Actually, I can follow BK's logic here somewhat. Vote: Swinkee
-Alpha
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Quote from TheFooFish »
Lies! -I'm Buffy Summers, town tracker. I used my ability on you and saw that you didn't use any abilities before the game started. My flavor is I was sucked through a mysterious space-time portal and I'm here to kill all the vampires, and my tracking ability is a combination of my Slayer and Native American skills.
That was a very quick Day.
Before help checks this thread and day ends, if anyone wants to claim a kill ability, nows the time. I can confirm for you. (Target will be selected randomly, by die roll.) Any volunteers?
Spock is not portrayed correctly. If Vulcans are above petty emotions, what motivates him to join the most elite starship crew in the galaxy? I, on the other hand, have transcended the weakness of emotion and achieved a blissful lack of caring. Apathy is my strength, our strength, which prevents us from being all-to-human. In this spirit, may Meh be with you, always.
However, I am useful as someone who CONFIRMS killers. If you're a killer, I can clear you. I think that makes me worth keeping around.
How does this work? You just redirect abilities, if I'm reading this correctly. I think my ability would be rather more useful towards this end. That's all I'm going to say about that.
Not that it matters, but symbolically I'm going to abstain from voting. If I had a chance to weigh in, I'd have said the case against swinkee isn't good enough to convince me.
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Vive, vale. Siquid novisti rectius istis,
candidus inperti; si nil, his utere mecum.
You all awaken. Hooray! Nobody died last night. Then you hear something stumbling around outside your tents. You look out, and see Pibbly, looking confused.
Oh, please dont let BillKing make decisions for you. He is obviously and Evil character that noticed Swinkee's reaction to my death, and assumed Good. The only question in my mind, is wether he is Chaotic Evil, Neutral Evil or Lawful Evil.
*finds his familiar* --Saweeeet!
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Hi Pibbly, how's it hanging? You're sure BK's not a good'un?
-Alpha
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Quote from TheFooFish »
Lies! -I'm Buffy Summers, town tracker. I used my ability on you and saw that you didn't use any abilities before the game started. My flavor is I was sucked through a mysterious space-time portal and I'm here to kill all the vampires, and my tracking ability is a combination of my Slayer and Native American skills.
hmm.. the ability to redirect someone's ability, does that sound like a Good person would do? i dont think so! To me it sounds like a Chaotic Evil Wizard (or Sorc) ability. And personally, i dont think that i want him choosing who lives and dies.
As for no deaths last night. Maybe we have a Killer who can only kill every other night. Or i guess we could have a lawful Good cleric who protected someone last night.
Oh ya, Crippled Fist, thx for the compliment!!
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I recieved no mention of anything that happened. I just got a Pm pretty much saying "You are Alive now, you may post again" with a little bit of D&D lingo thrown in
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Hi Pibbly, how's it hanging? You're sure BK's not a good'un?
-Alpha
Does it matter? What important here — as I outlined before — is killing your enemies. When over half the town is your enemy, assassins (Evil) are good and doctors (Good) are bad. In other words, you're arguing whether I'm scum. I'm obviously going to say no.
Now onto voting. I had BlinkingSpirit target Crippled_Fist. Crippled_Fist doesn't seem to be dead. Crippled_Fist may be suffering from negative effects, but unless he has reason to believe he shares an alignment with BlinkingSpirit he's going to shut up and make sure he gets lynched instead of clearing him. So we'll assume that BlinkingSpirit is a doctor or something, and that he needs to suffer immediate death. So I'll vote BlinkingSpirit. If anyone can confirm — say, by claiming a kill ability on Crippled_Fist that fizzled — that would be righteous.
Spock is not portrayed correctly. If Vulcans are above petty emotions, what motivates him to join the most elite starship crew in the galaxy? I, on the other hand, have transcended the weakness of emotion and achieved a blissful lack of caring. Apathy is my strength, our strength, which prevents us from being all-to-human. In this spirit, may Meh be with you, always.
Does it matter? What important here — as I outlined before — is killing your enemies. When over half the town is your enemy, assassins (Evil) are good and doctors (Good) are bad. In other words, you're arguing whether I'm scum. I'm obviously going to say no.
Now onto voting. I had BlinkingSpirit target Crippled_Fist. Crippled_Fist doesn't seem to be dead. Crippled_Fist may be suffering from negative effects, but unless he has reason to believe he shares an alignment with BlinkingSpirit he's going to shut up and make sure he gets lynched instead of clearing him. So we'll assume that BlinkingSpirit is a doctor or something, and that he needs to suffer immediate death. So I'll vote BlinkingSpirit. If anyone can confirm — say, by claiming a kill ability on Crippled_Fist that fizzled — that would be righteous.
