Dude, it's obvious Voxx is the SK, town already had a vig.
Congrats for the win.:nod:
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
The game is not being dumbed down. Control is doing fine; Draw-Go is not the only kind of control. Aggro is doing fine; Red Deck Wins is not the only kind of aggro. Creature combat is an important core concept and belongs in every color. Mythic rarity is not destroying the game. People whine too much for no good reason. Magic is more popular than ever, so keep calm, brew some decks and play some damn cards.
2011: Best Mafia Performance (Individual) - Best Newcomer
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
Yeah, if I could do it over again, I'd have lynched Tom, and left it with me/rick/dan alive the last day.
Pretty sure Dan would have tried to case Rick, and I think the case on Dan is much stronger than the one on Void.
But I ultimately decided to go for broke with the massive effort/case and swing it around as a WiFOM and sort of triple layer WiFOM thing where it leaves me/Void/Rick alive - even though the razor would point straight at myself.
Just I got kinda busy, and Void held up a lot better under pressure than I was expecting.
I put my odds at ~50/50 going into the last day, just didn't work out, heh.
I sincerely believed the game was over when I was lynched. I couldn't have been more genuine with that last series of posts if I tried - I laughed my ass off when it wasn't though. The flavor post was fun to write. I want to make that a thing when I die =P
I was also laughing when you guys continued to believe that there still could be another mafioso. I was like "o_o lolwtf? No way I was acting DX"
If it matters to anybody I spent zero time reading the other games I had requested.
I just read this one over and over again.
The prerelease weekend was actually critical, since spending three days not thinking about the game let me detach from my irrational void Is scum mentality and approach rereads thinking things through on the other side.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Can we have Megiddo removed from the forum forever please?
i'm pretty sure i can find your ***** online within 3 minutes
I thought your play Today was off though. Something didnt smell right, like you had magically become too aggressive. So that also helped to shake my mindset.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Can we have Megiddo removed from the forum forever please?
i'm pretty sure i can find your ***** online within 3 minutes
I was posting from the mindset that I knew Void was scum.
So I'm obviously going to just dismiss him and yeah.
Mix it in with a lot of RL things interfering the last day, and I couldn't play it quite the way I wanted.
It was frustrating feeling like there was nothing I could really do to impact the game - it was just you/void going back and forth and me hoping you'd have the coin land the wrong way on the WiFOM flips.
To discover the SK required no reading and no analysis. Just check the flips read "town dayvig" then read Voxx claim and see the word "vig". GG.
Also I greatly disagree Jeh post could not be easily be fabricated, after the scum is lynched everything he says should be disregarded. What really proved it was really a SK is the numbers, it's just impossible to have 6 scum in a 19 player game.
Rule number one to play as SK is "never try to pass as the town vig", Voxx made this mistake, was not punished by it, but lost anyway.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
The game is not being dumbed down. Control is doing fine; Draw-Go is not the only kind of control. Aggro is doing fine; Red Deck Wins is not the only kind of aggro. Creature combat is an important core concept and belongs in every color. Mythic rarity is not destroying the game. People whine too much for no good reason. Magic is more popular than ever, so keep calm, brew some decks and play some damn cards.
To discover the SK required no reading and no analysis. Just check the flips read "town dayvig" then read Voxx claim and see the word "vig". GG.
In LotR II (20 person game), there was a mandatory vigilante, three 1-shot vigs, and a JoAT variant that could order somebody to kill. Manipulator Mafia also had two full vigilantes (though that game was OP as all heck). I didn't read the exact situation here, but being careful about that sort of mod gaming is always a good thing.
But I'll agree that 6 mafia in a 19 person game seems like too much, and combined with there already being a vig... I agree that SK is way more likely.
Mafia design practices have come a long way since this ancient game. We now even have two reviewers to prevent such atrocities as the game you mentioned.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
The game is not being dumbed down. Control is doing fine; Draw-Go is not the only kind of control. Aggro is doing fine; Red Deck Wins is not the only kind of aggro. Creature combat is an important core concept and belongs in every color. Mythic rarity is not destroying the game. People whine too much for no good reason. Magic is more popular than ever, so keep calm, brew some decks and play some damn cards.
I dislike putting blame on just one guy for a teamgame, even if you had chosen wrong I don't think it would tarnish your play this game, which was stellar.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
The game is not being dumbed down. Control is doing fine; Draw-Go is not the only kind of control. Aggro is doing fine; Red Deck Wins is not the only kind of aggro. Creature combat is an important core concept and belongs in every color. Mythic rarity is not destroying the game. People whine too much for no good reason. Magic is more popular than ever, so keep calm, brew some decks and play some damn cards.
