I see. While the emblem/riot control situation sounds narrow as usually tamiyo emblem is game with even just a single spell in hand, it sounds like maybe you have a fair amount of aggro in your meta if it is that effective, so if it works for you I can't argue with results. On another note, I was looking over your list again, and I'm wondering how important do you feel your 4th Azorius Charm is? Most lists I'm seeing now have cut down to 3, some even 2(which i feel 2 is too low) because of the rise of creatures like voice of resurgence and mainly just value creatures that you wouldn't even want to put on top of your opponent's library, such as thragtusk, resto angel, haste creatures, etc. I was running 4 charms for a long time, until eventually I was finding myself using them to cycle most of the time (which other cards can do better), so I've cut to 3 and I like what the extra spot has freed up for my deck, so maybe that's a possibility for you. I know you said you're pretty set on the main deck, but just a suggestion. It might make room for the extra spot removal i suggested.
Much like I was saying before I have it at 4 because its flexible, and is one of the few cards that's never really dead in any match up. That isn't to say cards that are better in certain situations can't be used, I would just rather have the consistency. For example, I remember when I used to run warped physique. Sometimes it was nuts, other times it made me lose (oddly enough az charm would have kept those games going). The biggest value cards in the deck will always be verdict (or w.e boardwipe) and sphinx. The way I play fits very well into these two cards. I've often used far t2 just to bounce a strangleroot geist just to force the opponent to over commit to the board to catch up, and by that point souls or walkers buying yet more time eventually leads to devastating wipes (like 5 for 1) and huge sphinxes (for 7-8). In the early stages my list either plays draw go, or tempos out my opponent the first few turns just to blow them out later. It plays both styles quite well, probably because of the 4 charms giving me more options. At worst against voice you blank some damage, they get a token, might take a few next turn and if they replay it its basically just favoring you at that point since you just want to build lands up. Granted I haven't gone against too many decks lately with voice (just bant hexproof, but thats an extremely favorable match up anyway) but even when I was running 4 charms then it still wasn't the worst thing. It also always hits tokens, mainly advent, and I can't even tell you how many times Ive charmed my opponents last threat 3 times in a row. If my meta stays the same then I think my last shall too, but if Voice gets popular again, perhaps I'll have to change it up.
We got different views Esper neeeds to land drop every turn till 6/7 turn.
EW is "online" on the 5th turn when either kessig/gavony are online too.
Ghost Quartering a land before the 4th turn means that you are loosing 1 mana and your opponent doesn't wich is usually more important to us than for a midrange/aggro player (Jund will be always mana ahead since farseeks/keyrunes/mana dorks) and (we are in the competitive section right? :tongue:) you are fetching the opponent's deck for a 1/40.
Not sure when I said I was playing the deck in a way that didn't involve hitting lands every turn, and if we are in the competitive section, which jund lists are you referring to? Keyrune, from what I've seen lately, has been a 1of if any at all are run. As for arbor elf, that's quite a rarity in itself for jund to use that. Some other things: why would you use GQ t4, aside from dispatching a cavern? Also, the important side effect of using either is the same. You're losing a land regardless; the question really is do you want to do something marginal in keeping them off a potential basic land, or have multiple plays the same turn while hitting a key land. Tapping a bunch of lands and refraining from playing spells just won't cut it a majority of the time, possibly why drown has seen a slight decline.
I recently started playing Esper (and control in general) and I'm looking for some advice on my list. I've been running pretty much this list for the past few weeks, although I recently added the Restoration Angels. I didn't post my sideboard as of now because I'm still having trouble figuring it out.
I would like to find some room in here for at least two Detention Spheres, but I'm not sure what to swap out. My meta is a lot of aggro, if anyone has advice on how to tweak my mainboard to deal with that. There's minimal control, one Aristocrats, and a few Jund decks.
I have the one copy of Plate Mail in there to test and so far I've been finding it incredibly useful. It blocks almost anything aggro has, survives board wipes, and putting it on a Spirit token handles planeswalkers and 5 damage a turn with flying can end games pretty quickly.
I recently started playing Esper (and control in general) and I'm looking for some advice on my list. I've been running pretty much this list for the past few weeks, although I recently added the Restoration Angels. I didn't post my sideboard as of now because I'm still having trouble figuring it out.
I would like to find some room in here for at least two Detention Spheres, but I'm not sure what to swap out. My meta is a lot of aggro, if anyone has advice on how to tweak my mainboard to deal with that. There's minimal control, one Aristocrats, and a few Jund decks.
I have the one copy of Plate Mail in there to test and so far I've been finding it incredibly useful. It blocks almost anything aggro has, survives board wipes, and putting it on a Spirit token handles planeswalkers and 5 damage a turn with flying can end games pretty quickly.
With that list, you don't really need the restos since they can only blink a snapcaster. I'd add 2 or 3 more snapcasters and cut the restos. Also add another drownyard. Lingering souls should be a 4 of or 0 of in my opinion.
If your meta is aggro heavy you could consider running the decklist I posted a week or 2 ago in this thread. It does pretty well vs aggro.
I recently started playing Esper (and control in general) and I'm looking for some advice on my list. I've been running pretty much this list for the past few weeks, although I recently added the Restoration Angels. I didn't post my sideboard as of now because I'm still having trouble figuring it out.
I would like to find some room in here for at least two Detention Spheres, but I'm not sure what to swap out. My meta is a lot of aggro, if anyone has advice on how to tweak my mainboard to deal with that. There's minimal control, one Aristocrats, and a few Jund decks.
I have the one copy of Plate Mail in there to test and so far I've been finding it incredibly useful. It blocks almost anything aggro has, survives board wipes, and putting it on a Spirit token handles planeswalkers and 5 damage a turn with flying can end games pretty quickly.
6 maindeck counters is a lot. 3 resto angels with only one snapcaster to blink is also a lot. I'd cut some of each and add 2-3 Augur of Bolas or 2 augur and another snap. Helps your aggro matchup and gets some value out of your resto angels.
Even though I see fewer and fewer graveyard combo decks (humanator, junk reanimator) every week, I'm still running a pair of Crypt Incursion between the SB and maindeck, and loving it. It removes Ooze and Shaman fuel, and the lifegain has put a lot of games out of reach for me against Gruul/Naya/mono-red aggro for me in games where I simply was not going to get a relevant amount of life off a revelation in time to stabilize. After a wrath or even just some early spot removal/snapcaster trades, it adds up very quickly.
I recently started playing Esper (and control in general) and I'm looking for some advice on my list. I've been running pretty much this list for the past few weeks, although I recently added the Restoration Angels. I didn't post my sideboard as of now because I'm still having trouble figuring it out.
I would like to find some room in here for at least two Detention Spheres, but I'm not sure what to swap out. My meta is a lot of aggro, if anyone has advice on how to tweak my mainboard to deal with that. There's minimal control, one Aristocrats, and a few Jund decks.
I have the one copy of Plate Mail in there to test and so far I've been finding it incredibly useful. It blocks almost anything aggro has, survives board wipes, and putting it on a Spirit token handles planeswalkers and 5 damage a turn with flying can end games pretty quickly.
-3 resto angels -- great and deals with planeswalkers, I vote to remove, but keeping them isn't bad, but you need to drop mail plate to make room
-2 syncopate -- great turn 2-4, but only if the opponent doesn't mana accel and taps out, you want a turn 2-3 augur instead on turn 2-3 instead
-2 lingering souls -- they're only chump blockers that land turn 3+, IMO not playable without sorin
-1 snapcaster mage -- he's good, but terrible vs aggro since esper flashbacks cost 2 meaning he's useless until turn 4
-1 rewind -- comes down late vs aggro and doesn't untap lands if it's countered
+3 augur -- dig for verdict and block all those 2/2 forever, plays turn 2, and generates almost as much card advantage as snapcaster. If you keep resto, that's up to 6 digs 3 deep which gives 18 cards (a huge amount of your deck). Adding jace to that gives the best digging possible in a post-ponder world.
+1 essence scatter -- most decks don't run cavern, so it's a kill target creature before ETB triggers
+1 aetherling -- a fast win condition if mill fails -- not necessarily needed with resto
+1 warped physique -- because doom blade can't hit black creatures
+2 detention sphere -- you said make room. Personally, I'd probably play 1 MB and the other SB.
