I basically wanted to know whether or not you thought he was a scum rolecop. I knew those existed, but I don't know how often they come up. If you'd said something along the lines of "he didn't, he pulled a gambit" blah blah I would've voted you on the spot.
Also, this part about D_V's doctoring ability is intriguing...either way we have some time to think about this because the lynch threshold is at 4 votes right now, and I doubt we're going to get the scum to vote for himself
I basically wanted to know whether or not you thought he was a scum rolecop. I knew those existed, but I don't know how often they come up. If you'd said something along the lines of "he didn't, he pulled a gambit" blah blah I would've voted you on the spot.
Also, this part about D_V's doctoring ability is intriguing...either way we have some time to think about this because the lynch threshold is at 4 votes right now, and I doubt we're going to get the scum to vote for himself
What is the likelyhood that you're going to vote for me if you had to break it down into percentage points. This is an important question.
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Anyway what I'm saying is this, the NK is just a submitted action, not an action that is targeting. If it was, based on the flavor of this game, all scum would likely have something to the effect of : Perform the NK on target player, you may not use this ability if another scum has used this ability tonight (roughly worded, but something like that).
Now you're just making arguments to save your bacon.
Scum wouldn't each have an independent ability that is the nightkill - they would most likely have factional ability like any other game. Each mafia member doesn't get "Nightkill: You can kill a player each night." Almost always, it's "Mafia, you get to choose one person to kill a player each night."
Quote from kpaca »
Step up for != not commenting on alignment.
Also this isn't lylo. If/when I am lynched iLord will still have to correctly decide between shooting the doc or you, and DV will have to pick one. It's really a toss up at that point.
As for how iLord know D_V was doc- Simple. iLord has an ability that allows him to obtain the abilites of a player he targets at night. He is in effect, a scum rolecop.
Before you vote me one way or the other, how exactly was that swayable material. I'd just like to know. I mean it's obvious from my point of view that D_V is indeed the doc, because if D_V was scum, then iLord knowing he was doc wouldn't make sense. I know you are town because you're not lying about your ability. Which leaves me with good ole iLord.
In order for me to be scum, the scum nightkill would have to not be an action (which is impossible because there's a tracker in this game). If it doesn't count as an action then, something that the scumteam sends in together, then why did I just randomly choose to not target you in addition to my kill?
Quote from kpaca »
I skipped over that because it is set-up speculation and a moot point.
It's not a moot point - my point is that games with watchers and trackers simply do not have the scum nightkill as an untrackable action. I've read/played quite a bit of games and I've never seen it, and you know that you've never either.
Kpaca is completely obviously scum. Greymon, is there anyone of these points that doesn't appear damning to you?
Possibly, but it will be difficult since they are based on a set-up lie we both know to be true, but I will indeed answer them after I get answers from DV/greymon.
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Possibly, but it will be difficult since they are based on a set-up lie we both know to be true, but I will indeed answer them after I get answers from DV/greymon.
If you believe it to be true, then why would it be difficult to argue your side? In fact, according to you, I know it's true as well, so wouldn't it be more difficult for me to argue against what I know, rather than you argue for what you know?
I can wait though, but I'm afraid I don't see the value in your question.
If you are town, then the last scum has to be greymon.
D_V, if kpaca flips town, choose between protecting me and yourself tonight, to reduce the chance that the scum can win. If you protect the kill, we can still lynch greymon tomorrow.
If all goes well, however, that shouldn't be needed.
If you are town, then the last scum has to be greymon.
D_V, if kpaca flips town, choose between protecting me and yourself tonight, to reduce the chance that the scum can win. If you protect the kill, we can still lynch greymon tomorrow.
If all goes well, however, that shouldn't be needed.
Really doesn't matter, I'm lynched, and as such have no reason to lie. I'm town. I am the watcher, the results are what they said they were. Greymon isn't town, you're lying, which will be confirmed upon my death. You better hope you pick the right target scum.
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Really doesn't matter, I'm lynched, and as such have no reason to lie. I'm town. I am the watcher, the results are what they said they were. Greymon isn't town, you're lying, which will be confirmed upon my death. You better hope you pick the right target scum.
