Expect some kind of Jund hate for control. Affinity and faeries both had emergency hate printed against them and they weren't even as dominant as jund is now. My guess is that control will get the options they need against jund soon.
You mean like a Multikicker counterspell that completely hoses cascade?
We got one RUMOURED. It hasn't been confirmed at all, and the post is doubtful at least. The ability is to linear and lacks originality (basically replicate v.2.0-It doesn't even LOOK like kicker). And both cards revealed in the post use the same ability that conviniently we had just heard about at that time. Most rumors that appear so early and rely on keywords that were just confirmed -to look more believeable, happen to be fake.
Not saying the card doesn't exist, but don't place your hope too high.
I dunno. I was skeptical of the post myself when I first read it, but it seems very feasible that they'd print something like this to combat the dominance of Cascade. They're trying to push Control decks onto the backburner and give aggro decks a time to shine, but Cascade has taken away any identity that Control has at all. An aggro deck having more CA than a control deck = unhealthy for the game, not to mention retarded.
Problem is: Did they have any info on cascade (an alara reborn ability)'s "problematic" effect on the game when they created WWK? I highly doubt so. I think WWK was pretty much finished when Alara Reborn went out. And if they intended to design direct answers to cascade before Alara Reborn was out (or at least before its efficiency was thoroughly observed, if I can't guess sets schedules right), just "in case",don't you think they would have done sooner?
What I mean is that "Wow, that works just fine against the cascade cards that are pissing me off right now" is not necessarily an argument in favor of they reality of a rumoured card in my opinion. We should be careful of any rumor that is "just what we wanted".
Is it really that hard to believe they'd know cascade would be so "problematic?" I mean, RnD does playtest their cards, you know. FFL, etc.
R&D also makes mistakes, as they're more than willing to say.
And regarding that earlier thing about 1-2 life helping out in the long run, if you are at 1-2 life, you better have more up your sleeve than just a land anyway, or you're dead. I'm really excited about this land, and will definitely try throwing a WU Control deck together to see how it does.
Cards like bloodbraid, bit blast, and broodmate can create multiple threats with one card. In order to win with this land you need to reach a pretty deep end game to be able to activate it and swing enough time to get to lethal.
Giving a cascade player more time is going to give them more time to play a multi threat bomb.
Okay, you have Broodmate Dragon, Bloodbraid Elf, Putrid Leech, and Sprouting Thrinax on the battlefield. You attack.
The problem with defining this format by what is "fun" is that everyone seems to define fun as what they don't lose to. If you keep losing to easily answered cards, that means you should improve your deck. If you don't want to improve your deck, then you should come to peace with the idea that you are going to lose because you chose to not interact with better strategies.
Are borros and RDW really low tier? If thats the case then everything is low tier cept for jund.
Except the best deck in the format (arguably) is Naya Lightsaber, Turbofog/Jacerator is a high-tier deck, and every major tournament a new deck is showing up to win it.
I can get behind the man-lands. The only problem I'm going to have is that there are an aweful lot of expensive cards in magic nowadays already. With man-lands, no matter what they are, they are going to rocket up in price the moment they get cracked open, no matter what they have as abilities. You can reasonably guess that besides the one we already know, the green is probably going to be kick ass too. I'm not so sure about the black one tho. Black usually gets the shaft when it comes to manlands. I can't even remember the last ones name, it was so bad, but I do remember that it was less than useless as a permanent. But regardless, the prices on these jewels will be outrageous, and stretch peoples wallets even moreso than they already are, especially in todays economy. I know I'm going to get them anyways, but I sure hope that they make it worth our while all around the color pie. Not just 1 or 2 that do something great and the rest that just sit there as junk rares in binders. They make a land cycle, then the manlands need to kick some major ass.
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Except the best deck in the format (arguably) is Naya Lightsaber, Turbofog/Jacerator is a high-tier deck, and every major tournament a new deck is showing up to win it.
This is straight up wrong. Jund is by far the best deck in the format. Just cause Lightsaber won a couple matches against jund at worlds does not make it the best deck. You need a much bigger sample size. I've tested lightsaber against jund and id say the matchup is 55 - 45 in favor of jund.
The collonade is incredible for a UWx control deck and will be auto include in them.
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Quote from thundyr »
Jacerator is an aggro deck - it just wins by attacking the library, it doesn't really control the board other than to play a few Fogs
Expect some kind of Jund hate for control. Affinity and faeries both had emergency hate printed against them and they weren't even as dominant as jund is now. My guess is that control will get the options they need against jund soon.
are you seriously trying to suggest that jund is more dominant than TS/LOR fae or affinity were??
did you actually PLAY during those enviroments?
the man-land is good. it'll be an auto-include in WUx control decks. it will compliment baneslayer and jwar isle as a finisher quality card.
the man-land is good. it'll be an auto-include in WUx control decks. it will compliment baneslayer and jwar isle as a finisher quality card.
Celestial Colonnade: "Baneslayer, Sphinx, you are such wonderful finishers!"