Depending on who the lynch was, I got something different. I didn't necessarily get a kill every night.
My win condition also changed throughout the game. Unfortunately.
I started the game off with the win condition of a neutral survivor.
So after two scum die on day one, I decided to go for the quick town win.
I thought the two most likely scum were Kill Joy and Anak, with me having a better case on Kill Joy. Anak was largely a PoE thing where a couple posts twigged me the wrong way. So I figured I'd shoot Anak, lynch Kill Joy, and see where the game went from there.
But then Cyouni was shot night one, and my world came crashing down.
Because my win condition changed from neutral survivor to 'last man standing'.
@Drey: Well, they were designed by Axelrod and RafK, respectively. Although I agree that RafK's game could've used an extra reviewer, LotR II kinda made up for the extra vigs with extra VT roles, so it wasn't all that swingy
@Voxx: Man that's... harsh. Changing win conditions are hard :-/.
(on the plus side you would've won if your win con didn't change :p)
Hence my grousing and grumbling in my notes QT about it.
Actually.
**** it.
Here's my notes QT - I usually would never make them public because I don't like being meta'd, but since I doubt I'll be a SK ever again...whocareeessss.
After months of figuring out the finale, Voxxicus, Void, and the man whose forum identity keeps changing (-_-), decide that enough is enough. Immediately, the shapeshifter is realized to be true of heart as Void and Voxxicus realize the simultaneously thatthe other one is the evil. As Megiddo ponders what each person has said to the other, a thought suddenly occurs to him: Voxxicus claimed to be the cold war president, Dwight Eisenhower. Clearly, the "Voxxicus" in front of him has the aura of a young female. Immediately recognizing that Voxxicus has an air of desperation, as if on some holy quest, he immediately sides with Void as the two quickly pin Voxxicus to the ground. After a brief struggle, Voxxicus realizes that his mission has failed, and that only God can judge her now. Going slack, she humble waits for the final act to finish.
Jehanne d'Arc. (Neutral Follower of God) Voxxicus, You are Jeanne d'Arc (Joan of Arc) (ca. 1412– 30 May 1431)
You are a French legend and a holy saint. During the Hundred Years War with England, you helped to lead the French armies to several key victories. Only when you were kidnapped, and sold to England for trial did your life end, but your name lived on. Along with your canonization in 1920, every major French leader From Napoleon to Charles VII evoked your name as a sign of faith. Your anger with the world stems from your unfair trial and death. You come back for a second chance at life, and to make others see you are a messenger of God. And as His messenger, this atrocity of time will be straightened out.
Abilities: During the day, you may vote for any player. When a player is lynched, you will get the following effects, if your vote is on the lynched player: If the player lynched is a Town Vanilla, you will get a one-shot redirection. During the night, you may target two players. If your first target uses an ability, their target will target the second player. That player will be informed he/she was redirected, OR you will gain the ability to kill a player (during the night, send me the name of a player and that player will die). If the play is a Town non-Vanilla, you will gain a copy of whatever ability that player had, OR you may choose to be immune the next time you would be lynched tomorrow (the lynch will fail and go to night phase, this ability cannot be stacked. If the player is non-town, OR if nobody is lynched, you will gain the ability to kill a player (during the night, send me the name of a player and that player will die). This will trigger if youare the attempted lynch, prevented by your second ability.
Win Condition: You win when either all players are dead, or you can no longer be killed. You can also win with any team, if Pope John Paul II is still alive.
TOWN VICTORY
I have a few notes I wanted to point out, but I just want to say well done town, and Voxxicus. Expect a post from me in an hour.
Mafia design practices have come a long way since this ancient game. We now even have two reviewers to prevent such atrocities as the game you mentioned.
Both of those were fine-ish. (Exception: My role in Manipulator Mafia. Control random kill = control scumkill if no one else shoots.)
Legend of Aang Mafia - two town one-shot vigs, as well as a sortof-SK.
I've been a SK 4 times now, this was my first loss.
Being a neutral just means...being town.
Like, I just tried to put myself in the mindset that no matter how unlikely it was, the game wasn't over, so there had to be another scum out there, and act accordingly.
I think my posting was genuine from that perspective, it just wasn't enough to overcome probability.
