We need your help, you are just not helping us. You boldly called me scum and you were wrong. You called GMan town and you were wrong. Your reads aren't that sharp at all and you're barely providing reasoning on them. Stop sidestepping questions, stop playing dumb, you're smarter than that.
We need your help, you are just not helping us. You boldly called me scum and you were wrong. You called GMan town and you were wrong. Your reads aren't that sharp at all and you're barely providing reasoning on them. Stop sidestepping questions, stop playing dumb, you're smarter than that.
Why was Macius town?
Why is TMCT scum?
I think I understand why Seppel is thinking that TCMT is scum, but I don't agree with it just on the face of it. There's too many variables.
@Tom: Answer Seppel's question.
Also, I actually agree with Kosa's claiming Void-enhancement. Void being confirmed town (with a very powerful ability) is worth the risk, I feel, especially since there's at least a Doc still alive, and possibly/probably other protective roles.
tl;dr version: typically 3rd party role whose wincon is to kill/lynch one specific person. This bit in the flavor seems to confirm this: "Asenion locked on to a target, following their movements with his keen senses, noting that they were engaged in a fight of their own. He adjusted his existence's resonance so that it was in-tune with that of his mark's. He moved synchronously with the fighter, looking for the moment to learn what he needed to know."
However, Asenion was in fact town, not 3rd-party, which means I don't really know how Iso balanced it or if in fact that is what his role actually did.
Seppel, you need to explain at this point. Your behavior coming into toDay is not where it should be considering your statements from yesterDay. Please explain what your thought process was from yesterDay and why you believe the information to be irrelevant now that Macius is dead Town.
KK, you're welcome, but you appoarched toDay was awful claiming that information. Next time, hold your cards closer to you. Me being nearly confirmed Town won't matter too much unless my reads are accurate, which, as you know, typically not right.
Doing a full reread at this point. Focus on GMan and Asecion.
Maybe Iso was just relating to ingame events, like, as if Asenion was watching two people arguing... anyway, let us not flavorgame.
Considering half of Void's claim is true, he also probably has the power to grant people Night vigshots. Based on this, I find highly unlikely that we have two Night Vigs, especially when we have Tom. I would say GMan's kill was courtesy of the SK.
Seconded. This is actually super important Seppel. Why was Macius town? Also, while we're at it, why was Guardman town?
TMCT overreacted. Why is that particular overreaction scummy? Looks like the opposite in this case.
I agree with Rhand, especially given what Silver linked. Flavour feels like Asenion died because he was linked to Guardman's death somehow. Not sure about the third-party thing, but Asenion doesn't make sense as a mafia target anyway since he had lots of suspicion. They probably targeted Kosakosa (who was saved by Void).
Guardman didn't give us much to work with, unfortunately.
* Macius is town.
* Jumped on me with some pretty weak reasoning.
* Argued with Void, but he's already town.
* Lots of interaction with Seppl - anger at the "Macius is town" thing, following him onto Kosakosa's wagon, but absolutely no indication of his thoughts on Seppel at any point, even when angry.
* swishh voted TMCT on two separate occastions (RVS and later on). Both were a problem for Guardman.
* Bland answer to Silver's questions.
Rhand I have leaning town. Stardust I have no opinion on. Tom, I don't think he's scum, but I wouldn't be surprised to find out he's the SK or something along those lines.
For one last time could you please say why you think Macius is town. You've been saying this since you replaced in and you never, ever, EVER have said why you think he is town. And you have refused to even answer why you think that way.
Mostly out of frustration that nobody is taking Macius seriously anymore after a bad claim. It's like he claimed people realized they can test it and then they are satisfied with testing it when whether or not it is true is meaningless to his alignment. And one of the few people calling him town, Seppel, has refused to say why he is town despite me asking him repeatedly to say why, with me either being ignored or told to wait until tomorrow. Both of which are not acceptable responses. So yes I am going to be passive aggressive towards Seppel and his responses over this... but I think I just got side tracked and answered a different question... eh, whatever. Anyways I am active lurking to be passive aggressive towards Seppel so that he will get frustrated and actually tell me why he thinks Macius is town so I can either agree with him or tell him why he is wrong and we can go on to lynching Macius, except in the chance that Seppel can convince me via his reasoning that Macius is town.