+1 cryptic incursion -- you're game play is to put lots of cards in the GY. Aggro is mostly creatures. Mill them if you can (or just verdict) then play this to win (while you *can* lose, I never have as 20+ lifegain is just that hard to recover from). If aggro is that popular, consider a second in main and a third in sideboard
+0 swap one land for a third drownyard. 4 colorless lands is fine.
cards to consider:
blood baron -- He's a great wall vs aggro and the lifelink really helps. play 1-2
obzedat -- not my preference, but works. play only 1
lavinia of the tenth -- if you have loads of RG and RDW, she's only going to die if you choose to wipe the board, plus she timewalks them most of the time. Play 1 (maybe 1 in SB if red is that common)
sorin, lord of innistrad -- as mentioned, he's great with souls and makes your augurs and angels much better late game. The downside to playing him is if you don't fare well against bonfire, electrickery, and trample (hexproof specifically). Play 2
renounce the guilds -- good vs jund, domri aggro, bant, aristocrats (hit the important creatures through the tokens). Bad with sorin and d-sphere (but playable with blood baron). play 2
mutavault -- a good 1-2 of and survives board wipe. I've been testing a no-creatures build with 4 mutavault, 4 haunted mail plate, 4 dimir keyrune, and 4 azorius keyrune. It's fun if you like trying something different.
Though you haven't mentioned it, SB is also important. Pithing needle, terminus, negate, dispel, jace, memory adept, witchbane orb (deals with bonfire, rakdos's return, memory adept, and curse (a must if you're playing sorin and souls)), curse of death's hold, notion thief, rest in peace, etc are needed to deal with these decks more fully.
Been running UB but with winnings from a few tourney tops, trades and lending from friends I've managed to put together a Resto-less Esper list (has Charms, Verdicts, Revelations, Detention Spheres, etc.). How are its various matchups vs the meta?
Been running UB but with winnings from a few tourney tops, trades and lending from friends I've managed to put together a Resto-less Esper list (has Charms, Verdicts, Revelations, Detention Spheres, etc.). How are its various matchups vs the meta?
I've run esper without resto for quite a while (only creatures being 2 blood baron and 3 augur with notion thief and aetherling in sideboard).
bant hexproof, RDW, gruul aggro, aristocrats, BW humans and UWR are all good matchups IMHO. Blitz is fairly good unless they have a nut draw (in which case you just lose). Burning earth changes this a bit (I've taken to UW or UB instead of Esper because burning earth is that much of a problem in my meta at the moment).
Domri midrange, Jund midrange, and reanimator (mostly dead, but still worth mentioning) are lousy matchups in my experience.
Vs. Domri midrange This matchup is made difficult because of domri (of course), burning earth, and large haste creatures (hellkite, hellrider, and flinthoof boar). This matchup almost convinced me to board 2 blind obedience. The largest problem is that they have 8 permanents that threaten to (effectively) end the game quickly (4 domri and 4 burning earth) while esper only plays 4 counters, a couple d-spheres, and renounce the guilds. If they're on the play, there's almost nothing you can do about T1 land and elf followed by T2 domri. A resolved burning earth means you take at least 3 damage to kill it (and only if you have the o-ring). My main answer here was 2 pithing needles to help the hit (second can always be played on wolf-run). Sideboarding in council of the absolute after they board out mizzium mortars was another idea I toyed with. I also recommend a third d-sphere if you expect this matchup. I don't think you need 6 board wipes, but I'd definitely side in terminus as it deals with strangleroot.
Vs. Jund... the most broken deck in standard at the moment. Jund has it all, the best removal (putrify, bonfire), the best mana acceleration (farseek), the best card advantage (garruk primal hunter, rakdos's return, etc), and the best creatures (tusk, olivia, huntmaster, etc). Since most game 1 setups are geared against aggro, it's generally in your favor. Game 2 is where they side out some of the removal and side in liliana, the other rakdos's return, ruric thar, sire of insanity, etc. It is my opinion that this deck is currently the only reason that Esper isn't a tier 1 deck (though if it weren't for jund, reanimator would eat esper and then there's burning earth, so...). Anyway, let me expound on Jund a little.
With them playing 4-6 planeswalkers, your best answers are pithing needle as it can hit olivia, planeswalkers, scavanger ooze, and wolf-run. If they ever resolve thragtusk followed by primal hunter to draw 5, the game is more out of reach than if your UWR opponent revelationed for 10 (jund's power level per card is that high). An alternate that I've seen a number of times is the turn 3 garruk that churns out 3/3 tokens every turn. In short, it's easier to recover from liliana making both of you discard than garruk allowing them to draw. Another card of note is underworld connections. This card is bad (IMHO) not only because it draws cards, but because they now have the chance to miracle bonfire every turn.
Bonfire is huge in this matchup. It takes you a while to win with mill (and with huntmaster and thragtusk, even aetherling hitting for 8 a turn takes a while). Even after you think you've stabilized, you're probably one bonfire (or rakdos's return) from death and the bonfire just keeps getting larger (general note: any one of a half dozen jund threats completely eliminates your control -- never count on establishing control as you can't). The best way to deal with this particular threat is witchbane orb which shuts both of these down beautifully.
Ruric Thar and sire of insanity are basically auto-lose cards if you can't get rid of them (you must counter thar and counter or kill sire on their turn). I've seen more of ruric-thar recently and I believe he's the worse of the two because esper plays so many non-creatures and even with the doom blade in hand, you're guaranteed to take 6 damage in the late game (a fascinating "you lose" if they play it when you have less than 6 life).
The rest of the creatures are the usual passive card advantage engines that are hard/impossible to one for one. With mill being the best way to win, don't board in terminus, you probably don't need it anyway (if they're smart, they'll play out only one or two creatures at a time). Tamiyo's tap ability is often better than removal (they're forced to play a second threat which sets up a 2 for 1. I side out architect of thought, but side in one memory adept, the distraction and extra 10 cards helps push things just a little more in my favor. Renounce the guilds is good as it hits huntmaster, sire, ruric-thar, or liliana while avoiding tokens. Clone or evil twin help deal with thragtusk or olivia (just don't clone huntmaster as that doesn't end well).
The last cards I sideboard are appetite for brains and duress. Appetite hits most of the creatures and garruk while the biggest duress targets are liliana and rakdos's return and early farseeks. If I'm on the play, I keep in syncopate as countering their turn 2 farseek is a gamechanger. Games 2-3 are probably 60/40 in favor of jund in my experience (it used to be better before UWR became a thing and forced jund to pack some answers).
Not much to say about reanimator except that it eats esper alive. It's a very rare thing to win even a couple of games. While you *could* build your deck to take on reanimator, by the time you were finished, you would have terrible games vs a lot of other decks.
Vs hexproof it's mostly luck of their draw (like with blitz, you can't beat a nut draw). Board in renounce the guilds, ratchet bomb, duress, and negate. I also board in terminus and board out doom blade and warped physique. When hexproof took an upswing a while ago, I swapped terminus for merciless eviction with great success. I feel that aetherling or blood baron are a little better win conditions than mill in this matchup since hexproof is so non-interactive.
vs golgari control. Not much to say except win by mill and play all your sweepers and pithing needle (and side out doom blade). Without bonfire, ruric, sire, return, and garruk, it's not much to worry about. The biggest threats are underworld connections, liliana, and vraska (who kills drownyards).
vs UWR. This match heavily favors esper simply because of esper's removal. Your augurs beat their snapcasters and tie with their augurs, so focus attention on their restoration angels. In game 2, they tend to bring in assemble the legion, memory adept, and hellkite (plus some counters). Needle or RIP works vs moorland haunt and jace. The best answer to legion is curse of death's hold as their only answer is usually d-sphere Since curse kills snapcaster, zeroes augur, and reduces resto to a 2/3, it usually spells the end of the line if they can't answer it (game one they can actually burn you out with turn//burn, pillar, helix, snapcaster and resto, but pillar and turn//burn usually come out game two). Notion thief does a lot of work. Side in witchbane if you suspect memory adept.
Vs junk aristocrats. Game 1 can be difficult. This is where you will be thankful if you play 2 warped physique and 1 doom blade instead of the reverse. Hit blood artist before you board wipe and play blood baron ASAP if he's in your 60 like he should be. Post-board, play RIP or curse and guard it with your life (duress is good because it can hit abrupt decay). I don't like augur very much for this matchup though I often play one aetherling. Jace, architect of thought also works well at blanking all their small creatures. Tamiyo's card draw can be amazing here (I've had them alpha with 4 souls tokens only to tamiyo for 4 cards the next turn). Renounce is great as it hits aristocrat, varolz, and voice. Conversely, far//away isn't good at all. Finally, terminus or merciless eviction offers a way to deal with regen, undying, and tokens.
vs BW humans. Play blood baron, curse, and RIP. Sticking any one of these will win the game.
