I used the my ability last night. I gave someone 1 shot Warden.
I would also like a clarification on what Warden does. I'm also curious if you gave someone the ability to be a Warden last night only, or if you gave them an ability that they can use on any future night of the game - but that's probably best left unsaid for now.
I expected to not use the ability and clear my name tonight, and thus have the rest of the nights to use my ability without worry, or die. Yes its a gambit. But the role was very specific in that it will not be usable should my reputation be tarnished that day. (vote/fos)
This is the part that I'm missing. How was not gifting anyone with an ability going to clear you?
I find myself wanting to believe you're town, because I don't see you claiming the way you did unless you actually have some variant of that ability, and the ability itself doesn't seem that scummy. Nothing that you've done behaviourally seems townie beyond the claim itself, though.
--
By the way, as a formatting question - is there a way to hotlink to a specific post without quoting any part of it? I tried just pasting a link in, but it won't let me slap a title on it, so it ends up being a big naked link that doesn't read well.
Wow, a whole heck of a lot happened. And it started happening ridiculous fast, too. Didn't even get to participate in some random vote goodness. [/sad panda]
The fact that the mod can be voted on intrigues me. CP, you say you got Xyre's alignment from a third party. Are you really so certain that the third party is truly town aligned?
On the whole UD thing, I don't know what to think. Given the craziness that already abounds thus far I'd say the idea of such a role is believable, but the way he went about it seems bizarre. Role claiming on page 2 while under no pressure, being vague enough about it to immediately draw votes/FoS and render his role useless for the day... it just doesn't make sense to me.
MTGS stats (won/played)
As scum - 3/5
As town - 5/7
As neutral - none
(I really have been scum a lot)
I'm now writing for Eye of the Vortex, come check out MTG articles and other geek culture
I also moderate the MTG forum, so register (it's free) and voice your thoughts.
By the way, as a formatting question - is there a way to hotlink to a specific post without quoting any part of it? I tried just pasting a link in, but it won't let me slap a title on it, so it ends up being a big naked link that doesn't read well.
[url=insert url here]text you want here[/url]
Like that. For instance:
[url=http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/showpost.php?p=2818543&postcount=102]RobRoy's post where he requested this[/url]
By the way, as a formatting question - is there a way to hotlink to a specific post without quoting any part of it? I tried just pasting a link in, but it won't let me slap a title on it, so it ends up being a big naked link that doesn't read well.
Yes, you can do it by using the [/url=the link] tags, closing the brackets and then typing text then closing the [/url] tag.
Example (you should be able to see it if you quote this post) [url=http://youtube.com/watch?v=Yu_moia-oVI]Harmless Link[/url]
What?! Look at the initial post; he is dead. Deceased. Kaputt. Indefinitely horizontal. In mafia games, you see, people are occasionally "killed off," and when that sad event occurs, he or she is no longer allowed to post, on account of rigor mortis and what-have-you.
'Welcome to Mafia Salvation', it said, 'Population: 3,660.' And someone, they never figured out who, had painted on the sign in red letters: '1,831 to lynch.'
What?! Look at the initial post; he is dead. Deceased. Kaputt. Indefinitely horizontal. In mafia games, you see, people are occasionally "killed off," and when that sad event occurs, he or she is no longer allowed to post, on account of rigor mortis and what-have-you.
'Welcome to Mafia Salvation', it said, 'Population: 3,660.' And someone, they never figured out who, had painted on the sign in red letters: '1,831 to lynch.'
What?! Look at the initial post; he is dead. Deceased. Kaputt. Indefinitely horizontal. In mafia games, you see, people are occasionally "killed off," and when that sad event occurs, he or she is no longer allowed to post, on account of rigor mortis and what-have-you.
'Welcome to Mafia Salvation', it said, 'Population: 3,660.' And someone, they never figured out who, had painted on the sign in red letters: '1,831 to lynch.'
Right now my automatic reaction is that you're some role of the form "Achieve <unlikely thing>. Then you win and the game continues".
Did the fact you were going to look that way occur to you before you made your play? If so, what's your plan to prevent us from putting you in a box and forgetting about you for the rest of the game (and vigging you if you don't do what we say)?
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The Champagne item can result in any role. The receiving player has to accept it as a gift before he or she gets the role attached to it. I send champagne for any role I give out. From my understanding it says I am the sending it.
There may be other people with similar giving abilities, which is why i made it clear that Champagne from me is a role. Champagne from another player may be something else.
As for the specifics of when a player can use the ability it is not clear in my pm... It only states that I can give out a one shot, night use, ability that can be edited by xyre in any way he deems fit (I am assuming so I don't break the game in half.).
One problem with this: by getting your ability out in the open, you're insuring that if we ever do catch a scum, all they have to do is vote for you to keep us from getting whatever ability it is.
I'm leaning towards a poor scum gambit here. Just gut instinct. However, I don't want to lean on my instinct, or let it guide my decisions, so I'll FoS Urban Druid
I have a feeling FoS's are just as bad as votes in this game.
As for this 'neutral without a kill' talk...please. The only person to ever really successfully make that argument was Azrael, and he was a scum type of neutral at the time. And anyway, UD has claimed to be town anyway, so either A)that argument is invalid and you shouldn't be using it or B)you think that UD is a liar, and clearly should be voting him accordingly for such, on top of everything else.
Am I correct in assuming that with this post you are still going with the "UD is Neutral" case?
If you want to vote me for whatever reason, please do not use "Vote". Instead, FOS me and add a note to the effect that your intent is to vote. I will treat FOSes as votes with respect to claiming and so on and if I reach what would be lynch it's easy enough for you convert to votes at that point.
Again, I think there may be more to FoS's than the norm.
