I am Danny Hobbes. I am a gambler. Each night I will reveal the alignment of one player at random. Any abilities that are supposed to target me will instead target a random player. If I am lynched, a random player will die in my stead. (This will only happen once, to my knowledge.)
Do you now understand the danger?
To your knowledge? That doesn't make any sense.
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So, hm. You are not viggable. You also are not copable. You also can not be lynched.
Seems like that would be logical, considering he's the mod. Obviously this role would be broken on an actual player, but my bet is that Xyre assigned himself strict behavioral guidelines prior to the game to ensure that he doesn't inadvertantly break the game, but rather exists and posts like a normal player as a way of generating discussion and controversy. At which he's succeeded.
In either case, we can at least 'till night to see what his ability turns up.
Xyre: At what point during night does your ability fire?
Look at Xyre's games. Not even newbies are that bad at being scum, y'know?
While a good point, here's how I'm currently looking at this game: we've been told it'll be wacky, crazy, nuts, and more. Apparently we should trust no one. Any and everything may be a lie. So how many layers of deception are there? Taking things at face value and hoping it's an even number seems like a fair way to start.
This doesn't mean I'm not willing to listen to good logic and predictions, only that I'm going to start with exactly what is given to me no matter how bizare the game is.
EWP: Unvote, Vote: Ged Think with your own brain, sheep.
I am. Note that it took convincing to get that vote out. Please don't attack me for something others have done before me and continue to do, let alone for a faulty reason in the first place.
Unvote anyway, because I do want to think about that claim. It's probably worth waiting until night to check, anyway. SG (or someone else), is Danny Hobbes someone I should know or just a name?
I don't think that any of the names are anything. They are simply names Xyre made. But if I were to make random names for roles I wouldn't just make them totally worthless. As the mod, maybe Xyre can shed some light. Again, I doubt he can tell us much.
I am trying here, Xyre. I really am. And I have a few ideas. But if you could be a little more useful, it mighr help me get out of that box.
At any rate, there is a claim. Unvote Xyre x2. I am going to leave one for now to ensure continued answers to questions.
He's claimed cop, which means we need to seriously rethink the lynch based on whatever scum tells he's given. On the other hand, he's claimed unpreventable, unkillable, unframable cop.
*chokes*
I'm trying hard, here. I really am. But I am completely failing to see how this role could be anything but broken.
Let me put it this way: let's say for the sake of argument that we lynch at random every day/night, that the mafia kills the confirmed player each night, and that there are no extra kills. A mafia must survive an inspection and a lynch every day until day eleven under those circumstances. The odds of that happening are 21/22x19/20x17/18x15/16x13/14x11/12x9/10x7/8x5/6x3/4x1/2=16.81%
Approximately a 1/6 chance for the mafia to win, even before applying the intelligence of the town or any other abilities that are relevant in the game, such as a doc, or even taking into account the fact that mafia don't get to pick who to kill. I would call that broken.
On the plus side, we have the fact that we have an obvious liar who claims to be unlynchable. Is there some reason we shouldn't test that?
What?! Look at the initial post; he is dead. Deceased. Kaputt. Indefinitely horizontal. In mafia games, you see, people are occasionally "killed off," and when that sad event occurs, he or she is no longer allowed to post, on account of rigor mortis and what-have-you.
'Welcome to Mafia Salvation', it said, 'Population: 3,660.' And someone, they never figured out who, had painted on the sign in red letters: '1,831 to lynch.'
What?! Look at the initial post; he is dead. Deceased. Kaputt. Indefinitely horizontal. In mafia games, you see, people are occasionally "killed off," and when that sad event occurs, he or she is no longer allowed to post, on account of rigor mortis and what-have-you.
'Welcome to Mafia Salvation', it said, 'Population: 3,660.' And someone, they never figured out who, had painted on the sign in red letters: '1,831 to lynch.'
It's good to see that you haven't learned anything about false claiming since the last game in which I proved you for a liar and you turned out to be the mafia godfather, Xyre. The role that you claimed is absolutely ridiculous, for all of the reasons that CP listed. Plus, just like the last time you false-claimed a role(I'm referring to Player's Choice Mafia on news with both of these references), you've positioned a role that is too obvious and is just designed to discourage people from lynching you.
I also want to note that I think that Ged's interaction w/ Xyre is telling, and will be something I look at tonight/tomorrow, and possibly Arimnaes' as well.
But it seems like Xyre is pretty obviously today's lynch, now. The best part is that the theoretical 'unlynchability' is very easily tested.
But it seems like Xyre is pretty obviously today's lynch, now. The best part is that the theoretical 'unlynchability' is very easily tested.
Except you are forgetting the part where we lose a random player. Now, this is worse than lynching who you think is scummy, because ANYBODY can die. We could lose a townie, but we could also lose a Cop. All this to "test" Xyre, and even if he is telling the truth, there is probably more to his role at the inherant brokeness. I really dont like the losing a random townie/scum part. I really think that if you leave a game up to random draws, scum will pull this off, because they have info that we dont. I am very against this now, though I dont know whether or not to believe that claim.
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Quote from hotshizzle »
<hotshizle> WINE IN FRONT OF MEAL
<hotshizle> i think
No, what you're not realizing is that I think Xyre is absolutely full of crap in regards to that ability. The role has an absolutely made-up feel to it. In the last game that I played w/ him, Xyre false-claimed a role that allowed him to 'crucify' another player. The idea was that, if Xyre died while a player was crucified, that player would also die. Obviously this was a fake role, designed to discourage people from lynching him. Just like the role that he has informed us of right now.
Outside of this, the rest of the role is just ridiculously powerful and ridiculously random, both of which also make me not believe him at all.
He's claimed cop, which means we need to seriously rethink the lynch based on whatever scum tells he's given. On the other hand, he's claimed unpreventable, unkillable, unframable cop.
*chokes*
I'm trying hard, here. I really am. But I am completely failing to see how this role could be anything but broken.
Let me put it this way: let's say for the sake of argument that we lynch at random every day/night, that the mafia kills the confirmed player each night, and that there are no extra kills. A mafia must survive an inspection and a lynch every day until day eleven under those circumstances. The odds of that happening are 21/22x19/20x17/18x15/16x13/14x11/12x9/10x7/8x5/6x3/4x1/2=16.81%
Approximately a 1/6 chance for the mafia to win, even before applying the intelligence of the town or any other abilities that are relevant in the game, such as a doc, or even taking into account the fact that mafia don't get to pick who to kill. I would call that broken.
On the plus side, we have the fact that we have an obvious liar who claims to be unlynchable. Is there some reason we shouldn't test that?
Are you sure you want to start using math again, Carrion? That went down SO well in Elegant :p.
Now that Xyre has claimed, I think it is bad to lynch him. like, ever. with that role, omfg, the town should not be able to lose.
