does two games count as enough xp to know that..... i get the feeling it is, i think tekno tried to get me to claim at l-5 because i was stupid enough to have claimed there in another game. He figured that if he put enough pressure on me it would look like more than one person and i would capitulate and claim. Also as has already been pointed out he wont answer the questions pointed at him. scum, scum i say.
I brought up my thoughts,I don't think it's enough for a vote, I don't like to go only on a few posts, it often results in a mislynch. Scum will tend to go off small points. My posts stated my thoughts, Town need as much infomation and personal input as possible to win.
I'm comfortable with my vote after this response. Seems hella insincere.
does two games count as enough xp to know that..... i get the feeling it is, i think tekno tried to get me to claim at l-5 because i was stupid enough to have claimed there in another game. He figured that if he put enough pressure on me it would look like more than one person and i would capitulate and claim. Also as has already been pointed out he wont answer the questions pointed at him. scum, scum i say.
PLEASE RESPOND TO THE QUESTIONS BEING ASKED OF YOU.
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I doubt jordman qualifies as noob town. He has played in several mafia games, probably more than me.
He will probably qualify as newb town for a long, long time...
Seriously this is ridiculous - I asked you a question jordman and you just straight out ignored it twice. Anyone else I would call this scummy but with you I don't even know what it means.
You have one point here, that he's being jumpy with votes, but you're trying to make it seem like more. It's quite clear from your repeating yourself in the conclusion and with the word 'jumpy/jumping'.
This play is quite easily attributed to newb town, and what happened to you being cautious about votes?
What do you think of TechnoLink and Mandershex?
MH I feel is town given her actions and the questions she asked.
Tek I am unsure of currently. But he did make a good case against jordman, so he is leaning slightly town.
And given the way jordman has reacted I think this is more indicative of newb scum than newb town. He doesn't seem to be scum hunting as much as latching onto whatever he sees as scummy. This has been a common theme in pretty much every single post he has made (other than the ones where he is fighting with people over grammar).
Also where are you getting this cautious with my vote from?
Why claim "miller" item? Unless you think there was N0 actions? Or day investigations? Both of which I think are unlikely.
Why do you think these unlikely? We're not in a basic.
Quote from Infinis »
What to do with it? Do we have Doc, do we have item thief, do we have redirector, to we have jailkeeper, etc etc.
Mild speculation noted.
Quote from Infinis »
Calvin played the aggressive way with his item. He should have kept quiet, period end of sentence. Why? Because scum definitively want this item now. It is inherently more valuable to scum. Cat's out of the bag. Calvin needs to tell us who he';s giving the item to. WIFOM protects the decision.
WIFOM also protects if he doesn't announce who it goes to.
Excuse me? Where the ☺☺☺☺ did I say I wanted to lynch him for grammar? Seriously, this is getting sickening.
You've alluded to it in 5 or 6, but you only said "Let's lynch Jordman because he can't talk in a straight line." once. Do I really have to find and quote those posts for you? Honestly...some people...
shut kpac i'm not twelve, shut up guardman i'm not scum. The voting was to emphasize my point that i was worried about a gambit nothing more nothing less. hey guardman point of interest, if i was scum jumping wouldn't i jump on, ya know, WAGONS?
Omi. Defensive much? Not twelve or scum...so noob town 11-year old? Seriously, try this:
1) Type your post.
2) Hit "Preview Post".
3) Read your post aloud. See how that sounds? Like a drunken Tourette's victim? (No offense meant to anyone suffering from Tourette's.)
I am sort of suspicious of Cyan as he has a reputation for being a bulldog townie and so far he's seemed kind of laid back and watching from the sidelines.
His reticence at being obnoxious is suspicious, now that you mention it. He's usually much more of a bull(y)dog.
And I think you (along with Guardman, see below) are trying to take ealy advantage of a newb town.
I tend to agree, sadly, that Jordman feels like indignant newb town rather than scum. TL and Guard taking advantage? Eh...
Quote from TB »
Pretty sure he said he did actually want a claim. He has ignored this, though, so I'm not sure.
Ok, then let's get a serious response.
TeknoLink, when you asked Jordman to claim at L-5, were you being serious?
Quote from TB »
What do you mean by this?
Lady MacBeth from Shakespeare's play (MacBeth) commits murder and later is identified as being suspicious because she's like "I've done nothing wrong. Heh, heh...I'm innocent. Innocent. No murder around here. Hahaheh...Innocent, I tell you!!!" In other words, she protests too much. It's often a scumtell.
Quote from TB »
This is really the only decent point I've seen against Jordman. Did he post at all in between?
He had one, where he asked what Calvin thought about the conversation.
Quote from TB »
I'm calling newb town for now. Irritation like this is hard to fake. Kinda reminds me of me
Seriously this is ridiculous - I asked you a question jordman and you just straight out ignored it twice. Anyone else I would call this scummy but with you I don't even know what it means.
I concur. If questions are asked of you directly, you should answer them. Unless your screen name is kpaca or Cyan, of course.
You've alluded to it in 5 or 6, but you only said "Let's lynch Jordman because he can't talk in a straight line." once. Do I really have to find and quote those posts for you? Honestly...some people...
Take your elitist attitude and stick it up your rear. However, I defy you to find a post that I have made to the effect of what you've quoted.
Also, the bolded qualifier "maybe" is in my list because Cyan "may be" on my town list.
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Well, no, I don't actually think it was. He was my Mason partner in Superhero. From that interaction with him, it doesn't fit. He seemed like a no-nonsense type of guy. And, he knew the random phase was over.
Of course, I could be wrong, and I'm sure he'll tell me whenever he does come back on. But, if it wasn't a joke, I'm equally sure that he'll explain it and we'll all see.
does two games count as enough xp to know that..... i get the feeling it is, i think tekno tried to get me to claim at l-5 because i was stupid enough to have claimed there in another game. He figured that if he put enough pressure on me it would look like more than one person and i would capitulate and claim. Also as has already been pointed out he wont answer the questions pointed at him. scum, scum i say.
I am sort of suspicious of Cyan as he has a reputation for being a bulldog townie and so far he's seemed kind of laid back and watching from the sidelines.
I had already thought about this. I've never seen Cyan so lurky. Granted, I've only played in Superhero, and he didn't lurk and was scum, so that's likely not a tell, but it is still interesting that his play style seems completely different.
He will probably qualify as newb town for a long, long time...
Seriously this is ridiculous - I asked you a question jordman and you just straight out ignored it twice. Anyone else I would call this scummy but with you I don't even know what it means.
Someone please vig jordman.
Ok, remember the quote I told you to remember? Coupled with this, I'd say jordman REALLY needs to start answering some questions, or he may swing tonight.
Take your elitist attitude and stick it up your rear. However, I defy you to find a post that I have made to the effect of what you've quoted.
Ok, so either your sarcasm detector malfunctioned when you read my post, or mine is malfunctioning now. I felt that the exaggeration of 5-6 would identify it as a joke...but I fear for my rear, so I will explicitly state that I have not read a post by you (kpaca) this game that identified a grammar-lynch as a desirable action.
Quote from kpaca »
Also, the bolded qualifier "maybe" is in my list because Cyan "may be" on my town list.
