You can't stop what has been set in motion. Even if you get rid of me, my legacy will live on forever!"
"I wouldn't worry about that. The reception where you're going isn't that great." Robot Satan lunged for Cythare and before he could fight back had him restrained. Robot Satan looked back over his shoulder. "We'll call this even. Once I have him down there the robots should return to whatever they were doing."
"Oh, I almost forgot." Robot Satan pulled out a crinkly old piece of paper that most assuredly Cythare had long forgotten about. "You signed your soul over to me a long time ago. I've just come back to collect what's mine."
And with that Cythare and Robot Satan disappeared.
Cythare has died. He was:
Mom the Mafia Doctor.
You are Mom, the Chief Executive Officer of MomCorp. Owning 99.7% of the company as well as it’s subsidiaries such as “Mom’s Friendly Robot Company” has made you one of the richest people in the universe.
You’ve always been evil, so this is nothing new for you. Your next target? Planet Express.
“Amazing. Some dumb bastard has nearly a million other dumb bastards following his every twit.” –Mom
Abilities:
Other Information:
Final Vote Count:
Cythare (5): iRebel, FIGHTING, DCIII, Void, Rezombied
Idle Muse (1): Shockwave07
Void (1): Idle Muse
Not Voting: Cythare
Please have your night actions to me by 9PM Friday Night Eastern Time.
Be thankful that she wasn't your Mom.
That means you have an additional 12 hours to change any actions if you so desire.
No changes will be accepted after 9am eastern time.
"That's the new plan? Why wasn't that always the plan?"
"Shush. I'm thinking. DCIII, open that window."
"Sure. It is a pretty morning after all." As DCII turned back to the group, a rock with a note tied to it was thrown in.
"What does that note say?"
"It says," DCIII unwrinkled the paper. "Well, it just says 'Fear Us'."
"It probably would have been more threatening if you hadn't opened the window."
___________
Day 4 has begun.
That being said, I targeted FIGHTING with a role cop last night and was unsuccessful in my action.
Before going into the Night I advertised that I would this. If Shock delayed Idle, then a roleblock from him on me shouldn't have worked.
I'll leave for discussion as other night actions are claimed, but I wouldn't be shocked to see a three man scum team. If it's just two, I don't think that Idle can be the counterpart to Cythare. If it's three, it could be Idle and someone else, but if it's just two, I don't think it can be him alone if Shock did what he said he would.
Barring other information, my vote will likely be on FIGHTING. Both roles she claimed knowledge of were also scum roles Cythare as doc and roleblocker (which could be true or could be made up.
Town Win % = 75%
Mafia Win % = 75%
Overall Win % = 75%
Completed Game Log
2014: Best Mafia Performance (Group)
2014: Most Improved Player
2014: Best Town Player
2014: Best Overall Player
FIGHTING is possible under your scenario.
But just before the the Day closed I suggested targeting iRebel to check the validity of the Inventor/Doctor combo, so that is another thing to look into, but we do have evidence of at least half of that combo being true.
What I can't figure out is why Roleblock and don't carry through a NK when the action would likely clearly clear a player if they were delayed (Idle)? This creates another layer of WIFOM that confuses things further.
A bit of order of opperations that we don't know? NK and other night action can't happen at the same time? Or is it a case of a player mixing up signals based on WIFOM?
Need to get some questions answered.
Thanks to Heroes of the Plane Studios for the sigpic.
Spider-Man Mafia 3 (Off-Site: NGA)
Metroid Mafia (Off-Site: Mafia Universe)
Going a bit into Mod gaming territory here, but not necessarily. It would depend on how EtR is resolving Night actions. If a delayer is treated like a roleblocker, then we may have this chain of actions:
Shockwave delays Idle; Idle roleblocks DC; DC role cops FIGHTING.
If EtR resolves them in a fashion to minimise conflicts, then Shockwave would delay Idle, thus blocking Idle from roleblocking you.
If EtR resolves all roleblocks simultaneously, then Shockwave would delay Idle as Idle roleblocks you, which would end up with you being roleblocked.
That said, three scum plus a Hitman in a 12 man is hard for me to believe because it flat out means the town doesn't get the unwritten 3 mislynches before losing.
D1 Lynch (11)
N1 Scum Kill (10), Hitman Kill (9)
D2 Lynch (8)
N2 Scum Kill (7), Hitman (6)
D3 game over (3 scum, 1 Neutral, 2 town).
===
Also, if it isn't Idle, then how do we explain the double NK?
