[Quote]Theyre to jovial.[//quote]How does this imply that they are mafia? It's game, shouldn't we all be jovial? (which until two seconds ago I didn't even know was a word lol)
Even if we assume prophs vote counts (and it won't) you only have lngrrrr, Tom and condoms on you too, Makin L-3. Still remarkably convenient, but not as sinister as L-2 at this stage... And you are only at L-4 if that is such a thing cos Prophs is not a vote.
I thought it was 6 for some reason. I'm apparently in poor form.
While I'm not sure about the whole jovial = scum thing, Cythare's reactions reek of a scum mindset.
There's a couple of fairly common mindset scumtells.
One is the 'I'm town, why are you being so dumb' frustration.
The other is 'Yeah, I'm scum, but your reasons are stupid and this is why watch me defend myself and do nothing else'.
Cythare's posts radiate the second one. His hospital joke post reminds me of Seppel going "Sure I am" in Clue (after Az caught him on his first post) and he immediately thinks he's at L-2.
Even if we assume prophs vote counts (and it won't) you only have lngrrrr, Tom and condoms on you too, Makin L-3. Still remarkably convenient, but not as sinister as L-2 at this stage... And you are only at L-4 if that is such a thing cos Prophs is not a vote.
I thought it was 6 for some reason. I'm apparently in poor form.
While I'm not sure about the whole jovial = scum thing, Cythare's reactions reek of a scum mindset.
There's a couple of fairly common mindset scumtells.
One is the 'I'm town, why are you being so dumb' frustration.
The other is 'Yeah, I'm scum, but your reasons are stupid and this is why watch me defend myself and do nothing else'.
Cythare's posts radiate the second one. His hospital joke post reminds me of Seppel going "Sure I am" in Clue (after Az caught him on his first post) and he immediately thinks he's at L-2.
Unvote, vote Cythare
This is the first vote that seems legitimate. I'll get on "doing something else".
Except taht I did note that your flat response to Klevenklop was questionable and shouldn't be disregarded, because Klev wasn't participating in RVS when Vitek tried to dismiss it for being "during RVS", and my question to Vitek was only semi-rhetorical.
See, didn't want to be the party pooper but I have just witnessed two extremes if concern. Kevenklop for a mass claim so early and Proph for shooting it down in the manner he did.
Both are getting the benefit if the doubt for these reasons. Klevenklops subsequent posts read very heavily as a n00b to mafia games. Someone please feel free to correct me if she is a veteran, but she almost seems like someone who thought this would be a simple case of a list if characters and then a few series villains... Job done. But then when it got shot down she almost reverted to a 'why, I don't get it' mode which is further pressing the subject rather than letting it die away and be buried in RVS again.
Proph answered almost in a panicked fashion like he wasn't ready to be out in the spot. But then he clarified his point with an example and a more measured reasoning in terms of the general reason why, especially this early in the game, it isn't the best course of action.
as well as some minor follow-up bring up valid points that I agreed with. I really want to know if Vitek's response of "oh it was just RVS" is for real, or if he's trying to help you brush potential problems under the rug.
I would posit you have less right than me, and also assure you that I do not have a sense of humor sir.
Less experience != less rights.
I'm not removing your right to say somethings not working based on your experience.
Not sure what this has to do with the original topic, but sure. Calling someone scummy for being jovial, and then writing something that could be construed as being jovial just looked off. Even if you don't have a sense of humor, can you see how it would be construed that way? That's all I was getting at there.
Do you feel that remarks made in RVS should be disregarded completely?
Nope.
My beef is with the fact he mentioned it and immediately defended it himself as probably nothing.
If he thinks it is inconscpicious, the why mention it at all and if he thinks it is suspicious, he shouldn't be defending it right after mentioning it.
@Generic; I indeed missed your vote against Tom. You tried to appeal at him and when he called your posts forced, you followed by voting him? I can't say I understand your actions.
I would be really surprised if ganderin would count summon the reaper as vote and you seem to be a bit too nervous about votes against you.
Just to clarify: "he" is Generic? I can see his point of view, though. Prophy's curt responses to what would be legitimate questions coming from a new player aren't damning, but they're still worth keeping in mind. Whether or not Generic's point of view is accurate remains to be seen.
Generic has some forced posts and I don't like how seemingly every time he makes an accusation that he also puts a defense in for the person he's pointing at. It makes it seem like he doesn't like what was said, but he doesn't want to get on the wrong side of anyone while pointing it out. His made up list of what scum do and don't do seems more like a way of trying to get a few people to drink the wine and get off his back.
Generic has some forced posts and I don't like how seemingly every time he makes an accusation that he also puts a defense in for the person he's pointing at. It makes it seem like he doesn't like what was said, but he doesn't want to get on the wrong side of anyone while pointing it out. His made up list of what scum do and don't do seems more like a way of trying to get a few people to drink the wine and get off his back.
Unvote.