Ok, remember the quote I told you to remember? Coupled with this, I'd say jordman REALLY needs to start answering some questions, or he may swing tonight.
Calvin the only thing you've asked me as far as i can tell is why i thought kpac wanted me lynched for bad grammar. I am honestly trying to improve that.
I think the posts where he said bad grammar was scummy followed by the part where he said i should post somewhere else. That may not have been "lynch jordman now" but the open hostility felt like a bit much to me.
Calvin the only thing you've asked me as far as i can tell is why i thought kpac wanted me lynched for bad grammar. I am honestly trying to improve that.
I think the posts where he said bad grammar was scummy followed by the part where he said i should post somewhere else. That may not have been "lynch jordman now" but the open hostility felt like a bit much to me.
I applaud this! I can read it!!!
And the open hostility would be kpaca's playstyle. You'll get over it after you lynch him 2 or 3 times and get it out of your system.
But don't suggest that kpaca suggested that you should be lynched for bad grammar. That never happened.
Calvin the only thing you've asked me as far as i can tell is why i thought kpac wanted me lynched for bad grammar. I am honestly trying to improve that.
I think the posts where he said bad grammar was scummy followed by the part where he said i should post somewhere else. That may not have been "lynch jordman now" but the open hostility felt like a bit much to me.
ok that one i actually already answered. As i have explained i wanted to make sure tekno didn't discuss games that were in progress. He hadn't yet it was a precaution. I voted him for rather unrelated reasons. I thought he was being scummish with his failed accusation of me playing differently than i normaly do. My increased cohernecy not withstanding i don't think i have done anything out of the ordinary.
I'm amused that [Shalako], of all people, are talking about terrible reasoning. "Hey, PF's RVS daykill must be serious, therefore I should shoot him to prove that I have a daykill!"
infis, you just totally tryed to sound as town as possible, you even like SAID that you were trying to sound as town as possible, unvote vote infis.
Wow...jordman stole the words right out of my mouth. Trying to appease your attacker? Scummy. Painting your actions as innocent no matter what? Scummy. Choose-your-own-adventure leading? Scummy.
This is my first game with alot of you people so i don't know how you guys play, so i'm getting a whole lot of mixed signals.
People are confused about Cyan acting differently.
Kpaca is being as agressive as ever, has a very inquisitive touch.
MH is more concerened about everyone having fun rather than winning. (Complete oppiste to Kpaca).
Jordman has bad grammer.
So far it's been people trying to lynch Jordman for bad grammer. Kpaca trying to be rude and inqusitive to everyone, MH is trying to keep the game smooth.
I see MH as town because of how she keeps the game going and posts vallid points.
I see Kpaca as some rude guy using rudness to get people frustrated.
Jordman looks really scummy, but i sense a plot going on here, something just isn't right. I'm going to do a pbpa on his posts and people's arguments againt him.
Quote from Infins »
Alright catnipmancer...you don't like my fence sitting.. Let me ask you a question which is scummier:
Asking a question which you already know the answer to to cast light on someone? OR
Someone casting their vote about, at even the slimmest of suspicions?
If A then would you accept "I didnt read the thread thoroughly" as an answer
If B then would you accept "that's how I think townies should play" as an answer
Wow...jordman stole the words right out of my mouth. Trying to appease your attacker? Scummy. Painting your actions as innocent no matter what? Scummy. Choose-your-own-adventure leading? Scummy.
Vote Infinis
Assume the you in the post as the general pronoun not you in particular.
And your lack of an answer is duly noted. Call my question whatever you will, I gave you two options to decide from and yet you fail to address either. You do not even address if they are bad premises, you instead barn jordman.
So I repeat I am asking you a question, if you believe I'm trapping you tell me how. If you believe I'm asking a loaded question tell me how. Justify this lack of a response. If you can't then answer the previous question as posed.
I'm amused that [Shalako], of all people, are talking about terrible reasoning. "Hey, PF's RVS daykill must be serious, therefore I should shoot him to prove that I have a daykill!"
your trapping him by saying that no matter what your town without confirmation from another player, whether he barned me or not it is still certainly true.
Kpaca is being as agressive as ever, has a very inquisitive touch.
Inquisitive as opposed to...everyone else in the thread who's trying to figure out what's going on by asking questions and analyzing posts? What do you mean by "inquisitive"?
Quote from AK »
MH is more concerened about everyone having fun rather than winning. (Complete oppiste to Kpaca).
I don't think I agree with this, either. MH does seem to be concerned with scumhunting, which is good, but I don't see her trying to appease anyone in the name of greater fun.
Quote from AK »
Jordman looks really scummy, but i sense a plot going on here, something just isn't right. I'm going to do a pbpa on his posts and people's arguments againt him.
And your lack of an answer is duly noted. Call my question whatever you will, I gave you two options to decide from and yet you fail to address either. You do not even address if they are bad premises, you instead barn jordman.
So I repeat I am asking you a question, if you believe I'm trapping you tell me how. If you believe I'm asking a loaded question tell me how. Justify this lack of a response. If you can't then answer the previous question as posed.
It's not a question (and therefore a lack of answer isn't possible) if the response won't change the conclusion. You offered me with two choices, both designed to result in the concept that you're town. However, to sate your bloodthirst:
Asking a question which you already know the answer to to cast light on someone? OR
Someone casting their vote about, at even the slimmest of suspicions?
If A then would you accept "I didnt read the thread thoroughly" as an answer
If B then would you accept "that's how I think townies should play" as an answer
I think that asking a question that you already know the answer to is something that can be townie (if trying to ascertain whether or not a particular player has read the thread and is paying attention) or scummy (using inferrence, insinuation, or diversion to focus attention on and/or away from certain players). If you "answer" that you didn't read the thread thoroughly, my suspicion of you increases, as scum often pay less attention to the thread, PBPAs, arguments, etc., instead focusing on finding the little discrepancies that they can use to cause dissension, confusion, and strife. Was the "question that you already knew the answer to" "Why claim miller item" or "What to do with it"? Or was it "So who is scummy as of right now"? Cause I really didn't catch that you "knew" the answer to any of those.
Casting votes about, in and of itself, isn't scummy; rather it's often an indication of playstyle. Now, flip-flopping and flailing: those are scummy. Highlighting a list of suspicions/concerns and not voting? That's scummy. What you did in post #101...felt like you hadn't really read the thread, were speculating on an item that people have said we likely shouldn't speculate on, and were fencesitting. I don't think that's how townies should play.
your trapping him by saying that no matter what your town without confirmation from another player, whether he barned me or not it is still certainly true.
While I understand the desire to respond to bad arguments, when someone asks a direct question of a player, it's usually best to let that player respond to the question. That way, you don't preclude what could be a very revealing answer and/or provide scum with a logical out that they wouldn't have otherwise thought of. In particular, I hate others answering questions for me (although I have to admit that I've been guilty of it from time to time myself).
So I'm right, you are ignoring newb town tells in favour of newb scum tells.
But, he is making an effort to defend himself and make his posting more legible. he is also trying to find scum, if being jumpy and not throrough about is: he has had reasons for his votes.
Is attacking scummy things scummy now?
It's interesting that you attributed that to Jordman. So Jordman is talking about Jordman?