Essence Scatter? well to be honest at the time of writting my deck i found one missing spot & saw that card on one of my deck box.
my meta is almost full of aggro decks, random Dimir mill, weird american deck, 1 Kibler deck, 1 elves and some tokens decks.
any advice would be appreciated
With a full aggro meta, you should be very well positioned.
If you have lots of token decks, illness in the ranks is better than curse. Play one in sideboard and keep the curse for elves. I'd also remove shrivel. If the matchup is that bad for you despite all your board wipe, add a second curse. Shrivel is useless if they have just one elf lord.
I'd move ratchet bomb to sideboard and add 2 warped physique to give you 6 spot removal cards. Bring in the bombs vs elves and tokens.
Get rid of the planar cleansing. 3 terminus and 3 verdict (plus 2 ratchet bomb and curse) is enough board wipe; plus, you don't want to risk removing your o-rings.
Replace one mainboard syncopate with your essence scatter since everyone plays lots of creatures. Use it on undying, tusk, and other hard to remove creatures. If you have a second scatter, I'd play it too.
Play a second cryptic incursion, but play it mainboard. Incursion is only bad against other control decks that run 3-6 creatures, but it's a lifesaver in most of your matches.
Get rid of sundering growth. If you're having artifact problems (I can't think of any), just play a third o-ring as it can hit the artifact and a whole lot more.
I don't see you needing sever the bloodline. You have better token answers and a bunch of answers to voice and undying. Sever cost's a lot and plays at sorcery speed.
A single dispel or a third negate in sideboard will help any control/mill matchups. If you have issues dealing with the mill deck, board a witchbane orb in addition to spiral.
A single ghost quarter may be a good idea if your meta plays wolf-run. I'd also run 26 lands instead of 27.
I'm not sure what your weird american deck is. If it's aggro, you're all set. If it's control, counter the important stuff and illness in the ranks does a lot of work vs assemble the legions.
So far I can only show you all my maindeck as I havent recalled ALL the info on the environment I am playing in, but it is a casual place with a slight push for competitive play and attitude. FNM 1st place gets to pick a card from the new From the Vault 20 and I kind of dont want to scrub out with that on the line...so I figured Id drop my list in and ask for any advice. My list is the result of a combination of data from Gerry Thompson's article on UW flash (taking similar principles like trying to not outright die to Burning Earth, and decreasing potential issues of opponents' exile effects). I had originally went in with 4 restoration angel and 4 augur, which worked well enough to let me barely nudge into top 8 and then 1st last week, with some struggling, so the wheel isnt perfect for me yet.
Decks I have in my bag of tricks- Needless to say, someone who wants to play will probably have a deck UB/x Faeries UR Storm XURWB Affinity G Elves UW control
So far I can only show you all my maindeck as I havent recalled ALL the info on the environment I am playing in, but it is a casual place with a slight push for competitive play and attitude. FNM 1st place gets to pick a card from the new From the Vault 20 and I kind of dont want to scrub out with that on the line...so I figured Id drop my list in and ask for any advice. My list is the result of a combination of data from Gerry Thompson's article on UW flash (taking similar principles like trying to not outright die to Burning Earth, and decreasing potential issues of opponents' exile effects). I had originally went in with 4 restoration angel and 4 augur, which worked well enough to let me barely nudge into top 8 and then 1st last week, with some struggling, so the wheel isnt perfect for me yet.
With so few black spells, I'd change the mana base.
I'd play:
2 drownyard -- you only need one on the battlefield to win. Plus, you have the creatures to beat down most of the time.
4 hallowed fountain
3 glacial fortress
1 drowned catacombs
1 isolated chapel
3 swamp
7 plains
7 island
+1 cavern of souls -- in the sideboard for control matchups, you don't want another non-basic in main if it does nothing
With 5 black sources, you'll have one within the first couple of draws most of the time (if you don't just have it among your openers). eliminating a far//away or two for a celestial flare or renounce the guilds will make those misses less noticeable. I'd play 2 jace, architect of thought to help dig for one to activate drownyard though. I haven't tested this setup, but I like the idea enough that I think I'll be giving it a try.
That land base is a lot more similar to the base used by UW:
4 hallowed fountain
4 glacial fortress
1 azorius guildgate
1-2 ghost quarter/mutavault
8 island
7-8 plains
With so few black spells, I'd change the mana base.
I'd play:
2 drownyard -- you only need one on the battlefield to win. Plus, you have the creatures to beat down most of the time.
4 hallowed fountain
3 glacial fortress
1 drowned catacombs
1 isolated chapel
3 swamp
7 plains
7 island
+1 cavern of souls -- in the sideboard for control matchups, you don't want another non-basic in main if it does nothing
With 5 black sources, you'll have one within the first couple of draws most of the time (if you don't just have it among your openers). eliminating a far//away or two for a celestial flare or renounce the guilds will make those misses less noticeable. I'd play 2 jace, architect of thought to help dig for one to activate drownyard though. I haven't tested this setup, but I like the idea enough that I think I'll be giving it a try.
That land base is a lot more similar to the base used by UW:
4 hallowed fountain
4 glacial fortress
1 azorius guildgate
1-2 ghost quarter/mutavault
8 island
7-8 plains
5 black sources is not enough to support a single Doom Blade. I'd only do 5 if you just had a copy of a late-game card that needed black (Drownyard) With more than that, a bare minimum is 10, but you more likely want 12 since you're Doom Blades are designed to be played on turn 2.
Also, the Cavern in his maindeck wasn't rational when he had 4 Drownyards and is extremely favored in any mirror, but if he's cutting down below 4 Drownyards then he should sideboard copies of those before copies of Cavern.
5 black sources is not enough to support a single Doom Blade. I'd only do 5 if you just had a copy of a late-game card that needed black (Drownyard) With more than that, a bare minimum is 10, but you more likely want 12 since you're Doom Blades are designed to be played on turn 2.
Also, the Cavern in his maindeck wasn't rational when he had 4 Drownyards and is extremely favored in any mirror, but if he's cutting down below 4 Drownyards then he should sideboard copies of those before copies of Cavern.
Let's look at some numbers. With 5 cards and a 7 card hand, your chance are 47.5% of having it in your opening hand. Chances of having a black source by your second draw are 57%. If you played a think twice, that chance is now 62%.
With 7 sources, your chances by turn 2 (on the draw) are 70% and with that think twice are 75%. With 10 sources, your turn 1 chances (7 cards) are 75% and turn 2 with think twice are 86%.
Looking at the odds, I'm inclined to agree with you that more black sources are needed, but I think 7 is sufficient and switching two hallowed fountains for a watery grave and a godless shrine would be more than acceptable. (especially considering that the chances of drawing one of those five black spells is fairly low.)
Swapping the remaining two hallowed fountains could also be considered if you like the slightly higher statistics, but at that point, I'd be more inclined run a set of forbidden alchemy to search for one if I needed it.
My main point was that if burning earth is an issue, you absolutely must keep your non-basic land count high.
This is the version that I've been running for months, now. I cut most all the black maindeck cards a long time ago, deciding that Doom Blades were worse than Essence Scatter and that the primary way to deal with creatures is play Think Twice and Augurs early to filter your deck and then clean up the board with sweepers.
If it wasn't for the Duress in the sideboard I would go down to 10 black sources, but as it is, I don't think it makes much a difference against Burning Earth anyway. I have 4 ways to kill it after sideboard, and may add a fourth Detention Sphere over the Ratchet Bomb. I don't think you can just ignore the card just because you have a few basics in play, not when the deck is designed to utilize massive amounts of mana, so I'm more nworried about countering or laying Detention Sphere on it. I can see how a 4x Restoration Angel deck can ignore it and just race, but with true Control, I think you either take 3 damage to answer it, or go home.
I've been going over a few of the esper decks on these forums and other various sites, and I'm seeing that people are usually playing as few as 2 maindeck counterspells and as many as 8. I'd like to ask you guys -- what does everyone feel is the correct amount? Is it somewhere in the middle at around 4? Where do you guys feel is the line where you're going overboard? I'm running 5 in my deck now after recent suggestions, but I feel like 6 would be too many as drawing them when you're behind on board and trying to crawl back from a game can be terrible.