Vote Generic
Nice catch. I hadn't picked up on the fence sitting (I did notice the forced nature of his responses, as well as the quick followup that Vitek noted). I'm still wary of Proph/Vitek for their previous posts, but after rereading Generic's posts, this avenue is worth pursuing.
Unvote Prophylaxis Vote Generic
In that vein, a couple questions/notes for Generic (the second isn't so much a question):
1) Do you believe Vitek to be scum? You call him out on fence sitting, yet you provide a counterpoint to a lot of your items (as Karn noted).
2) You promised a t/s list this early? While I've got some ideas, I'm surprised that you were so quick out of the gates.
I'm interested to see what else k-j and swishh have to say.
FWIW, I don't have much to say at the moment. Generic's argument doesn't feel particularly scummy, but it does sound awkward. I'm willing to let the concerned parties duke it out for awhile.
Both just skirting the line around a push on me. Hoping to grab at more. I follow it up with a push on tom for flakiness and its sir karn on his trusty steed riding in to save him. maybe sir karn you thought i hadnt noticed you, but tom was the one who rode YOUR shirt tails so i wanted to see what he would do. Yet YOU were the one who bit. What do you do now?
This paragraph is full of made up things. My vote on you isn't a defense of Tom; it's an attack on you. I couldn't care less about your vote on Tom.
I can't control when people agree with my posts. Maybe it's because I'm right.
Please provide me the examples that constitute EVERY TIME.
Examples: twice in #44 for Klop and Proph; again for Proph in #47; again for Klop in #54; for Vitek in #86. Those are the posts (from before I made the comment) that you've jumped on anyone for something. And in all of them you also give a defense for their actions.
Also, the whole generic fight is very confusing to me, mostly because I have a very hard time understanding his posts. That being said, this:
Quote from Sir Karn »
Generic has some forced posts and I don't like how seemingly every time he makes an accusation that he also puts a defense in for the person he's pointing at. It makes it seem like he doesn't like what was said, but he doesn't want to get on the wrong side of anyone while pointing it out. His made up list of what scum do and don't do seems more like a way of trying to get a few people to drink the wine and get off his back.
...is a good point. Specifically, I find myself scratching my head at a lot of his posts, where he seems to talk himself in circles instead of making a direct point. I think that is what gives them the feeling of being forced.
(basically the arguement is i should have twisted the scenario to make them look bad rather than acknowledge redeeming subsequent posts?)
No. That's not "basically the arguement." Why did you point those things out at all if you just planned on giving a defense for their actions? It seems like you were trying to not blatantly say anyone was scum, but you still wanted to plant the idea that they could be.
Quote from Generic »
oh, that and just laughing at points becasue you have no answer.
I'm laughing at some points because they're ridiculous and fabricated. When there isn't a question, there is nothing to answer.
Quote from Generic »
Its thanks to cythare you might just get your wish with saving tom sir karn...
I do love a reactionary post. Lets see what happens when I do this vote tom
I wish they hadn't vocalised it but yeah it's not only interesting you would echo the sentiments of another, but a lazy 'I don't like it' without st least throwing a question at me or perhaps an analysis of the much larger post I had made before it to start posing questions against me.
As to the other question posed to me I would suggest prophs points about a very early character claim would be one a lot if more experienced mafia game players would know, because the biggest factor to a town win lies in the ability to use psychology. A more n00vish player will get excited over a theme they know and want to hear all the characters in the game to flavour game the hell out if it to scum hunt, disregarding a good mods ability to cover his arse on things like that.
So to understand the suggester of the idea is to understand the opening motives. Because an experienced person pulling that gambit means a whole new can of worms which would involve wifom which I don't wang to go into now as I have noted a few other things about the situation, not least that I'm the only one to actually question the motives behind the idea.
Generic has some forced posts and I don't like how seemingly every time he makes an accusation that he also puts a defense in for the person he's pointing at. It makes it seem like he doesn't like what was said, but he doesn't want to get on the wrong side of anyone while pointing it out. His made up list of what scum do and don't do seems more like a way of trying to get a few people to drink the wine and get off his back.
Unvote.
Vote Generic
Now im no math whizz sir karn but i think 53 comes before 88 in the counting system. And its strange how you build this lie against me yet omit the only arguement i had made at the time that i had felt was worth VOTING ON.
You don't attack anyone in #53. You say you're voting to "see what happens" and then you move on to a different topic.
Also, the whole generic fight is very confusing to me, mostly because I have a very hard time understanding his posts. That being said, this:
Quote from Sir Karn »
Generic has some forced posts and I don't like how seemingly every time he makes an accusation that he also puts a defense in for the person he's pointing at. It makes it seem like he doesn't like what was said, but he doesn't want to get on the wrong side of anyone while pointing it out. His made up list of what scum do and don't do seems more like a way of trying to get a few people to drink the wine and get off his back.
...is a good point. Specifically, I find myself scratching my head at a lot of his posts, where he seems to talk himself in circles instead of making a direct point. I think that is what gives them the feeling of being forced.
