I know beyond any shadow of doubt that DYH's attack on me was insincere, and what's more, that he knew it was insincere when he made it. That's all I need to disregard it.
The real scum is Shad. His reasoning for backing off the WoD wagon is preposterous: "I was frustrated, so I responded by wanting to lynch a 99% confirmed townie, but now I that I cooled down I'm ok with him living since he can't vig anyone else." His immediate response was to name WoD as scum for killing a townie - as though every other vig in history didn't take down some townies - and then after that reflected badly on him, he tried to slink out of the spotlight, but not before fishing WoD just to make sure he didn't have to worry about being next on the menu.
I can't imagine how a mafia would claim one-shot vig and get away with it, so I think it's much more likely that he's the SK, will kill someone the town demands dead tonight, then try to make it to the endgame where he can win it all with the kill the remaining townies wouldn't think he has.
Let's not fall for this.
Why do you bring Shad into the conversation where you are supposed to be the topic?
I don't like the last line - it rings of fear mongering.
Why do you bring Shad into the conversation where you are supposed to be the topic?
I don't like the last line - it rings of fear mongering.
I'm only the topic for DYH and kpaca, DYH's attack on me is cobblers, and I'm always the topic for kpaca. I am hardly "bringing Shad into the conversation" when most of my last posts have been focused on how he is scum.
@PM: A "tough guy" has a daykill, doesn't he? Shad didn't say anything about that, and I think it's a bit of a stretch to have two one-shot daykillers in the same game. I would've said we direct him to use his "one-shot" kill tonight, then lynch him tomorrow, but he's clearly about to be lynched today instead which is a good start to this game.
He offered to provide them if necessary. That's not fishing. Furthermore, I didn't ask. I said I'd be willing to hear them. Third, I'd like to hear from SK before moving forward with a lynch.
Well, I still feel that Skander is the scummiest person at the moment. And I don't care how he acted in the other games. I haven't played too many games here and when I did play, it was a while ago. So, at least for now, playstyles mean mostly nothing to me.
Another person who has popped up on my scumdar is Cyan. The bandwagoning on Chris and then jumping onto Skander (without much of a reason, save for saying that Seppel had a good post against him) and then the other posts saying that he agrees with the Skander wagon, yet doesn't post any arguments of his own.
It seems to me that you were willing to take the name scouring as a valid reason for a vote. Along with the reaction to the reaction, that was good enough for me to vote.
Here's why I think Cyan is scummy. He was quick to jump on the Chris wagon. Then when it was pointed out that you were another wagon, he jumped on that. When he was asked to provide his own reasons, he said that he didn't need to restate them. I think that it's bussing. Seems to me that he is willing to jump on whatever wagon is going, doesn't matter who the wagon is on. Like I said before, there needs to be reasons for a vote. "I agree...blah, blah, blah...vote" is not a valid reason in my book.
He tries to wrap up Cyan and Skander in a nice scum package, but that all falls apart when WoD vengevigs Cyan. This is also coupled by my reread of Skander I just did - his recent posts are more like the Skander I remember. Whoever said that it took a bit for him to get going was right.
Wow?
What do you mean wow?
I want to know why he'd make such a risky claim. I said either SK or WoD was probably scum. Its apparent that person is SK.
If you look at Basic #6, you can see I was against letting Azrael have his say after being confirmed scum by the town cop. I'm not making that mistake again. For the record, Az was in fact scum and I was town.
This seems like a bad play this early, but I counterclaim.
I'm the Piper.
I'll post more detail (if necessary) tonight as this is interesting, but I'd rather keep my ability private.
Vote: Shadowknight
So... Either SK is lying about his name, which would require some major cajones, or you're scum pulling a huge gambit with more risk than reward, which would also require even more major cajones.
No offense to you, key, but I'm more inclined to believe that SK has enough cajones to pull his stunt, being that yours would require more.
Wtf. Cyan's one of the better analysts in this game, douchebag or not. This is petty and personally I feel like you should be lynched, though no one else does. Stupid, petty **** like this deserves to have consequences.
..... really now. your now proposing that he should be killed. killing likley townies is just as bad a play.
Personally I think keeperofzion is newb. Ignoring currently.
please read everyones posts. seriously no good to skip peoples posts.
SK's play doesn't seem bad to me, maybe because I somewhat sympathize with wanting WoD to hang. His backing off later is the only real thing I have issue with.
is it just me or is this post getting worse
Don't like this post. Paragraph one seems fake, especially the part at the end. Second paragraph is very ick. Trying to sound townie by supporting the "WoD is town, don't lynch for bad play" while having an "original reason" to pad it (and the reason is pretty bad and tries to explain someone elses actions).
UnVote, Vote mmod. didn;t like you earlier, and this is just awful.
Quote from the rest of the post »
[spoiler]I have no idea what people's (I think I counted around 5, so I'll address it) beef with my one post is. I felt weird reading Chris's posts. Not sure how that falls under craplogic, but w.e floats your boat. I said what I felt and kept my vote there since I didn't have much of a place to put it. I defended a bandwagonning accusation because why would I not defend myself when someone calls me scummy and there's a simple answer why it's not scummy. I reread him, still feel weird about his posts, but I find other people more scummy than that feeling now:
I find it highly suspicious how Bilbroxain voted me for defending a bandwagonning accusation and kept mentioning me even though really, there's no case on me (Seppel and others would argue otherwise, but w.e) and all he has is hot air, later adding a quip about keeperofzion (oppurtunistic) and now SK (with a comment I personally don't agree with).
I don't find SK that bad. His original posts i can agree with; the backing off later seemed worse, but I don't find it lynchworthy.
[spoiler]What, you mean like when Cyan daykilled Loran in like the 4th post of one game?
Or when he accused me of blatantly cheating at the end of Amistarian, with no evidence whatsoever?
