Two color creature types vs. three color creature types. Help me come up with this list!
:symw::symu: Soldiers vs. :symg::symr::symb: Warriors
:symu::symb: Rogues vs. :symr::symg::symw: Scouts
:symb::symr: ??? vs. :symg::symw::symu: Mystics? (blue mystics?)
:symr::symg: Shamans vs. :symw::symu::symb: Wizards
:symg::symw: Rebels? vs. :symu::symb::symr: Mercenaries? (blue mercenaries?)
:symw::symb: Clerics vs. :symr::symg::symu: ???
:symu::symr: vs. :symw::symg::symb: ???
:symb::symg: Druids vs. :symw::symu::symr: Artificer
:symr::symw: Nomads? vs. :symu::symb::symg: ???
:symg::symu: ??? vs. :symb::symr::symw: Knights
*edit*
OK, I'm going to go ahead and make up some new tribes to fill in these blanks.
:symw::symu: Soldiers vs. :symg::symr::symb: Warriors
:symu::symb: Rogues vs. :symr::symg::symw: Scouts
:symb::symr: ??? vs. :symg::symw::symu: Mystics? (blue mystics?)
:symr::symg: Shamans vs. :symw::symu::symb: Wizards
:symg::symw: Rebels? vs. :symu::symb::symr: Mercenaries? (blue mercenaries?)
:symw::symb: Clerics vs. :symr::symg::symu: ?Skeptics? (logical, naturalist, break from tradition?)
:symu::symr: Blasters? vs. :symw::symg::symb: Archers? (black archers?)
:symb::symg: Druids vs. :symw::symu::symr: Artificer
:symr::symw: Nomads vs. :symu::symb::symg: ???
:symg::symu: Masters? vs. :symb::symr::symw: Knights
Blasters are guys who shoot magical laser beams. Alternative names could be Gunner or Spellslinger.
Masters are mounted spell casters as opposed to mounted fighters. They are kind of like elite wizards in the same way that knights are elite soldiers.
I would like to see a 5 color Rebel/Mercenary situation, and green rebs / blue mercs make total sense, though blue would probably play both sides of that conflict.
Maybe the UB tribe to oppose WBR Knight tribe should be nature themed, because I hear Nature doesn't like knights. I saw that in somebody's sig... but I can't remember whose it is or who said it. It's odd how I can't remember that, huh?
BGW Druids v UR artificers has some real precedent, how's that? You have something similar, but there are two or so white druids and no artificer I'm aware of.
The list doesn't neccessarily have to be perfect any more than Myers-Briggs is perfect. I guess the whole point of this is to develop a good structure for handling job types and finding gaps where we can fill things in.
For example:
If we have Nomads as the RW tribe, we need them to have some kind of enemy for GUB. The way I see it, Nomads ought to move around from land to land, so maybe GUB should be more stationary?
*This list could also just be used for one set or block and otherwise just do things so they feel good like usual.*
As for Minions, I don't see how I could incorporate those into this list anyway, so I can understand unbolding them. Maybe we should address minions in this or another thread though. What are minions? If they are a class, what defines them as a class? If they are a race, what defines them as a race? If neither of the above, what are they?
*edit*
The idea of blue playing both teams (rebel/mercenary) is a good one though. That would be a cool subtheme for a set.
BR Barbarians and GWU Monks? Blue monks here take on a more contemplative roll, with white monks having been seen before. BR is barbarians that totally fits, as the only green barbarians are one portal legend and Yavimaya Barbarian. Black barbarians aren't hard to imagine.
Nomads seem RGW to me, by searching. They would seem to make a better enemy of Rogues (or Pirates) than Rogue v Scout. Inevitably though you're going to have to make some new classes to do this, or open up types like mutant or race types.
Well, for new classes I have: RGU Skeptics. They are the enemies of Clerics. They break from the confines of tradition to embrace naturalism and logic. They are able to focus their powerful disbelief to create an anti-magical field.
Blasters/Gunners/Spellslingers in RU are the enemies of archers. They use more advanced magical weaponry to fight enemies from long range. They mostly have pinging abilities and ways of evading combat while still dealing damage.
Masters in GU are mounted elite spellcasters who use their mounts as a source of mobility and power and have abilities to pump up their mounts.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
GENERATION 3.78: The first time you see this, add it into your sig and add 1 to the number after generation
The enemy of Clerics should be Clerics, I don't like the idea that Skeptics can't be white. Some tribes, Wizard most proinently, can be found in every color and should be avoided for this kind of class war. I also object to Skeptic as being a class type as skepticism isn't a super power.