@UD: Well... honestly, i dont quite know WHAT to make of you, but i dont like HOW you did it, or anything you've said so far, it seems like you're being ridiculously evasive, slowly adding a piece of tiny info each time instead of just coming out and stating it. This feels scummy to me.
how stupid, you want me to full-role claim/name-claim page 8/day one with 4 votes on me...
This is the part that I'm missing. How was not gifting anyone with an ability going to clear you?
EBWOP:
I was not going to be cleared by Not gifting. I was going to be cleared because I knew that my post would be scummy. I would get investigated or the Warden would back me up if it came to my lynching today, which I doubt will be the case. By Drawing attention I am either going to be cleared tonight, or killed tonight. It was a gambit but so far I am thinking it may be a very good choice for me...
i was OMGUSing Cyan because he was voting me for what i believe to be all the wrong reasons.
I was not going to be cleared by Not gifting. I was going to be cleared because I knew that my post would be scummy.
I would get investigated or the Warden would back me up if it came to my lynching today, which I doubt will be the case. By Drawing attention I am either going to be cleared tonight, or killed tonight.
OK, that makes a little more sense, but not by much. So your plan was to vaguely claim, render yourself useless for a day, and risk getting NK'd (rendering yourself useless for the rest of the game) in hopes that either you'll get investigated or that the person whom you targeted will come forward? You didn't consider the possibility that the town would just go ahead and lynch you rather than investigate? Or that that the person you targeted might not be town (I'm not seeing how you'd be able to tell on Night 0 whether or not a person is town) and would just let you swing?
It was a gambit but so far I am thinking it may be a very good choice for me...
I'm no so sure this is going to work out as well as you think it is.
Right now my automatic reaction is that you're some role of the form "Achieve <unlikely thing>. Then you win and the game continues".
Did the fact you were going to look that way occur to you before you made your play? If so, what's your plan to prevent us from putting you in a box and forgetting about you for the rest of the game (and vigging you if you don't do what we say)?
It didn't occur to me. However, I don't particularly care if you kill me first. You can lynch me today and learn my alignment, then vig Xyre tonight, or whatever you want to do.
What?! Look at the initial post; he is dead. Deceased. Kaputt. Indefinitely horizontal. In mafia games, you see, people are occasionally "killed off," and when that sad event occurs, he or she is no longer allowed to post, on account of rigor mortis and what-have-you.
'Welcome to Mafia Salvation', it said, 'Population: 3,660.' And someone, they never figured out who, had painted on the sign in red letters: '1,831 to lynch.'
OK, that makes a little more sense, but not by much. So your plan was to vaguely claim, render yourself useless for a day, and risk getting NK'd (rendering yourself useless for the rest of the game) in hopes that either you'll get investigated or that the person whom you targeted will come forward? You didn't consider the possibility that the town would just go ahead and lynch you rather than investigate? Or that that the person you targeted might not be town (I'm not seeing how you'd be able to tell on Night 0 whether or not a person is town) and would just let you swing?
I'm no so sure this is going to work out as well as you think it is.
Better than going into days 2+ with the hopes of not doing anything that can be perceived as scummy and unintentionally ruining my chances.
At least here we know that whoever votes me is anti-town on days 2+. If I am not lynched several things can/may happen:
I can: get targeted for a NKed, I can be investigated, a watcher can watch me, a tracker can track me, I can get mafia roleblocked,or a doc can protect me.
Any of these first four will confirm that i am pro-town and can't take an action tonight. The first two will confirm my alignment. The fifth will be pointless and when i state that I made no action, the role blocker will either state that he/she role blocked me and that I could be lying. But then they would have to answer for their actions, which if they are mafia can be hard to justify. If I get Protected you will have me tomorrow, and night 2 someone will get an investigation, or a lie detection role. If i get investigated I will be confirmed and anyone who votes me for the remaining days will have to justify it past the cop claim.
Or I get lynched today and am proven right. So whoever decides to vote me into a lynch today, from that group, is likely scum.
I've put myself into a position to be one of the best sources of information gathering for the rest of the game, should I survive tonight.
I've put myself into a position to be one of the best sources of information gathering for the rest of the game, should I survive tonight.
You've put yourself in position to be one of our best sources of info by throwing yourself out in the open so the scum know who and what you are? That would be like a cop coming out on page 2 saying "Hey guys, I'm the cop and I'll be your #1 source of info provided I don't get roleblocked or killed." Again, I don't think this is going to work out as well as you think it is.
He's a stupid, stupid, stupid scum if he's making this bs up. The dude should be confirmable, even if he's just stupid town. Just take a chill pill and mellow out. Inventor isn't that painful to have out there.
UD, you're a dumb jerk for not just saying "Don't vote me" and spewing all that flavor crap. Look like a dumb town jerk though.
Does your information looks like someone, you know, investigated him, or whatev? Clarity, forsooth, is needed.
MTGS stats (won/played)
As scum - 3/5
As town - 5/7
As neutral - none
(I really have been scum a lot)
I'm now writing for Eye of the Vortex, come check out MTG articles and other geek culture
I also moderate the MTG forum, so register (it's free) and voice your thoughts.
MTGS stats (won/played)
As scum - 3/5
As town - 5/7
As neutral - none
(I really have been scum a lot)
I'm now writing for Eye of the Vortex, come check out MTG articles and other geek culture
I also moderate the MTG forum, so register (it's free) and voice your thoughts.
He's a stupid, stupid, stupid scum if he's making this bs up.
Not necessarily. What if he's a godfather?
Looks bad as town or scum to me. Consequently I'm inclined to ignore.
Quote from carrion pigeons »
However, I don't particularly care if you kill me first.