UUU Azami, Lady of Scrolls
RRR Diaochan, Artful Beauty
UR(U/R) Tibor, Lumia, & Melek (WIP)
Mafia Stats
===
Void, yesterDay you said you had a reason for wanting FIGHTING to claim earlier in the process. What was that reason?
UUU Azami, Lady of Scrolls
RRR Diaochan, Artful Beauty
UR(U/R) Tibor, Lumia, & Melek (WIP)
Mafia Stats
UUU Azami, Lady of Scrolls
RRR Diaochan, Artful Beauty
UR(U/R) Tibor, Lumia, & Melek (WIP)
Mafia Stats
UUU Azami, Lady of Scrolls
RRR Diaochan, Artful Beauty
UR(U/R) Tibor, Lumia, & Melek (WIP)
Mafia Stats
But iRebel brings up a good point. How does a double kill follow a no kill? And the potential order of opperations with the abilities. We can speculate and try to outguess the mod, but it is something that explain what's going on.
But do want everyone to check in and see what they have to add.
Thanks to Heroes of the Plane Studios for the sigpic.
Spider-Man Mafia 3 (Off-Site: NGA)
Metroid Mafia (Off-Site: Mafia Universe)
It works to explain the double NK. But there's one issue with it: FIGHTING was correct that we had a stand alone doctor in Cythare. It's fair to assume, from there, that FIGHTING is correct about a roleblocker, which is traditionally a scum role. So either:
- Idle is scum and a roleblocker, or;
- X (probably FIGHTING) is a roleblocker and the Mafia has a communal "letter bomb" skill
I'm just not seeing any scenario outside these two, and Occam's Razor says it's Idle.
UUU Azami, Lady of Scrolls
RRR Diaochan, Artful Beauty
UR(U/R) Tibor, Lumia, & Melek (WIP)
Mafia Stats
I'm down for an Idle vote unless someone comes forward with something unusual.
A rb taking precedence over a delay makes sense. He may even be able to do 2 actions at night if iRebel's doc+gift is any sort of precedent.
Vote Idle Muse
For what it is worth, it is not unheard of for two man scum teams to be able to perform both Night Kills and actions. See Dr. Polyopticon for a recent reference where the roleblocker could perform both, but the JoAT could not.*
* note that the roleblocker could, if his instrument was confirmed in the game thread, lose the ability to do both at Night. But the default was the capability to perform both.
UUU Azami, Lady of Scrolls
RRR Diaochan, Artful Beauty
UR(U/R) Tibor, Lumia, & Melek (WIP)
Mafia Stats
Except, if you read Cythare's role PM, it says he can perform a standard Mafia kill. So much for that eh?
I want dibs on Idle's hammer.
UUU Azami, Lady of Scrolls
RRR Diaochan, Artful Beauty
UR(U/R) Tibor, Lumia, & Melek (WIP)
Mafia Stats
I'm leaning toward FIGHTING since I was role blocked and indicated that I was going to target FIGHTING, not iRebel.
Town Win % = 75%
Mafia Win % = 75%
Overall Win % = 75%
Completed Game Log
2014: Best Mafia Performance (Group)
2014: Most Improved Player
2014: Best Town Player
2014: Best Overall Player
As I said earlier, if a Delayer is considered a form of roleblocking, and EtR resolves all role blocks simultaneously, it makes sense.
If he doesn't, then we have to have some kind of delayed kill mechanic. Which, as far as we can discern, makes no sense in this game because there aren't any other complex roles.
I maintain that Occam's Razor says it has to be Idle.
UUU Azami, Lady of Scrolls
RRR Diaochan, Artful Beauty
UR(U/R) Tibor, Lumia, & Melek (WIP)
Mafia Stats
So you know the mod's order of operations?
Waiting to hear back from EtR to see if he can share that but don't see much of a point in a delayer if he can't actually delay actions that another player makes.
Also, why would Idle block me for saying I was going to role cop FIGHTING?
Town Win % = 75%
Mafia Win % = 75%
Overall Win % = 75%
Completed Game Log
2014: Best Mafia Performance (Group)
2014: Most Improved Player
2014: Best Town Player
2014: Best Overall Player
Because WIFOM.
"DCIII said he was going to target FIGHTING. Would he really telegraph his real intent? Or is he trying to next level logic me? If the former, then I [Idle] should use my roleblock somewhere else; but! if he's trying to next level me, then I have to use it on him, because he'll then find out I am scum. But surely he has to know that I would catch onto such a plan... but if he knows that I'd catch onto such a plan, then would he role cop me knowing that I'd know he'd know that I should catch on"?
