I don't think SS is as good as Cradle, or close to it. It's not going to be even good till the right enchantments come out, that is a matter of time. By that time Cradle could be banned and this will be the best land in Legacy. This speculation but if you look at the trrends, theselands in Legacy always go up.
Agreed completely with this. I've played extensively with all three of the Urza's Saga bomb lands (Cradle, Sanctum and Academy), and Sanctum is not a patch on the other two - there are enough good, cheap creatures or artifacts to make the other two work, but we can't say the same for enchantments yet.
Sanctum should only go above Academy because it's 100% less banned. No way it goes above Cradle (not even close).
Hard to guess on a card that is very rarely seen on ebay or other places. Last completed listing for korean sanctum went for 65. None on SCG, none for auction or BiN right now on ebay. The only listing I found was 1 copy on magiccardmarket for 70 euro's/92 dollars right now. I once had a korean cradle but traded it a while back when, again, I couldn't sell it to a dealer because they couldn't find a price on it.
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"Yawgmoth," Freyalise whispered as she set the bomb, "now you will pay for your treachery."
I have a feeling Sanctums are going to be had to move for the people who bought in. I grabbed a playset for 40 bucks 6 months ago on eBay (probably the only time I have spent that kind of money purely on a tip from this forum) and nobody's wanted them since then. With the recent spike I feel basically locked into them, they just went from "difficult" to "impossible" as far as using them as a trade resource in my area and I have a feeling that I'll either buckle and get a Moat so I can actually, you know, use them, or buylist them out as 40% of retail because they're not putting up results and major dealers are too savvy to give me more.
There's always the chance that they actually do start winning Legacy events but I am not holding my breath.
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Thanks to Gabgabdevo for the awesome sig image!
I'm always looking for foil Madcap Skills and Ghitu Fire-Eater, [trade thread link forthcoming]
I have a feeling Sanctums are going to be had to move for the people who bought in. I grabbed a playset for 40 bucks 6 months ago on eBay (probably the only time I have spent that kind of money purely on a tip from this forum) and nobody's wanted them since then. With the recent spike I feel basically locked into them, they just went from "difficult" to "impossible" as far as using them as a trade resource in my area and I have a feeling that I'll either buckle and get a Moat so I can actually, you know, use them, or buylist them out as 40% of retail because they're not putting up results and major dealers are too savvy to give me more.
There's always the chance that they actually do start winning Legacy events but I am not holding my breath.
There's always a buyer. Question is, if it's for the right price. I feel now that the price exploded people may be questioning it, those who aren't savvy to this particular thread/forum. EDH/Casual crowd, and perhaps, Theros willing, produces the enchantments needed to have it come into the Legacy scene a bit more. I don't think they'll be impossible to move. If they become competitive or even one wanting one for EDH, they'll end up buying it for the new price. Well...because they'll have to now. It won't ever go back down to where it was.
If a card doubles in price in the woods, and nobody cares to play it, does it matter?
I've been buying, trading, and once and a while selling magic cards on and off since Clinton was re-elected, but I do not understand the (recent?) phenomenon where cards skyrocket in price with no apparent market, and then never drop again.
When a previously unplayed card finds a deck, and doubles, triples in price, I get it. When the meta shifts to bring a card more in demand, I get it. When speculation drives up the price of an unplayable card and the deck for it never materializes, I do not understand why the new prices remain. It seems like the law of supply and demand only applies in one direction in MTG finance and Serra's Sanctum is a perfect example. My $7 Didgeridoo that no one wants, will ever want, or will ever play is another good one.
This doesn't really bother me. I didn't miss out on obtaining playsets of these cards, since I don't want to play them. It just seems highly irrational.
If a card doubles in price in the woods, and nobody cares to play it, does it matter?
I've been buying, trading, and once and a while selling magic cards on and off since Clinton was re-elected, but I do not understand the (recent?) phenomenon where cards skyrocket in price with no apparent market, and then never drop again.
