But that was as a response on my attack, wasn't it? Should I have added the word 'scum' to my attack against you?
No, I made an inference that you were scum before that.
We wouldn't be having this discussion now if my parents never had sex. What is your argument?
Me asking the question happened in this thread.
It's not so much a matter of elaboration - I may have misused that term a little bit - but more a case of you not trying to persuade me to see the error of my case against you. I try to lay out my case as good as I can. iLord questioned me. You try to make iLord suspect. I say making someone suspect for the sole reason of making someone suspect is scummy.
Asking a question to see why someone's doing something scummy isn't always intended to make that person look scummy.
Tell me where I'm wrong and we can go from there.
The part where you think I'm scum for asking iLord the question I asked him.
I think me elaborating is not something in the interest of the game - otherwise I would have done so back then.
I disagree. Actually, I find your assertion completely ridiculous.
I think it's pretty clear who you're referring to in #20, but I'd like for you to commit all the same. I would also be most interested in an explanation of why you felt that you should still remain ambiguous at this juncture. It's fairly clear from your comments towards AI that you understand the importance of going "on record."
I'm going to agree with Kpaca and pioint out that Burst is painting things as scummy.
Christmas is kinda bogging me down though, hopefully I'll have better reads tomorrow
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Originally Posted by Arcadic View Post
scumbag
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Post #32. I'm disagreeing with Kpaca, because that was terribly-terrible if it was an out-in-the-open coach.
As for Wessel vs. Burst, I'm trying to follow what just happened, and <headassplode>. I feel like I'm reading a giant misdirection by smokescreen from Wessel. No honest read yet, but the tone is uncomfortable to me.
Just sayin.
--->DJ
You're disagreeing because it's terrible? Shouldn't you agree with me then? Are you scum number three?
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a)I'm not stupid. I hate how people are interpreting my post one way or another without asking for clarification first.
b)I"m still waiting Zas to answer my other question, until he does so I'm not explaining my vote.
c)RVS is dead and buried.
How would knowing his experience affect your opinion of him?
(ftr, ZasZ has plenty of experience, but only sporadically signs up for games nowadays. I think)
Of course it will, do you think experience doesn't matter when evaluating things people say?
Three things.
1)Why do you think we just need to follow Ced and everything will be fine?
2)You are a little overeager no? I don't remember Ced voting/accusing me of anything.
3)Looks like you are a gimmick, but can you tell us how much experience you have with mafia anyway?
This computer does weird things to posts. This is what I was trying to post: In all the bustle, no one commented on my "MMM" impression. Sad day.
Additionally, I feel that a lot of players are giving DRey a pass here. I'd like him to justify his claim that "this is not a rvs vote."
I wish I had three votes.
Three things.
1)what mmm means?
2)Who's giving me a pass here? I haven't even posted since yesterday. Why do you think I need to justify the "not a rvs vote" and not my vote per se?
3)Do you think you already discovered three scum so soon? Impressive, please share with us your scum list please.
Yeah I also don't buy the I lord votes but they are coming from mostly inexperienced players so I'm chalking it up to that.
Name those inexperienced players please sir.
---
Too many posts, more later.
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The game is not being dumbed down. Control is doing fine; Draw-Go is not the only kind of control. Aggro is doing fine; Red Deck Wins is not the only kind of aggro. Creature combat is an important core concept and belongs in every color. Mythic rarity is not destroying the game. People whine too much for no good reason. Magic is more popular than ever, so keep calm, brew some decks and play some damn cards.
What is the reason you're asking me this? Are you trying to get me on the DRey wagon? Or are you asking me this because you're trying to get me defend DRey? Honestly, if DRey meant that question in post 15 seriously, I will be the first person to turn that question around and ask it to DRey. I can't see how anyone who has played at least a couple of games (as I seeDRey has) can be so stupid to think that ZasZ's offer was realistic. Therefore, I saw DRey's post as a gambit (which post 15 merely reinforced, and he hasn't posted/defended himself since then). Therefore, I chose not to defend or attack DRey, instead I wanted to see the reactions to it and comment on those.
If you don't think 15 was serious, why would he ask ced first?
Never underestimate human stupidity! I lost a game due to not giving a scum (Serial Killer) the chance to be stupid - not doing it again.
I think I'm committed. Not every individual may see it, but I can't fool the player base as a whole.
I now have to weigh between ced395's request and yours - and since one of the two possible actions is irrevocable I'll decline for now.
AsianInvasion may decide to deny my request and take the consequences, but would then be under scrutiny. I *am* under scrutiny thanks to you.
Do you really need what you request? Right now? Or is it enough that we both are on the record with these two posts of ours? Think about it! Be smart!
There is no reasonable way that you remaining vague can help the town. The original post in itself isn't concerning, but your insistence on refusing to elaborate is. You're either being intentionally difficult, or you've got the greatest fear of committal I've ever seen. My request stands, and I urge you to put this matter to a close if you're just wasting our time.
Having actually read the post now, Unvote. Unless he is stupider than anyone I've seen before, there's no way he asks all those questions as scum.