Phone posting, so I'll review the other relevant points later, but just to clarify, having a mentor != being a noob. I've had a decent amount of experience, but was happy to have the opportunity to receive some gameplay pointers/input from someone more seasoned. By that logic, Prophylaxis and Tom are also noobs, and they've both played in a decent number of games. Don't insult me for having a mentor.
I think you will find I gave my reason for the vote and it was the one I pointed out again when responding to you. The fact you consider analysis of others without a vote as more legitimate examples of my casting suspicion than the one I felt strong enough to vote on is a joke.
I mean, your vote was obviously weak; you made it off of a one sentence post.
The bold part is fabricating things to fit your agenda and call me a joke.
Quote from Generic »
And your response to your blatant lie was to again pretend it never happened.
Even if you truly believe what you're saying here, which I don't, it's still 4 to 1 on examples. That's still 80%.
Mentor: an experienced player that offers some of their time to help a new player by being a “behind the scenes” source to answer questions about the game. Questions can range from vocabulary, to previous examples of when game results occurred, to general strategy advice. Mentors are advised to not give play-by-play instructions or make decisions for the new player, but to tell them (usually between phases) what they have done right and wrong already. Suggestions of what to do next are not allowed, and specific examples about other players in the game at hand are not allowed. (Communications with a Mentor are usually handled in a QT monitored by the Mod.)
When someone agrees with someone else's post, that's not "snuggling up" or buddying.
You, Generic, specifically called out Tom without any purpose other than buddying. You weren't agreeing with what he said, and you weren't making any points. All you said was:
So Sir Karn posted as I was. I'm suspicious of anyone who claims that it's "very clear" someone is scum so early in the game. Sounds like bussing to me.
Phone posting, so I'll review the other relevant points later, but just to clarify, having a mentor != being a noob. I've had a decent amount of experience, but was happy to have the opportunity to receive some gameplay pointers/input from someone more seasoned. By that logic, Prophylaxis and Tom are also noobs, and they've both played in a decent number of games. Don't insult me for having a mentor.
So not a n00b?
You have vote hopped on minimal logic (that I have also proven to be lies), agreed with something then 180'd it without hearing the response to what is spurious reasoning, voted immediately with that person based on the minimal spurious reasoning after already complaining about how fast and easy your wagon grew and then through all of that the point you focus on first is that the only shred of doubt about you being mafia (that you might just be naive to the game and wheeling anything) is not true?
Wow. That's a first for me to see someone get there knickers in a knot over the misinterpretation that gave an explanation to such actions... You stay at the bottom of the scum list the cythare.
Swishh, any input into the game so far? A vote for me? An opinion on the lies and the avoidance of points by sir karn? Anything?
Most of my "vote-hopping" was still during RVS (including my vote on Proph). While I did like some of the logic you presented, my first real vote was the one on you, because the case against you was the first thing that I felt warranted an actual vote.
If I stay at the bottom of your list because of my response, fine. I'm fine with (and understand) being called a noob due to bad gameplay, but using having a mentor as a qualifier is a separate matter, and felt dismissive at best.
See, didn't want to be the party pooper but I have just witnessed two extremes if concern. Kevenklop for a mass claim so early and Proph for shooting it down in the manner he did.
Both are getting the benefit if the doubt for these reasons. Klevenklops subsequent posts read very heavily as a n00b to mafia games. Someone please feel free to correct me if she is a veteran, but she almost seems like someone who thought this would be a simple case of a list if characters and then a few series villains... Job done. But then when it got shot down she almost reverted to a 'why, I don't get it' mode which is further pressing the subject rather than letting it die away and be buried in RVS again.
Proph answered almost in a panicked fashion like he wasn't ready to be out in the spot. But then he clarified his point with an example and a more measured reasoning in terms of the general reason why, especially this early in the game, it isn't the best course of action.
Sorry, was the party pooper after all. But then my leg is killing me and I'm out of Vicodin
Is as you can see 5 posts BEFORE you began to 'keep an eye on me'. You are making stuff up and its becoming painfully see through now sir karn.
You do realize that I can look at previous posts, right? I was already getting a bad feeling on you from this one.
You were the only one in a rush to end RVS, and it was with two attacks that you gave defenses for. Again, you wanted to plant the idea that these two are scum, but you didn't want to say it out loud because you knew the point was weak. That's really scummy.
When someone agrees with someone else's post, that's not "snuggling up" or buddying.
You, Generic, specifically called out Tom without any purpose other than buddying. You weren't agreeing with what he said, and you weren't making any points. All you said was:
Is good old fashioned scum hunting dead? Tom, you are in this game, I know I'm not alone in wanting to read the players rather than the game.
Once again, that is very forced, and cause for suspicion, so I kept an eye on you. After you posted more, it became very clear that you are scum.
Nice a clear in case you missed your current lie.
Yes you can look back, but that is not the arguement you gave for me becoming CLEARLY SCUM to you. If you intend to make stuff up, keep track of the lies sir karn.
Do you actually not understand that the accumulation of all of your posts contribute to my thinking of you being scum?
