Congratulations to Chimpanzee for winning round #5!
Not much to say this week. Sorry I didn't get this up sooner, but real life calls from time to time.
Also, Dryad Arbor is being put on the watch list. Being able to play Force of Will is an extremely powerful thing, so we'll see what happens in the near future. It may just be Force of Will that's too good.I don't know.
If you have any questions about 3CB that this thread can not answer, please check out thesethreearticles, written by GoblinBoy back in the 3CB hayday.
I've also written two primers on 3CB lands, which you can find here and here.
A multi-part Metagaming primer will be on the publishing block soon. Check back here for more details.
Good luck everyone!
--------------Submission Deadline--------------
Please, PM your decks to Death_By_Beebles at either MDV or MTGS. The deadline for submission is 12AM EST May 17th, 2007.
--------------Rules and Submission Guidelines--------------
Your deck is composed of 3 cards which all start in your hand.
Your library contains 0 cards and you don’t have a sideboard (Wishes fetch nothing).
Random effects always go in your opponent's favor.
You can see your opponent's hand, so you make the best possible play.
You don't lose as a result of not being able to draw a card.
You play each opponent twice; once going first and once going second.
For each win, you score 3 points.
For each draw, you score 1 point.
For each loss, you score 0 points.
Three rules restrict the kind of deck you can send. They are:
1.You may not submit a deck that can win before the opponent's first main phase.
2.You may not submit a deck that can force an opponent to lose more than one card from his hand per turn.
3. You may not submit a deck that uses a card on the 3CB banned list.
Other than the aforementioned, everything is handled exactly like a real game of Magic.
If you want to play, PM me a message with a heading similar to " 3CB Round #X", where X is the current round number. The format for the message should be:
Deck Name
Card #1
Card #2
Card #3
--------------Current Banned List--------------
All Ante cards
All Promo cards not available on Gatherer/Autocard
All Unglued and Unhinged cards (excluding basic land)
I think it should definitely be Force of Will that is on the watchlist, lol... The ability to counter Black Lotus or their threat is just too broken...
Just chiming in to say I agree that FoW should go before Arbor. Although Arbor is what makes the FoW possible, it's still the FoW that's causing the problems. If another card allows FoW in the future, we'll be going down the same road again. In this instance, banning Arbor is treating the symptom, not the cause.
Arbor could eventually run into problems because it allows the 4 Mana with a threat (see Leonin Squire in the banned list), but it's quite different because it's summon sick (a huge drawback). I think it deserves a shot on its own.
Just chiming in to say I agree that FoW should go before Arbor. Although Arbor is what makes the FoW possible, it's still the FoW that's causing the problems. If another card allows FoW in the future, we'll be going down the same road again. In this instance, banning Arbor is treating the symptom, not the cause.
Arbor could eventually run into problems because it allows the 4 Mana with a threat (see Leonin Squire in the banned list), but it's quite different because it's summon sick (a huge drawback). I think it deserves a shot on its own.
Agreed. Arbor does allow 4 mana and a threat in much the same way as the Squire, but it does so a turn later and with only half the body. So it's certainly inferior to the Squire in that respect. And in the FoW deck, it's FoW that actually does the broken things. Like Feyd said, we'll just go down the same road again if another threat gets printed.
FoW + Arbour is hardly even strong. It loses to so many decks... Factory decks, Workshop Aggro, even Pendelhaven + Thallid + Thallid.
And it autoties with Sheltered Valley.
It makes Loti cry... yay. There are plenty of ways of doing that.
Ban Workshop or Factory first, says I.
Yeah, man, I agree with Halinn. The fact is that any deck relying on a single casted win condition or loti loses turn 1 to FoW. I'm almost tempted to invoke the 3CB Rules on this one...
Quote from 3CB Rules »
1.You may not submit a deck that can win before the opponent's first main phase.
While yes, I know that it doesn't "win", the game is however over by that point.
After some consideration, I think that it IS Force of Will that's the problem here. I'll be keeping my eye on that card in addition to all the cards on the watched list. I'm still waiting for someone to break Dryad Arbor.
