The Tabernacle at Pendrell Vale has become an infamous card in the last couple years for its excessive buyouts giving it a price that is no longer affordable for most players by a huge margin. According to the EDH rules committee, the Power 9 is banned because of how inaccessible the cards are to almost everyone. If you look today at the price of Tabernacle, it currently exceeds the prices of every Power 9 card with the exception of Black Lotus.
This poll has been created to get an idea of how the community feels about Tabernacle in the format, and whether or not it should be banned in EDH due to it being the single most inaccessible EDH legal card in the entire game of Magic: The Gathering.
It's not even that great. I've got one and I've played it in...like...1 deck. And it wasn't that great.
Moxen are banned because they're expensive but also because they are NEEDED to optimize a deck. Anyone with a brain in their skull can see that a deck with a moxen is always better than without it. New players see that and think they need to spend thousands to compete.
Tabernacle is a niche card, and not one most new players are going to want to play anyway. It doesn't create perceived barrier to entry whatsoever - which was the point of banning those cards.
Ancestral Recall and Time Walk, one time effect cards, in EDH are not needed in most decks that can play them, yet they are banned only due to their excessive price.
Ancestral Recall and Time Walk, one time effect cards, in EDH are not needed in most decks that can play them, yet they are banned only due to their excessive price.
uhhhhhhhh.....wut?
If they were legal guaranteed 100% of decks that could play them, would play them.
Ancestral Recall and Time Walk, one time effect cards, in EDH are not needed in most decks that can play them, yet they are banned only due to their excessive price.
uhhhhhhhh.....wut?
If they were legal guaranteed 100% of decks that could play them, would play them.
This is likely untrue, as shown evident by the only legal Power 9 card in the format Timetwister. It doesn't automatically go into every deck that can run it. It's powerful, but it's a one time effect which hampers its power significantly in Commander versus its power in Vintage. Likewise with both Ancestral Recall and Time Walk, there would be many instances of decks that can run them, but opt not to because they would rather have a card that serves as a recursion engine. Time Warp and its functional reprints cost a significantly higher mana cost than Time Walk, but if the one time effect of taking an extra turn was really so good they had to go in "100% of decks that could play them" then 100% of decks that could play Time Warp would would be playing it (which they're not).
The reason Timetwister doesn't go into every blue deck is because the vast majority of people playing blue decks can't afford it. I struggle to think of many decks that could run it where Timetwister isn't in the best 99 cards you could put in there.
And the other two blue P9 cards are even better. Time Walk is so much stronger than Time Warp. The difference between 2 mana and 5 is incredible. I can't think of any reason not to put Walk in a deck - worst case, from turn two onwards, it basically reads "0: Draw a card, you may play an extra land this turn". Which is insanely powerful in of itself. Then look at what you can actually do with a extra turn that takes a mere two mana to cast....
Ancestral Recall and Time Walk, one time effect cards, in EDH are not needed in most decks that can play them, yet they are banned only due to their excessive price.
uhhhhhhhh.....wut?
If they were legal guaranteed 100% of decks that could play them, would play them.
This is likely untrue, as shown evident by the only legal Power 9 card in the format Timetwister. It doesn't automatically go into every deck that can run it. It's powerful, but it's a one time effect which hampers its power significantly in Commander versus its power in Vintage. Likewise with both Ancestral Recall and Time Walk, there would be many instances of decks that can run them, but opt not to because they would rather have a card that serves as a recursion engine. Time Warp and its functional reprints cost a significantly higher mana cost than Time Walk, but if the one time effect of taking an extra turn was really so good they had to go in "100% of decks that could play them" then 100% of decks that could play Time Warp would would be playing it (which they're not).
Thats because Timetwister is significantly weaker than Ancestral Recall and Timewalk. Those two are easy to use, cheap, and provide incredible value for the price. In a 100 singleton deck, Timetwister is significantly weaker than it is in vintage, because you can't use it to recycle your graveyard into your deck and redraw everything outside of a few purpose built decks, and you aren't able to play out your hand and fire it off turn 2. It's basically a somewhat better Wheel of Fortune in this format, with the exception that you can't use it as self and that it doesn't trigger discard triggers, making it worse than wheel at the jobs wheel is best at, and its generally worse than Timespiral. Oh,and if the Power 9 were reseeded today, Library and Time Vault would be competing for the 9th slot, not Timetwister.
