For the record, I do want the Piccolo found. I just want it done by a "not the piccolo" claim in case he has a similar PR to Tan and myself. And with respect to Tanarin's theory and to avoid any theory on something that I think is not that relevant, I've stopped hunting for the other people with PRs. They can out themselves if they feel it's relevant.
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An accurate description of myself:
Quote from Megiddo »
You're the dude who just lies a lot and makes people hate you and then magically becomes town later, right?
Edit: Oh right, you guys want non-set-up related content. Uh-uh, Gifttrix is starting to sound more Town to me because he's trying to figure out why people are doing things. Nis should probably comment on more stuff.
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An accurate description of myself:
Quote from Megiddo »
You're the dude who just lies a lot and makes people hate you and then magically becomes town later, right?
2011: Best Mafia Performance (Individual) - Best Newcomer
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
@Iso: The posts I selected feel very "hey look I'm posting" too me. He has also spoken very little about where his opinions of other's alignments are, especially in the early game. He has commented on other people's arguments but not really taken a stand himself.
This just feels off to me, as if you're trying to discredit what Tanarin has been doing/has said so far.
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I don't have any hard numbers on this, but I'm targeted more often than a black guy driving a beat-up sedan with a broken tail-light and no license plate, and Cy's well aware of that.
Asenion, Rand, ITF, and GD (All for similar reasons I have addressed earlier)
Scum Reads:
Iso (Wanting to out the piccolo), Trix (He seems to love stretching arguments)
If the two green players have the same motivation re:the soloist, why are your views on them so diametrically opposed? If that motivation is why you find Iso scummy, shouldn't Asen not be in your town pile?
Asenion, Rand, ITF, and GD (All for similar reasons I have addressed earlier)
Scum Reads:
Iso (Wanting to out the piccolo), Trix (He seems to love stretching arguments)
If the two green players have the same motivation re:the soloist, why are your views on them so diametrically opposed? If that motivation is why you find Iso scummy, shouldn't Asen not be in your town pile?
I Misinterpreted his post #48. I thought while he was wanting a claim, he did not want to explicitly out the piccolo. That still does not change the fact though I believe he is town for other reasons outside said claim and for reasons similar to the reasons for everyone else in my town pile.
@iRebel: Sorry did not see your questions, but here are your answers:
As far as going into a deeper explanation, no I can not, but my reasons for putting Asenion on the town pile are pretty clear if you have followed the conversation between him and I (Relating to post restrictions.)
As far as Iso's previous meta and me making meta calls are concerned, well I could post scum Iso games all day, but good luck finding any linking meta between them, or any difference between his scum and town games. He plays so similar as town and scum it is really hard to meta him.
@GiftTrix: You are making it sound like I have not done anything at all. Last I checked scumhunting was more than just stating your opinions about others. Sometimes it involves asking questions as well. Seems to be you are trying to rush everyone into a decision right now. I don't see the need to do so given the game just started a few days ago.
Asenion, Rand, ITF, and GD (All for similar reasons I have addressed earlier)
Scum Reads:
Iso (Wanting to out the piccolo), Trix (He seems to love stretching arguments)
If the two green players have the same motivation re:the soloist, why are your views on them so diametrically opposed? If that motivation is why you find Iso scummy, shouldn't Asen not be in your town pile?
I Misinterpreted his post #48. I thought while he was wanting a claim, he did not want to explicitly out the piccolo. That still does not change the fact though I believe he is town for other reasons outside said claim and for reasons similar to the reasons for everyone else in my town pile.
@iRebel: Sorry did not see your questions, but here are your answers:
As far as going into a deeper explanation, no I can not, but my reasons for putting Asenion on the town pile are pretty clear if you have followed the conversation between him and I (Relating to post restrictions.)
As far as Iso's previous meta and me making meta calls are concerned, well I could post scum Iso games all day, but good luck finding any linking meta between them, or any difference between his scum and town games. He plays so similar as town and scum it is really hard to meta him.