Leaving Tom alive would have been too obvious - I contemplated shooting you and leaving it as Tom/Void/Myself, as I think Tom might have been a little more impulsive to just lynching Void... but that just made too much sense from a 'Voxx is SK perspective' to risk.
The only better option might have been having a Rick/Dan/Voxx final day, and hoped that Dan's unwavering town read on me carried through. But that also fell under 'too obvious' I think.
I dunno.
I was in trouble once Cyouni died, given that Mafia were dropping like flies.
And when Jey confirmed that all the mafia were dead, I thought it was over, unless I could just dump a gallon of Wine (in front of me) over everything and ride it out.
Backup doc claims when there was already a universal backup claim was...not good.
If IB had claimed vanilla and been fairly active he probably could have pulled it out, though, yeah.
@Rick - yeah, but I think Dan might have voted you over me. He was adamant that this was my town game... and he was right, really - I played it exactly as I would have as town with a vig, up until the end.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
To post a comment, please login or register a new account.
¤.†.¤ The OceanLink ¤.†.¤
¤.†.¤ The OceanLink ¤.†.¤
¤.†.¤ The OceanLink ¤.†.¤
Congrats for the win.:nod:
Mythic rarity is not destroying the game. People whine too much for no good reason. Magic is more popular than ever, so keep calm, brew some decks and play some damn cards.
I thought it was Voxx as well... Let's see if I would have made the right move.
{мы, тьма}
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
JeY's RP post was the most valuable post ever.
I hope that it was Voxxicus. I was so tunneled onto Void at the start of the Day though. It really did take me a long time to swing around.
To figuring out last mafioso vs SK or like, it was an amazing post and is the highlight of this whole topic?
=D
¤.†.¤ The OceanLink ¤.†.¤
¤.†.¤ The OceanLink ¤.†.¤
Like, I spent the last...month? Just shaking my head and swirling my glass of wine.
You have no idea how close you were to winning this game.
I blame it all on Cyouni.
You'll see why eventually.
Pretty sure Dan would have tried to case Rick, and I think the case on Dan is much stronger than the one on Void.
But I ultimately decided to go for broke with the massive effort/case and swing it around as a WiFOM and sort of triple layer WiFOM thing where it leaves me/Void/Rick alive - even though the razor would point straight at myself.
Just I got kinda busy, and Void held up a lot better under pressure than I was expecting.
I put my odds at ~50/50 going into the last day, just didn't work out, heh.
I was also laughing when you guys continued to believe that there still could be another mafioso. I was like "o_o lolwtf? No way I was acting DX"
¤.†.¤ The OceanLink ¤.†.¤
Massively so.
I just read this one over and over again.
The prerelease weekend was actually critical, since spending three days not thinking about the game let me detach from my irrational void Is scum mentality and approach rereads thinking things through on the other side.
I thought your play Today was off though. Something didnt smell right, like you had magically become too aggressive. So that also helped to shake my mindset.
So I'm obviously going to just dismiss him and yeah.
Mix it in with a lot of RL things interfering the last day, and I couldn't play it quite the way I wanted.
It was frustrating feeling like there was nothing I could really do to impact the game - it was just you/void going back and forth and me hoping you'd have the coin land the wrong way on the WiFOM flips.
Also I greatly disagree Jeh post could not be easily be fabricated, after the scum is lynched everything he says should be disregarded. What really proved it was really a SK is the numbers, it's just impossible to have 6 scum in a 19 player game.
Rule number one to play as SK is "never try to pass as the town vig", Voxx made this mistake, was not punished by it, but lost anyway.
Mythic rarity is not destroying the game. People whine too much for no good reason. Magic is more popular than ever, so keep calm, brew some decks and play some damn cards.
In LotR II (20 person game), there was a mandatory vigilante, three 1-shot vigs, and a JoAT variant that could order somebody to kill. Manipulator Mafia also had two full vigilantes (though that game was OP as all heck). I didn't read the exact situation here, but being careful about that sort of mod gaming is always a good thing.
But I'll agree that 6 mafia in a 19 person game seems like too much, and combined with there already being a vig... I agree that SK is way more likely.
Mythic rarity is not destroying the game. People whine too much for no good reason. Magic is more popular than ever, so keep calm, brew some decks and play some damn cards.
Mythic rarity is not destroying the game. People whine too much for no good reason. Magic is more popular than ever, so keep calm, brew some decks and play some damn cards.
Everyone else would probably be yelling at you about how 'obvious' it was, though!
Anyway, Voxx, was RobRoy right about your NK reasoning? I wondered about that. It was one of the few behavioral tells I could locate in my rereads.