@Rhand: If I withhold info, it increases the chance the mafia will try to kill me.
Seppel you aren't helping anything by doing this I can prove he is town, but I'll say later. Unless you can prove otherwise Macius should be the lynch today as everything about him screams scum. And it isn't noob acting like scum stuff this is classic scum stuff that comes from a scummy mindset such as OMGUSing everyone that voted him to voting for himself and joining his wagon to trying to just straight WIFOM in response to his wagon.
I've played too many games with you to just trust you because you are Seppel.
Though I do really like Seppel's kosa case as it puts some hats on kosa more than just this flavor thing which has devolved into what the definition of "flavor" is.
I still would prefer a Macius lynch (I have a stronger scum read on Macius), but I have no problem with a kosakosa lynch today.
I'm willing to claim without being pushed to L-2. In fact it would be interesting to see how Void responds to my claim compared to how he responded to Macius.
TMCT is scum though.
Vote: The Most Curious Thing
I feel like we have a mindreader problem here. You say something and then expect me to read your mind on the rest. Unfortunately I have not been exposed to enough cosmic radiation to yet develop this power. Plus I would rather spend my time on more fruitful endeavors like gaining the power to control gravity using gamma radiation.
Why Macius over Swish? Saying that Macius stole Void's vote doesn't make sense, because why would he force Void to vote himself. Whatever's going on doesn't appear to be Macuis's fault.
Make no mistake I am no fan of swishh, but I have serious problems with how Macius has acted and reacted to pressure from his self vote to his FoS to his everybody who is voting me is scum. And his uninterested claim doesn't really do anything other than say I should just keep sailing in the same direction. As such I think he is more worthy of my vote.
Well except for our friend the vote thief. Which I'm guessing is either automatic or compulsive, because that's a bizarre application of the ability so early in the game.
Unless that is what he wants you think so that you won't guess his insidious plot to take over the world using a rigged election to make sure his pet goldfish Bob is elected president. In fact he might not even be a he at all. But we are approaching Tilde level conspiracy theories here.
I've been in too many games where the dayvig was anti-town. In this game especially I think we should treat all roles as neutral and try to go on behavior.
Guardman pushing to get the anti-town 3rd party lynched.
Rhand/Kosakosa/Silver/Seppel/Void/Macius are Town
Stardust/Wheat are Unknowns (Take a look at their interactions with Guardman. So odd.)
TMCT/Stormblind are Likely Scum
Tom is the freaking SK
@Tom: Please kill TMCT Stormblind, Stardust, or Wheat. Then we can lynch you.
(I was convinced Guardman was town because upon review, he was posting like he did as town. Looks like I should toss out meta and just go on behavior.)
He actually thinks I come off looking worse from the Guardman interactions. Did he even analyze those quotes? Guardman was fishing me like a fatty, and as soon as I called him out on his "scum of consciousness" he got super defensive and really cared about what I had to say.
I agree with Seppel's town reads.
Void is town because of meta. Silver is town for correctly pointing that out.
Kosa and Macius are confirmed.
Seppel: I don't see Stardust implying that you look bad because of your interactions with Guardman. You do look bad because you keep refusing to explain yourself.
He actually thinks I come off looking worse from the Guardman interactions. Did he even analyze those quotes? Guardman was fishing me like a fatty, and as soon as I called him out on his "scum of consciousness" he got super defensive and really cared about what I had to say.
A Guardman lynch sounds nice. Those last posts were written in a scum of consciousness method.
What does scum of consciousness even mean? Are you saying that me ranting is scummy?
I'm saying that your "rant" was scummy.
How was it scummy?
I know you're trying really hard to clear yourself based on interactions, but you're just wrong. At the same time you handwave my interactions with him, calling them "odd". Care to elaborate? Because I'm feeling pretty vindicated after having a scum player try to get me lynched based on misreading my posts.
I rushed to make my last post and forgot to make a note on Tom. Minor thing, but Guardman consistently called him neutral with no interactions otherwise.