Repeat unto eternity.
I completely read it as you saying Cythare was the poisoner. I can't read it seems.
That said I've already explained why it is HIGHLY unlikely there's three scum plus a neutral hit man. And explained why it's also unlikely that anyone but you is the final scum.
UUU Azami, Lady of Scrolls
RRR Diaochan, Artful Beauty
UR(U/R) Tibor, Lumia, & Melek (WIP)
Mafia Stats
He uses Seppel's order of operations and a "Delayer" if one existed would be considered a Replacement Effect, which would resolve prior to a roleblock.
Idle isn't roleblocking.
I got blocked trying to rolecop FIGHTING. Both roles that FIGHTING claimed to know were scum roles.
Vote: FIGHTING
All aboard!
Town Win % = 75%
Mafia Win % = 75%
Overall Win % = 75%
Completed Game Log
2014: Best Mafia Performance (Group)
2014: Most Improved Player
2014: Best Town Player
2014: Best Overall Player
Idle Muse is not the scum roleblocker unless Shockwave did not do the action that he said he did.
I either got roleblocked or FIGHTING has some aspect to her role that she did not share that returns unsuccessful results when investigated.
I can't think of a scenario where Idle could be scum alone right now. So, either we're dealing with a three man team OR Idle is not scum (or both).
This is a little flavorgaming here, but it makes sense to me that iRebel's role is the one that Miss Blue's character was backing up since Fry is slated to inherit Planet Express from Prof. Farnsworth. Also, why would a scum role give pro town benefits to other players? Also, why would iRebel counterclaim his scum buddy also leaving the only town protective role in a set up with TK's character as Rezombied's bulletproof?
iRebel is town.
Rezombied had all of those reactions toward the delayer saying that there could be other explanations and wouldn't vote for iRebel. I believe his role and I believe it fits with the game. I also think Rezombied has been genuine all game.
Rezombied is town.
Unless the scum are a three man team, I can't see Void being scum either (and still very unlikely then). There are vanillas needed to fill out the game and many PRs have been claimed.
Void is very, very likely to be town.
So, to me, since Idle can't be scum alone, there HAS to be scum within FIGHTING and Shockwave.
But, the more I think about it, either FIGHTING or Shockwave as a solo scum would mean that they'd need to have both a roleblock and a way to delay a kill.
All of this makes me think it's pretty likely that there are still two scum left since that would be a lot of power that would have to be consolidated into one role.
If there is only one scum left than it probably has to be Shockwave, though... but that means that his role would have to be delaying kills one night AND also capable of roleblocking and since FIGHTING said that her role confirmed that there are no partial roles found out with her ability (i.e. why the doc had to be Cythare and not iRebel), then there wouldn't be able to be a sole roleblocker in the game and have it be Shock.
So, if the team was Shock and Idle - why would Shock frame Idle heading into D2? That doesn't make sense, either.
FIGHTING should be the lynch today and if the game's not over, then Idle is probably her teammate, but it could also be Shock still.
If she's somehow innocent, then is has to be Shock with a teammate, and that teammate really could only be Void in that case.
That's my case for voting FIGHTING. Please follow suit!
Town Win % = 75%
Mafia Win % = 75%
Overall Win % = 75%
Completed Game Log
2014: Best Mafia Performance (Group)
2014: Most Improved Player
2014: Best Town Player
2014: Best Overall Player
UUU Azami, Lady of Scrolls
RRR Diaochan, Artful Beauty
UR(U/R) Tibor, Lumia, & Melek (WIP)
Mafia Stats
FIGHTING was my only null read and it's not based on behavior. Everything FIGHTING has done is not memorable to me. It really bothered me that I had nothing on FIGHTING, but reads on everyone else.
Thanks for the gift. I will keep the gift hidden for now. No need to out this information for the last Scum to try and utilize it to their advantage. And that's if we don'y lynch the last Scum toDay.
Very much what DCIII is saying here. This is good supporting evidence that FIGHTING may be the last Scum rather than Idle. This does not guarntee that either are the last Scum though. The post is riddled with WIFOM.
We have to be careful here. We have supporting evidence for both Idle and FIGHTING, but there is the chance that someone not involved Blocked you instead to paint them as Scum. We can't rule this out.