Despite all that, he got Mafia Player of the Year. [spoiler=Shameless Campaigning]Vote Wrath_of_DoG for Mafia Player of the Year 2009, people!!!1![/spoiler]On a more serious note, the main reason I daykilled Cyan was because of his old pattern of pre-emptive OMGUS.
He's done this before as both town and mafia, and it almost always generates negativity and distraction. Just once, I actually had the power to cut it off before it happened.
As a general rule, as Town or Mafia, Cyan tends to lead the town to at least two, sometimes more than two mislynches, before the rest of the Town realize that he just arbitrarily picks targets and yells at them for the rest of the game.
Yeah, I guess you could say it's a bit personal.[/spoiler]
Hey WoD, could we get some content out of you that isn't Cyan/Daykill related.
Wow, I have been gone for 3 days and I had to catch up on 8 pages.
First off, I thought that Dragyn_Mage and SK were the same person, or at least that's what I read. If they are, then why is it that they both appear on the votecount?
[/FONT]
Secondly, I think that WOD's daykill was petty. But I agree with everyone else that a daykill would be too powerful to scum so I he is 99% town in my book. Even a 1-shot DK is too much for scum.
Thirdly, I really don't like the way that SK is handling the daykill. I also don't want WoD to claim. I know he said that he was a 1-shot but even that info is too much info for scum. And I agree that voting a very probably confirmed townie, even if they act anti-town is in fact anti-town. Unvote, Vote: Shadow Knight.
I've been more suspicious of Niv most of the game, but Niv's recent posts, while I have not been liking them, are less suspicious to me than Alx.
Not only did he start of the game tripping my scumdar, he hasn't posted since page 5. Scummy+Lurking= Unhappyfacesmiley
I think Seppel and CPE are both town, and we should listen to them.
i still don;t quite get what your case on me was to begin with. you could read some of my old games from a while back. or i'm pretty sure people in this thread will tell you this is how i play.
I said "Wow" because you basically assumed we were going to lynch Shadow. What do you think of Yodavader?
The Shadow lynch seems likely. Do you think his role is protown?
As for Yodavader, I agree that his unvote maneuver does seem to allow him to sneak back on the bandwagon later. I don't like it, but I'm not willing to call him scum just yet.
well, then, how, does he allreddy have a "recruit" on an actionless N1. and one in and of that is willing to Counterclaim the cultleader?
Woah woah woah! Where did I say anything about a recruit???
Here are things the way I see it.
1. WoD shoots Cyan (for petty reasons).
2. Shadow Knight doesn't like it and takes a fair amount of suspicion. Earns a bandwagon.
3. Shadow claims Piper.
4. Key of Destiny counterclaims Piper.
5. Shadow Knight gives flavor. I read the flavor to mean something akin to a cult leader.
If two people are claiming Piper and 1-shot vig. One or both are lying. Realistically, being a 1-shot vig doesn't sound like something a Piper would be doing.
Leading people astray sounds like something a cult leader would do. What does this tell us about Key of Destiny?
I think SK is scum. I think Key of Destiny may be a cult leader.
I should also point out that SK may be lying about being a 1-shot vig (hence why I think he's scum).
Claiming Piper may have been a random guess on his behalf... but Key of Destiny counterclaimed.
Leading astray sounds very much like a cult leader to me. I vote we lynch SK and pressure KoD.
I really feel uncomfortable voting for someone that may turn out to be a night-vig.
I'm not trying to game the mod, but as I said, Piper sounds like a cult leader.
I was perfectly content questioning MMoD, but I'd rather chase down someone who could pose a greater threat in the long run.
Either SK or KoD is hiding something. This much is certain.
I'm going to go ahead and believe Key here. It seems pretty clear to me SK just got caught in a bad claim--not only did he get counterclaimed, but if we're going off Led Zepplin, isn't the piper supposed to be leading us to reason, not killing people? And I take back my I told you so.
Unvote Vote: Shadow Knight
I don't know if nom is town or scum. But I'd like to point out this type of behavior is his standard modus operandi.
Court Mafia: Day 1, hatch plan to KILL EVERYONE ELSE IN A SINGLE NIGHT, when the plan only allows him to hit 11 random players, ATTEMPTS TO FIRE ANYHOW (Roleblocked).
In other words....Nom is an impulsive player who doesn't think about planning long-term or listening to others. I wouldn't be surprised if he was town. At all.
I don't know if nom is town or scum. But I'd like to point out this type of behavior is his standard modus operandi.
Court Mafia: Day 1, hatch plan to KILL EVERYONE ELSE IN A SINGLE NIGHT, when the plan only allows him to hit 11 random players, ATTEMPTS TO FIRE ANYHOW (Roleblocked).
In other words....Nom is an impulsive player who doesn't think about planning long-term or listening to others. I wouldn't be surprised if he was town. At all.
kpaca's right. Forget about the unvote bit which I actually read as being an unvote from random stage but the rest is correct - wrong reaction to the initial vote as well as avoiding confronting DYH by using the word "strange" which implies that although the attack is wrong the attacker is good.
Also the use of the eyebrow smiley in there bothers me for some reason.
unvote Vote Chris XIV.
That is where I found the reaction wrong. When I read the voting at the time, it all seemed to me as though it was a joke vote and Chris said
Still, to be accused of noticing details is a bit...strange.
because of DYH's accusation that he used a wrong spelling of his name to vote himself. You go and use that as a reason to vote because Chris didn't respond to DYH when I didn't see anything to respond to.
As for everyone else asking about my unvote, FoS: When SK claimed a PR, I tend to think that they can help the town by taking out scum. Of course, a rerun of WoD might happen where a townie gets killed instead. So I went with the notion that he could help the town more than hurt it. But the FoS was because he wasn't confirmed. Could it be a fake claim? Possible. That was the reason for the FoS. But now that we have a counterclaim, I am ready to reVote: Shadow Knight. I was not trying to give myself a backdoor back onto the wagon (though it does look like it). I was saying that SK could still be scum and with the counterclaim, I feel good about my vote.