There's a huge disconnect in your mindset, here. You're stating that because I want the piccolo found that I'm scum. Asenion also wants the piccolo found. This should indicate that regardless of your prior conversation with Asenion, that this is reason enough in your eyes to view him as scum. If you think that, for some reason, he is town outside of that based on your conversation with him, then the fact that he wants the piccolo found shouldn't be solely indicative of scum - and in fact, it suggests that it's more null than anything else. Given that I am basically your ONLY scum read and it's a solid read as opposed to a leaning read, I am inclined to believe that you are full of **** as to your reasons for believing I am scum unless you also label Asenion as leaning scum or null at the very least. This is so horribly self-contradictory that there's no way you can justify taking two different stances on the same issue for different people regardless of their separate behavior if the issue in question is strong enough for you to label one as your ONLY strong scum read. As for the meta stuff...what exactly is the relevance, here?
2011: Best Mafia Performance (Individual) - Best Newcomer
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
Oh, I somehow missed that Trix was also a scum read for you. Regardless, point stands, and I question your interpretation of my interactions with Trix, as well, if you can somehow justify thinking we're scum together.
2011: Best Mafia Performance (Individual) - Best Newcomer
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
I Misinterpreted his post #48. I thought while he was wanting a claim, he did not want to explicitly out the piccolo. That still does not change the fact though I believe he is town for other reasons outside said claim and for reasons similar to the reasons for everyone else in my town pile.
Could you expand on these reasons and how they relate to Rhand, ITF, and dan, please?
As far as Iso's previous meta and me making meta calls are concerned, well I could post scum Iso games all day, but good luck finding any linking meta between them, or any difference between his scum and town games. He plays so similar as town and scum it is really hard to meta him.
This sounds like you are giving yourself an out. Backpedalling and waffling your own read to salvage an excuse in the future if things go sour.
@GiftTrix: You are making it sound like I have not done anything at all. Last I checked scumhunting was more than just stating your opinions about others. Sometimes it involves asking questions as well. Seems to be you are trying to rush everyone into a decision right now. I don't see the need to do so given the game just started a few days ago.
Scumhunting is also more than just asking questions, it's also stating your opinions about the answers you get. Asking questions without giving opinions feels just as scummy to me as giving opinions without attempting to dig deeper both are ignoring half of the methodology of the town.
How am I rushing? I didn't vote you, or make a huge case and demand everyone lynch you, or even call you scum. I just said "these posts seem empty" and asked you to give your opinion about other players that I saw as lacking.
As far as Iso's previous meta and me making meta calls are concerned, well I could post scum Iso games all day, but good luck finding any linking meta between them, or any difference between his scum and town games. He plays so similar as town and scum it is really hard to meta him.
This sounds like you are giving yourself an out. Backpedalling and waffling your own read to salvage an excuse in the future if things go sour.
No it doesn't, it just sounds like he is describing Iso. Arn, you aren't even addressing the right things to make a case on Tan.
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An accurate description of myself:
Quote from Megiddo »
You're the dude who just lies a lot and makes people hate you and then magically becomes town later, right?
As far as Iso's previous meta and me making meta calls are concerned, well I could post scum Iso games all day, but good luck finding any linking meta between them, or any difference between his scum and town games. He plays so similar as town and scum it is really hard to meta him.
This sounds like you are giving yourself an out. Backpedalling and waffling your own read to salvage an excuse in the future if things go sour.
No it doesn't, it just sounds like he is describing Iso. Arn, you aren't even addressing the right things to make a case on Tan.
If you mean discussing the discrepancy between his read on you and his read on Iso, I didn't feel it was something I needed to discuss since Tan has not responded to the people who already brought it up. Iso routinely tells other people that he himself cannot be "meta'd". I just found it awkward that Tanarin brought it up.
As for finding the Piccolo and the MC.. why not? I’m not sure there is enough argument for greater benefit to either party. What’s the point of the flavour, then?
No Arn, because people started seriously voting for me when I thought we were still in RVS. Also, two instant votes on me was reaction enough.
@The Piccolo: Please carefully re-read your role PM before claiming. If you believe it is reasonable, I think allowing Iso the opportunity to work with you is a good idea. Incidentally, I can also give a bonus to the Soloist.
@Arn: Yes, my claim was a joke. Part of my posting restriction is that I'm not actually allowed to fully claim.
@Everyone: I want to determine how the soloist is chosen asap. If you have any reasonable ideas, please share them. Even if you can't or won't reveal why you think it's true, let's start brainstorming. This is obviously a mechanic the Town needs to understand and control.
Asenion is a little too eager to scumhunt, too quick, too concerned 48.
