But is Ram-Gang any more solid of a threat than Burning-Tree Shaman, Giant Solifuge, or Shivan Wurm? I've seen the Shivan Wurm do some pretty amazing things with the gating ability. See Flametongue Kavu, Avalanche Riders, Siege-Gang Commander, Uktabi Orangutan, Deranged Hermit, Kitchen Finks, Murderous Redcap, the list goes on. I've already got BTS in the Gruul 3 slot, which can cause lots of headaches to control/combo players. Wizards needs to print a RG wither creature with regenerate :-/.
Not to sound like I'm disagreeing, just trying to play devil's advocate.
Man, typing all this made me realize that I like Ram-Gang too. I guess I could always just keep things the way they are and replace one of my mono-red creatures with Kird Ape. We'll see.
Orim's Thunder has been good in my Cube. Destroying two cards with one is always good times.
Cheers,
rant
Yes. Akroma's Vengeance is the nuts (cycling is Pro) and Orim's Thunder is a more effective 2 for 1 than Return to Dust IMO (which may only have 1 legit target when it's played anyways...):-/
So I've managed to work up the nerve to up the cube to 540 cards to make 12 man drafts possible and increase the variability in the cube. Also this will help to bring down the incredibly high current power level to a more manageable state. I haven't got all of the cards yet, but I have a good start and a pretty good direction. Let me know if anything stands out as particularly funny...
*Note: I will be trying to keep to the same overall 50/50 creature:non-creature ratio.
*EDIT: I have changed my mind to leave the cube @ 360 cards as it is now, except for the fact that I want to try to include some cards from the above list as well as a few others.
I don't have much cube drafting experience with white weenie. It seems to me that the Soltari Bros might be better for getting quick damage through, but the Knights seem more resilient and can block to boot.
If you can only run two, then I would choose the two Soltari guys. The near-unblockable in addition to relevant protection makes them pretty important for getting in damage long after 2/2 first strikers would be caught up in ground combat. Not saying the Knights are bad, but that in general the shadow creatures are better...
In a white weenie deck, the key is to get in damage with your guys before they wipe your board. I personally run all four of those cards, as I think they're all excellent. However, if I were to choose only two of them, I'd agree 100% with Kenny in that the two shadow guys are the two best.
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I would not cut Iwamori of the Open Fist as green is the weakest color in my opinion. It is very rare that his drawback applies. Green needs this fat creature.
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I would not cut Iwamori of the Open Fist as green is the weakest color in my opinion. It is very rare that his drawback applies. Green needs this fat creature.
This might be a cube dependant thing, but mine is packed with legendary creature cards, and Iwamori is a huge risk early to mid game.
I like Lotus Bloom better than Engineered Explosives.
Both do something really different and are not really comparable, but i feel like Explosives are often underwhelming in a similar fashion to Powder Keg.
Ya, you can't really compare the two. However, I don't find either the Explosives or the Keg to be underwhelming. The Engineered Explosives serves a very specific role that isn't covered by either the Keg, the Disk or the Stone. It's also really good with Trinket Mage (if you run it), and is a really good answer to token decks (like the Powder Keg). The Explosives is really good against white aggro, because even in a two-color deck the Explosives can remove 2 or 3 white creatures from the board.
I understand that the Lotus Bloom and Engineered Explosives aren't exactly comparable but no one really seems to be that excited by Bloom in my experience.
Powder Keg was too slow for us and was taken out. Both Keg and EE are great against tokens as described earlier, but I personally like EE a bit better since it can be tutored more readily via Trinket Mage. Also EE is more efficient for removal in the 1-3 CMC range as you don't have to wait two turns to kill off a Bob or Goyf, etc. However, chances are that EE will never reach 4 or 5, but I guess the same is true for Keg (you've probably already lost by that point).
The only others that i would consider cutting (to my dismay) from my artifact suite are:
I think that I am running a really tight ship at this point, it is incredibly hard to make cuts as pretty much everything has earned its place to some extent. See both Iwamori and Blastminer. The reason Iwamori is on the block is because in the last two sessions, he allowed an Akroma and an Oona to drop. Not exactly favorable. But on the other side of the coin, more often than not, he is simply a beast. I will deliberate this. Blastminer is good for nuking a Karoo or two but every once in a while he can hit a Maze of Ith or some other key card but is otherwise narrow about 75% of the time. Maybe Countryside Crusher would be a better cut. Most of the time he just kind of sits there.
I will consider the points brought up by the forum, thank you for your help.
I actually took both Engineered Explosives and Powder Keg out of my cube. I could see the case for adding the explosives back, but the key was terrible.
