Chamber's aggressiveness really is bothering me more than his play does usually. It seems like he's pushing the Puzzle wagon more than a townie normally would.
Quote from Puzzle »
About the clan claim, the vigilante and cop will also be easier to recognize. So, I see obvious drawbacks. Can anyone actually tell me how such a mass claim will help us find the scums, exactly ? We'll force them to lie but how hard is it for them just to pick a clan ?
I with ZDS here. I dont think that a mass claim will actually help the town. All i can see it doing is giving the mafia an educated guess at power roles. As ZDS said before, if someone can show how it will help the town, then ill jump on that bandwagon.
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Doc is more likely to be Phoenix or maybe Crabe than Lion, Crane or Unicorn.
Vigilante is more likely to be Crane, Lion or Dragon than Phoenix or Crab.
Etc...
I don't want to enter a discussion about power roles (so if I'm wrong with my examples, please just shut up for now) but you get the drift.
Hmm. That does make sense, and in a game this size, I can see where the problems may occur.
Against Mass Claim:
AlphaInsidious
Puzzle
ZDS
Pibbly
For Mass Claim:
CropCircles
Chamber
Arimnaes
Loran16
On the fence: Xyre (leaning against)
RafK
Pod (wants job claim)
-----------------------------
There's a rough list...for the record, a job claim?! That makes even less sense than a clan claim. Power roles will be forced to lie about their job in thi case..right?
-Alpha
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Quote from TheFooFish »
Lies! -I'm Buffy Summers, town tracker. I used my ability on you and saw that you didn't use any abilities before the game started. My flavor is I was sucked through a mysterious space-time portal and I'm here to kill all the vampires, and my tracking ability is a combination of my Slayer and Native American skills.
Right now, I would probably be against, for the facts, that as puzzle said, some roles might be in some clans, and also that Axelrod helped with the setup. I could possibly be in favor of it, if I see a sure way that we can trap the scum, without having the possibility of them all staying hidden under fake claims.
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Quote from hotshizzle »
<hotshizle> WINE IN FRONT OF MEAL
<hotshizle> i think
There's a rough list...for the record, a job claim?! That makes even less sense than a clan claim. Power roles will be forced to lie about their job in thi case..right?
No, I think a job claim would be giving too much away. I was in favor of just claiming clan, but I had forgotten, as Puzzle points out, that certain clans might be more likely to have certain roles.
The more i think about it, the more sure i am that a mass claim at any level is going to give more information to the scum than it will give to the town.
I think we should forget this idea of a mass claim, for now, and should concnetrait on a more productive way to find scum
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How negativly the idea is being viewed makes me think that it is indeed our best course of action.
Chamber, there are at most 4 mafia (5 would be unheard of in a game like this, right?). If there are 12 of us, and the mafia disliked it, the majority of people would still be able to support it. Your logic doesnt....make....sense.
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Quote from Seppel »
I love Joboman, Poggy, Niv, and Vezok, because, while they may not be the best players, they still try to win. Having fun is the most important thing to a game, but I've learned that if you don't try to win, then you're ruining everyone else's fun.
Hey I just realized dyh's other game was about a card game too. To bad I'm not mafia with cc this time :(.
Unvote, vote chamber LAL, amirite?
Reading over the descriptions of the clan, I didn't think that power roles would be guessable, but I do believe I was wrong. Move me to the "against" column.
And chamber, when we know more about the set-up, if it seems likely that a mass claim would hurt us, then any mafioso would get easy townie points for having opposed it early, and they endager themselves none by doing so. I could easily see this much resistance even if it would help the mafia.
In regards to DYH's last game, it was mostly a bunch of generic roles(cop, doc, vig, RBer, masons) with a few twists, a "tag" mechanic in which players were tagged during certain events(being RBed or Investigated for instance) and other roles could only target tagged players, and a two person mafia with the ability to recruit another player once during the game. It was relatively simple, but very well designed, and no form of mass claim would help anyone(if not for a Rahl gambit that got him lynched).
Puzzle is there a reason why you keep focussing on Arimnaes? The thing about him joining the plan then quickly dropping it is the only point ive seen so far (and that applies to me and 2 others as well), and that point happened after you were already urged a arimnaes wagon.
Just seems....strange.
