Vote Loran16. #72 was already scummy as hell (read #35 before it), and now you're just reaching for a reason to be in the trendy wagon (again).
For the record, Xyre's vote on Cyan is as justified as Cyan's vote on Xyre is not. Having done a similar thing once as scum doesn't justify adding the Nth vote to a wagon.
Trendy? Really?
Okay, so voting xyre first for fishing was trendy? Saying i thought that what he did wasnt that bad and wouldnt be followed up had it not been that it was day 1 was trendy? and then voting xyre due to him seeming to retaliatory voting both vamp and cyan?
I think my path of thinking was clear. I thought xyre was fishing early, and voted him for it. Later in the game, i still thought he was fishing but didnt think that his responses to accusations were that bad. Finally now with his votes i begin to think his responses merit a vote.
Tell me where the (again) comes from. Cuz...i dont see it. Heck the only wagon ive been on was the recent xyre one. Its not like im wagon hopping.
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I love Joboman, Poggy, Niv, and Vezok, because, while they may not be the best players, they still try to win. Having fun is the most important thing to a game, but I've learned that if you don't try to win, then you're ruining everyone else's fun.
I think what he means is that you did it (voting for me for fishing) because everyone else was doing it (hence bandwagonning), and now you're doing it again.
This wagon is too popular, and I think I may have scared anyone off of making any real support for Xyre anymore. We're just getting bogged down in saying which side of the discussion is scummier, which isn't helpful for anything. I'm going back to my Vote arim, which seems like it has more merit anyway. We can catch Xyre off his guard later.
What?! Look at the initial post; he is dead. Deceased. Kaputt. Indefinitely horizontal. In mafia games, you see, people are occasionally "killed off," and when that sad event occurs, he or she is no longer allowed to post, on account of rigor mortis and what-have-you.
'Welcome to Mafia Salvation', it said, 'Population: 3,660.' And someone, they never figured out who, had painted on the sign in red letters: '1,831 to lynch.'
They are not (all) scum trying to look town, but among them are scums trying to look town :teach:. Well, there probably are.
So… you've read the entirety of his billion games ? Just saying, the lack of a vote in that post most likely doesn't mean anything, only that he saw no voteworthy target at the time.
Xyre says he thought Spoon's use of a "we" rather than "I" was a slip of the keyboard. Which isn't actually improbable, I've myself sometimes "replaced" much longer words with others. There still is a problem, though. @Xyre : Why even bother asking ? Either it was an accident, in which case it has no meaning, or it was not an accident, in which case you were asking for information he may not want to (or rather, should not) reveal so soon. So why ask the question ?
EWP : I'm now wondering even more. Why did you need to know if he was "multitasking and whatnot" ? (not that it isn't the exact same question as above)
Perhaps because there are more than two players in this game ?
As far as I'm concerned, "Care to elaborate ?" = "Care to explain why you used a plural "we" ?" = "Care to give some info ?". I don't think I'm the only one who thinks that way.
Let me ask again : Why did you have to ask ? Is it this important to know if he had to mention himself with a plural (or just made an error) ? Why not simply wait for the next time he uses a first-person pronoun ? I don't get the reason for the rush (I also don't get how the town benefits from knowing whether it was intentional or not : at best they can try to guess his rolename, which isn't that helpful, and is something scums are better to do than townies, for the simple reason that they are a whole group sharing thoughts).
Vote Loran16. #72 was already scummy as hell (read #35 before it), and now you're just reaching for a reason to be in the trendy wagon (again).
For the record, Xyre's vote on Cyan is as justified as Cyan's vote on Xyre is not. Having done a similar thing once as scum doesn't justify adding the Nth vote to a wagon.
You're all over the guy, and now he's like your best buddy?
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Ambush Krotiq makes me laugh so much. I keep rereading the card and it keeps not having Flash. In what sense is this an ambush again? I just have visions of this huge Krotiq poorly concealed in some bushes, feeling slightly sad that his carefully planned ambushes never seem to work.
It's a perfectly ordinary day 1 bandwagon and isn't anywhere near lynching you. I hate the "woe is me" thing, and you know better.
Also "Cyan and Vampyr are being scummy together" was last game's meme
I also approve of Axelrod's post just above vis a vis ZDS and wish to subscribe to his newsletter, although I'm not inclined to move my vote off Xyre just yet.
I think what he means is that you did it (voting for me for fishing) because everyone else was doing it (hence bandwagonning), and now you're doing it again.
Uh....i was the first person to vote for you for fishing...it's the post after your fishing post (post #34 was your fishing, 35 was my vote)....soooo no?
but i'd like to hear him explain it to me since he's voting me and all and you're.....not.
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Quote from Seppel »
I love Joboman, Poggy, Niv, and Vezok, because, while they may not be the best players, they still try to win. Having fun is the most important thing to a game, but I've learned that if you don't try to win, then you're ruining everyone else's fun.
It's a perfectly ordinary day 1 bandwagon and isn't anywhere near lynching you. I hate the "woe is me" thing, and you know better.
Also "Cyan and Vampyr are being scummy together" was last game's meme
I also approve of Axelrod's post just above vis a vis ZDS and wish to subscribe to his newsletter, although I'm not inclined to move my vote off Xyre just yet.
When I posted that, I had seven or eight votes out of the 13 that it takes. That's close enough to justify the statement, sir.
Quote from loran16 »
but i'd like to hear him explain it to me since he's voting me and all and you're.....not.
Okay, loran, so maybe you can explain why the fishing is a bad thing here?
This is exactly what I mean when I'm talking about wagoning for stupid reasons. Xyre isn't the most townie-looking person here, so why resort to stupid reasons for voting him when you can use good ones? The only reason I can think of is that you're trying to manufacture a reason to be on the wagon, which seems pretty scummy.
What?! Look at the initial post; he is dead. Deceased. Kaputt. Indefinitely horizontal. In mafia games, you see, people are occasionally "killed off," and when that sad event occurs, he or she is no longer allowed to post, on account of rigor mortis and what-have-you.