When a previously unplayed card finds a deck, and doubles, triples in price, I get it. When the meta shifts to bring a card more in demand, I get it. When speculation drives up the price of an unplayable card and the deck for it never materializes, I do not understand why the new prices remain. It seems like the law of supply and demand only applies in one direction in MTG finance and Serra's Sanctum is a perfect example. My $7 Didgeridoo that no one wants, will ever want, or will ever play is another good one.
This doesn't really bother me. I didn't miss out on obtaining playsets of these cards, since I don't want to play them. It just seems highly irrational.
Welcome to Magic The Gathering since 2 years ago.
I've mentioned it and have been told that it's all about what the market will bear and supply and demand.
The sad thing is the demand is often driven by little or no reason other than "OMG I better buy as many of these as I can get before they go up!!!!1! I may never use it, but I better make sure and get them all just in case!"
Basically speculation is so bad that if somebody mentions a card it's likely to go up. If it's on the reserve list it'll most likely stay up. Even if not really used. Part of being a huge MTG playerbase and not enough cards to go around.
The ones that really drive me crazy are cards that aren't on the reserved list and aren't really that good. Due to crazy speculation and netdecking and people constantly watching the latest top 8 decklists, cards that should be $2 often blow up to crazy levels.
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Currently Playing: Standard:
Nothing, the format Bores me! Legacy: RBurn (Made on the Cheap!)R RGBelcherRG WSoldier StompyW BReanimatorB EDH: BUGRWSliver OverlordWRGUB BGeth, Lord of the VaultB
I am going to disagree. If a card is 100 dollars but is not liquid... it has no use for me. I would much rather have 20 5 dollar cards which I could sell/trade/use.
Especially when it comes to selling, it isn't about how much the card is worth, it is about how liquid the card is.
I much rather have 100 dollars of shocks than 150 dollars of cards I can't move.
Yeah... I would not be buying into serra's sanctum now... and if I was trying to trade it off... most people I know would no longer be interested at the price since they know how much it is played.
Also agreed with Kirin... liquid cards are much better than obscure high value ones that you have a hard time moving. It took me years to unload a Eureka for example and that time is a very real factor many people don't appreciate until they've had to deal with it.
I am going to disagree. If a card is 100 dollars but is not liquid... it has no use for me. I would much rather have 20 5 dollar cards which I could sell/trade/use.
Especially when it comes to selling, it isn't about how much the card is worth, it is about how liquid the card is.
I much rather have 100 dollars of shocks than 150 dollars of cards I can't move.
Yeah... I would not be buying into serra's sanctum now... and if I was trying to trade it off... most people I know would no longer be interested at the price since they know how much it is played.
Also agreed with Kirin... liquid cards are much better than obscure high value ones that you have a hard time moving. It took me years to unload a Eureka for example and that time is a very real factor many people don't appreciate until they've had to deal with it.
This is all well and good, but this is a reserved list card we're talking about here. It's an enchantment block we're heading into right now, there's limited supply of this card. So people can't move Force of Will? This argument is invalid, if they print a couple enchantments, there should be little reason this card sees a bit more play. Whether it be Legacy (likely) or any other format.
The only people who really benefited from this price surge on Serra Sanctum are the ones who got on the boat before it broke past the 20-25$ mark. Even if it took 6 months to a year to unload, there could be another price surge, or at worst people doubled their money.
I am going to disagree. If a card is 100 dollars but is not liquid... it has no use for me. I would much rather have 20 5 dollar cards which I could sell/trade/use.
Especially when it comes to selling, it isn't about how much the card is worth, it is about how liquid the card is.
I much rather have 100 dollars of shocks than 150 dollars of cards I can't move.
I gotta agree with Kirin because this is a point that is totally under appreciated. Not only is there real 'value' to the liquidity of cards that are easy to move vs. cards that are hard to move, but the accuracy of of the valuation of the hard to move cards may even be in question.