5 black sources is not enough to support a single Doom Blade. I'd only do 5 if you just had a copy of a late-game card that needed black (Drownyard) With more than that, a bare minimum is 10, but you more likely want 12 since you're Doom Blades are designed to be played on turn 2.
Also, the Cavern in his maindeck wasn't rational when he had 4 Drownyards and is extremely favored in any mirror, but if he's cutting down below 4 Drownyards then he should sideboard copies of those before copies of Cavern.
I actually cut the cavern for a third hallowed fountain because of the necessity of blue for spells. Also, I shifted the creatures of the deck to 4 Restoration Angel 4 Augur of Bolas and 1 runechanter's pike (as i think I said a number of pages back I played faeries for a while, so that seems relevant to the list I went with as default).
But as far as the manabase it comes down to using the full value of Far/Away when you can grab value off of bouncing Augur of Bolas (situational, I know, but it has pushed my capability with the deck fairly far)
I am reconsidering AEtherling though, my ability to find resources to play around my opponent dwindle with the 6-7 mana threat in the deck when I try to make full use of my mana (4 drownyard is a must for the specific version, so I switched the list to something that plays smoother for me)
Granted I top 4'ed again, and gave my friend the win to get him back for last week, so I cant say anyone is wrong, but black is currently still very important to the deck.
and Cipher, I have played your list and really enjoyed it when I did, but I wanted to know your mentality behind the list, because my perception of lines of play was very short sighted at the time, even with trying to predict the environment you play in (it wasnt "im gonna take his list and play it at fnm with no understanding", but i wished I could have).
Decks I have in my bag of tricks- Needless to say, someone who wants to play will probably have a deck UB/x Faeries UR Storm XURWB Affinity G Elves UW control
and Cipher, I have played your list and really enjoyed it when I did, but I wanted to know your mentality behind the list, because my perception of lines of play was very short sighted at the time, even with trying to predict the environment you play in (it wasnt "im gonna take his list and play it at fnm with no understanding", but i wished I could have).
It's pretty simple. I actually play Grixis more than I play Esper, since I feel it's better positioned (and I love playing with nearly zero sorceries). I ended up with this Esper list after doing a lot of goldfishing one day. When you remove the actual cognition of exactly what your opponent is up to, the development of your gameplan becomes more visible. What I realized is that the main way you win is to cast Supreme Verdict and Sphinx's Revelation. Nearly every other card in my list is designed to hit land drops and draw those 2 cards. I had 4x Far // Away at a point, and also Warped Physique at a point, but if you're going to Verdict, then these cards tend to read: gain 4-6 life. Running 4x Augur is obviously good if you follow this logic, since the card chump blocks and sets up Verdict turns, while also drawing you Verdict and Revelation. Azorius Charm is a pretty weak card right now, but it cycles when you don't need it, and if you can hit every land drop, then your late game is unbeatable. Essence Scatter helps deal with the plethora of cheap value creatures that every deck is playing, whereas Doom Blade is a loss of card advantage in exchange for lifegain (against Voice, it's not even lifegain).
Jace, Architect of Mana is literally there to hit land drops. I'm not sure what the numbers are, but the average opening hand will have 3 lands. You tend to naturally run out of mana after the 4th land drop, and this is the biggest limiter to the power of Revelation. Jace also draws into the bigger Jace late game, helping you not need to draw your entire deck to reliably kill your opponent. For the record, it's almost always faster to just Revelation your whole deck to draw Memory Adept than to Drownyard them over 6 turns.
Basically, to understand where I'm coming from, Revelation started to look worse and worse for me as the format sped up. To try and leverage it's strength I decided to build a deck that just wants to cast Augur/Think Twice/Azorius Charm and then Verdict and maybe Verdict again with Essence Scatter/Augur on 6 mana. I didn't have the manabase for Bant, so in lieu of Farseek (the card which put Revelation on the map), I'm running 20 "draw spells", 14 of which can draw into lands. The critical turns for the list are when you can Verdict with 2 mana open to Stabilize with Augur as a blocker or Azorius Charm/Essence Scatter.
I actually revamped that sideboard, and I'm going to try it tomorrow. The new one is:
Terminus was in the old sideboard because I would swap them with the Verdicts against Reanimator. I feel that the biggest issue is letting their crap resolve in the first place, forget playing Terminus to get around Rites. The Terminus would also come in against Aggro in place of Dissipates. Even if you didn't miracle it (something like 40% when you run 4 copies and play Think Twice before turn 6), it was still better than a counterspell. Now, 4x Burning Earth and 4x Domri is just too much. I lost the other day to a RG Aggro deck and I'm not going to let some scrub put me through that again. I think Archangel of Thune may possibly be a good answer to Burning Earth since they can't actually kill it, and the lifegain consistently gets larger. It also deals with Domri the same way Restoration Angel does, albeit slower. Syncopate in place of the other 2 Terminus allows me to not leave Dissipate in just to try to counter Burning Earth and Domri, while being better at stopping some early creatures and also being great in the Reanimator matchup that I yielded some (I'm also going to try boarding in 2x Archangel against Reanimator and not running Ætherling). The 4x Detention Sphere after sideboarding seems excessive, but I just don't know if I'd feel safe going down to 3 against GR Aggro. If you cast Verdict, there's a 40% chance they slap you with Burning Earth while you're tapped-out.
I would make the the Crypt Incursion a 4th Appetite but I like bringing in Incursion against Aggro. Not really necessary in a Revelation deck, but with Burning Earth, gaining 12 or 15 for 3 mana actually seems decent. I've found Appetite to be the best answer to Acidic Slime and Cavern of Souls, which is the only way Junk really can beat you.
As far as how to play the list, just prioritize hitting land drops over most things. Use your life total as a resource and remember that few cards will actually kill you before you find an answer. Thragtusk is a 2 for 1, Garruk is even worse, but Revelation will eventually draw most of your deck. I've beaten a resolved Ætherling before because my opponent went for it and let me draw 7 cards. These principles should be a given with Control in general, but nowadays many people have the midrange tap-out mentality.
I can't say that this style of Esper is better than the Sorin/Souls version (Adrian Sullivan nearly won another PTQ with his list and he doesn't strike me as a masterful player...http://www.mtgdecks.net/decks/view/56230), but this is the only way I'd play it.
Cipher i've been practicing with your build (except modified ever so slightly). I really like the theory/your explanation of how to play it. In short, I wanted to confirm that it's a solid foundation for draw-go esper.
I'm personally not a fan of 4 Revs (I know, heresy), so I only play 3. But augurs have been finding them just fine.
I did want to ask about the singleton ratchet in the side. For tokens? It just doesn't seem reliable as only a one of.
Cipher i've been practicing with your build (except modified ever so slightly). I really like the theory/your explanation of how to play it. In short, I wanted to confirm that it's a solid foundation for draw-go esper.
I'm personally not a fan of 4 Revs (I know, heresy), so I only play 3. But augurs have been finding them just fine.
I did want to ask about the singleton ratchet in the side. For tokens? It just doesn't seem reliable as only a one of.
Yes, the 3x Revelation is indeed heresy.
The Ratchet Bomb in the side was 2x, but then Burning Earth made me go up in Detention Spheres. I'm at 2x Detention Sphere in the sideboard, and no Ratchet Bombs, now.
I enjoyed the detailed explanations of your choices, but I'm really not getting your preference for Essence Scatter over Doom Blade. Unless you're dealing with massive amounts of ETB triggers or monoblack decks, Doom Blade accomplishes the same thing as Essence Scatter for the same mana, and is much more versatile as to when you can play it. If you topdeck an essence scatter the turn after they drop an Ash Zealot it's useless, while a Doom Blade is not. Doom Blade can answer their 1-drop, Essence Scatter cannot. Doom Blade lets you tap when you need to, letting you answer when you can still keep mana up for Dissipate, Drownyard, Think Twice, etc, while Essence Scatter forces you to tap on their terms instead of yours. Doom Blade wrecks bloodrush, Essence Scatter does not.
If every deck were running 12x Thragtusk, I'd agree with your choice, but if you have the mana to support either there are far more situations where Doom Blade is better than Essence Scatter than the reverse.