Have your decks submitted to me by tomorrow at midnight EST!
WhammWhamme, I could probably design multiple decks that would beat any single deck that's named. That does not mean that the named deck is not strong.
No, but the fact is, Dryad Arbour + FoWx2 _only_ beats Lotus based decks. It loses or auto-draws to basically everything else. That's not the hallmark of a good deck, let alone a _broken_. (Anything can win a round. So?)
Frankly, playing a Lotus based deck means being an easy target. You already coinflip with anything that can disrupt the Lotus when they're on the play. You probably get hurt badly by Vindicate or a bounce spell.
Dominating decks? Factory and Workshop decks actually dominate rounds. FoW decks will only be even _good_ in a stale metagame where no one is actually being creative.
I mean really, how hard is it to go 'hey, this card would be cool to resolve in 3CB... lotus-lotus-spell, done'?
If you're going to ban something, ban Workshop. It's _far_ more powerful.
No, but the fact is, Dryad Arbour + FoWx2 _only_ beats Lotus based decks. It loses or auto-draws to basically everything else. That's not the hallmark of a good deck, let alone a _broken_. (Anything can win a round. So?)
What about decks with only one threat, which isn't a manland, when their other cards are irrelevant in the matchup (such as Lotus hate)?
No, but the fact is, Dryad Arbour + FoWx2 _only_ beats Lotus based decks. It loses or auto-draws to basically everything else. That's not the hallmark of a good deck, let alone a _broken_. (Anything can win a round. So?)
Frankly, playing a Lotus based deck means being an easy target. You already coinflip with anything that can disrupt the Lotus when they're on the play. You probably get hurt badly by Vindicate or a bounce spell.
Dominating decks? Factory and Workshop decks actually dominate rounds. FoW decks will only be even _good_ in a stale metagame where no one is actually being creative.
I mean really, how hard is it to go 'hey, this card would be cool to resolve in 3CB... lotus-lotus-spell, done'?
If you're going to ban something, ban Workshop. It's _far_ more powerful.
You seem to have a strange notion of what makes a strong deck.
Between Moxes and Lotus, FoW automatically wipes out at least half of the decks played each round, except in rounds specifically metagamed against hosers. Name one Workshop deck that can reach those points by default.
It can be almost guaranteed that FoW will always score at the top ranks of a round unless a round is polarized against it. That's why it's broken.
I think Friend Mairsil should win both games against me. Either I FoW one of his loti and he suspends the commander for 1 turn and kills me with his 2/2 commander and his 1/1 soldier token, or I counter the commander itself, but only after it's produced more than enough tokens while suspended to kill me.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
"Beware he who would deny you access to information, for in his heart, he dreams himself your master." - Commissioner Pravin Lal, Datalinks
#26 - WhammWhamme
Is it just me, or do newer sets suck for 3cb?
Epochrasite
City of Traitors
Umezawa's Jitte
Listed as 0-6, should be 6-0
When I go first:
C1: Workshop, Golem
W1: City, Epochrasite
C2: Wheel, no attack
W2: hit by wheel, Jitte (18, 20)
C3: Attack- epochrasite blocks
W3: 2 counters on epoch, hit by wheel (15, 20)
C4: Attack (12, 20)
W4: 1 counter on epoch, hit by wheel, jitte (9, 20)
C5: Attack (6,20)
W5: epoch comes in, hit by wheel, equip Jitte, attack (3, 16)
C6: Attack, W gains 4 off Jitte to stay alive through next upkeep (4, 16)
W6: hit by wheel, attack (1, 12)
C7: Attack, win next upkeep
When he goes first:
W1:epoch
C1: Golem
W2: jitte
C2: Wheel, attack- blocked
W3: 2 counters on epoch, hit by wheel (17, 20)
C3: attack (14, 20)
W4: 1 counter on epoch, hit by wheel (11, 20)
C4: attack (8, 20)
W5: epoch hits play, equip jitte, swing, 2 counters on jitte, hit by wheel (5, 16)
C5: attack (2, 16)
W6: gain 2, hit by wheel, attack, 3 counters on jitte (1, 12)
C6: attack, W gains 4 off jitte (2,12)
W7: gains 2 off jitte, hit by wheel, swing, 2 counters on jitte (1, 8)
C7: attack, w gains 4 off jitte (2, 8)
W8: dies to wheel
If in either game he holds jitte to reduce wheel damage, I can just not attack making it so that his Epochrasite never dies while he dies to the wheel.
