Oh how I long to see reprints, or updated versions of, the other four Elder Dragons. They're dead though, which is sad. And even though Bolas was the only one of the five who ignited his spark and thus is worthy of a planeswalker card, he wasn't the only one that had an innate spark to begin with.
Technically, WotC can bring back any of the Elder Dragons they please, Nicol Bolas not withstanding, several of them have been dead and brought back (in the pre-revision comics though, only to get killed off again by Bolas between then and Bolas's reintroduction, but considering that Bolas is a lying liar who lies, his word can not be taken as truth.)
They could also bring back Taysir if they wanted, as he has canonically been brought back from the dead before.
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It's about time for the reserved list to die, for the sake of Vintage and Legacy (And Commander).
Technically, WotC can bring back any of the Elder Dragons they please, Nicol Bolas not withstanding, several of them have been dead and brought back (in the pre-revision comics though, only to get killed off again by Bolas between then and Bolas's reintroduction, but considering that Bolas is a lying liar who lies, his word can not be taken as truth.)
They could also bring back Taysir if they wanted, as he has canonically been brought back from the dead before.
True. But if they reprinted the old cards, they wouldn't do so well in today's metagame (Rampage, anyone?) so if they do bring them back, which they should, because, awesome (and an entire format [EDH] was built around them) new versions would fare much better. Bolas' original card was arguably the only one of the five that was useful.
When were the older Elders revived/killed again by Bolas? I don't seem to recall that...
Pre-revisionist, however:
~~Arcades Sabboth was supposedly killed by Kristina of the Woods, in her duel with Leshrac
~~Chromium Rhuell was killed by Tevesh Szat in order to escape the Shard of the Twelve Worlds
~~Vaevictis Asmadi's death is not confirmed, but it is hinted at in the comics that he was murdered by his cousin, Palladia-Mors
~~Palladia-Mors' death is also unconfirmed
~~Nicol Bolas is, of course, still alive and kicking after 25,000 years
"Other?" You have Nissa, Sorin (mostly), Kiora (when she arrives), Ajani, Nicol Bolas, and by this point, Tezzeret.
Compared to the Venser, Koth, Elspeth, Gideon, Jace, sarkhan, Lilli, and Garruk for Human walkers. You may notice that one you factor in that Venser is dead, that's even between human/non human. Depending on how you count Tezz and Sorin, there are 2-3 more Human than non-human walkers. Not bad.
Seriously, this entire conversation is stupid. A little under half of all the new walkers aren't human, why should that trend undergo some DRASTIC change?
"Other?" You have Nissa, Sorin (mostly), Kiora (when she arrives), Ajani, Nicol Bolas, and by this point, Tezzeret.
Compared to the Venser, Koth, Elspeth, Gideon, Jace, sarkhan, Lilli, and Garruk for Human walkers. You may notice that one you factor in that Venser is dead, that's even between human/non human. Depending on how you count Tezz and Sorin, there are 2-3 more Human than non-human walkers. Not bad.
Seriously, this entire conversation is stupid. A little under half of all the new walkers aren't human, why should that trend undergo some DRASTIC change?
I dont think anyone was asking for DRASTIC changes and all the points you made were mostly covered already. We were talking about races we would like to see. I dont appreciate being told the conversation I'm in is stupid.
"Other?" You have Nissa, Sorin (mostly), Kiora (when she arrives), Ajani, Nicol Bolas, and by this point, Tezzeret.
Compared to the Venser, Koth, Elspeth, Gideon, Jace, sarkhan, Lilli, and Garruk for Human walkers. You may notice that one you factor in that Venser is dead, that's even between human/non human. Depending on how you count Tezz and Sorin, there are 2-3 more Human than non-human walkers. Not bad.
Seriously, this entire conversation is stupid. A little under half of all the new walkers aren't human, why should that trend undergo some DRASTIC change?
If you count Koth as human, you have to count Tezzeret.
Hell, I can't understand why you DON'T count Tezzeret as human. You also decide to count Kiora, despite her not having an actual card, then immediately turn around and forget to add Ral and Dack. We have no idea what Sifa is, but money would be on human as well. Might as well take it one step further and count Baltrice if you count non-carded walkers.