@Seppel: I did believe that Cyan was a possible scum. He seemed like he was just jumping from wagon to wagon with no real reason for any of the jumps. When confronted for his reasons, he states that he didn't need to restate what was already said.
Shadow's reaction to WoD's kill does not fit his claim. Why not counter immediately if he's a town vig ? Why try to lynch him "for anti-town play" ? It makes no sense. Key's own counterclaim is the cherry on top. I think SK is the SK.
WoD has a 1-shot daykill and Shadow a night-kill?
How could he counter AFTER THE FACT? WoD made the kill without any type of hint/claim, then (instead of any content) proceeds to defend himself based upon play between Cyan and him in another game.
MMoD is okay with trying to lynch WoD and I don't see you commenting on that!
Key wants to keep his ability private. Does this not impact my suspicion he may be a cult leader?
It's a pretty safe assumption. Either he is scum, or Key is scum, or several players have the same rolename in this game. Assuming the third possibility is false, that leaves us with a 100% chance to hit scum either today or tomorrow if we lynch Shadow.
Under these conditions, why should we care about Yodavader ?
This right here makes me think you're scum defending Key, regardless of my cult leader suspicions. One less townie assures scum walk into Day 2 with nothing lost. I say we lynch Key. I highly doubt in doing so we'll lose a vig.
In other news, I disagree with a lot of Pale Mage's big post (372), and MTG_Junkie is strongly FoS-worthy.
I don't care for Pale Mage either because of the Chris wagon. Nor do I carry much love for Yodavader because he seems WAY behind on the times. But I tell you, your making me look like a suspect is crap. I'm not defending or condoning anyone save Niv at this point.
Nothing in my PM says anything about other Pipers. Also, I'm not sure where the cult leader talk came from. Why would I claim a killing role, if I was a cult leader? I'm really getting annoyed with the people who keep saying that my reaction to WoD's daykill doesn't fit with a vig. I'm not sure why anyone seems to think a SK would care who a dayvig kills as long as its not them. I saw someone with a more powerful version of my role waste it and got pissed. End of story.
I was voting you. I still suspect you. Shad and MMoD are worse. I also don't buy his claim and wouldn't be surprised to find that he is the actual SK.
I also don't need you, ZDS, to defend me. DYH has got nothing and I know it - it's incredibly disingenuous, for reasons I will be discussing later, for him to have tried that "and you were scum in all of those games" routine on me. If he wants to waste his vote, by all means, let him continue.
This is not a townie response. This is a caught scum pissed that he's in the spotlight for something he deems insignificant. Strawmanning the attack, as well (see below).
There's nothing DYH said that I need to respond to. What I posted was legitimate and has been done a hundred times by a hundred players, both scum and town. For him to extrapolate scum alignment out of "here's a post to remind you I'm still in the game, I don't want to get prodded" is pie-in-the-sky stuff and I simply don't have to bother with that kind of twilight zone speculation.
Look at all the charged language here. There's nothing about this post that even remotely screams townie. See above.
I know beyond any shadow of doubt that DYH's attack on me was insincere, and what's more, that he knew it was insincere when he made it. That's all I need to disregard it.
Then you don't read very well. There's nothing about my attack that's insincere. It has nothing to do with your alignments in previous games - you brought that up. It has everything to do with your fabricated excuse for why you posted the "sorry about my low activity" post. Then the audactity to call someone else on an image tell was laughable.
I'd be willing to lynch SK if Key just says that it's a counterclaim. If there's differences he should say them.
KoD was willing to give details. Before a (likely) SK lynch, I motion we hear them.
No, this is (again) not fishing. At least on my part. He offered, I partake.
But why would KoD tell everyone it was just a counterclaim?
Nothing in my PM says anything about other Pipers. Also, I'm not sure where the cult leader talk came from. Why would I claim a killing role, if I was a cult leader? I'm really getting annoyed with the people who keep saying that my reaction to WoD's daykill doesn't fit with a vig. I'm not sure why anyone seems to think a SK would care who a dayvig kills as long as its not them. I saw someone with a more powerful version of my role waste it and got pissed. End of story.
The cult leader talk is ridiculous.
You've not only claimed a killing role, but you've claimed killing flavor, as well. This is a good thing. It doesn't speak to your alignment, but it can possibly spare confusion later. About the bold...I still don't understand that as a reaction. A townie vig who sees someone else take a shot should be immediately suspicious. That's a natural reaction. The shot itself is tantamount to a claim. I'm suspicious that you weren't suspicious.
That said I'm against your wagon in spite of the counterclaim. We should use you as a second lynch today.
Then take it to the Mafia Council when this game is complete.
Obviously I don't feel it needs to be punished by the Council. This is an in-game matter. Emotions are part of mafia, if someones blinded by them, then next time someone will have a case to look back on and try not be blinded by them.
Why not?
I said I think he's just simply newb.
Well, he has a point. Aren't you going to dispute it?
"the post just gets worse", "this is just awful". I don't think he has a point, and he hasn't even said what his point is, so what's there to dispute? I mean sure, I say **** like that all the time, but when I do it, a fair number of other people think so too.
KoD was willing to give details. Before a (likely) SK lynch, I motion we hear them.
No, this is (again) not fishing. At least on my part. He offered, I partake.
But why would KoD tell everyone it was just a counterclaim?
MMoD, I'm pretty sure you're scum too.
Wtf have you not played mafia before? If he says its a counterclaim I'll vote. I don't need to hear details. If there's discrepancies we need to hear them.
I've rarely seen someone overreact this much, and this badly, as MTG_Junkie just now. Honestly, this is terrible.
