I would also replace the draining Whelk with Mystic Snake. I realize the Whelk can be a big flyer, but both are essentially useless copied, and with the Alchemist's Refuge as the only flash enabler, I would not count on having 6 open mana every turn, even with the muse.
Gah, how could I forget about Mystic Snake? Come to think about it, I may actually run both snake and whelk, since counterspell creatures are something I don't mind having more than one of, and both can be flickered with Navigator (who is the all-star of the deck after Palinchron) for recurring counterspells. But if I need room for something else, then I'll cut the whelk. I will definitely include Mystic Snake, though. I also realized I'm missing Regrowth, have to find room for that but I don't want to take out any more creatures. I could also go for Restock, but I like the idea of being able to recur Regrowth with Chronarch/Archaeomancer. Restock removes itself from the game, unfortunately.
Edit: @SuperSonik: Didn't see your reply the first time, for some reason. I've been having doubts about Force of Will, to be honest. As awesome of a card as it is and as much as I love it, you may be right in that it doesn't belong in a tricolor deck. I'm considering building a V-Clique 1v1 French Banlist EDH deck, maybe I can use it there. Can I Skullclamp tokens and draw cards from them? I think they hit the graveyard before being exiled, right? And I think I'll stay with SoFaI for now, but I do own SoFaF if it doesn't work out. Hell, if I can make room I'll run both of them.
Can I Skullclamp tokens and draw cards from them? I think they hit the graveyard before being exiled, right? And I think I'll stay with SoFaI for now, but I do own SoFaF if it doesn't work out. Hell, if I can make room I'll run both of them.
Yes, tokens go to the graveyard and will trigger any appropriate abilities. They are then removed as a State Based Action the next time SBA are checked.
With as creature heavy as you are, I would toss a bone to Light and Shadow over Fire and Ice. They both give +1 CA, but where FaI gives you a card value of unknown value, which averages to the average value of the deck, LaS will always give you a card value equal to the best card in your graveyard. With all of the special creatures you run, this is valuable. Also, LaS gives a better set of protections. White and Black have more prevalent single-target removals, and are more likely to see creatures in those colors (following green) before red and blue creatures, in general.
I will say that I left out the recommendation of Mystic Snake because I assumed you just chose Draining Whelk and Venser over it. It is, in fact, a better card for Riku IMO than Draining Whelk.
You know, another way to keep the gas coming for this deck is to play a bounce outlet or two. Crystal Shard is a favorite of mine for how cheap it is and because of its utility against other players. And now you are getting into soft lock territory with Muse, bounce outlet and Mystic Snake, countering a player every turn. It's really good with Venser too. If you want to add it to your stable of counters, consider cutting Cryptic Command (or Force). UUU is no gimmie and it doesn't interact well with other creature cards in your deck. You can't sac it to Birthing Pod when you're done with it or pitch it to survival.
Sword of Light and Shadow does help with this too, of course. I play it as well.
Regrowth is better than Restock. It's nice and cheap and easily copied, and it doesn't get exiled so Snapcaster can reuse it.
Damn, guess I have to get a SoLaS then I'll admit, one of the main reasons I chose SoFaI is because I own it and SoFaF, but you're right, SoLaS is probably better. Once I get a SoLaS, I'll cut SoFaI for it. I'm cutting Force for Skullclamp, but I think I'll hold off on Shard. It's harder to tutor for, and I already have Capsize, Venser, and Navigator for Bounce/Blink outlets. I'll keep it in mind, though, I do remember seeing it in one or more of the lists in the primer.
I'm still a fan of Cryptic, since it can do so many things, be copied, and cantrip. I am planning on getting the old dual lands despite my initial hesitance, so the UUU should be easier to get. And yeah, agreed on Regrowth. Initially I wanted to run Restock instead of Regrowth because I didn't see the exiling effect at the end, but that's definitely a dealbreaker. Once I get all the cards I ordered and make some trades tonight, I'll post the new list. Thanks for all the suggestions, guys.
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is Tunnel Ignus good enough to be used in warp world decks? would it trigger for all the lands? EDIT: OMG it does! just slotted it I think it will be magical c:
is Tunnel Ignus good enough to be used in warp world decks? would it trigger for all the lands? EDIT: OMG it does! just slotted it I think it will be magical c:
OOH I should give that guy a mention. That's a killer find.