I enjoyed the detailed explanations of your choices, but I'm really not getting your preference for Essence Scatter over Doom Blade. Unless you're dealing with massive amounts of ETB triggers or monoblack decks, Doom Blade accomplishes the same thing as Essence Scatter for the same mana, and is much more versatile as to when you can play it. If you topdeck an essence scatter the turn after they drop an Ash Zealot it's useless, while a Doom Blade is not. Doom Blade can answer their 1-drop, Essence Scatter cannot. Doom Blade lets you tap when you need to, letting you answer when you can still keep mana up for Dissipate, Drownyard, Think Twice, etc, while Essence Scatter forces you to tap on their terms instead of yours. Doom Blade wrecks bloodrush, Essence Scatter does not.
If every deck were running 12x Thragtusk, I'd agree with your choice, but if you have the mana to support either there are far more situations where Doom Blade is better than Essence Scatter than the reverse.
The arguments go both ways, but I'm still a fan of Essence Scatter. Doom Blade is obviously worse against Junk and Jund, but better against Aggro. I tend to see more UWR/Jund/Junk, especially from the better players locally. If you're experience is different, you may want to run Doom Blade, instead. Although you may want to even consider the midrange Esper build, at that point.
Full-on Esper loses easily in a burning earth-rich environment. This deck still has 13 basics, so burning earth isn't a great sideboard. I opted for far//away because it's removal that can be cast if black doesn't show up. Adding drownyards gives a huge edge vs UWR too.
@huktonfonix
essence scatter is the best way to deal with a lot of different cards in a lot of different decks. Doom blade is also good, but not if the creature leaves something behind or is undying or regenerates or is pro a color or is blinked with resto or...
I've been finding that essence scatter is crucial for not lagging behind against voice/thragtusk/etc. I've been playing more scatters than doom blade, although the versatility of doom blade isn't anything to scoff at either.
@Cipher: I can totally see cutting the ratchet bomb for more spheres. It hasn't performed for me yet.
What are people's opinions on notion thief? Too cute?
What are people's opinions on notion thief? Too cute?
I played it in my Grixis list, and it felt like a 4 mana blowout for Sphinx's Revelation, exactly. I know it also get's Think Twice, but given the removal spells present, even after sideboarding, I just felt that another Memory Adept was better.
Maybe it would be great if you see a lot of Revelation decks? I mostly just play against these midrange and aggro decks. It's also passable against GB Rock, I suppose. In Grixis, they leave in removal for Olivia, but in Esper, I doubt they have anything after board, and it would be good against the early Liliana and Underworld Connections, the 2 cards that matter the most. It also could blow out Garruk's ultimate (his -3 ability). My guess is that it would just work poorly with Supreme Verdict, though.
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Much like I was saying before I have it at 4 because its flexible, and is one of the few cards that's never really dead in any match up. That isn't to say cards that are better in certain situations can't be used, I would just rather have the consistency. For example, I remember when I used to run warped physique. Sometimes it was nuts, other times it made me lose (oddly enough az charm would have kept those games going). The biggest value cards in the deck will always be verdict (or w.e boardwipe) and sphinx. The way I play fits very well into these two cards. I've often used far t2 just to bounce a strangleroot geist just to force the opponent to over commit to the board to catch up, and by that point souls or walkers buying yet more time eventually leads to devastating wipes (like 5 for 1) and huge sphinxes (for 7-8). In the early stages my list either plays draw go, or tempos out my opponent the first few turns just to blow them out later. It plays both styles quite well, probably because of the 4 charms giving me more options. At worst against voice you blank some damage, they get a token, might take a few next turn and if they replay it its basically just favoring you at that point since you just want to build lands up. Granted I haven't gone against too many decks lately with voice (just bant hexproof, but thats an extremely favorable match up anyway) but even when I was running 4 charms then it still wasn't the worst thing. It also always hits tokens, mainly advent, and I can't even tell you how many times Ive charmed my opponents last threat 3 times in a row. If my meta stays the same then I think my last shall too, but if Voice gets popular again, perhaps I'll have to change it up.
Thanks to Hakai Studios for the awesome sig!
Not sure when I said I was playing the deck in a way that didn't involve hitting lands every turn, and if we are in the competitive section, which jund lists are you referring to? Keyrune, from what I've seen lately, has been a 1of if any at all are run. As for arbor elf, that's quite a rarity in itself for jund to use that. Some other things: why would you use GQ t4, aside from dispatching a cavern? Also, the important side effect of using either is the same. You're losing a land regardless; the question really is do you want to do something marginal in keeping them off a potential basic land, or have multiple plays the same turn while hitting a key land. Tapping a bunch of lands and refraining from playing spells just won't cut it a majority of the time, possibly why drown has seen a slight decline.
Thanks to Hakai Studios for the awesome sig!
3 Restoration Angel
1 Snapcaster Mage
Planeswalkers (3)
2 Jace, Architect of Thought
1 Tamiyo, the Moon Sage
Spells (27)
2 Dissipate
2 Doom Blade
1 Rewind
3 Far // Away
3 Think Twice
4 Supreme Verdict
2 Lingering Souls
3 Syncopate
3 Azorius Charm
1 Haunted Plate Mail
3 Sphinx's Revelation
3 Watery Grave
3 Drowned Catacomb
4 Hallowed Fountain
4 Glacial Fortress
4 Godless Shrine
2 Isolated Chapel
3 Island
1 Ghost Quarter
2 Nephalia Drownyard
I would like to find some room in here for at least two Detention Spheres, but I'm not sure what to swap out. My meta is a lot of aggro, if anyone has advice on how to tweak my mainboard to deal with that. There's minimal control, one Aristocrats, and a few Jund decks.
I have the one copy of Plate Mail in there to test and so far I've been finding it incredibly useful. It blocks almost anything aggro has, survives board wipes, and putting it on a Spirit token handles planeswalkers and 5 damage a turn with flying can end games pretty quickly.
With that list, you don't really need the restos since they can only blink a snapcaster. I'd add 2 or 3 more snapcasters and cut the restos. Also add another drownyard. Lingering souls should be a 4 of or 0 of in my opinion.
If your meta is aggro heavy you could consider running the decklist I posted a week or 2 ago in this thread. It does pretty well vs aggro.
6 maindeck counters is a lot. 3 resto angels with only one snapcaster to blink is also a lot. I'd cut some of each and add 2-3 Augur of Bolas or 2 augur and another snap. Helps your aggro matchup and gets some value out of your resto angels.
Even though I see fewer and fewer graveyard combo decks (humanator, junk reanimator) every week, I'm still running a pair of Crypt Incursion between the SB and maindeck, and loving it. It removes Ooze and Shaman fuel, and the lifegain has put a lot of games out of reach for me against Gruul/Naya/mono-red aggro for me in games where I simply was not going to get a relevant amount of life off a revelation in time to stabilize. After a wrath or even just some early spot removal/snapcaster trades, it adds up very quickly.
Rancored Elf will cancel your order if prices go up. Read about him and other shady vendors here.
My Trade Thread!
-3 resto angels -- great and deals with planeswalkers, I vote to remove, but keeping them isn't bad, but you need to drop mail plate to make room
-2 syncopate -- great turn 2-4, but only if the opponent doesn't mana accel and taps out, you want a turn 2-3 augur instead on turn 2-3 instead
-2 lingering souls -- they're only chump blockers that land turn 3+, IMO not playable without sorin
-1 snapcaster mage -- he's good, but terrible vs aggro since esper flashbacks cost 2 meaning he's useless until turn 4
-1 rewind -- comes down late vs aggro and doesn't untap lands if it's countered
+3 augur -- dig for verdict and block all those 2/2 forever, plays turn 2, and generates almost as much card advantage as snapcaster. If you keep resto, that's up to 6 digs 3 deep which gives 18 cards (a huge amount of your deck). Adding jace to that gives the best digging possible in a post-ponder world.
+1 essence scatter -- most decks don't run cavern, so it's a kill target creature before ETB triggers
+1 aetherling -- a fast win condition if mill fails -- not necessarily needed with resto
+1 warped physique -- because doom blade can't hit black creatures
+2 detention sphere -- you said make room. Personally, I'd probably play 1 MB and the other SB.