Quote from TB »
Not sure about infinis. It seems like a trap question to get someone to give a bad answer, and he seems to have leapt at the chance to attack trip for not answering, but the second post seems pretty genuine...
Assume the you in the post as the general pronoun not you in particular.
And your lack of an answer is duly noted. Call my question whatever you will, I gave you two options to decide from and yet you fail to address either. You do not even address if they are bad premises, you instead barn jordman.
So I repeat I am asking you a question, if you believe I'm trapping you tell me how. If you believe I'm asking a loaded question tell me how. Justify this lack of a response. If you can't then answer the previous question as posed.
Actually, it felt like a rather weak rebuttal/attack of opportunity. Like "Aha! I've got you!"
Calvin the only thing you've asked me as far as i can tell is why i thought kpac wanted me lynched for bad grammar. I am honestly trying to improve that.
I think the posts where he said bad grammar was scummy followed by the part where he said i should post somewhere else. That may not have been "lynch jordman now" but the open hostility felt like a bit much to me.
ok that one i actually already answered. As i have explained i wanted to make sure tekno didn't discuss games that were in progress. He hadn't yet it was a precaution. I voted him for rather unrelated reasons. I thought he was being scummish with his failed accusation of me playing differently than i normaly do. My increased cohernecy not withstanding i don't think i have done anything out of the ordinary.
The question was why would you vote Teknolink for wanting to lynch you for bad grammar when he never said such a thing.
Regardless, these posts make me feel a little better about you.
Aside from Cyan, the only person I'm really concerned about is WoD.
ok that one i actually already answered. As i have explained i wanted to make sure tekno didn't discuss games that were in progress. He hadn't yet it was a precaution. I voted him for rather unrelated reasons. I thought he was being scummish with his failed accusation of me playing differently than i normaly do. My increased cohernecy not withstanding i don't think i have done anything out of the ordinary.
When I read this post, my first thought was "Oh, ok Mr. Other Game Discussing Police-man." Is that really necessary? Is TeknoLink known to discuss ongoing games? Because I've never seen him do it.
So I'm right, you are ignoring newb town tells in favour of newb scum tells.
But, he is making an effort to defend himself and make his posting more legible. he is also trying to find scum, if being jumpy and not throrough about is: he has had reasons for his votes.
Is attacking scummy things scummy now?
Is it enough for him to have reasons for his votes if they're failed reasons? Lets review a few of them.
seems good to me i think for now i will unvote vote manders hex, your to good not to have seen that we can just have someone tell us about the item. Your blatant fishing annoys me.
tekno is being opportunistic and trying to get me to claim at 2 votes. Not to mention i think he tried to get me lynched on the grounds of "jordmans grammar stinks=antitown=lynch now herf derf" I think i'll vote tekno now :). Yes that right there was deflecting but its deflecting from something rather idiotic which was people being angry at me for voting what i saw as horrible scum fishing.
does two games count as enough xp to know that..... i get the feeling it is, i think tekno tried to get me to claim at l-5 because i was stupid enough to have claimed there in another game. He figured that if he put enough pressure on me it would look like more than one person and i would capitulate and claim. Also as has already been pointed out he wont answer the questions pointed at him. scum, scum i say.
Notice this is now the second time he has voted Tekno Link for something that he has done? Yes, he eventually answered the questions at him, but why did they have to be prodded out of him?
I'm feeling ya.
The question he asked seems like a solid question wanting to analyze the response given. I don't know that it accomplished anything, but it seems genuine, and the "second post" also seems good.
My post is a rebuttal to your accusation of fence sitting. The post is not about you. I clear that you in the second post.
Let's try again, once more with feeling:
Who is scummier in your mind:
Player A - Who asks Player B a question that Player A already has the answer to. Player A is accused of doing this to put undue attention on Player B.
Player A responds that he is only skimming and missed that the answer was already known
OR
Player Z - Who wildly votes every and anyone who he has the slightest suspicion of. Player Z is accused of not using reason and patience.
Player Z says he is playing Town how he thinks and it is the way that has served him well.
Which is scummier? No hedging, No fence sitting, a simple A or Z.
I fail to see how this has any bearing on my towniness. You have really flown off the handle. I never stated you were the subject of this hypothetical, if I implied it I cleared it up in the second post. So why so much vitriol?
Lastly where do I say anything near "Aha caught you scum" and feeling like I said that is crap.
I'm amused that [Shalako], of all people, are talking about terrible reasoning. "Hey, PF's RVS daykill must be serious, therefore I should shoot him to prove that I have a daykill!"
My post is a rebuttal to your accusation of fence sitting.
I guess I don't understand how, but ok...
Quote from Infinis »
Let's try again, once more with feeling:
Who is scummier in your mind:
Player A - Who asks Player B a question that Player A already has the answer to. Player A is accused of doing this to put undue attention on Player B.
Player A responds that he is only skimming and missed that the answer was already known
OR
Player Z - Who wildly votes every and anyone who he has the slightest suspicion of. Player Z is accused of not using reason and patience.
Player Z says he is playing Town how he thinks and it is the way that has served him well.
Which is scummier? No hedging, No fence sitting, a simple A or Z.
Does the bolded part indicate that it is known that Player A already knows the answer? If so, then Player A is scummier, because I know he knows, but he responds by saying that he missed information that I know he knows.
If "Player A already has the answer" means that the information is readily available in the thread, but Player A has given no indication that he knows that information, I would still be somewhat more suspicious of Player A than Player Z for two reasons: 1) I know players like Player Z; I call them Binary Players because they're either off (not voting) or on (voting). There's no inbetween. And 2) as a literate individual playing a game based on writing, reading, and responding, it's harder for me to understand how someone could miss information if they're paying attention to the thread. Not paying attention, as I've said before, has been identified to me and demonstrated to me as a scumtell.
Quote from Infinis »
I fail to see how this has any bearing on my towniness. You have really flown off the handle. I never stated you were the subject of this hypothetical, if I implied it I cleared it up in the second post. So why so much vitriol?
I admit: I was under the impression that your question was designed to mirror the game, which is why I asked which question you already knew the answer to. If it's more hypothetical, fine. But now that I've answered your question, how is it a rebuttal?
Quote from Infinis »
Lastly where do I say anything near "Aha caught you scum" and feeling like I said that is crap.
I felt like I responded appropriately, and you attacked me for not answering a question (which I didn't feel had a "right" answer), and barning (which I think is only partially true).
You're responding rather vitriolically yourself. Which doesn't detract from my leaning toward you as scum. But perhaps that will change when you explain your rebuttal.
@Cyan: If you're right, I will forever bow down to your god-like detecting skills. Not only is his name one of the least I would have expected to leap off your keyboard, but I wasn't picking up on much of any scumtells from him.
Does the bolded part indicate that it is known that Player A already knows the answer? If so, then Player A is scummier, because I know he knows, but he responds by saying that he missed information that I know he knows.
If "Player A already has the answer" means that the information is readily available in the thread, but Player A has given no indication that he knows that information, I would still be somewhat more suspicious of Player A than Player Z for two reasons: 1) I know players like Player Z; I call them Binary Players because they're either off (not voting) or on (voting). There's no inbetween. And 2) as a literate individual playing a game based on writing, reading, and responding, it's harder for me to understand how someone could miss information if they're paying attention to the thread. Not paying attention, as I've said before, has been identified to me and demonstrated to me as a scumtell.
