Quote from Madmanquail »I miss the discard rule too. It was changed while I was on a lengthy break, and the game felt different afterwards. Does anyone know when exactly the discard rule was changed from the old 'no more than one card' rule?
Quote from Heinsun »I'm somewhat confused by the ban of Maralen of the Mornsong in the Land Rule format. Her tutor instead of draw ability doesn't do a lot, as the lands don't need to be drawn, and a two sided 3 damage a turn doesn't seem close to overpowered. Is something going on there that I'm missing?
Quote from Feyd_Ruin »The issue is that non-land-rule rounds can compensate much more easily, and discard in lotus rounds isn't event relevant. With lotus abound, people often play out on first turn. Saying "No more than 1 on 1st" suffices to make discard a viable option while not limiting the format.
Quote from Madmanquail »I think the Shelldock 3CB one doesn't quite work...I could be wrong.
Quote from Feyd_Ruin »Foil / Island / Chancellor of the Forge should be considered for your list, Draco.
i don't see the problem with brain maggot or mesmeric fiend - we have already got the "no discard before opponent's turn 2" rule, which means mesmeric / brain maggot can't be included in most decks.
Quote from Madmanquail »i don't see the problem with brain maggot or mesmeric fiend - we have already got the "no discard before opponent's turn 2" rule, which means mesmeric / brain maggot can't be included in most decks.
Also, point for discussion: is the following deck problematic?
Black Lotus / Black Lotus / Auriok Salvagers / Ulamog, the Infinite Gyre / Pact of Negation
It's very fast like an all-in, immune to foil, and able to use pact as very powerful disruption or combo protection. Ulamog destroys a permanent upon casting, and annihilator takes care of other issues. Ulamog can even shuffle the deck back together if it ever gets killed.
I think the pact puts this deck over the top - It makes the deck nearly unbeatable without dedicated hate.
Quote from CreamedKarn »I'm afraid I don't understand why it is illegal to cast Emrakul turn 1. Could you point to which rule that breaks?
You can get your opponent to 5 life before their first turn, but you can't win before their first turn with it alone, right?
Edit: Ignore me, the rules say before your opponent's second turn, not first.
Quote from Rush_Clasic »The same rule allows a deck centered around Karn Liberated (and similar decks should they exist) to be legal, so that's a plus.
Quote from Heinsun »
[quote]Can the deck win against any legal deck?
2.3a. An entrant may not submit a deck that could enable the player of that deck to win the game or force any cards in an opponent's hand to change zones before an opponent's second turn. A card is forced to change zones if the owner of that card could make no sequence of decisions that would not result in either that card changing zones or that player losing the game before his or her second turn.
2.3b. An entrant may not submit a deck that wouldn't enable the player of that deck to win a match (see Rule 2.4d) against the player of at least one deck satisfying all rules.
That rule exists purely so that new players can be helped by the moderator when they unintentionally submit a deck which cannot win on its own. For example, the deck [[Foil]] / [[Island]] / [[Nether Spirit]] might look like a strong deck, but it cannot ever win a game, since the opponent can always just hold their cards for a draw. This rule allows me to inform the player that their deck doesn't work. Normally, the moderator cannot provide any kind of advice or coaching for the submissions, but if the deck is illegal then they can intervene via this rule.
Quote from Subtle_Relevance »In a round where players are not allowed to play more than one card of each card type, Barren Moor into Encroach would be legal, because every land card can be played on the first turn by an opponent trying to avoid discard...
Quote from Subtle_Relevance »The intent behind 2.3b is a little harder to discern.
Quote from Subtle_Relevance »The XCB comprehensive rules should be worded clearly to mirror the official comprehensive rules, and the abridged version that the majority of players read should reflect the meaning of the comprehensive rules, which they currently fail to do.