Hold off on further votes for me, guys, until I get some clarifications from help. Suffice it to say that I think billking is lying, but I'm not yet certain.
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Vive, vale. Siquid novisti rectius istis,
candidus inperti; si nil, his utere mecum.
And could you explain the logic behind the fact that anyone who kills is good, anyone who doesn't is bad, again? You kind of blew through it the first time.
Finally, it's Blinking Spirit. Two words. Thank you.
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Vive, vale. Siquid novisti rectius istis,
candidus inperti; si nil, his utere mecum.
Does it matter? What important here — as I outlined before — is killing your enemies. When over half the town is your enemy, assassins (Evil) are good and doctors (Good) are bad. In other words, you're arguing whether I'm scum. I'm obviously going to say no.
Evil people are only good for OTHER EVIL PEOPLE. As a good person, i need all of the EVIL people to be dead. Why would i want to keep them around, when they want to kill me. Your post does not make sence. I want to keep the docs around, because they might just protect me. A known good person, therefor keep me alive for another day.
I can kill my enimies by voting them off. I dont need other people to do it for me. therefor VOTE BILLKING
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And could you explain the logic behind the fact that anyone who kills is good, anyone who doesn't is bad, again? You kind of blew through it the first time.
I'll make it color-coded for easier reading.
For every player there are:
- 3 allied alignments
- 3 enemy alignments (by win condition)
- 2 more enemy alignments (due to competition for lynches OR due to being both ally and enemy)
For somone who is partial neutral (for example, NG) the distribution looks like this:
LG NG CG
LN XX CN
LE NE CE
For someone who's completely nonneutral (for example, LG) the distribution looks like this:
LG NG CG
LN XX CN
LE NE CE
What does this all mean? It means that over half the town is your enemy. This is the key fact that leads to all of the following positions:
- Killing abilities are good for the majority; a random kill every Night helps you more than hurts you.
- Things that stop killing abilities are bad for the majority; like I said, a random kill every Night helps you more than hurts you.
So, in other words, the roles are switched. The assassins are the Town, and it's the doctors who are scum. Bizarro Mafia.
Spock is not portrayed correctly. If Vulcans are above petty emotions, what motivates him to join the most elite starship crew in the galaxy? I, on the other hand, have transcended the weakness of emotion and achieved a blissful lack of caring. Apathy is my strength, our strength, which prevents us from being all-to-human. In this spirit, may Meh be with you, always.
Spock is not portrayed correctly. If Vulcans are above petty emotions, what motivates him to join the most elite starship crew in the galaxy? I, on the other hand, have transcended the weakness of emotion and achieved a blissful lack of caring. Apathy is my strength, our strength, which prevents us from being all-to-human. In this spirit, may Meh be with you, always.
The problem with your logic there, is it not completely random Killing. The evil people will go after the people that are GOOD. Like me. They know that they cant win with me alive. Why would they want to let me live? It is not random. It was only random on the first night. From now on, they will have atleast a good guess of who to kill. Also, the Doctors are my friends, they will hopefully keep me safe from the evil assasins. The doctors (most likely good/lawful) will want to keep those people alive. Therefor they are good for me. Just because you are evil and want everyone else dead, doesnt mean that the docs are bad for everyone else.
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Evil people are only good for OTHER EVIL PEOPLE. As a good person, i need all of the EVIL people to be dead. Why would i want to keep them around, when they want to kill me. Your post does not make sence. I want to keep the docs around, because they might just protect me. A known good person, therefor keep me alive for another day.
I can kill my enimies by voting them off. I dont need other people to do it for me. therefor VOTE BILLKING
Of course you'd say that. You're Good. A confirmed enemy of the town.
Spock is not portrayed correctly. If Vulcans are above petty emotions, what motivates him to join the most elite starship crew in the galaxy? I, on the other hand, have transcended the weakness of emotion and achieved a blissful lack of caring. Apathy is my strength, our strength, which prevents us from being all-to-human. In this spirit, may Meh be with you, always.
The problem with your logic there, is it not completely random Killing. The evil people will go after the people that are GOOD. Like me. They know that they cant win with me alive. Why would they want to let me live? It is not random. It was only random on the first night. From now on, they will have atleast a good guess of who to kill. Also, the Doctors are my friends, they will hopefully keep me safe from the evil assasins. The doctors (most likely good/lawful) will want to keep those people alive. Therefor they are good for me. Just because you are evil and want everyone else dead, doesnt mean that the docs are bad for everyone else.
You're wrong on several counts.
First, there's no incentive to kill you right now. We know your alignment, and from your flavor your role sounds rather nonthreatening. Perhaps you can kill people at night. If so, GREAT! Over half the town wants me dead... so they'd have no problem with you killing me tonight! They'd welcome the news!