Please do not vote hastily. We have already Mass Claimed so running someone up to L-2 is pointless. The Town has nothing but time on there hands. Town, take your time and read through the game. Use Cythare's interactions with others and see if an interaction sticks out like a sore thumb due to awkwardness of some sort or if an interaction abruptly stopped at a time when an interaction wouldn't.
I will be working on interaction chart to use as supportive evidence. My focus will be on Cythare's interactions with others.
Once the numbers are shown in percentage form we will be able to read the chart. Reading chart is simple as we are looking for a player that Cythare would have minimal interaction with, since it is easier for Scum to communicate with Town rather than their own Scum buddy, or we are looking for another interaction percentage that is higher than the others by a significant amount since an experienced player like Cythare would know to communicate with Scum buddy more often.
Based on these stats we have supporting evidence being given to Idle and Shockwave07 being Scum. This is a good place to start looking at interactions for anything that may be out of the normal. Looking back at Cythare’s posts there are a few posts that stick out as questionable. One with Asenion/Shockwave and the others with Idle Mude. Those posts are these here:
While this post is questionable it is not as strong as I would like it to be and therefore Idle will be push for the lynch toDay when I get done showing you the posts from Cythare involving Idle.
The only other questionable thing we have from Asenion/Shockwave07 is the claim of the delayer, but the ability has at least been proven to an extent. The only scenario where the ability is faked is if Shockwave07/Cythare did not perform an NK that Night to try and get out a delayer claim. But that is stretching it quiet a bit for me. Occam's says that Shockwave is Town.
Cythare avoids the Idle wagon because of the speed of the wagon, but when I challenge Cythare on this and show how it gets washed away, Cythare sees how my post as a fair assessment, but then does nothing with vote. It just sits there.
The next post we get is here:
The smaller of the two portions here is the interaction with Rhand. It shows that Cythare is willing to vote Rhand, but holds onto his vote with Rhand being L-3. The bigger issue of this post is how Cythare agrees with Iso on the slip that Idle made by saying “Nice catch”. While the “Nice catch” is WIFOM it is still a questionable interaction and, yet again, we have a lack of vote. If it was indeed a catch like Cythare said it was, then his vote should have followed as well.
Moving on:
The Rhand wagon is now looking like a counter wagon to Scum Idle after this post. There is no reason for Cythare to not include Idle here. With Rhand being Scummy at the time it made it easy to allow this counter wagon to happen.
Next post:
Now Cythare includes Idle in his post, but prior to this Cythare had not mentioned lynching Idle. He had only mentioned not wanting to vote him because of the delayed ability.
With all of this being presented I believe that lynching Idle Muse is the correct course of action for toDay.
Vote: Idle Muse
Why not just vote?
If Idle was delayed, who do you think roleblocked DCIII?
Unvote
Vote: Shockwave
I confess that I overlooked Shockwave07's post prior to doing the interaction chart.
1. Cythare (Mafia Doctor)
2. DC (Vanilla)
3. FIGHTING (Town Role Cop)
4. Guardman (Town Tracker)
5. Idle Muse (Vanilla)
6. iRebel (Town Doctor + Inventor)
7. Miss Blue (Town Backup)
8. Rez (Town Bulletproof)
9. Rhand (Vanilla)
10. Shockwave (Town Delayer)
11. TK
Baha421 (Neutral Hitman)12. Void (Vanilla)
(coloured = confirmed or all but confirmed, imo)
What we know:
1. Somehow two Night Kills happened Night Two. Scenarios include:
a. Mafia has access to some sort of delayed kill, be it a Mafia Poisoner, Letter Bomb style kill, or an unlikely communal kill/roleblock + kill
b. Shockwave's claim is true, which incriminates Idle Muse.
c. Miss Blue received a one shot kill from me and for reasons I'm not even sure God knows, decided to use it on Guardman. This is, in my opinion, highly unlikely.
2. A Mafia roleblocker OR Mafia JoAT with a rolebock exists; DC claims to be roleblocked. Scenarios include:
a. Someone besides myself being the scum roleblocker/JoAT and blocking DC.
b. DC is scum. This is, in my opinion, highly unlikely, for reasons below.
3. Shockwave delayed Idle Night 3. I protected DC. No NK occurred. Scenarios include:
a. Shockwave is a delayer and Idle is scum
b. Shockwave is a delayer and Idle is town.
c. Shockwave is scum and Idle is town
d. FIGHTING is a JoAT, roleblocked DC and no NK happened because the Mafia cannot perform both an action and a NK.
e. FIGHTING is a Roleblocker, somehow has a delayed kill (be it communal or weaved into his roleblock skill), roleblocked DC and no NK happened because the Mafia cannot perforn both an action and a NK.
f. FIGHTING is a Roleblocker, somehow has a delayed kill (be it communal or weaved into his roleblock skill), roleblocked and NK'd DC.
g. FIGHTING/Shockwave roleblocked DC and Y NK'd DC. This is unlikely, as I have explained before, because is requires three scum.