Yes, I also noticed your "Please lynch me!" t-shirt earlier.
Most definitely not going to happen, sorry.
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EBWODP: Heh - jerubaal's incoherence misled me there. I took him to be referring to Urban Druid. Obviously CP is not a godfather.
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As for this 'neutral without a kill' talk...please. The only person to ever really successfully make that argument was Azrael, and he was a scum type of neutral at the time. And anyway, UD has claimed to be town anyway, so either A)that argument is invalid and you shouldn't be using it or B)you think that UD is a liar, and clearly should be voting him accordingly for such, on top of everything else.
He isn't voting you for being a survivor. He had other reasons.
MTGS stats (won/played)
As scum - 3/5
As town - 5/7
As neutral - none
(I really have been scum a lot)
I'm now writing for Eye of the Vortex, come check out MTG articles and other geek culture
I also moderate the MTG forum, so register (it's free) and voice your thoughts.
Also, from the special rules, it seems like Cyan and Tilde are town. Clearly the latter couldn't replace just anyone at this point if Cyan was scum and Tilde has seen his role PM, assuming that was a real "replacement" effect.
I have to agree with you here.
@Jerub: :rofl::rofl:
Quote from UD 97 »
I posted that list to support my role claim. I can disregard it at any time. That list is in no way a post-restriction.
Why specifically, in your flavor, did you not include actively participating in achieving the goals of TFC? Flavor wise you spell out that your agenda is to guide us within our agenda, therefore it is to guide the town but not specifically to help it.
What?! Look at the initial post; he is dead. Deceased. Kaputt. Indefinitely horizontal. In mafia games, you see, people are occasionally "killed off," and when that sad event occurs, he or she is no longer allowed to post, on account of rigor mortis and what-have-you.
'Welcome to Mafia Salvation', it said, 'Population: 3,660.' And someone, they never figured out who, had painted on the sign in red letters: '1,831 to lynch.'
What?! Look at the initial post; he is dead. Deceased. Kaputt. Indefinitely horizontal. In mafia games, you see, people are occasionally "killed off," and when that sad event occurs, he or she is no longer allowed to post, on account of rigor mortis and what-have-you.
'Welcome to Mafia Salvation', it said, 'Population: 3,660.' And someone, they never figured out who, had painted on the sign in red letters: '1,831 to lynch.'
Why specifically, in your flavor, did you not include actively participating in achieving the goals of TFC? Flavor wise you spell out that your agenda is to guide us within our agenda, therefore it is to guide the town but not specifically to help it.
I guess I'm the only one who's ever been to a career coaching seminar with a Management Consultant before? I forget that people are younger than me.
OK, that makes a little more sense, but not by much. So your plan was to vaguely claim, render yourself useless for a day, and risk getting NK'd (rendering yourself useless for the rest of the game) in hopes that either you'll get investigated or that the person whom you targeted will come forward? You didn't consider the possibility that the town would just go ahead and lynch you rather than investigate? Or that that the person you targeted might not be town (I'm not seeing how you'd be able to tell on Night 0 whether or not a person is town) and would just let you swing?
Just noticed this on reread. Bad logic at the end there. UD could always name the person he gave the Warden to himself, forcing them to come forwards. At that point they have no choice but to confirm the gift - their other option is to deny it, and then likely get lynched the next day for lying when UD shows up as town.
At least here we know that whoever votes me is anti-town on days 2+. If I am not lynched several things can/may happen:
I can: get targeted for a NKed, I can be investigated, a watcher can watch me, a tracker can track me, I can get mafia roleblocked,or a doc can protect me.
Any of these first four will confirm that i am pro-town and can't take an action tonight. The first two will confirm my alignment. The fifth will be pointless and when i state that I made no action, the role blocker will either state that he/she role blocked me and that I could be lying. But then they would have to answer for their actions, which if they are mafia can be hard to justify. If I get Protected you will have me tomorrow, and night 2 someone will get an investigation, or a lie detection role. If i get investigated I will be confirmed and anyone who votes me for the remaining days will have to justify it past the cop claim.
Or I get lynched today and am proven right. So whoever decides to vote me into a lynch today, from that group, is likely scum.
I've put myself into a position to be one of the best sources of information gathering for the rest of the game, should I survive tonight.
So... much... bad... logic...
First off, while turning up dead would obviously prove your alignment, doing things that increase your chances of dying, given that you are a townie power role, are usually not productive. Investigations do prove your alignment, but in doing so you've distracted them from investigating others. A watcher can only show that you didn't target a specific person, and a tracker that you did not take an action - which says nothing about your alignment. The mafia isn't going to block you if you're a townie, 'cause you've already said you aren't doing anything tonight, and townies don't generally lie about things like that. And a doc protect is only useful if it actually prevents a kill.
Finally, if you do get lynched, it'll take a dozen people. And while it's likely that some of those people will be scum, it's not like we can just start killing them off one by one until we get all the scum. Your lynch would give us information, yes, but any lynch gets us information.
Look: you screwed up in how you presented your claim to the thread. The sooner you admit that and stop trying to defend what happened, the sooner we can move on to other things. I don't think we have enough to make you swing right now, and I do like the fact that you've been reasonably consistent in your arguments. Now if you could stop being consistently wrong it would help matters a lot.
Jesters are considered unacceptable by a fair percentage of the players on this site, so we can be confident there won't be a Jester in this game. (At least not a straightforward one - there could feasibly be some clever variation.)
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What?! Look at the initial post; he is dead. Deceased. Kaputt. Indefinitely horizontal. In mafia games, you see, people are occasionally "killed off," and when that sad event occurs, he or she is no longer allowed to post, on account of rigor mortis and what-have-you.