+1 cryptic incursion -- you're game play is to put lots of cards in the GY. Aggro is mostly creatures. Mill them if you can (or just verdict) then play this to win (while you *can* lose, I never have as 20+ lifegain is just that hard to recover from). If aggro is that popular, consider a second in main and a third in sideboard
+0 swap one land for a third drownyard. 4 colorless lands is fine.
cards to consider:
blood baron -- He's a great wall vs aggro and the lifelink really helps. play 1-2
obzedat -- not my preference, but works. play only 1
lavinia of the tenth -- if you have loads of RG and RDW, she's only going to die if you choose to wipe the board, plus she timewalks them most of the time. Play 1 (maybe 1 in SB if red is that common)
sorin, lord of innistrad -- as mentioned, he's great with souls and makes your augurs and angels much better late game. The downside to playing him is if you don't fare well against bonfire, electrickery, and trample (hexproof specifically). Play 2
renounce the guilds -- good vs jund, domri aggro, bant, aristocrats (hit the important creatures through the tokens). Bad with sorin and d-sphere (but playable with blood baron). play 2
mutavault -- a good 1-2 of and survives board wipe. I've been testing a no-creatures build with 4 mutavault, 4 haunted mail plate, 4 dimir keyrune, and 4 azorius keyrune. It's fun if you like trying something different.
Though you haven't mentioned it, SB is also important. Pithing needle, terminus, negate, dispel, jace, memory adept, witchbane orb (deals with bonfire, rakdos's return, memory adept, and curse (a must if you're playing sorin and souls)), curse of death's hold, notion thief, rest in peace, etc are needed to deal with these decks more fully.
I've run esper without resto for quite a while (only creatures being 2 blood baron and 3 augur with notion thief and aetherling in sideboard).
bant hexproof, RDW, gruul aggro, aristocrats, BW humans and UWR are all good matchups IMHO. Blitz is fairly good unless they have a nut draw (in which case you just lose). Burning earth changes this a bit (I've taken to UW or UB instead of Esper because burning earth is that much of a problem in my meta at the moment).
Domri midrange, Jund midrange, and reanimator (mostly dead, but still worth mentioning) are lousy matchups in my experience.
Vs. Domri midrange This matchup is made difficult because of domri (of course), burning earth, and large haste creatures (hellkite, hellrider, and flinthoof boar). This matchup almost convinced me to board 2 blind obedience. The largest problem is that they have 8 permanents that threaten to (effectively) end the game quickly (4 domri and 4 burning earth) while esper only plays 4 counters, a couple d-spheres, and renounce the guilds. If they're on the play, there's almost nothing you can do about T1 land and elf followed by T2 domri. A resolved burning earth means you take at least 3 damage to kill it (and only if you have the o-ring). My main answer here was 2 pithing needles to help the hit (second can always be played on wolf-run). Sideboarding in council of the absolute after they board out mizzium mortars was another idea I toyed with. I also recommend a third d-sphere if you expect this matchup. I don't think you need 6 board wipes, but I'd definitely side in terminus as it deals with strangleroot.
Vs. Jund... the most broken deck in standard at the moment. Jund has it all, the best removal (putrify, bonfire), the best mana acceleration (farseek), the best card advantage (garruk primal hunter, rakdos's return, etc), and the best creatures (tusk, olivia, huntmaster, etc). Since most game 1 setups are geared against aggro, it's generally in your favor. Game 2 is where they side out some of the removal and side in liliana, the other rakdos's return, ruric thar, sire of insanity, etc. It is my opinion that this deck is currently the only reason that Esper isn't a tier 1 deck (though if it weren't for jund, reanimator would eat esper and then there's burning earth, so...). Anyway, let me expound on Jund a little.
With them playing 4-6 planeswalkers, your best answers are pithing needle as it can hit olivia, planeswalkers, scavanger ooze, and wolf-run. If they ever resolve thragtusk followed by primal hunter to draw 5, the game is more out of reach than if your UWR opponent revelationed for 10 (jund's power level per card is that high). An alternate that I've seen a number of times is the turn 3 garruk that churns out 3/3 tokens every turn. In short, it's easier to recover from liliana making both of you discard than garruk allowing them to draw. Another card of note is underworld connections. This card is bad (IMHO) not only because it draws cards, but because they now have the chance to miracle bonfire every turn.
Bonfire is huge in this matchup. It takes you a while to win with mill (and with huntmaster and thragtusk, even aetherling hitting for 8 a turn takes a while). Even after you think you've stabilized, you're probably one bonfire (or rakdos's return) from death and the bonfire just keeps getting larger (general note: any one of a half dozen jund threats completely eliminates your control -- never count on establishing control as you can't). The best way to deal with this particular threat is witchbane orb which shuts both of these down beautifully.
Ruric Thar and sire of insanity are basically auto-lose cards if you can't get rid of them (you must counter thar and counter or kill sire on their turn). I've seen more of ruric-thar recently and I believe he's the worse of the two because esper plays so many non-creatures and even with the doom blade in hand, you're guaranteed to take 6 damage in the late game (a fascinating "you lose" if they play it when you have less than 6 life).
The rest of the creatures are the usual passive card advantage engines that are hard/impossible to one for one. With mill being the best way to win, don't board in terminus, you probably don't need it anyway (if they're smart, they'll play out only one or two creatures at a time). Tamiyo's tap ability is often better than removal (they're forced to play a second threat which sets up a 2 for 1. I side out architect of thought, but side in one memory adept, the distraction and extra 10 cards helps push things just a little more in my favor. Renounce the guilds is good as it hits huntmaster, sire, ruric-thar, or liliana while avoiding tokens. Clone or evil twin help deal with thragtusk or olivia (just don't clone huntmaster as that doesn't end well).
The last cards I sideboard are appetite for brains and duress. Appetite hits most of the creatures and garruk while the biggest duress targets are liliana and rakdos's return and early farseeks. If I'm on the play, I keep in syncopate as countering their turn 2 farseek is a gamechanger. Games 2-3 are probably 60/40 in favor of jund in my experience (it used to be better before UWR became a thing and forced jund to pack some answers).
Not much to say about reanimator except that it eats esper alive. It's a very rare thing to win even a couple of games. While you *could* build your deck to take on reanimator, by the time you were finished, you would have terrible games vs a lot of other decks.
Vs hexproof it's mostly luck of their draw (like with blitz, you can't beat a nut draw). Board in renounce the guilds, ratchet bomb, duress, and negate. I also board in terminus and board out doom blade and warped physique. When hexproof took an upswing a while ago, I swapped terminus for merciless eviction with great success. I feel that aetherling or blood baron are a little better win conditions than mill in this matchup since hexproof is so non-interactive.
vs golgari control. Not much to say except win by mill and play all your sweepers and pithing needle (and side out doom blade). Without bonfire, ruric, sire, return, and garruk, it's not much to worry about. The biggest threats are underworld connections, liliana, and vraska (who kills drownyards).
vs UWR. This match heavily favors esper simply because of esper's removal. Your augurs beat their snapcasters and tie with their augurs, so focus attention on their restoration angels. In game 2, they tend to bring in assemble the legion, memory adept, and hellkite (plus some counters). Needle or RIP works vs moorland haunt and jace. The best answer to legion is curse of death's hold as their only answer is usually d-sphere Since curse kills snapcaster, zeroes augur, and reduces resto to a 2/3, it usually spells the end of the line if they can't answer it (game one they can actually burn you out with turn//burn, pillar, helix, snapcaster and resto, but pillar and turn//burn usually come out game two). Notion thief does a lot of work. Side in witchbane if you suspect memory adept.
Vs junk aristocrats. Game 1 can be difficult. This is where you will be thankful if you play 2 warped physique and 1 doom blade instead of the reverse. Hit blood artist before you board wipe and play blood baron ASAP if he's in your 60 like he should be. Post-board, play RIP or curse and guard it with your life (duress is good because it can hit abrupt decay). I don't like augur very much for this matchup though I often play one aetherling. Jace, architect of thought also works well at blanking all their small creatures. Tamiyo's card draw can be amazing here (I've had them alpha with 4 souls tokens only to tamiyo for 4 cards the next turn). Renounce is great as it hits aristocrat, varolz, and voice. Conversely, far//away isn't good at all. Finally, terminus or merciless eviction offers a way to deal with regen, undying, and tokens.
vs BW humans. Play blood baron, curse, and RIP. Sticking any one of these will win the game.
I may add more later...
play the three & see your friend doing a face of HOLY CRAP!! that was priceless (that was in game two of one game day)
BTW this is the deck i use in two game days, losing to bad draws in semifinals :(, i think i need help with the sideboard.