- How does there being two claimed Pipers result in one of them being a possible Cult Leader ? I did read your posts, and all I see is highly convoluted flavour-based and rolename-based speculation.
- Why would vig-Shadow not reveal himself after WoD's kill ? What are the chance of there being two vigilantes in the game ? (well, apparently Shadow thought WoD was town, so that explains the lack of a counterclaim, but actually makes even less sense in the big picture).
- MMoD is not as scummy as Shadow, did not claim vig long after he should have, and was not counter-nameclaimed. They don't compare at all.
- How does Key's silence about his abilities imply anything about them ?
- Yes I'm defending Key, no I'm not scum and yes it regards your CL suspicions. No one deserves to not be defended against such complete ********.
- Of course we are not going to lose a vig if Key dies, he pretty much claimed he wasn't a vig.
- I'm not "making you look like a suspect", you are one.
First of all, I have a lot of time on my hands and I love playing Mafia (even if I suck). Hence, I will be responding quite a bit until I either a). fall asleep; or b). go to work.
1. The leading astray flavor made me think. Judging by the backlash, perhaps I'm wrong.
2. I'm not sure what you're saying here. Can you clarify?
3. I do not recall MMoD claiming. Also, you seem to be forgetting the other reasons I view him as scum.
4. Again, this goes back to my Piper = Cult Leader idea.
5. If the both of you are scum it does.
6. No, KoD only counterclaimed. Then said he'd like to keep his ability a secret. I'd keep mine too if I could draw people to my 'reason.'
7. A suspect of what? Why don't you tell everyone why you think I'm scummy? All I've done is try to sort out a huge vig and Piper mess. ****... if that's scummy, we're all doomed. As you said, if we all vote KoD, we won't lose a vig. I'd rather take a chance and lose a possible CL than lose a vig.
Wtf have you not played mafia before? If he says its a counterclaim I'll vote. I don't need to hear details. If there's discrepancies we need to hear them.
We don't need to hear discrepencies. It's clear Key is counterclaiming SK's name. There's nothing else we need to know about Key at the moment.
You've not only claimed a killing role, but you've claimed killing flavor, as well. This is a good thing. It doesn't speak to your alignment, but it can possibly spare confusion later. About the bold...I still don't understand that as a reaction. A townie vig who sees someone else take a shot should be immediately suspicious. That's a natural reaction. The shot itself is tantamount to a claim. I'm suspicious that you weren't suspicious.
I see it as Day and Night vig being weird. I still stand firm on WoD making a bad play in killing Cyan over a petty reason.
Obviously I don't feel it needs to be punished by the Council. This is an in-game matter. Emotions are part of mafia, if someones blinded by them, then next time someone will have a case to look back on and try not be blinded by them.
No, just no. Play the game as it happened and take it up with the council later. Lynching a nearly confirmed pro-town role is just stupid. He's still useful to the town.
"the post just gets worse", "this is just awful". I don't think he has a point, and he hasn't even said what his point is, so what's there to dispute? I mean sure, I say **** like that all the time, but when I do it, a fair number of other people think so too.
No, he was commenting on your scummy posts. You're taking it out of context here.
Wtf have you not played mafia before? If he says its a counterclaim I'll vote. I don't need to hear details. If there's discrepancies we need to hear them.
Yes, I've played Mafia before. On sites aside from this and 'Mafiascum.'
I think you're voting because a scumbuddy is, due to said counterclaim.
Shadow's claim makes perfect sense for his behavior.
Pale Mage and Kpaca (wow) bring up good points against them on this page. Not so sure about the Zindabad ones (need to see him post more).
I'd like to see Yodavader and Keeperofzion die (and what luck, we have a vig!).
Keeperofzion for fencesitting on an issue that needed no fencesitting ("Is WoD a good guy for being able to daykill, or is he not because of dk'ing a townie?")
Yodavader for unvoting yet FoSing WoD. Kpaca puts it best as an excuse to be able to jump back on the wagon, when, if Yodavader was smart, would know the wagon would never come to fruition. He's hoping they don't have to waste a kill on a 99% confirmed townie.
It's like they were trying to keep the WoD issue nagging in the back of people's minds, but failed. Horribly.
Unvote: Vote Yodavader since I can only choose one of them.
This has already been established, but Yodavader did not FoS WoD, he FoSed SK.
Shadow Knight claims Vig when there's already a Vig?
Shadow Knight claims Piper when there's already a Piper?
Very bizarre.
However I'm too distracted by Yodavader. With Cyan turning up town, these posts look even worse than they did before:
He tries to wrap up Cyan and Skander in a nice scum package, but that all falls apart when WoD vengevigs Cyan. This is also coupled by my reread of Skander I just did - his recent posts are more like the Skander I remember. Whoever said that it took a bit for him to get going was right.
Seems WoD's passion actually helped!
Vote on Yodavader stands.
My initial read on Yodavader was townish because he opened the door to argument with Cyan, which is not something I would expect of a lesser-known player as scum to do. However, it's apparent in reading through his posts that he's not really familiar with Cyan and his playstyle (the comment about his vote-swapping without establishing reason, so that read is moot.
He has a number of wishy-washy posts that bother me quite a bit, especially his explanation around the jump from Vote to FoS back to Vote, and he's definitely on my watch list.
* * *
Shadow Knight's claim is simply too convenient.
Look, Cyan turns up dead as "The Lady", which I am assuming is a reference to Stairway to Heaven, and SK claims another figure from the same song (lowered chance of running into a counter-claim). Then, he claims a 'safer' role in a one-shot vig (rather than a full, again lower chance of being outright counter-claimed). And lastly, he claims no additional information when he does reveal his role (no flavor, the only comment being that he "didn't want to claim"). Leading people away as a kill method? Bleh.
As much as it pains me to move my vote off Zindabad, who I do think is scum and the fact he's selling Shadowknight as the SK as opposed to mafia is not lost on me, either; ShadowKnight needs to die.