Always here to help I actually picked up 4 as well as 4 realm razers from a 10 cent card box, was gonna make the jankiest 60 card deck ever, then thought better of it
Realm Razer has a cool interaction with Kederekt Leviathan. If you stick the Leviathan, then play a Realm Razer, you have a 5/5 and a 4/2 and they have no board and no lands. They could get out of it by playing a land or 2 and removing your Realm Razer, but whatever.
Alternately, you can Tooth and Nail for them both, then stack your triggers right (Razer on bottom, Leviathan on top). Leviathan resolves, all non-land permanents get bounced. THAT triggers Razer's "leaves play" ability, which is now on top of the stack. It does nothing, since no lands are exiled to return to play. Finally, Razer's ETB trigger resolves and all lands get exiled. Leaving you with a 5/5 and everyone else with an empty board. No permanents at all.
If any were interested in a Budget token/warp world deck, I used the base of my budget deck (land search creatures/elfball) and switched up to a more token theme. This allows for more benefit with Hellrider and Craterhoof Behemoth. It also allows for much more clamp fodder.
In the web of war won't give anything off of a Warp world haste, but any tokens that stuff creates will come in kicking. Fervor and be added in as an extra haste outlet.
The deck has alternate wins in elfball strategies with Imperious perfect and extra elf generators, or in Kessig Cagebreakers. Both build off of the original theme.
$4 and change in extra budget allow substitutions with other powerful cards, and even almost a Sarkhan Vol ($12), who would enjoy the warp and dragon options, as well as mass tokens.
cost = $45.62 with my usual Riku cheatery of discounting everything in the original precon. The four cards add about $16-17 to the total, and Riku a bit less than $2. Say about $63-$64 total with no cheatery. All the cards are easily replaced within their own categories (eg. Greaves -> Whispersilk cloak (.25), Sol Ring -> Wayfarer's bauble, etc.)
Right after the discussion about him reminding me to make this deck. For shame. Yeah, he could squeeze in there, though he's a bit narrow in the scope of how the deck turned out.
true but if they hit even 5 lands off the warp (which they should) that's 15 damage each player, also nice when they pop a fetch having to take 4 damage each unless they wait til next turn where they have to take 3 to make a land drop.
fetches don't do any damage unless they need the mana immediately, they can crack it on an off turn and save themselves all the pain. It is, as always, great warp tech, which should be considered in any list with warp in it. I'm just focusing more on the tokens, and warp is being used as token support/board clearing.
Reiterate can also be added to the warp set, as you can then warp your opponents' boards to nothing, while increasing your own position. This gets even stronger with such effects as Warstorm Surge/Pandemonium.
I'll see about putting Warp-specific notes in, but the problem with going budget is the lack of available tutors for it.
I would also consider adding the new Archeomancer and friends to the list then to recur the warp. They whiff on the Reiterated copies, but who cares about that. The problem there is that a warp deck wants to be spell light, so they'll often end up being dead cards outside of warp. With a few tutors though, it may be acceptable.
Plans + Scroll and Drift could make the deck warp acceptable. Drift can also get Reiterate.
I'd pull Day of the dragons, and some of the alternate threat options for it. The new archeaomancer and Archivist can then also be added, probably fairly safely.
Let's see, about 5 cards to add in, so... Day out, and... Creeping Renaissance, Centaur Rootcaster, and Imperious Perfect, and 1 more something probably. Perfect out adds some extra budget room for a real tutor as well, or another mass token producer like Avenger, Hermit, or Baloths as well.
Truthfully, those can be swapped now, but I went with perfect to support the optional elf strategy (eggs in one basket thing), as well as wanting a lower curve.
Likewise, Zealous Conscripts makes good Warp fodder, and doubles as great tech in a pod chain (can skip the 5 slot*).
*with Kiki-jiki in your deck you can go infinite and win off a previous turn 4 drop+copy, by podding into Conscripts, untapping pod, and then podding into Kiki.
Point, I just followed the link and saw the FTV price. Mystical is at 4.70 (mirage), which makes it acceptable, allowing you to cut the elf for it.
