So, the hot new deck had been nissa elves. It plays very much like the pre zendikar elfball lists. It cranks out a bunch of elves, and then uses overrun or eldrazi monument to win. As additional win conditions they have the nissa and the garruk. There are two different takes on the deck, one splashing white for path to deal with big creatures like baneslayer, and the approach which slpashes red for sarkhan, bolt, and bloodbraid. In the last report that I heard, three of these decks are in the top 8 of the Nashville 5k. This deck may be the next hot deck in standard, it apparently beats jund.
It's kind of hard to play like Pre-Zendikar elves since there is no combo piece to act anything like elf combo.
I don't see how this could beat Jund when an EOT Lightning Bolt or a next turn Blightning immediately ends Nissa. There also aren't enough playable elves in the format to ever try to run an elf deck.
This sounds like unsubstantiated rumors. I wanted Nissa to be good when she was first spoiled, but she's way too frail and there aren't near enough good Elves to warrant playing her.
Nissa won't be of much use until we have more sets, im certain the next two sets will have more elves and goblins as we get back to magic beat down. but not yet...I can't wait to see goblins, elves, jund, vamps, and artifact/eldrazi going at it
Elves are possible but beating jund sounds like a huge rumor. Jund is beatable yes but if your only removal is Bolt/Burst or PtE (and maybe journey to nowhere) your not going to get anywhere when they're playing Pulse and Bolt to destroy Nissa, after that they pretty much have an answer to everything else through terminate, bolt, and even pulse. Post board the matchup has to be worst, Jund has jund charm main boarded to clear out the early elf rush (Nissa's Chosen is your only hope if you dont' have a second Archdruid to keep things stable).
I'm not against the idea of the deck being good, but I dont' think the deck has an easy matchup against jund.
It's kind of hard to play like Pre-Zendikar elves since there is no combo piece to act anything like elf combo.
I don't see how this could beat Jund when an EOT Lightning Bolt or a next turn Blightning immediately ends Nissa. There also aren't enough playable elves in the format to ever try to run an elf deck.
This sounds like unsubstantiated rumors. I wanted Nissa to be good when she was first spoiled, but she's way too frail and there aren't near enough good Elves to warrant playing her.
Not a rumor.
I was at the SCG 5k, and I witnessed one of these Mono Green Elf decks go ultimate with Nissa at the round 7 feature match (these players were 6-0). The pilot ended up winning that match.
It's kind of hard to play like Pre-Zendikar elves since there is no combo piece to act anything like elf combo.
I don't see how this could beat Jund when an EOT Lightning Bolt or a next turn Blightning immediately ends Nissa. There also aren't enough playable elves in the format to ever try to run an elf deck.
This sounds like unsubstantiated rumors. I wanted Nissa to be good when she was first spoiled, but she's way too frail and there aren't near enough good Elves to warrant playing her.
it is beating Jund as we speak lol just because you dont see it doesnt change reality
it is beating Jund as we speak lol just because you dont see it doesnt change reality
To be fair, a guy with Aug 2009 join date and a postcount of 59 posted that elves was a hot new deck, and had no proof and didn't mention any of the things (like the 5k) that have been mentioned since. In addition, the matchup doesn't seem that good on paper at first glance. It's not unreasonable to be skeptical, and he even posted why he was skeptical.
To be fair, a guy with Aug 2009 join date and a postcount of 59 posted that elves was a hot new deck, and had no proof and didn't mention any of the things (like the 5k) that have been mentioned since. In addition, the matchup doesn't seem that good on paper at first glance. It's not unreasonable to be skeptical, and he even posted why he was skeptical.
Maybe. I think alot of people just really underestimate these tribal lords. ALot of decks look real bad on paper but play much better, for example i built a little goblin deck for fun and it dominates vampires 12-0 vs pro net decked vampires and it doesnt run any amazing tech, just really obvious goblins, I bet these elves lists are looking the same, probably maindecking GSS and all those elves that look bad on paper like Nissa's chosen and Elvish Visionary.
I noticed in draft that Nissa's Chosen is much better than you assume it is as a vanilla 2/3, but I thought that was just because it was draft.