I find highly unlikely that I was the NK target and survived due to the vest. Iso sent me the PM saying that I have (note the present tense) a one-shot vest a bit after the Day started, hinting that it resolved at the start of the Day. I don't think I'd have received the message if I had lost the vest in the same Night I earned it, since I wouldn't technically have it no longer.
Until we go through another Night, Occam points Asenion's death to the mafia NK and GMan's to a SK, I suppose.
At the same time you handwave my interactions with him, calling them "odd". Care to elaborate?
Seriously, elaborate. Because what I'm quoting below is you throwing suspicion at two players with a weak scum word "odd". If they're so odd, why aren't either of us in your scum list? Probably because you're just casting a wide net.
Rhand is town you chucklehead. Just look at his interactions with Guardman.
There is no reason for Rhand to be clearing based on meta. If anything, Rhand should be using game mechanics plus my Role ability to determine my alignment. This does not fit the Rhand that I know as Town. And to say "the interactions don't line up" is complete WIFOM. You're saying that Rhand would not interact with Guardman that way if Rhand is scum.
I'm okay with lyncing either Rhand or Seppel at this point.
Void, why am I not allowed to use meta?
I had you on quite sure town way before Kosa confirmed you because of meta.
There is a difference between the polite scumvoid and the direct and sometimes rude townvoid. Silver correctly pointed that out.
At the same time you handwave my interactions with him, calling them "odd". Care to elaborate?
Seriously, elaborate. Because what I'm quoting below is you throwing suspicion at two players with a weak scum word "odd". If they're so odd, why aren't either of us in your scum list? Probably because you're just casting a wide net.
Seppel is casting a WIDE NET of ONLY FOUR PEOPLE LEFT IN THE GAME WHO COULD POSSIBLY BE SCUM
Void, why am I not allowed to use meta?
I had you on quite sure town way before Kosa confirmed you because of meta.
There is a difference between the polite scumvoid and the direct and sometimes rude townvoid. Silver correctly pointed that out.
I didn't say that you couldn't use meta. I said that you using meta in this situation is not your town game. Your Town game here would be using behavioral analysis and looking at my ability. You ignored my ability and are only comparing my behavior here to another game of mine. Btw, which game are you choosing to meta me on?
KK did not confirm me via meta. He is confirming me via my ability and behavior. Your getting this wrong/twisting what I am saying.
And you fully believe that that is my scum meta? And that nothing has changed about scum meta in my last few scum games?
Void, you're using my meta to explain why I can't use yours...
I saw townvoid on day1, nothing changed that read and kosa confirmed it day 2.
"Because of meta" was my original read.
*shrug*
Void, you're using my meta to explain why I can't use yours...
I saw townvoid on day1, nothing changed that read and kosa confirmed it day 2.
"Because of meta" was my original read.
*shrug*
Yes, I am using your meta here. And once again, I am not saying that you can't use my meta here. I'm saying that you using my meta here makes you scum, because using meta in this situation is the wrong way to go about getting a read on me at the present time. I cannot make this point anymore clear.
"Because of meta" is fine for Day 1. That is the best way to avoid lynching Town early on. But come Day 2, meta becomes weak and behavioral analysis needs to take affect. Just becasue you see me posting as what you call Town!Void does not mean that I am Town or nearly confirmed Town. A meta read on Day 2 might as well put me into a null category.
I would say to ask Iso, because he saw my scum meta change in a GIP.
Do me a favor, Rhand. Case me and show me that I am Town.
*sigh*
You're confirmed by Kosa. You're town. When a day 1 metaread gets confirmed like this, then why would I look for other tells on day 2?
I don't see the point in putting a case together to prove your confirmed alignment.
Stormblind: Why did you expect you would die, and why did you expect TMCT would die?
I did suggest having someone organize a kill on me, and have TMCT. End result of a top townie suspect dead or the mafia having to burn a tonne of resources to just kill tmct, AND me dying.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
[19:59] greymon90210: Hey StormBlind how tall are you? "I'm six money *****, don't forget it"
"The Critics always said that we'd only have a black president when pigs flu"...
Stormblind: Why did you expect you would die, and why did you expect TMCT would die?