I'd almost keep long-term over the scroll, since with the scroll you have to tutor for the mystical first (that stupid blue restriction), which makes it amount to a 3 cost anyways. Having the plans in also lets you run the drift, which double as a Reiterate tutor, which can be good. Otherwise I'd use Dizzy Spell as that can then get the Mystical, as well as Skullclamp, and the other utility 1 drops (which this deck has less of than my initial budget version, but still decent plan of action).
So yeah, the above changes, plus this, make a viable budget more-warp centered deck.
If you can fit a slot for some warp tutors, I'd say do it. The math is way in your favor. If you're swapping one permanent for one non-permanent that tutors for warp, then you can play with (essentially) 2 warp worlds instead of one, while having one measly less permanent for when a warp goes off. What's the good of having an artificially high permanent count if you never actually get the warp off, right?
Side note: screw the warp world phenomena in Planechase 2. UGHGHGHGHGH SO MUCH WORK
Goblin Marshall-->Wolfbriar Elemental? Scales a lot better at the higher mana costs you're considering here. Much higher ceiling with Wirewood Channeler and friends.
Masked Admirers-->?? Honestly SOMETHING in blue has to better than this I feel like, for draws. Maybe it just proves I don't know jack about elf tribal but I feel like you are paying too much mana to draw cards with this. Maybe this is where you want your Archaeomancer... or anything else, really. I'd play FTK before this.
Centaur Rootcaster-->?? Is this guy actually good? I see him in these budget decks you've offered up and I just don't know what to make of it. We have a 2/2 that does nothing when he enters play and has no synergy with elves that I know of, and no ways that I can see to get him through via trample or unblockable or whatever. I'm trying to think of something more impactful in his place but I'm floundering a bit here. It's the end of my workday and I'm out of brain.
Cagebreakers is gonna be so sick in the deck. Love the Fauna Shaman/Anger haste support.
If you can fit a slot for some warp tutors, I'd say do it. The math is way in your favor. If you're swapping one permanent for one non-permanent that tutors for warp, then you can play with (essentially) 2 warp worlds instead of one, while having one measly less permanent for when a warp goes off. What's the good of having an artificially high permanent count if you never actually get the warp off, right?
Side note: screw the warp world phenomena in Planechase 2. UGHGHGHGHGH SO MUCH WORK
Goblin Marshall-->Wolfbriar Elemental? Scales a lot better at the higher mana costs you're considering here. Much higher ceiling with Wirewood Channeler and friends.
Masked Admirers-->?? Honestly SOMETHING in blue has to better than this I feel like, for draws. Maybe it just proves I don't know jack about elf tribal but I feel like you are paying too much mana to draw cards with this. Maybe this is where you want your Archaeomancer... or anything else, really. I'd play FTK before this.
Centaur Rootcaster-->?? Is this guy actually good? I see him in these budget decks you've offered up and I just don't know what to make of it. We have a 2/2 that does nothing when he enters play and has no synergy with elves that I know of, and no ways that I can see to get him through via trample or unblockable or whatever. I'm trying to think of something more impactful in his place but I'm floundering a bit here. It's the end of my workday and I'm out of brain.
Cagebreakers is gonna be so sick in the deck. Love the Fauna Shaman/Anger haste support.
So, the initial idea was a budget list, with a larger token focus (started from when you were talking about Deranged Hermit, who sadly, is a bit expensive). Warp World got slotted in as a card that plays well with tokens; 3 slots were given at first, being Warp, Crater, and Day of the Dragons. Baru got slotted after, as an extra pump/trample that can play very nicely off a warp. You can certainly add a heavier warp focus, but that may detract from other win options. Not necessarily a bad thing, though if an extra win option, like the elves, only takes one slot and adds value to a large selection of cards, I think it's worth it. There are definitely other cuts that can be made for the Warp plays though.
Goblin Warmarshall was chosen because I was looking for another 6 drop for the pod chain. I didn't want to flood the options, but I wanted a variety of token producers on the 6, for the Craterhoof play on the 8. I thought a 3-2-1 split on the 6-7-8 costs might be heavy, but capable of working. The marshall also plays decent with pod (though not excellent due to sorcery speed on the pod), and gives a lot of bodies to play with. Goblins are also relevant for a Siege-Gang Commander pod on the 5, and the bodies for the chancellor play on the 7. The 6 slots were allocated to fast tokens (warmarshall), slow tokens (spider), and oh dear god I need an answer (hellkite). Wolfbriar Elemental plays nicely with the mana, but from my other budget deck, I've never had an issue being not tapped out. Admittedly, this deck is a bit shorter on the card advantage. Wolfbriar does not play well with coming off a pod, or off a warp.