Anyway, I vote no on banning Tabernacle. I base this on the fact that it's literally $4.50 in mtgo and I cannot remember ever seeing it in a match. Ever. I'm sure it's been used, but I haven't ran into it, and its certainly rarely used despite being affordable. Costing a $1000 isn't a barrier to entry if nobody wants to play it anyway.
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Ancestral Recall and Time Walk, one time effect cards, in EDH are not needed in most decks that can play them, yet they are banned only due to their excessive price.
uhhhhhhhh.....wut?
If they were legal guaranteed 100% of decks that could play them, would play them.
This is likely untrue, as shown evident by the only legal Power 9 card in the format Timetwister. It doesn't automatically go into every deck that can run it. It's powerful, but it's a one time effect which hampers its power significantly in Commander versus its power in Vintage. Likewise with both Ancestral Recall and Time Walk, there would be many instances of decks that can run them, but opt not to because they would rather have a card that serves as a recursion engine. Time Warp and its functional reprints cost a significantly higher mana cost than Time Walk, but if the one time effect of taking an extra turn was really so good they had to go in "100% of decks that could play them" then 100% of decks that could play Time Warp would would be playing it (which they're not).
Not all p9 cards are the same power level. time twister is powerful but only if your deck is built to take advantage of it. Many vintage decks are. Most commander decks aren't.
Your comparison to time warp is hilarious considering that card costs more than twice as much. It's basically the same thing as saying "well not very many decks run ur-golem's eye therefore sol ring isn't that good either". Cost matters. both recall and time walk are effects that benefit (nearly) every deck that has ever existed and at a ludicrously low price.
Not to be rude, but this conversation is kind of ridiculous. Universally powerful effects like Time walk and ancestral recall are in a completely different league than a niche card like tabernacle. Anyone playing blue who would choose not to play recall and time walk in a commander deck, given the opportunity, is just flat-out wrong (if they're building for power).
Ancestral Recall and Time Walk, one time effect cards, in EDH are not needed in most decks that can play them, yet they are banned only due to their excessive price.
uhhhhhhhh.....wut?
If they were legal guaranteed 100% of decks that could play them, would play them.
This is likely untrue, as shown evident by the only legal Power 9 card in the format Timetwister. It doesn't automatically go into every deck that can run it. It's powerful, but it's a one time effect which hampers its power significantly in Commander versus its power in Vintage. Likewise with both Ancestral Recall and Time Walk, there would be many instances of decks that can run them, but opt not to because they would rather have a card that serves as a recursion engine. Time Warp and its functional reprints cost a significantly higher mana cost than Time Walk, but if the one time effect of taking an extra turn was really so good they had to go in "100% of decks that could play them" then 100% of decks that could play Time Warp would would be playing it (which they're not).
Thats because Timetwister is significantly weaker than Ancestral Recall and Timewalk. Those two are easy to use, cheap, and provide incredible value for the price. In a 100 singleton deck, Timetwister is significantly weaker than it is in vintage, because you can't use it to recycle your graveyard into your deck and redraw everything outside of a few purpose built decks, and you aren't able to play out your hand and fire it off turn 2. It's basically a somewhat better Wheel of Fortune in this format, with the exception that you can't use it as self and that it doesn't trigger discard triggers, making it worse than wheel at the jobs wheel is best at, and its generally worse than Timespiral. Oh,and if the Power 9 were reseeded today, Library and Time Vault would be competing for the 9th slot, not Timetwister.
Anyway, I vote no on banning Tabernacle. I base this on the fact that it's literally $4.50 in mtgo and I cannot remember ever seeing it in a match. Ever. I'm sure it's been used, but I haven't ran into it, and its certainly rarely used despite being affordable. Costing a $1000 isn't a barrier to entry if nobody wants to play it anyway.
Fair points in regards to Timetwister. Although, Tabernacle is actually a $1700 (significantly higher than $1000) card per TCGPlayer's median value, and even more for almost every copy on ebay.