With that role, every time Xyre gets targeted, some random townie is very likely to die. Yeah great idea. Seriously, if you guys think that role is actually real, I think that you need to take a step back and reexamine your line of thought. Just look at the way that CP explained it, what he said is absolutely valid and correct, though slightly difficult to understand. I simply cannot believe that the role that Xyre just described to us exists.
Also, yesterday he told us that it is 'in the town's best interest if his role isn't revealed'. I fail to see how this is valid at all. It is highly unlikely that his role will ever reveal a scum. If anything, it is beneficial to the scum because it will constantly confirm townies, whom they can then kill. The whole thing is ridiculous and most likely faked.
First, I would like to enforce that treating xyre as though he was only a player is a horrible idea. We have to obviously treat him differently then we normally would a mod, but we can’t just forget he’s a mod in doing so. With that, your case on xyre is pretty much this, imo anyway, “I attacked you for no reason, and then you used an empty defense against my empty attack” This is obviously not indicative of anything.
Finally this goes along with number 1, xyre may not be telling the truth and still be a bad lynch. Perhaps he decided what he was to claim when pressured before the game started, or perhaps that’s his ‘role’ in that its what he as a player knows, but he’s actually paranoid or insane on a mod level of knowledge.
That post, #169, is not 'full of it at all'. It is absoultely valid. I just got finished playing in a game with Xyre where he false-claimed an ability that had the same core problem as this one. As such, obviously I'm going to be skeptical when he comes up with another role with the same problem so soon.
I didn't agree CPEs points because the entire basis to his stance is that 'Xyre is the Mod and thus we shouldn't lynch him'. Sorry, that holds no ground here whatsoever. Xyre has removed himself from the Mod position by not only acting like a player in the game, but, acting like a thoroughly scummy player at that. In fact, the only time that Xyre ever is 'the mod' is when he is trying to use that to convince us to not vote him. That is not acceptable.
Similarly, an ability that randomly reveals alignments, aside from just being stupid because it is completely contradictory to the purpose of the game of mafia, is much more useful to the mafia than the town. The only situation where it's not completely harmful to the town is when the Doc is alive. Beyond that, that part of Xyre's ability just throws the sheep to the wolves.
Also, my position is not scummy because, as I've stated repeatedly, I do not believe that lynching Xyre will result in a NL or a random lynch. I'm very confident now that, upon his death, he will be revealed as some scum role. And thankfully, no, I do not have a role-based reason to try to get the Mod lynched.
Also, I don't view your post 140 as actual questions, more like it's just you trying to discredit the reasons that I want to lynch Xyre. Reasons that I specifically laid out in post 137(I believe that is the correct #) and have elaborated upon since then.
It doesn't stop the scum from killing players they would want to kill anyway, it just gives them more obvious options.
Lastly, I fail to see how you are 'repeating CP', when CP pretty much flatly stated that he doesn't believe Xyre's role, and is also clearly in favor of lynching him. Maybe you meant CPE? What CPE doesn't realize is that he hit upon the crux of why Xyre's role is faked, in post 168, when he said 'I don't like losing a random townie'. I don't know if you guys don't pay alot of attention, but, the #1 role that mafia will try to fake(not counting vanilla) is a role that discourages people from lynching them. Stop and think about it, how often do you actually see roles that penalize the town for lynching someone? On very rare occassions you'll see a Super Saint, and even then you know exactly who is going to die. The idea that someone will just randomly get killed is ridiculous. That role is nothing but a scare tactic to try to keep people from lynching him(a type of role that Xyre is known for faking), and an attempt to appeal to the town's hesitance to lynch a cop by claiming a cop-esque role. There is no way that Xyre is telling the truth about his role.
@Cubus: That would be great, except that Xyre claims that the 'someone else will get lynched instead' only applies the first time he gets lynched, 'he thinks'. For one thing, how would he not KNOW if this were the case, considering the fact that he is the Mod. For another, if the 'flavor' behind this ability is because he is the Mod, it stands to reason that the ability would always work, it wouldn't be a '1 time deal'. Far too much of the role that Xyre claimed simply does not add up, and/or is just scare-mongering, which is why I am calling bull**** on the entire claim.
What you and bertrand don't understand is that when he says "he thinks" it's because he has to roleplay the difference between Xyre the mod and Xyre the player. Of course Xyre the mod knows what his role does, and what everyone else's does as well. We have no idea what Xyre the player knows, but it's likely he has given himself only as much info as a normal player would get about their role.
Also, if you're annoyed that Xyre has been using so much OMGUS, consider that there's not much else he can do without potentially compromising his huge boatload of extra information.
@ZDS: Your speculation that Xyre is lying on all accounts but that we should just let him live anyway is fascinating. Considering your complete failure to actually read/comprehend even the most basic aspects of anything that I said, you'll have to forgive me if I don't care that you don't agree with me. Let me try to make it abundantly clear. It does not matter that Xyre is the Mod. Does not, does not, does not. He has chosen to participate in this game as a player, and as such, is accountable as a player. His status as the Mod must be ignored for this to be at all practical. Otherwise, he essentially has carte blanche to do/say whatever he wants, and just fallback on 'derfderf I'm the Mod please don't lynch me I'm town I swear xxthxbye'. It's ridiculous. For the purposes of this discussion, he is not the Mod. He is a player, and a ridiculously scummy one at that, and deserves to be lynched accordingly. Period.
@Arimnaes: That doesn't wash. A normal 'player' in that situation would simply ask the Mod whether or not that ability only works once(or, more realistically, the player would know because something along those lines would be made clear in their role PM in the first place). Considering that Xyre is the mod, it can't exactly be difficult for him to know the answer to this question. Unless, of course, he is just lying because he didn't want to make the role seem too powerful, which, IMO, is the case.
I'd say that he cannot function as a player, and has more than sufficiently proven that thus far. The debacle that is this game thus far will likely result in a ban on mods ever participating in a game once this game is over.
However, that does nothing for the situation right now, and as Xyre persists in playing the game, the only course of action is for him to be held accountable just like any other player would. The fact that he is the Mod is irrelevant in this situation. He has indicated that he can be voted for, can cast votes, and can even be lynched. In that regard, he is a player in the game in every concept of the word, and that is how he should be treated. Following this, as a player he has been horrendously scummy thus far, and has a terrible claim that is almost surely a lie. He absolutely deserves to be lynched.
No, it's not. If he cannot act as a regular player, he should not try to participate as a regular player. It's pretty simple. Otherwise, we end up with situations like there, where he very, very obviously should be lynched, but no one wants to lynch him just because 'he's the Mod'.
Besides, you are guessing that he is controlled by 'external triggers', based off of apparently nothing, and I simply disagree with you. I see no logical reasoning as to why that would be the case. I think that Xyre tried to be a player and a Mod and screwed it up, and is now suffering the necessary consequences. His claim doesn't even make sense as a Mod acting as a player, let alone as just a player. The fact that he is the Mod doesn't excuse the majority(if any) of his scummy behavior. There was no reason for him to OMGUS vote anyone, no reason for his repeated mocking comments, He could have been the Mod and acted in a decent fashion, but he has not. A lynch is simply what he deserves at this juncture, regardless of whether or not he is the Mod.