Also, do not cut Tangle Wire... it is very popular in my cube and causes many blowouts.
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I'd add Crystal Shard to your blue, maybe over Desertion. Personally, I do not like Iwamori of the Closed Fist as I consider him too risky though most of the time he is very good. Austere Command is more powerful than Akroma's Vengeance but I would rather have the Vengeance because it cycles. I might be valuing this wrongly however.
Austere Command is more powerful than Akroma's Vengeance but I would rather have the Vengeance because it cycles. I might be valuing this wrongly however.
I think the command can be more powerful than the Vengeance, but the fact that the Vengeance cycles does make it better. I think you valued the cards correctly.
Not to sound like I'm disagreeing, just trying to play devil's advocate.
Man, typing all this made me realize that I like Ram-Gang too. I guess I could always just keep things the way they are and replace one of my mono-red creatures with Kird Ape. We'll see.
Current EDH Decks:
G Multani, Maro-Sorcerer
B Xiahou Dun, the One-Eyed
GU Momir Vig, Simic Visionary
I also include discussions about cards we took out, cards we banned, and cards we might add.
other potential changes:
- Aven Riftwatcher
+ Academy Rector
- Heartwood Storyteller
+ Nantuko Vigilante
I feel like I need more artifact/enchantment hate in white. Currently I only have Oblivion Ring, Dismantling Blow and Austere Command as relevant removal, as well as Archon of Justice I suppose. Should try to squeeze in something else? Ronom Unicorn, Turn to Dust, Seal of Cleansing, etc.?
Current EDH Decks:
G Multani, Maro-Sorcerer
B Xiahou Dun, the One-Eyed
GU Momir Vig, Simic Visionary
Orim's Thunder has been good in my Cube. Destroying two cards with one is always good times.
Cheers,
rant
My Cube
CubeCobra: https://cubecobra.com/cube/overview/5f5d0310ed602310515d4c32
Cube Tutor: http://cubetutor.com/viewcube/1963
oh and I added Miraculous Recovery in the place of [CARDDismantling Blow[/card] when it was moved into the UW slot.
Orim's Thunder looks good too.
But I'm not sure if I want to include more white wrath effects. Keep in mind there are only 45 card cube and currently I have 5 or 1:9...
Balance
Wrath of God
Rout
Austere Command
Final Judgment
*edit: and I meant Return to Dust in the previous post.
***edit 2: cube list updated per changes 2/6/09
Current EDH Decks:
G Multani, Maro-Sorcerer
B Xiahou Dun, the One-Eyed
GU Momir Vig, Simic Visionary
Yes. Akroma's Vengeance is the nuts (cycling is Pro) and Orim's Thunder is a more effective 2 for 1 than Return to Dust IMO (which may only have 1 legit target when it's played anyways...):-/
My 630 Card Powered Cube
My Article - "Cube Design Philosophy"
My Article - "Mana Short: A study in limited resource management."
My 50th Set (P)review - Discusses my top 20 Cube cards from OTJ!
*Note: I will be trying to keep to the same overall 50/50 creature:non-creature ratio.
*EDIT: I have changed my mind to leave the cube @ 360 cards as it is now, except for the fact that I want to try to include some cards from the above list as well as a few others.
Namely:
Current EDH Decks:
G Multani, Maro-Sorcerer
B Xiahou Dun, the One-Eyed
GU Momir Vig, Simic Visionary
I don't have much cube drafting experience with white weenie. It seems to me that the Soltari Bros might be better for getting quick damage through, but the Knights seem more resilient and can block to boot.
Current EDH Decks:
G Multani, Maro-Sorcerer
B Xiahou Dun, the One-Eyed
GU Momir Vig, Simic Visionary
If you can only run two, then I would choose the two Soltari guys. The near-unblockable in addition to relevant protection makes them pretty important for getting in damage long after 2/2 first strikers would be caught up in ground combat. Not saying the Knights are bad, but that in general the shadow creatures are better...
(list not current)
My Cube Google Docs Spreadsheet: https://spreadsheets.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AibgWfz0ukmOdDNhOHlucjcxUi1wVy00NDhLbDUtUlE&hl=en_US#gid=8
(list is always current)
I also include discussions about cards we took out, cards we banned, and cards we might add.
Cheers,
rant
My Cube
CubeCobra: https://cubecobra.com/cube/overview/5f5d0310ed602310515d4c32
Cube Tutor: http://cubetutor.com/viewcube/1963
My 630 Card Powered Cube
My Article - "Cube Design Philosophy"
My Article - "Mana Short: A study in limited resource management."
My 50th Set (P)review - Discusses my top 20 Cube cards from OTJ!
I am thinking...