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Quote from Seppel »
I love Joboman, Poggy, Niv, and Vezok, because, while they may not be the best players, they still try to win. Having fun is the most important thing to a game, but I've learned that if you don't try to win, then you're ruining everyone else's fun.
Incidentally, Unvote, Vote ZDS. Youve FOSed me and Arimnaes now...going to stick a vote somewhere sir?
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Quote from Seppel »
I love Joboman, Poggy, Niv, and Vezok, because, while they may not be the best players, they still try to win. Having fun is the most important thing to a game, but I've learned that if you don't try to win, then you're ruining everyone else's fun.
Eh, I'll cautiously add to this, for lack of time, and Vote: Loran16 ...Also, Loran...you're upset at ZDS for not voting for you?
-Alpha
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Quote from TheFooFish »
Lies! -I'm Buffy Summers, town tracker. I used my ability on you and saw that you didn't use any abilities before the game started. My flavor is I was sucked through a mysterious space-time portal and I'm here to kill all the vampires, and my tracking ability is a combination of my Slayer and Native American skills.
There is a flash of light and the late Emperor appears before you again.
"I just wanted to clear up some confusion." he says, "A fortnight is a period of 14 days. The deadline is not this Saturday, but it is the Saturday following - October 28th. That deadline will not be lifted under any circumstances, so work wisely with the time you have."
So there's two people voting you and you attack the person who isn't?
Why attack someone for Fosing when there're two people voting you?
He clearly wasnt voting zds for fosing him hes voting zds for only having fosed two people, and therefore fence sitting. Though this being loran.. I don't know how he can get upset at someone for only fosing.
Though this being loran.. I don't know how he can get upset at someone for only fosing.
QFT...although if we're thinking of the same thing, that was just a hilarious role restriction.
I've said my problem with Loran, aside from backing the mass claim without stating why.
-Alpha
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Quote from TheFooFish »
Lies! -I'm Buffy Summers, town tracker. I used my ability on you and saw that you didn't use any abilities before the game started. My flavor is I was sucked through a mysterious space-time portal and I'm here to kill all the vampires, and my tracking ability is a combination of my Slayer and Native American skills.
I said i didn't mind mass claiming. For my role , claiming the clan would not give anything away (i think). So i failed to see the harm in it, and thought the ability of such a claim to get the mafia to take an early lie might help us later in the game.
Now that it looks like the claim isnt going to happen, im not going to say that i radically oppose thed claim. Id be lieing-i can see the points puzzle and others have made, but From what i can see about my role (and chamber's statement on the fact that his role isnt guessable either), i don't think the claim would be that bad.
To Sum it up, i still think claiming aint a bad idea that could help the town.
BTW @Alpha...how is it scummy to say whether or not you're in support of a claiming plan? I fail to see how that indicates my scumminess.
==============================
My vote on ZDS is cuz of his fence sitting. Arimnaes is being heavily wagoned by Puzzle? ZDS FOSes him. Puzzle starts mentioning me? ZDS FOSes me. ZDS, in his last games here never was cautious with his vote and now all of a sudden he starts FOSing? It doesnt fit the standard ZDS townie playstyle.
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Quote from Seppel »
I love Joboman, Poggy, Niv, and Vezok, because, while they may not be the best players, they still try to win. Having fun is the most important thing to a game, but I've learned that if you don't try to win, then you're ruining everyone else's fun.
Incidentally, Unvote, Vote ZDS. Youve FOSed me and Arimnaes now...going to stick a vote somewhere sir?
*cough* Seinfeld *cough*
Right now, I'm thinking mass claiming may have a beneficial effect, but there's honestly no way to know for sure without actually knowing the roles available, because it could be that it's inherently suicidal.
3) I do not have a "playstyle". My level of cautiousness/aggressiveness is directly linked to my mood, my intuition, the amount of information I know, and whether I think it will be more useful to be cautious or to be aggressive. Please don't use metagaming to analyze my behaviour : It can only fail (and by the way, I'm always cautious with my votes ; because it seems like I sometimes throw them from out of nowhere does not mean there is not a train of thought behind it).
EVERYONE has a "playstyle". Yours has been pretty distinct, you're aggressive and you tend to go overboard analyzing people even when there's nothing there....