'Welcome to Mafia Salvation', it said, 'Population: 3,660.' And someone, they never figured out who, had painted on the sign in red letters: '1,831 to lynch.'
You've put yourself in position to be one of our best sources of info by throwing yourself out in the open so the scum know who and what you are? That would be like a cop coming out on page 2 saying "Hey guys, I'm the cop and I'll be your #1 source of info provided I don't get roleblocked or killed." Again, I don't think this is going to work out as well as you think it is.
Yes thats exactly it. Except that with 20+ different roles out there I'm confidant in the fact that there are things that can and prevent my death from occurring, should the town come to its senses.
For its rudimentary basis it is being called stupid however until I'm dead and the game is over, one can't know for sure usefull it will be.
If they get rid of me tonight, yes the town loses a possibly powerful role, but also, they could have lost it for several days due to any number of reasons. In this case I am either going to help definitively win the game, or help find scum with whatever outcome this plan has.
Originally, I wanted to channel Chamber and just type 'vote: urban druid', but as i read more and more I come to realize, he's just a complete moron. In my opinion inventors are overrated when it comes to people rating them in terms of power.
Unvote, Vote: Xyre, I enjoy this wagon, much more than the UD wagon.
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No, we are not doing what carrion pigeons says. Or at least if we are, we are certainly not doing so without first discussing and agreeing as much.
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okay. I think I kind of understand where UD is coming from. His idea makes sense in a weirded out sort of way. I disagree with his initial way of doing it, but at the moment there's not much more to say on it.
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No, we are not doing what carrion pigeons says. Or at least if we are, we are certainly not doing so without first discussing and agreeing as much.
This sounds like a decent place to go next. I'm seeing UD as more of a fool than scum (though possibly a neutral fool).
I don't think CP's idea is horrible. We had a long discussion about lynching the mod in Blood Moon, and I ended up thinking that the best time to do it is day 1 when we've got little else to do. Later on, we'll have solid leads from actions, multiple days of play, and what have you. Lynching the mod then is going to be a waste of resources, so if we're going to it should be today.
CP also says he's got 100% info that it's in our best interest to lynch the mod. I refuse to believe this game has a Jester in it, and absolute worst case scenario CP's win condition is to lynch the mod and we lose a lynch but cut down the number of mafia suspects by 1 (CP).
That said, we lose a lynch either way on someone who isn't (or at least better not be) mafia. But it's interesting discussion.
What?! Look at the initial post; he is dead. Deceased. Kaputt. Indefinitely horizontal. In mafia games, you see, people are occasionally "killed off," and when that sad event occurs, he or she is no longer allowed to post, on account of rigor mortis and what-have-you.
'Welcome to Mafia Salvation', it said, 'Population: 3,660.' And someone, they never figured out who, had painted on the sign in red letters: '1,831 to lynch.'
Okay, answer me this. Assume the vig does kill me tonight, and that I turn up town.
Will you lynch Xyre then?
Do you know exactly what will happen if we lynch Xyre? I mean, if we lynch a normal player, they aren't in the game anymore. What happens when we lynch the mod? Do you know for sure?
Yes. Or at least I'd be more favourably disposed towards it such that on any day where the Town has nothing better to do I'd vote in favour.
This is not to say you should be vigged though. That's up to the vig (presuming we even have one).
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On UD: I'm going to say leave him alone for now. He can be confirmed given time, and also the flavor of a 'reputation' is similar to mine, so I'm inclined to believe him a little more. His claiming was rather unwise, bad bad play, but that doesn't necessarily make him scum. His so-so experience and scum buddies should be able to tell him that if he were scum. Remember, those that can usually talk at night can day talk too secretly.
On Xyre: I don't see any gain from this lynch at all. CP's urging is rather compelling, but I don't see any town victories gained there. If the mod is scum we can lynch him later I think, but I still doubt that fact. There's no reason to lynch the mod day 1. Discussion on this option though wouldn't hurt.
Do you know exactly what will happen if we lynch Xyre? I mean, if we lynch a normal player, they aren't in the game anymore. What happens when we lynch the mod? Do you know for sure?
Yes. Or at least I'd be more favourably disposed towards it such that on any day where the Town has nothing better to do I'd vote in favour.
This is not to say you should be vigged though. That's up to the vig (presuming we even have one).
What does "the Town has nothing better to do" mean? I'm sitting here telling you where the scum is!
I am saying that if both Xyre and myself are alive at the end of the day (which seems inexcusable to me, personally), I should be vigged. I don't particularly care what you're opinion is on that subject, unless you're the vig.
What?! Look at the initial post; he is dead. Deceased. Kaputt. Indefinitely horizontal. In mafia games, you see, people are occasionally "killed off," and when that sad event occurs, he or she is no longer allowed to post, on account of rigor mortis and what-have-you.
'Welcome to Mafia Salvation', it said, 'Population: 3,660.' And someone, they never figured out who, had painted on the sign in red letters: '1,831 to lynch.'
On Xyre: I don't see any gain from this lynch at all. CP's urging is rather compelling, but I don't see any town victories gained there. If the mod is scum we can lynch him later I think, but I still doubt that fact. There's no reason to lynch the mod day 1. Discussion on this option though wouldn't hurt.
What if the mod is our best lead?
I have several reasons that I would support a Xyre lynch over a UD lynch.
1. The UD lynch is happening over his own stupidity. I take his poor planning to be too poorly thought out to be a gambit. I also have the feeling that he is just some crazy neutral. So, we would be lynching a goofy neutral, and the only thing we gain is the loss of one unhelpful townie. Not much going for it there.
2. CP seems incredibly sure of Xyre's scumminess, which is more than can be said for any other player in the game right now.