Instead, it would be much better to kill someone who we don't know their alignment yet. With a ressurector in this game, the assassin becomes the ultimate cop — he makes the information public. I guarantee that killing you today or tonight is definitely a mistake. No no no... we're going after your friends.
Second, if someone is a doctor, it would be in their best interest to protect either no one or (better yet) themselves. If half the town is your enemy, why would you try to protect someone you'd rather see die? Granted: any Good doctors could protect you because they KNOW you are a teammate. The non-Good doctors (if any) will have no incentive to protect you, however, and if anyone protects you, it's not going to work, because we're not interested in killing you tonight (see above).
Spock is not portrayed correctly. If Vulcans are above petty emotions, what motivates him to join the most elite starship crew in the galaxy? I, on the other hand, have transcended the weakness of emotion and achieved a blissful lack of caring. Apathy is my strength, our strength, which prevents us from being all-to-human. In this spirit, may Meh be with you, always.
For every player there are:
- 3 allied alignments
- 3 enemy alignments (by win condition)
- 2 more enemy alignments (due to competition for lynches OR due to being both ally and enemy)
For somone who is partial neutral (for example, NG) the distribution looks like this:
LG NG CG
LN XX CN
LE NE CE
As a partially neutral player, I can say this is incorrect. I win for eliminating all character of the alignment directly opposed to me, and all characters from either one or the other alignment. So, if I was Pibbly, I'd win for killing all chaotic characters and either all good or all evil characters. Perhaps Pibbly can confirm?
Quote from billking »
For someone who's completely nonneutral (for example, LG) the distribution looks like this:
LG NG CG
LN XX CN
LE NE CE
What does this all mean? It means that over half the town is your enemy. This is the key fact that leads to all of the following positions:
- Killing abilities are good for the majority; a random kill every Night helps you more than hurts you.
- Things that stop killing abilities are bad for the majority; like I said, a random kill every Night helps you more than hurts you.
You are missing the key fact that the killers theoretically aren't killing randomly; they're killing according to their goals. If your alignment is opposed to theirs, they're not going to kill people whose elimination is beneficial to you; they're going to kill you.
Secondly, elimination changes the logic somewhat. For a CE player, swinkee and Puzzle's deaths swing the balance considerably, so that if this player was the killer, he wouldn't want to fire randomly, because his chances of killing an ally or potential ally are much greater now.
Thirdly, there are nine alignments, but twelve of us. That means some of us are doubled up. We might assume that they're spread evenly throughout (perhaps an extra one in each of the extreme alignments, an no true neutral); depending on how they're spread, this could change the argument somewhat. There's also the possibility that they're not distributed evenly to consider; if there actually is a "mafia" of sorts in this game, it might mean there are more evils than otherwise, perhaps three independent evil players and three evil conspirators.
Finally, what leap of logic led you to conclude that because my ability didn't kill Crippled_Fist, it actually protected him from death?
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Vive, vale. Siquid novisti rectius istis,
candidus inperti; si nil, his utere mecum.
Spock is not portrayed correctly. If Vulcans are above petty emotions, what motivates him to join the most elite starship crew in the galaxy? I, on the other hand, have transcended the weakness of emotion and achieved a blissful lack of caring. Apathy is my strength, our strength, which prevents us from being all-to-human. In this spirit, may Meh be with you, always.
First, there's no incentive to kill you right now. We know your alignment, and from your flavor your role sounds rather nonthreatening. Perhaps you can kill people at night. If so, GREAT! Over half the town wants me dead... so they'd have no problem with you killing me tonight! They'd welcome the news!
But he's neutral good, which means all the evil players need him dead to win, and the LN and CN characters have the option of killing all good players to win as well.
Quote from billking »
Instead, it would be much better to kill someone who we don't know their alignment yet. With a ressurector in this game, the assassin becomes the ultimate cop — he makes the information public. I guarantee that killing you today or tonight is definitely a mistake. No no no... we're going after your friends.
Again, the resurrector is only going to resurrect allies - so if he's LG, he's only going to rez NG characters (like Pibbly) or LN characters (like swinkee - expect him to be back soon, guys).
Quote from billking »
Second, if someone is a doctor, it would be in their best interest to protect either no one or (better yet) themselves. If half the town is your enemy, why would you try to protect someone you'd rather see die? Granted: any Good doctors could protect you because they KNOW you are a teammate. The non-Good doctors (if any) will have no incentive to protect you, however, and if anyone protects you, it's not going to work, because we're not interested in killing you tonight (see above).
Again, the evil players will now be gunning for Pibbly because he is a confirmed good player; taking out a confirmed goodie beats a random shot every time for them.