And yet you dont seem like the same ZDS. I smell a RAT.
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Quote from Seppel »
I love Joboman, Poggy, Niv, and Vezok, because, while they may not be the best players, they still try to win. Having fun is the most important thing to a game, but I've learned that if you don't try to win, then you're ruining everyone else's fun.
Having never played a game with ZDS, im probably the last person who should be talking about this, but this seems to me, an attempt on Loran's part to change the focus of attention away from him to someone else.
If anyone else who has played a game with him, has something to say, id love to hear about it, but right now, i think im going to have vote loran.
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and Pibbly, if youve ever played a game with ZDS, youd see what i mean. But considering my argument is mainly playstyle differences, its kind of hard to explain if you don't know ZDS at all. Not much i can do for that im afraid.
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Quote from Seppel »
I love Joboman, Poggy, Niv, and Vezok, because, while they may not be the best players, they still try to win. Having fun is the most important thing to a game, but I've learned that if you don't try to win, then you're ruining everyone else's fun.
I dont really think loran is scum here, but I am not sure. I think that his attack on ZDS, seems like a way he is trying to brush off attention. I agree with pod though Fos Pipply 5th vote is very scummy, and the fact that loran is at 5 doesnt seem good to me.
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Quote from hotshizzle »
<hotshizle> WINE IN FRONT OF MEAL
<hotshizle> i think
Ummm, how was it intended to help the scum there?? In that game it ended up helping the town by tripping up CPE and by revealing the Wu's Safeclaims. But i fail to see how knowing the breakdown of wu and shu wouldve helped the scum there?
The scum were in a situation where there were 3 of us in a large game and we had no extra kill or anything (so obviously there were other scum types out there). We all has safe Shu claims; I was interested in finding out the rest of the structure of the game.
Flushing out the Wu and the Wu safe claims was a big part of helping me and Az nearly win the game; other than losing CPE, who we didn't know about anyway, it set the game up in a big way for the mafia because it sent the town hunting the Wu and assorted others. Az and I ended up losing that one because of the imbalanced amount of power roles the town had (arimnaes' ability to secretly confirm himself as doc to Kenji was brutal, and won the game for the town). We didn't lose because the nation claim plan was a bad idea
In this game it's hard to say, especially since I already claimed my clan in a manner of speaking. I'm inclined to agree that exposing our clans won't necessarily expose our abilities- but I'm not sure what the town actually gains.
ZDS: i dont feel that i defened you very much. I felt that i couldnt justify a vote on you for play style reasons when i have never played with you. Expecially when the person brining up the accusation is under pressure themselves. Now if other people, without many votes on them, also agreed with Loran, i would have to rethink my position. There has been plenty of time for other people to address the "different playstyles" issue and no one has. This to me seems like an indication that loran might have been attempting to alter the focus, anyway he could.
Also, i dont think that he thought the mass claim out. If he thinks that the majority of abilities would be hard to guess by the clans, then what is the point of the claim. Im sure if someone tried really hard, they could find a way to fit almost every ability into every clan. If his assuptions are true, then it isnt going to be that hard for the mafia to stick to a lie that has no real consiquences.
And lastly, I find that when going on the defesive, its never a good idea to attempt to point out scuminess in the same post. It looks to much like an attempted shift in focus.
Of course, this is all moot, as it seems that the bandwagon is fading.
Pod: Don't really know what to say to pod. He says this is a gut feeling, and unless he explains it, it will be kinda hard to dispute. Also, i think i should mention that ive never played a game with pod (i dont think, anyway) so i dont think that a gut feeleing with no proof (yet) from a person ive never played with before, can hold much weight.
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I love Joboman, Poggy, Niv, and Vezok, because, while they may not be the best players, they still try to win. Having fun is the most important thing to a game, but I've learned that if you don't try to win, then you're ruining everyone else's fun.
Isn't it the same thing as saying "I could have voted you for play style reason if the circumstances were different" ? Aren't you a little hypocritical for voting loran for doing something you could have done yourself ?
I find Loran scummy, for being scummy. I am not relating his play to previous games. He is relating your play to a previous game and using it as proof. I dont have that luxurey and i dont find Loran in position to be making points like that with out any hard proof, or other people to be chiming in. (I think i may have misinterpreted your question/point)
Quote from ZDS »
The "conversation" about my playstyle between me and loran happened in the span of a few hours, until you stopped it yourself. This does not qualify as "plenty of time for other people to address the "different playstyles" issue".
i didnt stop the conversation about your play style.