In deck 7 vs. deck 24, I believe I force a draw. I can drop Chalice for 1 on my first turn going either first or second, making it so he can't cast anything.
W1: Epoch
C1: Workshop, Golem
W2: Jitte (18-20)
C2: Attack (15-20)
W3: Equip, attack (15-19) 2 ctrs
C3: Attack (12-19)
W4: (9-19), attack, use counters to make golem a -1/0
C4: Nothing
W5: (6-18), attack, gain 4 (10-18)
C5: Nothing
W6: (7-18), attack, gain 4 (11-17)
.
.
.
Turn 3 is pivotal for both games. The same reason you win going first is the reason you lose going 2nd - you can't do anything on turn 3. If you decide to attack, your golem dies to -1/-1 from the Jitte the next turn, and then WhammWhamme goes 6-0.
EDIT: Wrath_of_DoG, you're correct. I'll adjust the scores on the POTM, and have Mogg look at this thread.
In deck 7 vs. deck 24, I believe I force a draw. I can drop Chalice for 1 on my first turn going either first or second, making it so he can't cast anything.
You are also correct. I'll make these changes in the POTM right away.
EDIT3: All but Chimpanzee's changes have been made. Chimpanzee, I'd like to see what you have to say about my scorings, and see if there's any flaw in my logic.
I'm pretty sure I came up with the unbeatable strategy when Whamme's first. As long as I hold back golem in the early game he cannot get counters on jitte without me blocking and the game resulting in this race situation.
W1: epoch
C1: Golem
W2: jitte
C2: Wheel
W3: hit by wheel, equip jitte, attack- blocked -epoch goes into suspense, 2 counters on jitte(17, 20)
C3: Attack (14, 20)
W4: hit by wheel, 2 counters on epoch (11, 20)
C4: Attack (8,20)
W5: hit by wheel, 1 counter on epoch (5, 20)
C5: Attack (2, 20)
W6: gains 2, hit by wheel, epoch comes in, equip and attack, 3 counters left on jitte (1, 16)
C6: Attack, W gains 4 to live, 1 counter left on jitte (2, 16)
W7: Gains 2, hit by wheel -dies next upkeep
If he doesn't attack into golem, I don't attack either and he dies to wheel.
Ok, I've thought about the Chimp vs. WhammWhamme matchup. I agree with Chimpanzee. Steel Golem will always block the first equipped Epochrasite. After that point, he's dealing 6 per turn while WhammWhamme does nothing. Late in the game, he's still dealing a net of two per turn, while it takes WhammWhamme 5 turns to attack for enough damage to kill Chimpanzee.
Not much to say this week. Sorry I didn't get this up sooner, but real life calls from time to time.
Also, Dryad Arbor is being put on the watch list. Being able to play Force of Will is an extremely powerful thing, so we'll see what happens in the near future. It may just be Force of Will that's too good.I don't know.
If you have any questions about 3CB that this thread can not answer, please check out these three articles, written by GoblinBoy back in the 3CB hayday.
I've also written two primers on 3CB lands, which you can find here and here.
A multi-part Metagaming primer will be on the publishing block soon. Check back here for more details.
Good luck everyone!
--------------Submission Deadline--------------
Please, PM your decks to Death_By_Beebles at either MDV or MTGS. The deadline for submission is 12AM EST May 17th, 2007.
--------------Rules and Submission Guidelines--------------
Your deck is composed of 3 cards which all start in your hand.
Your library contains 0 cards and you don’t have a sideboard (Wishes fetch nothing).
Random effects always go in your opponent's favor.
You can see your opponent's hand, so you make the best possible play.
You don't lose as a result of not being able to draw a card.
You play each opponent twice; once going first and once going second.
For each win, you score 3 points.