This card is frustrating. Especially in Quebec. It seems whenever a Quebecois player is stuck, he yells out tabarnac, even if it's not on the board, or we're not even playing Magic.
I'm not really sure if it's really that busted. I mean, the only archetype I can think of that really has an issue with it is tokens, right? I mean, I guess, maybe aggro decks that don't use that many tokens? It can be much more powerful with Winter Orb, but there are plenty of tax effects to make Winter Orb OP. (Look at any GAAIV or Derevi decklist some time. Derevi doesn't even use Tabernacle.)
Even then, you can't really get mad, just because there are so many answers. Funny thing, every color but blue, note the color generally least affected by this (I think only Talrand is among monoblue decks.) has an answer to lands. (And even blue can do something like Phantasmal Terrain or Imprisoned in the Moon.) Yeah, some people will whine about land destruction, but if you're playing Tabernacle, you really can't get mad.
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Card advantage is not the same thing as card draw. Something for 2B cannot be strictly worse than something for BBB or 3BB. If you're taking out Swords to Plowshares for Plummet, you're a fool. Stop doing these things!
The reason Timetwister doesn't go into every blue deck is because the vast majority of people playing blue decks can't afford it. I struggle to think of many decks that could run it where Timetwister isn't in the best 99 cards you could put in there.
I'd disagree. If you aren't comboing to win, or refreshing your hand after dumping moxen, *or nekusaring*, or whatnot, then it's a symmetrical draw effect in the color that's already best at draw. Why would you want to help your opponents do what you already do best?
I own one and I've run it in 1, maybe 2 decks. The one I ran it in for sure was alexi, zephyr mage and it was greeeeaaaat...at letting my opponents draw into tons of answers and stomp on my face =/
I play against one deck with a Tabernacle it is a really well tuned Tasigur Loam with 50+ lands and it really makes the most out of it putting some serious brakes onto a lot of the decks played against it, however it isn't dominant at all.
I understand where the idea of a ban based on price comes from however I don't really agree and personally I think things should be banned due to power first and everything else a far second.
The Tabernacle at Pendrell Vale has become an infamous card in the last couple years for its excessive buyouts giving it a price that is no longer affordable for most players by a huge margin. According to the EDH rules committee, the Power 9 is banned because of how inaccessible the cards are to almost everyone. If you look today at the price of Tabernacle, it currently exceeds the prices of every Power 9 card with the exception of Black Lotus.
This poll has been created to get an idea of how the community feels about Tabernacle in the format, and whether or not it should be banned in EDH due to it being the single most inaccessible EDH legal card in the entire game of Magic: The Gathering.
The "perceived barrier to entry" criteria for banning is not really about card availability, but it is more about quelling the perception that Commander requires Vintage power in order to compete. The precise wording from the Rules Committee (RC) is as follows:
Commander is a socially welcoming format with a vast card pool. These two traits clash when it comes to certain early Magic cards, even if they would possibly be acceptable in their game play. It's not enough that the card is simply expensive. It must also be something that would be near-universally played if available and contribute to a perception that the format is only for the Vintage audience.
You can read the entire Commander Format Philosophy document (with commentary by Sheldon) here. I highly doubt that the RC would invoke "Perceived Barrier to Entry" as a reason to ban any card just because it's price has gotten out of hand. I'm still amazed as to how much The Tabernacle at Pendrell Vale has gone up in price, but I would be even more amazed if it got banned because if it.
Sheldon's said in his articles before that the 'price as a barrier' qualifier would probably never be used to ban a card again.
Likely because banning would make it cheaper and the original reason for the ban would cease to be true.
Without making it sound like I'm pro or con on this idea, I seriously question whether banning Tabernacle in EDH would cause the price to fall far enough to make an unban a consideration. I'd say the dominate driving force behind Tabernacles price is its appearance in a single Legacy deck combined with the Reserved List making speculators doing everything imaginable to pump the price to stratospheric levels.
Far too easy to play around or nuke in edh. My friend has one and while it’s annoying in a group of creature decks, there’s so much variety in edh, it’s hardly (and I would argue far less) as powerful as a mass sweeper like Damnation, BSZ, or even Torment of Hailfire. Those synergize with so much more cards that Tabernacle is more like a planechase event than an actual format bomb. Anyway, the Tabernacle player is usually alpha struck for playing it, so you could fairly argue it’s risky to bring out.