Being a wizard lets you throw fireballs or whatnot, but skeptics only have a place in worlds where there's reason to doubt. You can't deny magic or the power of the gods when people can clearly demonstrate it, and do so daily. The Skeptic may be the enemy of the church in the real world, but that's only because the pope can't throw thunderbolts on unbelievers. In a world where the church heads can actually summon their god to do battle, skepticism isn't an issue.
Blaster sounds like an inferior Wizard, and Master line an inferior lord. I don't think there are enough types to have ten different two-sided conflicts without some of them sucking. Some of these battles have to extend to races or the idea fails.
If you had one set of conflicts (say the ones with all ally color) be based around races and the others (Ones based around enemy / wedge colors) based on classes then you could have a lot more fun. Suppose Goblins were BRG and Druids were WG, for example, you could have a green Goblin Druid. If the enemy of goblins is upposed to be birds (WU) and druids be Artificers (Hypothetically UBR) then that goblin druid can have an ability pertaining to one or both conflicts. You could also have a black or red goblin artificer that hates birds and druids, etc. That way you can fill out 10 different wars in half the number of creatures.
In my spare time I'm kicking around something like that idea, but without goblins, birds, druids, or artificers. I think it has some real potential if you work at it.
Red monks are kind of silly. I think monks as WG, (maybe WGU, but that would be expanding the tribe) would be better.
Berserkers, as Barbarians and Warriors, all want the same colors, BRG. The problem with this kind of probelm is that many types wan the same types. I think Berserker is more GR, so you could have Barbarian become BR and Warrior take BG or BRG. There is so little distinction between those tribes it's hard to make any progress here without just making an arbitrary decision and building from that decision.
I think the point remains though that UG needs some sort of class tribe of it's own. This little excercise has also shown me that blue rebel/mercenaries would be a cool idea and it has gotten me thinking about black archers and such.
*edit* By the way, I'm part of the "get rid of barbarians" as a tribe camp. It really is an arbitrary creature type. All the barbarians could easily just be warriors, berserkers, or shamans.
:symw::symu: Soldiers vs. :symg::symr::symb: Warriors
:symu::symb: ??? vs. :symr::symg::symw: Archers (red archers as Tim variants.)
:symb::symr: ??? vs. :symg::symw::symu: Monks
:symr::symg: Shamans vs. :symw::symu::symb: Wizards
:symg::symw: Scouts vs. :symu::symb::symr: Rogues
:symw::symb: Clerics vs. :symr::symg::symu: ???
:symu::symr: Artificers vs. :symw::symg::symb: Druids
:symb::symg: ??? vs. :symw::symu::symr: ???
:symr::symw: ??? vs. :symu::symb::symg: ???
:symg::symu: ??? vs. :symb::symr::symw: Knights
Pirate hasn't come up yet, that could easily be UB, maybe even red too. There are so few pirates that the tribe is essencially unexplored territory. Maybe GW Citicens v UBR Pirates? I don't know what the natural enemy of pirates would be, and I want to say that the first person to say it's Ninja or Chuck Norris earns my eternal hatered. I don't see pirates hating Archers or Scouts, so we'd have to replace that with something else.
BG could be Barbarians, or Berserkers if we want to avoid a virtually dead type. They're the same thing realistically. They hate Monks, done deal. Otherwise I like this latest list. Artificers have more of a UR feel IMOP, and I like druids as being the balance between good and evil, hence GWB.
I think part of the reason why I'm doing this is also to see what color combinations are explored more than others. BRG has more job types that work for it compared to the other colors. I think that certain jobs should be taken out of certain colors to give other jobs more room to grow and explore new flavors.
*edit*
In more detail...
Berserkers just don't seem very G to me. When I think Berserkers, I think suicidal aggro. I think of all the things that RB stand for. I don't imagine berserkers fighting for nature and harmony and cooperation and growth or any of the things that green is supposed to stand for. I see berserkers ignoring their own wounds and killing things because thats what berserkers do.
I also think that shamans should be taken out of black. Black already has wizards and clerics. Black has enough spellcasters. If anything blue needs more spellcasters as it is the spellcaster color.
*edit2*
Hmmm...