I admit: I was under the impression that your question was designed to mirror the game, which is why I asked which question you already knew the answer to. If it's more hypothetical, fine. But now that I've answered your question, how is it a rebuttal?
I am trying to build a case that will become more apparent as the day progresses. But I know of two people already who are damn clever to know already where I'm going with this, vis a vis these are not hypothetical at all.
I felt like I responded appropriately, and you attacked me for not answering a question (which I didn't feel had a "right" answer), and barning (which I think is only partially true).
What you did was strawman the post eg "choose your own adventure" style question, fence sat by saying conditionally this and this, which is not what I asked for. If you're town why wouldnt you just state your opinion no need to hedge since I'm not attacking anyone as of yet.
You're responding rather vitriolically yourself. Which doesn't detract from my leaning toward you as scum. But perhaps that will change when you explain your rebuttal.
No it won't. I have no doubts your vote we be on me for the entire day no matter what occurs. Which is a valid strategy, many use the blanket "he was acting scummy" statement to vote me and eventually lynch me. Not QQ just saying tl:dr and tunnel vision always wins against reason.
I'm amused that [Shalako], of all people, are talking about terrible reasoning. "Hey, PF's RVS daykill must be serious, therefore I should shoot him to prove that I have a daykill!"
What you did was strawman the post eg "choose your own adventure" style question, fence sat by saying conditionally this and this, which is not what I asked for. If you're town why wouldnt you just state your opinion no need to hedge since I'm not attacking anyone as of yet.
I disagree. I honestly saw your A or B as you offering up a no-win situation, where however I answered would prove your point. I still don't see where you're going with this.
Quote from Infinis »
No it won't. I have no doubts your vote we be on me for the entire day no matter what occurs.
I have doubts, because you're starting to confuse me, and you're only growing in confidence, which is not what I expected.
Quote from Infinis »
Which is a valid strategy, many use the blanket "he was acting scummy" statement to vote me and eventually lynch me. Not QQ just saying tl:dr and tunnel vision always wins against reason.
What's "QQ"? Are you asserting that I'm using that blanket statement to vote you?
I disagree. I honestly saw your A or B as you offering up a no-win situation, where however I answered would prove your point. I still don't see where you're going with this.
How is A and B a no-win situation? Asking you which you enjoy more killing babies or burning animals with blow torches is a no-win situation. I asked you given two situations about a third parties scumminess (a hypothetical third party at that) which do you think is scummier.
I repeat how in anyway shape or form is this a trap, no win, or any form of a negative for you? If you can't tell us who you think is scummier in a situation (again a hypothetical one at least to the best of your knowledge) then that is the very definition, black and white, of fence sitting which you so quickly jumped on me for.
I have doubts, because you're starting to confuse me, and you're only growing in confidence, which is not what I expected.
What's "QQ"?
QQ = Crying. I am growing in confidence because I can see no reason for you to avoid answering a hypothetical about hypothetical people. Only scum would be worried about me trapping him or making him take a negative stance on one of his scum buddies.
I'm amused that [Shalako], of all people, are talking about terrible reasoning. "Hey, PF's RVS daykill must be serious, therefore I should shoot him to prove that I have a daykill!"
You guys could just look at my history in minis...it's always like this, and I always say this same thing.
My playstyle is fairly reactionary, in a mini, it takes alot longer for there to be anything to really react to.
I will say that, reading things over, I don't think that Infinis is scum.
I've gone and read the first posts you've made in all your minis from the past year and a half and now I am confused. You see, you've been scum most of the time. The only mini that I found where you were town was Dictionary mafia. In all your games you have opinions on players pretty much right away and are very confident in them. In Dictionary this is also true but you do take a couple of days to get into the game.
I'm pretty much at the point of unvoting you because as opposed to your behvaiour being different from your usual townie play it seems to be different from both your townie and scum play. This behavious is still odd for me to see but it doesn't line up with your scum behaviour either.
I haven't seen your behaviour in any of the minis resemble your play here but my eye caught on this post in Prehistoric where you are scum:
@Andelijah: I still don't really get it. So your main assertion is that I've been more quiet this game 'than I normally am'? My contention is that this has no bearing whatsoever on my alignment, especially since your 'points of reference' are 2 ongoing games where my alignment is unknown. Sometimes, I simply don't post alot at the start of a game. Sometimes I do. It has nothing to do with my affiliation.
@AK: Or, seeing as how you're at 5 votes now, you could stop wasting everyone's time and get on with claiming. You have been slowly accumulating votes throughout your 'discourse' with me, clearly people are coming to realize that you are scum. Get on with it already.
I feel that my brief read of your first couple of posts hasn't been enough to get a grasp on this situation. When I have time I will try to read those games further.
Half of the playerbase has replaced, some within the last few days. Another 7-10 days to work out a good lynch(not Xyre) is a reasonable requestion.
On topic, Vote Skander. He has said little to nothing all day, then goes from 'Vote Xyre'(for no stated reason) to 'yeah I don't really think Xyre is scum'(but doesn't unvote him). Then shortly thereafter, Xyre is one of the three people he is suspicious of. Yeahhhhhhh okay.
This post absolutely stinks. What Kraj is trying to say is extremely obvious. It's particularly interesting that you accuse him of 'trying to forcibly push a vote from nothing', considering that is *exactly* what you did in regard to Andelijah.
Vote ZDS
From the timestamps Cyan doesn't seem to really get started in the game until 5 days in.
I thought that Catalina's initial suggestion was okay, if a little naive.
But after the 'clarification', I'm all on board for a Vote Catalina.
No matter how you try to mask it, a gender claim is simply going to benefit the scum more than the town. I'm pretty sure that we should never reveal our genders, unless we're in a situation where we have a specific reason to suspect that one of the genders is about to be wiped out. And even then, we would have to have protective measures in place.
That's a pretty easy target. Two people not posting much.
I'm keepin an eye on you.
It's easy to just apply blanket tells (lurker hunting) to situations but it helps if you actually analyze the situations.
You see the reason I find WoD and Cyan suspicious is not simply because they are lurking but rather because lurking for them is out of charachter.
With Cyan I am going to have to further investigate to see what's going on. With Wrath of Dog I have seen people say that he lurks as scum. I would quote them but I don't remember where it was and this forum's search function is not helping at all. I'll try to find this later or maybe just look at WoD's games myself to see this.
Infinis vs. Cantripmancer is leaving me slightly confused but also feeling Infinis as town. He strikes me as playing the same way as in Sword of Truth where he has some kind of weird logic going on that others don't always get.
Inquisitive as opposed to...everyone else in the thread who's trying to figure out what's going on by asking questions and analyzing posts? What do you mean by "inquisitive"?
He seems more inclined to use any means necisary to find his target,i'm not saying everyone else dosn't scum hunt,i'mjust saying he's more agressive.
Quote from Cantripmancer »
A plot? Please, expound.
Like that scum are going for a quick mislynch.
Quote from Calvin »
EBWODP: With the way kpaca is playing, I'm betting he's Malcolm from Basic #10...
How is A and B a no-win situation? Asking you which you enjoy more killing babies or burning animals with blow torches is a no-win situation. I asked you given two situations about a third parties scumminess (a hypothetical third party at that) which do you think is scummier.