There are some bad people at Princeton-Plainsboro. Drug addicts, killers, sociopaths, liars, cheats, villains, and backstabbers. And that's just the staff. Some of the patients are worse. People die. That's the first thing you learn at a hospital. If you don't have the stomach for it, you won't last a week. Then again, some of you won't last the day. Some of the bad people here decided to make things worse. They're after you. Sure, you've broken the rules once or twice, but hasn't everyone? Why are they after you? Who are they? You've got to get to the bottom of this.
The scene opens on Klevenclop looking around at everyone else gathered together. "Raise your hands if you're the ones behind this."
A few of you jokingly fling suspicion at one one another, smiling and laughing to clear the tension.
Condoms isn't having any frivolity; "People who crack jokes are scum. You're probably the ones behind this!"
After a few sidelong glances and accusing stares, the accusations start flying. It's not the first time a large scale argument broke out within these walls, and it won't be the last.
"Lets stop all this kidding around and get down to business!" exclaims Generic.
With 12 players alive, it's 7 to lynch!
Tom (1): Vitek, Cythare (3): Tom, Condoms, Prophylaxis Sir Karn (2): Swishh, Generic Condoms (1): Kevenklop Generic (2): Sir Karn, Cythare
I didn't change my stance on Proph/Vitek. But I do feel that Karn's original posts pointed to something more that was in your posts besides a feeling about others. Upon going back to read them, I saw the fence-sitting I didn't see before.
My first post had little to do with you and more to do with disliking Vitek's response. I used you in the second one as a reference, yes. Some of the things you were saying made sense. But even scum lay some facts in with their faux-analysis, and using one of your posts does not equate to clearing you as town.
Do you actually not understand that the accumulation of all of your posts contribute to my thinking of you being scum?
You do realise you are now openly changing your arguement even with the evidence above your new lies?
No. You're wrong.
Quote from Generic »
Bare in mind his reason for being CERTAIN im scum is because i dared to bring up things said by others in the RVS, including their subsequent posts on the same subject to give a balanced read on those people.
You clearly stated that AFTER I posted MORE you were certain I was scum. Yet you base your vote on a post that came 5 posts previous to your initial one. That's not twisting anything, that's fact.
Yes. After you made more posts, it became clear that you are scum. Yes, my base is from the two posts listed (#44 and #49). You're telling me I'm not allowed to talk about any posts other than #49.
If this is what you're confused about:
I was suspicious of you when I voted you. Your posts since my vote have enforced my suspicious to where I'm certain.
This is getting ridiculous. If you don't understand by now, I can't wrap my head around how.
Most likely JeY didn't want to leave an RVS vote up until Monday.
This.
I have a few minutes for now and... 6 whopping pages to read. Oh KillJoy. I better catch up a little bit before this explodes over the weekend and I'm actually able to post. I'm tired too... and hungry. Being in a house without food >_<
Funny, I just posted a facebook status in computer code expressing my excitement for the end of classes though making a complex joke about being so mind-numb from computer science courses that all I'm capable of doing is writing code. Nobody will get it because it's no explicitly stated D; (Not that I expect people to anyway).
tl;dr yay programming references. In case you're wondering, '=/=' is a more typical 'does not equal'.
---
If I had to say something, I truly believe Condoms was trolling for a good portion of posts before #85. Maybe I'm wrong but my eyebrow was raised to like the 5th power for those posts and I couldn't derive anything coherent so I think he's just trying to push buttons.
...As I continue to read, I think pointing this out is completely pointless. -sigh-.
6. Teh JeY - concerning opening post conveniently excuses him from active involvement at the moment, but i cant say its a lie so a total on the fence middle grounder right here.
You can't because I literally said in the sign-ups that I have lots of stuff to do >_> It was not an excuse. I'm posting now because I'm in that limbo where I just settled down in my mom's house for the first time in two months and feel like a quick break, but no games to play really since I'm on my laptop. I mean... I have League, but @#$% league right now.
Also her* But you did spell my name right (with proper capitalization!) first try – seems to be an anomaly here at MTGS despite my name being -right there- in my posts.
Don't worry, I'll get involved v_v"
---
Speaking of Generic... Sorry sweetie but after a certain point I started carefully skimming your posts instead of fully reading them because they're all written in the same voice. A voice I recognize quite well, and to me you're basically just... spouting stuff. Real specific, I know, but I will point out that 'spouting stuff' =/= 'posting content' [lol right after I make comments about the 'does not equal thing. okay I'll stop.]
Maybe you are posting content, but it's just getting tedious to read now. I don't like a majority of your posting. Many before me have pointed out the problems already but I'll add another to the list (maybe it's just re-stating something already established a different way even, but), you're trying too hard?
Generic #166 (I dunno how to do the fancy post link or whatever [unless you guys do a 'link to post' and shorten it with a url=http]####[/url <_< -too lazy]):
People can agree with certain points you make if they already felt a certain way without liking you in general that much. Reminds me of Tenzin vs Tarlock on Legend of Korra.