3. A Xyre lynch will give us insight for the next day. It will lead to more investigations and more information no matter Xyre's actual alignment.
4. I have a good idea of where the third party information is coming from, which helps to hold up CP's words so far.
I believe that a Xyre lynch is comparitavely advantageous to a UD lynch.
Vote Xyre
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Thanks to THEY DID WHAT!? For the sweet banner!
Games played:3, 1 ongoing Times Town: 1, with 1 win Times Scum: 1, with 1 loss
Originally, I wanted to channel Chamber and just type 'vote: urban druid', but as i read more and more I come to realize, he's just a complete moron. In my opinion inventors are overrated when it comes to people rating them in terms of power.
Do you know exactly what will happen if we lynch Xyre? I mean, if we lynch a normal player, they aren't in the game anymore. What happens when we lynch the mod? Do you know for sure?
Both Az and Xyre have run games before where lynching the mod has been an option. In both cases the mod simply carried on his duties post-lynch (and in Xyre's last game, Xyre was posting for DYH, and so voting him lynched DYH).
Neither UD (claimed inventor) or Xyre (I don't trust CP right now) are good targets right now.
BT or Jobie are much better options for unquestioningly going along with a Xyre wagon.
Quote from BT »
1. The UD lynch is happening over his own stupidity. I take his poor planning to be too poorly thought out to be a gambit. I also have the feeling that he is just some crazy neutral. So, we would be lynching a goofy neutral, and the only thing we gain is the loss of one unhelpful townie. Not much going for it there.
2. CP seems incredibly sure of Xyre's scumminess, which is more than can be said for any other player in the game right now.
Because it was less than 100 posts into the game.
Besides, CP's certainty is making me less certain. I have a hard time trusting information that is claimed to be 100% accurate: because that so rarely happens in mafia games.
3. A Xyre lynch will give us insight for the next day. It will lead to more investigations and more information no matter Xyre's actual alignment.
It will give us no information. CP takes all responsibility, and so we can't analyze anything.
We've already had a night 0.
I believe that a Xyre lynch is comparitavely advantageous to a UD lynch.
Dude, Bat, are you always this much of a control freak? I mean, what's with the whole thou-shalt-not-go-against-my-will-or-I-will-vote-you tirade. Do you actually have reasons, or just thy own omnipotent read?
BEAT THE SYSTEM, STICK IT TO THE MAN!!!!!!
Unvote, Vote: Xyre
Suck it, Trebek.
And I'm still fricking hungry. Nachos would be good.
MTGS stats (won/played)
As scum - 3/5
As town - 5/7
As neutral - none
(I really have been scum a lot)
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What?! Look at the initial post; he is dead. Deceased. Kaputt. Indefinitely horizontal. In mafia games, you see, people are occasionally "killed off," and when that sad event occurs, he or she is no longer allowed to post, on account of rigor mortis and what-have-you.
'Welcome to Mafia Salvation', it said, 'Population: 3,660.' And someone, they never figured out who, had painted on the sign in red letters: '1,831 to lynch.'
Just noticed this on reread. Bad logic at the end there. UD could always name the person he gave the Warden to himself, forcing them to come forwards. At that point they have no choice but to confirm the gift - their other option is to deny it, and then likely get lynched the next day for lying when UD shows up as town.
Fair enough.
As far as the Xyre lynch goes, I'm not feeling it. I can't see the mod being a scum power role (since he's already got 100% info on every player), so I don't see the urgency here. We need to find scum who are going to be an active threat to the town (i.e. the ones who are actually players that are, by posts or abilities, actively hindering the town). Plus lynching the mod seems to me to be more likely a neutral win con than a town one. If at some point CP is confirmed 100% to be town (by death or otherwise) then I could see lynching Xyre, but as bateleur put it "if there's nothing better to do". And by "better to do" I assume he means "lynch a scummy player".
@CP: I would compare this play to Bat's suggestion in Ruroni Kenshin mafia:
There he wanted the confirmed town to choose a wagon on person of unknown alignment.
Here you want a person of unknown alignment to choose a wagon on a person of (supposedly) confirmed alignment.
I don't see that he called you a survivor after you clarified your claimed alignment for Pale Mage. Link?
I would also like a clarification on what Warden does. I'm also curious if you gave someone the ability to be a Warden last night only, or if you gave them an ability that they can use on any future night of the game - but that's probably best left unsaid for now.
This is the part that I'm missing. How was not gifting anyone with an ability going to clear you?
I find myself wanting to believe you're town, because I don't see you claiming the way you did unless you actually have some variant of that ability, and the ability itself doesn't seem that scummy. Nothing that you've done behaviourally seems townie beyond the claim itself, though.
--
By the way, as a formatting question - is there a way to hotlink to a specific post without quoting any part of it? I tried just pasting a link in, but it won't let me slap a title on it, so it ends up being a big naked link that doesn't read well.
The fact that the mod can be voted on intrigues me. CP, you say you got Xyre's alignment from a third party. Are you really so certain that the third party is truly town aligned?
On the whole UD thing, I don't know what to think. Given the craziness that already abounds thus far I'd say the idea of such a role is believable, but the way he went about it seems bizarre. Role claiming on page 2 while under no pressure, being vague enough about it to immediately draw votes/FoS and render his role useless for the day... it just doesn't make sense to me.
Record: 3-2
Simpsons Mafia (Newbie) - Vanilla Mafia - Win
The Fiasco Corporation - Town Reporter - Loss
Doomsday Mafia - Mafia Roleblocker - Win
Battle Royale Mafia - Serial Daykiller - Loss
Danger City Mafia - Vanilla Town - Win
Regardless of how dumb this dude seems right now, his claim seems to be verifiable-ish.