'Welcome to Mafia Salvation', it said, 'Population: 3,660.' And someone, they never figured out who, had painted on the sign in red letters: '1,831 to lynch.'
Okay, loran, so maybe you can explain why the fishing is a bad thing here?
This is exactly what I mean when I'm talking about wagoning for stupid reasons. Xyre isn't the most townie-looking person here, so why resort to stupid reasons for voting him when you can use good ones? The only reason I can think of is that you're trying to manufacture a reason to be on the wagon, which seems pretty scummy.
Vote loran.
Whaaaa? I voted him originally because he fished in the first place. That's not why i voted him again cp. I voted him this time because of his scummy as hell defense, which was recently capped off by his seemingly retaliatory votes against vamp and cyan.
Can't you read what i say?
Also xyre, you really wanna go there?
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Quote from Seppel »
I love Joboman, Poggy, Niv, and Vezok, because, while they may not be the best players, they still try to win. Having fun is the most important thing to a game, but I've learned that if you don't try to win, then you're ruining everyone else's fun.
Whaaaa? I voted him originally because he fished in the first place. That's not why i voted him again cp. I voted him this time because of his scummy as hell defense, which was recently capped off by his seemingly retaliatory votes against vamp and cyan.
Can't you read what i say?
Also xyre, you really wanna go there?
So I don't get to vote you for have a poor reason to join the wagon in the first place? Past transgressions are forgotten, as long as you go to Duke? As far as I'm concerned, it looks just like you're looking for excuses to be on Xyre's wagon. 1 poor reason plus 1 mediocre reason doesn't amount to one good reason.
In fact, quite the opposite. The more crap reasons get brought up by different people against a person, the less it looks like a good lynch and the more it looks like manipulation.
What?! Look at the initial post; he is dead. Deceased. Kaputt. Indefinitely horizontal. In mafia games, you see, people are occasionally "killed off," and when that sad event occurs, he or she is no longer allowed to post, on account of rigor mortis and what-have-you.
'Welcome to Mafia Salvation', it said, 'Population: 3,660.' And someone, they never figured out who, had painted on the sign in red letters: '1,831 to lynch.'
Now, darling, you're getting there, but I want to see passion! Anger! This guy's mocking you! Making you look like a fool. Are you going to take that? No! You're angry, you're spiteful - I want to see that! Give me EMOTION!
Well, defending townies is a good way to get townie points later in the game. Of course, that begs the question of whether or not ZDS actually believes what he said, or if he's just speaking theoretically. Because, you know, if he actually thinks that Xyre is townie, and defending him is supposed to garner townie points later on, then what is lending him the sudden confidence to flip-flop like that? What does he know that we don't?
On the other hand, if ZDS is only speaking theoretically, then he presumably still believes Xyre to be scum, at least as a strong possibility. So why is ZDS trying to swing suspicion away from him? Is he protecting a scum buddy? This points to a strong inconsistency, if you ask me.
What?! Look at the initial post; he is dead. Deceased. Kaputt. Indefinitely horizontal. In mafia games, you see, people are occasionally "killed off," and when that sad event occurs, he or she is no longer allowed to post, on account of rigor mortis and what-have-you.
'Welcome to Mafia Salvation', it said, 'Population: 3,660.' And someone, they never figured out who, had painted on the sign in red letters: '1,831 to lynch.'
Funny, I thought you were speaking in a general way when you said fishing was not a wagon-worthy offense (yet it is vote-worthy, find the error).
IMO, Fishing is something that townies do almost as often as scum. It's a natural instinct to be curious after all. A vote for a small fishing attempt was appropriate there, not as a springboard for a wagon, but as a warning CUT IT OUT.
If said person continues with his fishing, or if he fishes for something that is should clearly not be out in the open, then a wagon was fine. But what xyre did there was fish for something that well..was going to be answered ANYHOW in the person's next post.
Anyhow, I'm going to reread the Xyre wagon from the entirety...my parents arent home atm, so i got extra time.
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Quote from Seppel »
I love Joboman, Poggy, Niv, and Vezok, because, while they may not be the best players, they still try to win. Having fun is the most important thing to a game, but I've learned that if you don't try to win, then you're ruining everyone else's fun.
The way you say it, it sounds like it wasn't worth noticing (so why the vote ?). It also sounds like you didn't actually thought of that until it has been brought up recently.
To be fair, you're right in that at the time of the post i didnt realize that the question of whether he had a PR would be answered by spoon's next post.
However, my vote was indeed just a warning at the time to stay away from fishing for role information.
I thought about it later, about the time that the wagon formed on xyre and i unvoted him, and after listening to xyre's defense i realized that whether he had a PR would be answered by spoon's next post.
Like i said, upon hearing Xyre's first defense i didn't really find it scummy, which is why i not only unvoted him, but made the point that being defensive does not necessarily indicate a scummy intent. It was only more recently, upon xyre's reactions to his 2 latest accusations, that i thought he was worthy of a vote.
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Quote from Seppel »
I love Joboman, Poggy, Niv, and Vezok, because, while they may not be the best players, they still try to win. Having fun is the most important thing to a game, but I've learned that if you don't try to win, then you're ruining everyone else's fun.
About that, what exactly do you think is wrong with these votes ?
Okay, i relooked at the wagon, and would concede that vampyr's vote is one of just plain bandwagoning based on the reasoning i disagreed with in the first place ,one which seemed to be more done for the sake of bandwagoning than any other reason. So i guess Xyre's vote of vampyr wasn't bad.
Cyan's vote on the other hand, i think was valid (i frequently make playstyle comparisons), and thus Xyre's vote back at him i dont really think is justified.
And that's my view.
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Quote from Seppel »
I love Joboman, Poggy, Niv, and Vezok, because, while they may not be the best players, they still try to win. Having fun is the most important thing to a game, but I've learned that if you don't try to win, then you're ruining everyone else's fun.