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Vive, vale. Siquid novisti rectius istis,
candidus inperti; si nil, his utere mecum.
Finally, what leap of logic led you to conclude that because my ability didn't kill Crippled_Fist, it actually protected him from death?
None. I haven't concluded it. I've just concluded that that might have been what happeend, and that's enough for me. (You don't need a very good reason to vote when you know half the town is your enemy.)
Spock is not portrayed correctly. If Vulcans are above petty emotions, what motivates him to join the most elite starship crew in the galaxy? I, on the other hand, have transcended the weakness of emotion and achieved a blissful lack of caring. Apathy is my strength, our strength, which prevents us from being all-to-human. In this spirit, may Meh be with you, always.
Maybe you say you arnt going to kill me, just so i dont get any protection tonight. I dont know, all i know is that you are my enemy. and i dont want you alive. Is anyone else gonig to post here? we do need other people to post information. This is not just a Pibbly-Billking argument thread. We can argue with other people as well.
But how are you going to go after my friends, when you dont know who they are. A smart man would go for the sure thing, in this case, that would be me.
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Then, considering how you're obviously not LN or CN, you'll lose.
Actually, I am either LN or CN. Pibbly is one of my secondary enemies.
Also, Evil isn't concerned with kills. They have enough kills. What they're concerned with is collecting the information they need to set things up. Remember, Good is scum... so Evil are essentially the cops. They're concerned primarily with information gathering. Killing will come in time; until then, patience is a virtue.
Spock is not portrayed correctly. If Vulcans are above petty emotions, what motivates him to join the most elite starship crew in the galaxy? I, on the other hand, have transcended the weakness of emotion and achieved a blissful lack of caring. Apathy is my strength, our strength, which prevents us from being all-to-human. In this spirit, may Meh be with you, always.
Actually, I am either LN or CN. Pibbly is one of my secondary enemies.
Then how do you explain our difference in win conditions?
Also, Evil isn't concerned with kills. They have enough kills. What they're concerned with is collecting the information they need to set things up. Remember, Good is scum... so Evil are essentially the cops. They're concerned primarily with information gathering. Killing will come in time; until then, patience is a virtue.
How is good scum? The more information is revealed, the less random evil will be, and the more its targeting will reflect its win conditions, which are not yours. Furthermore, one of the extreme evil alignments is going to be targeting you (as is one of the good extreme alignments, to be sure, but the good alignment probably won't have the capacity to kill you offhand).
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Vive, vale. Siquid novisti rectius istis,
candidus inperti; si nil, his utere mecum.
Spock is not portrayed correctly. If Vulcans are above petty emotions, what motivates him to join the most elite starship crew in the galaxy? I, on the other hand, have transcended the weakness of emotion and achieved a blissful lack of caring. Apathy is my strength, our strength, which prevents us from being all-to-human. In this spirit, may Meh be with you, always.
All the win conditions are the same (i assume) just altered for which ever alignment you are. So assuming that you are CN, you have to kill all LAWFUL, and kill all of either the Good or the Evil..... according to my win condition
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All the win conditions are the same (i assume) just altered for which ever alignment you are. So assuming that you are CN, you have to kill all LAWFUL, and kill all of either the Good or the Evil..... according to my win condition
I interpret this to mean "Kill all the Lawfuls, and in the weird instance that they're done before you are, finish up the game." Which isn't very different, strategically, from "Kill all the Lawfuls."
By the way, yes, my win condition is worded like that.
Spock is not portrayed correctly. If Vulcans are above petty emotions, what motivates him to join the most elite starship crew in the galaxy? I, on the other hand, have transcended the weakness of emotion and achieved a blissful lack of caring. Apathy is my strength, our strength, which prevents us from being all-to-human. In this spirit, may Meh be with you, always.
I interpret this to mean "Kill all the Lawfuls, and in the weird instance that they're done before you are, finish up the game." Which isn't very different, strategically, from "Kill all the Lawfuls."
By the way, yes, my win condition is worded like that.
Hunh? You need five alignments dead, not three. Pibbly's win condition is worded the same way as my own, which, by the way, I did not "hint at," but outright told you (read the thread):
Quote from Blinking Spirit »
As a partially neutral player, I can say this is incorrect. I win for eliminating all character of the alignment directly opposed to me, and all characters from either one or the other alignment. So, if I was Pibbly, I'd win for killing all chaotic characters and either all good or all evil characters. Perhaps Pibbly can confirm?
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Vive, vale. Siquid novisti rectius istis,
candidus inperti; si nil, his utere mecum.
My point is that Good and Evil are probably going to be killing each other in the meantime. I doubt there'll be much work to do after I get done doing my job... maybe one person. Big deal.