If we assume that you didn't lie, then I can only assume that greymon's ability had some hidden perks (such as messing with your results at a crucial moment).
I can't be scum because you confirmed me as not targeting anyone in a game with a tracker. Additionally, if you say that the mafia kill is not a standard ability, then why didn't I use my real ability in addition to it?
D_V, don't listen to kpaca - his logic doesn't make sense.
I still hope that you're just screwing with us right now.
Honestly, I'm not. You will be lynched tomorrow if there is a tomorrow, I'm confidant in that.
The fact that you have to keep trying to cover your ass and say "DV, zomg don't listen to him" is quite telling in my opinion. And if greymon's ability tampered with my results I would have know when I targeted Wuffles. Face it, it's obvious that the scum NK isn't a targetable abilty (which you already know), and this will be taken care of tomorrow.
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The fact that you have to keep trying to cover your ass and say "DV, zomg don't listen to him" is quite telling in my opinion. And if greymon's ability tampered with my results I would have know when I targeted Wuffles. Face it, it's obvious that the scum NK isn't a targetable abilty (which you already know), and this will be taken care of tomorrow.
You still haven't explained why I would just not use my rolecop ability if the scum nightkill isn't a normal ability.
Greymon's ability could easily be directable - greymon could choose when to use it. Obviously, in such a scenario, withholding using the ability is devastating to the town, and may result in our loss if D_V doesn't believe me and listens to you.
I really don't see any point in you lying anymore (any fun you would've gotten out of this is over), so I'm thinking that greymon has to be the last scum.
I thought that my role granted me NK immunity and so I played it as such - dropping some hints and stuff that I had a power role. Unfortunately it didn't work exactly as planned.
iLord definitely gets the mafia MVP, good all around behavior.
I'm very sad the multivoter died early. Zasz and i talked a bit about that role, and originally the maximum votes it could get was not capped at 3.
And then it died before it got any votes. Sigh. FAIL.
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Mafia MVP Harry Potter Mafia!
Logical Reasoning is dead; Long Live Stupidity
Quote from Seppel »
I love Joboman, Poggy, Niv, and Vezok, because, while they may not be the best players, they still try to win. Having fun is the most important thing to a game, but I've learned that if you don't try to win, then you're ruining everyone else's fun.
Town LVP here for not trusting kpaca...and sneaky I might add that the possibility of the other amrou being mafia was brought up a couple times and yet they were both town, nice touch
Man I was laughing like crazy once i realized why iLord chose to claim role cop. Great work taking the chance killing Wuffles. Good job for saving this. I thought we were sorta screwed once Wuffles NK'ed me, but I suppose it worked out like we thought hahahahahaha. Good thing DV protected himself.
I'm surprised no one else realized that DV was the doctor. With the crazy hints he kept dropping day 1 I thought for sure Wuffles would've realized it, and thought that kpaca realized it too, which would've made iLord's claim much less strong.
First, I'm amused that the mafia KNEW essentially that DV was the doc the entire game and never shot him.
Second, whoever's plan it was to vig vanillas was retarded. Reduced iLord's needed survival by a day in a game the town was pretty ahead in.
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Logical Reasoning is dead; Long Live Stupidity
Quote from Seppel »
I love Joboman, Poggy, Niv, and Vezok, because, while they may not be the best players, they still try to win. Having fun is the most important thing to a game, but I've learned that if you don't try to win, then you're ruining everyone else's fun.
There were higher priority targets. DV was sort of a distraction basically, and us putting him on the our town sides gave us a better view once he died (if he did). We could shoot around since we could figure out basically who he was not going to protect.
I'm surprised no one else realized that DV was the doctor. With the crazy hints he kept dropping day 1 I thought for sure Wuffles would've realized it, and thought that kpaca realized it too, which would've made iLord's claim much less strong.
I realized that he was the doc pretty early after Wuffles made a whole big deal of him knowing that AE was lying. iLord hinted too much that he knew about it (before he claimed) but I thought that was just him being careless town not scum setting up a falseclaim.
Did you guys think that I had a good role?
EDIT: By that I mean, did you mafia people kill me because you thought I had a power role?
Damnit I was played like a friggin' flute...and I was thinkin I was getting better at this game....