@TheGreatGiver: Scumhunting happens naturally. I'm creating content. People are responding to it. Once I'm satisfied, I'll re-read the situation and make a best approximation of alignments of those involved. Expect days of my ranting before then.
Didn’t strike me as natural; good thing he has a plan.
So you're just blowing smoke into the thread while trying to figure out how best to manipulate the game and letting scum hunting be a trivial side game?
People obviously have to react to something to start being perceived as scum (except, maybe, when they immediately begin babbling like Asenion). Point being: Trix comes off as offended and angry about something he could benefit from as town.
As for the hinderance see the exchange between me and Asenion posts 61-70. It's basically me stating he isn't scum hunting and hims saying "you're right, I'm not."
Trix has mentioned the word(s) scum(/)hunting more times than he has attempted it, so, what I mean to say is.. how do you people say it? Fos: Trix
@ITF: What makes you feel his question in post #61 is a fish attempt? I can certainly see it being asked without the intention of it being a fishing expedition. As for the stretch he makes in #58, yes it is a stretch, but is it really one to be voting him over ATM?
I honestly think Iso's push for a MC when it was established by Asenion's reply to me that there are restrictions floating around that prevent such a thing from being profitable is more disturbing in nature.
Why would he need to know the nature of Iso's ability as town?
Given Iso's claimed ability and Iso's nature, I can totally seeing him asking for the soloist to claim as town. Possible as scum... but would be a little ballsy even for Iso.
Quote from Pinky »
Et tu brute? I will ask you the same thing as Tan. Why is an instrument claim bad? If Iso is telling the truth what harm does it do for the solo person to claim?
I know it's weird, but you have to trust that it's a bad idea. There's already been way too much info dumping in the thread, and I'd rather prevent more if I can.
We could maybe do a instrument claim, then anyone that has a PR just claims family (woodwind, brass, string, or percussion). That would at least get around anyone's PRs. Main problem I see with it is scum can claim PR to give themselves wiggle room. Thoughts on this?
Quote from Iso »
Agreed about Asenion. I am dubious about Tanarin, however. Some of his reactions read as forced. We'll see how that cookie crumbles, though.
Reason on Tanarin is he was info dumping like crazy, which tends to come from town.
Quote from Iso »
Quote from ITF »
The piccolo should not claim today, and a mass instrument claim would be a bad idea as well.
I disagree by about 5000%.
I guess we could do a "not piccolo" claim or what I suggested above (which would more likely than not point to the piccolo), but I worry about the scum RBing the piccolo.
Quote from Rhand »
Why not unvote iRebel?
... Vote: ImTehFairy. Keeping your RVS vote on someone after RVS is often a tell (scum!iRebel did that in MTGS mafia)
Because I didn't have anywhere better to put my vote at the time.
It was scummy for iRebel in MTGS mafia because his RVS vote was on a relevant wagon, and he kept it waaaaay past RVS.
@Nis: Is there anything else you have to add to this game other then speculation?
How am I the one speculating? I tried to head off speculation on whether or not Dr. Polyopticon is a player at this time. It's a rabbit hole that doesn't need to be explored right now. Your attempt to mischaracterize the situation has been noted.
Really don't like this post. The difference is most other players have been scum hunting.
Quote from Nis »
Did I vote you? Did I even call you scummy?
Quote from Nis »
Your attempt to mischaracterize the situation has been noted.
You're clearly calling her scummy in the quoted part. Town don't "mischaracterize" situations, scum do.
Why are you so interested in Rhand and myself?
Quote from Arnnaria »
I present evidence when I'm discussing a read on players. I try to make my evidence support a logical conclusion based upon what I am saying. The fact that I don't outline or draw a direct opinion on said evidence is not something I feel comfortable doing at such an early juncture. Call it "summarizing" (to use the terminology Asenion is using) if you like. We are looking at a very finite source of information here. Some players haven't even posted since RVS ended.
But you gave plenty of things that could be used to determine Gifts's Alignment... yet you didn't give an actual read. One of your primary reasons for thinking Iso is scum (not getting the "joke") Gifts also did, yet you seem to be reading them completely differently and I don't get why.
Quote from Okarin »
Trix has mentioned the word(s) scum(/)hunting more times than he has attempted it, so, what I mean to say is.. how do you people say it? Fos: Trix
I agree, but why FoS rather than vote?