---
Sir Karn, your simple, elegant and calm replies make me think pretty good about you.
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Vote: Generic
I feel like I need to deal with Cythare too... Someone (maybe not Cythare) is driving one heck of a Vengabus and I will make it my life mission to find out who! ...And shoot them myself! ...And hijack the bus! ...And drive it to the ice cream store and get ice cream! ...Then eat ice cream!
...too far I bet.
Okay all I got until I get this paper done. If I get it done before Monday I'll be 'active' again sooner.
It all began with some simple comment addressing Generic's buddying attempt, but now it's so big that I really don't feel like combing through it all (skimming it, a good portion just looks like back-and-forth mudslinging and OMGUS).
I feel like it's probably a town on town battle, because it feels like both are honestly trying to catch scum, and scum don't usually like to post that much. On the other hand, Generic also feels over-defensive. He didn't have to blow it to the proportion that he did, and if he is town he should realize that doing so isn't very productive.
IMPORTANT:
I want the wall of texts to stop, as they are distracting. I could see this battle going on forever with the same persistence and neither player convincing anyone to lynch the other because nobody else wants to read through all that mess to find the good points amongst all the mudslinging. If it must go on, I want both of you to keep it as concise and to-the-point as possible. Leave out the minor points and focus on the main ones.
As it stands there is so much focus on the two of you that scumhunting among other players / analyzing other players is made quite difficult.
To say i lacked content is an insult. Do i throw a lot at my arguements? damn straight. I dont let people lie about or twist my actual posts. But sir karn has the advantage of pre established friendships on MTGS. im the new face who likes to post aggressively.
To say people are only agreeing with me because I've been on MTGS longer than you is an insult. I don't even know most of these people.
But you still arent going to get away with lying about things sir karn whilever im still involved. And i still want to see that T/S list.
I haven't put out a T/S list because there are a number of people who haven't posted much. Which is fine for now, because it's hardly even been a whole day since the game has come up... (we're only going on 30 hours now.)
On the other hand, Generic also feels over-defensive. He didn't have to blow it to the proportion that he did, and if he is town he should realize that doing so isn't very productive.
I agree with this hand.
He's not town though, so he doesn't mind that it isn't very productive. Reference his most recent post, #138.
Phone posting, so I'll review the other relevant points later, but just to clarify, having a mentor != being a noob. I've had a decent amount of experience, but was happy to have the opportunity to receive some gameplay pointers/input from someone more seasoned. By that logic, Prophylaxis and Tom are also noobs, and they've both played in a decent number of games. Don't insult me for having a mentor.
Well if your play cant be explained as newb play you're even more likely to be scum.
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I know what i said and what i meant and i will defend that until im dead.
There's a difference in us. I'm confident enough in what I say that I don't feel the need to defend it until I'm dead.
Yet you have, i havent been posting all by myself for the last few pages.
Thats the biggest load of crap you have spewed yet. Worried about your image? You have defended your own posts as much as i have, only difference is i proved your lies, you changed your arguements.
I clear things up once or twice, but then I move on. You've been stuck on some stuff for well over a dozen posts at a time.
What you call "changing arguments" is me moving on because I've sufficiently said what I've needed to say. I bring up a different topic that will move the thread forward rather than going in circles.
Saying you've proven things over and over doesn't mean you actually did.
OH, so ignoring things was moving on! and there was me thinking you had no answer for it. Silly me. You failing to counter my arguement was not you backing out like a coward. But its ok, you got 2 people following you, change the arg... i mean MOVE ON a few more times and see if you can get any more to believe you dont defend your posts (which you just admitted you did after saying you dont need to) nor care about your image (which you do because you have defended your own comments AGAIN)
I haven't ignored anything. When I move on, it's after I've answered you at least once already on the subject.
Also, if you bothered to actually read the post, I said:
I know what i said and what i meant and i will defend that until im dead.
I will clear things up once or twice if you misconstrue what I said, but I won't defend myself to death like you will, and I won't go in circles with you.
You still say you believe me to be buddying and now say you notice my vote, why holding back on challenging my alignment? Sitting on the fence and subtley throwing mud at me to see if it can stick wont get you anywhere, I respond to all points to me and against me.
Second, he's bringing up solid points against you. It's not mud slinging. You can have someone leaning scum without voting. He may or may not be on the fence.
Now do you think my vote was justified with a logical reason, OMGUS from toms limp wristed response to what he viewed as buddying or do you think I'm having a nervous breakdown?
Or all three
On the point you asked for:
You give him two (three?) options of the answer, to give him outs to the situation.
Giving the person answers while asking the question is what I was pointing out. It's much like what you did with Proph and Klop on the two posts you admitted to doing this with.
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__________________________________________ With 12 players alive, it's 7 to lynch!
Tom (1): Vitek Cythare (3): Tom, Condoms, Prophylaxis Sir Karn (2): Swishh, Generic Condoms (1):Kevenklop Generic (3): Sir Karn, Cythare, TeH JeY
Not currently voting (2): LnGrrR, Killjoy
__________________________________________
Please feel free to PM me with any incorrect vote counts and include the post number of the missing or incorrect vote.
