Just wondering, is JtMS any good in stax? This card is good in legacy and other formats when it comes to control, but is it any good in EDH and in stax?
Jace is good everywhere. If people are struggling to establish a board state and he hits, you're going to drown the table in card advantage and just take the game over.
I made a thread about it, but I think sire of insanity is an amazing stax card. I just can't get him to work right now.
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The EDH stax primer When you absolutely, positively got to kill every permanent in the room, accept no substitutes.
Strionic Resonator? Does this have a place in Stax? It seems good, being able to copy Smokestack and Braids triggers. I am playing Thrax as my General, would be nice to also copy his ability. What do you guys think?
Strionic Resonator? Does this have a place in Stax? It seems good, being able to copy Smokestack and Braids triggers. I am playing Thrax as my General, would be nice to also copy his ability. What do you guys think?
I've decided to give it a shot in my Mishra-stax (that is focused on artifacts).
It is nice to copy the smokestax trigger with 3-4 counters to push someone really behind. It is also nice for copying token triggers and similar to help you to have stuff to be feeded to smokestax etc.
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Quote from Prophylaxis »
Also modgaming Bur setups is kind of treading down a dark path
Nothing in this game is degenerate or completely dominant. They haven't banned anything in standard in a long, long time. Hell they should have banned affinity right away, but they didn't until boxed sales collapsed too. Hasbro had to come in and fire people.
I'll enjoy watching all the whiners eat crow monday.
Is Monoblue Stax a thing? Right now I'm UW Grand Arbiter but wondering if Monoblue would be better. I lose Armageddon, Thalia and Replenish though.
I have had luck with mono blue stax running Meloku the Clouded Mirror as the general. You lose the LD, but still have Sunder and Land Equilibrium. Quicksliver Fountain can also be fun. And don't forget Back to Basics.
I have had luck with mono blue stax running Meloku the Clouded Mirror as the general. You lose the LD, but still have Sunder and Land Equilibrium. Quicksliver Fountain can also be fun. And don't forget Back to Basics.
Could I see your list? I too have a Meloku stax list that I've had for some time, and would like to see another one.
Is Monoblue Stax a thing? Right now I'm UW Grand Arbiter but wondering if Monoblue would be better. I lose Armageddon, Thalia and Replenish though.
I haven't had much luck with monoblue. I honestly think Stax needs black to truly be effective, mostly because of the forced sacrifice aspect. I mean, you have the eponymous card, but I like to be able to stop my opponent dead in his tracks.
Card advantage is not the same thing as card draw. Something for 2B cannot be strictly worse than something for BBB or 3BB. If you're taking out Swords to Plowshares for Plummet, you're a fool. Stop doing these things!
I haven't had much luck with monoblue. I honestly think Stax needs black to truly be effective, mostly because of the forced sacrifice aspect. I mean, you have the eponymous card, but I like to be able to stop my opponent dead in his tracks..
I don't find black to be needed. Most of my stax decks that worked out better were without black.
I think it varies on playstyle
All stax decks do vary on playstyle but mono blue will be VERY difficult. Usually you need atleast 2 colors and 3 would be best. In mono blue, you don't have as many answers or stax/denial effects alone or etc. I mean its definitely doable but MUCH harder to pilot and win with.
All stax decks do vary on playstyle but mono blue will be VERY difficult. Usually you need atleast 2 colors and 3 would be best. In mono blue, you don't have as many answers or stax/denial effects alone or etc. I mean its definitely doable but MUCH harder to pilot and win with.
Syphon Flesh is some good black sac + some chumps to fuel other forms of it.
Would Norn's Annex count for anything or is the 2 life not a big enough penalty in commander to warrant anything, also the amount of lands that tap for any color diminish it as well.
Syphon Flesh is some good black sac + some chumps to fuel other forms of it.
Would Norn's Annex count for anything or is the 2 life not a big enough penalty in commander to warrant anything, also the amount of lands that tap for any color diminish it as well.
Even if lands tap for any color, when you create white and it's not in your color identity, it becomes colorless.
Even if lands tap for any color, when you create white and it's not in your color identity, it becomes colorless.
It doesn't become colorless - it's colorless to begin with.
903.9. If mana would be added to a player's mana pool of a color that isn't in the color identity of that player's commander, that amount of colorless mana is added to that player's mana pool instead.
Uhh what? I don't think this makes any sense. Have you played Stax decks against other decks? The smokestack takes an ENTIRE turn cycle to tick up to one. If my opponents have an aura shards or viashino heretic or shattering pulse or etc in play, I will never win the game with a smokestack.
Mono blue stacks, to me, sounds VERY difficult to do as I don't think it would have much reach or ability to lock down fast enough.
Could I see your list? I too have a Meloku stax list that I've had for some time, and would like to see another one.