~
Not sure what to think about Gifts reversing his read on Ascenion. It's reasonable, but part of me is saying that he stopped because he saw that the Ascenion wagon wasn't going anywhere.
iRebel is scum hunting in his first post :thumbsup:.
Tanarin questioning me on my vote on Gifts, then voting Gifts for what seems like similar reasons is weird, and makes me want to look at Tan closer if Gifts flips scum. Gut still says Tan wouldn't be as info-spilling as scum though.
@Okarin: Hi, good of you to join us! Are you voting somebody?
@ITF: I would also request a soloist claim as scum if I felt it would benefit my team. I wouldn't write it off as townIso just because it's ballsy - see CCMVI for why.
2011: Best Mafia Performance (Individual) - Best Newcomer
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
I will be hammering all lynches, and behavior otherwise will be constituted as anti-town behavior.
Are you framing the person that votes before you? And to clarify, do you mean your own behaviour, that is to say, if you do not hammer, other people should consider your behaviour constituted as anti-town? (English is a poorly inflected language and needs pronouns for clarity)
I present evidence when I'm discussing a read on players. I try to make my evidence support a logical conclusion based upon what I am saying. The fact that I don't outline or draw a direct opinion on said evidence is not something I feel comfortable doing at such an early juncture. Call it "summarizing" (to use the terminology Asenion is using) if you like. We are looking at a very finite source of information here. Some players haven't even posted since RVS ended.
But you gave plenty of things that could be used to determine Gifts's Alignment... yet you didn't give an actual read. One of your primary reasons for thinking Iso is scum (not getting the "joke") Gifts also did, yet you seem to be reading them completely differently and I don't get why.
I barely wrote two sentences on Gifts's. Gifts didn't advocate a mass claim after voting Asenion because he offered a mass claim.
2011: Best Mafia Performance (Individual) - Best Newcomer
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
2011: Best Mafia Performance (Individual) - Best Newcomer
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
ITF, you shouldn't worry about it. I know what the scum can do to the soloist and how to play around it. That's why I'm advocating finding him.
@Arnnaria: You could have attacked Tanarin for any scummy behavior. The traditional once per game Iso meta post is a complete null tell. I actually had a similar section in my big post, but I cut it because I felt my other points shouldn't have anything to distract from them. It doesn't surprise me in the slightest to see someone make a similar post right after.
@Rhand: Be useful in your next post.
@Okarin: You dun goofed. I'm not a huge fan of this scum tell, but other people are. I would like to know your level of mafia experience.
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An accurate description of myself:
Quote from Megiddo »
You're the dude who just lies a lot and makes people hate you and then magically becomes town later, right?
2011: Best Mafia Performance (Individual) - Best Newcomer
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
2011: Best Mafia Performance (Individual) - Best Newcomer
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
And I've been agreeing. And now we know that the concerns regarding the Soloist being harmed are ill-founded. So more people should be on board with this.
2011: Best Mafia Performance (Individual) - Best Newcomer
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
/barn Iso re: post 157. I just don't see how Tanarin can clear Asension (something I agree with fully) but place Iso in the scum camp. 2+2 =/= 5. Right now I feel as if Iso and Asenion are the two biggest pro-town players at this point. I'd go as far as betting serious money on both being town, that's how confident I am right now of them.
Tanarin, which player(s) have helped form your opinion of Iso thus far?
I like ITF's comments about Nis.
And I'm also not the piccolo.
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I don't have any hard numbers on this, but I'm targeted more often than a black guy driving a beat-up sedan with a broken tail-light and no license plate, and Cy's well aware of that.
2011: Best Mafia Performance (Individual) - Best Newcomer
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
I don't have any hard numbers on this, but I'm targeted more often than a black guy driving a beat-up sedan with a broken tail-light and no license plate, and Cy's well aware of that.
And the piccolo business has nothing to do with moving the game forward. It's side business that I would hope to address by Night and will help us Tomorrow.
@ITF: Good. Enjoy your power. Be prepared to explain what you did with it at some point in the future when it becomes relevant. I like your play so far and it reminds me a lot of your early game in Presidential Mafia.
What does everyone else think of Okarin right now? I'm especially curious what my town reads think. (ITF, iRebel, and maybe Gifts) And please say what makes you have that opinion.