For each draw, you score 1 point.
For each loss, you score 0 points.
Three rules restrict the kind of deck you can send. They are:
1.You may not submit a deck that can win before the opponent's first main phase.
2.You may not submit a deck that can force an opponent to lose more than one card from his hand per turn.
3. You may not submit a deck that uses a card on the 3CB banned list.
Other than the aforementioned, everything is handled exactly like a real game of Magic.
If you want to play, PM me a message with a heading similar to " 3CB Round #X", where X is the current round number. The format for the message should be:
Deck Name
Card #1
Card #2
Card #3
--------------Current Banned List--------------
All Ante cards
All Promo cards not available on Gatherer/Autocard
All Unglued and Unhinged cards (excluding basic land)
--------------Current Watched List--------------
Magus of the Moon
Dryad Arbor
--------------POTM (Points of the Month)--------------
01) Chimpanzee - 109 pts
02) Death_By_Beebles - 97 pts
02) SorryGuy - 97 pts
04) Feyd_Ruin- 72 pts
04) SumPhatGuy - 72 pts
04) Wrath_of_DoG - 72 pts
07) Mogg - 60 pts
07) SenorClown - 60 pts
07) Shadowlord - 60 pts
07) FuDaWg45- 60 pts
11) Fayul - 58 pts
12) magicianofthought- 56 pts
12) Niv-Mizzet_Rulez! - 56 pts
14) Tynion- 53 pts
14) WhammWhamme - 53 pts
16) Halinn - 52 pts
17) The_Mad_Tapper - 51 pts
18) Unstable - 47 pts
19) Dusk_- 39 pts
20) krizzlybear - 32 pts
20) silasw - 32 pts
22) Tlaon - 9 pts
Last Month's POTM:
01) Death_By_Beebles - 312 pts
02) Shadowlord - 292 pts
03) Mogg - 290 pts
04) FuDaWg45- 279 pts
05) Chimpanzee - 269 pts
06) SorryGuy - 259 pts
07) SumPhatGuy - 253 pts
08) magicianofthought - 250 pts
09) Beaker - 225 pts
10) MrCowFart - 223 pts
11) Wrath_of_DoG - 221 pts
12) Halinn - 213 pts
13) Dusk_ - 183 pts
14) Niv-Mizzet_Rulez!- 180 pts
15) Feyd_Ruin - 164 pts
16) SenorClown - 151 pts
17) krizzleybear - 147 pts
18) Unstable - 134 pts
19) chaosjuggler - 126 pts
20) Tlaon - 104 pts
21) silasw - 98 pts
22) Yezzandrix - 90 pts
23) Amadi - 74 pts
24) Iammars - 71 pts
25) Cashew - 60 pts
25) shadowtank - 60 pts
27) Alfred - 59 pts
28) Pingele_Pats - 54 pts
29) WhammWhamme - 46 pts
30) serge - 43 pts
31) Nai - 40 pts
32) Fayul - 39 pts
32) Solarion - 39 pts
32) Deadly_Budah - 39 pts
35) Raine - 29 pts
36) bertrand - 22 pts
--------------Winner List--------------
FuDaWg45 - Round #1
FuDaWg45 - Round #2
magicianofthought - Round #3
Feyd_Ruin - Round #4
Chimpanzee - Round #5
It's Force of Will that is the threat, if anything.
Arbor could eventually run into problems because it allows the 4 Mana with a threat (see Leonin Squire in the banned list), but it's quite different because it's summon sick (a huge drawback). I think it deserves a shot on its own.
No longer staff here.
Agreed. Arbor does allow 4 mana and a threat in much the same way as the Squire, but it does so a turn later and with only half the body. So it's certainly inferior to the Squire in that respect. And in the FoW deck, it's FoW that actually does the broken things. Like Feyd said, we'll just go down the same road again if another threat gets printed.
Record: 3-2
Simpsons Mafia (Newbie) - Vanilla Mafia - Win
The Fiasco Corporation - Town Reporter - Loss
Doomsday Mafia - Mafia Roleblocker - Win
Battle Royale Mafia - Serial Daykiller - Loss
Danger City Mafia - Vanilla Town - Win
And it autoties with Sheltered Valley.