And you need to add Karn.
So, in other words, you need to count correctly before you accuse anything of being stupid.
I'm confused by Page 3 of the webcomic, "Gathering Forces, part III". At the bottom, Koth refers to Venser as "Human," almost implying that Koth does not consider himself such. Anyone care to elaborate on that?
I'm confused by Page 3 of the webcomic, "Gathering Forces, part III". At the bottom, Koth refers to Venser as "Human," almost implying that Koth does not consider himself such. Anyone care to elaborate on that?
I think it has more to do with Koth being accustomed to the many sentient races of Mirrodin/New Phyrexia.
Loxodon, Leonin, Goblin, Ogre, Elf, Troll, Vedalken, Drones, Slith, Myr, Vampires, Dryads, and Golems. And maybe even dragons, depending on how intelligent said dragons are on the plane.
True. But if they reprinted the old cards, they wouldn't do so well in today's metagame (Rampage, anyone?) so if they do bring them back, which they should, because, awesome (and an entire format [EDH] was built around them) new versions would fare much better. Bolas' original card was arguably the only one of the five that was useful.
When were the older Elders revived/killed again by Bolas? I don't seem to recall that...
Pre-revisionist, however:
~~Arcades Sabboth was supposedly killed by Kristina of the Woods, in her duel with Leshrac
~~Chromium Rhuell was killed by Tevesh Szat in order to escape the Shard of the Twelve Worlds
~~Vaevictis Asmadi's death is not confirmed, but it is hinted at in the comics that he was murdered by his cousin, Palladia-Mors
~~Palladia-Mors' death is also unconfirmed
~~Nicol Bolas is, of course, still alive and kicking after 25,000 years
It is quite possible that Vaevictis and Palladia survived, however, there is no conclusive evidence either way, and Bolas does claim he is the last of the Elders, however, as we all know: Bolas is a lying liar who lies, and as such can not be trusted.
But as we have seen before, death is not necessarily the end for elder dragons, all it takes is one talented or determined being to bring them back, just as Nicol came back.
And if they come back, how unlikely it may be, they will likely come back as planeswalkers to work as a foil for Bolas.
The only other pre-mending and dead planeswalker I can even fathom seeing return would be, as I mentioned earlier, Taysir or Rabiah, and that is only because he has canonically done so before, and we are about due for our first five color walker...
The only other pre-mending and dead planeswalker I can even fathom seeing return would be, as I mentioned earlier, Taysir or Rabiah, and that is only because he has canonically done so before, and we are about due for our first five color walker...
I think you underestimate the number of leftover pre-mending walkers.
Last we hard from Sandruu, he was involved in the Planeswalker War on Corondor after Ravidel set off the Mox Beacon.
Dakkon Blackblade is still wandering about in theory. Geyadrone Dihada too, since their story never had a resolution.
Eskil the White was never dealt with, since the last we heard of him was from Mangara.
Ravi is still on Ulgrotha near as we can tell.
We know very very little about Fatima's fate since she banished Taysir from his home.
Jared Carthalion's fate is also unknown.
And finally, There's a chance Jaya Ballard isn't dead given the fact that they left us totally in the dark over who "Jodah" was in Time Spiral. Of course, I don't think Jaya is likely to come back since we have Chandra.
I have not read the novels of the Zendikar block, but I have read on WotC's website that the Eldrazi were originally sealed away by Sorin, a draconic planeswalker named Ugin, and an "unnamed lithomancer" ("litho" meaning "stone," as in "monolith"). Since Sorin has already been portrayed in existing cards, how likely is it that Ugin or the unnamed lithomancer may be further developed as characters in future stories or sets?
I've still got my fingers crossed for a squirrel walker, not a humanized squirrel but an actual squirrel.