And Eldrazi monument wins games by itself, ramping into it could be brutal vs alot of decks
I want to see how these elves lists are working, I bet they are completely different from how I am picturing them
Well, the guy who just joined in August plays lots of Magic, and does not invest all of his time on forums. Sorry. But, my friends at the 5k have been updating me all day, and the mono green elves have been winning games all day. Actually over the curse of this week, elves have been written about on channelfireball, and talked about intensly, because in a meta where volcaninc fallout and like effects that were existant in the day of black white tokens have all but vanished, why not drop 12 elves by turn 4, then overrun, no problem. Don't be so critical of people you don't know, because I know a lot about Magic to support an argument.
Well, the guy who just joined in August plays lots of Magic, and does not invest all of his time on forums. Sorry. But, my friends at the 5k have been updating me all day, and the mono green elves have been winning games all day. Actually over the curse of this week, elves have been written about on channelfireball, and talked about intensly, because in a meta where volcaninc fallout and like effects that were existant in the day of black white tokens have all but vanished, why not drop 12 elves by turn 4, then overrun, no problem. Don't be so critical of people you don't know, because I know a lot about Magic to support an argument.
Yeh i dont like when people judge others on forums because of low post count. I just have to ask how does the deck drop all those elves so early, what elves does it play?
Well, the guy who just joined in August plays lots of Magic, and does not invest all of his time on forums. Sorry. But, my friends at the 5k have been updating me all day, and the mono green elves have been winning games all day. Actually over the curse of this week, elves have been written about on channelfireball, and talked about intensly, because in a meta where volcaninc fallout and like effects that were existant in the day of black white tokens have all but vanished, why not drop 12 elves by turn 4, then overrun, no problem. Don't be so critical of people you don't know, because I know a lot about Magic to support an argument.
Uh.. get your panties in a bundle more. I wasn't attacking you, I was merely saying that people with low post counts and late join dates aren't immediately believed unless they have proof about something. I never said you didn't know what you were talking about or even that you were wrong.
Good god, the stupid is out tonight
And to stay on topic, I don't think this deck will stay on top because it's so easy to start mainboarding fallout and pyroclasm if it becomes an issue.
Uh.. get your panties in a bundle more. I wasn't attacking you, I was merely saying that people with low post counts and late join dates aren't immediately believed unless they have proof about something. I never said you didn't know what you were talking about or even that you were wrong.
Good god, the stupid is out tonight
And to stay on topic, I don't think this deck will stay on top because it's so easy to start mainboarding fallout and pyroclasm if it becomes an issue.
I don't get why anyone would attempt to "trick" someone into thinking a deck is good. THAT would be stupid; I guess Magic is serious, serious business.
Being skeptical is fine, but calling someone a liar (or, rather, a con) because you think the deck sucks is just plain ********.
There's a nissa thread in developing that has been getting a bit of traffic. I posted early on my skepticism that the deck was any good. And even if the concept was okay that Nissa herself was garbage. But the thread stuck around (unlike so many else there) so there must be something to it.
From what I understand, the combo is Nissa + Eldrazi. The testing in the thread indicated that indestructible creatures were a lot more valuable than the alternatives that just pumped them up.
That said, I can't imagine that deck being more successful than last season's elves, and I can't help but think that any success the deck had at the 5k was substantially due to misplay/misevaluation of a relatively unknown deck.
damn it doesnt run lotus cobra, that will just make the price go down even more
Maindecking the 4 GSS is what I thought would be a good idea, those guys destroy alot of decks and at worse are 3/3 for 3 which is good. Ive played decks like this only they run Sarkhan Vol-Sarkhan just seems to make the deck alot worse which didnt surprise me, he's a noob-timmy walker. Looks just like a really simple deck, decent CA with walkers and BBelf. Glad people will stop playing jund and Twilight.dec, twilight dies to swarm+GSS
I don't get why anyone would attempt to "trick" someone into thinking a deck is good. THAT would be stupid; I guess Magic is serious, serious business.
Being skeptical is fine, but calling someone a liar (or, rather, a con) because you think the deck sucks is just plain ********.
This. I also dont like when people who just netdeck pro jund or Twilight.dec lists always get defensive about their deck saying stuff like "hmmm seems like pulse, bolt and jund charm own your deck, these results must be lies"
I actually forgot about the idea. I would have to imagine that it does beat the crap out of Jund too. The synergy between the planeswalkers and Oran-Rief shouldn't be underestimated.