Quote from Pibbly »
if anyone else who has played a game with him, has something to say, id love to hear about it,
That kinda looks like im asking for more input. How does asking other people to talk about it stop the conversation? And becuase i didnt stop the conversation about it, there was at least 24 hours between the first post about play style and this post. That is plenty of time, and people can still talk about it now, if they want, and id (like id said before) take it into account.
Quote from ZDS »
I'll grant you the "alterating the focus" part, but why did you vote instead of fosing when he was at 4/7 votes and I specifically asked for no more votes ? You didn't ask him to claim, yet you happily put him at claim-range. That's weird.
Other points I agree with.
i find FOSing completely useless. Whetere im mafia or town i almost completely ignore them unless it is at the end game or almost every single player FOSed me. Id have to admit, i missed you asking for no more votes. I guess i just skimmed over it, my bad. As for him being within claim range, i guess thats true. I didn't ask him to claim because i wasn't at the point where only a claim was going to save him. I was still open to the possibility of him not being scum. And two away from lynch is a perfectly safe spot in my opinion (from getting rush lynched).
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But seriously, Puzzle...are you just trying to see how much influence you can have on us, by constantly trying to make bandwagons? We still have more than a week...that's plenty of time, despite how moderately slow this thread is moving.
-Alpha
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Quote from TheFooFish »
Lies! -I'm Buffy Summers, town tracker. I used my ability on you and saw that you didn't use any abilities before the game started. My flavor is I was sucked through a mysterious space-time portal and I'm here to kill all the vampires, and my tracking ability is a combination of my Slayer and Native American skills.
Puzzle does not need to justify his vote, he is obviously bandwagonning as much as he can. Let's just hope his play will not entirely consist of "vote arimnaes, vote whoeverisbeingbandwagonned, vote arimnaes, vote whoeverisbeingbandwagonned, bis repetita".
Or perhaps he's simply supporting the logic of those who voted for Pibbles before him? It's not completely unnatural. It looks strange, but not that much so.
ZDS: I dont find him accusing you because of play style scummy, its the way he did it (the seeming attempt at redirection) as well as all the other reasons ive already stated.
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Bet you that if somone else (Loran, say) had bandwagonned as reasonlessly as Puzzle you woulda been down on them like a ton of bricks. Instead, you tell Xyre that Puzzles actions are arcane and mysterious, only understood by him, as he obviously has some greater plan for the good of the town, which is somehow ok.
Heh, you're asking him for clarification now? Normally when you have your vote on someone and are asking them to clarify their reasons for doing something, it's called attacking. But w/ever. Just that your 2nd to last post looked far too agressive to simply be a post asking for clarification of a point, like you claim it is.
I agree w/puzzle. Rafk and CC should be here. Plus, it's the not the fact that the deadlines so close, it's that we can't get an extension that I hate.
Hey, I have people who are willing to barn me. I just can't pull a chamber and expect them to flock to my aid like puzzle's doing.
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Quote from Seppel »
I love Joboman, Poggy, Niv, and Vezok, because, while they may not be the best players, they still try to win. Having fun is the most important thing to a game, but I've learned that if you don't try to win, then you're ruining everyone else's fun.
1. One week left isn't much. Look how far (or not far, to be precise) we've gone in 10 days.
2. If we don't get a claim at least 4 days before the deadline, it may be hard to evaluate it properly. Let alone get another wagon rolling. That leads to poor lynches / no-lynches, none of which helps the town.
True, but chances are that you aren't going to force a claim by starting baseless bandwagons. You'll need voting support for that...also, your switch just brings less people to vote with you...
Bet you that if somone else (Loran, say) had bandwagonned as reasonlessly as Puzzle you woulda been down on them like a ton of bricks. Instead, you tell Xyre that Puzzles actions are arcane and mysterious, only understood by him, as he obviously has some greater plan for the good of the town, which is somehow ok.
K, let's test that.. Unvote, Vote Puzzle.