How would that be possible? Ordinary squirrels are not rational, sentient, self-aware beings, which one must be to awaken their planeswalker spark. I am no expert on the subject of planewalksers, but I thought that any sentient, self-aware being possesses the potential to awaken their planeswalker's spark and become a planeswalker, although very few beings ever succeed in realizing that potential. I sincerely hope that you are joking when you say that you wish for a squirrel planeswalker, but if you are not, then I must ask: why would you want to see such a planeswalker? Squirrels are not badass or fierce animals, so I would never be able to take any squirrel-themed character seriously, no matter how powerful or intimidating they were.
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“Those who would trade their freedoms for security will have neither.”-Benjamin Franklin
“When the people fear the government, there is tyranny; when the government fears the people, there is liberty.”-Thomas Jefferson
“A vote is like a rifle; its usefulness depends upon the character of its user.”-Theodore Roosevelt
“Patriotism means to stand by one's country; it does not mean to stand by one's president.”-Theodore Roosevelt
About squirrels : in the Marvel Universe, Squirrel-Girl has a unique power, full control over... squirrels. It may sounds a little weak, funny, childish, and not impressive at all, but she managed to defeat several big vilains, some of them twice.
About squirrels : in the Marvel Universe, Squirrel-Girl has a unique power, full control over... squirrels. It may sounds a little weak, funny, childish, and not impressive at all, but she managed to defeat several big vilains, some of them twice.
So... Never underestimate a squirrel. Never ever.
Also, R&D loves squirrels... Especially MaRo. They'll find a way.
If a black/green Nissa appears in a future set, will her abilities still be elf-specific, or may she have abilities that work in a greater range of decks?
What about Kiora Atua? Has whatever information revealed about her thus far suggested that her abilities will be merfolk-specific, or will she be, hopefully, able to be fit in nearly any deck, as is the case with most planeswalker cards?
What about Garruk's transition from mono-green to black/green? As Garruk has appeared in every core set since planeswalkers started appearing in such sets, and no core set to date has ever had multicolored cards, how will his transition be handled in future sets? Will he stop appearing in core sets, or will he somehow be cured of the Veil's curse return to being mono-green? I myself would prefer him coming to accept his corruption and become comfortable with being black/green, as that would make him far more interesting, in my mind.
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“Those who would trade their freedoms for security will have neither.”-Benjamin Franklin
“When the people fear the government, there is tyranny; when the government fears the people, there is liberty.”-Thomas Jefferson
“A vote is like a rifle; its usefulness depends upon the character of its user.”-Theodore Roosevelt
“Patriotism means to stand by one's country; it does not mean to stand by one's president.”-Theodore Roosevelt
If a black/green Nissa appears in a future set, will her abilities still be elf-specific, or may she have abilities that work in a greater range of decks?
Since it seems like no one liked her card but myself, yes, she'll not be tribal. If she is, I'm fine with that. I'll still love her.
Maybe in AVR Avacyn will be a white angel planeswalker
She was created, so unless Sorin can make a spark, much less a soul, you won't be getting Avacyn as a walker.
I know I'm being a little unfair to you, as you're just starting out, but the theory has been tossed around a lot and just today was pretty definitively defused.
I think you underestimate the number of leftover pre-mending walkers.
Last we hard from Sandruu, he was involved in the Planeswalker War on Corondor after Ravidel set off the Mox Beacon.
Dakkon Blackblade is still wandering about in theory. Geyadrone Dihada too, since their story never had a resolution.
Eskil the White was never dealt with, since the last we heard of him was from Mangara.
Ravi is still on Ulgrotha near as we can tell.
We know very very little about Fatima's fate since she banished Taysir from his home.
Jared Carthalion's fate is also unknown.
And finally, There's a chance Jaya Ballard isn't dead given the fact that they left us totally in the dark over who "Jodah" was in Time Spiral. Of course, I don't think Jaya is likely to come back since we have Chandra.
I am not sure about how much time has passed since the mending, which is why I chose not to mention any of those. But logically most of them would have died of old age by now. I can imagine that Ravi might still be around, but only if the Baron has turned her (He did seem to have some sentimental attachment to her after all).
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It's about time for the reserved list to die, for the sake of Vintage and Legacy (And Commander).
In all fairness, if Venser can appear without any bloody explanation, any of the lost oldwalkers could turn up with some strained explanation of why they didn't age or ways they prolonged their life.