I don't quite follow your thought process here. How do his questions exclude him from being scum? Or even making him more likely town, for that matter?
Well, aside from the fact that he seems to make posts like that as town (example), there's no incentive for a scum to make such a post. Not only could it look like fishing, it's not even useful fishing, and it doesn't help him blend in at all.
Well, aside from the fact that he seems to make posts like that as town (example), there's no incentive for a scum to make such a post. Not only could it look like fishing, it's not even useful fishing, and it doesn't help him blend in at all.
The incentive for most scum posts is to make it look like they're actually scumhunting.
Well, aside from the fact that he seems to make posts like that as town (example), there's no incentive for a scum to make such a post. Not only could it look like fishing, it's not even useful fishing, and it doesn't help him blend in at all.
I know I'm town, but you clearing me because "he post like that as town" is unsatisfying/naive or as weak attempt to buddy up with me. If only I knew how much experience you have... that's why I hate gimmicks.
@Ced see why experience matters?
Anyway, you thinking scum is more prone to make "useful fishing" than town is telling. I just put you on my newbie pile.
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The game is not being dumbed down. Control is doing fine; Draw-Go is not the only kind of control. Aggro is doing fine; Red Deck Wins is not the only kind of aggro. Creature combat is an important core concept and belongs in every color. Mythic rarity is not destroying the game. People whine too much for no good reason. Magic is more popular than ever, so keep calm, brew some decks and play some damn cards.
Okay, so there's the possibility that he's an idiot savant, but I think I'm going to go with normal idiot for now.
Do you have something against me? Looks like you are somewhat bitter, probably because I have defeated you on a battle of wits before. But I'm getting tired of you insults so let's focus on the game shall we?
What I have fished for?
What do you think about Zas first post? I don't remember you saying anything about it (or anything else for what matter) yet you voted me because of it.
Why my post was so bad from a scum standpoint I must be town?
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The game is not being dumbed down. Control is doing fine; Draw-Go is not the only kind of control. Aggro is doing fine; Red Deck Wins is not the only kind of aggro. Creature combat is an important core concept and belongs in every color. Mythic rarity is not destroying the game. People whine too much for no good reason. Magic is more popular than ever, so keep calm, brew some decks and play some damn cards.
If you read my post what are you waiting for to answer my direct questions?
In part because I thought "I"m still waiting Zas to answer my other question, until he does so I'm not explaining my vote" was hilariously ironic, but sure, I'll bite.
The answer to the first two questions is you're missing the point, the scummy thing was looking for someone to cover your ass before you moved in. Answer to the third is quite a bit, I just felt like playing under a different name.
Anyway, you thinking scum is more prone to make "useful fishing" than town is telling. I just put you on my newbie pile.
Well, I have no idea who you are, which makes me think I'm not the green one here.
What I have fished for?
What do you think about Zas first post? I don't remember you saying anything about it (or anything else for what matter) yet you voted me because of it.
Why my post was so bad from a scum standpoint I must be town?
First and third also missed the point. Go reread my post. Zas' first post was clearly facetious.
Lol both Drey and Zas are scum this game is going to be so ****ing easy.
vote: Zas.
I bolded the biggest display of coaching I've ever seen in my entire flipping life.
I agree. not sure if you're calling Dray scum cause you think he's the one bieng coached, or cause of his terrible posting allreddy. either way, I really ho it's this easy.
Though it could technically be addressed to a number of players like you and DJ, Wessel's violation was by far the most flagrant, with him posting twice with no contributing content in the face of numerous points of interest.
I may be wrong, but I thought it was an (a bit too) obvious gambit on the part of DRey. Although I have never played in a game with DRey, I don't think he would have done this for any other reason than trying to get the reactions from others. Therefore I am not willing to believe he's scum yet. And I'm not going to be pushed onto any wagon just because I'm forced onto it.
@Everyone: I told you Wessel was scum. Look how he set me up to look scummy so he could vote for me.
I'm not deliberately trying to make him look scummy. It's pretty obvious I was just questioning something I found scummy.
Why did you answer that question he posed to you? none of the above is always a valid answer to a question. so, it's his fault you answered a set up queston? no, it's on you for answering it.
Sorry, but you're not going to get away with this OMGUS. If I ever misunderstood you, you can always explain it fully to me.
I thought your half-hearted attack was scummy, because the only reason I could see for you to do it was because you wanted to (defend me, which you deny, or) try to falsely depict iLord as a scum. Even if iLord is scum, the reason that he only chose to ask me does not make him scum by itself. That you attack him on it (so early day 1), made me very skeptical. You saw an opportunity to attack, and you took it. That is essentially why I think your action was suspicious.
I then posted two or three possible reasons why in my view you would do that (In my opinion, they are all sort of scummy, but the second one the most). You then say that you chose to make iLord suspect (which is something completely different from questioning him, in which case I would have phrased the question differently or not have taken this matter to debate upon).
The fact that you chose not elaborate your reason lead me to the opinion that you were, indeed, scum. Furthermore, to then say I am scum because I saw you action as scummy behaviour is in my opinion OMGUS.