Hello again. Terribly sorry about not posting over the weekend, but I had some pressing engagements to see to.
On the Xyre wagon: Not terribly impressed with the Xyre bandwagon, which as I read it started off with Xyre's comment on a perceived grammatical error, or rather his excessive defense of calling Spoon out on it. I've never had the pleasure of actually playing with Xyre, but I'm fairly confident that if I had, I still wouldn't accept 'regular playstyle' as an excuse for that level of defensiveness.
Quote from loran16 »
Cyan's vote on the other hand, i think was valid (i frequently make playstyle comparisons), and thus Xyre's vote back at him i dont really think is justified.
Can you think of any circumstances where it might be justified? All it ended up doing was bringing more suspicion on to him.
No vote for now, since I do not labour under the delusion that a vote for anyone actually accomplishes anything meaningful at this point in time.
What?! Look at the initial post; he is dead. Deceased. Kaputt. Indefinitely horizontal. In mafia games, you see, people are occasionally "killed off," and when that sad event occurs, he or she is no longer allowed to post, on account of rigor mortis and what-have-you.
'Welcome to Mafia Salvation', it said, 'Population: 3,660.' And someone, they never figured out who, had painted on the sign in red letters: '1,831 to lynch.'
I disagree, Hvir. I think that it's important to throw votes around. It gets reactions a lot more reliably, and more honestly, sometimes, too.
Vote Hvir.
You just might be onto something there.
Unvote;
Vote: Hvir
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Ambush Krotiq makes me laugh so much. I keep rereading the card and it keeps not having Flash. In what sense is this an ambush again? I just have visions of this huge Krotiq poorly concealed in some bushes, feeling slightly sad that his carefully planned ambushes never seem to work.
I still need to do that playstyle on Xyre, and I wanna do some on Atlseal too, as I thought him majorly scummy in Elegant, too, when he ended up town.
Well, part of the reason to explain this, Pod, is I'm still trying out different playing styles to see which work best for me. So, feel free to try to read how I'm currently playing, but it probably wouldn't lend you much, if any, information. (Just trying to save you some time, is all)
I disagree, Hvir. I think that it's important to throw votes around. It gets reactions a lot more reliably, and more honestly, sometimes, too.
Vote Hvir.
Honestly cp, it looks like you're looking for any reason to vote for anyone now... I'm quite happy with where my vote is for now. Thank you very much.
@Xyre wagon: For how early it grew, I'd say it grew really quickly. I didn't see much validity to it at the time, myself. Tomorrow will lend me time to look into those that got on the wagon with less than stellar reasons. In the meantime, cp seems a perfectly valid place to keep my vote.
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If you're town and I'm mafia, you've already lost. You just don't know it yet.
I disagree, Hvir. I think that it's important to throw votes around. It gets reactions a lot more reliably, and more honestly, sometimes, too.
Vote Hvir.
Whaaa? Why exactly are we attacking hvir? I don't see it.
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Quote from Seppel »
I love Joboman, Poggy, Niv, and Vezok, because, while they may not be the best players, they still try to win. Having fun is the most important thing to a game, but I've learned that if you don't try to win, then you're ruining everyone else's fun.
(“Hit the lights. I want him to look dramatic and sincere. Quiet, here he comes.”)
“Do any of you even care where we are, how we got here and what we are doing here?”
("Close up. I want a close up of this.")
“ I get that you all seem to be playing that mafia game. I used to play it in school, but doesn’t anyone think we should get moving? I’m going to go looking around, going up to the top down to the bottom. Maybe there’s a way out. I don’t know, but it beats staying here and arguing amonst ourselves.
If anyone is interested, I’ve been listening.
To your discussion, and to your game and if I were playing the game I’d rank you people this way in terms of liability or likelihood of being mafia.
Most likely to least likely, but......, you know what?, maybe it isn't such a good Idea to come right out and list all of you.
Here, this is the most suspicous and the least as I see it.
carrion pigeons -7
Gratis +5
Now this is as of post #127. I’m reading from there on to see how much this might change. Sorry if this looks a little, well anal, it’s what I do. I mean what I do for a living, you know numbers, risk assessments, stuff like that. I'll tell you what though. The second most suspicous player is a real surprise. I'm keeping a special eye on him.
Anyway, since you guys all seem set on playing this game
I’ll VOTE: Carrion Pigeons
and start trying to head outside.”
Hawkeye7 then moves off actively looking for a way out of the Mall.
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RELAPSED MAFIA JUNKIE
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The jab was appreciated. Why were my votes on Cyan and Vampyr unjustified, hmm?
Your vote carries far less power then you seem to think it does. With 24 players in the game, it takes 13 votes to lynch someone. At the point you voted Vampyr, and then for Cyan, neither of them had ANY votes. All that your retaliatory votes do for you is make you look even worse than before.
Your vote carries far less power then you seem to think it does. With 24 players in the game, it takes 13 votes to lynch someone. At the point you voted Vampyr, and then for Cyan, neither of them had ANY votes. All that your retaliatory votes do for you is make you look even worse than before.
If they were retaliatory, wouldn't we be making more of a mess of them right now?
In reality, you fail to recognize that Vampyr shamelessly bandwagonned me, and then Cyan joined in without any real rationality. Yes, these two were voting for me, but my votes were motivated by a desire to point out how scummy they were acting, not "retaliation", as you try to pin on me.
Anyway, while I don't support loran, it looks to me like the town's decided that wagons on him and Hvir are in order. This is idiotic. Cyan, carrion pigeons, and ZeDorkSlipeur are the people on my scumdar at the moment, especially the former. My vote is quite happy where it is.
If they were retaliatory, wouldn't we be making more of a mess of them right now?
In reality, you fail to recognize that Vampyr shamelessly bandwagonned me, and then Cyan joined in without any real rationality. Yes, these two were voting for me, but my votes were motivated by a desire to point out how scummy they were acting, not "retaliation", as you try to pin on me.