4 Glacial Fortress
4 Godless Shrine
4 Hallowed Fountain
3 Isolated Chapel
3 Nephalia Drownyard
3 Watery Grave
2 Island
3 Snapcaster Mage
1 AEtherling
4 Think Twice
3 Azorius Charm
3 Sphinx's Revelation
2 Ratchet Bomb
2 Oblivion Ring
2 Dissipate
2 Doom Blade
2 Syncopate
2 Supreme Verdict
2 Terminus
2 Far // Away
1 Renounce the Guilds
1 Jace, Memory Adept
1 Sever the Bloodline
2 Negate
1 Supreme Verdict
1 Terminus
1 Sever the Bloodline
1 Planar Cleansing
1 Shrivel
1 Curse of Death's Hold
1 Psychic Spiral
1 Crypt Incursion
1 Rest in Peace
1 Blood Baron of Vizkopa
1 Blind Obedience
1 Sundering Growth
1 Essence Scatter
Essence Scatter? well to be honest at the time of writting my deck i found one missing spot & saw that card on one of my deck box.
my meta is almost full of aggro decks, random Dimir mill, weird american deck, 1 Kibler deck, 1 elves and some tokens decks.
any advice would be appreciated
With a full aggro meta, you should be very well positioned.
If you have lots of token decks, illness in the ranks is better than curse. Play one in sideboard and keep the curse for elves. I'd also remove shrivel. If the matchup is that bad for you despite all your board wipe, add a second curse. Shrivel is useless if they have just one elf lord.
I'd move ratchet bomb to sideboard and add 2 warped physique to give you 6 spot removal cards. Bring in the bombs vs elves and tokens.
Get rid of the planar cleansing. 3 terminus and 3 verdict (plus 2 ratchet bomb and curse) is enough board wipe; plus, you don't want to risk removing your o-rings.
Replace one mainboard syncopate with your essence scatter since everyone plays lots of creatures. Use it on undying, tusk, and other hard to remove creatures. If you have a second scatter, I'd play it too.
Play a second cryptic incursion, but play it mainboard. Incursion is only bad against other control decks that run 3-6 creatures, but it's a lifesaver in most of your matches.
Get rid of sundering growth. If you're having artifact problems (I can't think of any), just play a third o-ring as it can hit the artifact and a whole lot more.
I don't see you needing sever the bloodline. You have better token answers and a bunch of answers to voice and undying. Sever cost's a lot and plays at sorcery speed.
A single dispel or a third negate in sideboard will help any control/mill matchups. If you have issues dealing with the mill deck, board a witchbane orb in addition to spiral.
A single ghost quarter may be a good idea if your meta plays wolf-run. I'd also run 26 lands instead of 27.
I'm not sure what your weird american deck is. If it's aggro, you're all set. If it's control, counter the important stuff and illness in the ranks does a lot of work vs assemble the legions.
Creatures---9
2 AEtherling
3 Restoration Angel
1 Snapcaster Mage
3 Augur of Bolas
4 Supreme Verdict
4 Sphinx's Revelation
3 Far/Away
2 Dissipate
2 Warped Physique
1 Think Twice
3 Azorius Charm
1 Doom Blade
2 Essence Scatter
2 Syncopate
3 Isolated Chapel
3 Drowned Catacombs
1 Cavern of Souls
2 Hallowed Fountain
2 Godless Shrine
2 Watery Grave
4 Nephalia Drownyard
3 Island
1 Swamp
3 Plains
UB/x Faeries
UR Storm
XURWB Affinity
G Elves
UW control
With so few black spells, I'd change the mana base.
I'd play:
2 drownyard -- you only need one on the battlefield to win. Plus, you have the creatures to beat down most of the time.
4 hallowed fountain
3 glacial fortress
1 drowned catacombs
1 isolated chapel
3 swamp
7 plains
7 island
+1 cavern of souls -- in the sideboard for control matchups, you don't want another non-basic in main if it does nothing
With 5 black sources, you'll have one within the first couple of draws most of the time (if you don't just have it among your openers). eliminating a far//away or two for a celestial flare or renounce the guilds will make those misses less noticeable. I'd play 2 jace, architect of thought to help dig for one to activate drownyard though. I haven't tested this setup, but I like the idea enough that I think I'll be giving it a try.
That land base is a lot more similar to the base used by UW:
4 hallowed fountain
4 glacial fortress
1 azorius guildgate
1-2 ghost quarter/mutavault
8 island
7-8 plains
5 black sources is not enough to support a single Doom Blade. I'd only do 5 if you just had a copy of a late-game card that needed black (Drownyard) With more than that, a bare minimum is 10, but you more likely want 12 since you're Doom Blades are designed to be played on turn 2.
Also, the Cavern in his maindeck wasn't rational when he had 4 Drownyards and is extremely favored in any mirror, but if he's cutting down below 4 Drownyards then he should sideboard copies of those before copies of Cavern.
Let's look at some numbers. With 5 cards and a 7 card hand, your chance are 47.5% of having it in your opening hand. Chances of having a black source by your second draw are 57%. If you played a think twice, that chance is now 62%.
With 7 sources, your chances by turn 2 (on the draw) are 70% and with that think twice are 75%. With 10 sources, your turn 1 chances (7 cards) are 75% and turn 2 with think twice are 86%.
Looking at the odds, I'm inclined to agree with you that more black sources are needed, but I think 7 is sufficient and switching two hallowed fountains for a watery grave and a godless shrine would be more than acceptable. (especially considering that the chances of drawing one of those five black spells is fairly low.)
Swapping the remaining two hallowed fountains could also be considered if you like the slightly higher statistics, but at that point, I'd be more inclined run a set of forbidden alchemy to search for one if I needed it.
My main point was that if burning earth is an issue, you absolutely must keep your non-basic land count high.
1 Jace, Memory Adept
1 Jace, Architect of Thought
4 Augur of Bolas
2 Snapcaster Mage
Spells (25)
2 Essence Scatter
3 Dissipate
4 Azorius Charm
2 Far
4 Supreme Verdict
2 Detention Sphere
4 Think Twice
4 Sphinx's Revelation
1 Island
4 Hallowed Fountain
4 Glacial Fortress
3 Watery Grave
4 Drowned Catacomb
3 Godless Shrine
4 Isolated Chapel
4 Nephalia Drownyard
1 Jace, Memory Adept
1 Ætherling
1 Dispel
1 Essence Scatter
1 Dissipate
2 Duress
2 Appetite for Brains
4 Terminus
1 Ratchet Bomb
1 Detention Sphere
This is the version that I've been running for months, now. I cut most all the black maindeck cards a long time ago, deciding that Doom Blades were worse than Essence Scatter and that the primary way to deal with creatures is play Think Twice and Augurs early to filter your deck and then clean up the board with sweepers.
If it wasn't for the Duress in the sideboard I would go down to 10 black sources, but as it is, I don't think it makes much a difference against Burning Earth anyway. I have 4 ways to kill it after sideboard, and may add a fourth Detention Sphere over the Ratchet Bomb. I don't think you can just ignore the card just because you have a few basics in play, not when the deck is designed to utilize massive amounts of mana, so I'm more nworried about countering or laying Detention Sphere on it. I can see how a 4x Restoration Angel deck can ignore it and just race, but with true Control, I think you either take 3 damage to answer it, or go home.
I actually cut the cavern for a third hallowed fountain because of the necessity of blue for spells. Also, I shifted the creatures of the deck to 4 Restoration Angel 4 Augur of Bolas and 1 runechanter's pike (as i think I said a number of pages back I played faeries for a while, so that seems relevant to the list I went with as default).
But as far as the manabase it comes down to using the full value of Far/Away when you can grab value off of bouncing Augur of Bolas (situational, I know, but it has pushed my capability with the deck fairly far)
I am reconsidering AEtherling though, my ability to find resources to play around my opponent dwindle with the 6-7 mana threat in the deck when I try to make full use of my mana (4 drownyard is a must for the specific version, so I switched the list to something that plays smoother for me)
Granted I top 4'ed again, and gave my friend the win to get him back for last week, so I cant say anyone is wrong, but black is currently still very important to the deck.
and Cipher, I have played your list and really enjoyed it when I did, but I wanted to know your mentality behind the list, because my perception of lines of play was very short sighted at the time, even with trying to predict the environment you play in (it wasnt "im gonna take his list and play it at fnm with no understanding", but i wished I could have).