I repeat how in anyway shape or form is this a trap, no win, or any form of a negative for you? If you can't tell us who you think is scummier in a situation (again a hypothetical one at least to the best of your knowledge) then that is the very definition, black and white, of fence sitting which you so quickly jumped on me for.
Ok, well, it appears I've gotten myself in deep with what I thought was an insightful parry of an attack, so here's an analysis of the posts in question, in order:
Alright catnipmancer...you don't like my fence sitting.. Let me ask you a question which is scummier:
Asking a question which you already know the answer to to cast light on someone? OR
Someone casting their vote about, at even the slimmest of suspicions?
If A then would you accept "I didnt read the thread thoroughly" as an answer
If B then would you accept "that's how I think townies should play" as an answer
Your original post. You start off with a deliberate slur/misspelling of my name, which, while I'm used to it after a few games with kpaca, seems designed to irritate/annoy/throw me off the logical track and put me on an emotional tact. It felt like an attack right out of the box. You then mention my dislike of your fencesitting (which I still feel it was, btw), and "counter" with your question. When I first read it, I thought you were using it as your defense to fencesitting. Since you hadn't been casting your vote about, I figured that "B" was another player that you were trying to compare yourself favorably to, and that "A" was you. I read through your earlier posts, trying to find the question you asked that you already knew the answer to, and couldn't figure it out. I then turned my attention to what you were asking and realized that neither action, taken out of context, was particularly scummy.
I feared that you were waiting for me to answer one or the other (not really caring which), at which point you'd point out either how you exemplified the less scummy or how I exemplified the more scummy. It felt like a trick question, designed to paint you as town either way.
Of note, not only did jordman seem to read it a similar way, Archon Kamigawa in post #144 identified it as a "weak attack", and Toastboy in post #150 said it seemed like a trap question to get someone to give a bad answer, so I don't feel that my response was all that unusual. Moving on:
Wow...jordman stole the words right out of my mouth. Trying to appease your attacker? Scummy. Painting your actions as innocent no matter what? Scummy. Choose-your-own-adventure leading? Scummy.
Vote Infinis
If you take into account the reasoning that I went through, outlined above, I came to the conclusion that you were being sneaky and scummy. I honestly thought that others would feel the same; the fact that more seasoned vets than there can be scum have dismissed your question as innocent obviously makes me question my outcome.
Assume the you in the post as the general pronoun not you in particular.
And your lack of an answer is duly noted. Call my question whatever you will, I gave you two options to decide from and yet you fail to address either. You do not even address if they are bad premises, you instead barn jordman.
So I repeat I am asking you a question, if you believe I'm trapping you tell me how. If you believe I'm asking a loaded question tell me how. Justify this lack of a response. If you can't then answer the previous question as posed.
The bolded part still felt like lacing the trap with sugar. "I'm not talking about you, catnipmancer...it's no one in particular." I still felt that you would turn around and declare your innocence based on my response. I both explained how I felt it was loaded and addressed both, below:
It's not a question (and therefore a lack of answer isn't possible) if the response won't change the conclusion. You offered me with two choices, both designed to result in the concept that you're town. However, to sate your bloodthirst:
I think that asking a question that you already know the answer to is something that can be townie (if trying to ascertain whether or not a particular player has read the thread and is paying attention) or scummy (using inferrence, insinuation, or diversion to focus attention on and/or away from certain players). If you "answer" that you didn't read the thread thoroughly, my suspicion of you increases, as scum often pay less attention to the thread, PBPAs, arguments, etc., instead focusing on finding the little discrepancies that they can use to cause dissension, confusion, and strife. Was the "question that you already knew the answer to" "Why claim miller item" or "What to do with it"? Or was it "So who is scummy as of right now"? Cause I really didn't catch that you "knew" the answer to any of those.
Casting votes about, in and of itself, isn't scummy; rather it's often an indication of playstyle. Now, flip-flopping and flailing: those are scummy. Highlighting a list of suspicions/concerns and not voting? That's scummy. What you did in post #101...felt like you hadn't really read the thread, were speculating on an item that people have said we likely shouldn't speculate on, and were fencesitting. I don't think that's how townies should play.
I still feel that your post in #101 is questionable and borderline speculation. You still haven't answered my question, btw: Why do you think it unlikely that there are no actions or day investigations?
My post is a rebuttal to your accusation of fence sitting. The post is not about you. I clear that you in the second post.
Let's try again, once more with feeling:
Who is scummier in your mind:
Player A - Who asks Player B a question that Player A already has the answer to. Player A is accused of doing this to put undue attention on Player B.
Player A responds that he is only skimming and missed that the answer was already known
OR
Player Z - Who wildly votes every and anyone who he has the slightest suspicion of. Player Z is accused of not using reason and patience.
Player Z says he is playing Town how he thinks and it is the way that has served him well.
Which is scummier? No hedging, No fence sitting, a simple A or Z.
I fail to see how this has any bearing on my towniness. You have really flown off the handle. I never stated you were the subject of this hypothetical, if I implied it I cleared it up in the second post. So why so much vitriol?
Lastly where do I say anything near "Aha caught you scum" and feeling like I said that is crap.
You clarified your question, and I felt like I answered it below. I understand why you find the delay suspicious, but remember that I was suspicious of you already when you started this volley, so I was proceding with caution.
Does the bolded part indicate that it is known that Player A already knows the answer? If so, then Player A is scummier, because I know he knows, but he responds by saying that he missed information that I know he knows.
If "Player A already has the answer" means that the information is readily available in the thread, but Player A has given no indication that he knows that information, I would still be somewhat more suspicious of Player A than Player Z for two reasons: 1) I know players like Player Z; I call them Binary Players because they're either off (not voting) or on (voting). There's no inbetween. And 2) as a literate individual playing a game based on writing, reading, and responding, it's harder for me to understand how someone could miss information if they're paying attention to the thread. Not paying attention, as I've said before, has been identified to me and demonstrated to me as a scumtell.
I admit: I was under the impression that your question was designed to mirror the game, which is why I asked which question you already knew the answer to. If it's more hypothetical, fine. But now that I've answered your question, how is it a rebuttal?
I felt like I responded appropriately, and you attacked me for not answering a question (which I didn't feel had a "right" answer), and barning (which I think is only partially true).
You're responding rather vitriolically yourself. Which doesn't detract from my leaning toward you as scum. But perhaps that will change when you explain your rebuttal.
I still don't see where you're going, but I'm sufficiently convinced that you care, and more than I would expect scum to.
Quote from Infinis »
No what I'm saying is that you will continue your vote on me with a blanket statement and soon so will your cronies.
Vote: Cantripmancer
So my question was "Are you asserting that I'm using that blanket statement to vote you?", and you respond with "No, you're voting me with a blanket statement."? What?
I'm sufficiently confused. I'm not unvoting you, at least not yet, because I still have suspicions. But I'm a lot less sure than when I started.
EBWODP: With the way kpaca is playing, I'm betting he's Malcolm from Basic #10...