I was not a true serial killer.
Depending on who the lynch was, I got something different. I didn't necessarily get a kill every night.
My win condition also changed throughout the game. Unfortunately.
I started the game off with the win condition of a neutral survivor.
So after two scum die on day one, I decided to go for the quick town win.
I thought the two most likely scum were Kill Joy and Anak, with me having a better case on Kill Joy. Anak was largely a PoE thing where a couple posts twigged me the wrong way. So I figured I'd shoot Anak, lynch Kill Joy, and see where the game went from there.
But then Cyouni was shot night one, and my world came crashing down.
Because my win condition changed from neutral survivor to 'last man standing'.
And I was like welp, ****.
Besides being the pope.
¤.†.¤ The OceanLink ¤.†.¤
@Voxx: Man that's... harsh. Changing win conditions are hard :-/.
(on the plus side you would've won if your win con didn't change :p)
And yeah.
I'd have won if Cyouni had lived.
Hence my grousing and grumbling in my notes QT about it.
Actually.
**** it.
Here's my notes QT - I usually would never make them public because I don't like being meta'd, but since I doubt I'll be a SK ever again...whocareeessss.
http://www.quicktopic.com/49/H/8EGvQjmpA37d
Jehanne d'Arc. (Neutral Follower of God)
Voxxicus, You are Jeanne d'Arc (Joan of Arc) (ca. 1412– 30 May 1431)
You are a French legend and a holy saint. During the Hundred Years War with England, you helped to lead the French armies to several key victories. Only when you were kidnapped, and sold to England for trial did your life end, but your name lived on. Along with your canonization in 1920, every major French leader From Napoleon to Charles VII evoked your name as a sign of faith. Your anger with the world stems from your unfair trial and death. You come back for a second chance at life, and to make others see you are a messenger of God. And as His messenger, this atrocity of time will be straightened out.
Abilities: During the day, you may vote for any player. When a player is lynched, you will get the following effects, if your vote is on the lynched player:
If the player lynched is a Town Vanilla, you will get a one-shot redirection. During the night, you may target two players. If your first target uses an ability, their target will target the second player. That player will be informed he/she was redirected, OR you will gain the ability to kill a player (during the night, send me the name of a player and that player will die).
If the play is a Town non-Vanilla, you will gain a copy of whatever ability that player had, OR you may choose to be immune the next time you would be lynched tomorrow (the lynch will fail and go to night phase, this ability cannot be stacked.
If the player is non-town, OR if nobody is lynched, you will gain the ability to kill a player (during the night, send me the name of a player and that player will die). This will trigger if youare the attempted lynch, prevented by your second ability.
Win Condition: You win when either all players are dead, or you can no longer be killed.
You can also win with any team, if Pope John Paul II is still alive.
TOWN VICTORY
I have a few notes I wanted to point out, but I just want to say well done town, and Voxxicus. Expect a post from me in an hour.
The GJ way path to no lynching:
One last thing, would have been so highly amused if Voxx got a shot...and then used it on me.
Both of those were fine-ish. (Exception: My role in Manipulator Mafia. Control random kill = control scumkill if no one else shoots.)
Legend of Aang Mafia - two town one-shot vigs, as well as a sortof-SK.
Apparently I did pretty good for my first mafia game ever; according to Iso. I was the last scum alive, so @_@
¤.†.¤ The OceanLink ¤.†.¤
I was so astonished that Voxx fell for the trap that I couldn't believe he was actually anti-town.
Turns out he wasn't anti-town at the time.
Being a neutral just means...being town.
Like, I just tried to put myself in the mindset that no matter how unlikely it was, the game wasn't over, so there had to be another scum out there, and act accordingly.
I think my posting was genuine from that perspective, it just wasn't enough to overcome probability.
The only better option might have been having a Rick/Dan/Voxx final day, and hoped that Dan's unwavering town read on me carried through. But that also fell under 'too obvious' I think.
I dunno.
I was in trouble once Cyouni died, given that Mafia were dropping like flies.
And when Jey confirmed that all the mafia were dead, I thought it was over, unless I could just dump a gallon of Wine (in front of me) over everything and ride it out.
Rick/Dan/Voxx would have been interesting, though I think I end up just voting you in that position.
If IB had claimed vanilla and been fairly active he probably could have pulled it out, though, yeah.
@Rick - yeah, but I think Dan might have voted you over me. He was adamant that this was my town game... and he was right, really - I played it exactly as I would have as town with a vig, up until the end.