Would you argue that placing votes on them did NOT make you look any worse? You don't HAVE to vote for someone if you disagree with what they're saying. Voting for someone is a poor substitute for sound logical argument.
Anyway, while I don't support loran, it looks to me like the town's decided that wagons on him and Hvir are in order. This is idiotic. Cyan, carrion pigeons, and ZeDorkSlipeur are the people on my scumdar at the moment, especially the former. My vote is quite happy where it is.
By 'wagon', are you referring to carrion pigeons rather poorly veiled attempt to disprove my earlier statement about voting being unnecessary so early in the game, and Axelrod's follow-up vote? Storm in a teacup.
Hello again. Terribly sorry about not posting over the weekend, but I had some pressing engagements to see to.
On the Xyre wagon: Not terribly impressed with the Xyre bandwagon, which as I read it started off with Xyre's comment on a perceived grammatical error, or rather his excessive defense of calling Spoon out on it. I've never had the pleasure of actually playing with Xyre, but I'm fairly confident that if I had, I still wouldn't accept 'regular playstyle' as an excuse for that level of defensiveness.
The above confuses me. You're not impressed with the Xyre wagon but you also don't accept Xyre's excuse for how defensive he was being? I would like to be sure I'm reading you correctly.
Quote from Hvir »
No vote for now, since I do not labour under the delusion that a vote for anyone actually accomplishes anything meaningful at this point in time.
It would accomplish proving you can vote, if this hasn't already occurred.
Quote from Hvir »
Your vote carries far less power then you seem to think it does. With 24 players in the game, it takes 13 votes to lynch someone. At the point you voted Vampyr, and then for Cyan, neither of them had ANY votes.
While a single vote is not going to accomplish anything meaningful by itself, we need 13 of those single votes on one person to progress. Mocking a vote because it's the first one on someone is silly- SOMEONE always has to be the first. Deep, I know.
Not to say Xyre's votes were great or anything, but I don't like that reason for opposing them.
ZDS is totally worth a wagon, but I don't see what Cyan did that should draw him any attention at all.
Also, @Hvir: what gives you the impression that I'm trying to veil anything? I quite specifically contradicted you. are you trying to say that you would have reacted the same way if I hadn't voted? Because I don't believe you. I just think you were trying to stay under the radar, and are ticked that someone called you on it.
Come on. Vote me. You know you want to, however hypocritical it'll make you look.
What?! Look at the initial post; he is dead. Deceased. Kaputt. Indefinitely horizontal. In mafia games, you see, people are occasionally "killed off," and when that sad event occurs, he or she is no longer allowed to post, on account of rigor mortis and what-have-you.
'Welcome to Mafia Salvation', it said, 'Population: 3,660.' And someone, they never figured out who, had painted on the sign in red letters: '1,831 to lynch.'
Come on. Vote me. You know you want to, however hypocritical it'll make you look.
Vote Hvir.
ummmm, hey, that's something i would say....I take offense to that!
[/kidding]
Unvote, FoS CP. I want to know what you think about Hvir. I've heard what rafk thinks, but you've so far seemed just to vote him and well....lets not be chamber, mkay?
ehh scratch that, Vote CP. Maybe thatll get you to explain your actions.
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I love Joboman, Poggy, Niv, and Vezok, because, while they may not be the best players, they still try to win. Having fun is the most important thing to a game, but I've learned that if you don't try to win, then you're ruining everyone else's fun.
The above confuses me. You're not impressed with the Xyre wagon but you also don't accept Xyre's excuse for how defensive he was being? I would like to be sure I'm reading you correctly.
Sorry for being unclear - I'm not impressed by the fact that the wagon is hinging on Xyre's initial questioning of Spoon's use of 'we' and his perceived defensiveness. I don't actually believe Xyre to be scum at this point - while it wouldn't be a shocking revelation to me if he were, I see him as an easily-flustered player right now.
While a single vote is not going to accomplish anything meaningful by itself, we need 13 of those single votes on one person to progress. Mocking a vote because it's the first one on someone is silly- SOMEONE always has to be the first. Deep, I know.
Not to say Xyre's votes were great or anything, but I don't like that reason for opposing them.
I would probably give more weight to Xyre's votes if they actually STAYED on for a significant period of time. His rapid unvote-vote tactic doesn't accomplish anything and comes across as petty.
Come on. Vote me. You know you want to, however hypocritical it'll make you look.
Vote Hvir.
What exactly would voting for you accomplish? You've already demonstrated the fact that you have multiple-votes, an ability that is traditionally pro-town. The fact that you've been quite free in the use of the ability on the first day leads me to believe that you are not scum, unless you're taking a tremendous gambit as scum with multiple votes.
Almost every single post by ZDS just screams scum to me. I'll be making a more detailed case later, for now the vote obv stays.
In other news, I can't make heads and tails in the tug-of-war between Xyre's attackers and the attackers of Xyre's attackers.
I've been reading and re-reading Xyre's posts since I voted him and while I think he was stretching things to explain himself, I'm getting a more frustrated tone from his posts rather than a desperate tone. Which leads me to believe he's town. So I'll Unvote: Xyre.
It's interesting to see CP swing his multi-vote ability like the blunt force of destruction he seems to want it to be. I've never seen multi-votes used so freely, wildly and rather recklessly.
I'm not buying the wagon on Hvir, I just don't see the reasons behind it as being valid. On the other hand, loran looks like a good target. It seems to me as if loran is taking the easy route for a vote and slapping Xyre with a vote just for OMGUS'ing. Am I reading that wrong, loran?
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Games finished:17
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Town/Mafia/Other - 13/2/2
Won/Lost/replaced/modkilled- 4/13/3/1
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Ye have enemies? Good, good - it means ye've stood up for something, sometime in thy life. - Elminster of Shadowdale
I've been reading and re-reading Xyre's posts since I voted him and while I think he was stretching things to explain himself, I'm getting a more frustrated tone from his posts rather than a desperate tone. Which leads me to believe he's town. So I'll Unvote: Xyre.