Spock is not portrayed correctly. If Vulcans are above petty emotions, what motivates him to join the most elite starship crew in the galaxy? I, on the other hand, have transcended the weakness of emotion and achieved a blissful lack of caring. Apathy is my strength, our strength, which prevents us from being all-to-human. In this spirit, may Meh be with you, always.
The only problem with that, is You are forcusing on Me, a good person. If you dont start to focus on some Lawful people, then how are you going to win?
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My point is that Good and Evil are probably going to be killing each other in the meantime. I doubt there'll be much work to do after I get done doing my job... maybe one person. Big deal.
That was not the impression I got from your pretty little diagram. If you're CN, CE and CG should both be orange, given that one or the other is going to have to die for you to win. In other words, the winning game state for you must be either NG, CG, CN or NE, CE, CN.
I think a flavor claim from you is in order, by the way. What, flavorwise, did you do last night when you redirected my ability to Crippled Fist?
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Vive, vale. Siquid novisti rectius istis,
candidus inperti; si nil, his utere mecum.
Spock is not portrayed correctly. If Vulcans are above petty emotions, what motivates him to join the most elite starship crew in the galaxy? I, on the other hand, have transcended the weakness of emotion and achieved a blissful lack of caring. Apathy is my strength, our strength, which prevents us from being all-to-human. In this spirit, may Meh be with you, always.
Spock is not portrayed correctly. If Vulcans are above petty emotions, what motivates him to join the most elite starship crew in the galaxy? I, on the other hand, have transcended the weakness of emotion and achieved a blissful lack of caring. Apathy is my strength, our strength, which prevents us from being all-to-human. In this spirit, may Meh be with you, always.
Suggestion
Enchantment (Compulsion) [Language-Dependent, Mind-Affecting] Level: Brd 2, Sor/Wiz 3 Components: V, M Casting Time: 1 standard action Range: Close (25 ft. + 5 ft./2 levels) Target: One living creature Duration: 1 hour/level or until completed Saving Throw: Will negates Spell Resistance: Yes
You influence the actions of the target creature by suggesting a course of activity (limited to a sentence or two). The suggestion must be worded in such a manner as to make the activity sound reasonable. Asking the creature to do some obviously harmful act automatically negates the effect of the spell.
The suggested course of activity can continue for the entire duration. If the suggested activity can be completed in a shorter time, the spell ends when the subject finishes what it was asked to do. You can instead specify conditions that will trigger a special activity during the duration. If the condition is not met before the spell duration expires, the activity is not performed.
A very reasonable suggestion causes the save to be made with a penalty (such as -1 or -2).
Material Component: A snake’s tongue and either a bit of honeycomb or a drop of sweet oil.
Spock is not portrayed correctly. If Vulcans are above petty emotions, what motivates him to join the most elite starship crew in the galaxy? I, on the other hand, have transcended the weakness of emotion and achieved a blissful lack of caring. Apathy is my strength, our strength, which prevents us from being all-to-human. In this spirit, may Meh be with you, always.
What?! Look at the initial post; he is dead. Deceased. Kaputt. Indefinitely horizontal. In mafia games, you see, people are occasionally "killed off," and when that sad event occurs, he or she is no longer allowed to post, on account of rigor mortis and what-have-you.
'Welcome to Mafia Salvation', it said, 'Population: 3,660.' And someone, they never figured out who, had painted on the sign in red letters: '1,831 to lynch.'
Billking, you forget that lawfuls will want to get you dead. That said I won't be voting on alignment lines. Just for the person with the bigger target on there head.vote: BK
Also claims are meaningless because there is no way to verify them.
Lastly I figured out BK's big brother type speak from before (see below), being evil is the same as being good. It's just an arbitrary line to divide the group in to sects.
Quote from BK »
So, in short:
- over half of the town is scum, therefore scummy is good
- townie is bad (lynchable)
- scummy claims (particularly the ability to nightkill) should protect you from lynch
- alignment claims are beneficial, but only if you don't have a useful ability
For support for these claims (which seem ridiculous at face value), actually read the above post.
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Spock is not portrayed correctly. If Vulcans are above petty emotions, what motivates him to join the most elite starship crew in the galaxy? I, on the other hand, have transcended the weakness of emotion and achieved a blissful lack of caring. Apathy is my strength, our strength, which prevents us from being all-to-human. In this spirit, may Meh be with you, always.
Vote: Swinkee
-Alpha
Before help checks this thread and day ends, if anyone wants to claim a kill ability, nows the time. I can confirm for you. (Target will be selected randomly, by die roll.) Any volunteers?