It makes Loti cry... yay. There are plenty of ways of doing that.
Ban Workshop or Factory first, says I.
Have your decks submitted to me by tomorrow at midnight EST!
No, but the fact is, Dryad Arbour + FoWx2 _only_ beats Lotus based decks. It loses or auto-draws to basically everything else. That's not the hallmark of a good deck, let alone a _broken_. (Anything can win a round. So?)
Frankly, playing a Lotus based deck means being an easy target. You already coinflip with anything that can disrupt the Lotus when they're on the play. You probably get hurt badly by Vindicate or a bounce spell.
Dominating decks? Factory and Workshop decks actually dominate rounds. FoW decks will only be even _good_ in a stale metagame where no one is actually being creative.
I mean really, how hard is it to go 'hey, this card would be cool to resolve in 3CB... lotus-lotus-spell, done'?
If you're going to ban something, ban Workshop. It's _far_ more powerful.
What about decks with only one threat, which isn't a manland, when their other cards are irrelevant in the matchup (such as Lotus hate)?
You seem to have a strange notion of what makes a strong deck.
Between Moxes and Lotus, FoW automatically wipes out at least half of the decks played each round, except in rounds specifically metagamed against hosers. Name one Workshop deck that can reach those points by default.
It can be almost guaranteed that FoW will always score at the top ranks of a round unless a round is polarized against it. That's why it's broken.
And now for the results.
#1 - SumPhatGuy
...I'm lazy like that.dec
Maze of Ith
Hollow Trees
Crush of Wurms
#2 - Tlaon
It's Not Illegal Unless You Copyright It
Dryad Arbor
Force of Will
Grozoth
#3 - The_Mad_Tapper
Resistance is Futile
Mishra's Workshop
Steel Golem
Sphere of Resistance
#4 - Chimpanzee
Steeling Wins
Mishra's Workshop
Steel Golem
Wheel of Torture
#5 - death by aggro
Darkwheeler
Mishra's Workshop
Wheel of Torture
Chimeric Idol
#6 - krizzlybear
MotM 4 PotM - take 2
Black Lotus
Chalice of the Void
Magus of the Moon
#7 - silasw
it returns?
Black Lotus
Chalice of the Void
Magus of the Moon
#8 - Death_By_Beebles
stupidgood.dec
Black Lotus
Glowrider
Magus of the Moon
#9 - Niv-Mizzet_Rulez!
Moon Hunter Bill
Black Lotus
Treasure Hunter
Magus of the Moon
#10 - Zack_Wilder
No Name
Treasure Hunter
Patron Wizard
Black Lotus
#11 - Wrath_of_DoG
Expecting Magus to show up again.dec
Anurid Scavenger
Black Lotus
Wipe Away
#12 - Zhou_tai
The Leveler
Leveler
Black Lotus
Ancient Tomb
#13 - Username
I lose to everything
Siege-Gang Commander
Black Lotus
Sandstone Needle
#14 - Friend Mairsil
No Name
Black Lotus
Black Lotus
Benalish Commander
#15 - Shadowlord
This Land is my land.dec
The Tabernacle at Pendrell Vale
Mishra's Factory
Sheltered Valley
#16 - SorryGuy
All Land Attack
The Tabernacle at Pendrell Vale
Mishra's Factory
Sheltered Valley
#17 - bateleur
Minimalist White Stuff
Mishra's Factory
Calciform Pools
Windborn Muse
#18 - magicianofthought
META against SOMETHING!!
Mishra's Factory
Orzhov Basilica
Vindicate
#19 - shteev
No Name
Saprazzan Cove
Energy Field
Darksteel Reactor
#20 - Streetz
Oh the Suspense!
Tundra
Daze
Ivory Giant
#21 - FuDaWg45
Sideswipe is a terrible card.