In fairness though, I only think like... 3 of those tops are possible.
In all fairness, if Venser can appear without any bloody explanation, any of the lost oldwalkers could turn up with some strained explanation of why they didn't age or ways they prolonged their life.
In fairness though, I only think like... 3 of those tops are possible.
I thought they did explain it though. But he did know Teferi and Jhoria, so there is a chance they could have provided him with slow water. But I dunno.
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It's about time for the reserved list to die, for the sake of Vintage and Legacy (And Commander).
Squee, Goblin Ascendant 1RRR
Planeswalker – Squee
{+2}: Put 2 1/1 Goblin tokens with haste onto the battlefield.
{-4}: You get an emblem with “Goblin creatures you control get +1/+0 for each other Goblin creature you control.”
{-9}: Sacrifice all Goblin creatures you control. ~ deals X damage to target creature or player, where X is twice the number of Goblins sacrificed this way.
{3}
I swear I first read it as Wingbonger...something tells me that "As Long as Wingbonger is paired with another creature, both creatures have weed." wouldn't be as good. Seems solid for limited.
I'd just be happy if they stopped making them look like He-Man actions figures.
Quoted for friggin' truth. I love Jace but I really wanted to punch something after I read what he was supposed to be about and I saw his physical proportions. He's a mind mage but he looks like he spends hours in the gym not in the library. I always envision Jace as being a relatively thin ready guy who if he has any serious muscle tone it's more long and lean than that bulky thing we have. I just console myself with him by saying what we see in all the imagery is just his illusion magic to make himself look more intimidating.
One day we'll get a card called something like Jace, True Nerd and it'll look like what he's supposed to be :tongue:. It'll make him owning Tezz (who I can see being muscular and bulky) even more awesome.
As for more non human walkers I can see it but I think humans will continue to be the norm. All the other races in the multiverse have something on humans giving them the majority of the exploration powers seems like a fair trade. So what if you don't have elven strength and reflexes, Centaur stamina, vampire power and longevity, dwarven durability, leonin speed, Loxodon strength, etc. You get to go out and do what humans are best at. Explore strange new worlds and help them fall to pieces
Squee, Goblin Ascendant 1RRR
Planeswalker – Squee
{+2}: Put 2 1/1 Goblin tokens with haste onto the battlefield.
{-4}: You get an emblem with “Goblin creatures you control get +1/+0 for each other Goblin creature you control.”
{-9}: Sacrifice all Goblin creatures you control. ~ deals X damage to target creature or player, where X is twice the number of Goblins sacrificed this way.
{3}
I prefer mine-fits the flavor better.
ATTACHMENTS
Squee Goblin Planeswalker
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Technically, none... So far...
But knowing Wizards, soon. Very soon.
Technically, WotC can bring back any of the Elder Dragons they please, Nicol Bolas not withstanding, several of them have been dead and brought back (in the pre-revision comics though, only to get killed off again by Bolas between then and Bolas's reintroduction, but considering that Bolas is a lying liar who lies, his word can not be taken as truth.)
They could also bring back Taysir if they wanted, as he has canonically been brought back from the dead before.
---
Numquam evolutioni obstes. Solum conculceris.
Pascite draconem, evolvite aut morimini.
BEtched Champion/InfectB
WSoilders/knightsW
WUVenser SplicerWU
RRDWR
GFeed the Pack comboG
WUPool of ExhaustionWU
EDH
GEzuri, Elf OverrunG
BGeth, GraverobberB
UThada Adel, ThiefU
RUrabrask, Big RedR
WElesh Norn, CrusadeW
WUGAngus Makenzie, Bant ControlWUG
Extended
WGElvesWG
Legacy
RGoblinsR
UBGFariesUBG
UBGRaffinityUBG
True. But if they reprinted the old cards, they wouldn't do so well in today's metagame (Rampage, anyone?) so if they do bring them back, which they should, because, awesome (and an entire format [EDH] was built around them) new versions would fare much better. Bolas' original card was arguably the only one of the five that was useful.
