So I came across a situation in the finals match at my local FNM today (clearly, a Cataline Wine Mixer level event), and I wanted to get some clarification. I did not contact a judge during the conflict, so I am not trying to validate/negate another judge's ruling. This is strictly between myself and the other player in the finals (though in the future, I will probably just consult a judge immediately).
Here is the game state:
It is game 2 of the finals.
I was at 14 life, no creatures on the board, Opponent had a Notion Thief and 2 Snapcaster Mages in play. Essentially I was on a 2 turn lethal clock to his damage from those creatures.
I told him that he could not counter the Detention Sphere, since it had already resolved and he had asked for targets. He said he could, because it was in response to me casting.
The target ability from Detention Sphere is a triggered, enters the battlefield ability (wording might not be 100% accurate there).
My question is, at what point does the spell resolve? If he is asking me for targets, has he acknowledged the spell has resloved and the ability has triggered? Or do I need to ask him for a response to the casting, or announce the trigger first? Neither of us are/were new to magic, but we both had differing opinions on how announcing the targets for Detention Sphere works.
Any input is greatly appreciated, and thank you for your help in advance.
From section 4.2 of the Magic Tournament Rules, which apply to all DCI-sanctioned tournaments including FNM:
If a player casts a spell or activates an ability and announces choices for it that are not normally made until resolution, the player must adhere to those choices unless an opponent responds to that spell or ability. If an opponent inquires about choices made during resolution, that player is assumed to be passing priority and allowing that spell or ability to resolve.
By the time the sphere has entered the battlefield, it can't be countered, since it's no longer on the stack. While you can shortcut it (And most people do) the way it works is you cast it, find out whether it resolves or not, then name the target.
What your opponent did is not a legal move, he has to counter it before you name a target.
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Collecting Maw of the Mire! Feel free to send me any you have, so long as they're in reasonable condition.
Detention Sphere targets when it comes into play, because it's effect is a triggered ability, which triggers when it comes into play, which can be clearly identified by the "When..." at the beginning of it's effect. By asking for targets, you're basically acknowledging that it's resolving, unless you explicitly state otherwise. For instance...
Hey, it's still on the stack, but out of curiosity, what are you planning on targeting?
Detention Sphere has no targets as a spell, only an ETB trigger. You do not target anything until the spell has resolved.
In the situation you described I would definitely call a judge for a ruling. Your opponent's asking for a target COULD BE inferred as he/she acknowledging that the spell has resolved, thus passed the point where he/she could counter the spell. But with this being FNM, I'm not sure how your judge would rule it.
By the time the sphere has entered the battlefield, it can't be countered, since it's no longer on the stack. While you can shortcut it (And most people do) the way it works is you cast it, find out whether it resolves or not, then name the target.
What your opponent did is not a legal move, he has to counter it before you name a target.
So, based on that board state, I then would have exiled the 3 Snapcaster Mages in play, and he would've had a Counterflux with flashback available until end of turn?
So, based on that board state, I then would have exiled the 3 Snapcaster Mages in play, and he would've had a Counterflux with flashback available until end of turn?
Correct. Assuming no one responds to the Snapcaster as a spell nor his triggered ability to give Counterlash Flashback until end of turn.
Your D Sphere resolves.
With the D Sphere ETB ability on the stack, targeting a Snapcaster Mage, your opponent Flashes in another Snapcaster Mage.
Snapcaster resolves, as does his ETB ability to give Counterlash Flashback until end of turn.
Your D Sphere's ETB ability resolves, exiling all 3 Snapcaster Mages...$90 removed from the game...
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So I came across a situation in the finals match at my local FNM today (clearly, a Cataline Wine Mixer level event), and I wanted to get some clarification. I did not contact a judge during the conflict, so I am not trying to validate/negate another judge's ruling. This is strictly between myself and the other player in the finals (though in the future, I will probably just consult a judge immediately).
Here is the game state:
It is game 2 of the finals.
I was at 14 life, no creatures on the board, Opponent had a Notion Thief and 2 Snapcaster Mages in play. Essentially I was on a 2 turn lethal clock to his damage from those creatures.
I cast Detention Sphere. He looked at it, then asked me for the target. I replied Snapcaster Mage. He said in response, cast Snapcaster Mage targeting Counterflux, counter the Detention Sphere.
I told him that he could not counter the Detention Sphere, since it had already resolved and he had asked for targets. He said he could, because it was in response to me casting.
The target ability from Detention Sphere is a triggered, enters the battlefield ability (wording might not be 100% accurate there).
My question is, at what point does the spell resolve? If he is asking me for targets, has he acknowledged the spell has resloved and the ability has triggered? Or do I need to ask him for a response to the casting, or announce the trigger first? Neither of us are/were new to magic, but we both had differing opinions on how announcing the targets for Detention Sphere works.
Any input is greatly appreciated, and thank you for your help in advance.
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Lightning Bolts don't kill creatures. State-based actions kill creatures.
"When Detention Sphere enters the battlefield"
By the time the sphere has entered the battlefield, it can't be countered, since it's no longer on the stack. While you can shortcut it (And most people do) the way it works is you cast it, find out whether it resolves or not, then name the target.
What your opponent did is not a legal move, he has to counter it before you name a target.
In the situation you described I would definitely call a judge for a ruling. Your opponent's asking for a target COULD BE inferred as he/she acknowledging that the spell has resolved, thus passed the point where he/she could counter the spell. But with this being FNM, I'm not sure how your judge would rule it.
So, based on that board state, I then would have exiled the 3 Snapcaster Mages in play, and he would've had a Counterflux with flashback available until end of turn?
Correct. Assuming no one responds to the Snapcaster as a spell nor his triggered ability to give Counterlash Flashback until end of turn.
Your D Sphere resolves.
With the D Sphere ETB ability on the stack, targeting a Snapcaster Mage, your opponent Flashes in another Snapcaster Mage.
Snapcaster resolves, as does his ETB ability to give Counterlash Flashback until end of turn.
Your D Sphere's ETB ability resolves, exiling all 3 Snapcaster Mages...$90 removed from the game...