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An accurate description of myself:
Quote from Megiddo »
You're the dude who just lies a lot and makes people hate you and then magically becomes town later, right?
Oh one more thing: Everything is going according to my plan right now and hopefully Tomorrow I can reveal helpful things. However, I think any additional information right now would be an unnecessary risk. I know I've been the one pushing for more information, but there is always risk involved and I have everything I need now.
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An accurate description of myself:
Quote from Megiddo »
You're the dude who just lies a lot and makes people hate you and then magically becomes town later, right?
Well, I'm pretty sure Okarin is a gimick given he's flat out ignored the request for previous Mafia experience. He's also a newly registered account too.
I don't like this comment from him:
Asenion is a little too eager to scumhunt, too quick, too concerned 48.
(post 164)
Sounds like he is implying Asenion is scum because he's actively scum hunting, which is contradictory to me. It also comes across as if he's trying to compensate for being completely inactive thus far.
The rest of his post is just short comments, with no real scum hunting that I see.
I did the same thing in MTGS Mafia and it was considered a scum read (though I had my reasons, which are neither here nor there), so right now I have a slight scum read. He needs to start posting real content.
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I don't have any hard numbers on this, but I'm targeted more often than a black guy driving a beat-up sedan with a broken tail-light and no license plate, and Cy's well aware of that.
Before I forget: I want every person who thinks an instrument claim is a bad idea, to explain in detail why it's a bad idea.
It might just be me seeing ghosts, but this looks like a post that scum in the dark would make.
That line caught my attention as well, especially after I went off on her to read the thread initially back in post #81. You would think after re-reading that she would have caught on. Now, there is a chance she is just being lazy town here, but I dunno.
@iRebel and others asking about my Iso vs Asenion read: Basically I feel Asenion is town due to how willingly he not only spilled the fact he had a post restriction (He was first after all,) but also the fact that we now know there are more than 3 players with post restrictions, odds are he is town. Yes, I can't fully rule out the fact that he could be scum, but again, given how willingly he has spilled info into the thread, I can't see scum doing such a thing.
@ITF: Yes I did question your vote on Gifts initially, but that was because I didn't feel just one stretch was enough to put a vote on him. By the time I had voted, he tried to stretch things again (Trying to say I am not contributing anything at all.)
@Oakrin RE: Post 164: OK, Why do you feel that being "Eager" to scumhunt is a bad thing? Almost sounds like you are trying to say he is "Too Townie", and that just does not jive with me.
Also, how was what Asenion said in post #67 "unnatural"? You kinda leave everyone hanging here.
And as others have said, why the FoS in your first post? Especially given you seem to have a solid read on GT. It makes me feel as if you are trying to "commit" to a wagon without actually committing to it.
I don't have any hard numbers on this, but I'm targeted more often than a black guy driving a beat-up sedan with a broken tail-light and no license plate, and Cy's well aware of that.
@iRebel: So...because other people told you it was scummy in a game you did it as town in, you are saying it's scummy? But you were town when you did it, so how does that make any sense?
@Tan: So...the fact that I openly claimed that I have no PR is somehow not a point in my favor?
@Asenion: I believe I've made my stance on Okarin quite clear.
2011: Best Mafia Performance (Individual) - Best Newcomer
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
Wait, three others, Tanarin? I only remember seeing you and Asenion cop to having a post restriction. Who did I miss?
Yes, ITF is one (He hinted at it earlier on and then outright said it,) and GD and Rhand have both implied they have post restrictions as well in previous posts (112 and 113 respectively.)
@iRebel: So...because other people told you it was scummy in a game you did it as town in, you are saying it's scummy? But you were town when you did it, so how does that make any sense?
@Tan: So...the fact that I openly claimed that I have no PR is somehow not a point in my favor?
@Asenion: I believe I've made my stance on Okarin quite clear.
No, Iso, that isn't what I meant. In MTGS Mafia, I took a more under the radar approach, because every time I would find anything to say, I found someone else had already said it, and I felt barning a lot of posts was frowned upon, so I didn't post much, and when I did, it was just general thoughts, like Okarin is doing now. In that game, I was Mafia, but the fact I was Mafia was not the reason I did so. That posting habit led to me being caught as scum.
So my point is, I'm extrapolating from what I learned in MTGS Mafia and applying it to Okarin as I see a parallel.
Sorry for the confusion.