The reason Timetwister doesn't go into every blue deck is because the vast majority of people playing blue decks can't afford it. I struggle to think of many decks that could run it where Timetwister isn't in the best 99 cards you could put in there.
I'd disagree. If you aren't comboing to win, or refreshing your hand after dumping moxen, *or nekusaring*, or whatnot, then it's a symmetrical draw effect in the color that's already best at draw. Why would you want to help your opponents do what you already do best?
I own one and I've run it in 1, maybe 2 decks. The one I ran it in for sure was alexi, zephyr mage and it was greeeeaaaat...at letting my opponents draw into tons of answers and stomp on my face =/
Well, I admit I've never actually so much as touched a Timetwister, let alone actually run one in a deck. But I've played a hell of a lot of Wheel of Fortunes, and I can safely say that if that was colourless, it would be in all but one of my decks (Edric Flying Men/Turn is the only exception). Even when I have access to good card draw, a 3 mana draw seven is still an extremely powerful card. And given that, outside of looping, Twister is basically the same as Wheel, I'm gonna be running it in nearly all my blue decks were such a thing affordable.
I guess it's meta dependent - if you're never the target and/or your opponents tend to keep full grips while you empty yours, then I suppose it seems good. I'd say it's less a draw 7 and more a draw x-y, where x is the average cards in your opponents hands and y is the cards in your hand. So if they had an average 10 card hand while you had 3, then sure, it's insane. 10-3 = 7. If you and your opponents all had 3-4 cards in hand, though, then you've basically accomplished nothing.
Personally I'm usually a control player and I usually have a full-ish grip. My opponents are usually idiots and usually don't. And while I'm not always the target, I'd say I'm the target more often than average, so any extra gas I give them is very possibly coming directly in my face.
I think one thing to keep in mind with Tabernacle is that, unlike the other cards that are banned as per the barrier to entry rule - not every deck that CAN run it would WANT it. A lot of archetypes in EDH are creature based and most of those wouldn't want a Tabernacle.
The moxen, Lotus and Walk/Recall though? They'd go in every deck that can run them.
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My Commander decks:
Chandra, Torch of Defiance - Oops! All Chandras. Prime Speaker Zegana - Draw for Power. Pir & Toothy - Counterpalooza. Arcades, the Strategist - Another Brick in the Wall. Zacama, Primal Calamity - Calamity of Double Mana. Edgar Markov - Vampires Don't Die. Child of Alara - Dreamcrusher.
What are you all talking about? Tabernacle doesn't universally slot into every deck like Sol Ring, but if you're playing a control deck you should probably be playing it. It is a free way to slow down any deck that wants to play creatures, and it is one of the hardest permanent types to interact with.
In many cases, Pendrell Mists or Magus of the Tabernacle are better, since the original Tabernacle destroys creatures, while its replacements make the creatures get sacrificed. (Magus having a huge butt has also been relevant for me in the past.)
Honestly, I only have one deck I would rather have Tabernacle in than Mists or Magus: my Child of Alara deck, which is full of indestructible creatures.
Yes, the fact that Tabernacle costs a land drop while the other two cost 4 mana can be relevant, but I see plenty of games where nobody's got a creature down by T4 in EDH anyway.
What are you all talking about? Tabernacle doesn't universally slot into every deck like Sol Ring, but if you're playing a control deck you should probably be playing it. It is a free way to slow down any deck that wants to play creatures, and it is one of the hardest permanent types to interact with.
It's not free (costs a card and a land drop) and it makes everyone beat the crap out of you while not actually preventing them from doing anything, usually.
Trust me, I've got one. It's not that great. It's even kind of counterproductive for a control deck because it makes people only play out a few creatures at a time, so your board wipes get worse. It's only really great in stax, and stax is pretty rare outside of cEDH.
It's not free (costs a card and a land drop) and it makes everyone beat the crap out of you while not actually preventing them from doing anything, usually.