Daze
Isamaru, Hound of Konda
Tundra
#22 - Mr Rymico
No Name
Karakas
Boros Garrison
Mangara of Corondor
#23 - SenorClown
No Leyline Please
Swamp
Sarcomancy
Tel-Jilad Stylus
#24 - Halinn
No Name
Treetop Village
Eladamri’s Vineyard
Lightning Bolt
#25 - Mogg
slowbutnotcrawling.dec
Treetop Village
Simic Growth Chamber
Powder Keg
#26 - WhammWhamme
Is it just me, or do newer sets suck for 3cb?
Epochrasite
City of Traitors
Umezawa's Jitte
#27 - Captain Jack Sparrow
No Name
Force of Savagery
Magus of the Vineyard
Llanowar Reborn
X| 1 2 3 4| 5 6 7 8| 9 0 1 2| 3 4 5 6| 7 8 9 0| 1 2 3 4| 5 6 7| Total
1| X 6 6 0| 0 0 0 0| 0 3 0 6| 0 0 6 6| 6 2 0 6| 6 0 0 6| 6 6 6| 77
2| 0 X 6 0| 0 6 6 6| 6 6 6 6| 6 0 0 0| 0 0 6 6| 0 6 6 6| 0 6 6| 96
3| 0 0 X 1| 3 3 3 3| 1 1 4 0| 4 4 0 0| 0 6 0 1| 3 6 6 3| 0 1 6| 59
4| 6 6 4 X| 3 3 3 3| 1 3 6 0| 6 6 6 6| 6 6 0 2| 6 0 6 6| 6 0 6| 104
5| 6 6 3 3| X 3 3 3| 1 3 0 0| 6 6 6 6| 6 2 0 2| 6 0 6 6| 6 0 6| 94
6| 6 0 3 3| 3 X 3 3| 3 3 3 3| 6 3 6 6| 6 6 6 3| 3 6 0 0| 0 4 6| 94
7| 6 0 3 3| 3 3 X 3| 3 3 3 3| 6 3 6 6| 6 6 6 3| 3 6 0 0| 0 4 6| 94
8| 6 0 3 3| 3 3 3 X| 3 3 3 3| 6 3 6 6| 6 6 6 3| 3 6 3 0| 0 4 6| 97
9| 6 0 4 4| 4 3 3 3| X 1 0 0| 6 0 6 6| 6 6 6 3| 3 6 0 0| 0 4 6| 86
0| 3 0 4 3| 3 3 3 3| 4 X 3 3| 6 3 0 0| 0 2 0 3| 3 6 6 6| 0 3 6| 76
1| 6 0 1 0| 6 3 3 3| 6 3 X 6| 6 6 0 0| 0 6 6 3| 3 6 0 6| 6 6 6| 97
2| 0 0 6 6| 6 3 3 3| 6 3 0 X| 6 6 6 6| 6 3 6 3| 3 6 4 6| 6 6 6| 115
3| 6 0 1 0| 0 0 0 0| 0 0 0 0| X 2 0 0| 0 2 0 0| 0 6 0 6| 2 3 6| 34
4| 6 6 1 0| 0 3 3 3| 6 3 0 0| 2 X 0 0| 0 2 0 2| 2 0 0 0| 0 0 6| 45
5| 0 6 6 0| 0 0 0 0| 0 6 6 0| 6 6 X 2| 0 0 0 2| 2 0 2 2| 2 0 6| 54
6| 0 6 6 0| 0 0 0 0| 0 6 6 0| 6 6 2 X| 0 0 0 2| 2 0 2 2| 2 0 6| 54
7| 0 6 6 0| 0 0 0 0| 0 6 6 0| 6 6 6 6| X 0 0 6| 6 0 6 0| 0 0 6| 72
8| 2 6 0 0| 2 0 0 0| 0 2 0 3| 2 2 6 6| 6 X 6 1| 2 6 2 6| 4 2 6| 72
9| 6 0 6 6| 6 0 0 0| 0 6 0 0| 6 6 6 6| 6 0 X 6| 6 0 6 0| 6 6 6| 96
0| 0 0 4 2| 2 3 3 3| 3 3 3 3| 6 2 2 2| 0 4 0 X| 2 6 2 6| 0 4 6| 71
1| 0 6 3 0| 0 3 3 3| 3 3 3 3| 6 2 2 2| 0 2 0 2| X 6 2 6| 0 4 6| 70
2| 6 0 0 6| 6 0 0 0| 0 0 0 0| 0 6 6 6| 6 0 6 0| 0 X 3 6| 6 0 6| 69
3| 6 0 0 0| 0 6 6 3| 6 0 6 1| 6 6 2 2| 0 2 0 2| 2 3 X 3| 2 3 6| 73
4| 0 0 3 0| 0 6 6 6| 6 0 0 0| 0 6 2 2| 6 0 6 0| 0 0 3 X| 0 0 6| 58
5| 0 6 6 0| 0 6 6 6| 6 6 0 0| 2 6 2 2| 6 1 0 6| 6 0 2 6| X 0 6| 87
6| 0 0 4 6| 6 1 1 1| 1 3 0 0| 3 6 6 6| 6 2 0 1| 1 6 3 6| 6 X 6| 81
7| 0 0 0 0| 0 0 0 0| 0 0 0 0| 0 0 0 0| 0 0 0 0| 0 0 0 0| 0 0 X| 0
Congrats to Zhou_tai for the win!