Masked Admirers have a lot going for them. A simple cantrip may not look like much, but with Riku, they get you 2 cards net between them. Add to this a decently aggressive early game body, and they are a solid all around creature. The built in recursion is where they shine though. Even if you get blown out somehow, you can play Riku to recover them, and then rebuild from scratch. They should never be underestimated.
Centaur Rootcaster... is an effect I've been testing for a while. There's usually someone who's open, or who you can afford to hit. If you're attacking with other things too, especially lots of them, or bigger ones, it's hard for your opponents to justify blocking them, even though they know you'll get a land. All in all, I haven't ever been super-excited to see them, but I haven't been sad either. Easy to fill a spot, easy cut to make a spot. They're spot-on, solidly average. Take em or leave em at your preference. Probably weaker for the warp play. Easily one of the first cards I'd cut if I needed room, as seen by my earlier comments. Partially they're in since I was using my other budget deck as a skeleton.
Hey Sonik, Proteus Staff isn't in the Primer's artifact set. What do you think of Blue's older cousin to Birthing Pod?
I usually like staff in a creature-light deck, as you can then use it to stack the library and abuse ETB triggers at the same time, but with Riku doubling up what you get, you get advantage every activation. You can also ship tokens to the bottom to leave your creatures available for recursion, or ship a creature to the bottom to pull it back out with pod. It can also be used offensively as a tuck for a problematic creature/general.
Hey Sonik, Proteus Staff isn't in the Primer's artifact set. What do you think of Blue's older cousin to Birthing Pod?
It should be in there and it's a complete oversight. I actually run it in the budget toolbox version. I wish I could play it in my powered list but my inner Spike just won't let me, even though it has so much synergy with things like Pod and Sneak Attack, and you can use it defensively to boot. You can't ask for more from a 3-mana artifact. I might make room for it one of these days on sheer will power alone.
I'll add it shortly. In short, I love the card. (EDIT: Done, and pretty-fied!)
RE: your updates... Just a thought but in my Thromok deck I recently replaced Creeping Renaissance with Skullmulcher and I haven't looked back. Would that be something your elf ramp/threat suite would be interested in?
Seems pretty playable. A 1-mana cantrip almost guaranteed to get a creature? I would think, mathmatecally speaking, this would be a good card if you were likely to see more than one creature in your top 5 cards. That way you had a chance to improve your card quality based on the situation, rather than just cantripping for a random creature.
So if you are playing 20 creatures, then the top five should yield approximately one creature. It you are playing 30 creatures, the top five should yield 1.5 creatures. It goes up from there. So basically, unless you're in the 25-30+ range for creatures, and probably more like 30+, then I could see it being good, especially once you add Riku's copy ability to the equation.
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StaffRetired EDH - Tibor and Lumia | [PR]Nemata |Ramirez dePietro | [C]Edric | Riku | Jenara | Lazav | Heliod | Daxos | Roon | Kozilek
Edit: @SuperSonik: Didn't see your reply the first time, for some reason. I've been having doubts about Force of Will, to be honest. As awesome of a card as it is and as much as I love it, you may be right in that it doesn't belong in a tricolor deck. I'm considering building a V-Clique 1v1 French Banlist EDH deck, maybe I can use it there. Can I Skullclamp tokens and draw cards from them? I think they hit the graveyard before being exiled, right? And I think I'll stay with SoFaI for now, but I do own SoFaF if it doesn't work out. Hell, if I can make room I'll run both of them.
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StaffYes, tokens go to the graveyard and will trigger any appropriate abilities. They are then removed as a State Based Action the next time SBA are checked.
With as creature heavy as you are, I would toss a bone to Light and Shadow over Fire and Ice. They both give +1 CA, but where FaI gives you a card value of unknown value, which averages to the average value of the deck, LaS will always give you a card value equal to the best card in your graveyard. With all of the special creatures you run, this is valuable. Also, LaS gives a better set of protections. White and Black have more prevalent single-target removals, and are more likely to see creatures in those colors (following green) before red and blue creatures, in general.