This does not make me feel good at all...
If it makes you feel better I had a solid town read on you the whole game. Up until the pint where you claimed that you used your ability on me and got a result. I figured you had to be lying and were the last scum but I guess somehow your ability didn't target or something and so was able to hit me.
I feel better after reading the QT. I didn't feel this game was one of my better ones (especially reading Milldawg the wrong way - I should have gone with my gut), but seeing that the scum thought I had a role (when in fact I was probably worse than a vanilla) and was a threat makes me feel like I contributed a little.
From now on, I'm AZWOLGING D_V as soon as I can, whenever I can. Because this game shows that he is physically incapable of being helpful to the town outside of counterclaiming a noob scum
Most useless player, EVER. All you had to do was protect me as we agreed. There was no friggin' reason for you to keep yourself alive when I was the key to victory.
Cheers for the MVP, I feel that I pretty much was working in the town's best interests all game, aside from my one-sided crusade with regard to KP day 1 instead of finally settling on someone I did think was scum regardless.
But I despise games where MVPs exist, but LVP's aren't given out. Especially in this game, where a certain player deserves it SOOOO much.
Wuffles, I just want to apologize for refusing to budge from the stance you might be scummy.
I latched on and couldn't manage to let myself go when I should of.
Bro, don't worry about it. My lack of solid positioning on the day 1 scum lynch was enough to raise yours or anyone's scumdar.
I DID feel that you were being very obtuse with the whole Serial Killer thing, though. As if I would have been noob enough not to fire night 1.
It's kind of ironic, though, that as soon as I decided to dance to the town's tune and kill a person I was 80% sure was town, we lost. So in a way it's my fault for not going for iLord as well. I shouldn't have been worried about the consequences.
Bro, don't worry about it. My lack of solid positioning on the day 1 scum lynch was enough to raise yours or anyone's scumdar.
I DID feel that you were being very obtuse with the whole Serial Killer thing, though. As if I would have been noob enough not to fire night 1.
It's kind of ironic, though, that as soon as I decided to dance to the town's tune and kill a person I was 80% sure was town, we lost. So in a way it's my fault for not going for iLord as well. I shouldn't have been worried about the consequences.
Meh, we're all epic fail.
I was being hard headed about you being SK, but I just couldn't get it through my thick scull you weren't anti town. At one point I was like, "wait! He can't be the SK", and then 5 seconds later I was like "Wait, I'm positive Wuffles has to be scum :teach:!"= EPIC fail.
Bur really, the self protect doc was a terrible play in hindsight. Even though I was supporting saving greymon at the time (which was equally terrible), I was wrong. This is a good example of a town needing to stick to its guns.
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I was being hard headed about you being SK, but I just couldn't get it through my thick scull you weren't anti town. At one point I was like, "wait! He can't be the SK", and then 5 seconds later I was like "Wait, I'm positive Wuffles has to be scum :teach:!"= EPIC fail.
Bur really, the self protect doc was a terrible play in hindsight. Even though I was supporting saving greymon at the time (which was equally terrible), I was wrong. This is a good example of a town needing to stick to its guns.
I feel I should once more pull out the irony here.
If ALL of the town had stuck to its guns then we had it.
But if I had defected, and shot iLord, then I could've pulled it off right there.
So it wasn't really a case of "the town didn't stick to the plan" it was a case of "Wuffles stuck to the plan and got ****ed over by D_V not doing so".
I feel I should once more pull out the irony here.
If ALL of the town had stuck to its guns then we had it.
But if I had defected, and shot iLord, then I could've pulled it off right there.
So it wasn't really a case of "the town didn't stick to the plan" it was a case of "Wuffles stuck to the plan and got ****ed over by D_V not doing so".
Yeah, if D_V just protected you every night, I was screwed.
So I set-up a false plan first that made D_V choose, and I decided to gamble the game on that since I was screwed otherwise.
Also, this part about D_V's doctoring ability is intriguing...either way we have some time to think about this because the lynch threshold is at 4 votes right now, and I doubt we're going to get the scum to vote for himself
What is the likelyhood that you're going to vote for me if you had to break it down into percentage points. This is an important question.