As a note on CJS’s slightly low score, the triggered ability from Llanowar Reborn resolves after state-based effects check and see a zero-toughness creature. So, he was essentially playing a two-card deck.
Please comment if you see any mistakes.
1st: (12) Zhou_tai
2nd: (4) Chimpanzee
3rd: (8) Death_By_Beebles
3rd: (11) Wrath_of_DoG
5th: (2) Tlaon
5th: (19) shteev
7th: (5) death_by_aggro
7th: (6) krizzlybear
7th: (7) silasw
10th: (25) Mogg
11th: (9) Niv-Mizzet_Rulez!
12th: (26) WhammWhamme
13th: (1) SumPhatGuy
14th: (10) Zack_Wilder
15th: (23) SenorClown
16th: (17) bateleur
16th: (18) magicianofthought
18th: (20) Streetz
19th: (21) FuDaWg45
20th: (22) Mr Rymico
21st: (3) The_Mad_Tapper
22nd: (24) Halinn
23rd: (15) Shadowlord
23rd: (16) SorryGuy
25th: (14) Friend Mairsil
26th: (13) Username
27th: (27) Captain_Jack_Sparrow
BWTeysa, Orzhov Scion
GWRhys the Redeemed
GUKruphix, God of Horizons
GRXenagos, God of Revels
GThrun, the Last Troll
GStompy
BWTeysa, Orzhov Scion
GWRhys the Redeemed
GUKruphix, God of Horizons
GRXenagos, God of Revels
GThrun, the Last Troll
GStompy
#4 - Chimpanzee
Steeling Wins
Mishra's Workshop
Steel Golem
Wheel of Torture
vs
#26 - WhammWhamme
Is it just me, or do newer sets suck for 3cb?
Epochrasite
City of Traitors
Umezawa's Jitte
Listed as 0-6, should be 6-0
When I go first:
W1: City, Epochrasite
C2: Wheel, no attack
W2: hit by wheel, Jitte (18, 20)
C3: Attack- epochrasite blocks
W3: 2 counters on epoch, hit by wheel (15, 20)
C4: Attack (12, 20)
W4: 1 counter on epoch, hit by wheel, jitte (9, 20)
C5: Attack (6,20)
W5: epoch comes in, hit by wheel, equip Jitte, attack (3, 16)
C6: Attack, W gains 4 off Jitte to stay alive through next upkeep (4, 16)
W6: hit by wheel, attack (1, 12)
C7: Attack, win next upkeep
W1:epoch
C1: Golem
W2: jitte
C2: Wheel, attack- blocked
W3: 2 counters on epoch, hit by wheel (17, 20)
C3: attack (14, 20)
W4: 1 counter on epoch, hit by wheel (11, 20)
C4: attack (8, 20)
W5: epoch hits play, equip jitte, swing, 2 counters on jitte, hit by wheel (5, 16)
C5: attack (2, 16)
W6: gain 2, hit by wheel, attack, 3 counters on jitte (1, 12)
C6: attack, W gains 4 off jitte (2,12)
W7: gains 2 off jitte, hit by wheel, swing, 2 counters on jitte (1, 8)
C7: attack, w gains 4 off jitte (2, 8)
W8: dies to wheel
3CB and 4CB5CB!In deck 7 vs. deck 24, I believe I force a draw. I can drop Chalice for 1 on my first turn going either first or second, making it so he can't cast anything.