Trust me, I've got one. It's not that great. It's even kind of counterproductive for a control deck because it makes people only play out a few creatures at a time, so your board wipes get worse. It's only really great in stax, and stax is pretty rare outside of cEDH.
Yes, yes not "free". You know what I meant.
But how is it not stopping them? If they're beating you with creatures that means they're spending their mana to keep their creatures around, which has to be good for you.
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This poll has been created to get an idea of how the community feels about Tabernacle in the format, and whether or not it should be banned in EDH due to it being the single most inaccessible EDH legal card in the entire game of Magic: The Gathering.
Moxen are banned because they're expensive but also because they are NEEDED to optimize a deck. Anyone with a brain in their skull can see that a deck with a moxen is always better than without it. New players see that and think they need to spend thousands to compete.
Tabernacle is a niche card, and not one most new players are going to want to play anyway. It doesn't create perceived barrier to entry whatsoever - which was the point of banning those cards.
EDH Primers
Phelddagrif - Zirilan
EDH
Thrasios+Bruse - Pang - Sasaya - Wydwen - Feather - Rona - Toshiro - Sylvia+Khorvath - Geth - QMarchesa - Firesong - Athreos - Arixmethes - Isperia - Etali - Silas+Sidar - Saskia - Virtus+Gorm - Kynaios - Naban - Aryel - Mizzix - Kazuul - Tymna+Kraum - Sidar+Tymna - Ayli - Gwendlyn - Phelddagrif 4 - Liliana - Kaervek - Phelddagrif 3 - Mairsil - Scarab - Child - Phenax - Shirei - Thada - Depala - Circu - Kytheon - GrenzoHR - Phelddagrif - Reyhan+Kraum - Toshiro - Varolz - Nin - Ojutai - Tasigur - Zedruu - Uril - Edric - Wort - Zurgo - Nahiri - Grenzo - Kozilek - Yisan - Ink-Treader - Yisan - Brago - Sidisi - Toshiro - Alexi - Sygg - Brimaz - Sek'Kuar - Marchesa - Vish Kal - Iroas - Phelddagrif - Ephara - Derevi - Glissa - Wanderer - Saffi - Melek - Xiahou Dun - Lazav - Lin Sivvi - Zirilan - Glissa
PDH - Drake - Graverobber - Izzet GM - Tallowisp - Symbiote Brawl - Feather - Ugin - Jace - Scarab - Angrath - Vraska - Kumena Oathbreaker - Wrenn&6
If they were legal guaranteed 100% of decks that could play them, would play them.
EDH Primers
Phelddagrif - Zirilan
EDH
Thrasios+Bruse - Pang - Sasaya - Wydwen - Feather - Rona - Toshiro - Sylvia+Khorvath - Geth - QMarchesa - Firesong - Athreos - Arixmethes - Isperia - Etali - Silas+Sidar - Saskia - Virtus+Gorm - Kynaios - Naban - Aryel - Mizzix - Kazuul - Tymna+Kraum - Sidar+Tymna - Ayli - Gwendlyn - Phelddagrif 4 - Liliana - Kaervek - Phelddagrif 3 - Mairsil - Scarab - Child - Phenax - Shirei - Thada - Depala - Circu - Kytheon - GrenzoHR - Phelddagrif - Reyhan+Kraum - Toshiro - Varolz - Nin - Ojutai - Tasigur - Zedruu - Uril - Edric - Wort - Zurgo - Nahiri - Grenzo - Kozilek - Yisan - Ink-Treader - Yisan - Brago - Sidisi - Toshiro - Alexi - Sygg - Brimaz - Sek'Kuar - Marchesa - Vish Kal - Iroas - Phelddagrif - Ephara - Derevi - Glissa - Wanderer - Saffi - Melek - Xiahou Dun - Lazav - Lin Sivvi - Zirilan - Glissa
PDH - Drake - Graverobber - Izzet GM - Tallowisp - Symbiote Brawl - Feather - Ugin - Jace - Scarab - Angrath - Vraska - Kumena Oathbreaker - Wrenn&6
My Helpdesk
[Pr] Marath | [Pr] Lovisa | Jodah | Saskia | Najeela | Yisan | Lord Windgrace | Atraxa | Meren | Gisa and Geralf
This is likely untrue, as shown evident by the only legal Power 9 card in the format Timetwister. It doesn't automatically go into every deck that can run it. It's powerful, but it's a one time effect which hampers its power significantly in Commander versus its power in Vintage. Likewise with both Ancestral Recall and Time Walk, there would be many instances of decks that can run them, but opt not to because they would rather have a card that serves as a recursion engine. Time Warp and its functional reprints cost a significantly higher mana cost than Time Walk, but if the one time effect of taking an extra turn was really so good they had to go in "100% of decks that could play them" then 100% of decks that could play Time Warp would would be playing it (which they're not).