The likely hood of a cult is possible but I don't think that it is probable.
As far as my Vote to FoS to Vote goes, here is my explanation (again). I originally thought SK was scum for how he dealt with the WoD DK on Cyan. When he claimed, I unvoted/FoSed because he claimed a power role (that could be helpful to town) but it was not proven. Then when he got counter (name)claimed, I revoted. The chances of having 2 people with the same name is very unlikely. I don't think that it's a very wise move for KoD (if he is scum) to counterclaim this early in the game. So suspicion falls back on SK. If SK gets lynched and turns out town, then suspicion falls on KoD for the counterclaim. If SK gets lynched and turns out scum, then that pretty much clears KoD.
This is assuming I know anything at all about Led Zepplin, but ok. I've got nothing else to give you guys. All I know is that when I turn up town, KoD had better be the next lynch, followed by whoever offered up the flotsom of "there could be more than one piper."
No, just no. Play the game as it happened and take it up with the council later. Lynching a nearly confirmed pro-town role is just stupid. He's still useful to the town.
I disagree? Wtf more do you expect. I mean really, I put out my opinion, if you disagree fine, stop bringing it up, vote me for it, w.e; but I'm not going to argue on this when we disagree and I've said all I need to for it.
He's still playing, right? Players, not statistics. No one will ever become a player like your glorious self if you continue to 'ignore' them, ass.
WTF is wrong with you; are you trying to make this personal? I'm reading his posts, I'm ignoring his wagon BECAUSE I DON'T THINK ITS SCUMMY, I THINK ITS NEWB. If you have a problem with me thinking someones newb and that his posts are indicative of that and not newb, then I can't help you there. I don't care if people call me an ass because I am an ass, I give a **** when you call me an ass for no reason.
No, he was commenting on your scummy posts. You're taking it out of context here.
YES HE WAS COMMENTING ON MY POSTS THAT'S EXACTLY WHAT I'M SAYING?!?!?!??!?!?!?!?!?!
Yes, I've played Mafia before. On sites aside from this and 'Mafiascum.'
I think you're voting because a scumbuddy is, due to said counterclaim.
So you're saying I'm voting, or planning on voting SK, because I am scumbuddies with KeyofDestiny? Who you actually think may be the cult leader right?
WTF is this cantripmancer2.0? (It's rhetorical don't answer MTGJ)
This is assuming I know anything at all about Led Zepplin, but ok. I've got nothing else to give you guys. All I know is that when I turn up town, KoD had better be the next lynch, followed by whoever offered up the flotsom of "there could be more than one piper."
If there is one song by Led Zepplin I would expect 99.99% of the population to know anything about, it's Stairway to Heaven.
There are a multitude of games that would like to point out to you that identical rolenames can and do exist. In this case, however, I think you simply took a shot at a feasible role name based on what Cyan turned up as and built a claim upon it.
As much as it pains me to move my vote off Zindabad, who I do think is scum and the fact he's selling Shadowknight as the SK as opposed to mafia is not lost on me, either; ShadowKnight needs to die.
Unvote, Vote: ShadowKnight
I'm just looking at his claim logically. He's not going to claim one-shot vig and think he's not going to get called on to prove it. So he's going to have to come up with a kill from somewhere. That indicates either what PM called a "tough guy" which I have never played with and which I understand to have a daykill anyway, so it'd be hard for him to explain that one away, or the SK. I think the latter is more likely, especially having played with Shad as mafia lately.
FTR, ignore all the flotsam floating around the thread about cults. All of it is useless trash speculation. We have a counterclaimed scum, day 1, lynch him.
I actually think that, before we lynch (if we haven't hit it already), we need to think about the dragyn_mage thing. Being that we actually want to lynch Shadow Knight, I'm trying
Unvote, Vote: dragyn_mage
Sorry to be a pest, but could we get a votecount, mod?
I know that people are saying SK used to be dragyn_mage, but I honestly don't know what that means in the context of the game. Does dragyn_mage vote with SK, because SK doesn't have his own vote up there anywhere? I apologize if we already had this conversation and I skimmed over it, but I don't recall it.
FTR, there is so much trash floating around in the thread right now it's ridiculous. Focus on the issues at hand, which are the counter-claim and the dragyn_mage thing. Until that happens, there is no logical reason that we should even think about lynching someone else.
MTGS stats (won/played)
As scum - 3/5
As town - 5/7
As neutral - none
(I really have been scum a lot)
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because Cults tend to be rarely used in the making of mafia games the only game on this site that I know of that had a true cult (not a townie cult, ala tales of the fantastic) would be final fantasy VII mafia. I don't know why they aren't widely used, but it's probably because they can get ******** really quickly. Also, normally people don't think about cults until a dead cultist turns up.
I see it as Day and Night vig being weird. I still stand firm on WoD making a bad play in killing Cyan over a petty reason.
Now this is interesting. a night vig and a day vig, both one shots. I actually didn't think of that.
I don't like this line. I'll tell people why Day 2.
i'm sure you could tell us now.
For the last time, he offered details. I'm asking for that reason alone. Pale Mage, are you in on this with MMoD?
Nothing wrong with this, but we really don't need the details, and it does make you look like you're fishing.
I'm just looking at his claim logically. He's not going to claim one-shot vig and think he's not going to get called on to prove it. So he's going to have to come up with a kill from somewhere. That indicates either what PM called a "tough guy" which I have never played with and which I understand to have a daykill anyway, so it'd be hard for him to explain that one away, or the SK. I think the latter is more likely, especially having played with Shad as mafia lately.
From my research, a tough guy is a mafia member who can perform his own night kill, but only when he's not performing the normal mafia kill. So he could still explain it that way.