Granted nobody is going to question that a hard to move black lotus is worth a ton,
but if your digeridoos goes up to $10 bucks each due to speculation, how "real" is the market valuation if you cant move it at that price? If you have to lower your price to half, to move it, the $10 valuation is more wishful pricing than reality.
I am going to disagree. If a card is 100 dollars but is not liquid... it has no use for me. I would much rather have 20 5 dollar cards which I could sell/trade/use.
Especially when it comes to selling, it isn't about how much the card is worth, it is about how liquid the card is.
I much rather have 100 dollars of shocks than 150 dollars of cards I can't move.
This is the point I was trying to make, more elegantly made. An expensive card with no home in a deck and no special collector/nostalgia appeal seemingly has no liquidity. In any sort of rational market, one would expect the price to gradually come down until the point where the card could be moved, but that never seems to happen.
This is the point I was trying to make, more elegantly made. An expensive card with no home in a deck and no special collector/nostalgia appeal seemingly has no liquidity. In any sort of rational market, one would expect the price to gradually come down until the point where the card could be moved, but that never seems to happen.
It's not so much irrational as it is inefficient. Market inefficiencies persist when the costs in time, effort, and transactions costs are too high to cause financially rational actors to profit off those inefficiencies.
Cards don't need to have any other reason to be worth money than rarity and likeability.
Sometimes it's bandwagon stupidity...
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Currently Playing: Standard:
Nothing, the format Bores me! Legacy: RBurn (Made on the Cheap!)R RGBelcherRG WSoldier StompyW BReanimatorB EDH: BUGRWSliver OverlordWRGUB BGeth, Lord of the VaultB
I have a feeling Sanctums are going to be had to move for the people who bought in. I grabbed a playset for 40 bucks 6 months ago on eBay (probably the only time I have spent that kind of money purely on a tip from this forum) and nobody's wanted them since then. With the recent spike I feel basically locked into them, they just went from "difficult" to "impossible" as far as using them as a trade resource in my area and I have a feeling that I'll either buckle and get a Moat so I can actually, you know, use them, or buylist them out as 40% of retail because they're not putting up results and major dealers are too savvy to give me more.
There's always the chance that they actually do start winning Legacy events but I am not holding my breath.
what's wrong with putting them back on ebay for profit?
NM are going for $30+ on ebay; you got them for a third of that price, why are you upset? Are you unhappy because they are worth more and you can't get rid of them now? Give someone half off and I'm sure you can get rid of them easily.
What a funny post.
Stores are out of cards. Old cards like Legends as an example Invoke Prejudice are valued because they are overpowered, good in edh, and collector's know how rare theyare. People need to understand yhat cards are drying up. People think this game is mainly investors or players who will sell cards once they are outstandingly high. This is not true at all. I have at least 6 friends who once obtain a card no matter the value, it's going into their collection and never will be on the market unless they quit and you won't get that single you want because the collection is going online as one auction. Not too mention the investors eho will go 20+ years ormore before putting up an up a Volcanic Island. This is not just flippers and advantage takers, it's mostly hoarding players and stuborn owners.
Stores are out of cards. Old cards like Legends as an example Invoke Prejudice are valued because they are overpowered, good in edh, and collector's know how rare theyare. People need to understand yhat cards are drying up. People think this game is mainly investors or players who will sell cards once they are outstandingly high. This is not true at all. I have at least 6 friends who once obtain a card no matter the value, it's going into their collection and never will be on the market unless they quit and you won't get that single you want because the collection is going online as one auction. Not too mention the investors eho will go 20+ years ormore before putting up an up a Volcanic Island. This is not just flippers and advantage takers, it's mostly hoarding players and stuborn owners.