UB/x Faeries
UR Storm
XURWB Affinity
G Elves
UW control
It's pretty simple. I actually play Grixis more than I play Esper, since I feel it's better positioned (and I love playing with nearly zero sorceries). I ended up with this Esper list after doing a lot of goldfishing one day. When you remove the actual cognition of exactly what your opponent is up to, the development of your gameplan becomes more visible. What I realized is that the main way you win is to cast Supreme Verdict and Sphinx's Revelation. Nearly every other card in my list is designed to hit land drops and draw those 2 cards. I had 4x Far // Away at a point, and also Warped Physique at a point, but if you're going to Verdict, then these cards tend to read: gain 4-6 life. Running 4x Augur is obviously good if you follow this logic, since the card chump blocks and sets up Verdict turns, while also drawing you Verdict and Revelation. Azorius Charm is a pretty weak card right now, but it cycles when you don't need it, and if you can hit every land drop, then your late game is unbeatable. Essence Scatter helps deal with the plethora of cheap value creatures that every deck is playing, whereas Doom Blade is a loss of card advantage in exchange for lifegain (against Voice, it's not even lifegain).
Jace, Architect of Mana is literally there to hit land drops. I'm not sure what the numbers are, but the average opening hand will have 3 lands. You tend to naturally run out of mana after the 4th land drop, and this is the biggest limiter to the power of Revelation. Jace also draws into the bigger Jace late game, helping you not need to draw your entire deck to reliably kill your opponent. For the record, it's almost always faster to just Revelation your whole deck to draw Memory Adept than to Drownyard them over 6 turns.
Basically, to understand where I'm coming from, Revelation started to look worse and worse for me as the format sped up. To try and leverage it's strength I decided to build a deck that just wants to cast Augur/Think Twice/Azorius Charm and then Verdict and maybe Verdict again with Essence Scatter/Augur on 6 mana. I didn't have the manabase for Bant, so in lieu of Farseek (the card which put Revelation on the map), I'm running 20 "draw spells", 14 of which can draw into lands. The critical turns for the list are when you can Verdict with 2 mana open to Stabilize with Augur as a blocker or Azorius Charm/Essence Scatter.
I actually revamped that sideboard, and I'm going to try it tomorrow. The new one is:
1 Ætherling
2 Archangel of Thune
2 Syncopate
1 Dissipate
2 Duress
3 Appetite for Brains
2 Detention Sphere
1 Crypt Incursion
Terminus was in the old sideboard because I would swap them with the Verdicts against Reanimator. I feel that the biggest issue is letting their crap resolve in the first place, forget playing Terminus to get around Rites. The Terminus would also come in against Aggro in place of Dissipates. Even if you didn't miracle it (something like 40% when you run 4 copies and play Think Twice before turn 6), it was still better than a counterspell. Now, 4x Burning Earth and 4x Domri is just too much. I lost the other day to a RG Aggro deck and I'm not going to let some scrub put me through that again. I think Archangel of Thune may possibly be a good answer to Burning Earth since they can't actually kill it, and the lifegain consistently gets larger. It also deals with Domri the same way Restoration Angel does, albeit slower. Syncopate in place of the other 2 Terminus allows me to not leave Dissipate in just to try to counter Burning Earth and Domri, while being better at stopping some early creatures and also being great in the Reanimator matchup that I yielded some (I'm also going to try boarding in 2x Archangel against Reanimator and not running Ætherling). The 4x Detention Sphere after sideboarding seems excessive, but I just don't know if I'd feel safe going down to 3 against GR Aggro. If you cast Verdict, there's a 40% chance they slap you with Burning Earth while you're tapped-out.
I would make the the Crypt Incursion a 4th Appetite but I like bringing in Incursion against Aggro. Not really necessary in a Revelation deck, but with Burning Earth, gaining 12 or 15 for 3 mana actually seems decent. I've found Appetite to be the best answer to Acidic Slime and Cavern of Souls, which is the only way Junk really can beat you.
As far as how to play the list, just prioritize hitting land drops over most things. Use your life total as a resource and remember that few cards will actually kill you before you find an answer. Thragtusk is a 2 for 1, Garruk is even worse, but Revelation will eventually draw most of your deck. I've beaten a resolved Ætherling before because my opponent went for it and let me draw 7 cards. These principles should be a given with Control in general, but nowadays many people have the midrange tap-out mentality.
I can't say that this style of Esper is better than the Sorin/Souls version (Adrian Sullivan nearly won another PTQ with his list and he doesn't strike me as a masterful player...http://www.mtgdecks.net/decks/view/56230), but this is the only way I'd play it.
Cipher i've been practicing with your build (except modified ever so slightly). I really like the theory/your explanation of how to play it. In short, I wanted to confirm that it's a solid foundation for draw-go esper.
I'm personally not a fan of 4 Revs (I know, heresy), so I only play 3. But augurs have been finding them just fine.
I did want to ask about the singleton ratchet in the side. For tokens? It just doesn't seem reliable as only a one of.
Yes, the 3x Revelation is indeed heresy.
The Ratchet Bomb in the side was 2x, but then Burning Earth made me go up in Detention Spheres. I'm at 2x Detention Sphere in the sideboard, and no Ratchet Bombs, now.
I enjoyed the detailed explanations of your choices, but I'm really not getting your preference for Essence Scatter over Doom Blade. Unless you're dealing with massive amounts of ETB triggers or monoblack decks, Doom Blade accomplishes the same thing as Essence Scatter for the same mana, and is much more versatile as to when you can play it. If you topdeck an essence scatter the turn after they drop an Ash Zealot it's useless, while a Doom Blade is not. Doom Blade can answer their 1-drop, Essence Scatter cannot. Doom Blade lets you tap when you need to, letting you answer when you can still keep mana up for Dissipate, Drownyard, Think Twice, etc, while Essence Scatter forces you to tap on their terms instead of yours. Doom Blade wrecks bloodrush, Essence Scatter does not.
If every deck were running 12x Thragtusk, I'd agree with your choice, but if you have the mana to support either there are far more situations where Doom Blade is better than Essence Scatter than the reverse.
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The arguments go both ways, but I'm still a fan of Essence Scatter. Doom Blade is obviously worse against Junk and Jund, but better against Aggro. I tend to see more UWR/Jund/Junk, especially from the better players locally. If you're experience is different, you may want to run Doom Blade, instead. Although you may want to even consider the midrange Esper build, at that point.
4 augur of bolas
1 aetherling
1 haunted plate mail
planeswalkers (2 +1)
1 jace, memory adept
1 jace, architect of thought
1 pithing needle
counters(7)
2 dissipate
1 render silent
2 syncopate
2 essence scatter
removal(12)
4 supreme verdict
2 far//away
2 renounce the guilds
4 azorius
3 sphinx's revelation
3 think twice
land(26)
3 hallowed fountain
3 glacial fortress
2 drowned catacombs
1 watery grave
2 isolated chapel
7 island
6 plains
2 nephalia drownyard
1 pithing needle
2 terminus
2 ratchet bomb
2 blind obedience
1 witchbane orb
1 aetherling
1 oblivion ring
2 detention sphere
2 negate
1 dispel
Full-on Esper loses easily in a burning earth-rich environment. This deck still has 13 basics, so burning earth isn't a great sideboard. I opted for far//away because it's removal that can be cast if black doesn't show up. Adding drownyards gives a huge edge vs UWR too.
@huktonfonix
essence scatter is the best way to deal with a lot of different cards in a lot of different decks. Doom blade is also good, but not if the creature leaves something behind or is undying or regenerates or is pro a color or is blinked with resto or...
@Cipher: I can totally see cutting the ratchet bomb for more spheres. It hasn't performed for me yet.
What are people's opinions on notion thief? Too cute?
I played it in my Grixis list, and it felt like a 4 mana blowout for Sphinx's Revelation, exactly. I know it also get's Think Twice, but given the removal spells present, even after sideboarding, I just felt that another Memory Adept was better.
Maybe it would be great if you see a lot of Revelation decks? I mostly just play against these midrange and aggro decks. It's also passable against GB Rock, I suppose. In Grixis, they leave in removal for Olivia, but in Esper, I doubt they have anything after board, and it would be good against the early Liliana and Underworld Connections, the 2 cards that matter the most. It also could blow out Garruk's ultimate (his -3 ability). My guess is that it would just work poorly with Supreme Verdict, though.