Retired EDH - Tibor and Lumia | [PR]Nemata |Ramirez dePietro | [C]Edric | Riku | Jenara | Lazav | Heliod | Daxos | Roon | Kozilek
You know, another way to keep the gas coming for this deck is to play a bounce outlet or two. Crystal Shard is a favorite of mine for how cheap it is and because of its utility against other players. And now you are getting into soft lock territory with Muse, bounce outlet and Mystic Snake, countering a player every turn. It's really good with Venser too. If you want to add it to your stable of counters, consider cutting Cryptic Command (or Force). UUU is no gimmie and it doesn't interact well with other creature cards in your deck. You can't sac it to Birthing Pod when you're done with it or pitch it to survival.
Sword of Light and Shadow does help with this too, of course. I play it as well.
Regrowth is better than Restock. It's nice and cheap and easily copied, and it doesn't get exiled so Snapcaster can reuse it.
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I'm still a fan of Cryptic, since it can do so many things, be copied, and cantrip. I am planning on getting the old dual lands despite my initial hesitance, so the UUU should be easier to get. And yeah, agreed on Regrowth. Initially I wanted to run Restock instead of Regrowth because I didn't see the exiling effect at the end, but that's definitely a dealbreaker. Once I get all the cards I ordered and make some trades tonight, I'll post the new list. Thanks for all the suggestions, guys.
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OOH I should give that guy a mention. That's a killer find.
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Alternately, you can Tooth and Nail for them both, then stack your triggers right (Razer on bottom, Leviathan on top). Leviathan resolves, all non-land permanents get bounced. THAT triggers Razer's "leaves play" ability, which is now on top of the stack. It does nothing, since no lands are exiled to return to play. Finally, Razer's ETB trigger resolves and all lands get exiled. Leaving you with a 5/5 and everyone else with an empty board. No permanents at all.
Janky but why not
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StaffIn the web of war won't give anything off of a Warp world haste, but any tokens that stuff creates will come in kicking. Fervor and be added in as an extra haste outlet.
In the web of war, Baru, fist of krosa, Hellrider and Craterhoof Behemoth all make the tokens deadly. Most can be tutored via pod/shaman. Day of the Dragons works as well, and is killer with Web of War.
The deck has alternate wins in elfball strategies with Imperious perfect and extra elf generators, or in Kessig Cagebreakers. Both build off of the original theme.
$4 and change in extra budget allow substitutions with other powerful cards, and even almost a Sarkhan Vol ($12), who would enjoy the warp and dragon options, as well as mass tokens.
5 Riku of two Reflections
Creature (ramp) = 14
2 Quirion Elves - .17
2 Heart Warden - .15
3 Silhana Starfletcher - .12
3 Elvish Archdruid - 1.13
3 Elvish Harbinger - 1.20
4 Wirewood Channeler - .99
2 Viridian Emissary - .19
2 Coiling Oracle - .37
3 Farhaven Elf - .19
3 Yavimaya Dryad - .26
3 Wood elves - .23
4 Quirion Trailblazer - .12
4 Centaur Rootcaster - .13
4 Ondu Giant - .11
Creatures (draw) = 7
2 Elvish Visionary - .15
2 Fauna Shaman - 3.39
3 Edric, Spymaster of Trest - IN PRECON
3 Trinket Mage - .24
4 Masked Admirers - .54
5 Mulldrifter - .36
6 Soul of the Harvest - .47
1 Sylvan Safekeeper - .70
2 Wirewood Hivemaster - 1.02
3 Imperious Perfect - 5.00
3 Viridian Corrupter - .20
3 Viridian Shaman - .24
4 Anger - .69
4 Beetleback Chief - .91
4 Clone - .40
4 Hellrider - 2.72
4 Lys Alana Huntmaster - .35
5 Acidic Slime - .19
5 baru, fist of krosa - .58
5 Caldera Hellion - .34
5 Indrik Stomphowler - .26
5 Kessig Cagebreakers - .54
5 Siege-Gang Commander - 1.28
6 Dragonlair Spider - .65
6 Goblin Marshal - .65
6 Steel Hellkite - .61
7 Chancellor of the Forge - .33
7 Myr Battlesphere - .78
8 Craterhoof Behemoth - 2.93
5 Creeping Renaissance - .30
8 Warp World - .30
Artifact = 7
1 Sol ring - IN PRECON
1 Skullclamp - 2.29
2 Genesis Chamber - .94
2 Lightning Greaves - IN PRECON
3 Crystal Shard - .49
4 Birthing Pod - 3.22
5 Citanul Flute - .67
Enchantment = 6
3 Fecundity - .69
3 Fires of Yavimaya - .95
4 Parallel lives - 1.65
4 coastal piracy - .37
5 In the Web of War - .56
7 Day of the Dragons - 1.31
Planeswalker = 1
4 Garruk Wildspeaker - IN PRECON
Lands = 40
15 Forest
14 Island
11 Mountain
cost = $45.62 with my usual Riku cheatery of discounting everything in the original precon. The four cards add about $16-17 to the total, and Riku a bit less than $2. Say about $63-$64 total with no cheatery. All the cards are easily replaced within their own categories (eg. Greaves -> Whispersilk cloak (.25), Sol Ring -> Wayfarer's bauble, etc.)