If that's true, kpaca should switch Malcolm-mode on more often. Malcolm pegged scum with his first vote in that game, and was more civil overall than I've ever seen kpaca. Just as cryptically brief, of course. (As a funny note, when I was reading through Malcolm's posts, I noticed the Hobbes avatar and thought, "maybe Malcolm is Calvin! What's Calvin trying to pull?", but then I realized that you were also in #10, and signing up to a game as your regular account and as a gimmick would be ridiculously heinous.)
@Cantripmancer, I'm going to stop myself from anwering your post besides the points at me, mainly because i have just done a pbpa in another game and a largish pst here.
Yeah, I sorta caught that. I'd like to know specifics as to why you think that.
The wagon is going fast and started on a weak argument which has just escelated.
Why?
Because Malcom was(we think) a gimmick account, now Kpaca isn't that but Malcom basicly contribueted nothing and only threw around random posts that got us no where.
@Cantripmancer, I'm going to stop myself from anwering your post besides the points at me, mainly because i have just done a pbpa in another game and a largish pst here.
As you should.
Quote from AK »
Because Malcom was(we think) a gimmick account, now Kpaca isn't that but Malcom basicly contribueted nothing and only threw around random posts that got us no where.
It seems pretty obvious to me that he was a gimmick account. His random posts accurately identified Cyouni as scum and AK, Calvin, and TB as town (of course he was wrong about Killerhamster). Those could have been lucky guesses, I suppose, but he seemed pretty confident (and accurate).
I AM TEH MASTAH O FAIL
ty spiderboys
I AM TEH MASTAH O FAIL
ty spiderboys
I'm comfortable with my vote after this response. Seems hella insincere.
PLEASE RESPOND TO THE QUESTIONS BEING ASKED OF YOU.
He will probably qualify as newb town for a long, long time...
Seriously this is ridiculous - I asked you a question jordman and you just straight out ignored it twice. Anyone else I would call this scummy but with you I don't even know what it means.
Someone please vig jordman.
Basic #10-Town-Win
Sword of Truth-Town-Loss
LOTR II - Town-Loss
Indiana Jones - Town-Win
Manipulator - Town-Win
The Asphodel Meadows - Town-Win
Highlander - Neutral Survivor - Win
MH I feel is town given her actions and the questions she asked.
Tek I am unsure of currently. But he did make a good case against jordman, so he is leaning slightly town.
And given the way jordman has reacted I think this is more indicative of newb scum than newb town. He doesn't seem to be scum hunting as much as latching onto whatever he sees as scummy. This has been a common theme in pretty much every single post he has made (other than the ones where he is fighting with people over grammar).
Also where are you getting this cautious with my vote from?
Why do you think these unlikely? We're not in a basic.
Mild speculation noted.
WIFOM also protects if he doesn't announce who it goes to.
Nice fencesit.
You've alluded to it in 5 or 6, but you only said "Let's lynch Jordman because he can't talk in a straight line." once. Do I really have to find and quote those posts for you? Honestly...some people...
Interesting. Why the bolded qualifier?
Omi. Defensive much? Not twelve or scum...so noob town 11-year old? Seriously, try this:
1) Type your post.
2) Hit "Preview Post".
3) Read your post aloud. See how that sounds? Like a drunken Tourette's victim? (No offense meant to anyone suffering from Tourette's.)
His reticence at being obnoxious is suspicious, now that you mention it. He's usually much more of a bull(y)dog.
When kpaca gets all huffy, it's cute. You? Just obnoxious.
I tend to agree, sadly, that Jordman feels like indignant newb town rather than scum. TL and Guard taking advantage? Eh...
Ok, then let's get a serious response.
TeknoLink, when you asked Jordman to claim at L-5, were you being serious?
Lady MacBeth from Shakespeare's play (MacBeth) commits murder and later is identified as being suspicious because she's like "I've done nothing wrong. Heh, heh...I'm innocent. Innocent. No murder around here. Hahaheh...Innocent, I tell you!!!" In other words, she protests too much. It's often a scumtell.
He had one, where he asked what Calvin thought about the conversation.
Yeah.
I concur. If questions are asked of you directly, you should answer them. Unless your screen name is kpaca or Cyan, of course.
Also, the bolded qualifier "maybe" is in my list because Cyan "may be" on my town list.
Well, no, I don't actually think it was. He was my Mason partner in Superhero. From that interaction with him, it doesn't fit. He seemed like a no-nonsense type of guy. And, he knew the random phase was over.
Of course, I could be wrong, and I'm sure he'll tell me whenever he does come back on. But, if it wasn't a joke, I'm equally sure that he'll explain it and we'll all see.
This is sooooo the pot calling the kettle black!
Just take note of this for now. All will be explained shortly.
Ahh, ok. Makes sense.
I had already thought about this. I've never seen Cyan so lurky. Granted, I've only played in Superhero, and he didn't lurk and was scum, so that's likely not a tell, but it is still interesting that his play style seems completely different.
Ok, remember the quote I told you to remember? Coupled with this, I'd say jordman REALLY needs to start answering some questions, or he may swing tonight.
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Your waffling is duly noted.
What do you mean here?
I said it right here in the same post.
Tired of corporate corruption ruining your favorite MtG site?
Come join ours!!
We even have Mafia!!
Oh, I see. I thought you meant YOU were going to explain Jordman's lunacy.
Tired of corporate corruption ruining your favorite MtG site?
Come join ours!!
We even have Mafia!!
I'll look over things today.
Cyan apologizing? Now I KNOW something's up.
FOS: Cyan
(Yes, this is serious...I've never seen Cyan act like this.)
I think the posts where he said bad grammar was scummy followed by the part where he said i should post somewhere else. That may not have been "lynch jordman now" but the open hostility felt like a bit much to me.
I AM TEH MASTAH O FAIL
ty spiderboys
I applaud this! I can read it!!!
And the open hostility would be kpaca's playstyle. You'll get over it after you lynch him 2 or 3 times and get it out of your system.
But don't suggest that kpaca suggested that you should be lynched for bad grammar. That never happened.
Please answer it, I'd like to know this, too.
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Come join ours!!
We even have Mafia!!
I AM TEH MASTAH O FAIL
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Asking a question which you already know the answer to to cast light on someone? OR
Someone casting their vote about, at even the slimmest of suspicions?
If A then would you accept "I didnt read the thread thoroughly" as an answer
If B then would you accept "that's how I think townies should play" as an answer
12-11? I'm losing track
I AM TEH MASTAH O FAIL
ty spiderboys
Wow...jordman stole the words right out of my mouth. Trying to appease your attacker? Scummy. Painting your actions as innocent no matter what? Scummy. Choose-your-own-adventure leading? Scummy.
Vote Infinis
This is my first game with alot of you people so i don't know how you guys play, so i'm getting a whole lot of mixed signals.
People are confused about Cyan acting differently.
Kpaca is being as agressive as ever, has a very inquisitive touch.
MH is more concerened about everyone having fun rather than winning. (Complete oppiste to Kpaca).
Jordman has bad grammer.
So far it's been people trying to lynch Jordman for bad grammer. Kpaca trying to be rude and inqusitive to everyone, MH is trying to keep the game smooth.
I see MH as town because of how she keeps the game going and posts vallid points.
I see Kpaca as some rude guy using rudness to get people frustrated.
Jordman looks really scummy, but i sense a plot going on here, something just isn't right. I'm going to do a pbpa on his posts and people's arguments againt him.