13 to lynch
cpe - 1 andelijah
zindabad - 1 Disrupt your Hymn
keeperofzion - 2 ChrisXIV, Pale Mage
dragyn_mage - 7 Alx2, Niv, keeperofzion, zindabad, ZDS, keyofdestiny, kpaca
Bilbroxian - 1 mmod
yodavader - 1 Zeppel
Alx2 - 1 Nom_Anor
Not Voting:MTG Junkie, Skander, WoD, dragyn_mage, Infinis, jerubbaal, cpe, yodavader, Bilbroxian
Yes
<XylBot> ||| MAFIABOT || sk: LookingforReality (Copycat) |||
<XylBot> ||| MAFIABOT || survivor: matjoeman (Anarchist) |||
<XylBot> ||| MAFIABOT || town: kops (Anarchist) |||
Mafia stats
What? I've posted plenty of content in the few posts I have.
The plot thickens...
I'd be willing to hear your details, but I'm inclined to hear SK's response first.
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Why do you bring Shad into the conversation where you are supposed to be the topic?
I don't like the last line - it rings of fear mongering.
Interesting.
Vote Shadow Knight.
Why do you need his details? Fishing much?
I'm only the topic for DYH and kpaca, DYH's attack on me is cobblers, and I'm always the topic for kpaca. I am hardly "bringing Shad into the conversation" when most of my last posts have been focused on how he is scum.
@PM: A "tough guy" has a daykill, doesn't he? Shad didn't say anything about that, and I think it's a bit of a stretch to have two one-shot daykillers in the same game. I would've said we direct him to use his "one-shot" kill tonight, then lynch him tomorrow, but he's clearly about to be lynched today instead which is a good start to this game.
"...a talisman against all evil, so long as you obey me."
He offered to provide them if necessary. That's not fishing. Furthermore, I didn't ask. I said I'd be willing to hear them. Third, I'd like to hear from SK before moving forward with a lynch.
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Shadow Knight claims Piper when there's already a Piper?
Very bizarre.
However I'm too distracted by Yodavader. With Cyan turning up town, these posts look even worse than they did before:
He tries to wrap up Cyan and Skander in a nice scum package, but that all falls apart when WoD vengevigs Cyan. This is also coupled by my reread of Skander I just did - his recent posts are more like the Skander I remember. Whoever said that it took a bit for him to get going was right.
Seems WoD's passion actually helped!
Vote on Yodavader stands.
Wow.
What do you mean wow?
I want to know why he'd make such a risky claim. I said either SK or WoD was probably scum. Its apparent that person is SK.
If you look at Basic #6, you can see I was against letting Azrael have his say after being confirmed scum by the town cop. I'm not making that mistake again. For the record, Az was in fact scum and I was town.
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So... Either SK is lying about his name, which would require some major cajones, or you're scum pulling a huge gambit with more risk than reward, which would also require even more major cajones.
No offense to you, key, but I'm more inclined to believe that SK has enough cajones to pull his stunt, being that yours would require more.
Vote Shadow Knight
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I don't know what you're playing at, but my flavor is that I'm the piper and I can lead one person away ala the pied piper.
..... really now. your now proposing that he should be killed. killing likley townies is just as bad a play.
please read everyones posts. seriously no good to skip peoples posts.
is it just me or is this post getting worse
UnVote, Vote mmod. didn;t like you earlier, and this is just awful.
someone dosen't know what the probation list is for.
Hey WoD, could we get some content out of you that isn't Cyan/Daykill related.
FoS YV
Opertunisim i belive is the word. ready to jumb back on at any moment
i still don;t quite get what your case on me was to begin with. you could read some of my old games from a while back. or i'm pretty sure people in this thread will tell you this is how i play.
actually, he didn't explain "why I'm scummy" he just said it.
I have a good feeling this is big brother all over again. WoD is probabaly the piper as well here.
so much more likley that this is big brother-esq. not really much of a counterclaim.
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Anyway...
@Anyone not convinced that Yodavader is scum: Raise your hand and explain why not.
Regardless, it doesn't sound like a pro-town role.
Vote: Shadow Knight
FOS: Key of Destiny
@Niv: Glad I'm not the only one thinking MMoD is acting funny.
@Seppel: Please tell me what you meant when you quoted me and said, "Wow".
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The Shadow lynch seems likely. Do you think his role is protown?
As for Yodavader, I agree that his unvote maneuver does seem to allow him to sneak back on the bandwagon later. I don't like it, but I'm not willing to call him scum just yet.
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1 shot vig is not a town role, when did this happen?
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Piper doesn't sound like a pro-town role.
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Well, gaming the flavor much? is this just your gut that is gaiming the mod here or is there more to this?
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The way I read his flavor sounds like a cult leader.
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Woah woah woah! Where did I say anything about a recruit???
Here are things the way I see it.
1. WoD shoots Cyan (for petty reasons).
2. Shadow Knight doesn't like it and takes a fair amount of suspicion. Earns a bandwagon.
3. Shadow claims Piper.
4. Key of Destiny counterclaims Piper.
5. Shadow Knight gives flavor. I read the flavor to mean something akin to a cult leader.
If two people are claiming Piper and 1-shot vig. One or both are lying. Realistically, being a 1-shot vig doesn't sound like something a Piper would be doing.
Leading people astray sounds like something a cult leader would do. What does this tell us about Key of Destiny?
I think SK is scum. I think Key of Destiny may be a cult leader.
Does this clear things up?
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Claiming Piper may have been a random guess on his behalf... but Key of Destiny counterclaimed.
Leading astray sounds very much like a cult leader to me. I vote we lynch SK and pressure KoD.
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Unvote
I really feel uncomfortable voting for someone that may turn out to be a night-vig.
I'm not trying to game the mod, but as I said, Piper sounds like a cult leader.
I was perfectly content questioning MMoD, but I'd rather chase down someone who could pose a greater threat in the long run.