Assassins are cold, calculating, stealthy killers. Not red at all.
What are the enemies of clerics? It's so obvious, why didn't I see it before? Make heretic a creature type. It only affects two creatures: Soldevi Heretic and Viashino Heretic.
Mystics. Does white really need another type of spiritual guy? What is the difference between a cleric and a mystic? What if we make mystics blue to address blue spirituality? Theres more blue cards with mystic in the name than there are white cards with mystic in the type line. Basically make these the 'masters' that I was suggesting.
:symw::symu: Soldiers vs. :symg::symr::symb: Warriors
:symu::symb: Assassins vs. :symr::symg::symw: Archers
:symb::symr: Berserkers vs. :symg::symw::symu: Monks
:symr::symg: Shamans vs. :symw::symu::symb: Wizards
:symg::symw: Scouts vs. :symu::symb::symr: Rogues
:symw::symb: Clerics vs. :symr::symg::symu: Heretics
:symu::symr: Artificers vs. :symw::symg::symb: Druids
:symb::symg: ??? vs. :symw::symu::symr: ???
:symr::symw: ??? vs. :symu::symb::symg: ???
:symg::symu: Mystics vs. :symb::symr::symw: Knights
:symw::symu: Soldiers vs. :symg::symr::symb: Warriors
:symu::symb: Rogues vs. :symr::symg::symw: Scouts
:symb::symr: ??? vs. :symg::symw::symu: Mystics? (blue mystics?)
:symr::symg: Shamans vs. :symw::symu::symb: Wizards
:symg::symw: Rebels? vs. :symu::symb::symr: Mercenaries? (blue mercenaries?)
:symw::symb: Clerics vs. :symr::symg::symu: ???
:symu::symr: vs. :symw::symg::symb: ???
:symb::symg: Druids vs. :symw::symu::symr: Artificer
:symr::symw: Nomads? vs. :symu::symb::symg: ???
:symg::symu: ??? vs. :symb::symr::symw: Knights
List of creature types (jobs bolded) (possibles italic):
Advisor, Anemone, Angel, Anteater, Antelope, Ape, Archer, Archon, Artificer, Assassin, Assembly-Worker, Atog, Aurochs, Avatar, Badger, Barbarian, Basilisk, Bat, Bear, Beast, Beeble, Berserker, Bird, Blinkmoth, Boar, Bringer, Brushwagg, Camarid, Camel, Caribou, Carrier, Cat, Centaur, Cephalid, Chimera, Citizen, Cleric, Cockatrice, Construct, Coward, Crab, Crocodile, Cyclops, Dauthi, Demon, Deserter, Devil, Djinn, Dragon, Drake, Dreadnought, Drone, Druid, Dryad, Dwarf, Efreet, Egg, Elder, Elemental, Elephant, Elf, Elk, Eye, Faerie, Ferret, Fish, Flagbearer, Fox, Frog, Fungus, Gargoyle, Giant, Gnome, Goat, Goblin, Golem, Gorgon, Graveborn, Gremlin, Griffin, Hag, Harpy, Hellion, Hippo, Homarid, Homunculus, Horror, Horse, Hound, Human, Hydra, Illusion, Imp, Incarnation, Insect, Jellyfish, Juggernaut, Kavu, Kirin, Kithkin, Knight, Kobold, Kor, Kraken, Lammasu, Leech, Leviathan, Lhurgoyf, Licid, Lizard, Manticore, Masticore, Mercenary, Merfolk, Metathran, Minion, Minotaur, Monger, Mongoose, Monk, Moonfolk, Mutant, Myr, Mystic, Nautilus, Nephilim, Nightmare, Nightstalker, Ninja, Nomad, Octopus, Ogre, Ooze, Orb, Orc, Orgg, Ouphe, Ox, Oyster, Pegasus, Pentavite, Pest, Phelddagrif, Phoenix, Pincher, Pirate, Plant, Prism, Rabbit, Rat, Rebel, Reflection, Rhino, Rigger, Rogue, Salamander, Samurai, Sand, Saproling, Satyr, Scarecrow, Scorpion, Scout, Serf, Serpent, Shade, Shaman, Shapeshifter, Sheep, Skeleton, Slith, Sliver, Slug, Snake, Soldier, Soltari, Spawn, Specter, Spellshaper, Sphinx, Spider, Spike, Spirit, Splinter, Sponge, Squid, Squirrel, Starfish, Survivor, Tetravite, Thalakos, Thopter, Thrull, Treefolk, Triskelavite, Troll, Turtle, Unicorn, Vampire, Vedalken, Viashino, Volver, Wall, Warrior, Weird, Whale, Wizard, Wolf, Wolverine, Wombat, Worm, Wraith, Wurm, Yeti, Zombie, Zubera
*edit*
OK, I'm going to go ahead and make up some new tribes to fill in these blanks.