Cyan, think about this for a moment...if Xyre IS lying about his ability as a player, he has the right as a mod at any point to give himself that ability, and we as a town would never know. Lynching him will provide us with no information whatsoever. You keep saying he will come up as a scum role, BUT HE COULD NEVER BE PART OF A SCUM GROUP. He would be absolutly useless to a scum group if he wanted to maintain the integrity fo the game. The only LOGICAL explanation is that Xyre is off his rocker. he has given him self a town or neutral, non-killing role. We should ignore him as a player, and hope that he reverts back to just being a mod. If he continues to post in a player fashion, we can deal with him tomorrow.
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It should be abundantly obvious to everyone here that Xyre has no interest in maintaining the integrity of the game, his actions thus far have already irreparably damaged it. I also find the theory that he could just make his abilities be whatever he wants unacceptable. It's one thing to beware of bastard modding, but I refuse to consider the notion that the Mod would make illegal, unethical plays.
It should be abundantly obvious to everyone here that Xyre has no interest in maintaining the integrity of the game, his actions thus far have already irreparably damaged it.
It's abundantly obvious to me that you have no idea what the hell you're talking about. You don't know the setup. You don't know what restrictions Xyre has on his "role", or how it works; you don't know anything. You're just flaming Xyre for no reason.
I'm not even sure what you're angry about, just that you're way off-base and you're blowing stuff out of proportion.
Quote from Cyan »
It's one thing to beware of bastard modding, but I refuse to consider the notion that the Mod would make illegal, unethical plays.
Which is why you need to realize that Xyre would not have given himself a role that could seriously jeopardize the balance of the game. He would not and will not reveal information that would ruin the game. If he's "town", he's not going to just going to out all the scum. If he's "mafia", he's not going to tell them all the power roles.
Edit: I would also remind you that despite the last-minute preparations, Xyre waited painstakingly to have the setup approved before starting the game. The council would not have approved a setup in which he gets to act in the full capacity of a player while also being the mod, which means that his participation as a player in the game is at most a gimmick that will mess with our heads but not seriously sway the game in either direction.
1) @chamber: if my math is flawed, show me. Otherwise, just shut up. What was the point of saying that without even trying to back it up?
2) @Cyan: you do seem to be getting personal about this again. The issue here is simple, but if the game is irrepairably broken, there's nothing to do about it now. Wait until the endgame to start throwing complaints like that around. Also, your argument that the mafia benefit from having cleared players is not only ridiculous (derf; the mafia don't get to pick their targets and the doc does), but also counterproductive (the point being that the role favors the town too much).
3) @WoLG: Let's assume that Xyre has some integrity, eh?
4) The case against Xyre does not revolve around his 'scum' tells. He's claimed cop, so that just doesn't matter. We have to examine his claim on its own merits. So basically, we have a claim that is obviously a lie. The only reason not to lynch him on that basis alone is because we think that he might be protecting a real power role. The argument that we shouldn't lynch him because a random townie might die is a faulty one: it assumes that he's telling the truth, when he obviously is not.
Now, I'm not unwilling to believe the mod may have a power role of sorts, and I'm willing to wait a day or two to see is he can demonstrate such. However, considering how much likelier it is that he's refusing to talk because the town really wouldn't hesitate to lynch him if we knew his real role, I think we still need to pressure a real claim from him. He's put himself into a situation where he likely will be the hostile target of one side or the other, so the extra, deadly risk of exposing himself is minimal.
I also want to point out that his claim discourages investigations along with everything else. The fact that he falseclaimed a role designed to discourage people from investigating him ought to be telling.
What?! Look at the initial post; he is dead. Deceased. Kaputt. Indefinitely horizontal. In mafia games, you see, people are occasionally "killed off," and when that sad event occurs, he or she is no longer allowed to post, on account of rigor mortis and what-have-you.
'Welcome to Mafia Salvation', it said, 'Population: 3,660.' And someone, they never figured out who, had painted on the sign in red letters: '1,831 to lynch.'
1) @chamber: if my math is flawed, show me. Otherwise, just shut up. What was the point of saying that without even trying to back it up?
I honestly don't care to do the math myself, but as far as I can see, I really only glanced at it, you don't actually acount for the cop investigation, and you assumed that only one mafia would be alive in end game.
On a different note, I've asked to replace out of this game, this will very likely be my last post of it.
I think it's highly unfortunate that, despite thoroughly scummy play on the part of Xyre, and the fact that he is almost surely lying in regards to his role, somehow people want to give him the benefit of the doubt and assume that he 'has' to act that way. Is that honestly the best thing that anyone can come up with? I understand giving a person a little bit of leeway, but, that is ridiculous.
Also, I fail to see the logic in the theory that he 'must' be town because he is the Mod. I think it is infinitely more likely that he is some kind of scum role. I wouldn't go so far as to say that he is part of the mafia, because it's hard to imagine that being balanced at all, but his behavior and fabricated claim clearly indicate scummy behavior. For me, that is enough. It doesn't matter that he's the Mod. He's a player also, and accountable as a player.
However, if we're not going to lynch him, we need to move on. I think that Ged is another good person to look at right now. He has completely and utterly barned my reasons for voting Xyre, in a way that seems scummy to me. I'm still leaving my vote on Xyre, in hopes that people realize that leaving him alive is completely illogical and poor play, but we need to do something other than sit around repeating the same arguments over and over.
While I agree that Xyre is using the clout of his role as mod to discourage a lynch, and that his role is highly suspect, I still fall in with those that believe lynching Xyre is a bad idea. We have no idea whether any other repercussions will befall us lynching Xyre, and for that reason alone we should be sceptical of lynching him. Isn't the point of the game to lynch the most suspicious character? Didn't Xyre say that we could lynch anything? Well right now the cookies I'm eating are giving me a sugar headache. That's pretty suspicous. Vote: Cookies! Xyre may have proven himself suspicous, but the fact remains that he's the mod, we're the players and we have no idea of the scope of this setup. Breaking the sculpture that looks like it will make the most noise can also incur you the biggest debt.
In other news. Cyan proves himself a scummy-second to Xyre by beating the dead horse until it croaks and then jumping on a new victim. Ged, but also CP and Arimnaes have both been vehemently against lynching Xyre. I don't think Ged is next on everyone else's list. I think it's Cyan, and because Cyan realized he can no longer quicklynch Xyre he's trying to divert our attention elsewhere.
2.) OK. Saying my post was meaningless, because it was about a meaningless section. GG me.
3.) Maybe I just wasn't reading close enough but. As far as I can tell, Ged seemed to me to be somewhat against a Xyre lynch, while most of CP's posts seem more intent on getting him to claim than Lynching him. Perhaps I misread; "I'm willing to wait a day or two" to me doesn't imply lynching Xyre today.
In fact, I believe that most people would agree that lynching Xyre might be a better alternative in the future. You yourself agreed that if possible it would be better to vig Xyre than lynch and that it's probably not a good idea to do that right now.