I remember trying to make it but then ended up having to scrap it because it just had no way to deal with fliers. It looks like the deck still doesn't but I guess it just wins fast enough.
I'm not real surprised. I've been playing with Oran Reif's in my GBW Cobra deck and Nissa's Chosen, Garruck Tokens, and Stags get pretty nasty with a +1/+1 counter on them. Garruck can occasionally add a second one with an untap. It's nice to have the stag up to 4/4 since it's out of bolt range and there's nothing Jund can do aside from hold back a Bloodbraid to block the stag. They flat lose to it.
Big fat dumb dudes get there against decks with piles of removal. Jund has a lot, but you can run them out when they can't sit back holding bolts to take care of planeswalkers.
I've tried the mono-G, G/R, Naya, but I still think my favorite is the G/W/B combination of fatties. At least we get to shove it in all the faces of the people who thought Nissa wan't any good.
My current Elf deck with Niss and garruk until the new sets come out:::: I just put this deck together like 30 minutes ago. Taking suggestions! :-D. Thanks.
My current Elf deck with Niss and garruk until the new sets come out:::: I just put this deck together like 30 minutes ago. Taking suggestions! :-D. Thanks.
GW does get you the Dauntless escort.. but I'd say that woodcrasher and cylian elves are really subpar choices. I'd prefer the Elvish Visionaries and Archdruids. The ramp (Khalni and Harrow) are unnecessary with archdruids.
Oh you play Nissa? Okay, make your Elf Dude, then bolt her.
you know you are 2-for-1-ed? and you wanna bolt the t1 Llanowar Elves. you wanna bolt Elvish Archdruid. you wanna bolt GSS. you wanna bolt Garruk. you wanna bolt Nissa's Chosen/Beast tokens in response to Oran-Rief activations. you are not going to have enough bolts.
you know you are 2-for-1-ed? and you wanna bolt the t1 Llanowar Elves. you wanna bolt Elvish Archdruid. you wanna bolt GSS. you wanna bolt Garruk. you wanna bolt Nissa's Chosen/Beast tokens in response to Oran-Rief activations. you are not going to have enough bolts.
Yep. A 2/3 elf + duress for 4 mana isn't too bad.
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I don't see how this could beat Jund when an EOT Lightning Bolt or a next turn Blightning immediately ends Nissa. There also aren't enough playable elves in the format to ever try to run an elf deck.
This sounds like unsubstantiated rumors. I wanted Nissa to be good when she was first spoiled, but she's way too frail and there aren't near enough good Elves to warrant playing her.
EDH:
W Eight-and-a-Half-Tails
GB Nath of the Gilt-Leaf
Gfast animals slow shildrenG
51-18-4 (retired as of 6-4-11)
I'm not against the idea of the deck being good, but I dont' think the deck has an easy matchup against jund.
There was once [The Pack], but no more.
Clearly the deck CAN beat Jund and IS really good... or maybe people were just unprepared for it
If it's not that easy to hate out it looks like it will be a real contender in the upcoming meta.
Not a rumor.
I was at the SCG 5k, and I witnessed one of these Mono Green Elf decks go ultimate with Nissa at the round 7 feature match (these players were 6-0). The pilot ended up winning that match.
it is beating Jund as we speak lol just because you dont see it doesnt change reality
To be fair, a guy with Aug 2009 join date and a postcount of 59 posted that elves was a hot new deck, and had no proof and didn't mention any of the things (like the 5k) that have been mentioned since. In addition, the matchup doesn't seem that good on paper at first glance. It's not unreasonable to be skeptical, and he even posted why he was skeptical.
L2 Judge
Maybe. I think alot of people just really underestimate these tribal lords. ALot of decks look real bad on paper but play much better, for example i built a little goblin deck for fun and it dominates vampires 12-0 vs pro net decked vampires and it doesnt run any amazing tech, just really obvious goblins, I bet these elves lists are looking the same, probably maindecking GSS and all those elves that look bad on paper like Nissa's chosen and Elvish Visionary.
I noticed in draft that Nissa's Chosen is much better than you assume it is as a vanilla 2/3, but I thought that was just because it was draft.