Either SK or KoD is hiding something. This much is certain.
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Unvote
Vote: Shadow Knight
But WoD, you're forgetting only SK has claimed vig. Key didn't claim any abilities.
That's the thing that's bugging me.
Who says KoD is a vig?
Three vigs? I doubt it.
Too many questions are being raised here, and I think we need to consider the implications.
I don't think KoD is a vig, and I'm leaning scum on SK. I just don't want to vote in case SK just made some dumb moves and really is a night-vig.
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Yes, to me, it seemed that you were using that as a reason to vote.
That is where I found the reaction wrong. When I read the voting at the time, it all seemed to me as though it was a joke vote and Chris said
because of DYH's accusation that he used a wrong spelling of his name to vote himself. You go and use that as a reason to vote because Chris didn't respond to DYH when I didn't see anything to respond to.
As for everyone else asking about my unvote, FoS: When SK claimed a PR, I tend to think that they can help the town by taking out scum. Of course, a rerun of WoD might happen where a townie gets killed instead. So I went with the notion that he could help the town more than hurt it. But the FoS was because he wasn't confirmed. Could it be a fake claim? Possible. That was the reason for the FoS. But now that we have a counterclaim, I am ready to reVote: Shadow Knight. I was not trying to give myself a backdoor back onto the wagon (though it does look like it). I was saying that SK could still be scum and with the counterclaim, I feel good about my vote.
@Seppel: I did believe that Cyan was a possible scum. He seemed like he was just jumping from wagon to wagon with no real reason for any of the jumps. When confronted for his reasons, he states that he didn't need to restate what was already said.
No, the fact there are two possible Pipers combined with Shadow Knight's flavor.
Please, read my posts instead of jumping to assumptions.
WoD has a 1-shot daykill and Shadow a night-kill?
How could he counter AFTER THE FACT? WoD made the kill without any type of hint/claim, then (instead of any content) proceeds to defend himself based upon play between Cyan and him in another game.
MMoD is okay with trying to lynch WoD and I don't see you commenting on that!
Key wants to keep his ability private. Does this not impact my suspicion he may be a cult leader?
This right here makes me think you're scum defending Key, regardless of my cult leader suspicions. One less townie assures scum walk into Day 2 with nothing lost. I say we lynch Key. I highly doubt in doing so we'll lose a vig.
Vote: KeyofDestiny
I don't care for Pale Mage either because of the Chris wagon. Nor do I carry much love for Yodavader because he seems WAY behind on the times. But I tell you, your making me look like a suspect is crap. I'm not defending or condoning anyone save Niv at this point.
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I'm reading people's post, ignore means I'm not going to pursue him.
lolk.
I don't care for MTGJ's absurd idea.
I'd be willing to lynch SK if Key just says that it's a counterclaim. If there's differences he should say them.
This is not a townie response. This is a caught scum pissed that he's in the spotlight for something he deems insignificant. Strawmanning the attack, as well (see below).
Look at all the charged language here. There's nothing about this post that even remotely screams townie. See above.
Then you don't read very well. There's nothing about my attack that's insincere. It has nothing to do with your alignments in previous games - you brought that up. It has everything to do with your fabricated excuse for why you posted the "sorry about my low activity" post. Then the audactity to call someone else on an image tell was laughable.
I'll get back to this in a minute; I have several conference calls coming up.
V/LA: 3/21-3/24 & 3/27-3/29
Then take it to the Mafia Council when this game is complete.
Why not?
Well, he has a point. Aren't you going to dispute it?
KoD was willing to give details. Before a (likely) SK lynch, I motion we hear them.
No, this is (again) not fishing. At least on my part. He offered, I partake.
But why would KoD tell everyone it was just a counterclaim?
MMoD, I'm pretty sure you're scum too.
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The cult leader talk is ridiculous.
You've not only claimed a killing role, but you've claimed killing flavor, as well. This is a good thing. It doesn't speak to your alignment, but it can possibly spare confusion later. About the bold...I still don't understand that as a reaction. A townie vig who sees someone else take a shot should be immediately suspicious. That's a natural reaction. The shot itself is tantamount to a claim. I'm suspicious that you weren't suspicious.
That said I'm against your wagon in spite of the counterclaim. We should use you as a second lynch today.
I said I think he's just simply newb.
"the post just gets worse", "this is just awful". I don't think he has a point, and he hasn't even said what his point is, so what's there to dispute? I mean sure, I say **** like that all the time, but when I do it, a fair number of other people think so too.
Wtf have you not played mafia before? If he says its a counterclaim I'll vote. I don't need to hear details. If there's discrepancies we need to hear them.
First of all, I have a lot of time on my hands and I love playing Mafia (even if I suck). Hence, I will be responding quite a bit until I either a). fall asleep; or b). go to work.
1. The leading astray flavor made me think. Judging by the backlash, perhaps I'm wrong.
2. I'm not sure what you're saying here. Can you clarify?
3. I do not recall MMoD claiming. Also, you seem to be forgetting the other reasons I view him as scum.
4. Again, this goes back to my Piper = Cult Leader idea.
5. If the both of you are scum it does.
6. No, KoD only counterclaimed. Then said he'd like to keep his ability a secret. I'd keep mine too if I could draw people to my 'reason.'
7. A suspect of what? Why don't you tell everyone why you think I'm scummy? All I've done is try to sort out a huge vig and Piper mess. ****... if that's scummy, we're all doomed. As you said, if we all vote KoD, we won't lose a vig. I'd rather take a chance and lose a possible CL than lose a vig.
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We don't need to hear discrepencies. It's clear Key is counterclaiming SK's name. There's nothing else we need to know about Key at the moment.
I'm not completely convinced he is. I'm about 80% sure he is, so I wouldn't be surprised if he was. However, I'm 99% sure that SK is scum.