At this point, I'm willing to test his claim. Our day 1 lynch is basically random anyway considering we have no info to go on.
Another option is to wait for the investigation. I prefer this one.
This whole lynch-the-mod thing seems outright rediculous...he's either just messing with us or roleplaying. He's probably laughing his ass off at us right now
Another thing I'm suspecting is that Cyan isn't telling us something. He's smarter than this. The fact that he's abandoned all logic seems odd to me.
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At this point, I'm willing to test his claim. Our day 1 lynch is basically random anyway considering we have no info to go on.
Another option is to wait for the investigation. I prefer this one.
This is pretty much where I stand. While I have problems with Xyre role, we will have some further information about it by the end of the night. He never answered though, and it could be key.
Xyre, at what point in the night does your ability trigger?
Quote from bertrand »
This whole lynch-the-mod thing seems outright rediculous...he's either just messing with us or roleplaying. He's probably laughing his ass off at us right now
If this is true, he shouldn't be modding. I highly doubt this. I doubt this as much as the argument of 'well, he will change his role anyway.' This is absurd. Fadeblue and the rest of the council would not allow a mod to that with himself. As for how Xyre has had a lack of integrity, I do not see it. However he has been playing, I am sure it is according to how he planned before the game. Which brings me to:
Quote from ZDS »
Cyan, how is it so hard to understand that Xyre can not act freely as a player and must be controlled either by external triggers or by another player, which means lynching him will only result in the day being wasted (and perhaps a player weakened), no matter how truthful his claim is ?
I do not see any evidence of either of these. Do you have any idea what these triggers might be? Because I have seen no indication of them. As for by another player, this is even more unlikely. The quickness between his posts and his mod posts and to what the time of what he is replying to seems to rule this out.
What explains his behavior is some sort of posting restriction. No, he can not be a totally free player. At the same time, he can control what he is does and what he says. Regardless, we should not consider him a reliable source or listen to anything he says, really.
Also, ZDS, people do not like it when you do things like:
Honestly Cyan, the truth is, you're just pissed off that he gave himself a role and want to lynch him to teach him how to behave as a Mafia mod, right ?
That or you are on drugs or something…
Questioning people's out of game motivations is never nice. The same goes for you, Cyan. For being this early in the game, I think everyone just needs to step back and realize that this is a game. Breath in, and breath out, and let's have a good time.
ZDS did, however, bring up a case that also flashed in front of my eyes. The last two posts by Hyram alarmed me, and the other three are not much better. Firstly, to address the last post. If you admit that your vote was useless, then unvote. We have established that you can indeed vote for anything and anyone. Doing so contributes nothing to the game and does not help us. Also, I think it was pretty clear that no one at any point was actually trying to speedlynch Xyre. But maybe you didn't read that either, which doesn't really make it any better.
In fact, I believe that most people would agree that lynching Xyre might be a better alternative in the future.
Are you saying you support this? Or are you saying most people support and therefore you do too? And if you do support this then why is it better to do so in the future? What is the difference?
You yourself agreed that if possible it would be better to vig Xyre than lynch and that it's probably not a good idea to do that right now.
What about you, though? Do you think we should vig Xyre, espcially after his claim? And if we should, why later and not now?
Your first posts aren't better, either. Your first post was random, your second was more-or-less aimless speculation, and the third was already attacked by Cyan. I am bothered and I am going to go ahead and Unvote: Xyre, Vote: Hyram.
As for Cubus, I have no ideas. If he doesn't want to explain it, that is more than fine with me. If you are unsure yourself Cubus, that is fine too. Either way I would say it is a point in Cubus' favor, ore than otherwise, but this dips into WIFOM, really.
Here's my position. As it developed.
Firstly, what intrigued me most about the game was the set-up. Furthermore, I've never played in a 'Deep South' game before.
When people, mostly Cyan, began their crusade against Xyre, I was pretty much against it. I didn't think that the role of a player-mod could significantly imbalance the game to warrant his removal. I remained against his Lynch/kill until Xyre claimed.
At that point, I began to side with those wanting to test his claim. Not immediately perhaps, but further on down the road. I would tend to agree that vigging Xyre is the best way to test this. But I don't think the game should turn into 'lets prove Xyre's rollclaim.'
I think it's conveniant that Xyre didn't have to lie in his cop ability. Like ZDS and Cubus I believe his 'reveal a random player's alignment' is the result of whomever is vigged/lynched/etc.
Yes my position on Xyre has changed over the course of the game.
I don't deny it.
However, if we're not going to lynch him, we need to move on. I think that Ged is another good person to look at right now. He has completely and utterly barned my reasons for voting Xyre, in a way that seems scummy to me. I'm still leaving my vote on Xyre, in hopes that people realize that leaving him alive is completely illogical and poor play, but we need to do something other than sit around repeating the same arguments over and over.
First of all, yay for moving on. This is rediculous.
Now Cyan, what do you want me to do at that point? Lie and say that I don't think we should see what happens if we get closer to lynching the mod? Tell the truth and then make up more filmsy reasons for voting him? Say nothing at all? I'd rather just say that you'd convinced me (as you had) and be done with it.
I'd like to see what happens if Xyre makes it to night, so I'm against lynching him for the time being to clear up whatever discussion of my view there was.
Oh, and here's a list of all the things I can think of to talk about in the hopes that it'll stimulate some conversation:
Xyre (AKA keep beating the horse)
Cubus' state of being
Swinkee's / Dagger's / someone else's posting restriction
Cyan, Hyram, or myself being suspicious
Voting for something other than someone's death
The die role on post 4
Top 3 scum lists
...and so on. I'm just hoping we can talk about something other than Xyre for a wee bit.
I'll post on some if not all of these topics later, but I have to sleep at the moment.
First of all, yay for moving on. This is rediculous.
Now Cyan, what do you want me to do at that point? Lie and say that I don't think we should see what happens if we get closer to lynching the mod? Tell the truth and then make up more filmsy reasons for voting him? Say nothing at all? I'd rather just say that you'd convinced me (as you had) and be done with it.
I'd like to see what happens if Xyre makes it to night, so I'm against lynching him for the time being to clear up whatever discussion of my view there was.
Oh, and here's a list of all the things I can think of to talk about in the hopes that it'll stimulate some conversation:
Xyre (AKA keep beating the horse)
Cubus' state of being
Swinkee's / Dagger's / someone else's posting restriction
Cyan, Hyram, or myself being suspicious
Voting for something other than someone's death
The die role on post 4
Top 3 scum lists
...and so on. I'm just hoping we can talk about something other than Xyre for a wee bit.
I'll post on some if not all of these topics later, but I have to sleep at the moment.
This doesn't really do anything for me. Unvote, Vote Ged
I still don't see a reason to lynch the mod instead of vigging, blocking, or inspecting the mod. Would someone on Xyre's wagon kindly explain it for me?