This looks like a weak attack to me.
Thanks To KrackShott
Old extendo moved
Assume the you in the post as the general pronoun not you in particular.
And your lack of an answer is duly noted. Call my question whatever you will, I gave you two options to decide from and yet you fail to address either. You do not even address if they are bad premises, you instead barn jordman.
So I repeat I am asking you a question, if you believe I'm trapping you tell me how. If you believe I'm asking a loaded question tell me how. Justify this lack of a response. If you can't then answer the previous question as posed.
12-11? I'm losing track
I AM TEH MASTAH O FAIL
ty spiderboys
I don't think I agree with this, either. MH does seem to be concerned with scumhunting, which is good, but I don't see her trying to appease anyone in the name of greater fun.
A plot? Please, expound.
It's not a question (and therefore a lack of answer isn't possible) if the response won't change the conclusion. You offered me with two choices, both designed to result in the concept that you're town. However, to sate your bloodthirst:
I think that asking a question that you already know the answer to is something that can be townie (if trying to ascertain whether or not a particular player has read the thread and is paying attention) or scummy (using inferrence, insinuation, or diversion to focus attention on and/or away from certain players). If you "answer" that you didn't read the thread thoroughly, my suspicion of you increases, as scum often pay less attention to the thread, PBPAs, arguments, etc., instead focusing on finding the little discrepancies that they can use to cause dissension, confusion, and strife. Was the "question that you already knew the answer to" "Why claim miller item" or "What to do with it"? Or was it "So who is scummy as of right now"? Cause I really didn't catch that you "knew" the answer to any of those.
Casting votes about, in and of itself, isn't scummy; rather it's often an indication of playstyle. Now, flip-flopping and flailing: those are scummy. Highlighting a list of suspicions/concerns and not voting? That's scummy. What you did in post #101...felt like you hadn't really read the thread, were speculating on an item that people have said we likely shouldn't speculate on, and were fencesitting. I don't think that's how townies should play.
Vote most definitely stands.
While I understand the desire to respond to bad arguments, when someone asks a direct question of a player, it's usually best to let that player respond to the question. That way, you don't preclude what could be a very revealing answer and/or provide scum with a logical out that they wouldn't have otherwise thought of. In particular, I hate others answering questions for me (although I have to admit that I've been guilty of it from time to time myself).
jordman - 3 (Cyan, Guardman, TeknoLink)
Archon Kamigawa - 2 (kpaca, Toastboy)
Infinis - 2 (Cantripmancer, jordman)
Cyan - 1 (Wrath_of_DoG)
Not Voting: Archon Kamigawa, Calvin, Infinis, MandersHex
With 12 alive, its 7 to lynch.
FYI - WoD informed me of limited internet access this week, hence his low participation. Expect him to resume normal posting next week.
Current New Favorite Person™: Mallory Archer
She knows why.
By "second post", are you talking about this one:
Actually, it felt like a rather weak rebuttal/attack of opportunity. Like "Aha! I've got you!"
You know he doesn't. Don't encourage him.
Exactly.
Vote Cyan.
The question was why would you vote Teknolink for wanting to lynch you for bad grammar when he never said such a thing.
Regardless, these posts make me feel a little better about you.
Aside from Cyan, the only person I'm really concerned about is WoD.
Basic #10-Town-Win
Sword of Truth-Town-Loss
LOTR II - Town-Loss
Indiana Jones - Town-Win
Manipulator - Town-Win
The Asphodel Meadows - Town-Win
Highlander - Neutral Survivor - Win
When I read this post, my first thought was "Oh, ok Mr. Other Game Discussing Police-man." Is that really necessary? Is TeknoLink known to discuss ongoing games? Because I've never seen him do it.
Is it enough for him to have reasons for his votes if they're failed reasons? Lets review a few of them.
Epic fail in his analyzing, so not a good post.
How is deflecting ever a town-tell? Can anyone explain that?
Notice this is now the second time he has voted Tekno Link for something that he has done? Yes, he eventually answered the questions at him, but why did they have to be prodded out of him?
I'm feeling ya.
The question he asked seems like a solid question wanting to analyze the response given. I don't know that it accomplished anything, but it seems genuine, and the "second post" also seems good.
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Come join ours!!
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My post is a rebuttal to your accusation of fence sitting. The post is not about you. I clear that you in the second post.
Let's try again, once more with feeling:
Who is scummier in your mind:
Player A - Who asks Player B a question that Player A already has the answer to. Player A is accused of doing this to put undue attention on Player B.
Player A responds that he is only skimming and missed that the answer was already known
OR
Player Z - Who wildly votes every and anyone who he has the slightest suspicion of. Player Z is accused of not using reason and patience.
Player Z says he is playing Town how he thinks and it is the way that has served him well.
Which is scummier? No hedging, No fence sitting, a simple A or Z.
I fail to see how this has any bearing on my towniness. You have really flown off the handle. I never stated you were the subject of this hypothetical, if I implied it I cleared it up in the second post. So why so much vitriol?
Lastly where do I say anything near "Aha caught you scum" and feeling like I said that is crap.
12-11? I'm losing track
My playstyle is fairly reactionary, in a mini, it takes alot longer for there to be anything to really react to.
I will say that, reading things over, I don't think that Infinis is scum.
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Does the bolded part indicate that it is known that Player A already knows the answer? If so, then Player A is scummier, because I know he knows, but he responds by saying that he missed information that I know he knows.
If "Player A already has the answer" means that the information is readily available in the thread, but Player A has given no indication that he knows that information, I would still be somewhat more suspicious of Player A than Player Z for two reasons: 1) I know players like Player Z; I call them Binary Players because they're either off (not voting) or on (voting). There's no inbetween. And 2) as a literate individual playing a game based on writing, reading, and responding, it's harder for me to understand how someone could miss information if they're paying attention to the thread. Not paying attention, as I've said before, has been identified to me and demonstrated to me as a scumtell.
I admit: I was under the impression that your question was designed to mirror the game, which is why I asked which question you already knew the answer to. If it's more hypothetical, fine. But now that I've answered your question, how is it a rebuttal?
I felt like I responded appropriately, and you attacked me for not answering a question (which I didn't feel had a "right" answer), and barning (which I think is only partially true).
You're responding rather vitriolically yourself. Which doesn't detract from my leaning toward you as scum. But perhaps that will change when you explain your rebuttal.
@Cyan: If you're right, I will forever bow down to your god-like detecting skills. Not only is his name one of the least I would have expected to leap off your keyboard, but I wasn't picking up on much of any scumtells from him.
Like I said, I'm still looking things over.
I am trying to build a case that will become more apparent as the day progresses. But I know of two people already who are damn clever to know already where I'm going with this, vis a vis these are not hypothetical at all.
What you did was strawman the post eg "choose your own adventure" style question, fence sat by saying conditionally this and this, which is not what I asked for. If you're town why wouldnt you just state your opinion no need to hedge since I'm not attacking anyone as of yet.
No it won't. I have no doubts your vote we be on me for the entire day no matter what occurs. Which is a valid strategy, many use the blanket "he was acting scummy" statement to vote me and eventually lynch me. Not QQ just saying tl:dr and tunnel vision always wins against reason.