Wow that is scummy. To drive this point home I will quote you. "Town shouldn't worry about being voted for."
I don't worry about dying, now would you not comment on a question of mine before I get an answer.
Now you're just making arguments to save your bacon.
Scum wouldn't each have an independent ability that is the nightkill - they would most likely have factional ability like any other game. Each mafia member doesn't get "Nightkill: You can kill a player each night." Almost always, it's "Mafia, you get to choose one person to kill a player each night."
In order for me to be scum, the scum nightkill would have to not be an action (which is impossible because there's a tracker in this game). If it doesn't count as an action then, something that the scumteam sends in together, then why did I just randomly choose to not target you in addition to my kill?
It's not a moot point - my point is that games with watchers and trackers simply do not have the scum nightkill as an untrackable action. I've read/played quite a bit of games and I've never seen it, and you know that you've never either.
Kpaca is completely obviously scum. Greymon, is there anyone of these points that doesn't appear damning to you?
My Custom Set: Solescurio
Do you plan on eventually answering my points?
My Custom Set: Solescurio
Possibly, but it will be difficult since they are based on a set-up lie we both know to be true, but I will indeed answer them after I get answers from DV/greymon.
If you believe it to be true, then why would it be difficult to argue your side? In fact, according to you, I know it's true as well, so wouldn't it be more difficult for me to argue against what I know, rather than you argue for what you know?
I can wait though, but I'm afraid I don't see the value in your question.
My Custom Set: Solescurio
Good game iLord.
Hope you can pull it out D_V.
There's no reason for me to argue with a brick wall at this point.
Are you saying that you're town?
My Custom Set: Solescurio
Vote: kpaca
I'm afraid I don't believe you.
Why would you lie about who I targeted as town?
If you are town, then the last scum has to be greymon.
D_V, if kpaca flips town, choose between protecting me and yourself tonight, to reduce the chance that the scum can win. If you protect the kill, we can still lynch greymon tomorrow.
If all goes well, however, that shouldn't be needed.
My Custom Set: Solescurio
Really doesn't matter, I'm lynched, and as such have no reason to lie. I'm town. I am the watcher, the results are what they said they were. Greymon isn't town, you're lying, which will be confirmed upon my death. You better hope you pick the right target scum.
Typo.
If we assume that you didn't lie, then I can only assume that greymon's ability had some hidden perks (such as messing with your results at a crucial moment).
I can't be scum because you confirmed me as not targeting anyone in a game with a tracker. Additionally, if you say that the mafia kill is not a standard ability, then why didn't I use my real ability in addition to it?
D_V, don't listen to kpaca - his logic doesn't make sense.
I still hope that you're just screwing with us right now.
My Custom Set: Solescurio
The fact that you have to keep trying to cover your ass and say "DV, zomg don't listen to him" is quite telling in my opinion. And if greymon's ability tampered with my results I would have know when I targeted Wuffles. Face it, it's obvious that the scum NK isn't a targetable abilty (which you already know), and this will be taken care of tomorrow.
You still haven't explained why I would just not use my rolecop ability if the scum nightkill isn't a normal ability.
Greymon's ability could easily be directable - greymon could choose when to use it. Obviously, in such a scenario, withholding using the ability is devastating to the town, and may result in our loss if D_V doesn't believe me and listens to you.
I really don't see any point in you lying anymore (any fun you would've gotten out of this is over), so I'm thinking that greymon has to be the last scum.
My Custom Set: Solescurio
...I'm also getting pretty tired of being killed N1.
Disappointed with the vanillas to be honest. The roles felt a little stock to me, although I'm big on complexity.
"...a talisman against all evil, so long as you obey me."
I thought that my role granted me NK immunity and so I played it as such - dropping some hints and stuff that I had a power role. Unfortunately it didn't work exactly as planned.
iLord definitely gets the mafia MVP, good all around behavior.
Zindabad played pretty nicely on D1.
And I mean hate them
Edit: mafia deserved this win.
A very cool setup though, good job Zasz!
Hanna, Ship's Navigator - WU Enchantments Control
Wort, the Raidmother - RG Copy ALL the Spells!