CP needs to speak. Speak!!!
And neon flamingos. Fricking neon green flamingos. Don't say I didn't warn you.
MTGS stats (won/played)
As scum - 3/5
As town - 5/7
As neutral - none
(I really have been scum a lot)
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[url=insert url here]text you want here[/url]
Like that. For instance:
[url=http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/showpost.php?p=2818543&postcount=102]RobRoy's post where he requested this[/url]
becomes:
RobRoy's post where he requested this
Record: 3-2
Simpsons Mafia (Newbie) - Vanilla Mafia - Win
The Fiasco Corporation - Town Reporter - Loss
Doomsday Mafia - Mafia Roleblocker - Win
Battle Royale Mafia - Serial Daykiller - Loss
Danger City Mafia - Vanilla Town - Win
Yes, you can do it by using the [/url=the link] tags, closing the brackets and then typing text then closing the [/url] tag.
Example (you should be able to see it if you quote this post) [url=http://youtube.com/watch?v=Yu_moia-oVI]Harmless Link[/url]
I did... then people voted for me so i made it clear why I asked people not to vote by posting that my claim was hidden in my first post.
How is that? We'll have several new night actions, plus you'll know my alignment (one way or the other), at the very least.
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When there are this many people yelling at you for how you came forward with the info, I think it might be time to admit that you made a mistake.
I would like responses to what I wrote here.
Yes.
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Wait. What typo?
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Right now my automatic reaction is that you're some role of the form "Achieve <unlikely thing>. Then you win and the game continues".
Did the fact you were going to look that way occur to you before you made your play? If so, what's your plan to prevent us from putting you in a box and forgetting about you for the rest of the game (and vigging you if you don't do what we say)?
(I'm on on this site much anymore. If you want to get in touch it's probably best to email me: dom@heffalumps.org)
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I'm getting to it. There are 3 pages of info that need responding, before yours.
The Champagne item can result in any role. The receiving player has to accept it as a gift before he or she gets the role attached to it. I send champagne for any role I give out. From my understanding it says I am the sending it.
There may be other people with similar giving abilities, which is why i made it clear that Champagne from me is a role. Champagne from another player may be something else.
As for the specifics of when a player can use the ability it is not clear in my pm... It only states that I can give out a one shot, night use, ability that can be edited by xyre in any way he deems fit (I am assuming so I don't break the game in half.).
There are limits I haven't yet expressed.
I have a feeling FoS's are just as bad as votes in this game.
Am I correct in assuming that with this post you are still going with the "UD is Neutral" case?
Again, I think there may be more to FoS's than the norm.
how stupid, you want me to full-role claim/name-claim page 8/day one with 4 votes on me...
Hell no.
I've already cleared up this misunderstanding.
@Robroy: 1: Post 77
2: a Warden protects/roleblocks for a night.
EBWOP:
I was not going to be cleared by Not gifting. I was going to be cleared because I knew that my post would be scummy. I would get investigated or the Warden would back me up if it came to my lynching today, which I doubt will be the case. By Drawing attention I am either going to be cleared tonight, or killed tonight. It was a gambit but so far I am thinking it may be a very good choice for me...
i was OMGUSing Cyan because he was voting me for what i believe to be all the wrong reasons.
Is the third party in this game currently?
V/LA: 3/21-3/24 & 3/27-3/29
Going from an OMGUS to a perceived mis-rep vote is not wrong. Its unfounded but not at all wrong.
OK, that makes a little more sense, but not by much. So your plan was to vaguely claim, render yourself useless for a day, and risk getting NK'd (rendering yourself useless for the rest of the game) in hopes that either you'll get investigated or that the person whom you targeted will come forward? You didn't consider the possibility that the town would just go ahead and lynch you rather than investigate? Or that that the person you targeted might not be town (I'm not seeing how you'd be able to tell on Night 0 whether or not a person is town) and would just let you swing?
I'm no so sure this is going to work out as well as you think it is.
Record: 3-2
Simpsons Mafia (Newbie) - Vanilla Mafia - Win
The Fiasco Corporation - Town Reporter - Loss
Doomsday Mafia - Mafia Roleblocker - Win
Battle Royale Mafia - Serial Daykiller - Loss
Danger City Mafia - Vanilla Town - Win
It didn't occur to me. However, I don't particularly care if you kill me first. You can lynch me today and learn my alignment, then vig Xyre tonight, or whatever you want to do.
I'm not neutral.
I have no way of knowing this.
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Better than going into days 2+ with the hopes of not doing anything that can be perceived as scummy and unintentionally ruining my chances.
At least here we know that whoever votes me is anti-town on days 2+. If I am not lynched several things can/may happen:
I can: get targeted for a NKed, I can be investigated, a watcher can watch me, a tracker can track me, I can get mafia roleblocked,or a doc can protect me.
Any of these first four will confirm that i am pro-town and can't take an action tonight. The first two will confirm my alignment. The fifth will be pointless and when i state that I made no action, the role blocker will either state that he/she role blocked me and that I could be lying. But then they would have to answer for their actions, which if they are mafia can be hard to justify. If I get Protected you will have me tomorrow, and night 2 someone will get an investigation, or a lie detection role. If i get investigated I will be confirmed and anyone who votes me for the remaining days will have to justify it past the cop claim.
Or I get lynched today and am proven right. So whoever decides to vote me into a lynch today, from that group, is likely scum.
I've put myself into a position to be one of the best sources of information gathering for the rest of the game, should I survive tonight.
You've put yourself in position to be one of our best sources of info by throwing yourself out in the open so the scum know who and what you are? That would be like a cop coming out on page 2 saying "Hey guys, I'm the cop and I'll be your #1 source of info provided I don't get roleblocked or killed." Again, I don't think this is going to work out as well as you think it is.