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I don't have any hard numbers on this, but I'm targeted more often than a black guy driving a beat-up sedan with a broken tail-light and no license plate, and Cy's well aware of that.
@iRebel: So...because other people told you it was scummy in a game you did it as town in, you are saying it's scummy? But you were town when you did it, so how does that make any sense?
@Tan: So...the fact that I openly claimed that I have no PR is somehow not a point in my favor?
@Asenion: I believe I've made my stance on Okarin quite clear.
No, Iso, that isn't what I meant. In MTGS Mafia, I took a more under the radar approach, because every time I would find anything to say, I found someone else had already said it, and I felt barning a lot of posts was frowned upon, so I didn't post much, and when I did, it was just general thoughts, like Okarin is doing now. In that game, I was Mafia, but the fact I was Mafia was not the reason I did so. That posting habit led to me being caught as scum.
So my point is, I'm extrapolating from what I learned in MTGS Mafia and applying it to Okarin as I see a parallel.
Sorry for the confusion.
...so wouldn't that make Okarin scum? Shouldn't town try to generate reactions form players and ask questions?
2011: Best Mafia Performance (Individual) - Best Newcomer
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
I don't have any hard numbers on this, but I'm targeted more often than a black guy driving a beat-up sedan with a broken tail-light and no license plate, and Cy's well aware of that.
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My cube: http://cubetutor.com/viewcube/9981
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{мы, тьма}
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
I agree with those calling Rhand's vote on Arnnaria a bit weak. Rhand is capable of higher quality content too, so I'm eager to see it.
This just feels off to me, as if you're trying to discredit what Tanarin has been doing/has said so far.
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So no thoughts on ITF and/or Rhand?
If the two green players have the same motivation re:the soloist, why are your views on them so diametrically opposed? If that motivation is why you find Iso scummy, shouldn't Asen not be in your town pile?
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The first rule of Cursecatcher is, You do not talk about Cursecatcher.
I Misinterpreted his post #48. I thought while he was wanting a claim, he did not want to explicitly out the piccolo. That still does not change the fact though I believe he is town for other reasons outside said claim and for reasons similar to the reasons for everyone else in my town pile.
@iRebel: Sorry did not see your questions, but here are your answers:
As far as going into a deeper explanation, no I can not, but my reasons for putting Asenion on the town pile are pretty clear if you have followed the conversation between him and I (Relating to post restrictions.)
As far as Iso's previous meta and me making meta calls are concerned, well I could post scum Iso games all day, but good luck finding any linking meta between them, or any difference between his scum and town games. He plays so similar as town and scum it is really hard to meta him.
@GiftTrix: You are making it sound like I have not done anything at all. Last I checked scumhunting was more than just stating your opinions about others. Sometimes it involves asking questions as well. Seems to be you are trying to rush everyone into a decision right now. I don't see the need to do so given the game just started a few days ago.
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There's a huge disconnect in your mindset, here. You're stating that because I want the piccolo found that I'm scum. Asenion also wants the piccolo found. This should indicate that regardless of your prior conversation with Asenion, that this is reason enough in your eyes to view him as scum. If you think that, for some reason, he is town outside of that based on your conversation with him, then the fact that he wants the piccolo found shouldn't be solely indicative of scum - and in fact, it suggests that it's more null than anything else. Given that I am basically your ONLY scum read and it's a solid read as opposed to a leaning read, I am inclined to believe that you are full of **** as to your reasons for believing I am scum unless you also label Asenion as leaning scum or null at the very least. This is so horribly self-contradictory that there's no way you can justify taking two different stances on the same issue for different people regardless of their separate behavior if the issue in question is strong enough for you to label one as your ONLY strong scum read. As for the meta stuff...what exactly is the relevance, here?
{мы, тьма}
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
{мы, тьма}
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
Could you expand on these reasons and how they relate to Rhand, ITF, and dan, please?
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The first rule of Cursecatcher is, You do not talk about Cursecatcher.
This sounds like you are giving yourself an out. Backpedalling and waffling your own read to salvage an excuse in the future if things go sour.
Scumhunting is also more than just asking questions, it's also stating your opinions about the answers you get. Asking questions without giving opinions feels just as scummy to me as giving opinions without attempting to dig deeper both are ignoring half of the methodology of the town.