===
So let's work with this a little.
1. DC cannot be scum (I know no one thinks he is, but indulge me) because none of the Night actions from N3 make any sense from that perspective. Why wouldn't scum!DC NK me? Or FIGHTING? The only answer would be is he cannot use both an ability and perform the NK in the same night. I was successful in my Night actions, so clearly I wasn't targeted. So the only logical target for scum!DC would be to roleblock FIGHTING. But that doesn't pan out either, because he claimed to be roleblocked, and if he roleblocked FIGHTING it sets up a dichotomy between those two. It would be better for scum!DC to not claim I gave him a one-shot role cop if he was going to try and frame FIGHTING. Killing FIGHTING would've made more sense for scum!DC.
So that eliminates 2(b) from the list of scenarios, making 2(a) true. DC was roleblocked. That clears Idle Muse, thus removing 1(b) from the scenario list, meaning that 1(a) has to be true and 3(a) cannot be true.
2. If 1(a) is true, then the Mafia has a JoAT with no less than the following or a communal delayed kill ability or a roleblocker that also kills, but is delayed:
- Delayed Kill
- Roleblock
3. There's a fringe argument to be made that Rez is scum, but honestly, I don't consider it likely. His claim makes sense given the Neutral hitman. I cannot see a reason for him to roleblock DC when he can just kill FIGHTING or I. I suppose there's an argument to be made that he wanted to pour a ton of WIFOM into the thread? It seems like a less than ideal plan of action, as allowing DC to rolecop FIGHTING and killing FIGHTING essentially time walks DC, removing the ability to have FIGHTING somehow condemn Rez.
4. We know these are true:
1(a): a. Mafia has access to some sort of delayed kill, be it a Mafia Poisoner, Letter Bomb style kill, or an unlikely communal kill/roleblock + kill
2(a): a. Someone besides myself being the scum roleblocker/JoAT and blocking DC.
We know these are not or cannot be true:
1(b): b. Shockwave's claim is true, which incriminates Idle Muse.
2(b): b. DC is scum.
3(a): a. Shockwave is a delayer and Idle is scum.
I believe this to be highly, highly, highly, unlikely:
3(g): FIGHTING/Shockwave roleblocked DC and Y NK'd DC. This is unlikely, as I have explained before, because is requires three scum.
It doesn't matter whether we lynch FIGHTING or Shockwave toDay. If we lynch Shockwave, either 3(b) or 3(c) will be true. If 3(b), then one of 3(d)(e)(f) is true; if it's 3(c), then 3(d)(e)(f) are all false. If we lynch FIGHTING and he flips town, then 3(c) has to be true, whereas a scum FIGHTING means 3(b) has to be true.
If, somehow, 3(b) is true whilst 3(d)(e)(f) are false, then I have no idea what the hell is going on. Though I have to admit, having four Vanillas seems... off, to me, but I can't rationalise any of the living vanillas (DC, Idle, and Void) being scum.
Whilst I will support either a FIGHTING or Shockwave lynch toDay, I believe we should lynch Shockwave. It will resolve the existing dichotomy between Shockwave and Idle and provide us more information than FIGHTING, I think.
Vote: Shockwave
UUU Azami, Lady of Scrolls
RRR Diaochan, Artful Beauty
UR(U/R) Tibor, Lumia, & Melek (WIP)
Mafia Stats
I've been following along, but work has been pretty intense (2 jobs, up to 16-hour days), PLUS I usually don't have access to my computer after 11PM or so... so yeah. I've nicked off tonight to take care of this though.
The shockwave wagon confused me as I was watching it develop because it didn't make sense. The other scum is a roleblocker, but for Shockwave to be scum he has to have a delay kill. But then I thought back to something:
I said that I "can't ask" about the mafia Night kill, but the more accurate statement is that that the mafia Night kill isn't factored into my ability at all. Meaning, if etr treats this delay kill as a modified factional kill (for instance, as a communal ability), I wouldn't have learned about it when I learned about the roleblocker. So it all fits nicely.