Rakdos, Lord of Riots - BR Group Murder-Hug
Reaper King - WUBRG Token Copies
Shirei, Shizo's Caretaker - B Sacrifice Engine
Grenzo, Dungeon Warden - BR Randomized Toolbox
Karametra, God of Harvests - GW Ramp
And then it died before it got any votes. Sigh. FAIL.
Logical Reasoning is dead; Long Live Stupidity
Town LVP here for not trusting kpaca...and sneaky I might add that the possibility of the other amrou being mafia was brought up a couple times and yet they were both town, nice touch
agree with the MVPs though, they played well!
The Izzet
I'm surprised no one else realized that DV was the doctor. With the crazy hints he kept dropping day 1 I thought for sure Wuffles would've realized it, and thought that kpaca realized it too, which would've made iLord's claim much less strong.
First, I'm amused that the mafia KNEW essentially that DV was the doc the entire game and never shot him.
Second, whoever's plan it was to vig vanillas was retarded. Reduced iLord's needed survival by a day in a game the town was pretty ahead in.
Logical Reasoning is dead; Long Live Stupidity
I realized that he was the doc pretty early after Wuffles made a whole big deal of him knowing that AE was lying. iLord hinted too much that he knew about it (before he claimed) but I thought that was just him being careless town not scum setting up a falseclaim.
Did you guys think that I had a good role?
EDIT: By that I mean, did you mafia people kill me because you thought I had a power role?
At least you made it to the night.:mad:
Way to play iLORD
They hate us cause they ain't us.
Grats scum.
Scum discussion thread. Posted my last thoughts in there.
Good job Wuffles - basically single-handedly screwed the mafia over.
--------------------------------
Rolecop was an idea that I had for MMOD's claim, and once he died, I realized that I could claim it in massclaim and get away with it.
My Custom Set: Solescurio
Yeah, that's why I hate self-protecting docs.
My Custom Set: Solescurio
This does not make me feel good at all...
If it makes you feel better I had a solid town read on you the whole game. Up until the pint where you claimed that you used your ability on me and got a result. I figured you had to be lying and were the last scum but I guess somehow your ability didn't target or something and so was able to hit me.
I feel better after reading the QT. I didn't feel this game was one of my better ones (especially reading Milldawg the wrong way - I should have gone with my gut), but seeing that the scum thought I had a role (when in fact I was probably worse than a vanilla) and was a threat makes me feel like I contributed a little.
Not as much as we played D_V :D!
My Custom Set: Solescurio
Most useless player, EVER. All you had to do was protect me as we agreed. There was no friggin' reason for you to keep yourself alive when I was the key to victory.
Cheers for the MVP, I feel that I pretty much was working in the town's best interests all game, aside from my one-sided crusade with regard to KP day 1 instead of finally settling on someone I did think was scum regardless.
But I despise games where MVPs exist, but LVP's aren't given out. Especially in this game, where a certain player deserves it SOOOO much.
I latched on and couldn't manage to let myself go when I should of.
I DID feel that you were being very obtuse with the whole Serial Killer thing, though. As if I would have been noob enough not to fire night 1.
It's kind of ironic, though, that as soon as I decided to dance to the town's tune and kill a person I was 80% sure was town, we lost. So in a way it's my fault for not going for iLord as well. I shouldn't have been worried about the consequences.
Meh, we're all epic fail.
I was being hard headed about you being SK, but I just couldn't get it through my thick scull you weren't anti town. At one point I was like, "wait! He can't be the SK", and then 5 seconds later I was like "Wait, I'm positive Wuffles has to be scum :teach:!"= EPIC fail.
Bur really, the self protect doc was a terrible play in hindsight. Even though I was supporting saving greymon at the time (which was equally terrible), I was wrong. This is a good example of a town needing to stick to its guns.
If ALL of the town had stuck to its guns then we had it.
But if I had defected, and shot iLord, then I could've pulled it off right there.
So it wasn't really a case of "the town didn't stick to the plan" it was a case of "Wuffles stuck to the plan and got ****ed over by D_V not doing so".
Yeah, if D_V just protected you every night, I was screwed.
So I set-up a false plan first that made D_V choose, and I decided to gamble the game on that since I was screwed otherwise.
My Custom Set: Solescurio