Not in deck (cost):
6 Rampaging Baloths
7 Avenger of Zendikar
7 Regal Force
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StaffReiterate can also be added to the warp set, as you can then warp your opponents' boards to nothing, while increasing your own position. This gets even stronger with such effects as Warstorm Surge/Pandemonium.
I'll see about putting Warp-specific notes in, but the problem with going budget is the lack of available tutors for it.
Mystical Tutor is $8.73
Gamble is $7.34
Long-term plans is acceptable at $.41 (and you can merchant scroll for it at $1.14, or transmute Drift of Phatasms for $.19)
I would also consider adding the new Archeomancer and friends to the list then to recur the warp. They whiff on the Reiterated copies, but who cares about that. The problem there is that a warp deck wants to be spell light, so they'll often end up being dead cards outside of warp. With a few tutors though, it may be acceptable.
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StaffI'd pull Day of the dragons, and some of the alternate threat options for it. The new archeaomancer and Archivist can then also be added, probably fairly safely.
Let's see, about 5 cards to add in, so... Day out, and... Creeping Renaissance, Centaur Rootcaster, and Imperious Perfect, and 1 more something probably. Perfect out adds some extra budget room for a real tutor as well, or another mass token producer like Avenger, Hermit, or Baloths as well.
Truthfully, those can be swapped now, but I went with perfect to support the optional elf strategy (eggs in one basket thing), as well as wanting a lower curve.
Likewise, Zealous Conscripts makes good Warp fodder, and doubles as great tech in a pod chain (can skip the 5 slot*).
*with Kiki-jiki in your deck you can go infinite and win off a previous turn 4 drop+copy, by podding into Conscripts, untapping pod, and then podding into Kiki.
Retired EDH - Tibor and Lumia | [PR]Nemata |Ramirez dePietro | [C]Edric | Riku | Jenara | Lazav | Heliod | Daxos | Roon | Kozilek
mystical is online for 4 bucks ;D
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StaffPoint, I just followed the link and saw the FTV price. Mystical is at 4.70 (mirage), which makes it acceptable, allowing you to cut the elf for it.
I'd almost keep long-term over the scroll, since with the scroll you have to tutor for the mystical first (that stupid blue restriction), which makes it amount to a 3 cost anyways. Having the plans in also lets you run the drift, which double as a Reiterate tutor, which can be good. Otherwise I'd use Dizzy Spell as that can then get the Mystical, as well as Skullclamp, and the other utility 1 drops (which this deck has less of than my initial budget version, but still decent plan of action).
So yeah, the above changes, plus this, make a viable budget more-warp centered deck.
Retired EDH - Tibor and Lumia | [PR]Nemata |Ramirez dePietro | [C]Edric | Riku | Jenara | Lazav | Heliod | Daxos | Roon | Kozilek
Side note: screw the warp world phenomena in Planechase 2. UGHGHGHGHGH SO MUCH WORK
Goblin Marshall-->Wolfbriar Elemental? Scales a lot better at the higher mana costs you're considering here. Much higher ceiling with Wirewood Channeler and friends.
Masked Admirers-->?? Honestly SOMETHING in blue has to better than this I feel like, for draws. Maybe it just proves I don't know jack about elf tribal but I feel like you are paying too much mana to draw cards with this. Maybe this is where you want your Archaeomancer... or anything else, really. I'd play FTK before this.