Vote Hyram. He's our best lead for the day, and I would like him to answer ZDS's questions. What exactly was the point of that post, if it wasn't to exploit the attacks on Cyan?
@chamber (not that it matters at this point, but whatever): I did take into account investigations, by assuming that the mafia would effectively have their kill chosen for them. Also, I specifically stated that it was the odds of a single mafia surviving. The odds of multiple mafia murviving are miniscule enough not to be worth considering.
@Cyan: I can't say I really like the idea of a Ged wagon. He didn't start the game with by agreeing with your point of view, so he didn't really barn you. Do you have some other point against him?
@Cubus: Do you have a posting restriction of some sort, or is there some other reason you chose to wait so long to start posting?
@ZDS: I am not for lynching Xyre today. I am for waiting for more information in order to make a decision, including, hopefully, forcing a real claim from him. However, I'm willing to drop this, pending an investigation, since Xyre has made clear he doesn't want to be investigated.
@Hyram: Unvote, Vote Hyram. I just went back through your posts, and none of them were particularly thrilling, but that last one was just awful. Expect to be forced to claim in very short order.
What?! Look at the initial post; he is dead. Deceased. Kaputt. Indefinitely horizontal. In mafia games, you see, people are occasionally "killed off," and when that sad event occurs, he or she is no longer allowed to post, on account of rigor mortis and what-have-you.
'Welcome to Mafia Salvation', it said, 'Population: 3,660.' And someone, they never figured out who, had painted on the sign in red letters: '1,831 to lynch.'
@Cubus: I knew it! I knew it! *elated* You were not dead at all!
I agree Xyre's claim is ridiculous... for a player. Not so sure about it being on a player-mod in a specialty game though. Also, we cannot treat him as a player but rather as a player with a severe restriction. And I agree with the notion of waiting to see what he can provide for the town during the Night as of now.
As for Hyram, I'll be awaiting his next response first.
Chambers gone??? noooo. Atleast, we wont have random gambits. But HI SERGE. @Cyan, he obviously cant STOP posting, or he will have to prod himself. Seriously, he is playing, deal with it. Right now, I think that Hyrams post was bad, but I would like to keep my vote on Cyan, and wasnt counted last change, so Unvote, Vote Cyan.
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Wow. I replaced into a very fun screwed-up game. It seems that there is a great deal of discussion on day one and rather than flip flop between opinions I am gonna state mine.
Xyre cannot function as a normal player. He feels very much like an NPC. Automated responses, predictable actions, and very little original content. The problem is that these are all also scum tells. I do not think we should lynch Xyre today. I would be willing to believe that if everyone unvotes Xyre and begins talking about another subject, he might just become a lurker. None of Xrye's actions are helpful to the town in the slightest. I do think that he is non-harmful to the town either.
The scummiest person I can find right now is Cyan. He does seem to try to be logical, however he isnt succeeding and is starting to repeat himself. The conversation is getting very heavy into WIFOM territory. I believe an FoS: Cyan is in order for this. Your not presenting new evidence Cyan, just going back over what you already think. I get what you say but I don't believe it to be true. I think right now you are a paranoid townie acting alot like scum. If you continue being paranoid about everything, than my suspicion of you will rise.
It seems sort of silly to ridicule a company for marketing efforts. Of course they are going to hype upcoming products, every company on the face of the planet does it, and it works, thats why they do it. There isn't really any sense complaining about it. If you don't like the marketing, ignore it.
Truthfully, at this point, there seems to be SO much random things going on that i'm unsure what to do.
Cyan is popping things out every two seconds about someone.
Cubus is undead, and i HIGHLY doubt its simply flavour, but its unwise to assume it means he's scum.
And we've lost chamber.
Posting to avoid a prod, and just stating that at current i feel befuddled.
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OMGUS voting from me? I doubt you could provide an example of me ever OMGUS voting someone in any game I've been in.
Anyway, I think I might be being too hard on Ged. His play here just reminds me of other games where he was scum. But it also reminds me of a game where he was town(Midian Mafia), so, I'll Unvote Ged and keep an eye on him, for now.
I will also Vote Hyram. At first, I thought that maybe it was just a genuine misunderstanding that caused his action, but the more he posts, the more it seems like he just tried to take advantage of a situation and failed miserably and is now flailing.
Ack! Its serge the scum who claimed doc then didnt claim doc in a newb game! We are surely doomed!
(Kidding, :-P).
Things of note. Cyan seems very not-scum to me. (Yeah i said it).
Unvote, Vote Cubus. Im sorry, I just do not trust an undead in a mafia game, especially one who FAKES being dead and only posts because of prod. Purposeful lurking =//= Townie.
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I love Joboman, Poggy, Niv, and Vezok, because, while they may not be the best players, they still try to win. Having fun is the most important thing to a game, but I've learned that if you don't try to win, then you're ruining everyone else's fun.
The problem I have with Xyre still posting is that it seems like the only thing he can talk about is himself. Which would make sense, otherwise we get into broken game territory. But if this is true, and if Cyan feels to the need to continue rebutting Xyre, then we may never move along. That is why I really think we should just ignore him as a general course of action.
I also agree with Cyan that Ged's last post was not very good. I do not like that Cyan did not explain why, though. Ged, posting about things we can talk about is nice. The problem, the same problem that I have with Hyram, is that you are not taking a position on any of the issues. You are merely proposing them. That means you can wait for others to respond and then agree with the prevailing idea. This is not pro-town behavior.
Which brings me back to Hyram. Last time you did not explain really much at all. I am unsure where those replies came from but it had little actual relevance to the current discussion. Also, how many games have you been in? In those, how many times have you been scum?
I think we should just ignore Xyre for now. Let's see what his alleged ability turns up.
unvote vote loran16, for the terrible voting rationale on Cubus. I also think that Cyan is town being stupid, and that loran is trying to score some free points by taking the oh so controversial position of supporting him.
To your knowledge? That doesn't make any sense.
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In either case, we can at least 'till night to see what his ability turns up.
Xyre: At what point during night does your ability fire?
While a good point, here's how I'm currently looking at this game: we've been told it'll be wacky, crazy, nuts, and more. Apparently we should trust no one. Any and everything may be a lie. So how many layers of deception are there? Taking things at face value and hoping it's an even number seems like a fair way to start.
This doesn't mean I'm not willing to listen to good logic and predictions, only that I'm going to start with exactly what is given to me no matter how bizare the game is.
I am. Note that it took convincing to get that vote out. Please don't attack me for something others have done before me and continue to do, let alone for a faulty reason in the first place.
Unvote anyway, because I do want to think about that claim. It's probably worth waiting until night to check, anyway. SG (or someone else), is Danny Hobbes someone I should know or just a name?
I am trying here, Xyre. I really am. And I have a few ideas. But if you could be a little more useful, it mighr help me get out of that box.
At any rate, there is a claim. Unvote Xyre x2. I am going to leave one for now to ensure continued answers to questions.