Spock is not portrayed correctly. If Vulcans are above petty emotions, what motivates him to join the most elite starship crew in the galaxy? I, on the other hand, have transcended the weakness of emotion and achieved a blissful lack of caring. Apathy is my strength, our strength, which prevents us from being all-to-human. In this spirit, may Meh be with you, always.
How does this work? You just redirect abilities, if I'm reading this correctly. I think my ability would be rather more useful towards this end. That's all I'm going to say about that.
Not that it matters, but symbolically I'm going to abstain from voting. If I had a chance to weigh in, I'd have said the case against swinkee isn't good enough to convince me.
candidus inperti; si nil, his utere mecum.
swinkee: 6 (musashi, Navyjoe, billking, ruler of avatar, AlphaInsidious, Hawkeye7)
Not Voting: Blinking Spirit, Carrion Pigeons, Crippled_Fist, Kheoinn
Someone casts Hold Person, someone else performs a coup de grace. Swinkee dies.
You find him to be a Dwarf, clad in full plate mail.
Swinkee, Lawful Neutral Dwarf Fighter, has been lynched
It is now Night Two. No talking. Instead, send me night actions!
Proud worshipper of TFE.
Pibbly is now Alive again.
With 11 alive, it takes 6 to lynch.
*finds his familiar* --Saweeeet!
-Alpha
As for no deaths last night. Maybe we have a Killer who can only kill every other night. Or i guess we could have a lawful Good cleric who protected someone last night.
Oh ya, Crippled Fist, thx for the compliment!!
candidus inperti; si nil, his utere mecum.
Now onto voting. I had BlinkingSpirit target Crippled_Fist. Crippled_Fist doesn't seem to be dead. Crippled_Fist may be suffering from negative effects, but unless he has reason to believe he shares an alignment with BlinkingSpirit he's going to shut up and make sure he gets lynched instead of clearing him. So we'll assume that BlinkingSpirit is a doctor or something, and that he needs to suffer immediate death. So I'll vote BlinkingSpirit. If anyone can confirm — say, by claiming a kill ability on Crippled_Fist that fizzled — that would be righteous.
Spock is not portrayed correctly. If Vulcans are above petty emotions, what motivates him to join the most elite starship crew in the galaxy? I, on the other hand, have transcended the weakness of emotion and achieved a blissful lack of caring. Apathy is my strength, our strength, which prevents us from being all-to-human. In this spirit, may Meh be with you, always.
Hold off on further votes for me, guys, until I get some clarifications from help. Suffice it to say that I think billking is lying, but I'm not yet certain.
candidus inperti; si nil, his utere mecum.
Finally, it's Blinking Spirit. Two words. Thank you.
candidus inperti; si nil, his utere mecum.
Evil people are only good for OTHER EVIL PEOPLE. As a good person, i need all of the EVIL people to be dead. Why would i want to keep them around, when they want to kill me. Your post does not make sence. I want to keep the docs around, because they might just protect me. A known good person, therefor keep me alive for another day.
I can kill my enimies by voting them off. I dont need other people to do it for me. therefor VOTE BILLKING
candidus inperti; si nil, his utere mecum.
For every player there are:
- 3 allied alignments
- 3 enemy alignments (by win condition)
- 2 more enemy alignments (due to competition for lynches OR due to being both ally and enemy)
For somone who is partial neutral (for example, NG) the distribution looks like this:
LG NG CG
LN XX CN
LE NE CE
For someone who's completely nonneutral (for example, LG) the distribution looks like this:
LG NG CG
LN XX CN
LE NE CE
What does this all mean? It means that over half the town is your enemy. This is the key fact that leads to all of the following positions:
- Killing abilities are good for the majority; a random kill every Night helps you more than hurts you.
- Things that stop killing abilities are bad for the majority; like I said, a random kill every Night helps you more than hurts you.
So, in other words, the roles are switched. The assassins are the Town, and it's the doctors who are scum. Bizarro Mafia.
Spock is not portrayed correctly. If Vulcans are above petty emotions, what motivates him to join the most elite starship crew in the galaxy? I, on the other hand, have transcended the weakness of emotion and achieved a blissful lack of caring. Apathy is my strength, our strength, which prevents us from being all-to-human. In this spirit, may Meh be with you, always.
Spock is not portrayed correctly. If Vulcans are above petty emotions, what motivates him to join the most elite starship crew in the galaxy? I, on the other hand, have transcended the weakness of emotion and achieved a blissful lack of caring. Apathy is my strength, our strength, which prevents us from being all-to-human. In this spirit, may Meh be with you, always.
Of course you'd say that. You're Good. A confirmed enemy of the town.