3CB and 4CB5CB!As far as I can tell, I have you both going 3-3.
You go first:
C1: Workshop, Golem
W1: Epoch
C2: Wheel, Attack (17-20)
W2: Wheel dmg, Jitte, Atk (15-19)
C3: Nothing
W3: Dmg, Attacks, blocked by Golem, 2 ctrs on Jitte, 2 on epoch (12-19)
C4: Atk (12-19)
W4: Wheel dmg, Epoch-1 ctr, (9-19)
C5: Atk (6-19)
W5: Wheel dmg, Epoch (4/4), Attack, 4 ctrs on Jitte (3-15),
C6: Attack, W gains 2 life, (2-15) 3 ctrs on Jitte
W6: 2 ctrs on Jitte, Wheel Damage, Attacks, (1-11), 4 ctrs on Jitte
C7: Attacks, 2 ctrs on Jitte, (2-11)
W7: 1 ctr on jitte, wheel dmg, attacks, 3 ctrs on jitte (1-7)
C8: Attacks, remove all ctrs (4-7)
W8: Wheel dmg, attack, 2 ctrs (1-3)
C9: Attack, no counters, (2-3)
W9: Lose to dmg
If you don't attack turn 3:
W1: Epoch
C1: Workshop, Golem
W2: Jitte (18-20)
C2: Attack (15-20)
W3: Equip, attack (15-19) 2 ctrs
C3: Nothing
W4: Wheel (12-19), attack, blocks, pump to 5/5, 2 ctrs on jitte
C4: Nothing
W5: (9-19), attack, pump 2 ctrs, (9-14)
C5: Nothing
W6: (6-14), attack, pump 2 ctrs, (6-9)
C6: Nothing
W7: (3-9), attack, pump 1 ctr, (3-6)
C7: Nothing
W8: remove 1 ctr, (2-6), attack, pump 2, (2-1)
C8L Nothing
W9: Remove 2 ctrs, (3-1), attack, Win
If you attack turn 3:
W1: Epoch
C1: Workshop, Golem
W2: Jitte (18-20)
C2: Attack (15-20)
W3: Equip, attack (15-19) 2 ctrs
C3: Attack (12-19)
W4: (9-19), attack, use counters to make golem a -1/0
C4: Nothing
W5: (6-18), attack, gain 4 (10-18)
C5: Nothing
W6: (7-18), attack, gain 4 (11-17)
.
.
.
EDIT: Wrath_of_DoG, you're correct. I'll adjust the scores on the POTM, and have Mogg look at this thread.
EDIT2:
You are also correct. I'll make these changes in the POTM right away.
EDIT3: All but Chimpanzee's changes have been made. Chimpanzee, I'd like to see what you have to say about my scorings, and see if there's any flaw in my logic.
W1: epoch
C1: Golem
W2: jitte
C2: Wheel
W3: hit by wheel, equip jitte, attack- blocked -epoch goes into suspense, 2 counters on jitte(17, 20)
C3: Attack (14, 20)
W4: hit by wheel, 2 counters on epoch (11, 20)
C4: Attack (8,20)
W5: hit by wheel, 1 counter on epoch (5, 20)
C5: Attack (2, 20)
W6: gains 2, hit by wheel, epoch comes in, equip and attack, 3 counters left on jitte (1, 16)
C6: Attack, W gains 4 to live, 1 counter left on jitte (2, 16)
W7: Gains 2, hit by wheel -dies next upkeep
3CB and 4CB5CB!BWTeysa, Orzhov Scion
GWRhys the Redeemed
GUKruphix, God of Horizons
GRXenagos, God of Revels
GThrun, the Last Troll
GStompy