And your post I was quoting wasn't in jest at all? Because it sure looked like it to me.
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I can't say I don't appreciate the approach, but it falls flat if it is followed up by what I consider to be a joking remark.
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Draft my cube! (630 cards)
Psh, who are you to decide whats falling flat?
So?
I thought it was 6 for some reason. I'm apparently in poor form.
Someone with just as much a right as you do. If you vote someone for joking, then follow with a joke, should I be taking you seriously?
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Curse PremiumThere's a couple of fairly common mindset scumtells.
One is the 'I'm town, why are you being so dumb' frustration.
The other is 'Yeah, I'm scum, but your reasons are stupid and this is why watch me defend myself and do nothing else'.
Cythare's posts radiate the second one. His hospital joke post reminds me of Seppel going "Sure I am" in Clue (after Az caught him on his first post) and he immediately thinks he's at L-2.
Unvote, vote Cythare
I would posit you have less right than me, and also assure you that I do not have a sense of humor sir.
This is the first vote that seems legitimate. I'll get on "doing something else".
Except taht I did note that your flat response to Klevenklop was questionable and shouldn't be disregarded, because Klev wasn't participating in RVS when Vitek tried to dismiss it for being "during RVS", and my question to Vitek was only semi-rhetorical.
Generic's notes here:
as well as some minor follow-up bring up valid points that I agreed with. I really want to know if Vitek's response of "oh it was just RVS" is for real, or if he's trying to help you brush potential problems under the rug.
Vitek + Prophy for scum team. Still unsold on #3.
Draft my cube! (630 cards)
Less experience != less rights.
Draft my cube! (630 cards)
I'm not removing your right to say somethings not working based on your experience.
Not sure what this has to do with the original topic, but sure. Calling someone scummy for being jovial, and then writing something that could be construed as being jovial just looked off. Even if you don't have a sense of humor, can you see how it would be construed that way? That's all I was getting at there.
Just to clarify: "he" is Generic? I can see his point of view, though. Prophy's curt responses to what would be legitimate questions coming from a new player aren't damning, but they're still worth keeping in mind. Whether or not Generic's point of view is accurate remains to be seen.
Draft my cube! (630 cards)
I do understand you. I just don't agree with you.
Draft my cube! (630 cards)
Unvote.
Vote Generic
Nice catch. I hadn't picked up on the fence sitting (I did notice the forced nature of his responses, as well as the quick followup that Vitek noted). I'm still wary of Proph/Vitek for their previous posts, but after rereading Generic's posts, this avenue is worth pursuing.
Unvote Prophylaxis
Vote Generic
In that vein, a couple questions/notes for Generic (the second isn't so much a question):
1) Do you believe Vitek to be scum? You call him out on fence sitting, yet you provide a counterpoint to a lot of your items (as Karn noted).
2) You promised a t/s list this early? While I've got some ideas, I'm surprised that you were so quick out of the gates.
I'm interested to see what else k-j and swishh have to say.
Draft my cube! (630 cards)
Or its Tom. Ill never clear that guy again.
Club Flamingo Wins: 1!
This paragraph is full of made up things. My vote on you isn't a defense of Tom; it's an attack on you. I couldn't care less about your vote on Tom.
I can't control when people agree with my posts. Maybe it's because I'm right.
I literally laughed at how awful that sentence is. Forced is a very common word, and it describes what you're doing.
Examples: twice in #44 for Klop and Proph; again for Proph in #47; again for Klop in #54; for Vitek in #86. Those are the posts (from before I made the comment) that you've jumped on anyone for something. And in all of them you also give a defense for their actions.
You like the approach of thinking anyone who acted jovial in RVS is scum. I'll make sure I stick a pin in that.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Also, the whole generic fight is very confusing to me, mostly because I have a very hard time understanding his posts. That being said, this:
...is a good point. Specifically, I find myself scratching my head at a lot of his posts, where he seems to talk himself in circles instead of making a direct point. I think that is what gives them the feeling of being forced.
No. That's not "basically the arguement." Why did you point those things out at all if you just planned on giving a defense for their actions? It seems like you were trying to not blatantly say anyone was scum, but you still wanted to plant the idea that they could be.
I'm laughing at some points because they're ridiculous and fabricated. When there isn't a question, there is nothing to answer.
LOL. Where are you getting this stuff from?
You don't attack anyone in #53. You say you're voting to "see what happens" and then you move on to a different topic.
From some games I've read, that's just how Condoms plays. It's a null tell for him.
Yes.
Draft my cube! (630 cards)
I mean, your vote was obviously weak; you made it off of a one sentence post.
The bold part is fabricating things to fit your agenda and call me a joke.
Even if you truly believe what you're saying here, which I don't, it's still 4 to 1 on examples. That's still 80%.
Do you want me to point out every time someone is buddying for the rest of the game?