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Also, all this stuff with MTG_J is ridiculous. That is all.
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I'm really liking a scum team of you, SK, yodavader, and maybe zindabad right now.
Why? And this question is directed at everyone.
I see it as Day and Night vig being weird. I still stand firm on WoD making a bad play in killing Cyan over a petty reason.
I don't like this line. I'll tell people why Day 2.
No, just no. Play the game as it happened and take it up with the council later. Lynching a nearly confirmed pro-town role is just stupid. He's still useful to the town.
He's still playing, right? Players, not statistics. No one will ever become a player like your glorious self if you continue to 'ignore' them, ass.
No, he was commenting on your scummy posts. You're taking it out of context here.
Yes, I've played Mafia before. On sites aside from this and 'Mafiascum.'
I think you're voting because a scumbuddy is, due to said counterclaim.
For the last time, he offered details. I'm asking for that reason alone. Pale Mage, are you in on this with MMoD?
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This has already been established, but Yodavader did not FoS WoD, he FoSed SK.
My initial read on Yodavader was townish because he opened the door to argument with Cyan, which is not something I would expect of a lesser-known player as scum to do. However, it's apparent in reading through his posts that he's not really familiar with Cyan and his playstyle (the comment about his vote-swapping without establishing reason, so that read is moot.
He has a number of wishy-washy posts that bother me quite a bit, especially his explanation around the jump from Vote to FoS back to Vote, and he's definitely on my watch list.
* * *
Shadow Knight's claim is simply too convenient.
Look, Cyan turns up dead as "The Lady", which I am assuming is a reference to Stairway to Heaven, and SK claims another figure from the same song (lowered chance of running into a counter-claim). Then, he claims a 'safer' role in a one-shot vig (rather than a full, again lower chance of being outright counter-claimed). And lastly, he claims no additional information when he does reveal his role (no flavor, the only comment being that he "didn't want to claim"). Leading people away as a kill method? Bleh.
As much as it pains me to move my vote off Zindabad, who I do think is scum and the fact he's selling Shadowknight as the SK as opposed to mafia is not lost on me, either; ShadowKnight needs to die.
Unvote, Vote: ShadowKnight
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The likely hood of a cult is possible but I don't think that it is probable.
As far as my Vote to FoS to Vote goes, here is my explanation (again). I originally thought SK was scum for how he dealt with the WoD DK on Cyan. When he claimed, I unvoted/FoSed because he claimed a power role (that could be helpful to town) but it was not proven. Then when he got counter (name)claimed, I revoted. The chances of having 2 people with the same name is very unlikely. I don't think that it's a very wise move for KoD (if he is scum) to counterclaim this early in the game. So suspicion falls back on SK. If SK gets lynched and turns out town, then suspicion falls on KoD for the counterclaim. If SK gets lynched and turns out scum, then that pretty much clears KoD.
WTF is wrong with you; are you trying to make this personal? I'm reading his posts, I'm ignoring his wagon BECAUSE I DON'T THINK ITS SCUMMY, I THINK ITS NEWB. If you have a problem with me thinking someones newb and that his posts are indicative of that and not newb, then I can't help you there. I don't care if people call me an ass because I am an ass, I give a **** when you call me an ass for no reason.
YES HE WAS COMMENTING ON MY POSTS THAT'S EXACTLY WHAT I'M SAYING?!?!?!??!?!?!?!?!?!
So you're saying I'm voting, or planning on voting SK, because I am scumbuddies with KeyofDestiny? Who you actually think may be the cult leader right?
WTF is this cantripmancer2.0? (It's rhetorical don't answer MTGJ)
If there is one song by Led Zepplin I would expect 99.99% of the population to know anything about, it's Stairway to Heaven.
There are a multitude of games that would like to point out to you that identical rolenames can and do exist. In this case, however, I think you simply took a shot at a feasible role name based on what Cyan turned up as and built a claim upon it.
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I'm just looking at his claim logically. He's not going to claim one-shot vig and think he's not going to get called on to prove it. So he's going to have to come up with a kill from somewhere. That indicates either what PM called a "tough guy" which I have never played with and which I understand to have a daykill anyway, so it'd be hard for him to explain that one away, or the SK. I think the latter is more likely, especially having played with Shad as mafia lately.
"...a talisman against all evil, so long as you obey me."
I actually think that, before we lynch (if we haven't hit it already), we need to think about the dragyn_mage thing. Being that we actually want to lynch Shadow Knight, I'm trying
Unvote, Vote: dragyn_mage
Sorry to be a pest, but could we get a votecount, mod?
I know that people are saying SK used to be dragyn_mage, but I honestly don't know what that means in the context of the game. Does dragyn_mage vote with SK, because SK doesn't have his own vote up there anywhere? I apologize if we already had this conversation and I skimmed over it, but I don't recall it.
FTR, there is so much trash floating around in the thread right now it's ridiculous. Focus on the issues at hand, which are the counter-claim and the dragyn_mage thing. Until that happens, there is no logical reason that we should even think about lynching someone else.
MTGS stats (won/played)
As scum - 3/5
As town - 5/7
As neutral - none
(I really have been scum a lot)
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because Cults tend to be rarely used in the making of mafia games the only game on this site that I know of that had a true cult (not a townie cult, ala tales of the fantastic) would be final fantasy VII mafia. I don't know why they aren't widely used, but it's probably because they can get ******** really quickly. Also, normally people don't think about cults until a dead cultist turns up.
Now this is interesting. a night vig and a day vig, both one shots. I actually didn't think of that.
i'm sure you could tell us now.
Nothing wrong with this, but we really don't need the details, and it does make you look like you're fishing.
Funny. And I've actually had the feeling of you on that same scum team. Where have we seen this before?
From my research, a tough guy is a mafia member who can perform his own night kill, but only when he's not performing the normal mafia kill. So he could still explain it that way.
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