I'm down to lynch shock. That should be game over. If he's not it, though, we can pretty much just POE from here. I suspect either I or iRebel will be killed Tonight and the other blocked, but there's only one scum and not a lot of room to hide.
I checked DCIII last Night. He is what he says. At the time he was the only living player other than rezombied that isn't either mechanically confirmed or Void, and if I lose to scumVoid this game I will stop playing mafia.
DCIII definitely made the right move trying to target me, but the roleblocker finally reared its head. Just an FYI, I'm not scum, and if you want to try and lynch me you need more than "oh I got roleblocked after saying I was going to target FIGHTING," which is 100% WIFOM. I'm guessing that the scum are trying to keep their options open in terms of mislynch fodder going forward, which is why they did that.
I'm sorry that I don't have more time to put into this game. I like this direction and feel pretty confident in this wagon.
If I'm alive Tomorrow I'll commit to a full reread, no matter what I have to do. My schedule is crammed this week though.
vote shockwave
*crosses fingers*
If I can count, that's a lynch.
Yep, that is a lynch.
Guess we'll find out soon enough if it's 3(b) or 3(d)(e)(f)...
What's your planet again, Rez?
UUU Azami, Lady of Scrolls
RRR Diaochan, Artful Beauty
UR(U/R) Tibor, Lumia, & Melek (WIP)
Mafia Stats
UUU Azami, Lady of Scrolls
RRR Diaochan, Artful Beauty
UR(U/R) Tibor, Lumia, & Melek (WIP)
Mafia Stats
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NO.
UUU Azami, Lady of Scrolls
RRR Diaochan, Artful Beauty
UR(U/R) Tibor, Lumia, & Melek (WIP)
Mafia Stats
Guys think about it for a second. Does this logic add up even in the most hair brained version of a scheme?
Thanks to Heroes of the Plane Studios for the sigpic.
Spider-Man Mafia 3 (Off-Site: NGA)
Metroid Mafia (Off-Site: Mafia Universe)
Thanks to Heroes of the Plane Studios for the sigpic.
Spider-Man Mafia 3 (Off-Site: NGA)
Metroid Mafia (Off-Site: Mafia Universe)
There's only six lynch options, Shockwave, and after examining everything, your lynch makes some of the most sense.
If you're town though, then take this time in twilight go give us a T/S list, your thoughts on FIGHTING, and whatever else you think may be relevant.
UUU Azami, Lady of Scrolls
RRR Diaochan, Artful Beauty
UR(U/R) Tibor, Lumia, & Melek (WIP)
Mafia Stats
Thanks to Heroes of the Plane Studios for the sigpic.
Spider-Man Mafia 3 (Off-Site: NGA)
Metroid Mafia (Off-Site: Mafia Universe)
No.
UUU Azami, Lady of Scrolls
RRR Diaochan, Artful Beauty
UR(U/R) Tibor, Lumia, & Melek (WIP)
Mafia Stats
UUU Azami, Lady of Scrolls
RRR Diaochan, Artful Beauty
UR(U/R) Tibor, Lumia, & Melek (WIP)
Mafia Stats
:censored: and I thought I had my first scum catch by ability use in this game going too...
Alright guess I should get my thoughts out there.
There are two ways this roleblock could be looked at. A) The option everyone is already thinking, it could be someone looking to hide their role. Very likely, as a caught roleblocker after a mass claim like that would be fast tracked to our sci-fi version of a gallows. Or B) Could be a scum taking a very oppertunistic move to create some misdirecting WIFOM.
Or maybe a combo of the two.
At the moment the most likely to be implicated would be FIGHTING or iRebel, even if half of his ability is proven.
DCIII is unlikely as we already had a mislynch lined up and claiming that now serves little purpose. As is Idle Muse who I delayed twice, as you will at least get proof of my role soon.
That leaves us with Void and Rezombied as the least likely to be noticed. And of the two I am at the moment leaning Rez for scum. During Day 3 when FIGHTING presses a Cythare lynch, he did vote Idle Muse as if to push that lynch through instead, but once Cythare got into hammer range he switched on the spot.
On top of that he tried to say during Day 2 that maybe it was a Doc that caused the no NK instead of my now unlikely NK delay. And I am beginning to think that was him leaking mafia information...
And while toDay wasn't very long, I don't remember Rezombied doing anything of note. Void at least made an effort.
Take out Rez this coming Day. Please!
Thanks to Heroes of the Plane Studios for the sigpic.
Spider-Man Mafia 3 (Off-Site: NGA)
Metroid Mafia (Off-Site: Mafia Universe)