From the Glossary onsite:
You, Generic, specifically called out Tom without any purpose other than buddying. You weren't agreeing with what he said, and you weren't making any points. All you said was:
Once again, that is very forced, and cause for suspicion, so I kept an eye on you. After you posted more, it became very clear that you are scum.
Most of my "vote-hopping" was still during RVS (including my vote on Proph). While I did like some of the logic you presented, my first real vote was the one on you, because the case against you was the first thing that I felt warranted an actual vote.
If I stay at the bottom of your list because of my response, fine. I'm fine with (and understand) being called a noob due to bad gameplay, but using having a mentor as a qualifier is a separate matter, and felt dismissive at best.
T/S list to come when I get home.
Draft my cube! (630 cards)
You do realize that I can look at previous posts, right? I was already getting a bad feeling on you from this one.
You were the only one in a rush to end RVS, and it was with two attacks that you gave defenses for. Again, you wanted to plant the idea that these two are scum, but you didn't want to say it out loud because you knew the point was weak. That's really scummy.
Do you actually not understand that the accumulation of all of your posts contribute to my thinking of you being scum?
There are some bad people at Princeton-Plainsboro. Drug addicts, killers, sociopaths, liars, cheats, villains, and backstabbers. And that's just the staff. Some of the patients are worse. People die. That's the first thing you learn at a hospital. If you don't have the stomach for it, you won't last a week. Then again, some of you won't last the day. Some of the bad people here decided to make things worse. They're after you. Sure, you've broken the rules once or twice, but hasn't everyone? Why are they after you? Who are they? You've got to get to the bottom of this.
The scene opens on Klevenclop looking around at everyone else gathered together. "Raise your hands if you're the ones behind this."
A few of you jokingly fling suspicion at one one another, smiling and laughing to clear the tension.
Condoms isn't having any frivolity; "People who crack jokes are scum. You're probably the ones behind this!"
After a few sidelong glances and accusing stares, the accusations start flying. It's not the first time a large scale argument broke out within these walls, and it won't be the last.
"Lets stop all this kidding around and get down to business!" exclaims Generic.
With 12 players alive, it's 7 to lynch!
Tom (1): Vitek,
Cythare (3): Tom, Condoms, Prophylaxis
Sir Karn (2): Swishh, Generic
Condoms (1): Kevenklop
Generic (2): Sir Karn, Cythare
Not currently voting (3)LnGrrrR, Killjoy, Teh Jey
-[thread=14456]The [Untitled] Avatar and Sig shop![/thread] Avatar from:[thread=25376] [Epic Graphics][/thread]
Awards:
Elegant Mafia: The Joker, Mafia MVP
My first post had little to do with you and more to do with disliking Vitek's response. I used you in the second one as a reference, yes. Some of the things you were saying made sense. But even scum lay some facts in with their faux-analysis, and using one of your posts does not equate to clearing you as town.
Draft my cube! (630 cards)
No. You're wrong.
And again you're lying.
It's funny how that quote you claim is from Cythare is actually from Vitek:
I provided the link for you.
More lying to twist the case in your favor.
What do you want me to talk about with post 86? I've already talked about it once.
Yes. After you made more posts, it became clear that you are scum. Yes, my base is from the two posts listed (#44 and #49). You're telling me I'm not allowed to talk about any posts other than #49.
If this is what you're confused about:
I was suspicious of you when I voted you. Your posts since my vote have enforced my suspicious to where I'm certain.
This is getting ridiculous. If you don't understand by now, I can't wrap my head around how.
This.
I have a few minutes for now and... 6 whopping pages to read. Oh
KillJoy. I better catch up a little bit before this explodes over the weekend and I'm actually able to post. I'm tired too... and hungry. Being in a house without food >_<Enough!
-reads-
Funny, I just posted a facebook status in computer code expressing my excitement for the end of classes though making a complex joke about being so mind-numb from computer science courses that all I'm capable of doing is writing code. Nobody will get it because it's no explicitly stated D; (Not that I expect people to anyway).
tl;dr yay programming references. In case you're wondering, '=/=' is a more typical 'does not equal'.
---
If I had to say something, I truly believe Condoms was trolling for a good portion of posts before #85. Maybe I'm wrong but my eyebrow was raised to like the 5th power for those posts and I couldn't derive anything coherent so I think he's just trying to push buttons.
...As I continue to read, I think pointing this out is completely pointless. -sigh-.
You can't because I literally said in the sign-ups that I have lots of stuff to do >_> It was not an excuse. I'm posting now because I'm in that limbo where I just settled down in my mom's house for the first time in two months and feel like a quick break, but no games to play really since I'm on my laptop. I mean... I have League, but @#$% league right now.
Also her* But you did spell my name right (with proper capitalization!) first try – seems to be an anomaly here at MTGS despite my name being -right there- in my posts.
Don't worry, I'll get involved v_v"
---
Speaking of Generic... Sorry sweetie but after a certain point I started carefully skimming your posts instead of fully reading them because they're all written in the same voice. A voice I recognize quite well, and to me you're basically just... spouting stuff. Real specific, I know, but I will point out that 'spouting stuff' =/= 'posting content' [lol right after I make comments about the 'does not equal thing. okay I'll stop.]