It's interesting to see CP swing his multi-vote ability like the blunt force of destruction he seems to want it to be. I've never seen multi-votes used so freely, wildly and rather recklessly.
I'm not buying the wagon on Hvir, I just don't see the reasons behind it as being valid. On the other hand, loran looks like a good target. It seems to me as if loran is taking the easy route for a vote and slapping Xyre with a vote just for OMGUS'ing. Am I reading that wrong, loran?
I've already addressed the reasoning for my vote. If you read my reasoning, you'll get my answer. I've also already voted CP since then, but well, go ahead and read my posts before you post again. I dont feel the need to explain myself twice, especially after you obviously havent read my prior posts.
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Quote from Seppel »
I love Joboman, Poggy, Niv, and Vezok, because, while they may not be the best players, they still try to win. Having fun is the most important thing to a game, but I've learned that if you don't try to win, then you're ruining everyone else's fun.
For the record, my votes on Hvir are strictly to pull a response from him. I think he did not react to them very well, and that's a point for future reference, but there is no reason to start a bandwagon on him. Axel may disagree; I don't know.
The people I'm genuinely interested in are loran and ZDS, which is why those are the ones I actually made the beginnings of cases against. If we're going to have a bandwagon, it may as well be one of them.
Anyway,
Quote from Vampyr »
It's interesting to see CP swing his multi-vote ability like the blunt force of destruction he seems to want it to be. I've never seen multi-votes used so freely, wildly and rather recklessly.
Free and wild? I'm okay with that. Recklessly? No. Reckless would have been piling votes on Xyre for no other reason than because I could put him in lynching range.
What?! Look at the initial post; he is dead. Deceased. Kaputt. Indefinitely horizontal. In mafia games, you see, people are occasionally "killed off," and when that sad event occurs, he or she is no longer allowed to post, on account of rigor mortis and what-have-you.
'Welcome to Mafia Salvation', it said, 'Population: 3,660.' And someone, they never figured out who, had painted on the sign in red letters: '1,831 to lynch.'
I've been reading and re-reading Xyre's posts since I voted him and while I think he was stretching things to explain himself, I'm getting a more frustrated tone from his posts rather than a desperate tone. Which leads me to believe he's town. So I'll Unvote: Xyre.
It's interesting to see CP swing his multi-vote ability like the blunt force of destruction he seems to want it to be. I've never seen multi-votes used so freely, wildly and rather recklessly.
I'm not buying the wagon on Hvir, I just don't see the reasons behind it as being valid. On the other hand, loran looks like a good target. It seems to me as if loran is taking the easy route for a vote and slapping Xyre with a vote just for OMGUS'ing. Am I reading that wrong, loran?
Alert subroutines have been engaged, Mr. Vampyr. Your lack of conviction is troubling.
Mr. Xyre has been in the spotlight for some time, has he not? But now the focus of discussion is shifting. Other options have been brought up. And it is now that you choose to unvote, without feeling there's any better place for your vote to go. Your ostensible reason for doing so does not inspire confidence, Mr. Vampyr.
You impugn Mr. Carrion's judgment, without leveling any actual charges. What, Mr. Vampyr, was the point of that remark?
You do not favor the wagon on Mr. Hvir, but you cannot bring yourself to give a more specific reason than "the reasons don't seem valid."
You see Mr. Loran as a good target, but you do not place your own vote.
Unvote, Vote Vampyr. Your entire post seems to me to be a test balloon. You've taken off your vote and not even moved it onto the person you ostensibly think is a good lead. You want us to remember that you're here, but you don't want to offend anyone.
Well, Mr. Vampyr, I shall not forget that you are here. Make no mistake about that. You cannot escape the gaze of the Matrix.
Alert subroutines have been engaged, Mr. Vampyr. Your lack of conviction is troubling.
Mr. Xyre has been in the spotlight for some time, has he not? But now the focus of discussion is shifting. Other options have been brought up. And it is now that you choose to unvote, without feeling there's any better place for your vote to go. Your ostensible reason for doing so does not inspire confidence, Mr. Vampyr.
You impugn Mr. Carrion's judgment, without leveling any actual charges. What, Mr. Vampyr, was the point of that remark?
You do not favor the wagon on Mr. Hvir, but you cannot bring yourself to give a more specific reason than "the reasons don't seem valid."
You see Mr. Loran as a good target, but you do not place your own vote.
Unvote, Vote Vampyr. Your entire post seems to me to be a test balloon. You've taken off your vote and not even moved it onto the person you ostensibly think is a good lead. You want us to remember that you're here, but you don't want to offend anyone.
Well, Mr. Vampyr, I shall not forget that you are here. Make no mistake about that. You cannot escape the gaze of the Matrix.
Bold emphasis mine.
eight Mr. in one post = Unvote, Vote Arimnaes.
Annoying as hell, if it isn't a posting restriction. Roleplaying is fine and all...but...some people are taking it too far.
Alright, I'm caught up and even though this wagon has passed, my impression of Xyre's defense is a lot like what I saw out of him in Magic Mafia where he was town. His reaction there meant that he wasn't that hard of a mislynch. I have only seen him in 24 besides that (IIRC), but I am trying to purge that game from my memory.
A couple other things of note: Spoon seeing if there is anything that happens when one votes the mod. Given that this is a specialty game (and all the speculation around him in general), I think that this is a very interesting line of inquiry.
CP's multi-vote revelation isn't something that I would have done per se although I understand it. I think that keeping close notes of his play today will benefit us in the long run.
Finally, I want to see what Alx brings to bear against ZDS, as I don't really see much of a case on him at the moment.
Annoying as hell, if it isn't a posting restriction. Roleplaying is fine and all...but...some people are taking it too far.