Spock is not portrayed correctly. If Vulcans are above petty emotions, what motivates him to join the most elite starship crew in the galaxy? I, on the other hand, have transcended the weakness of emotion and achieved a blissful lack of caring. Apathy is my strength, our strength, which prevents us from being all-to-human. In this spirit, may Meh be with you, always.
First, there's no incentive to kill you right now. We know your alignment, and from your flavor your role sounds rather nonthreatening. Perhaps you can kill people at night. If so, GREAT! Over half the town wants me dead... so they'd have no problem with you killing me tonight! They'd welcome the news!
Instead, it would be much better to kill someone who we don't know their alignment yet. With a ressurector in this game, the assassin becomes the ultimate cop — he makes the information public. I guarantee that killing you today or tonight is definitely a mistake. No no no... we're going after your friends.
Second, if someone is a doctor, it would be in their best interest to protect either no one or (better yet) themselves. If half the town is your enemy, why would you try to protect someone you'd rather see die? Granted: any Good doctors could protect you because they KNOW you are a teammate. The non-Good doctors (if any) will have no incentive to protect you, however, and if anyone protects you, it's not going to work, because we're not interested in killing you tonight (see above).
Spock is not portrayed correctly. If Vulcans are above petty emotions, what motivates him to join the most elite starship crew in the galaxy? I, on the other hand, have transcended the weakness of emotion and achieved a blissful lack of caring. Apathy is my strength, our strength, which prevents us from being all-to-human. In this spirit, may Meh be with you, always.
As a partially neutral player, I can say this is incorrect. I win for eliminating all character of the alignment directly opposed to me, and all characters from either one or the other alignment. So, if I was Pibbly, I'd win for killing all chaotic characters and either all good or all evil characters. Perhaps Pibbly can confirm?
You are missing the key fact that the killers theoretically aren't killing randomly; they're killing according to their goals. If your alignment is opposed to theirs, they're not going to kill people whose elimination is beneficial to you; they're going to kill you.
Secondly, elimination changes the logic somewhat. For a CE player, swinkee and Puzzle's deaths swing the balance considerably, so that if this player was the killer, he wouldn't want to fire randomly, because his chances of killing an ally or potential ally are much greater now.
Thirdly, there are nine alignments, but twelve of us. That means some of us are doubled up. We might assume that they're spread evenly throughout (perhaps an extra one in each of the extreme alignments, an no true neutral); depending on how they're spread, this could change the argument somewhat. There's also the possibility that they're not distributed evenly to consider; if there actually is a "mafia" of sorts in this game, it might mean there are more evils than otherwise, perhaps three independent evil players and three evil conspirators.
Finally, what leap of logic led you to conclude that because my ability didn't kill Crippled_Fist, it actually protected him from death?
candidus inperti; si nil, his utere mecum.
Spock is not portrayed correctly. If Vulcans are above petty emotions, what motivates him to join the most elite starship crew in the galaxy? I, on the other hand, have transcended the weakness of emotion and achieved a blissful lack of caring. Apathy is my strength, our strength, which prevents us from being all-to-human. In this spirit, may Meh be with you, always.
So are you.
But he's neutral good, which means all the evil players need him dead to win, and the LN and CN characters have the option of killing all good players to win as well.
Again, the resurrector is only going to resurrect allies - so if he's LG, he's only going to rez NG characters (like Pibbly) or LN characters (like swinkee - expect him to be back soon, guys).
Again, the evil players will now be gunning for Pibbly because he is a confirmed good player; taking out a confirmed goodie beats a random shot every time for them.
candidus inperti; si nil, his utere mecum.
Then, considering how you're obviously not LN or CN, you'll lose.
candidus inperti; si nil, his utere mecum.
Spock is not portrayed correctly. If Vulcans are above petty emotions, what motivates him to join the most elite starship crew in the galaxy? I, on the other hand, have transcended the weakness of emotion and achieved a blissful lack of caring. Apathy is my strength, our strength, which prevents us from being all-to-human. In this spirit, may Meh be with you, always.
But how are you going to go after my friends, when you dont know who they are. A smart man would go for the sure thing, in this case, that would be me.
Also, Evil isn't concerned with kills. They have enough kills. What they're concerned with is collecting the information they need to set things up. Remember, Good is scum... so Evil are essentially the cops. They're concerned primarily with information gathering. Killing will come in time; until then, patience is a virtue.
Spock is not portrayed correctly. If Vulcans are above petty emotions, what motivates him to join the most elite starship crew in the galaxy? I, on the other hand, have transcended the weakness of emotion and achieved a blissful lack of caring. Apathy is my strength, our strength, which prevents us from being all-to-human. In this spirit, may Meh be with you, always.
Then how do you explain our difference in win conditions?