Maybe you are posting content, but it's just getting tedious to read now. I don't like a majority of your posting. Many before me have pointed out the problems already but I'll add another to the list (maybe it's just re-stating something already established a different way even, but), you're trying too hard?
Generic #166 (I dunno how to do the fancy post link or whatever [unless you guys do a 'link to post' and shorten it with a url=http]####[/url <_< -too lazy]):
People can agree with certain points you make if they already felt a certain way without liking you in general that much. Reminds me of Tenzin vs Tarlock on Legend of Korra.
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Sir Karn, your simple, elegant and calm replies make me think pretty good about you.
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Vote: Generic
I feel like I need to deal with Cythare too... Someone (maybe not Cythare) is driving one heck of a Vengabus and I will make it my life mission to find out who! ...And shoot them myself! ...And hijack the bus! ...And drive it to the ice cream store and get ice cream! ...Then eat ice cream!
...too far I bet.
Okay all I got until I get this paper done. If I get it done before Monday I'll be 'active' again sooner.
¤.†.¤ The OceanLink ¤.†.¤
Because I'm voting Cythare.
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@Generic/SirKarn fight:
It all began with some simple comment addressing Generic's buddying attempt, but now it's so big that I really don't feel like combing through it all (skimming it, a good portion just looks like back-and-forth mudslinging and OMGUS).
I feel like it's probably a town on town battle, because it feels like both are honestly trying to catch scum, and scum don't usually like to post that much. On the other hand, Generic also feels over-defensive. He didn't have to blow it to the proportion that he did, and if he is town he should realize that doing so isn't very productive.
IMPORTANT:
I want the wall of texts to stop, as they are distracting. I could see this battle going on forever with the same persistence and neither player convincing anyone to lynch the other because nobody else wants to read through all that mess to find the good points amongst all the mudslinging. If it must go on, I want both of you to keep it as concise and to-the-point as possible. Leave out the minor points and focus on the main ones.
As it stands there is so much focus on the two of you that scumhunting among other players / analyzing other players is made quite difficult.
To say people are only agreeing with me because I've been on MTGS longer than you is an insult. I don't even know most of these people.
I haven't put out a T/S list because there are a number of people who haven't posted much. Which is fine for now, because it's hardly even been a whole day since the game has come up... (we're only going on 30 hours now.)
Yep.
I agree with this hand.
He's not town though, so he doesn't mind that it isn't very productive. Reference his most recent post, #138.
There's a difference in us. I'm confident enough in what I say that I don't feel the need to defend it until I'm dead.
Well if your play cant be explained as newb play you're even more likely to be scum.
I clear things up once or twice, but then I move on. You've been stuck on some stuff for well over a dozen posts at a time.
What you call "changing arguments" is me moving on because I've sufficiently said what I've needed to say. I bring up a different topic that will move the thread forward rather than going in circles.
Saying you've proven things over and over doesn't mean you actually did.
I haven't ignored anything. When I move on, it's after I've answered you at least once already on the subject.
Also, if you bothered to actually read the post, I said:
I said I don't need to defend it until I'm dead. It's pointing at the fact that you said:
I will clear things up once or twice if you misconstrue what I said, but I won't defend myself to death like you will, and I won't go in circles with you.
Club Flamingo Wins: 1!
First, I'll point out that you admit to making a play that shouldn't be understood. I don't like that at all.
Second, he's bringing up solid points against you. It's not mud slinging. You can have someone leaning scum without voting. He may or may not be on the fence.
On the point you asked for:
You give him two (three?) options of the answer, to give him outs to the situation.
Giving the person answers while asking the question is what I was pointing out. It's much like what you did with Proph and Klop on the two posts you admitted to doing this with.
?
If you're bored, add something to the conversation.
If you'd like your vote to be counted, be sure to follow usual mafia etiquette, or your vote may not be seen. Unformatted votes in the middle or end of sentances are less likely to be noticed and counted by a moderator.
For a quick refresher: Place votes in bold on a new line like this:
Vote: Player
If you have a vote currently on another player, you must unvote before casting a new vote. Put it in bold on a new line like this:
Unvote.
You may combine them for easier viewing:
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__________________________________________
With 12 players alive, it's 7 to lynch!
Tom (1): Vitek
Cythare (3): Tom, Condoms, Prophylaxis
Sir Karn (2): Swishh, Generic
Condoms (1):Kevenklop
Generic (3): Sir Karn, Cythare, TeH JeY
Not currently voting (2): LnGrrR, Killjoy
__________________________________________
Please feel free to PM me with any incorrect vote counts and include the post number of the missing or incorrect vote.
-[thread=14456]The [Untitled] Avatar and Sig shop![/thread] Avatar from:[thread=25376] [Epic Graphics][/thread]
Awards:
Elegant Mafia: The Joker, Mafia MVP