Baneslayer: "Thank you! I never could have done it without you backing me up to pay my casting cost."
Sphinx: "Yeah, big props to you, you're not a bad finisher yourself!"
You could do 99, unless they make a legendary Dryad Arbor in WWK.
I sure hope they do but Wizards is trying to get away from the legendary land thing. From a flavor standpoint they are saying that 'Two people can be in the same legendary place at the same time'. So i don't know...
I sure hope they do but Wizards is trying to get away from the legendary land thing.
No, they haven't said anything about getting away from Legendary Lands altogether, only that they are now willing to use non-Legendary Lands to represent unique places like Valakut. It is quite likely that a land which is well-balanced by having only one copy be able to be played at once will appear as a rare or mythic Legendary Land again someday in the future.
It is quite likely that a land which is well-balanced by having only one copy be able to be played at once will appear as a rare or mythic Legendary Land again someday in the future.
I don't see how that balances anything. I seem to recall that the original type 2 had a restricted list, but it was decided that balancing powerful spells by limiting them to 1 per deck was just making the game more luck based and it didn't balance anything, so all restricted cards were added to the banned list.
I think that while there is an inherent balance in legendary creatures and planeswalkers, because it limits you to one in play but due to the ease of removal you will probably play multiple copies anyway. With lands, most decks can't remove lands, so playing multiples of a legendary land makes you end up with dead cards in your hand, which is "not fun". Since the current plan seems to be avoiding "not fun" mechanics (strong counterspells, land destruction), I doubt we will see legendary lands again.
I can't remember the exact article, but I remember reading that legendary lands wouldn't return because it gives a player LD for only the cost of dropping a land.
I don't see how that balances anything. I seem to recall that the original type 2 had a restricted list, but it was decided that balancing powerful spells by limiting them to 1 per deck was just making the game more luck based and it didn't balance anything, so all restricted cards were added to the banned list.
Right, but that's a completely and entirely different thing from the Legend rule. Restricting cards is bad because it makes it extremely luck-based how often you draw them. With a Legendary card, you can (and in some cases, do) run the full complement of 4 in your deck so that you still draw it as often, but you can only play with one at once. There are tons of legendary creatures, artifacts, and lands that are balanced using that drawback.
I can't remember the exact article, but I remember reading that legendary lands wouldn't return because it gives a player LD for only the cost of dropping a land.
No, that also didn't happen.
We just had 6 legendary lands in Time Spiral block. This isn't a mechanic like World Enchantments that R&D decided was worth getting rid of for all time.
I totally knew the Eldrazi's power would take the form of elemental... called it.
The Eldrazi are still very much asleep during the time of Worldwake. Other things might be happening in the world that eventually lead to their arrival, but the Eldrazi themselves are still asleep and cannot take action on Zendikar.
Celestial Colonnade: "Baneslayer, Sphinx, you are such wonderful finishers!"
Baneslayer: "Thank you! I never could have done it without you backing me up to pay my casting cost."
Sphinx: "Yeah, big props to you, you're not a bad finisher yourself!"
Since the current plan seems to be avoiding "not fun" mechanics (strong counterspells, land destruction), I doubt we will see legendary lands again.
You seem to have missed the point with what they are trying to do here. They don't want to take away strong counter spells and LD spells, they want to take away an abundance of such spells. In the last Standard we had Cryptic Command, a very strong counter spell. In this Standard we have Goblin Ruinblaster, a strong LD spell. All they want to avoid is having a deck that is Draw-Go and an LD deck. And legendary lands fall no where near that level of annoyance as you seem to imply here.
Now that's a sweet winning condition for U/W control decks, and since it's not legendary you can run 3 without worrying too much...now all that's missing is some usable countermagic, and decent counters, and counters that don't suck, oh! and decent card drawing too (though Courier's Capsule could be certainly worse).
You seem to have missed the point with what they are trying to do here. They don't want to take away strong counter spells and LD spells, they want to take away an abundance of such spells. In the last Standard we had Cryptic Command, a very strong counter spell. In this Standard we have Goblin Ruinblaster, a strong LD spell. All they want to avoid is having a deck that is Draw-Go and an LD deck. And legendary lands fall no where near that level of annoyance as you seem to imply here.
If you play 4 copies of one, it can be pretty damn annoying (aka not fun) to open a hand with more than one, or if you keep a hand of legendary land +regular land regular land, and then only draw additional copies of your legendary...
Of course you can go and build the deck with just a single copy of the legendary land, which puts us back into the balance via restriction argument. Cards that are only balanced by being restricted to one per deck aren't really balanced, they are just a random bonus when you get them.
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You mean like a Multikicker counterspell that completely hoses cascade?
We got one
I dunno. I was skeptical of the post myself when I first read it, but it seems very feasible that they'd print something like this to combat the dominance of Cascade. They're trying to push Control decks onto the backburner and give aggro decks a time to shine, but Cascade has taken away any identity that Control has at all. An aggro deck having more CA than a control deck = unhealthy for the game, not to mention retarded.