Centaur Rootcaster-->?? Is this guy actually good? I see him in these budget decks you've offered up and I just don't know what to make of it. We have a 2/2 that does nothing when he enters play and has no synergy with elves that I know of, and no ways that I can see to get him through via trample or unblockable or whatever. I'm trying to think of something more impactful in his place but I'm floundering a bit here. It's the end of my workday and I'm out of brain.
Cagebreakers is gonna be so sick in the deck. Love the Fauna Shaman/Anger haste support.
:symu::symr: Melek WheelStorm
:symw::symg: Trostani Enchantress (updated 6/5)
:symg::symr::symu: Unexpected Results.dec
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StaffSo, the initial idea was a budget list, with a larger token focus (started from when you were talking about Deranged Hermit, who sadly, is a bit expensive). Warp World got slotted in as a card that plays well with tokens; 3 slots were given at first, being Warp, Crater, and Day of the Dragons. Baru got slotted after, as an extra pump/trample that can play very nicely off a warp. You can certainly add a heavier warp focus, but that may detract from other win options. Not necessarily a bad thing, though if an extra win option, like the elves, only takes one slot and adds value to a large selection of cards, I think it's worth it. There are definitely other cuts that can be made for the Warp plays though.
Goblin Warmarshall was chosen because I was looking for another 6 drop for the pod chain. I didn't want to flood the options, but I wanted a variety of token producers on the 6, for the Craterhoof play on the 8. I thought a 3-2-1 split on the 6-7-8 costs might be heavy, but capable of working. The marshall also plays decent with pod (though not excellent due to sorcery speed on the pod), and gives a lot of bodies to play with. Goblins are also relevant for a Siege-Gang Commander pod on the 5, and the bodies for the chancellor play on the 7. The 6 slots were allocated to fast tokens (warmarshall), slow tokens (spider), and oh dear god I need an answer (hellkite). Wolfbriar Elemental plays nicely with the mana, but from my other budget deck, I've never had an issue being not tapped out. Admittedly, this deck is a bit shorter on the card advantage. Wolfbriar does not play well with coming off a pod, or off a warp.
Masked Admirers have a lot going for them. A simple cantrip may not look like much, but with Riku, they get you 2 cards net between them. Add to this a decently aggressive early game body, and they are a solid all around creature. The built in recursion is where they shine though. Even if you get blown out somehow, you can play Riku to recover them, and then rebuild from scratch. They should never be underestimated.
Centaur Rootcaster... is an effect I've been testing for a while. There's usually someone who's open, or who you can afford to hit. If you're attacking with other things too, especially lots of them, or bigger ones, it's hard for your opponents to justify blocking them, even though they know you'll get a land. All in all, I haven't ever been super-excited to see them, but I haven't been sad either. Easy to fill a spot, easy cut to make a spot. They're spot-on, solidly average. Take em or leave em at your preference. Probably weaker for the warp play. Easily one of the first cards I'd cut if I needed room, as seen by my earlier comments. Partially they're in since I was using my other budget deck as a skeleton.
Don't forget the anger/pod Cagebreaker support =D
Retired EDH - Tibor and Lumia | [PR]Nemata |Ramirez dePietro | [C]Edric | Riku | Jenara | Lazav | Heliod | Daxos | Roon | Kozilek
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Staff5 Riku of two Reflections