And the other two blue P9 cards are even better. Time Walk is so much stronger than Time Warp. The difference between 2 mana and 5 is incredible. I can't think of any reason not to put Walk in a deck - worst case, from turn two onwards, it basically reads "0: Draw a card, you may play an extra land this turn". Which is insanely powerful in of itself. Then look at what you can actually do with a extra turn that takes a mere two mana to cast....
Thats because Timetwister is significantly weaker than Ancestral Recall and Timewalk. Those two are easy to use, cheap, and provide incredible value for the price. In a 100 singleton deck, Timetwister is significantly weaker than it is in vintage, because you can't use it to recycle your graveyard into your deck and redraw everything outside of a few purpose built decks, and you aren't able to play out your hand and fire it off turn 2. It's basically a somewhat better Wheel of Fortune in this format, with the exception that you can't use it as self and that it doesn't trigger discard triggers, making it worse than wheel at the jobs wheel is best at, and its generally worse than Timespiral. Oh,and if the Power 9 were reseeded today, Library and Time Vault would be competing for the 9th slot, not Timetwister.
Anyway, I vote no on banning Tabernacle. I base this on the fact that it's literally $4.50 in mtgo and I cannot remember ever seeing it in a match. Ever. I'm sure it's been used, but I haven't ran into it, and its certainly rarely used despite being affordable. Costing a $1000 isn't a barrier to entry if nobody wants to play it anyway.
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Step 1: Identify the problem. What aspect of Magic don't you like? Step 2: Find out how others deal with the problem. How do players deal with this aspect of the game when they run into it? Step 3: Do what those players do. Step 4: No more problem. Bonus: You are now better at Magic. Enjoy those extra wins!
Your comparison to time warp is hilarious considering that card costs more than twice as much. It's basically the same thing as saying "well not very many decks run ur-golem's eye therefore sol ring isn't that good either". Cost matters. both recall and time walk are effects that benefit (nearly) every deck that has ever existed and at a ludicrously low price.
Not to be rude, but this conversation is kind of ridiculous. Universally powerful effects like Time walk and ancestral recall are in a completely different league than a niche card like tabernacle. Anyone playing blue who would choose not to play recall and time walk in a commander deck, given the opportunity, is just flat-out wrong (if they're building for power).
EDH Primers
Phelddagrif - Zirilan
EDH
Thrasios+Bruse - Pang - Sasaya - Wydwen - Feather - Rona - Toshiro - Sylvia+Khorvath - Geth - QMarchesa - Firesong - Athreos - Arixmethes - Isperia - Etali - Silas+Sidar - Saskia - Virtus+Gorm - Kynaios - Naban - Aryel - Mizzix - Kazuul - Tymna+Kraum - Sidar+Tymna - Ayli - Gwendlyn - Phelddagrif 4 - Liliana - Kaervek - Phelddagrif 3 - Mairsil - Scarab - Child - Phenax - Shirei - Thada - Depala - Circu - Kytheon - GrenzoHR - Phelddagrif - Reyhan+Kraum - Toshiro - Varolz - Nin - Ojutai - Tasigur - Zedruu - Uril - Edric - Wort - Zurgo - Nahiri - Grenzo - Kozilek - Yisan - Ink-Treader - Yisan - Brago - Sidisi - Toshiro - Alexi - Sygg - Brimaz - Sek'Kuar - Marchesa - Vish Kal - Iroas - Phelddagrif - Ephara - Derevi - Glissa - Wanderer - Saffi - Melek - Xiahou Dun - Lazav - Lin Sivvi - Zirilan - Glissa
PDH - Drake - Graverobber - Izzet GM - Tallowisp - Symbiote Brawl - Feather - Ugin - Jace - Scarab - Angrath - Vraska - Kumena Oathbreaker - Wrenn&6
I'm not really sure if it's really that busted. I mean, the only archetype I can think of that really has an issue with it is tokens, right? I mean, I guess, maybe aggro decks that don't use that many tokens? It can be much more powerful with Winter Orb, but there are plenty of tax effects to make Winter Orb OP. (Look at any GAAIV or Derevi decklist some time. Derevi doesn't even use Tabernacle.)