-Alpha
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Quote from TheFooFish »
Lies! -I'm Buffy Summers, town tracker. I used my ability on you and saw that you didn't use any abilities before the game started. My flavor is I was sucked through a mysterious space-time portal and I'm here to kill all the vampires, and my tracking ability is a combination of my Slayer and Native American skills.
I was going to do the smart thing, and try and push a wagon before deciding whether or not to daykill, but I'm just too damn lazy and impatient to wait for it, or to try and convince people.
CPE, claim in your next post, or I'll daykill you.
CPE, claim in your next post, or I'll daykill you.
'And we'll have fun, fun, fun, till CC takes the CPE awaaaay.'
-Alpha
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Quote from TheFooFish »
Lies! -I'm Buffy Summers, town tracker. I used my ability on you and saw that you didn't use any abilities before the game started. My flavor is I was sucked through a mysterious space-time portal and I'm here to kill all the vampires, and my tracking ability is a combination of my Slayer and Native American skills.
Pod: You claimed that i was non-commital, defensive and useless. Please let me refute this claims
Non-comimtal, What about my vote for loran? how exactly more commital do you want me to be? The next step up would be to get him lynched, and about 4 days ago, i would have been ok with that. In fact im pretty sure i wouldnt be that disapointed if he got lynched today.
Defensive, Ever since my vote ZDS, you and other people have been all over me. Like i clearly said in my defence, i find people who start yelling scum in other people's direction when under attack scummy, so i try and avoid it. But for your sake, i shall try and reread the thread this weekend.
Useless, I have generated discusion and voiced my opinion. How is this useless. I realiaze that it usually takes me a couple of real days before i get going as i really have no clue what to say in the early game. Exactly what else would you like me to do?
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I was going to do the smart thing, and try and push a wagon before deciding whether or not to daykill, but I'm just too damn lazy and impatient to wait for it, or to try and convince people.
CPE, claim in your next post, or I'll daykill you.
Woah...daykiller in a mini game... Yikes.
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Quote from Seppel »
I love Joboman, Poggy, Niv, and Vezok, because, while they may not be the best players, they still try to win. Having fun is the most important thing to a game, but I've learned that if you don't try to win, then you're ruining everyone else's fun.
CC I dont really want to do this, but I am a Townie, so I guess I dont have a LOT to lose here. Seriously though, why the eager daykill? I have been here, I am just very busy this week (I had like 4 tests already and 2 tommorrow) I also think that Puzzle is bandwagoning a lot, and I dont know if that is a scumtell for him, as he seems to be less crazy as scum. I also admit a daykiller in a mini is scary. So far I think that I would be happy with a ZDS, or a Loran lynch. Both have just struck me wierd, and I dont know about puzzle, right now I will say town though.
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Quote from hotshizzle »
<hotshizle> WINE IN FRONT OF MEAL
<hotshizle> i think
I was going to do the smart thing, and try and push a wagon before deciding whether or not to daykill, but I'm just too damn lazy and impatient to wait for it, or to try and convince people.
CPE, claim in your next post, or I'll daykill you.
How so?
Experiments Series: #5 (Courtly Intrigue Mafia) | #4 (Drunken Tracker) | #3 (Big Red Button) - coming soon | #2 (Pope Mafia) | #1 (Iso's Inflammable Mafia)
Mini Games: MTGS Mafia Redux II (Invitational, Evil Mirror Universe) | Unreal City
Old Games (bad): The Greenwood Affair | Blood Moon Mafia
Hmm. That does make sense, and in a game this size, I can see where the problems may occur.
Experiments Series: #5 (Courtly Intrigue Mafia) | #4 (Drunken Tracker) | #3 (Big Red Button) - coming soon | #2 (Pope Mafia) | #1 (Iso's Inflammable Mafia)
Mini Games: MTGS Mafia Redux II (Invitational, Evil Mirror Universe) | Unreal City
Old Games (bad): The Greenwood Affair | Blood Moon Mafia
Against Mass Claim:
AlphaInsidious
Puzzle
ZDS
Pibbly
For Mass Claim:
CropCircles
Chamber
Arimnaes
Loran16
On the fence:
Xyre (leaning against)
RafK
Pod (wants job claim)
-----------------------------
There's a rough list...for the record, a job claim?! That makes even less sense than a clan claim. Power roles will be forced to lie about their job in thi case..right?