How is good scum? The more information is revealed, the less random evil will be, and the more its targeting will reflect its win conditions, which are not yours. Furthermore, one of the extreme evil alignments is going to be targeting you (as is one of the good extreme alignments, to be sure, but the good alignment probably won't have the capacity to kill you offhand).
candidus inperti; si nil, his utere mecum.
Spock is not portrayed correctly. If Vulcans are above petty emotions, what motivates him to join the most elite starship crew in the galaxy? I, on the other hand, have transcended the weakness of emotion and achieved a blissful lack of caring. Apathy is my strength, our strength, which prevents us from being all-to-human. In this spirit, may Meh be with you, always.
By the way, yes, my win condition is worded like that.
Spock is not portrayed correctly. If Vulcans are above petty emotions, what motivates him to join the most elite starship crew in the galaxy? I, on the other hand, have transcended the weakness of emotion and achieved a blissful lack of caring. Apathy is my strength, our strength, which prevents us from being all-to-human. In this spirit, may Meh be with you, always.
Hunh? You need five alignments dead, not three. Pibbly's win condition is worded the same way as my own, which, by the way, I did not "hint at," but outright told you (read the thread):
candidus inperti; si nil, his utere mecum.
Spock is not portrayed correctly. If Vulcans are above petty emotions, what motivates him to join the most elite starship crew in the galaxy? I, on the other hand, have transcended the weakness of emotion and achieved a blissful lack of caring. Apathy is my strength, our strength, which prevents us from being all-to-human. In this spirit, may Meh be with you, always.
That was not the impression I got from your pretty little diagram. If you're CN, CE and CG should both be orange, given that one or the other is going to have to die for you to win. In other words, the winning game state for you must be either NG, CG, CN or NE, CE, CN.
I think a flavor claim from you is in order, by the way. What, flavorwise, did you do last night when you redirected my ability to Crippled Fist?
candidus inperti; si nil, his utere mecum.
Spock is not portrayed correctly. If Vulcans are above petty emotions, what motivates him to join the most elite starship crew in the galaxy? I, on the other hand, have transcended the weakness of emotion and achieved a blissful lack of caring. Apathy is my strength, our strength, which prevents us from being all-to-human. In this spirit, may Meh be with you, always.
candidus inperti; si nil, his utere mecum.
You targeted Crippled_Fist. That's exactly what I sent to help im a bug. If there's an error, it's on Mod's part.
Spock is not portrayed correctly. If Vulcans are above petty emotions, what motivates him to join the most elite starship crew in the galaxy? I, on the other hand, have transcended the weakness of emotion and achieved a blissful lack of caring. Apathy is my strength, our strength, which prevents us from being all-to-human. In this spirit, may Meh be with you, always.
candidus inperti; si nil, his utere mecum.
Suggestion
Enchantment (Compulsion) [Language-Dependent, Mind-Affecting]
Level: Brd 2, Sor/Wiz 3
Components: V, M
Casting Time: 1 standard action
Range: Close (25 ft. + 5 ft./2 levels)
Target: One living creature
Duration: 1 hour/level or until completed
Saving Throw: Will negates
Spell Resistance: Yes
You influence the actions of the target creature by suggesting a course of activity (limited to a sentence or two). The suggestion must be worded in such a manner as to make the activity sound reasonable. Asking the creature to do some obviously harmful act automatically negates the effect of the spell.
The suggested course of activity can continue for the entire duration. If the suggested activity can be completed in a shorter time, the spell ends when the subject finishes what it was asked to do. You can instead specify conditions that will trigger a special activity during the duration. If the condition is not met before the spell duration expires, the activity is not performed.
A very reasonable suggestion causes the save to be made with a penalty (such as -1 or -2).
Material Component: A snake’s tongue and either a bit of honeycomb or a drop of sweet oil.
Spock is not portrayed correctly. If Vulcans are above petty emotions, what motivates him to join the most elite starship crew in the galaxy? I, on the other hand, have transcended the weakness of emotion and achieved a blissful lack of caring. Apathy is my strength, our strength, which prevents us from being all-to-human. In this spirit, may Meh be with you, always.
Mafia MVP BM Mafia
Mafia MVP Matrix Mafia
Also claims are meaningless because there is no way to verify them.
Lastly I figured out BK's big brother type speak from before (see below), being evil is the same as being good. It's just an arbitrary line to divide the group in to sects.
By the way, great game, help. Not.
Spock is not portrayed correctly. If Vulcans are above petty emotions, what motivates him to join the most elite starship crew in the galaxy? I, on the other hand, have transcended the weakness of emotion and achieved a blissful lack of caring. Apathy is my strength, our strength, which prevents us from being all-to-human. In this spirit, may Meh be with you, always.