Well said, I honestly couldn't agree more. Everyone always looks at the "stock market players" and instantly blames them for price surges ect. But what a vast majority of people dont realize is that everyone is responsible. Players, hoarders, speculators. We all buy cards and use cards. The one thing about speculators though is....
at least they give back the cards to the rest of the market
And Magic is still expanding of course. For every player selling his collection (and dropping all his Invoke prejudices back on the market), 2 players are getting into Magic. Once Magic passes its peak and more people quit than enter the game, I think the market will die off again. There won't be a buyer for the 10 Prejudices on the market and for every buyer, 2 more will pop up ebay. Hopefully it deflates slowly and not with a bang. Although, even if the prices crash with a bang, it will only have influence on shops and traders, not for most players. For those players Magic will become a sweet candy shop where they can buy every card they ever wanted for almost nothing
Reprints the one card that people point to when saying that art objectifies women.
Well done Wizards.
Liliana does not objectify women in any way at all. We have gotten to a point in our society that every single picture of a women must be objectifying a women in some negative way......blah blah blah.. That is not the case. (((Sarcasm)))Picture of a girl drinking a milk shake, must be sex related and putting women down, picture of girl sitting on a beach, picture of a girl driving a car, picture of a girl on the moon at a new space station.)))
You have a picture of an attractive strong power women who girls dress up as for anime conventions. What more do you want? The picture is fine, happy to see a reprint. Sick of of seeing people claim that everything in existence must be putting women down. Then all I have to do is replace the word "women" with anything else to get the same mentality; fish, cats, arabs, blacks, jews, men, environment, whites, chinese, old people, etc. It doesn't matter what word I put in. Stop sucking life out of everything man. That artwork of her is awesome. Stop putting stuff down man. Just stop. If the picture was really as negative as you claim she would totally nude, in a kitchen, making sandwiches and giving blow jobs. Her abilities would be horrible as well. +1 do nothing -2 do nothing -6 do nothing. Instead liliana of the veil is an amazing planeswalker comparable to jace, the mind sculpter with great art to appreciate.
My suggestion listen to some comedy radio for a while, pandora is free, youtube is free there is something out there for you. ***** go make fun of somebody. The whole world is so serious and campaigning for some cause, or someones rights, everything is a hate crime, racist, sexist. blah blah blah.
"O no mcdonalds must be slandering a hate crime against skinny people every time they make a big mac." hahaha jeeze You're just someone perpetuating another groups negative perspective that they've made you believe is correct. Look at the picture for a hour and tell me what's wrong with it? I don't see anything.
I have heard vague rumors of a moustache-dispensing vending machine in a distant laundromat, across the street from a tattoo parlor. However, this information is shaky, and time is of the essence.
Agreed completely with this. I've played extensively with all three of the Urza's Saga bomb lands (Cradle, Sanctum and Academy), and Sanctum is not a patch on the other two - there are enough good, cheap creatures or artifacts to make the other two work, but we can't say the same for enchantments yet.
Sanctum should only go above Academy because it's 100% less banned. No way it goes above Cradle (not even close).
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There's always the chance that they actually do start winning Legacy events but I am not holding my breath.
Thanks to Gabgabdevo for the awesome sig image!
I'm always looking for foil Madcap Skills and Ghitu Fire-Eater, [trade thread link forthcoming]
There's always a buyer. Question is, if it's for the right price. I feel now that the price exploded people may be questioning it, those who aren't savvy to this particular thread/forum. EDH/Casual crowd, and perhaps, Theros willing, produces the enchantments needed to have it come into the Legacy scene a bit more. I don't think they'll be impossible to move. If they become competitive or even one wanting one for EDH, they'll end up buying it for the new price. Well...because they'll have to now. It won't ever go back down to where it was.
I've been buying, trading, and once and a while selling magic cards on and off since Clinton was re-elected, but I do not understand the (recent?) phenomenon where cards skyrocket in price with no apparent market, and then never drop again.
When a previously unplayed card finds a deck, and doubles, triples in price, I get it. When the meta shifts to bring a card more in demand, I get it. When speculation drives up the price of an unplayable card and the deck for it never materializes, I do not understand why the new prices remain. It seems like the law of supply and demand only applies in one direction in MTG finance and Serra's Sanctum is a perfect example. My $7 Didgeridoo that no one wants, will ever want, or will ever play is another good one.