-Alpha
No, I think a job claim would be giving too much away. I was in favor of just claiming clan, but I had forgotten, as Puzzle points out, that certain clans might be more likely to have certain roles.
Move me back to the fence, I guess.
I think we should forget this idea of a mass claim, for now, and should concnetrait on a more productive way to find scum
Town/Mafia/Other - 14/6/3
Win/Lose/Tie - 11/12/0
Nk/lynched/Survived - 16/4/3
Huh? What do you mean?
Experiments Series: #5 (Courtly Intrigue Mafia) | #4 (Drunken Tracker) | #3 (Big Red Button) - coming soon | #2 (Pope Mafia) | #1 (Iso's Inflammable Mafia)
Mini Games: MTGS Mafia Redux II (Invitational, Evil Mirror Universe) | Unreal City
Old Games (bad): The Greenwood Affair | Blood Moon Mafia
Town/Mafia/Other - 14/6/3
Win/Lose/Tie - 11/12/0
Nk/lynched/Survived - 16/4/3
Chamber, there are at most 4 mafia (5 would be unheard of in a game like this, right?). If there are 12 of us, and the mafia disliked it, the majority of people would still be able to support it. Your logic doesnt....make....sense.
Logical Reasoning is dead; Long Live Stupidity
Reading over the descriptions of the clan, I didn't think that power roles would be guessable, but I do believe I was wrong. Move me to the "against" column.
And chamber, when we know more about the set-up, if it seems likely that a mass claim would hurt us, then any mafioso would get easy townie points for having opposed it early, and they endager themselves none by doing so. I could easily see this much resistance even if it would help the mafia.
In regards to DYH's last game, it was mostly a bunch of generic roles(cop, doc, vig, RBer, masons) with a few twists, a "tag" mechanic in which players were tagged during certain events(being RBed or Investigated for instance) and other roles could only target tagged players, and a two person mafia with the ability to recruit another player once during the game. It was relatively simple, but very well designed, and no form of mass claim would help anyone(if not for a Rahl gambit that got him lynched).
[The Family]
AlphaInsidious (2) - Pod, RafaelK
Arimnaes (1) - Puzzle
Chamber (1) - CropCircles
Pibbly (1) - Arimnaes
Puzzle (1) - Chamber
ZeDorkSlipeur (1) - Creampuffeater
With 12 alive, it is 7 to lynch.
Deadline is set (and not being lifted) for Saturday, October 28th.
V/LA: 3/21-3/24 & 3/27-3/29
Just seems....strange.
Logical Reasoning is dead; Long Live Stupidity
Incidentally, Unvote, Vote ZDS. Youve FOSed me and Arimnaes now...going to stick a vote somewhere sir?
Logical Reasoning is dead; Long Live Stupidity
-Alpha
"I just wanted to clear up some confusion." he says, "A fortnight is a period of 14 days. The deadline is not this Saturday, but it is the Saturday following - October 28th. That deadline will not be lifted under any circumstances, so work wisely with the time you have."
He again presents the tablet:
Loran16 (3) - Puzzle, Pod, AlphaInsidious
ZeDorkSlipeur (2) - Creampuffeater, Loran16
AlphaInsidious (1) - RafaelK
Chamber (1) - CropCircles
Pibbly (1) - Arimnaes
Puzzle (1) - Chamber
With 12 alive, it is 7 to lynch.
Deadline is set (and not being lifted) for Saturday, October 28th.
V/LA: 3/21-3/24 & 3/27-3/29
He clearly wasnt voting zds for fosing him hes voting zds for only having fosed two people, and therefore fence sitting. Though this being loran.. I don't know how he can get upset at someone for only fosing.
Town/Mafia/Other - 14/6/3
Win/Lose/Tie - 11/12/0
Nk/lynched/Survived - 16/4/3
QFT...although if we're thinking of the same thing, that was just a hilarious role restriction.
I've said my problem with Loran, aside from backing the mass claim without stating why.
-Alpha
I said i didn't mind mass claiming. For my role , claiming the clan would not give anything away (i think). So i failed to see the harm in it, and thought the ability of such a claim to get the mafia to take an early lie might help us later in the game.