I did suggest having someone organize a kill on me, and have TMCT. End result of a top townie suspect dead or the mafia having to burn a tonne of resources to just kill tmct, AND me dying.
I suppose that's consistent but I'm still unimpressed with the idea from the beginning.
No, I'm a dayvig. I can't kill people in the Night too... think about that. 14 player game, yo.
----
@Seppel: Is that what you meant by your question? Also, I'm going to use my kill on whoever we get to L-2 and are ready to lynch, so that we effectively get another lynch. I'm not going to rando-shoot someone right now just because you tell me to.
And calling me a day-viging SK? A 14 player game that has 2 evil kills per night and 1 evil kill per day? Use your head.
This doesn't feel like townSeppel. Getting the reasoning for his reads out of him has been like pulling teeth and he still hasn't given most it. Vote: Seppel
----
@Void: What happened from 721 to 728? Seppel's posts didn't explain Macius or TMCT.
Also what's going on with 730 & 743? This is the second time this game you've voted the same person twice in a row with no unvote (for that person) in between. Last time was Day 1 on Macius (95 & 105).
Should be interesting to see if your vote sticks again. There is already evidence in favor of you knowing why your vote sticks.
This doesn't feel like townSeppel. Getting the reasoning for his reads out of him has been like pulling teeth and he still hasn't given most it. Vote: Seppel
Would you shoot me if I didn't reveal my reads?
Your vote doesn't align with your mindset. You sound like you just want me to explain myself, but then you say you'll shot the person who gets to L-2, but then you push me closer to L-2!
I'd ask what is wrong with you, but I already know.
I'm strongly leaning that way. I need to look over things after finals are over but I'm probably going to put my vote there.
I know that I dislike the Seppel wagon. The votes on him are (mostly) because he's unhelpful, not because he's scum. He's shown that he's going to continue being insufferable, voting him isn't going to help that situation.
This doesn't feel like townSeppel. Getting the reasoning for his reads out of him has been like pulling teeth and he still hasn't given most it. Vote: Seppel
Would you shoot me if I didn't reveal my reads?
Your vote doesn't align with your mindset. You sound like you just want me to explain myself, but then you say you'll shot the person who gets to L-2, but then you push me closer to L-2!
I'd ask what is wrong with you, but I already know.
I said I'd shoot if we got someone to L-2 and are ready to lynch (after the claim).
I also never said I couldn't be a part of the wagon. I'm voting you because until I have reason to believe otherwise I think you are scum. And I will shoot you if enough other people agree.
Why was Macius town?
Why is TMCT scum?
I think I understand why Seppel is thinking that TCMT is scum, but I don't agree with it just on the face of it. There's too many variables.
@Tom: Answer Seppel's question.
Also, I actually agree with Kosa's claiming Void-enhancement. Void being confirmed town (with a very powerful ability) is worth the risk, I feel, especially since there's at least a Doc still alive, and possibly/probably other protective roles.
Anyone?
I have the impression that Asenion sacrificed himself to kill Guardman and that the nightkill didn't happen.
If that's not true, then we seem to have a town nightvig, which means Tom is probably not town.
tl;dr version: typically 3rd party role whose wincon is to kill/lynch one specific person. This bit in the flavor seems to confirm this: "Asenion locked on to a target, following their movements with his keen senses, noting that they were engaged in a fight of their own. He adjusted his existence's resonance so that it was in-tune with that of his mark's. He moved synchronously with the fighter, looking for the moment to learn what he needed to know."
However, Asenion was in fact town, not 3rd-party, which means I don't really know how Iso balanced it or if in fact that is what his role actually did.
Why is your first impression that there was no NK on a Night with two deaths?
Because I read the lore, and the dead townie seems to have killed himself.
Seppel, you need to explain at this point. Your behavior coming into toDay is not where it should be considering your statements from yesterDay. Please explain what your thought process was from yesterDay and why you believe the information to be irrelevant now that Macius is dead Town.
WHY DO YOU THINK I WANT YOUR REASONING FFS
KK, you're welcome, but you appoarched toDay was awful claiming that information. Next time, hold your cards closer to you. Me being nearly confirmed Town won't matter too much unless my reads are accurate, which, as you know, typically not right.