Record: 3-2
Simpsons Mafia (Newbie) - Vanilla Mafia - Win
The Fiasco Corporation - Town Reporter - Loss
Doomsday Mafia - Mafia Roleblocker - Win
Battle Royale Mafia - Serial Daykiller - Loss
Danger City Mafia - Vanilla Town - Win
UD, you're a dumb jerk for not just saying "Don't vote me" and spewing all that flavor crap. Look like a dumb town jerk though.
Does your information looks like someone, you know, investigated him, or whatev? Clarity, forsooth, is needed.
Where the hell did my feet go?
Ahhhhhh
Oh. Phew.
MTGS stats (won/played)
As scum - 3/5
As town - 5/7
As neutral - none
(I really have been scum a lot)
I'm now writing for Eye of the Vortex, come check out MTG articles and other geek culture
I also moderate the MTG forum, so register (it's free) and voice your thoughts.
MTGS stats (won/played)
As scum - 3/5
As town - 5/7
As neutral - none
(I really have been scum a lot)
I'm now writing for Eye of the Vortex, come check out MTG articles and other geek culture
I also moderate the MTG forum, so register (it's free) and voice your thoughts.
Not necessarily. What if he's a godfather?
Looks bad as town or scum to me. Consequently I'm inclined to ignore.
Yes, I also noticed your "Please lynch me!" t-shirt earlier.
Most definitely not going to happen, sorry.
(I'm on on this site much anymore. If you want to get in touch it's probably best to email me: dom@heffalumps.org)
Forum Awards: Best Writer 2005, Best Limited Strategist 2005-2012
5CB PotM - June 2005, November 2005, February 2006, April 2008, May 2008, Feb 2009
MTGSalvation Articles: 1-20, plus guest appearance on MTGCast #86!
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(I'm on on this site much anymore. If you want to get in touch it's probably best to email me: dom@heffalumps.org)
Forum Awards: Best Writer 2005, Best Limited Strategist 2005-2012
5CB PotM - June 2005, November 2005, February 2006, April 2008, May 2008, Feb 2009
MTGSalvation Articles: 1-20, plus guest appearance on MTGCast #86!
<Limited Clan>
I'm fairly certain that part of post 77 was him being annoyed at other people for calling you a neutral without a kill. Read the paragraph carefully:
He isn't voting you for being a survivor. He had other reasons.
I'm hungry as hell. Anyone got chips?? Fig newtons would be hella-awesome.
MTGS stats (won/played)
As scum - 3/5
As town - 5/7
As neutral - none
(I really have been scum a lot)
I'm now writing for Eye of the Vortex, come check out MTG articles and other geek culture
I also moderate the MTG forum, so register (it's free) and voice your thoughts.
@Jerub: :rofl::rofl:
Why specifically, in your flavor, did you not include actively participating in achieving the goals of TFC? Flavor wise you spell out that your agenda is to guide us within our agenda, therefore it is to guide the town but not specifically to help it.
Sigil: an MMORPCCG ">Mexus: An MMORPCCG
Sigh. Are you seriously suggesting that I might be a Jester after the last time Xyre tried to pull that?
Fine, vig me then. I see no good reason to wait until tomorrow to kill Xyre, but if that's what it's going to take, then whatever.
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I guess I'm the only one who's ever been to a career coaching seminar with a Management Consultant before? I forget that people are younger than me.
Just noticed this on reread. Bad logic at the end there. UD could always name the person he gave the Warden to himself, forcing them to come forwards. At that point they have no choice but to confirm the gift - their other option is to deny it, and then likely get lynched the next day for lying when UD shows up as town.
So... much... bad... logic...
First off, while turning up dead would obviously prove your alignment, doing things that increase your chances of dying, given that you are a townie power role, are usually not productive. Investigations do prove your alignment, but in doing so you've distracted them from investigating others. A watcher can only show that you didn't target a specific person, and a tracker that you did not take an action - which says nothing about your alignment. The mafia isn't going to block you if you're a townie, 'cause you've already said you aren't doing anything tonight, and townies don't generally lie about things like that. And a doc protect is only useful if it actually prevents a kill.
Finally, if you do get lynched, it'll take a dozen people. And while it's likely that some of those people will be scum, it's not like we can just start killing them off one by one until we get all the scum. Your lynch would give us information, yes, but any lynch gets us information.
Look: you screwed up in how you presented your claim to the thread. The sooner you admit that and stop trying to defend what happened, the sooner we can move on to other things. I don't think we have enough to make you swing right now, and I do like the fact that you've been reasonably consistent in your arguments. Now if you could stop being consistently wrong it would help matters a lot.
This has been mentioned a couple times. Link please?
I was a Jester in Xyre's game The Greenwood Affair.
Jesters are considered unacceptable by a fair percentage of the players on this site, so we can be confident there won't be a Jester in this game. (At least not a straightforward one - there could feasibly be some clever variation.)
(I'm on on this site much anymore. If you want to get in touch it's probably best to email me: dom@heffalumps.org)
Forum Awards: Best Writer 2005, Best Limited Strategist 2005-2012
5CB PotM - June 2005, November 2005, February 2006, April 2008, May 2008, Feb 2009
MTGSalvation Articles: 1-20, plus guest appearance on MTGCast #86!
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Yes thats exactly it. Except that with 20+ different roles out there I'm confidant in the fact that there are things that can and prevent my death from occurring, should the town come to its senses.
For its rudimentary basis it is being called stupid however until I'm dead and the game is over, one can't know for sure usefull it will be.