This doesn't really bother me. I didn't miss out on obtaining playsets of these cards, since I don't want to play them. It just seems highly irrational.
Rancored Elf will cancel your order if prices go up. Read about him and other shady vendors here.
My Trade Thread!
Welcome to Magic The Gathering since 2 years ago.
I've mentioned it and have been told that it's all about what the market will bear and supply and demand.
The sad thing is the demand is often driven by little or no reason other than "OMG I better buy as many of these as I can get before they go up!!!!1! I may never use it, but I better make sure and get them all just in case!"
Basically speculation is so bad that if somebody mentions a card it's likely to go up. If it's on the reserve list it'll most likely stay up. Even if not really used. Part of being a huge MTG playerbase and not enough cards to go around.
The ones that really drive me crazy are cards that aren't on the reserved list and aren't really that good. Due to crazy speculation and netdecking and people constantly watching the latest top 8 decklists, cards that should be $2 often blow up to crazy levels.
Currently Playing:
Standard:
Nothing, the format Bores me!
Legacy:
RBurn (Made on the Cheap!)R
RGBelcherRG
WSoldier StompyW
BReanimatorB
EDH:
BUGRWSliver OverlordWRGUB
BGeth, Lord of the VaultB
Especially when it comes to selling, it isn't about how much the card is worth, it is about how liquid the card is.
I much rather have 100 dollars of shocks than 150 dollars of cards I can't move.
Kirin's Skyfire Help Desk
Trading Post
Also agreed with Kirin... liquid cards are much better than obscure high value ones that you have a hard time moving. It took me years to unload a Eureka for example and that time is a very real factor many people don't appreciate until they've had to deal with it.
This is all well and good, but this is a reserved list card we're talking about here. It's an enchantment block we're heading into right now, there's limited supply of this card. So people can't move Force of Will? This argument is invalid, if they print a couple enchantments, there should be little reason this card sees a bit more play. Whether it be Legacy (likely) or any other format.
The only people who really benefited from this price surge on Serra Sanctum are the ones who got on the boat before it broke past the 20-25$ mark. Even if it took 6 months to a year to unload, there could be another price surge, or at worst people doubled their money.
I gotta agree with Kirin because this is a point that is totally under appreciated. Not only is there real 'value' to the liquidity of cards that are easy to move vs. cards that are hard to move, but the accuracy of of the valuation of the hard to move cards may even be in question.
Granted nobody is going to question that a hard to move black lotus is worth a ton,
but if your digeridoos goes up to $10 bucks each due to speculation, how "real" is the market valuation if you cant move it at that price? If you have to lower your price to half, to move it, the $10 valuation is more wishful pricing than reality.
This is the point I was trying to make, more elegantly made. An expensive card with no home in a deck and no special collector/nostalgia appeal seemingly has no liquidity. In any sort of rational market, one would expect the price to gradually come down until the point where the card could be moved, but that never seems to happen.
Rancored Elf will cancel your order if prices go up. Read about him and other shady vendors here.
My Trade Thread!
It's not so much irrational as it is inefficient. Market inefficiencies persist when the costs in time, effort, and transactions costs are too high to cause financially rational actors to profit off those inefficiencies.
Sometimes it's bandwagon stupidity...
Currently Playing:
Standard:
Nothing, the format Bores me!
Legacy:
RBurn (Made on the Cheap!)R
RGBelcherRG
WSoldier StompyW
BReanimatorB
EDH:
BUGRWSliver OverlordWRGUB
BGeth, Lord of the VaultB
what's wrong with putting them back on ebay for profit?
What a funny post.
Well said, I honestly couldn't agree more. Everyone always looks at the "stock market players" and instantly blames them for price surges ect. But what a vast majority of people dont realize is that everyone is responsible. Players, hoarders, speculators. We all buy cards and use cards. The one thing about speculators though is....
at least they give back the cards to the rest of the market
Hoarders//collectors. Don't.
But wouldn't that mean less people to play with?