How am I rushing? I didn't vote you, or make a huge case and demand everyone lynch you, or even call you scum. I just said "these posts seem empty" and asked you to give your opinion about other players that I saw as lacking.
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No it doesn't, it just sounds like he is describing Iso. Arn, you aren't even addressing the right things to make a case on Tan.
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If you mean discussing the discrepancy between his read on you and his read on Iso, I didn't feel it was something I needed to discuss since Tan has not responded to the people who already brought it up. Iso routinely tells other people that he himself cannot be "meta'd". I just found it awkward that Tanarin brought it up.
Asenion is a little too eager to scumhunt, too quick, too concerned 48.
Didn’t strike me as natural; good thing he has a plan.
People obviously have to react to something to start being perceived as scum (except, maybe, when they immediately begin babbling like Asenion). Point being: Trix comes off as offended and angry about something he could benefit from as town.
Trix has mentioned the word(s) scum(/)hunting more times than he has attempted it, so, what I mean to say is.. how do you people say it? Fos: Trix
Why would he need to know the nature of Iso's ability as town?
Given Iso's claimed ability and Iso's nature, I can totally seeing him asking for the soloist to claim as town. Possible as scum... but would be a little ballsy even for Iso.
I know it's weird, but you have to trust that it's a bad idea. There's already been way too much info dumping in the thread, and I'd rather prevent more if I can.
We could maybe do a instrument claim, then anyone that has a PR just claims family (woodwind, brass, string, or percussion). That would at least get around anyone's PRs. Main problem I see with it is scum can claim PR to give themselves wiggle room. Thoughts on this?
Reason on Tanarin is he was info dumping like crazy, which tends to come from town.
I guess we could do a "not piccolo" claim or what I suggested above (which would more likely than not point to the piccolo), but I worry about the scum RBing the piccolo.
Because I didn't have anywhere better to put my vote at the time.
It was scummy for iRebel in MTGS mafia because his RVS vote was on a relevant wagon, and he kept it waaaaay past RVS.
Really don't like this post. The difference is most other players have been scum hunting.
You're clearly calling her scummy in the quoted part. Town don't "mischaracterize" situations, scum do.
Why are you so interested in Rhand and myself?
But you gave plenty of things that could be used to determine Gifts's Alignment... yet you didn't give an actual read. One of your primary reasons for thinking Iso is scum (not getting the "joke") Gifts also did, yet you seem to be reading them completely differently and I don't get why.
I agree, but why FoS rather than vote?
~
Not sure what to think about Gifts reversing his read on Ascenion. It's reasonable, but part of me is saying that he stopped because he saw that the Ascenion wagon wasn't going anywhere.
iRebel is scum hunting in his first post :thumbsup:.
Tanarin questioning me on my vote on Gifts, then voting Gifts for what seems like similar reasons is weird, and makes me want to look at Tan closer if Gifts flips scum. Gut still says Tan wouldn't be as info-spilling as scum though.
@ITF: I would also request a soloist claim as scum if I felt it would benefit my team. I wouldn't write it off as townIso just because it's ballsy - see CCMVI for why.
{мы, тьма}
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
Yes, some people have sensitive toes.
Are you framing the person that votes before you? And to clarify, do you mean your own behaviour, that is to say, if you do not hammer, other people should consider your behaviour constituted as anti-town? (English is a poorly inflected language and needs pronouns for clarity)
I barely wrote two sentences on Gifts's. Gifts didn't advocate a mass claim after voting Asenion because he offered a mass claim.
{мы, тьма}
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
Unvote, Vote Okarin
NO BRAKES
{мы, тьма}
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
@Arnnaria: You could have attacked Tanarin for any scummy behavior. The traditional once per game Iso meta post is a complete null tell. I actually had a similar section in my big post, but I cut it because I felt my other points shouldn't have anything to distract from them. It doesn't surprise me in the slightest to see someone make a similar post right after.
@Rhand: Be useful in your next post.
@Okarin: You dun goofed. I'm not a huge fan of this scum tell, but other people are. I would like to know your level of mafia experience.
My cube: http://cubetutor.com/viewcube/9981
wut.
{мы, тьма}
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
My cube: http://cubetutor.com/viewcube/9981
Now everyone should claim if they are not the piccolo.
{мы, тьма}
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
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And I've been agreeing. And now we know that the concerns regarding the Soloist being harmed are ill-founded. So more people should be on board with this.