I really don't see how that is taking anything too far Mr. Spoon. The way I see it is that it is very light roleplay, which is actually quite refreshing to read amongst most of these other rather droll posts. I am not a roleplayer myself, but I don't think we should be harassing others for doing it unless it is interfering with the game. Let them have their fun.
vote Spoon
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Trendy? Really?
Okay, so voting xyre first for fishing was trendy? Saying i thought that what he did wasnt that bad and wouldnt be followed up had it not been that it was day 1 was trendy? and then voting xyre due to him seeming to retaliatory voting both vamp and cyan?
I think my path of thinking was clear. I thought xyre was fishing early, and voted him for it. Later in the game, i still thought he was fishing but didnt think that his responses to accusations were that bad. Finally now with his votes i begin to think his responses merit a vote.
Tell me where the (again) comes from. Cuz...i dont see it. Heck the only wagon ive been on was the recent xyre one. Its not like im wagon hopping.
Logical Reasoning is dead; Long Live Stupidity
Experiments Series: #5 (Courtly Intrigue Mafia) | #4 (Drunken Tracker) | #3 (Big Red Button) - coming soon | #2 (Pope Mafia) | #1 (Iso's Inflammable Mafia)
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Old Games (bad): The Greenwood Affair | Blood Moon Mafia
This wagon is too popular, and I think I may have scared anyone off of making any real support for Xyre anymore. We're just getting bogged down in saying which side of the discussion is scummier, which isn't helpful for anything. I'm going back to my Vote arim, which seems like it has more merit anyway. We can catch Xyre off his guard later.
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To this:
You're all over the guy, and now he's like your best buddy?
It's a perfectly ordinary day 1 bandwagon and isn't anywhere near lynching you. I hate the "woe is me" thing, and you know better.
Also "Cyan and Vampyr are being scummy together" was last game's meme
I also approve of Axelrod's post just above vis a vis ZDS and wish to subscribe to his newsletter, although I'm not inclined to move my vote off Xyre just yet.
Uh....i was the first person to vote for you for fishing...it's the post after your fishing post (post #34 was your fishing, 35 was my vote)....soooo no?
but i'd like to hear him explain it to me since he's voting me and all and you're.....not.
Logical Reasoning is dead; Long Live Stupidity
When I posted that, I had seven or eight votes out of the 13 that it takes. That's close enough to justify the statement, sir.
Do you want me to?
Experiments Series: #5 (Courtly Intrigue Mafia) | #4 (Drunken Tracker) | #3 (Big Red Button) - coming soon | #2 (Pope Mafia) | #1 (Iso's Inflammable Mafia)
Mini Games: MTGS Mafia Redux II (Invitational, Evil Mirror Universe) | Unreal City
Old Games (bad): The Greenwood Affair | Blood Moon Mafia
This is exactly what I mean when I'm talking about wagoning for stupid reasons. Xyre isn't the most townie-looking person here, so why resort to stupid reasons for voting him when you can use good ones? The only reason I can think of is that you're trying to manufacture a reason to be on the wagon, which seems pretty scummy.
Vote loran.
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Whaaaa? I voted him originally because he fished in the first place. That's not why i voted him again cp. I voted him this time because of his scummy as hell defense, which was recently capped off by his seemingly retaliatory votes against vamp and cyan.
Can't you read what i say?
Also xyre, you really wanna go there?
Logical Reasoning is dead; Long Live Stupidity
So I don't get to vote you for have a poor reason to join the wagon in the first place? Past transgressions are forgotten, as long as you go to Duke? As far as I'm concerned, it looks just like you're looking for excuses to be on Xyre's wagon. 1 poor reason plus 1 mediocre reason doesn't amount to one good reason.
In fact, quite the opposite. The more crap reasons get brought up by different people against a person, the less it looks like a good lynch and the more it looks like manipulation.
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Now, darling, you're getting there, but I want to see passion! Anger! This guy's mocking you! Making you look like a fool. Are you going to take that? No! You're angry, you're spiteful - I want to see that! Give me EMOTION!
Experiments Series: #5 (Courtly Intrigue Mafia) | #4 (Drunken Tracker) | #3 (Big Red Button) - coming soon | #2 (Pope Mafia) | #1 (Iso's Inflammable Mafia)
Mini Games: MTGS Mafia Redux II (Invitational, Evil Mirror Universe) | Unreal City
Old Games (bad): The Greenwood Affair | Blood Moon Mafia
Why exactly they defending Xyre would give them townie points, irrespective of their alignments?
We'll make you an offer you can't refuse.
Hosting: Vista Mafia
Hosted: Intrigue Mafia (Mini), Seance #43 (Basic), Conflux Mafia (Normal), Goo Mafia (FTQ), Experiment #26 (Basic)
Ongoing/Completed - 0/41
Town/Mafia/SK/Survivor - 30/6/4/1
NKed/Lynched/Survived - 15/11/15
On the other hand, if ZDS is only speaking theoretically, then he presumably still believes Xyre to be scum, at least as a strong possibility. So why is ZDS trying to swing suspicion away from him? Is he protecting a scum buddy? This points to a strong inconsistency, if you ask me.
Unvote, unvote, unvote, vote ZDS.
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IMO, Fishing is something that townies do almost as often as scum. It's a natural instinct to be curious after all. A vote for a small fishing attempt was appropriate there, not as a springboard for a wagon, but as a warning CUT IT OUT.
If said person continues with his fishing, or if he fishes for something that is should clearly not be out in the open, then a wagon was fine. But what xyre did there was fish for something that well..was going to be answered ANYHOW in the person's next post.
Anyhow, I'm going to reread the Xyre wagon from the entirety...my parents arent home atm, so i got extra time.
Logical Reasoning is dead; Long Live Stupidity
To be fair, you're right in that at the time of the post i didnt realize that the question of whether he had a PR would be answered by spoon's next post.
However, my vote was indeed just a warning at the time to stay away from fishing for role information.