I've switched it to a Thraximundar stax deck for meta reasons. When it was together though, the Meloku build ran a Stasis lock, as well as the Stax stuff, Sunder, Tangle Wire, Academy Ruins to recur and such. I will post the Thrax list when I have some more time. I am currently putting the finishing touches on it. PM me though, and I'll discuss my former Meloku build more with you if you like.
Mono blue stacks, to me, sounds VERY difficult to do as I don't think it would have much reach or ability to lock down fast enough.
Isn't blue known for locking down the game? Heh.
In all seriousness, it would have to be combined with lots of control elements and use stax as a control element/secondary lock.
But I believe it's very possible to make a mono-blue stax deck.
With the talk on what colors are good for stax and why, I think too many people emphasize Smokestack and Braids, Cabal Minion. These are about the most timing-dependent cards that Stax plays, in my opinion. Certainly, a T3 or T4 Braids is one of the biggest single threats in the format that can touch down that early, but she's a blank late by herself, and the window where she's good closes earlier and earlier as playgroups adapt to Stax, or just trim down their deck generally. The feeling can be that the sac effects are just too slow. Even when 4 copies are available, not all of the Mishra's Workshop decks in Vintage run Smokestack, and a lot of them have just started running Slash Panther and Lodestone Golem to finish. None of them have ever run Braids, to my knowledge.
If I were to come up with my top 10 Stax cards for EDH, 7 or 8 of them would probably be artifacts. Off the top of my head - Winter Orb, Static Orb, Sphere of Resistance, Tangle Wire. So the ability to interact with artifacts is probably the chief qualification of any color. Blue is the clear leader there with Tezzeret, Fabricate, Academy Ruins, etc, and Red is a distant second due mainly to Goblin Welder and goblin tutors. I would probably rate White higher than Red in general because of the creature versions of these artifacts. So for me Blue > White > Red > Black = Green. The only 'necessary' color for me is Blue, and generally I pick the other colors based on what choice of Commander they give me.
So although I think the mana intensiveness of Meloku Stax would be kind of odd, I think it's more than do'able. Thada Adel Stax is terrific though, and I've built very obvious and preliminary versions of her that have performed well. You can always fish out an opponent's artifact to sacrifice it if you really want to push the upkeep of pain theme.
Here's a UB deck I posted recently that's close to mono-Blue in its Stax elements. It's pretty simple in the direction it takes, and it focuses more on doing the more effective things more repeatedly and consistently rather than on a lot of scattered elements.
I'm Stax Guy #2 if you need outside advice from a blue-player's advice. I approach Stax differently than Phil, Dan, David, and everybody else in my playgroup does.
Just give me a private message, and I will get back to you with my input, but just be prepared for my reply.
Was just about to post here about Spirit Mirror It can be used to trigger grave pact, which seems pretty cool.
WBRG Saskia the Unyielding
WUB Sharuum the Hegemon
RWU Shu Yun, the Silent Tempest
RG Wort, the Raidmother
WU Brago, King Eternal
B Chainer, Dementia Master
Jace is good everywhere. If people are struggling to establish a board state and he hits, you're going to drown the table in card advantage and just take the game over.
I made a thread about it, but I think sire of insanity is an amazing stax card. I just can't get him to work right now.
The EDH stax primer
When you absolutely, positively got to kill every permanent in the room, accept no substitutes.
I've decided to give it a shot in my Mishra-stax (that is focused on artifacts).
It is nice to copy the smokestax trigger with 3-4 counters to push someone really behind. It is also nice for copying token triggers and similar to help you to have stuff to be feeded to smokestax etc.
Who's eating crow?
I have had luck with mono blue stax running Meloku the Clouded Mirror as the general. You lose the LD, but still have Sunder and Land Equilibrium. Quicksliver Fountain can also be fun. And don't forget Back to Basics.
Could I see your list? I too have a Meloku stax list that I've had for some time, and would like to see another one.
http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/showthread.php?t=307453
I haven't had much luck with monoblue. I honestly think Stax needs black to truly be effective, mostly because of the forced sacrifice aspect. I mean, you have the eponymous card, but I like to be able to stop my opponent dead in his tracks.
There is one monoblue Stax option, but Erayo, Soratami Ascendant is banned for reasons.
On phasing:
I don't find black to be needed. Most of my stax decks that worked out better were without black.
I think it varies on playstyle
[Primer] Kozilek, Butcher with Juice.
Post a list so we can see?
Wanted Card List: (PM me)
1 Avacyn, Angel of Hope
1 Ravages of War
1 Swords to Plowshares (Judge)
1 Land Tax (Judge)
U
1 Mana Vortex
B
1 Desolation Angel (Foil)
1 Guardian Beast
1 Contamination
R
1 Kiki-Jiki, Mirror Breaker
G
1 Food Chain
WUBRG
1 Rohgahh of Kher Keep
X
1 Charcoal Diamond (Foil)
1 Fellwar Stone (Foil)
T
1 Temple Garden (Foil)
3 Mutavault
1 Kor Haven
I dunno, top of my head stasis + something like Vedalken Mastermind. Throw a Tangle Wire in the mix or those old decks that use skip turn cards with Smokestack and Stasis.