12-11? I'm losing track
I AM TEH MASTAH O FAIL
ty spiderboys
I AM TEH MASTAH O FAIL
ty spiderboys
I have doubts, because you're starting to confuse me, and you're only growing in confidence, which is not what I expected.
What's "QQ"? Are you asserting that I'm using that blanket statement to vote you?
How is A and B a no-win situation? Asking you which you enjoy more killing babies or burning animals with blow torches is a no-win situation. I asked you given two situations about a third parties scumminess (a hypothetical third party at that) which do you think is scummier.
I repeat how in anyway shape or form is this a trap, no win, or any form of a negative for you? If you can't tell us who you think is scummier in a situation (again a hypothetical one at least to the best of your knowledge) then that is the very definition, black and white, of fence sitting which you so quickly jumped on me for.
QQ = Crying. I am growing in confidence because I can see no reason for you to avoid answering a hypothetical about hypothetical people. Only scum would be worried about me trapping him or making him take a negative stance on one of his scum buddies.
No what I'm saying is that you will continue your vote on me with a blanket statement and soon so will your cronies.
Vote: Cantripmancer
12-11? I'm losing track
Toastboy is solidly town.
That is all.
I've gone and read the first posts you've made in all your minis from the past year and a half and now I am confused. You see, you've been scum most of the time. The only mini that I found where you were town was Dictionary mafia. In all your games you have opinions on players pretty much right away and are very confident in them. In Dictionary this is also true but you do take a couple of days to get into the game.
I'm pretty much at the point of unvoting you because as opposed to your behvaiour being different from your usual townie play it seems to be different from both your townie and scum play. This behavious is still odd for me to see but it doesn't line up with your scum behaviour either.
I haven't seen your behaviour in any of the minis resemble your play here but my eye caught on this post in Prehistoric where you are scum:
I feel that my brief read of your first couple of posts hasn't been enough to get a grasp on this situation. When I have time I will try to read those games further.
Continued attacking in consecutive posts.
Order of the Stick - scum
First post:
Continued attacking in consecutive posts.
Janus - scum (replacement)
First post:
Continued attacking in consecutive posts.
Camp Tachronic - Serial Killer
First post:
Slightly waffly but then followed by this:
and more attacks.
Dictionary - Town
First post:
Second post is more aggresive though.
From the timestamps Cyan doesn't seem to really get started in the game until 5 days in.
Prehistoric - scum
First post:
Non-aggresive consecutive posts.[/spoiler]
How so?
It's easy to just apply blanket tells (lurker hunting) to situations but it helps if you actually analyze the situations.
You see the reason I find WoD and Cyan suspicious is not simply because they are lurking but rather because lurking for them is out of charachter.
With Cyan I am going to have to further investigate to see what's going on. With Wrath of Dog I have seen people say that he lurks as scum. I would quote them but I don't remember where it was and this forum's search function is not helping at all. I'll try to find this later or maybe just look at WoD's games myself to see this.
Infinis vs. Cantripmancer is leaving me slightly confused but also feeling Infinis as town. He strikes me as playing the same way as in Sword of Truth where he has some kind of weird logic going on that others don't always get.
Basic #10-Town-Win
Sword of Truth-Town-Loss
LOTR II - Town-Loss
Indiana Jones - Town-Win
Manipulator - Town-Win
The Asphodel Meadows - Town-Win
Highlander - Neutral Survivor - Win
Basic #10-Town-Win
Sword of Truth-Town-Loss
LOTR II - Town-Loss
Indiana Jones - Town-Win
Manipulator - Town-Win
The Asphodel Meadows - Town-Win
Highlander - Neutral Survivor - Win
Who is that and what would me being him actually mean?
He seems more inclined to use any means necisary to find his target,i'm not saying everyone else dosn't scum hunt,i'mjust saying he's more agressive.
Like that scum are going for a quick mislynch.
I really, Really hope not.
Thanks To KrackShott
Old extendo moved
Your original post. You start off with a deliberate slur/misspelling of my name, which, while I'm used to it after a few games with kpaca, seems designed to irritate/annoy/throw me off the logical track and put me on an emotional tact. It felt like an attack right out of the box. You then mention my dislike of your fencesitting (which I still feel it was, btw), and "counter" with your question. When I first read it, I thought you were using it as your defense to fencesitting. Since you hadn't been casting your vote about, I figured that "B" was another player that you were trying to compare yourself favorably to, and that "A" was you. I read through your earlier posts, trying to find the question you asked that you already knew the answer to, and couldn't figure it out. I then turned my attention to what you were asking and realized that neither action, taken out of context, was particularly scummy.
I feared that you were waiting for me to answer one or the other (not really caring which), at which point you'd point out either how you exemplified the less scummy or how I exemplified the more scummy. It felt like a trick question, designed to paint you as town either way.
Of note, not only did jordman seem to read it a similar way, Archon Kamigawa in post #144 identified it as a "weak attack", and Toastboy in post #150 said it seemed like a trap question to get someone to give a bad answer, so I don't feel that my response was all that unusual. Moving on:
If you take into account the reasoning that I went through, outlined above, I came to the conclusion that you were being sneaky and scummy. I honestly thought that others would feel the same; the fact that more seasoned vets than there can be scum have dismissed your question as innocent obviously makes me question my outcome.
The bolded part still felt like lacing the trap with sugar. "I'm not talking about you, catnipmancer...it's no one in particular." I still felt that you would turn around and declare your innocence based on my response. I both explained how I felt it was loaded and addressed both, below:
I still feel that your post in #101 is questionable and borderline speculation. You still haven't answered my question, btw: Why do you think it unlikely that there are no actions or day investigations?
I still felt at this point that I was responding appropriately by not falling into your trap.
You clarified your question, and I felt like I answered it below. I understand why you find the delay suspicious, but remember that I was suspicious of you already when you started this volley, so I was proceding with caution.
I still don't see where you're going, but I'm sufficiently convinced that you care, and more than I would expect scum to.
So my question was "Are you asserting that I'm using that blanket statement to vote you?", and you respond with "No, you're voting me with a blanket statement."? What?
I'm sufficiently confused. I'm not unvoting you, at least not yet, because I still have suspicions. But I'm a lot less sure than when I started.
If that's true, kpaca should switch Malcolm-mode on more often. Malcolm pegged scum with his first vote in that game, and was more civil overall than I've ever seen kpaca. Just as cryptically brief, of course. (As a funny note, when I was reading through Malcolm's posts, I noticed the Hobbes avatar and thought, "maybe Malcolm is Calvin! What's Calvin trying to pull?", but then I realized that you were also in #10, and signing up to a game as your regular account and as a gimmick would be ridiculously heinous.)
Yeah, I sorta caught that. I'd like to know specifics as to why you think that.
Why?
The wagon is going fast and started on a weak argument which has just escelated.
Because Malcom was(we think) a gimmick account, now Kpaca isn't that but Malcom basicly contribueted nothing and only threw around random posts that got us no where.
Thanks To KrackShott
Old extendo moved
It seems pretty obvious to me that he was a gimmick account. His random posts accurately identified Cyouni as scum and AK, Calvin, and TB as town (of course he was wrong about Killerhamster). Those could have been lucky guesses, I suppose, but he seemed pretty confident (and accurate).