I thought about it later, about the time that the wagon formed on xyre and i unvoted him, and after listening to xyre's defense i realized that whether he had a PR would be answered by spoon's next post.
Like i said, upon hearing Xyre's first defense i didn't really find it scummy, which is why i not only unvoted him, but made the point that being defensive does not necessarily indicate a scummy intent. It was only more recently, upon xyre's reactions to his 2 latest accusations, that i thought he was worthy of a vote.
Logical Reasoning is dead; Long Live Stupidity
Okay, i relooked at the wagon, and would concede that vampyr's vote is one of just plain bandwagoning based on the reasoning i disagreed with in the first place ,one which seemed to be more done for the sake of bandwagoning than any other reason. So i guess Xyre's vote of vampyr wasn't bad.
Cyan's vote on the other hand, i think was valid (i frequently make playstyle comparisons), and thus Xyre's vote back at him i dont really think is justified.
And that's my view.
Logical Reasoning is dead; Long Live Stupidity
On the Xyre wagon: Not terribly impressed with the Xyre bandwagon, which as I read it started off with Xyre's comment on a perceived grammatical error, or rather his excessive defense of calling Spoon out on it. I've never had the pleasure of actually playing with Xyre, but I'm fairly confident that if I had, I still wouldn't accept 'regular playstyle' as an excuse for that level of defensiveness.
Can you think of any circumstances where it might be justified? All it ended up doing was bringing more suspicion on to him.
No vote for now, since I do not labour under the delusion that a vote for anyone actually accomplishes anything meaningful at this point in time.
Vote Hvir.
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Alas, my name is not Xyre, and as such, I do not care. If you want something, ask for it directly.
You just might be onto something there.
Unvote;
Vote: Hvir
Well, part of the reason to explain this, Pod, is I'm still trying out different playing styles to see which work best for me. So, feel free to try to read how I'm currently playing, but it probably wouldn't lend you much, if any, information. (Just trying to save you some time, is all)
Honestly cp, it looks like you're looking for any reason to vote for anyone now... I'm quite happy with where my vote is for now. Thank you very much.
@Xyre wagon: For how early it grew, I'd say it grew really quickly. I didn't see much validity to it at the time, myself. Tomorrow will lend me time to look into those that got on the wagon with less than stellar reasons. In the meantime, cp seems a perfectly valid place to keep my vote.
The jab was appreciated. Why were my votes on Cyan and Vampyr unjustified, hmm?
Experiments Series: #5 (Courtly Intrigue Mafia) | #4 (Drunken Tracker) | #3 (Big Red Button) - coming soon | #2 (Pope Mafia) | #1 (Iso's Inflammable Mafia)
Mini Games: MTGS Mafia Redux II (Invitational, Evil Mirror Universe) | Unreal City
Old Games (bad): The Greenwood Affair | Blood Moon Mafia
Whaaa? Why exactly are we attacking hvir? I don't see it.
Logical Reasoning is dead; Long Live Stupidity
(“Hit the lights. I want him to look dramatic and sincere. Quiet, here he comes.”)
“Do any of you even care where we are, how we got here and what we are doing here?”
("Close up. I want a close up of this.")
“ I get that you all seem to be playing that mafia game. I used to play it in school, but doesn’t anyone think we should get moving? I’m going to go looking around, going up to the top down to the bottom. Maybe there’s a way out. I don’t know, but it beats staying here and arguing amonst ourselves.
If anyone is interested, I’ve been listening.
To your discussion, and to your game and if I were playing the game I’d rank you people this way in terms of liability or likelihood of being mafia.
Most likely to least likely, but......, you know what?, maybe it isn't such a good Idea to come right out and list all of you.
Here, this is the most suspicous and the least as I see it.
carrion pigeons -7
Gratis +5
Now this is as of post #127. I’m reading from there on to see how much this might change. Sorry if this looks a little, well anal, it’s what I do. I mean what I do for a living, you know numbers, risk assessments, stuff like that. I'll tell you what though. The second most suspicous player is a real surprise. I'm keeping a special eye on him.
Anyway, since you guys all seem set on playing this game
I’ll VOTE: Carrion Pigeons
and start trying to head outside.”
Hawkeye7 then moves off actively looking for a way out of the Mall.
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Your vote carries far less power then you seem to think it does. With 24 players in the game, it takes 13 votes to lynch someone. At the point you voted Vampyr, and then for Cyan, neither of them had ANY votes. All that your retaliatory votes do for you is make you look even worse than before.
If they were retaliatory, wouldn't we be making more of a mess of them right now?
In reality, you fail to recognize that Vampyr shamelessly bandwagonned me, and then Cyan joined in without any real rationality. Yes, these two were voting for me, but my votes were motivated by a desire to point out how scummy they were acting, not "retaliation", as you try to pin on me.
Anyway, while I don't support loran, it looks to me like the town's decided that wagons on him and Hvir are in order. This is idiotic. Cyan, carrion pigeons, and ZeDorkSlipeur are the people on my scumdar at the moment, especially the former. My vote is quite happy where it is.
Experiments Series: #5 (Courtly Intrigue Mafia) | #4 (Drunken Tracker) | #3 (Big Red Button) - coming soon | #2 (Pope Mafia) | #1 (Iso's Inflammable Mafia)
Mini Games: MTGS Mafia Redux II (Invitational, Evil Mirror Universe) | Unreal City
Old Games (bad): The Greenwood Affair | Blood Moon Mafia
Would you argue that placing votes on them did NOT make you look any worse? You don't HAVE to vote for someone if you disagree with what they're saying. Voting for someone is a poor substitute for sound logical argument.
By 'wagon', are you referring to carrion pigeons rather poorly veiled attempt to disprove my earlier statement about voting being unnecessary so early in the game, and Axelrod's follow-up vote? Storm in a teacup.
The above confuses me. You're not impressed with the Xyre wagon but you also don't accept Xyre's excuse for how defensive he was being? I would like to be sure I'm reading you correctly.