Now that it looks like the claim isnt going to happen, im not going to say that i radically oppose thed claim. Id be lieing-i can see the points puzzle and others have made, but From what i can see about my role (and chamber's statement on the fact that his role isnt guessable either), i don't think the claim would be that bad.
To Sum it up, i still think claiming aint a bad idea that could help the town.
BTW @Alpha...how is it scummy to say whether or not you're in support of a claiming plan? I fail to see how that indicates my scumminess.
==============================
My vote on ZDS is cuz of his fence sitting. Arimnaes is being heavily wagoned by Puzzle? ZDS FOSes him. Puzzle starts mentioning me? ZDS FOSes me. ZDS, in his last games here never was cautious with his vote and now all of a sudden he starts FOSing? It doesnt fit the standard ZDS townie playstyle.
Logical Reasoning is dead; Long Live Stupidity
*cough* Seinfeld *cough*
Right now, I'm thinking mass claiming may have a beneficial effect, but there's honestly no way to know for sure without actually knowing the roles available, because it could be that it's inherently suicidal.
Experiments Series: #5 (Courtly Intrigue Mafia) | #4 (Drunken Tracker) | #3 (Big Red Button) - coming soon | #2 (Pope Mafia) | #1 (Iso's Inflammable Mafia)
Mini Games: MTGS Mafia Redux II (Invitational, Evil Mirror Universe) | Unreal City
Old Games (bad): The Greenwood Affair | Blood Moon Mafia
EVERYONE has a "playstyle". Yours has been pretty distinct, you're aggressive and you tend to go overboard analyzing people even when there's nothing there....
And yet you dont seem like the same ZDS. I smell a RAT.
Logical Reasoning is dead; Long Live Stupidity
If anyone else who has played a game with him, has something to say, id love to hear about it, but right now, i think im going to have vote loran.
and Pibbly, if youve ever played a game with ZDS, youd see what i mean. But considering my argument is mainly playstyle differences, its kind of hard to explain if you don't know ZDS at all. Not much i can do for that im afraid.
Logical Reasoning is dead; Long Live Stupidity
Could someone explain to me what the case against loran is? (Besides general Lynch All Lorans principles, that is).
The scum were in a situation where there were 3 of us in a large game and we had no extra kill or anything (so obviously there were other scum types out there). We all has safe Shu claims; I was interested in finding out the rest of the structure of the game.
Flushing out the Wu and the Wu safe claims was a big part of helping me and Az nearly win the game; other than losing CPE, who we didn't know about anyway, it set the game up in a big way for the mafia because it sent the town hunting the Wu and assorted others. Az and I ended up losing that one because of the imbalanced amount of power roles the town had (arimnaes' ability to secretly confirm himself as doc to Kenji was brutal, and won the game for the town). We didn't lose because the nation claim plan was a bad idea
In this game it's hard to say, especially since I already claimed my clan in a manner of speaking. I'm inclined to agree that exposing our clans won't necessarily expose our abilities- but I'm not sure what the town actually gains.
You must have a real self-hate complex.
Town/Mafia/Other - 14/6/3
Win/Lose/Tie - 11/12/0
Nk/lynched/Survived - 16/4/3
ZeDorkSlipeur (3) - Creampuffeater, Loran16, Arimnaes
Loran16 (2) - AlphaInsidious, Pibbly
Pibbly (2) - Pod, ZeDorkSlipeur
AlphaInsidious (1) - RafaelK
Arimnaes (1) - Puzzle
Chamber (1) - CropCircles
Pod (1) - Chamber
With 12 alive, it is 7 to lynch.
Deadline is Saturday, October 28th.
V/LA: 3/21-3/24 & 3/27-3/29
ZDS: i dont feel that i defened you very much. I felt that i couldnt justify a vote on you for play style reasons when i have never played with you. Expecially when the person brining up the accusation is under pressure themselves. Now if other people, without many votes on them, also agreed with Loran, i would have to rethink my position. There has been plenty of time for other people to address the "different playstyles" issue and no one has. This to me seems like an indication that loran might have been attempting to alter the focus, anyway he could.
Also, i dont think that he thought the mass claim out. If he thinks that the majority of abilities would be hard to guess by the clans, then what is the point of the claim. Im sure if someone tried really hard, they could find a way to fit almost every ability into every clan. If his assuptions are true, then it isnt going to be that hard for the mafia to stick to a lie that has no real consiquences.