If they get rid of me tonight, yes the town loses a possibly powerful role, but also, they could have lost it for several days due to any number of reasons. In this case I am either going to help definitively win the game, or help find scum with whatever outcome this plan has.
Unvote, Vote: Xyre, I enjoy this wagon, much more than the UD wagon.
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No, we are not doing what carrion pigeons says. Or at least if we are, we are certainly not doing so without first discussing and agreeing as much.
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Forum Awards: Best Writer 2005, Best Limited Strategist 2005-2012
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MTGSalvation Articles: 1-20, plus guest appearance on MTGCast #86!
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This sounds like a decent place to go next. I'm seeing UD as more of a fool than scum (though possibly a neutral fool).
I don't think CP's idea is horrible. We had a long discussion about lynching the mod in Blood Moon, and I ended up thinking that the best time to do it is day 1 when we've got little else to do. Later on, we'll have solid leads from actions, multiple days of play, and what have you. Lynching the mod then is going to be a waste of resources, so if we're going to it should be today.
CP also says he's got 100% info that it's in our best interest to lynch the mod. I refuse to believe this game has a Jester in it, and absolute worst case scenario CP's win condition is to lynch the mod and we lose a lynch but cut down the number of mafia suspects by 1 (CP).
That said, we lose a lynch either way on someone who isn't (or at least better not be) mafia. But it's interesting discussion.
I support a Xyre vigging.
Okay, answer me this. Assume the vig does kill me tonight, and that I turn up town.
Will you lynch Xyre then?
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Do you know exactly what will happen if we lynch Xyre? I mean, if we lynch a normal player, they aren't in the game anymore. What happens when we lynch the mod? Do you know for sure?
Yes. Or at least I'd be more favourably disposed towards it such that on any day where the Town has nothing better to do I'd vote in favour.
This is not to say you should be vigged though. That's up to the vig (presuming we even have one).
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Forum Awards: Best Writer 2005, Best Limited Strategist 2005-2012
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MTGSalvation Articles: 1-20, plus guest appearance on MTGCast #86!
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On Xyre: I don't see any gain from this lynch at all. CP's urging is rather compelling, but I don't see any town victories gained there. If the mod is scum we can lynch him later I think, but I still doubt that fact. There's no reason to lynch the mod day 1. Discussion on this option though wouldn't hurt.
I know a scum will die.
What does "the Town has nothing better to do" mean? I'm sitting here telling you where the scum is!
I am saying that if both Xyre and myself are alive at the end of the day (which seems inexcusable to me, personally), I should be vigged. I don't particularly care what you're opinion is on that subject, unless you're the vig.
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What if the mod is our best lead?
I have several reasons that I would support a Xyre lynch over a UD lynch.
1. The UD lynch is happening over his own stupidity. I take his poor planning to be too poorly thought out to be a gambit. I also have the feeling that he is just some crazy neutral. So, we would be lynching a goofy neutral, and the only thing we gain is the loss of one unhelpful townie. Not much going for it there.
2. CP seems incredibly sure of Xyre's scumminess, which is more than can be said for any other player in the game right now.
3. A Xyre lynch will give us insight for the next day. It will lead to more investigations and more information no matter Xyre's actual alignment.
4. I have a good idea of where the third party information is coming from, which helps to hold up CP's words so far.
I believe that a Xyre lynch is comparitavely advantageous to a UD lynch.
Vote Xyre
It just takes a night to prove him.
Yes.
Until then, no.
Both Az and Xyre have run games before where lynching the mod has been an option. In both cases the mod simply carried on his duties post-lynch (and in Xyre's last game, Xyre was posting for DYH, and so voting him lynched DYH).
Neither UD (claimed inventor) or Xyre (I don't trust CP right now) are good targets right now.
BT or Jobie are much better options for unquestioningly going along with a Xyre wagon.
Because it was less than 100 posts into the game.
Besides, CP's certainty is making me less certain. I have a hard time trusting information that is claimed to be 100% accurate: because that so rarely happens in mafia games.
It will give us no information. CP takes all responsibility, and so we can't analyze anything.
We've already had a night 0.
It doesn't have to be either or.
Vote: BT
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last updated 03/23/11
BEAT THE SYSTEM, STICK IT TO THE MAN!!!!!!
Unvote, Vote: Xyre
Suck it, Trebek.
And I'm still fricking hungry. Nachos would be good.
MTGS stats (won/played)
As scum - 3/5
As town - 5/7
As neutral - none
(I really have been scum a lot)
I'm now writing for Eye of the Vortex, come check out MTG articles and other geek culture
I also moderate the MTG forum, so register (it's free) and voice your thoughts.
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Fair enough.
As far as the Xyre lynch goes, I'm not feeling it. I can't see the mod being a scum power role (since he's already got 100% info on every player), so I don't see the urgency here. We need to find scum who are going to be an active threat to the town (i.e. the ones who are actually players that are, by posts or abilities, actively hindering the town). Plus lynching the mod seems to me to be more likely a neutral win con than a town one. If at some point CP is confirmed 100% to be town (by death or otherwise) then I could see lynching Xyre, but as bateleur put it "if there's nothing better to do". And by "better to do" I assume he means "lynch a scummy player".
Record: 3-2
Simpsons Mafia (Newbie) - Vanilla Mafia - Win
The Fiasco Corporation - Town Reporter - Loss
Doomsday Mafia - Mafia Roleblocker - Win
Battle Royale Mafia - Serial Daykiller - Loss
Danger City Mafia - Vanilla Town - Win
There he wanted the confirmed town to choose a wagon on person of unknown alignment.
Here you want a person of unknown alignment to choose a wagon on a person of (supposedly) confirmed alignment.
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last updated 03/23/11