When were the older Elders revived/killed again by Bolas? I don't seem to recall that...
Pre-revisionist, however:
~~Arcades Sabboth was supposedly killed by Kristina of the Woods, in her duel with Leshrac
~~Chromium Rhuell was killed by Tevesh Szat in order to escape the Shard of the Twelve Worlds
~~Vaevictis Asmadi's death is not confirmed, but it is hinted at in the comics that he was murdered by his cousin, Palladia-Mors
~~Palladia-Mors' death is also unconfirmed
~~Nicol Bolas is, of course, still alive and kicking after 25,000 years
Compared to the Venser, Koth, Elspeth, Gideon, Jace, sarkhan, Lilli, and Garruk for Human walkers. You may notice that one you factor in that Venser is dead, that's even between human/non human. Depending on how you count Tezz and Sorin, there are 2-3 more Human than non-human walkers. Not bad.
Seriously, this entire conversation is stupid. A little under half of all the new walkers aren't human, why should that trend undergo some DRASTIC change?
Join the Poetry Running Contest!
I dont think anyone was asking for DRASTIC changes and all the points you made were mostly covered already. We were talking about races we would like to see. I dont appreciate being told the conversation I'm in is stupid.
If you count Koth as human, you have to count Tezzeret.
Hell, I can't understand why you DON'T count Tezzeret as human. You also decide to count Kiora, despite her not having an actual card, then immediately turn around and forget to add Ral and Dack. We have no idea what Sifa is, but money would be on human as well. Might as well take it one step further and count Baltrice if you count non-carded walkers.
And you need to add Karn.
So, in other words, you need to count correctly before you accuse anything of being stupid.
Probably not.
Fiers has been relegated to a questionable position.
The link: http://www.wizards.com/magic/multiverse/article.aspx?x=mtgcom/feature2/110a
~Lil Kalki
Proud Disciple of the Church of the Wary
I think it has more to do with Koth being accustomed to the many sentient races of Mirrodin/New Phyrexia.
Loxodon, Leonin, Goblin, Ogre, Elf, Troll, Vedalken, Drones, Slith, Myr, Vampires, Dryads, and Golems. And maybe even dragons, depending on how intelligent said dragons are on the plane.
It is quite possible that Vaevictis and Palladia survived, however, there is no conclusive evidence either way, and Bolas does claim he is the last of the Elders, however, as we all know: Bolas is a lying liar who lies, and as such can not be trusted.
But as we have seen before, death is not necessarily the end for elder dragons, all it takes is one talented or determined being to bring them back, just as Nicol came back.
And if they come back, how unlikely it may be, they will likely come back as planeswalkers to work as a foil for Bolas.
The only other pre-mending and dead planeswalker I can even fathom seeing return would be, as I mentioned earlier, Taysir or Rabiah, and that is only because he has canonically done so before, and we are about due for our first five color walker...
---
Numquam evolutioni obstes. Solum conculceris.
Pascite draconem, evolvite aut morimini.
I think you underestimate the number of leftover pre-mending walkers.
Last we hard from Sandruu, he was involved in the Planeswalker War on Corondor after Ravidel set off the Mox Beacon.
Dakkon Blackblade is still wandering about in theory. Geyadrone Dihada too, since their story never had a resolution.
Eskil the White was never dealt with, since the last we heard of him was from Mangara.
Ravi is still on Ulgrotha near as we can tell.
We know very very little about Fatima's fate since she banished Taysir from his home.
Jared Carthalion's fate is also unknown.
And finally, There's a chance Jaya Ballard isn't dead given the fact that they left us totally in the dark over who "Jodah" was in Time Spiral. Of course, I don't think Jaya is likely to come back since we have Chandra.
How would that be possible? Ordinary squirrels are not rational, sentient, self-aware beings, which one must be to awaken their planeswalker spark. I am no expert on the subject of planewalksers, but I thought that any sentient, self-aware being possesses the potential to awaken their planeswalker's spark and become a planeswalker, although very few beings ever succeed in realizing that potential. I sincerely hope that you are joking when you say that you wish for a squirrel planeswalker, but if you are not, then I must ask: why would you want to see such a planeswalker? Squirrels are not badass or fierce animals, so I would never be able to take any squirrel-themed character seriously, no matter how powerful or intimidating they were.