Even then, you can't really get mad, just because there are so many answers. Funny thing, every color but blue, note the color generally least affected by this (I think only Talrand is among monoblue decks.) has an answer to lands. (And even blue can do something like Phantasmal Terrain or Imprisoned in the Moon.) Yeah, some people will whine about land destruction, but if you're playing Tabernacle, you really can't get mad.
On phasing:
I own one and I've run it in 1, maybe 2 decks. The one I ran it in for sure was alexi, zephyr mage and it was greeeeaaaat...at letting my opponents draw into tons of answers and stomp on my face =/
EDH Primers
Phelddagrif - Zirilan
EDH
Thrasios+Bruse - Pang - Sasaya - Wydwen - Feather - Rona - Toshiro - Sylvia+Khorvath - Geth - QMarchesa - Firesong - Athreos - Arixmethes - Isperia - Etali - Silas+Sidar - Saskia - Virtus+Gorm - Kynaios - Naban - Aryel - Mizzix - Kazuul - Tymna+Kraum - Sidar+Tymna - Ayli - Gwendlyn - Phelddagrif 4 - Liliana - Kaervek - Phelddagrif 3 - Mairsil - Scarab - Child - Phenax - Shirei - Thada - Depala - Circu - Kytheon - GrenzoHR - Phelddagrif - Reyhan+Kraum - Toshiro - Varolz - Nin - Ojutai - Tasigur - Zedruu - Uril - Edric - Wort - Zurgo - Nahiri - Grenzo - Kozilek - Yisan - Ink-Treader - Yisan - Brago - Sidisi - Toshiro - Alexi - Sygg - Brimaz - Sek'Kuar - Marchesa - Vish Kal - Iroas - Phelddagrif - Ephara - Derevi - Glissa - Wanderer - Saffi - Melek - Xiahou Dun - Lazav - Lin Sivvi - Zirilan - Glissa
PDH - Drake - Graverobber - Izzet GM - Tallowisp - Symbiote Brawl - Feather - Ugin - Jace - Scarab - Angrath - Vraska - Kumena Oathbreaker - Wrenn&6
I understand where the idea of a ban based on price comes from however I don't really agree and personally I think things should be banned due to power first and everything else a far second.
Likely because banning would make it cheaper and the original reason for the ban would cease to be true.
The "perceived barrier to entry" criteria for banning is not really about card availability, but it is more about quelling the perception that Commander requires Vintage power in order to compete. The precise wording from the Rules Committee (RC) is as follows:
You can read the entire Commander Format Philosophy document (with commentary by Sheldon) here. I highly doubt that the RC would invoke "Perceived Barrier to Entry" as a reason to ban any card just because it's price has gotten out of hand. I'm still amazed as to how much The Tabernacle at Pendrell Vale has gone up in price, but I would be even more amazed if it got banned because if it.
Without making it sound like I'm pro or con on this idea, I seriously question whether banning Tabernacle in EDH would cause the price to fall far enough to make an unban a consideration. I'd say the dominate driving force behind Tabernacles price is its appearance in a single Legacy deck combined with the Reserved List making speculators doing everything imaginable to pump the price to stratospheric levels.
Well, I admit I've never actually so much as touched a Timetwister, let alone actually run one in a deck. But I've played a hell of a lot of Wheel of Fortunes, and I can safely say that if that was colourless, it would be in all but one of my decks (Edric Flying Men/Turn is the only exception). Even when I have access to good card draw, a 3 mana draw seven is still an extremely powerful card. And given that, outside of looping, Twister is basically the same as Wheel, I'm gonna be running it in nearly all my blue decks were such a thing affordable.