-1 Condemn (somewhat conditional)
+1 Path to Exile
-1 Ranger of Eos (not enough relevant 1-drops by the time he sees play)
+1 Battlegrace Angel
-1 Chittering Rats (not incredible)
+1 Mesmeric Fiend
-1 Buried Alive (not enough support cards @ 360 cards)
+1 Sarcomancy
-1 Dwarven Blastminer (not enough targets to make him outstanding)
+1 Slith Firewalker
-1 Molten Disaster (trip red is very hard to pull off unless in mono red)
+1 Banefire
-1 Browbeat (replacement with a strictly better card)
+1 Wheel of Fortune
-1 Uktabi Orangutan (good but not as good as ol' stompy)
+1 Indrik Stomphowler
-1 Iwamori of the Open Fist (can be a kick in the pants if you are not careful)
+1 Silvos, Rogue Elemental
-1 Lotus Bloom (underwhelming)
+1 Engineered Explosives
Current EDH Decks:
G Multani, Maro-Sorcerer
B Xiahou Dun, the One-Eyed
GU Momir Vig, Simic Visionary
My 630 Card Powered Cube
My Article - "Cube Design Philosophy"
My Article - "Mana Short: A study in limited resource management."
My 50th Set (P)review - Discusses my top 20 Cube cards from OTJ!
I also include discussions about cards we took out, cards we banned, and cards we might add.
This might be a cube dependant thing, but mine is packed with legendary creature cards, and Iwamori is a huge risk early to mid game.
Ya, you can't really compare the two. However, I don't find either the Explosives or the Keg to be underwhelming. The Engineered Explosives serves a very specific role that isn't covered by either the Keg, the Disk or the Stone. It's also really good with Trinket Mage (if you run it), and is a really good answer to token decks (like the Powder Keg). The Explosives is really good against white aggro, because even in a two-color deck the Explosives can remove 2 or 3 white creatures from the board.
My 630 Card Powered Cube
My Article - "Cube Design Philosophy"
My Article - "Mana Short: A study in limited resource management."
My 50th Set (P)review - Discusses my top 20 Cube cards from OTJ!
Powder Keg was too slow for us and was taken out. Both Keg and EE are great against tokens as described earlier, but I personally like EE a bit better since it can be tutored more readily via Trinket Mage. Also EE is more efficient for removal in the 1-3 CMC range as you don't have to wait two turns to kill off a Bob or Goyf, etc. However, chances are that EE will never reach 4 or 5, but I guess the same is true for Keg (you've probably already lost by that point).
The only others that i would consider cutting (to my dismay) from my artifact suite are:
Altar of Dementia
Tangle Wire
I think that I am running a really tight ship at this point, it is incredibly hard to make cuts as pretty much everything has earned its place to some extent. See both Iwamori and Blastminer. The reason Iwamori is on the block is because in the last two sessions, he allowed an Akroma and an Oona to drop. Not exactly favorable. But on the other side of the coin, more often than not, he is simply a beast. I will deliberate this. Blastminer is good for nuking a Karoo or two but every once in a while he can hit a Maze of Ith or some other key card but is otherwise narrow about 75% of the time. Maybe Countryside Crusher would be a better cut. Most of the time he just kind of sits there.
I will consider the points brought up by the forum, thank you for your help.
Current EDH Decks:
G Multani, Maro-Sorcerer
B Xiahou Dun, the One-Eyed
GU Momir Vig, Simic Visionary
Also, do not cut Tangle Wire... it is very popular in my cube and causes many blowouts.
I also include discussions about cards we took out, cards we banned, and cards we might add.
My 630 Card Powered Cube
My Article - "Cube Design Philosophy"
My Article - "Mana Short: A study in limited resource management."
My 50th Set (P)review - Discusses my top 20 Cube cards from OTJ!
oh believe me i know, that is why i would have hated to cut it
Current EDH Decks:
G Multani, Maro-Sorcerer
B Xiahou Dun, the One-Eyed
GU Momir Vig, Simic Visionary
Oh, I misunderstood. I thought you were planning on cutting it. Good to see that it's staying.
My 630 Card Powered Cube
My Article - "Cube Design Philosophy"
My Article - "Mana Short: A study in limited resource management."
My 50th Set (P)review - Discusses my top 20 Cube cards from OTJ!
I think the command can be more powerful than the Vengeance, but the fact that the Vengeance cycles does make it better. I think you valued the cards correctly.
My 630 Card Powered Cube
My Article - "Cube Design Philosophy"
My Article - "Mana Short: A study in limited resource management."
My 50th Set (P)review - Discusses my top 20 Cube cards from OTJ!