He's claimed cop, which means we need to seriously rethink the lynch based on whatever scum tells he's given. On the other hand, he's claimed unpreventable, unkillable, unframable cop.
*chokes*
I'm trying hard, here. I really am. But I am completely failing to see how this role could be anything but broken.
Let me put it this way: let's say for the sake of argument that we lynch at random every day/night, that the mafia kills the confirmed player each night, and that there are no extra kills. A mafia must survive an inspection and a lynch every day until day eleven under those circumstances. The odds of that happening are 21/22x19/20x17/18x15/16x13/14x11/12x9/10x7/8x5/6x3/4x1/2=16.81%
Approximately a 1/6 chance for the mafia to win, even before applying the intelligence of the town or any other abilities that are relevant in the game, such as a doc, or even taking into account the fact that mafia don't get to pick who to kill. I would call that broken.
On the plus side, we have the fact that we have an obvious liar who claims to be unlynchable. Is there some reason we shouldn't test that?
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I also want to note that I think that Ged's interaction w/ Xyre is telling, and will be something I look at tonight/tomorrow, and possibly Arimnaes' as well.
But it seems like Xyre is pretty obviously today's lynch, now. The best part is that the theoretical 'unlynchability' is very easily tested.
Outside of this, the rest of the role is just ridiculously powerful and ridiculously random, both of which also make me not believe him at all.
Now that Xyre has claimed, I think it is bad to lynch him. like, ever. with that role, omfg, the town should not be able to lose. Are you sure you want to start using math again, Carrion? That went down SO well in Elegant :p.
Also, yesterday he told us that it is 'in the town's best interest if his role isn't revealed'. I fail to see how this is valid at all. It is highly unlikely that his role will ever reveal a scum. If anything, it is beneficial to the scum because it will constantly confirm townies, whom they can then kill. The whole thing is ridiculous and most likely faked.
Finally this goes along with number 1, xyre may not be telling the truth and still be a bad lynch. Perhaps he decided what he was to claim when pressured before the game started, or perhaps that’s his ‘role’ in that its what he as a player knows, but he’s actually paranoid or insane on a mod level of knowledge.
Also, CP, your math is flawed.
Town/Mafia/Other - 14/6/3
Win/Lose/Tie - 11/12/0
Nk/lynched/Survived - 16/4/3
I didn't agree CPEs points because the entire basis to his stance is that 'Xyre is the Mod and thus we shouldn't lynch him'. Sorry, that holds no ground here whatsoever. Xyre has removed himself from the Mod position by not only acting like a player in the game, but, acting like a thoroughly scummy player at that. In fact, the only time that Xyre ever is 'the mod' is when he is trying to use that to convince us to not vote him. That is not acceptable.
Similarly, an ability that randomly reveals alignments, aside from just being stupid because it is completely contradictory to the purpose of the game of mafia, is much more useful to the mafia than the town. The only situation where it's not completely harmful to the town is when the Doc is alive. Beyond that, that part of Xyre's ability just throws the sheep to the wolves.
Also, my position is not scummy because, as I've stated repeatedly, I do not believe that lynching Xyre will result in a NL or a random lynch. I'm very confident now that, upon his death, he will be revealed as some scum role. And thankfully, no, I do not have a role-based reason to try to get the Mod lynched.
Also, I don't view your post 140 as actual questions, more like it's just you trying to discredit the reasons that I want to lynch Xyre. Reasons that I specifically laid out in post 137(I believe that is the correct #) and have elaborated upon since then.
It doesn't stop the scum from killing players they would want to kill anyway, it just gives them more obvious options.
Lastly, I fail to see how you are 'repeating CP', when CP pretty much flatly stated that he doesn't believe Xyre's role, and is also clearly in favor of lynching him. Maybe you meant CPE? What CPE doesn't realize is that he hit upon the crux of why Xyre's role is faked, in post 168, when he said 'I don't like losing a random townie'. I don't know if you guys don't pay alot of attention, but, the #1 role that mafia will try to fake(not counting vanilla) is a role that discourages people from lynching them. Stop and think about it, how often do you actually see roles that penalize the town for lynching someone? On very rare occassions you'll see a Super Saint, and even then you know exactly who is going to die. The idea that someone will just randomly get killed is ridiculous. That role is nothing but a scare tactic to try to keep people from lynching him(a type of role that Xyre is known for faking), and an attempt to appeal to the town's hesitance to lynch a cop by claiming a cop-esque role. There is no way that Xyre is telling the truth about his role.
@Cubus: That would be great, except that Xyre claims that the 'someone else will get lynched instead' only applies the first time he gets lynched, 'he thinks'. For one thing, how would he not KNOW if this were the case, considering the fact that he is the Mod. For another, if the 'flavor' behind this ability is because he is the Mod, it stands to reason that the ability would always work, it wouldn't be a '1 time deal'. Far too much of the role that Xyre claimed simply does not add up, and/or is just scare-mongering, which is why I am calling bull**** on the entire claim.
Also, if you're annoyed that Xyre has been using so much OMGUS, consider that there's not much else he can do without potentially compromising his huge boatload of extra information.
@Arimnaes: That doesn't wash. A normal 'player' in that situation would simply ask the Mod whether or not that ability only works once(or, more realistically, the player would know because something along those lines would be made clear in their role PM in the first place). Considering that Xyre is the mod, it can't exactly be difficult for him to know the answer to this question. Unless, of course, he is just lying because he didn't want to make the role seem too powerful, which, IMO, is the case.
However, that does nothing for the situation right now, and as Xyre persists in playing the game, the only course of action is for him to be held accountable just like any other player would. The fact that he is the Mod is irrelevant in this situation. He has indicated that he can be voted for, can cast votes, and can even be lynched. In that regard, he is a player in the game in every concept of the word, and that is how he should be treated. Following this, as a player he has been horrendously scummy thus far, and has a terrible claim that is almost surely a lie. He absolutely deserves to be lynched.
Besides, you are guessing that he is controlled by 'external triggers', based off of apparently nothing, and I simply disagree with you. I see no logical reasoning as to why that would be the case. I think that Xyre tried to be a player and a Mod and screwed it up, and is now suffering the necessary consequences. His claim doesn't even make sense as a Mod acting as a player, let alone as just a player. The fact that he is the Mod doesn't excuse the majority(if any) of his scummy behavior. There was no reason for him to OMGUS vote anyone, no reason for his repeated mocking comments, He could have been the Mod and acted in a decent fashion, but he has not. A lynch is simply what he deserves at this juncture, regardless of whether or not he is the Mod.
Xyre is off his rocker.he has given him self a town or neutral, non-killing role. We should ignore him as a player, and hope that he reverts back to just being a mod. If he continues to post in a player fashion, we can deal with him tomorrow.-[thread=14456]The [Untitled] Avatar and Sig shop![/thread] Avatar from:[thread=25376] [Epic Graphics][/thread]
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I'm not even sure what you're angry about, just that you're way off-base and you're blowing stuff out of proportion.