“When the people fear the government, there is tyranny; when the government fears the people, there is liberty.”-Thomas Jefferson
“A vote is like a rifle; its usefulness depends upon the character of its user.”-Theodore Roosevelt
“Patriotism means to stand by one's country; it does not mean to stand by one's president.”-Theodore Roosevelt
So... Never underestimate a squirrel. Never ever.
Also, R&D loves squirrels... Especially MaRo. They'll find a way.
What about Kiora Atua? Has whatever information revealed about her thus far suggested that her abilities will be merfolk-specific, or will she be, hopefully, able to be fit in nearly any deck, as is the case with most planeswalker cards?
What about Garruk's transition from mono-green to black/green? As Garruk has appeared in every core set since planeswalkers started appearing in such sets, and no core set to date has ever had multicolored cards, how will his transition be handled in future sets? Will he stop appearing in core sets, or will he somehow be cured of the Veil's curse return to being mono-green? I myself would prefer him coming to accept his corruption and become comfortable with being black/green, as that would make him far more interesting, in my mind.
“When the people fear the government, there is tyranny; when the government fears the people, there is liberty.”-Thomas Jefferson
“A vote is like a rifle; its usefulness depends upon the character of its user.”-Theodore Roosevelt
“Patriotism means to stand by one's country; it does not mean to stand by one's president.”-Theodore Roosevelt
Since it seems like no one liked her card but myself, yes, she'll not be tribal. If she is, I'm fine with that. I'll still love her.
She was created, so unless Sorin can make a spark, much less a soul, you won't be getting Avacyn as a walker.
I know I'm being a little unfair to you, as you're just starting out, but the theory has been tossed around a lot and just today was pretty definitively defused.
I am not sure about how much time has passed since the mending, which is why I chose not to mention any of those. But logically most of them would have died of old age by now. I can imagine that Ravi might still be around, but only if the Baron has turned her (He did seem to have some sentimental attachment to her after all).
---
Numquam evolutioni obstes. Solum conculceris.
Pascite draconem, evolvite aut morimini.
In fairness though, I only think like... 3 of those tops are possible.
I thought they did explain it though. But he did know Teferi and Jhoria, so there is a chance they could have provided him with slow water. But I dunno.
---
Numquam evolutioni obstes. Solum conculceris.
Pascite draconem, evolvite aut morimini.
Squee, Goblin Ascendant 1RRR
Planeswalker – Squee
{+2}: Put 2 1/1 Goblin tokens with haste onto the battlefield.
{-4}: You get an emblem with “Goblin creatures you control get +1/+0 for each other Goblin creature you control.”
{-9}: Sacrifice all Goblin creatures you control. ~ deals X damage to target creature or player, where X is twice the number of Goblins sacrificed this way.
{3}
RIP Mike McArtor. The Mothership won't be the same.
Legacy
GG Aggro Elves GG
Quoted for friggin' truth. I love Jace but I really wanted to punch something after I read what he was supposed to be about and I saw his physical proportions. He's a mind mage but he looks like he spends hours in the gym not in the library. I always envision Jace as being a relatively thin ready guy who if he has any serious muscle tone it's more long and lean than that bulky thing we have. I just console myself with him by saying what we see in all the imagery is just his illusion magic to make himself look more intimidating.
One day we'll get a card called something like Jace, True Nerd and it'll look like what he's supposed to be :tongue:. It'll make him owning Tezz (who I can see being muscular and bulky) even more awesome.
As for more non human walkers I can see it but I think humans will continue to be the norm. All the other races in the multiverse have something on humans giving them the majority of the exploration powers seems like a fair trade. So what if you don't have elven strength and reflexes, Centaur stamina, vampire power and longevity, dwarven durability, leonin speed, Loxodon strength, etc. You get to go out and do what humans are best at. Explore strange new worlds and help them fall to pieces
You can check out my artwork here and here
I prefer mine-fits the flavor better.