Doing a full reread at this point. Focus on GMan and Asecion.
Considering half of Void's claim is true, he also probably has the power to grant people Night vigshots. Based on this, I find highly unlikely that we have two Night Vigs, especially when we have Tom. I would say GMan's kill was courtesy of the SK.
Seconded. This is actually super important Seppel. Why was Macius town? Also, while we're at it, why was Guardman town?
TMCT overreacted. Why is that particular overreaction scummy? Looks like the opposite in this case.
I agree with Rhand, especially given what Silver linked. Flavour feels like Asenion died because he was linked to Guardman's death somehow. Not sure about the third-party thing, but Asenion doesn't make sense as a mafia target anyway since he had lots of suspicion. They probably targeted Kosakosa (who was saved by Void).
Guardman didn't give us much to work with, unfortunately.
* Macius is town.
* Jumped on me with some pretty weak reasoning.
* Argued with Void, but he's already town.
* Lots of interaction with Seppl - anger at the "Macius is town" thing, following him onto Kosakosa's wagon, but absolutely no indication of his thoughts on Seppel at any point, even when angry.
* swishh voted TMCT on two separate occastions (RVS and later on). Both were a problem for Guardman.
* Bland answer to Silver's questions.
I'd say Seppel and TMCT look the worst out of the gates here. Reread to get others' interactions with Guardman to come.
Also Macius is apparently alive again.
Guardman pushing to get the anti-town 3rd party lynched.
Rhand/Kosakosa/Silver/Seppel/Void/Macius are Town
Stardust/Wheat are Unknowns (Take a look at their interactions with Guardman. So odd.)
TMCT/Stormblind are Likely Scum
Tom is the freaking SK
@Tom: Please kill TMCT Stormblind, Stardust, or Wheat. Then we can lynch you.
(I was convinced Guardman was town because upon review, he was posting like he did as town. Looks like I should toss out meta and just go on behavior.)
Come on, people.
And here's one for the scrapbook:
Alright, I'm done. Start voting Tom.
He actually thinks I come off looking worse from the Guardman interactions. Did he even analyze those quotes? Guardman was fishing me like a fatty, and as soon as I called him out on his "scum of consciousness" he got super defensive and really cared about what I had to say.
Thank you, Seppel.
Vote: TMCT
Void is town because of meta. Silver is town for correctly pointing that out.
Kosa and Macius are confirmed.
Seppel: I don't see Stardust implying that you look bad because of your interactions with Guardman. You do look bad because you keep refusing to explain yourself.
Vote: Rhand
Oh my god, you suck (right back at ya ;)).
Is this "super defensive"? No.
I know you're trying really hard to clear yourself based on interactions, but you're just wrong. At the same time you handwave my interactions with him, calling them "odd". Care to elaborate? Because I'm feeling pretty vindicated after having a scum player try to get me lynched based on misreading my posts.
I rushed to make my last post and forgot to make a note on Tom. Minor thing, but Guardman consistently called him neutral with no interactions otherwise.
Rhand is town you chucklehead. Just look at his interactions with Guardman.
Until we go through another Night, Occam points Asenion's death to the mafia NK and GMan's to a SK, I suppose.
Just lynch him.
Seriously, elaborate. Because what I'm quoting below is you throwing suspicion at two players with a weak scum word "odd". If they're so odd, why aren't either of us in your scum list? Probably because you're just casting a wide net.
There is no reason for Rhand to be clearing based on meta. If anything, Rhand should be using game mechanics plus my Role ability to determine my alignment. This does not fit the Rhand that I know as Town. And to say "the interactions don't line up" is complete WIFOM. You're saying that Rhand would not interact with Guardman that way if Rhand is scum.
I'm okay with lyncing either Rhand or Seppel at this point.
I lol'd
I had you on quite sure town way before Kosa confirmed you because of meta.
There is a difference between the polite scumvoid and the direct and sometimes rude townvoid. Silver correctly pointed that out.
Seppel is casting a WIDE NET of ONLY FOUR PEOPLE LEFT IN THE GAME WHO COULD POSSIBLY BE SCUM
DEAR GOD SEPPEL IS A MANIAC
LYNCH HIM NOW
That's correct. And it has nothing to do with meta. You're the one using meta.