And Eldrazi monument wins games by itself, ramping into it could be brutal vs alot of decks
I want to see how these elves lists are working, I bet they are completely different from how I am picturing them
Yeh i dont like when people judge others on forums because of low post count. I just have to ask how does the deck drop all those elves so early, what elves does it play?
Uh.. get your panties in a bundle more. I wasn't attacking you, I was merely saying that people with low post counts and late join dates aren't immediately believed unless they have proof about something. I never said you didn't know what you were talking about or even that you were wrong.
Good god, the stupid is out tonight
And to stay on topic, I don't think this deck will stay on top because it's so easy to start mainboarding fallout and pyroclasm if it becomes an issue.
L2 Judge
oran-rief the vastwood says NO to fallout.
Nissa and garruk says NO to Day of judgement
its a pretty strong deck. it has beats and board staying power.
ChibiSwan! YOU ROCK!
...........Shin on the textless Cryptic Command
Being skeptical is fine, but calling someone a liar (or, rather, a con) because you think the deck sucks is just plain ********.
From what I understand, the combo is Nissa + Eldrazi. The testing in the thread indicated that indestructible creatures were a lot more valuable than the alternatives that just pumped them up.
That said, I can't imagine that deck being more successful than last season's elves, and I can't help but think that any success the deck had at the 5k was substantially due to misplay/misevaluation of a relatively unknown deck.
Maindecking the 4 GSS is what I thought would be a good idea, those guys destroy alot of decks and at worse are 3/3 for 3 which is good. Ive played decks like this only they run Sarkhan Vol-Sarkhan just seems to make the deck alot worse which didnt surprise me, he's a noob-timmy walker. Looks just like a really simple deck, decent CA with walkers and BBelf. Glad people will stop playing jund and Twilight.dec, twilight dies to swarm+GSS
This. I also dont like when people who just netdeck pro jund or Twilight.dec lists always get defensive about their deck saying stuff like "hmmm seems like pulse, bolt and jund charm own your deck, these results must be lies"
http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/showthread.php?p=4344684#post4344684
I actually forgot about the idea. I would have to imagine that it does beat the crap out of Jund too. The synergy between the planeswalkers and Oran-Rief shouldn't be underestimated.
I remember trying to make it but then ended up having to scrap it because it just had no way to deal with fliers. It looks like the deck still doesn't but I guess it just wins fast enough.
I mean, the deck just doesn't scream "Top 8 potential" to me.. and it has so little removal..
I don't see how this can beat out Control builds running Day of Judgment, or heck, even decks running LIGHTNING BOLT.
Oh you play Nissa? Okay, make your Elf Dude, then bolt her.
I bet stag helped this to shoulder through a Jund heavy meta. The Planeswalker engine however is just bonkers with multiple oran-riefs.
Big fat dumb dudes get there against decks with piles of removal. Jund has a lot, but you can run them out when they can't sit back holding bolts to take care of planeswalkers.
I've tried the mono-G, G/R, Naya, but I still think my favorite is the G/W/B combination of fatties. At least we get to shove it in all the faces of the people who thought Nissa wan't any good.
<----Patiently waits for Balance to be legal in Legacy.
Creatures:
X3 llanowar elves
X4 cylian elves
X4 Nissa's chosen
X4 baloth woodcrasher
X4 dauntless escort
Plainswalkers:
X2 Garruk wildspeaker
X2 Nissa revane
Spells:
X4 primary bellow
X2 overrun
X3 khalni heart expedition
X4 harrow
X4 vines of vastwood
Heroes of the Plane Studios
Hm.
GW does get you the Dauntless escort.. but I'd say that woodcrasher and cylian elves are really subpar choices. I'd prefer the Elvish Visionaries and Archdruids. The ramp (Khalni and Harrow) are unnecessary with archdruids.
thats from something else.
you know you are 2-for-1-ed? and you wanna bolt the t1 Llanowar Elves. you wanna bolt Elvish Archdruid. you wanna bolt GSS. you wanna bolt Garruk. you wanna bolt Nissa's Chosen/Beast tokens in response to Oran-Rief activations. you are not going to have enough bolts.
Yep. A 2/3 elf + duress for 4 mana isn't too bad.