Creature (ramp) = 13
2 Heart Warden - .15
2 Quirion Elves - .17
3 Elvish Archdruid - 1.13
3 Elvish Harbinger - 1.20
3 Silhana Starfletcher - .12
4 Wirewood Channeler - .99
2 Viridian Emissary - .19
2 Coiling Oracle - .37
3 Farhaven Elf - .19
3 Yavimaya Dryad - .26
3 Wood elves - .23
4 Quirion Trailblazer - .12
4 Ondu Giant - .11
Creatures (draw) = 6
2 Elvish Visionary - .15
2 Fauna Shaman - 3.39
3 Edric, Spymaster of Trest - IN PRECON
4 Masked Admirers - .54
5 Mulldrifter - .36
6 Soul of the Harvest - .47
Creatures (threat/answer) = 20
1 Sylvan Safekeeper - .70
2 Tunnel Ignus - .29
2 Wirewood Hivemaster - 1.02
3 Imperious Perfect - 5.00
3 Viridian Corrupter - .20
3 Viridian Shaman - .24
4 Anger - .69
4 Beetleback Chief - .91
4 Hellrider - 2.72
4 Lys Alana Huntmaster - .35
5 Acidic Slime - .19
5 baru, fist of krosa - .58
5 Indrik Stomphowler - .26
5 Kessig Cagebreakers - .54
5 Siege-Gang Commander - 1.28
5 Urabrask the hidden - 2.78
6 Dragonlair Spider - .65
6 Goblin Marshal - .65
7 Chancellor of the Forge - .33
8 Craterhoof Behemoth - 2.93
3 Drift of phantasms - .19
4 Archeomancer - ???
Sorcery = 2
5 Creeping Renaissance - .30
8 Warp World - .30
Instant = 2
1 Mystical tutor - 4.70
3 Long-term plans - .41
Artifact = 6
1 Skullclamp - 2.29
2 Genesis Chamber - .94
2 Lightning Greaves - IN PRECON
3 Crystal Shard - .49
4 Birthing Pod - 3.22
5 Citanul Flute - .67
Enchantment = 7
3 Fecundity - .69
3 Fires of Yavimaya - .95
4 Parallel lives - 1.65
4 coastal piracy - .37
5 In the Web of War - .56
6 Warstorm Surge - .32
7 Day of the Dragons - 1.31
Planeswalker = 1
4 Garruk Wildspeaker - IN PRECON
Lands = 40
15 Forest
14 Island
11 Mountain
in
Drift of phantasms, .19
mystical tutor, + 4.70
long-term plans, + .41
warstorm surge, +.32
urabrask the hidden, +2.78
archeomancer, + ??
tunnel ignus +.29
out
5 Caldera Hellion - .34
4 Centaur Rootcaster - .13
1 Sol ring - 0
3 Trinket Mage - .24
4 Clone - .40
7 Myr Battlesphere - .78
6 Steel Hellkite - .61
cost = $51.81; a bit over my target, Urabrask can probably be cut...
Retired EDH - Tibor and Lumia | [PR]Nemata |Ramirez dePietro | [C]Edric | Riku | Jenara | Lazav | Heliod | Daxos | Roon | Kozilek
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StaffI usually like staff in a creature-light deck, as you can then use it to stack the library and abuse ETB triggers at the same time, but with Riku doubling up what you get, you get advantage every activation. You can also ship tokens to the bottom to leave your creatures available for recursion, or ship a creature to the bottom to pull it back out with pod. It can also be used offensively as a tuck for a problematic creature/general.
Retired EDH - Tibor and Lumia | [PR]Nemata |Ramirez dePietro | [C]Edric | Riku | Jenara | Lazav | Heliod | Daxos | Roon | Kozilek
Sig and Avatar Credit: Heroes of the Plane Studios
It should be in there and it's a complete oversight. I actually run it in the budget toolbox version. I wish I could play it in my powered list but my inner Spike just won't let me, even though it has so much synergy with things like Pod and Sneak Attack, and you can use it defensively to boot. You can't ask for more from a 3-mana artifact. I might make room for it one of these days on sheer will power alone.
I'll add it shortly. In short, I love the card. (EDIT: Done, and pretty-fied!)
RE: your updates... Just a thought but in my Thromok deck I recently replaced Creeping Renaissance with Skullmulcher and I haven't looked back. Would that be something your elf ramp/threat suite would be interested in?
Seems pretty playable. A 1-mana cantrip almost guaranteed to get a creature? I would think, mathmatecally speaking, this would be a good card if you were likely to see more than one creature in your top 5 cards. That way you had a chance to improve your card quality based on the situation, rather than just cantripping for a random creature.
So if you are playing 20 creatures, then the top five should yield approximately one creature. It you are playing 30 creatures, the top five should yield 1.5 creatures. It goes up from there. So basically, unless you're in the 25-30+ range for creatures, and probably more like 30+, then I could see it being good, especially once you add Riku's copy ability to the equation.
:symu::symr: Melek WheelStorm
:symw::symg: Trostani Enchantress (updated 6/5)
:symg::symr::symu: Unexpected Results.dec