And lastly, I find that when going on the defesive, its never a good idea to attempt to point out scuminess in the same post. It looks to much like an attempted shift in focus.
Of course, this is all moot, as it seems that the bandwagon is fading.
Pod: Don't really know what to say to pod. He says this is a gut feeling, and unless he explains it, it will be kinda hard to dispute. Also, i think i should mention that ive never played a game with pod (i dont think, anyway) so i dont think that a gut feeleing with no proof (yet) from a person ive never played with before, can hold much weight.
Logical Reasoning is dead; Long Live Stupidity
I find Loran scummy, for being scummy. I am not relating his play to previous games. He is relating your play to a previous game and using it as proof. I dont have that luxurey and i dont find Loran in position to be making points like that with out any hard proof, or other people to be chiming in. (I think i may have misinterpreted your question/point)
i didnt stop the conversation about your play style.
That kinda looks like im asking for more input. How does asking other people to talk about it stop the conversation? And becuase i didnt stop the conversation about it, there was at least 24 hours between the first post about play style and this post. That is plenty of time, and people can still talk about it now, if they want, and id (like id said before) take it into account.
i find FOSing completely useless. Whetere im mafia or town i almost completely ignore them unless it is at the end game or almost every single player FOSed me. Id have to admit, i missed you asking for no more votes. I guess i just skimmed over it, my bad. As for him being within claim range, i guess thats true. I didn't ask him to claim because i wasn't at the point where only a claim was going to save him. I was still open to the possibility of him not being scum. And two away from lynch is a perfectly safe spot in my opinion (from getting rush lynched).
Jealousy...
But seriously, Puzzle...are you just trying to see how much influence you can have on us, by constantly trying to make bandwagons? We still have more than a week...that's plenty of time, despite how moderately slow this thread is moving.
-Alpha
Or perhaps he's simply supporting the logic of those who voted for Pibbles before him? It's not completely unnatural. It looks strange, but not that much so.
Experiments Series: #5 (Courtly Intrigue Mafia) | #4 (Drunken Tracker) | #3 (Big Red Button) - coming soon | #2 (Pope Mafia) | #1 (Iso's Inflammable Mafia)
Mini Games: MTGS Mafia Redux II (Invitational, Evil Mirror Universe) | Unreal City
Old Games (bad): The Greenwood Affair | Blood Moon Mafia
Hey, I have people who are willing to barn me. I just can't pull a chamber and expect them to flock to my aid like puzzle's doing.
Logical Reasoning is dead; Long Live Stupidity
Unvote, Vote CPE in case we end up having to do it the hard way.
[The Family]
True, but chances are that you aren't going to force a claim by starting baseless bandwagons. You'll need voting support for that...also, your switch just brings less people to vote with you...
K, let's test that.. Unvote, Vote Puzzle.
-Alpha
I was going to do the smart thing, and try and push a wagon before deciding whether or not to daykill, but I'm just too damn lazy and impatient to wait for it, or to try and convince people.
CPE, claim in your next post, or I'll daykill you.
[The Family]
'And we'll have fun, fun, fun, till CC takes the CPE awaaaay.'
-Alpha
Non-comimtal, What about my vote for loran? how exactly more commital do you want me to be? The next step up would be to get him lynched, and about 4 days ago, i would have been ok with that. In fact im pretty sure i wouldnt be that disapointed if he got lynched today.
Defensive, Ever since my vote ZDS, you and other people have been all over me. Like i clearly said in my defence, i find people who start yelling scum in other people's direction when under attack scummy, so i try and avoid it. But for your sake, i shall try and reread the thread this weekend.
Useless, I have generated discusion and voiced my opinion. How is this useless. I realiaze that it usually takes me a couple of real days before i get going as i really have no clue what to say in the early game. Exactly what else would you like me to do?
unvote, incidentally, my early prod has been overtaken by events.
Woah...daykiller in a mini game... Yikes.
Logical Reasoning is dead; Long Live Stupidity
Threaten pod next plz <3.
Town/Mafia/Other - 14/6/3
Win/Lose/Tie - 11/12/0
Nk/lynched/Survived - 16/4/3
Then shoot him.