Which is why you need to realize that Xyre would not have given himself a role that could seriously jeopardize the balance of the game. He would not and will not reveal information that would ruin the game. If he's "town", he's not going to just going to out all the scum. If he's "mafia", he's not going to tell them all the power roles.
2) @Cyan: you do seem to be getting personal about this again. The issue here is simple, but if the game is irrepairably broken, there's nothing to do about it now. Wait until the endgame to start throwing complaints like that around. Also, your argument that the mafia benefit from having cleared players is not only ridiculous (derf; the mafia don't get to pick their targets and the doc does), but also counterproductive (the point being that the role favors the town too much).
3) @WoLG: Let's assume that Xyre has some integrity, eh?
4) The case against Xyre does not revolve around his 'scum' tells. He's claimed cop, so that just doesn't matter. We have to examine his claim on its own merits. So basically, we have a claim that is obviously a lie. The only reason not to lynch him on that basis alone is because we think that he might be protecting a real power role. The argument that we shouldn't lynch him because a random townie might die is a faulty one: it assumes that he's telling the truth, when he obviously is not.
Now, I'm not unwilling to believe the mod may have a power role of sorts, and I'm willing to wait a day or two to see is he can demonstrate such. However, considering how much likelier it is that he's refusing to talk because the town really wouldn't hesitate to lynch him if we knew his real role, I think we still need to pressure a real claim from him. He's put himself into a situation where he likely will be the hostile target of one side or the other, so the extra, deadly risk of exposing himself is minimal.
I also want to point out that his claim discourages investigations along with everything else. The fact that he falseclaimed a role designed to discourage people from investigating him ought to be telling.
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I honestly don't care to do the math myself, but as far as I can see, I really only glanced at it, you don't actually acount for the cop investigation, and you assumed that only one mafia would be alive in end game.
On a different note, I've asked to replace out of this game, this will very likely be my last post of it.
Town/Mafia/Other - 14/6/3
Win/Lose/Tie - 11/12/0
Nk/lynched/Survived - 16/4/3
Also, I fail to see the logic in the theory that he 'must' be town because he is the Mod. I think it is infinitely more likely that he is some kind of scum role. I wouldn't go so far as to say that he is part of the mafia, because it's hard to imagine that being balanced at all, but his behavior and fabricated claim clearly indicate scummy behavior. For me, that is enough. It doesn't matter that he's the Mod. He's a player also, and accountable as a player.
However, if we're not going to lynch him, we need to move on. I think that Ged is another good person to look at right now. He has completely and utterly barned my reasons for voting Xyre, in a way that seems scummy to me. I'm still leaving my vote on Xyre, in hopes that people realize that leaving him alive is completely illogical and poor play, but we need to do something other than sit around repeating the same arguments over and over.
In other news. Cyan proves himself a scummy-second to Xyre by beating the dead horse until it croaks and then jumping on a new victim. Ged, but also CP and Arimnaes have both been vehemently against lynching Xyre. I don't think Ged is next on everyone else's list. I think it's Cyan, and because Cyan realized he can no longer quicklynch Xyre he's trying to divert our attention elsewhere.
2.) OK. Saying my post was meaningless, because it was about a meaningless section. GG me.
3.) Maybe I just wasn't reading close enough but. As far as I can tell, Ged seemed to me to be somewhat against a Xyre lynch, while most of CP's posts seem more intent on getting him to claim than Lynching him. Perhaps I misread; "I'm willing to wait a day or two" to me doesn't imply lynching Xyre today.
In fact, I believe that most people would agree that lynching Xyre might be a better alternative in the future. You yourself agreed that if possible it would be better to vig Xyre than lynch and that it's probably not a good idea to do that right now.
The "A Weekend in the Suburbs" Vote Count
loran16 - 1 (creampuffeater)
Cubus - 1 (StormBlind)
Xyre - 5 (Cyan, SorryGuy, Jobie, loran16, carrion pigeons)
Fayul - 1 (Swinkee)
Wrath of Dog - 2 (Dagger, Squiggler)
Cyan - 2 (Fayul, Cubus,
Cookies! - 1 (Hyram)
Hyram - 1 (ZeDorkSlipeur)
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Another option is to wait for the investigation. I prefer this one.
This whole lynch-the-mod thing seems outright rediculous...he's either just messing with us or roleplaying. He's probably laughing his ass off at us right now
Another thing I'm suspecting is that Cyan isn't telling us something. He's smarter than this. The fact that he's abandoned all logic seems odd to me.
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He us unliving, care to explain cubus?
This is pretty much where I stand. While I have problems with Xyre role, we will have some further information about it by the end of the night. He never answered though, and it could be key.
Xyre, at what point in the night does your ability trigger?
If this is true, he shouldn't be modding. I highly doubt this. I doubt this as much as the argument of 'well, he will change his role anyway.' This is absurd. Fadeblue and the rest of the council would not allow a mod to that with himself. As for how Xyre has had a lack of integrity, I do not see it. However he has been playing, I am sure it is according to how he planned before the game. Which brings me to:
I do not see any evidence of either of these. Do you have any idea what these triggers might be? Because I have seen no indication of them. As for by another player, this is even more unlikely. The quickness between his posts and his mod posts and to what the time of what he is replying to seems to rule this out.
What explains his behavior is some sort of posting restriction. No, he can not be a totally free player. At the same time, he can control what he is does and what he says. Regardless, we should not consider him a reliable source or listen to anything he says, really.
Also, ZDS, people do not like it when you do things like:
Questioning people's out of game motivations is never nice. The same goes for you, Cyan. For being this early in the game, I think everyone just needs to step back and realize that this is a game. Breath in, and breath out, and let's have a good time.
ZDS did, however, bring up a case that also flashed in front of my eyes. The last two posts by Hyram alarmed me, and the other three are not much better. Firstly, to address the last post. If you admit that your vote was useless, then unvote. We have established that you can indeed vote for anything and anyone. Doing so contributes nothing to the game and does not help us. Also, I think it was pretty clear that no one at any point was actually trying to speedlynch Xyre. But maybe you didn't read that either, which doesn't really make it any better.
Are you saying you support this? Or are you saying most people support and therefore you do too? And if you do support this then why is it better to do so in the future? What is the difference?
What about you, though? Do you think we should vig Xyre, espcially after his claim? And if we should, why later and not now?
Your first posts aren't better, either. Your first post was random, your second was more-or-less aimless speculation, and the third was already attacked by Cyan. I am bothered and I am going to go ahead and Unvote: Xyre, Vote: Hyram.
As for Cubus, I have no ideas. If he doesn't want to explain it, that is more than fine with me. If you are unsure yourself Cubus, that is fine too. Either way I would say it is a point in Cubus' favor, ore than otherwise, but this dips into WIFOM, really.
Here's my position. As it developed.
Firstly, what intrigued me most about the game was the set-up. Furthermore, I've never played in a 'Deep South' game before.