Is it really that hard to believe they'd know cascade would be so "problematic?" I mean, RnD does playtest their cards, you know. FFL, etc.
And regarding that earlier thing about 1-2 life helping out in the long run, if you are at 1-2 life, you better have more up your sleeve than just a land anyway, or you're dead. I'm really excited about this land, and will definitely try throwing a WU Control deck together to see how it does.
Okay, you have Broodmate Dragon, Bloodbraid Elf, Putrid Leech, and Sprouting Thrinax on the battlefield. You attack.
I cast Fog.
My turn? Okay, good.
I draw two more Fog spells, a Negate, another Howling Mine, and a Flashfreeze.
Have fun.
I would be down. I love man lands and after WWK comes out i hope i can make a sweet all land, yes 100 land, EDH deck. Does anyone here have one yet?
Except the best deck in the format (arguably) is Naya Lightsaber, Turbofog/Jacerator is a high-tier deck, and every major tournament a new deck is showing up to win it.
Stalking Stones
I liked this when it came out years ago in Mono-blue permission, as it seemed designed for the deck, but this new Serra will (IMHO) kick its ass.
-Pentavore
You could do 99, unless they make a legendary Dryad Arbor in WWK.
This is straight up wrong. Jund is by far the best deck in the format. Just cause Lightsaber won a couple matches against jund at worlds does not make it the best deck. You need a much bigger sample size. I've tested lightsaber against jund and id say the matchup is 55 - 45 in favor of jund.
The collonade is incredible for a UWx control deck and will be auto include in them.
are you seriously trying to suggest that jund is more dominant than TS/LOR fae or affinity were??
did you actually PLAY during those enviroments?
the man-land is good. it'll be an auto-include in WUx control decks. it will compliment baneslayer and jwar isle as a finisher quality card.
Jund IS more dominant than affinity and faeries as has been explained in several articles. Here is one of them. http://strategy.channelfireball.com/featured-articles/silvestri-says-worlds-breakdown/
Yes this is a fact jund is the #1 most format defining deck of all time.....which is stupid because it IS more beatable than the aforementioned
Original quote by ParticleMan
LOL
Celestial Colonnade: "Baneslayer, Sphinx, you are such wonderful finishers!"
Baneslayer: "Thank you! I never could have done it without you backing me up to pay my casting cost."
Sphinx: "Yeah, big props to you, you're not a bad finisher yourself!"
Or did you mean "complement"?
I sure hope they do but Wizards is trying to get away from the legendary land thing. From a flavor standpoint they are saying that 'Two people can be in the same legendary place at the same time'. So i don't know...
No, they haven't said anything about getting away from Legendary Lands altogether, only that they are now willing to use non-Legendary Lands to represent unique places like Valakut. It is quite likely that a land which is well-balanced by having only one copy be able to be played at once will appear as a rare or mythic Legendary Land again someday in the future.
I don't see how that balances anything. I seem to recall that the original type 2 had a restricted list, but it was decided that balancing powerful spells by limiting them to 1 per deck was just making the game more luck based and it didn't balance anything, so all restricted cards were added to the banned list.
I think that while there is an inherent balance in legendary creatures and planeswalkers, because it limits you to one in play but due to the ease of removal you will probably play multiple copies anyway. With lands, most decks can't remove lands, so playing multiples of a legendary land makes you end up with dead cards in your hand, which is "not fun". Since the current plan seems to be avoiding "not fun" mechanics (strong counterspells, land destruction), I doubt we will see legendary lands again.
Right, but that's a completely and entirely different thing from the Legend rule. Restricting cards is bad because it makes it extremely luck-based how often you draw them. With a Legendary card, you can (and in some cases, do) run the full complement of 4 in your deck so that you still draw it as often, but you can only play with one at once. There are tons of legendary creatures, artifacts, and lands that are balanced using that drawback.
No, that also didn't happen.
We just had 6 legendary lands in Time Spiral block. This isn't a mechanic like World Enchantments that R&D decided was worth getting rid of for all time.
The Eldrazi are still very much asleep during the time of Worldwake. Other things might be happening in the world that eventually lead to their arrival, but the Eldrazi themselves are still asleep and cannot take action on Zendikar.
I meant quite exactly what I said.
you realize this is article is based off of one tournament, right?
You seem to have missed the point with what they are trying to do here. They don't want to take away strong counter spells and LD spells, they want to take away an abundance of such spells. In the last Standard we had Cryptic Command, a very strong counter spell. In this Standard we have Goblin Ruinblaster, a strong LD spell. All they want to avoid is having a deck that is Draw-Go and an LD deck. And legendary lands fall no where near that level of annoyance as you seem to imply here.
If you play 4 copies of one, it can be pretty damn annoying (aka not fun) to open a hand with more than one, or if you keep a hand of legendary land +regular land regular land, and then only draw additional copies of your legendary...
Of course you can go and build the deck with just a single copy of the legendary land, which puts us back into the balance via restriction argument. Cards that are only balanced by being restricted to one per deck aren't really balanced, they are just a random bonus when you get them.