:symw::symu: Soldiers vs. :symg::symr::symb: Warriors
:symu::symb: Rogues vs. :symr::symg::symw: Scouts
:symb::symr: ??? vs. :symg::symw::symu: Mystics? (blue mystics?)
:symr::symg: Shamans vs. :symw::symu::symb: Wizards
:symg::symw: Rebels? vs. :symu::symb::symr: Mercenaries? (blue mercenaries?)
:symw::symb: Clerics vs. :symr::symg::symu: ?Skeptics? (logical, naturalist, break from tradition?)
:symu::symr: Blasters? vs. :symw::symg::symb: Archers? (black archers?)
:symb::symg: Druids vs. :symw::symu::symr: Artificer
:symr::symw: Nomads vs. :symu::symb::symg: ???
:symg::symu: Masters? vs. :symb::symr::symw: Knights
Blasters are guys who shoot magical laser beams. Alternative names could be Gunner or Spellslinger.
Masters are mounted spell casters as opposed to mounted fighters. They are kind of like elite wizards in the same way that knights are elite soldiers.
There is an imposter among us...
Butcher of Words.
Made by Spiderboy4
Maybe the UB tribe to oppose WBR Knight tribe should be nature themed, because I hear Nature doesn't like knights. I saw that in somebody's sig... but I can't remember whose it is or who said it. It's odd how I can't remember that, huh?
BGW Druids v UR artificers has some real precedent, how's that? You have something similar, but there are two or so white druids and no artificer I'm aware of.
Argivian Archaeologist
Argivian Blacksmith
Ayesha Tanaka
Hanna, Ship's Navigator
The list doesn't neccessarily have to be perfect any more than Myers-Briggs is perfect. I guess the whole point of this is to develop a good structure for handling job types and finding gaps where we can fill things in.
For example:
If we have Nomads as the RW tribe, we need them to have some kind of enemy for GUB. The way I see it, Nomads ought to move around from land to land, so maybe GUB should be more stationary?
*This list could also just be used for one set or block and otherwise just do things so they feel good like usual.*
As for Minions, I don't see how I could incorporate those into this list anyway, so I can understand unbolding them. Maybe we should address minions in this or another thread though. What are minions? If they are a class, what defines them as a class? If they are a race, what defines them as a race? If neither of the above, what are they?
*edit*
The idea of blue playing both teams (rebel/mercenary) is a good one though. That would be a cool subtheme for a set.
There is an imposter among us...
Nomads seem RGW to me, by searching. They would seem to make a better enemy of Rogues (or Pirates) than Rogue v Scout. Inevitably though you're going to have to make some new classes to do this, or open up types like mutant or race types.
RGU Skeptics. They are the enemies of Clerics. They break from the confines of tradition to embrace naturalism and logic. They are able to focus their powerful disbelief to create an anti-magical field.
Blasters/Gunners/Spellslingers in RU are the enemies of archers. They use more advanced magical weaponry to fight enemies from long range. They mostly have pinging abilities and ways of evading combat while still dealing damage.
Masters in GU are mounted elite spellcasters who use their mounts as a source of mobility and power and have abilities to pump up their mounts.
There is an imposter among us...
Being a wizard lets you throw fireballs or whatnot, but skeptics only have a place in worlds where there's reason to doubt. You can't deny magic or the power of the gods when people can clearly demonstrate it, and do so daily. The Skeptic may be the enemy of the church in the real world, but that's only because the pope can't throw thunderbolts on unbelievers. In a world where the church heads can actually summon their god to do battle, skepticism isn't an issue.
Tell that to Richard Dawkins.
There is an imposter among us...
OK, so skeptics don't work then. How do you feel about the Blasters and Masters though?
There is an imposter among us...