It would accomplish proving you can vote, if this hasn't already occurred.
While a single vote is not going to accomplish anything meaningful by itself, we need 13 of those single votes on one person to progress. Mocking a vote because it's the first one on someone is silly- SOMEONE always has to be the first. Deep, I know.
Not to say Xyre's votes were great or anything, but I don't like that reason for opposing them.
Has it?
Who died and made you the boss of what the town has decided?
Why does that post feel like you are commenting on the town as a separate entity, e.g. one you are not a part of?
When did you stop beating your wife?
Also, @Hvir: what gives you the impression that I'm trying to veil anything? I quite specifically contradicted you. are you trying to say that you would have reacted the same way if I hadn't voted? Because I don't believe you. I just think you were trying to stay under the radar, and are ticked that someone called you on it.
Come on. Vote me. You know you want to, however hypocritical it'll make you look.
Vote Hvir.
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ummmm, hey, that's something i would say....I take offense to that!
[/kidding]
Unvote, FoS CP. I want to know what you think about Hvir. I've heard what rafk thinks, but you've so far seemed just to vote him and well....lets not be chamber, mkay?
ehh scratch that, Vote CP. Maybe thatll get you to explain your actions.
Logical Reasoning is dead; Long Live Stupidity
Sorry for being unclear - I'm not impressed by the fact that the wagon is hinging on Xyre's initial questioning of Spoon's use of 'we' and his perceived defensiveness. I don't actually believe Xyre to be scum at this point - while it wouldn't be a shocking revelation to me if he were, I see him as an easily-flustered player right now.
I already mock-voted for loran16 earlier in the day.
I would probably give more weight to Xyre's votes if they actually STAYED on for a significant period of time. His rapid unvote-vote tactic doesn't accomplish anything and comes across as petty.
What exactly would voting for you accomplish? You've already demonstrated the fact that you have multiple-votes, an ability that is traditionally pro-town. The fact that you've been quite free in the use of the ability on the first day leads me to believe that you are not scum, unless you're taking a tremendous gambit as scum with multiple votes.
I have no reason to vote for you.
Doesn't count until it shows up on an official votecount.
Fair enough, I guess.
Vote loran16
My vote doesn't mean anything; I'll remove it as soon as Azrael provides another vote count. It's just that loran16 is Player #1 in the listing.
In other news, I can't make heads and tails in the tug-of-war between Xyre's attackers and the attackers of Xyre's attackers.
Good to see chamber joined us in this game.
I've been reading and re-reading Xyre's posts since I voted him and while I think he was stretching things to explain himself, I'm getting a more frustrated tone from his posts rather than a desperate tone. Which leads me to believe he's town. So I'll Unvote: Xyre.
It's interesting to see CP swing his multi-vote ability like the blunt force of destruction he seems to want it to be. I've never seen multi-votes used so freely, wildly and rather recklessly.
I'm not buying the wagon on Hvir, I just don't see the reasons behind it as being valid. On the other hand, loran looks like a good target. It seems to me as if loran is taking the easy route for a vote and slapping Xyre with a vote just for OMGUS'ing. Am I reading that wrong, loran?
PM me if you have any to trade or sell.
Games finished:17
Games ongoing:1
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Ye have enemies? Good, good - it means ye've stood up for something, sometime in thy life. - Elminster of Shadowdale
I've already addressed the reasoning for my vote. If you read my reasoning, you'll get my answer. I've also already voted CP since then, but well, go ahead and read my posts before you post again. I dont feel the need to explain myself twice, especially after you obviously havent read my prior posts.
Logical Reasoning is dead; Long Live Stupidity
I also have a theory about CP, though I'm not sure whether it means he's scum or town. I'll have to think it over a bit.
The people I'm genuinely interested in are loran and ZDS, which is why those are the ones I actually made the beginnings of cases against. If we're going to have a bandwagon, it may as well be one of them.
Anyway,
Free and wild? I'm okay with that. Recklessly? No. Reckless would have been piling votes on Xyre for no other reason than because I could put him in lynching range.
Unvote, unvote, unvote, vote Vampyr.
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Mr. Xyre has been in the spotlight for some time, has he not? But now the focus of discussion is shifting. Other options have been brought up. And it is now that you choose to unvote, without feeling there's any better place for your vote to go. Your ostensible reason for doing so does not inspire confidence, Mr. Vampyr.
You impugn Mr. Carrion's judgment, without leveling any actual charges. What, Mr. Vampyr, was the point of that remark?
You do not favor the wagon on Mr. Hvir, but you cannot bring yourself to give a more specific reason than "the reasons don't seem valid."
You see Mr. Loran as a good target, but you do not place your own vote.
Unvote, Vote Vampyr. Your entire post seems to me to be a test balloon. You've taken off your vote and not even moved it onto the person you ostensibly think is a good lead. You want us to remember that you're here, but you don't want to offend anyone.
Well, Mr. Vampyr, I shall not forget that you are here. Make no mistake about that. You cannot escape the gaze of the Matrix.
Bold emphasis mine.
eight Mr. in one post = Unvote, Vote Arimnaes.
Annoying as hell, if it isn't a posting restriction. Roleplaying is fine and all...but...some people are taking it too far.
A couple other things of note: Spoon seeing if there is anything that happens when one votes the mod. Given that this is a specialty game (and all the speculation around him in general), I think that this is a very interesting line of inquiry.
CP's multi-vote revelation isn't something that I would have done per se although I understand it. I think that keeping close notes of his play today will benefit us in the long run.
Finally, I want to see what Alx brings to bear against ZDS, as I don't really see much of a case on him at the moment.
Vote: Azrael
I really don't see how that is taking anything too far Mr. Spoon. The way I see it is that it is very light roleplay, which is actually quite refreshing to read amongst most of these other rather droll posts. I am not a roleplayer myself, but I don't think we should be harassing others for doing it unless it is interfering with the game. Let them have their fun.
vote Spoon