Personally I'm usually a control player and I usually have a full-ish grip. My opponents are usually idiots and usually don't. And while I'm not always the target, I'd say I'm the target more often than average, so any extra gas I give them is very possibly coming directly in my face.
So, timetwister sits in a box mostly.
EDH Primers
Phelddagrif - Zirilan
EDH
Thrasios+Bruse - Pang - Sasaya - Wydwen - Feather - Rona - Toshiro - Sylvia+Khorvath - Geth - QMarchesa - Firesong - Athreos - Arixmethes - Isperia - Etali - Silas+Sidar - Saskia - Virtus+Gorm - Kynaios - Naban - Aryel - Mizzix - Kazuul - Tymna+Kraum - Sidar+Tymna - Ayli - Gwendlyn - Phelddagrif 4 - Liliana - Kaervek - Phelddagrif 3 - Mairsil - Scarab - Child - Phenax - Shirei - Thada - Depala - Circu - Kytheon - GrenzoHR - Phelddagrif - Reyhan+Kraum - Toshiro - Varolz - Nin - Ojutai - Tasigur - Zedruu - Uril - Edric - Wort - Zurgo - Nahiri - Grenzo - Kozilek - Yisan - Ink-Treader - Yisan - Brago - Sidisi - Toshiro - Alexi - Sygg - Brimaz - Sek'Kuar - Marchesa - Vish Kal - Iroas - Phelddagrif - Ephara - Derevi - Glissa - Wanderer - Saffi - Melek - Xiahou Dun - Lazav - Lin Sivvi - Zirilan - Glissa
PDH - Drake - Graverobber - Izzet GM - Tallowisp - Symbiote Brawl - Feather - Ugin - Jace - Scarab - Angrath - Vraska - Kumena Oathbreaker - Wrenn&6
The moxen, Lotus and Walk/Recall though? They'd go in every deck that can run them.
Honestly, I only have one deck I would rather have Tabernacle in than Mists or Magus: my Child of Alara deck, which is full of indestructible creatures.
Yes, the fact that Tabernacle costs a land drop while the other two cost 4 mana can be relevant, but I see plenty of games where nobody's got a creature down by T4 in EDH anyway.
Two Score, Minus Two or: A Stargate Tail
(Image by totallynotabrony)
Trust me, I've got one. It's not that great. It's even kind of counterproductive for a control deck because it makes people only play out a few creatures at a time, so your board wipes get worse. It's only really great in stax, and stax is pretty rare outside of cEDH.
EDH Primers
Phelddagrif - Zirilan
EDH
Thrasios+Bruse - Pang - Sasaya - Wydwen - Feather - Rona - Toshiro - Sylvia+Khorvath - Geth - QMarchesa - Firesong - Athreos - Arixmethes - Isperia - Etali - Silas+Sidar - Saskia - Virtus+Gorm - Kynaios - Naban - Aryel - Mizzix - Kazuul - Tymna+Kraum - Sidar+Tymna - Ayli - Gwendlyn - Phelddagrif 4 - Liliana - Kaervek - Phelddagrif 3 - Mairsil - Scarab - Child - Phenax - Shirei - Thada - Depala - Circu - Kytheon - GrenzoHR - Phelddagrif - Reyhan+Kraum - Toshiro - Varolz - Nin - Ojutai - Tasigur - Zedruu - Uril - Edric - Wort - Zurgo - Nahiri - Grenzo - Kozilek - Yisan - Ink-Treader - Yisan - Brago - Sidisi - Toshiro - Alexi - Sygg - Brimaz - Sek'Kuar - Marchesa - Vish Kal - Iroas - Phelddagrif - Ephara - Derevi - Glissa - Wanderer - Saffi - Melek - Xiahou Dun - Lazav - Lin Sivvi - Zirilan - Glissa
PDH - Drake - Graverobber - Izzet GM - Tallowisp - Symbiote Brawl - Feather - Ugin - Jace - Scarab - Angrath - Vraska - Kumena Oathbreaker - Wrenn&6
But how is it not stopping them? If they're beating you with creatures that means they're spending their mana to keep their creatures around, which has to be good for you.