I didn't say that you couldn't use meta. I said that you using meta in this situation is not your town game. Your Town game here would be using behavioral analysis and looking at my ability. You ignored my ability and are only comparing my behavior here to another game of mine. Btw, which game are you choosing to meta me on?
KK did not confirm me via meta. He is confirming me via my ability and behavior. Your getting this wrong/twisting what I am saying.
And you fully believe that that is my scum meta? And that nothing has changed about scum meta in my last few scum games?
Vote: Rhand
I saw townvoid on day1, nothing changed that read and kosa confirmed it day 2.
"Because of meta" was my original read.
*shrug*
Yes, I am using your meta here. And once again, I am not saying that you can't use my meta here. I'm saying that you using my meta here makes you scum, because using meta in this situation is the wrong way to go about getting a read on me at the present time. I cannot make this point anymore clear.
"Because of meta" is fine for Day 1. That is the best way to avoid lynching Town early on. But come Day 2, meta becomes weak and behavioral analysis needs to take affect. Just becasue you see me posting as what you call Town!Void does not mean that I am Town or nearly confirmed Town. A meta read on Day 2 might as well put me into a null category.
I would say to ask Iso, because he saw my scum meta change in a GIP.
Do me a favor, Rhand. Case me and show me that I am Town.
You're confirmed by Kosa. You're town. When a day 1 metaread gets confirmed like this, then why would I look for other tells on day 2?
I don't see the point in putting a case together to prove your confirmed alignment.
You're confirmed town in my heart
It's... surprising that me and TMCT are still alive. I fully expected one of us to die last night. (More TMCT then me TBH.)
Seppel's play is really starting to irritate me. His holier then thou, I don't have to disclose anything.
You said Macius was town yesterday, and said you'd explain today. So explain.
I did suggest having someone organize a kill on me, and have TMCT. End result of a top townie suspect dead or the mafia having to burn a tonne of resources to just kill tmct, AND me dying.
I suppose that's consistent but I'm still unimpressed with the idea from the beginning.
No, I'm a dayvig. I can't kill people in the Night too... think about that. 14 player game, yo.
----
@Seppel: Is that what you meant by your question? Also, I'm going to use my kill on whoever we get to L-2 and are ready to lynch, so that we effectively get another lynch. I'm not going to rando-shoot someone right now just because you tell me to.
And calling me a day-viging SK? A 14 player game that has 2 evil kills per night and 1 evil kill per day? Use your head.
This doesn't feel like townSeppel. Getting the reasoning for his reads out of him has been like pulling teeth and he still hasn't given most it. Vote: Seppel
----
@Void: What happened from 721 to 728? Seppel's posts didn't explain Macius or TMCT.
Also what's going on with 730 & 743? This is the second time this game you've voted the same person twice in a row with no unvote (for that person) in between. Last time was Day 1 on Macius (95 & 105).
Should be interesting to see if your vote sticks again. There is already evidence in favor of you knowing why your vote sticks.
Wheat, do you think Stormblind is scum?
Would you shoot me if I didn't reveal my reads?
Your vote doesn't align with your mindset. You sound like you just want me to explain myself, but then you say you'll shot the person who gets to L-2, but then you push me closer to L-2!
I'd ask what is wrong with you, but I already know.
I'm strongly leaning that way. I need to look over things after finals are over but I'm probably going to put my vote there.
I know that I dislike the Seppel wagon. The votes on him are (mostly) because he's unhelpful, not because he's scum. He's shown that he's going to continue being insufferable, voting him isn't going to help that situation.
I'd post my reasoning but the game I would reference is still ongoing.
I will answer the rest later, but you need to fully explain why you believe this statement.
I said I'd shoot if we got someone to L-2 and are ready to lynch (after the claim).
I also never said I couldn't be a part of the wagon. I'm voting you because until I have reason to believe otherwise I think you are scum. And I will shoot you if enough other people agree.
I already did and Stardust brought something up about it too. I don't have time now but I can probably find quotes next time I'm on.
Vote Tom.
Share your reasoning you chucklehead.