There's cards like Arcane Laboratory, Frozen Aether, Overburden, Back to Basics.
It seems to be leaning towards lockdown-stax.
[Primer] Kozilek, Butcher with Juice.
Smokestack + Academy Ruins is pretty much all blue needs.
Would Norn's Annex count for anything or is the 2 life not a big enough penalty in commander to warrant anything, also the amount of lands that tap for any color diminish it as well.
Even if lands tap for any color, when you create white and it's not in your color identity, it becomes colorless.
[Primer] Kozilek, Butcher with Juice.
It doesn't become colorless - it's colorless to begin with.
Yeah, maybe I should've worded it better.
[Primer] Kozilek, Butcher with Juice.
Uhh what? I don't think this makes any sense. Have you played Stax decks against other decks? The smokestack takes an ENTIRE turn cycle to tick up to one. If my opponents have an aura shards or viashino heretic or shattering pulse or etc in play, I will never win the game with a smokestack.
Mono blue stacks, to me, sounds VERY difficult to do as I don't think it would have much reach or ability to lock down fast enough.
Wanted Card List: (PM me)
1 Avacyn, Angel of Hope
1 Ravages of War
1 Swords to Plowshares (Judge)
1 Land Tax (Judge)
U
1 Mana Vortex
B
1 Desolation Angel (Foil)
1 Guardian Beast
1 Contamination
R
1 Kiki-Jiki, Mirror Breaker
G
1 Food Chain
WUBRG
1 Rohgahh of Kher Keep
X
1 Charcoal Diamond (Foil)
1 Fellwar Stone (Foil)
T
1 Temple Garden (Foil)
3 Mutavault
1 Kor Haven
I've switched it to a Thraximundar stax deck for meta reasons. When it was together though, the Meloku build ran a Stasis lock, as well as the Stax stuff, Sunder, Tangle Wire, Academy Ruins to recur and such. I will post the Thrax list when I have some more time. I am currently putting the finishing touches on it. PM me though, and I'll discuss my former Meloku build more with you if you like.
Isn't blue known for locking down the game? Heh.
In all seriousness, it would have to be combined with lots of control elements and use stax as a control element/secondary lock.
But I believe it's very possible to make a mono-blue stax deck.
[Primer] Kozilek, Butcher with Juice.
If so what would you run in it? Who would the commander be and why?
I think they try to discourage lists in this sub forum so I would say post it in the multiplayer deck area and link it here?
Also I believe infernal darkness is in the thread somewhere.
Wanted Card List: (PM me)
1 Avacyn, Angel of Hope
1 Ravages of War
1 Swords to Plowshares (Judge)
1 Land Tax (Judge)
U
1 Mana Vortex
B
1 Desolation Angel (Foil)
1 Guardian Beast
1 Contamination
R
1 Kiki-Jiki, Mirror Breaker
G
1 Food Chain
WUBRG
1 Rohgahh of Kher Keep
X
1 Charcoal Diamond (Foil)
1 Fellwar Stone (Foil)
T
1 Temple Garden (Foil)
3 Mutavault
1 Kor Haven
If I were to come up with my top 10 Stax cards for EDH, 7 or 8 of them would probably be artifacts. Off the top of my head - Winter Orb, Static Orb, Sphere of Resistance, Tangle Wire. So the ability to interact with artifacts is probably the chief qualification of any color. Blue is the clear leader there with Tezzeret, Fabricate, Academy Ruins, etc, and Red is a distant second due mainly to Goblin Welder and goblin tutors. I would probably rate White higher than Red in general because of the creature versions of these artifacts. So for me Blue > White > Red > Black = Green. The only 'necessary' color for me is Blue, and generally I pick the other colors based on what choice of Commander they give me.
So although I think the mana intensiveness of Meloku Stax would be kind of odd, I think it's more than do'able. Thada Adel Stax is terrific though, and I've built very obvious and preliminary versions of her that have performed well. You can always fish out an opponent's artifact to sacrifice it if you really want to push the upkeep of pain theme.
Here's a UB deck I posted recently that's close to mono-Blue in its Stax elements. It's pretty simple in the direction it takes, and it focuses more on doing the more effective things more repeatedly and consistently rather than on a lot of scattered elements.
http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/showthread.php?t=525664
Best bet is post a link here.
amazingly epic sig courtesy of DarkNightCavalier at Heroes of the Planes.
Just give me a private message, and I will get back to you with my input, but just be prepared for my reply.
EDH
BWG Doran Suicide Tempo BWG
BUW Sharuum Midrange Control BUW