{мы, тьма}
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
I'm not the piccolo.
Sigil: an MMORPCCG ">Mexus: An MMORPCCG
Tanarin, which player(s) have helped form your opinion of Iso thus far?
I like ITF's comments about Nis.
And I'm also not the piccolo.
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I have a PR, but I'm a woodwind. If you read between the lines, you should be able to figure out what I am.
There's a big difference between a mass claim and an instrument claim though.
Again, why?
I am not the Piccolo.
Cool.
I was actually looking through the game again to look for who might and who might not be the Piccolo before ITF claimed and I found a post I disliked:
It might just be me seeing ghosts, but this looks like a post that scum in the dark would make.
{мы, тьма}
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
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You are... Not paying attention...
And the piccolo business has nothing to do with moving the game forward. It's side business that I would hope to address by Night and will help us Tomorrow.
@ITF: Good. Enjoy your power. Be prepared to explain what you did with it at some point in the future when it becomes relevant. I like your play so far and it reminds me a lot of your early game in Presidential Mafia.
What does everyone else think of Okarin right now? I'm especially curious what my town reads think. (ITF, iRebel, and maybe Gifts) And please say what makes you have that opinion.
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@Iso: That's plausible. In my experience Town PB tends to be more aggressively hunting by now.
Nis and Rhand need to comment on current events. Both of you have my attention.
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I don't like this comment from him:
(post 164)
Sounds like he is implying Asenion is scum because he's actively scum hunting, which is contradictory to me. It also comes across as if he's trying to compensate for being completely inactive thus far.
The rest of his post is just short comments, with no real scum hunting that I see.
I did the same thing in MTGS Mafia and it was considered a scum read (though I had my reasons, which are neither here nor there), so right now I have a slight scum read. He needs to start posting real content.
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That line caught my attention as well, especially after I went off on her to read the thread initially back in post #81. You would think after re-reading that she would have caught on. Now, there is a chance she is just being lazy town here, but I dunno.
@iRebel and others asking about my Iso vs Asenion read: Basically I feel Asenion is town due to how willingly he not only spilled the fact he had a post restriction (He was first after all,) but also the fact that we now know there are more than 3 players with post restrictions, odds are he is town. Yes, I can't fully rule out the fact that he could be scum, but again, given how willingly he has spilled info into the thread, I can't see scum doing such a thing.
@ITF: Yes I did question your vote on Gifts initially, but that was because I didn't feel just one stretch was enough to put a vote on him. By the time I had voted, he tried to stretch things again (Trying to say I am not contributing anything at all.)
@Oakrin RE: Post 164: OK, Why do you feel that being "Eager" to scumhunt is a bad thing? Almost sounds like you are trying to say he is "Too Townie", and that just does not jive with me.
Also, how was what Asenion said in post #67 "unnatural"? You kinda leave everyone hanging here.
And as others have said, why the FoS in your first post? Especially given you seem to have a solid read on GT. It makes me feel as if you are trying to "commit" to a wagon without actually committing to it.
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^This
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***
@Tan: So...the fact that I openly claimed that I have no PR is somehow not a point in my favor?
@Asenion: I believe I've made my stance on Okarin quite clear.
{мы, тьма}
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
My cube: http://cubetutor.com/viewcube/9981
Yes, ITF is one (He hinted at it earlier on and then outright said it,) and GD and Rhand have both implied they have post restrictions as well in previous posts (112 and 113 respectively.)
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How on earth do these imply that they have PR's??
No, Iso, that isn't what I meant. In MTGS Mafia, I took a more under the radar approach, because every time I would find anything to say, I found someone else had already said it, and I felt barning a lot of posts was frowned upon, so I didn't post much, and when I did, it was just general thoughts, like Okarin is doing now. In that game, I was Mafia, but the fact I was Mafia was not the reason I did so. That posting habit led to me being caught as scum.
So my point is, I'm extrapolating from what I learned in MTGS Mafia and applying it to Okarin as I see a parallel.
Sorry for the confusion.
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Damn, there goes my master plan.
...so wouldn't that make Okarin scum? Shouldn't town try to generate reactions form players and ask questions?
{мы, тьма}
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
UUU Azami, Lady of Scrolls
RRR Diaochan, Artful Beauty
UR(U/R) Tibor, Lumia, & Melek (WIP)
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