If you had one set of conflicts (say the ones with all ally color) be based around races and the others (Ones based around enemy / wedge colors) based on classes then you could have a lot more fun. Suppose Goblins were BRG and Druids were WG, for example, you could have a green Goblin Druid. If the enemy of goblins is upposed to be birds (WU) and druids be Artificers (Hypothetically UBR) then that goblin druid can have an ability pertaining to one or both conflicts. You could also have a black or red goblin artificer that hates birds and druids, etc. That way you can fill out 10 different wars in half the number of creatures.
In my spare time I'm kicking around something like that idea, but without goblins, birds, druids, or artificers. I think it has some real potential if you work at it.
Don't take this the wrong way, but those are both terrible, terrible names.
Maybe:
WR - Artificer / UBG - Fungus
or
WR - Samurai / UBG - Ninja
http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/showpost.php?p=4557651&postcount=1
TheWarden's Creative Commons Music Pick Project (Retired):
http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/showthread.php?t=336498
UBR: Wizards
URG: Monks
Butcher of Words.
Made by Spiderboy4
Berserkers, as Barbarians and Warriors, all want the same colors, BRG. The problem with this kind of probelm is that many types wan the same types. I think Berserker is more GR, so you could have Barbarian become BR and Warrior take BG or BRG. There is so little distinction between those tribes it's hard to make any progress here without just making an arbitrary decision and building from that decision.
• Recent Card Ideas • My Drawings at DeviantArt
*edit* By the way, I'm part of the "get rid of barbarians" as a tribe camp. It really is an arbitrary creature type. All the barbarians could easily just be warriors, berserkers, or shamans.
:symw::symu: Soldiers vs. :symg::symr::symb: Warriors
:symu::symb: ??? vs. :symr::symg::symw: Archers (red archers as Tim variants.)
:symb::symr: ??? vs. :symg::symw::symu: Monks
:symr::symg: Shamans vs. :symw::symu::symb: Wizards
:symg::symw: Scouts vs. :symu::symb::symr: Rogues
:symw::symb: Clerics vs. :symr::symg::symu: ???
:symu::symr: Artificers vs. :symw::symg::symb: Druids
:symb::symg: ??? vs. :symw::symu::symr: ???
:symr::symw: ??? vs. :symu::symb::symg: ???
:symg::symu: ??? vs. :symb::symr::symw: Knights
There is an imposter among us...
BG could be Barbarians, or Berserkers if we want to avoid a virtually dead type. They're the same thing realistically. They hate Monks, done deal. Otherwise I like this latest list. Artificers have more of a UR feel IMOP, and I like druids as being the balance between good and evil, hence GWB.
I think part of the reason why I'm doing this is also to see what color combinations are explored more than others. BRG has more job types that work for it compared to the other colors. I think that certain jobs should be taken out of certain colors to give other jobs more room to grow and explore new flavors.
*edit*
In more detail...
Berserkers just don't seem very G to me. When I think Berserkers, I think suicidal aggro. I think of all the things that RB stand for. I don't imagine berserkers fighting for nature and harmony and cooperation and growth or any of the things that green is supposed to stand for. I see berserkers ignoring their own wounds and killing things because thats what berserkers do.
I also think that shamans should be taken out of black. Black already has wizards and clerics. Black has enough spellcasters. If anything blue needs more spellcasters as it is the spellcaster color.
*edit2*
Hmmm...
Assassins are cold, calculating, stealthy killers. Not red at all.
What are the enemies of clerics? It's so obvious, why didn't I see it before? Make heretic a creature type. It only affects two creatures: Soldevi Heretic and Viashino Heretic.
Mystics. Does white really need another type of spiritual guy? What is the difference between a cleric and a mystic? What if we make mystics blue to address blue spirituality? Theres more blue cards with mystic in the name than there are white cards with mystic in the type line. Basically make these the 'masters' that I was suggesting.
:symw::symu: Soldiers vs. :symg::symr::symb: Warriors
:symu::symb: Assassins vs. :symr::symg::symw: Archers
:symb::symr: Berserkers vs. :symg::symw::symu: Monks
:symr::symg: Shamans vs. :symw::symu::symb: Wizards
:symg::symw: Scouts vs. :symu::symb::symr: Rogues
:symw::symb: Clerics vs. :symr::symg::symu: Heretics
:symu::symr: Artificers vs. :symw::symg::symb: Druids
:symb::symg: ??? vs. :symw::symu::symr: ???
:symr::symw: ??? vs. :symu::symb::symg: ???
:symg::symu: Mystics vs. :symb::symr::symw: Knights
There is an imposter among us...