When people, mostly Cyan, began their crusade against Xyre, I was pretty much against it. I didn't think that the role of a player-mod could significantly imbalance the game to warrant his removal. I remained against his Lynch/kill until Xyre claimed.
At that point, I began to side with those wanting to test his claim. Not immediately perhaps, but further on down the road. I would tend to agree that vigging Xyre is the best way to test this. But I don't think the game should turn into 'lets prove Xyre's rollclaim.'
I think it's conveniant that Xyre didn't have to lie in his cop ability. Like ZDS and Cubus I believe his 'reveal a random player's alignment' is the result of whomever is vigged/lynched/etc.
Yes my position on Xyre has changed over the course of the game.
I don't deny it.
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First of all, yay for moving on. This is rediculous.
Now Cyan, what do you want me to do at that point? Lie and say that I don't think we should see what happens if we get closer to lynching the mod? Tell the truth and then make up more filmsy reasons for voting him? Say nothing at all? I'd rather just say that you'd convinced me (as you had) and be done with it.
I'd like to see what happens if Xyre makes it to night, so I'm against lynching him for the time being to clear up whatever discussion of my view there was.
Oh, and here's a list of all the things I can think of to talk about in the hopes that it'll stimulate some conversation:
Xyre (AKA keep beating the horse)
Cubus' state of being
Swinkee's / Dagger's / someone else's posting restriction
Cyan, Hyram, or myself being suspicious
Voting for something other than someone's death
The die role on post 4
Top 3 scum lists
...and so on. I'm just hoping we can talk about something other than Xyre for a wee bit.
I'll post on some if not all of these topics later, but I have to sleep at the moment.
This doesn't really do anything for me. Unvote, Vote Ged
Vote Hyram. He's our best lead for the day, and I would like him to answer ZDS's questions. What exactly was the point of that post, if it wasn't to exploit the attacks on Cyan?
Experiments Series: #5 (Courtly Intrigue Mafia) | #4 (Drunken Tracker) | #3 (Big Red Button) - coming soon | #2 (Pope Mafia) | #1 (Iso's Inflammable Mafia)
Mini Games: MTGS Mafia Redux II (Invitational, Evil Mirror Universe) | Unreal City
Old Games (bad): The Greenwood Affair | Blood Moon Mafia
@Cyan: I can't say I really like the idea of a Ged wagon. He didn't start the game with by agreeing with your point of view, so he didn't really barn you. Do you have some other point against him?
@Cubus: Do you have a posting restriction of some sort, or is there some other reason you chose to wait so long to start posting?
@ZDS: I am not for lynching Xyre today. I am for waiting for more information in order to make a decision, including, hopefully, forcing a real claim from him. However, I'm willing to drop this, pending an investigation, since Xyre has made clear he doesn't want to be investigated.
@Hyram: Unvote, Vote Hyram. I just went back through your posts, and none of them were particularly thrilling, but that last one was just awful. Expect to be forced to claim in very short order.
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I agree Xyre's claim is ridiculous... for a player. Not so sure about it being on a player-mod in a specialty game though. Also, we cannot treat him as a player but rather as a player with a severe restriction. And I agree with the notion of waiting to see what he can provide for the town during the Night as of now.
As for Hyram, I'll be awaiting his next response first.
We'll make you an offer you can't refuse.
Hosting: Vista Mafia
Hosted: Intrigue Mafia (Mini), Seance #43 (Basic), Conflux Mafia (Normal), Goo Mafia (FTQ), Experiment #26 (Basic)
Ongoing/Completed - 0/41
Town/Mafia/SK/Survivor - 30/6/4/1
NKed/Lynched/Survived - 15/11/15
Experiments Series: #5 (Courtly Intrigue Mafia) | #4 (Drunken Tracker) | #3 (Big Red Button) - coming soon | #2 (Pope Mafia) | #1 (Iso's Inflammable Mafia)
Mini Games: MTGS Mafia Redux II (Invitational, Evil Mirror Universe) | Unreal City
Old Games (bad): The Greenwood Affair | Blood Moon Mafia
funscrewed-up game. It seems that there is a great deal of discussion on day one and rather than flip flop between opinions I am gonna state mine.Xyre cannot function as a normal player. He feels very much like an NPC. Automated responses, predictable actions, and very little original content. The problem is that these are all also scum tells. I do not think we should lynch Xyre today. I would be willing to believe that if everyone unvotes Xyre and begins talking about another subject, he might just become a lurker. None of Xrye's actions are helpful to the town in the slightest. I do think that he is non-harmful to the town either.
The scummiest person I can find right now is Cyan. He does seem to try to be logical, however he isnt succeeding and is starting to repeat himself. The conversation is getting very heavy into WIFOM territory. I believe an FoS: Cyan is in order for this. Your not presenting new evidence Cyan, just going back over what you already think. I get what you say but I don't believe it to be true. I think right now you are a paranoid townie acting alot like scum. If you continue being paranoid about everything, than my suspicion of you will rise.
Awaiting OMGUS voting.........
Cyan is popping things out every two seconds about someone.
Cubus is undead, and i HIGHLY doubt its simply flavour, but its unwise to assume it means he's scum.
And we've lost chamber.
Posting to avoid a prod, and just stating that at current i feel befuddled.
Anyway, I think I might be being too hard on Ged. His play here just reminds me of other games where he was scum. But it also reminds me of a game where he was town(Midian Mafia), so, I'll Unvote Ged and keep an eye on him, for now.
I will also Vote Hyram. At first, I thought that maybe it was just a genuine misunderstanding that caused his action, but the more he posts, the more it seems like he just tried to take advantage of a situation and failed miserably and is now flailing.
(Kidding, :-P).
Things of note. Cyan seems very not-scum to me. (Yeah i said it).
Unvote, Vote Cubus. Im sorry, I just do not trust an undead in a mafia game, especially one who FAKES being dead and only posts because of prod. Purposeful lurking =//= Townie.
Logical Reasoning is dead; Long Live Stupidity
I also agree with Cyan that Ged's last post was not very good. I do not like that Cyan did not explain why, though. Ged, posting about things we can talk about is nice. The problem, the same problem that I have with Hyram, is that you are not taking a position on any of the issues. You are merely proposing them. That means you can wait for others to respond and then agree with the prevailing idea. This is not pro-town behavior.
Which brings me back to Hyram. Last time you did not explain really much at all. I am unsure where those replies came from but it had little actual relevance to the current discussion. Also, how many games have you been in? In those, how many times have you been scum?
unvote vote loran16, for the terrible voting rationale on Cubus. I also think that Cyan is town being stupid, and that loran is trying to score some free points by taking the oh so controversial position of supporting him.
Experiments Series: #5 (Courtly Intrigue Mafia) | #4 (Drunken Tracker) | #3 (Big Red Button) - coming soon | #2 (Pope Mafia) | #1 (Iso's Inflammable Mafia)
Mini Games: MTGS Mafia Redux II (Invitational, Evil Mirror Universe) | Unreal City
Old Games (bad): The Greenwood Affair | Blood Moon Mafia