No. What makes you think I think they've been distancing?
[/spoiler]
UnVote, Vote Burstinatrix
I'm going to admit that after these couple posts, I'm having a hard time reading burst's posts. this is just so terrible. as the discussion goes on, he just keeps looking worse and worse.
Nineteen posts so far on this page with a total of 42 quotes. It's going to be one of those games, isn't it.
this. lol.
but seriously, through this whole exchange, Burst has really done nothing to adequatally defend himself, other than trying to tell Wessel that he's scummy, cause of a question he decided to answer. really, my mind was made up right there.
What's wrong with you people...how are there this many posts in a game that started up on Christmas Eve?!
Finally done with festivities, but without reading yet I'll gt my RVS licks in with a Vote: Liquidity Crisis.
Because droughts are serious business.
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Quote from TheFooFish »
Lies! -I'm Buffy Summers, town tracker. I used my ability on you and saw that you didn't use any abilities before the game started. My flavor is I was sucked through a mysterious space-time portal and I'm here to kill all the vampires, and my tracking ability is a combination of my Slayer and Native American skills.
Really now, first you say you do something to make iLord look scummy, then you say you didn't try to make him look scummy. Are you this stupid?
I can't believe you honestly think Burst is dumb enough to claim a bad gambit out in the open like this. In the same way that I don't believe Drey really thought Zaz was asking for a mass claim, and I don't really think Kpaca thinks that was a coaching attempt way back there.
I'm feeling like you're baiting Burst into an argument here, and smearing him with obvious crap. No wonder he's reacting the way he is.
Way of getting one quote out of my post and misrepresenting it. Let me reply to this post by copy/paste some of the things I said in my post, as an answer.
"Yes, just like with DRey, I can't believe he's this... stupid. However, DRey defends himself in a way I can understand, Burstinatrix however, defends himself by saying 'I am not scum' and 'you are scum'."
"DEFEND YOURSELF!
Decently.
Please."
All I'm saying is that Burstinatrix isn't defending himself well. Instead, he just says he tried to make iLord look scummy. This may be just a stupid thing to say, so I want to give him the opportunity to defend himself better. Just saying 'I didn't do it to make it him look scummy' isn't good enough. I saw his initial post as kind of scummy. I questioned him on it, and the only thing he has been doing, is confirm my thoughts.
No, I got you the first time. I'm not misconstruing anything, because my point is that it's crazy to think Burst would admit seriously to trying to paint iLord as scummy like he did, and you're confirming here that this is exactly why you're after him.
Quote from wessel »
Why do this, DJ Catchem? Trying to defend Burstinatrix and attacking me by misconstruing my words (deliberately or not)? Are you Burst's scumbuddy?
Because he's reacting like a frustrated townie under attack, and also for,the reason I stated above.
And again, if you're re onfirming the reason you're attacking him, then I'm not misconstruing you.
And if I answer 'yes' to your last (terrible) question, are you going to try to claim that I'm honestly claiming scum, like you are with Burst here?
Post #32. I'm disagreeing with Kpaca, because that was terribly-terrible if it was an out-in-the-open coach.
As for Wessel vs. Burst, I'm trying to follow what just happened, and <headassplode>. I feel like I'm reading a giant misdirection by smokescreen from Wessel. No honest read yet, but the tone is uncomfortable to me.
Just sayin.
--->DJ
This doesn't even make sense.
Drey and Burst are scum buddies.
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Originally Posted by Arcadic View Post
scumbag
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I personally think that the discussion to be had on the few "points of interest" at that stage was very little.
Also, if Wessel wanted to "stay quiet", why did he merely not make a post (like all the other people who didn't post because of Christmas and all that)?
I think your misinterpreting the mindset that I postulated. Wessel would read the thread and respond to various points of interest. I found it suspicious that he deemed WoD's random vote worthy of a response, yet none of the serious votes were graced with his opinion. The scum mindset would be "I don't know what I should stay about this particular vote, so I'm not going to comment on it." It's not a damning tell, by any means, but when so many other topics of conversation are passed over in favor of RVS palaver, it certainly pushes you to investigate.
Quote from Ced »
I feel that your post #41 is an exaggaration of the situation.
"Wessel's violation was by far the most flagrant." Those are some pretty fiery words. Were they denoting suspicion? How much suspicion?
You'll forgive my language, then - I don't find those words "fiery" at all. I meant that Wessel's behavior was significantly more noticeable than that of the other players that Burst felt my question also applied to.
Quote from Ced »
At this stage slowrolling things can help. Sometimes, you want to see more reactions from the guy you're putting under scrutiny before they know they're under scrutiny.
Of course, I agree with you that when fishing for reactions, it is often the best course of action to hold the net open for as long as possible. In this case, however, the opportunity for reactions has long passed.
It's also exceedingly difficult to get reactions from someone who doesn't know they're being poked in the first place. To what would they react to?
Quote from Ced »
No they don't. Explain why those posts make DRey scum.
What if he wants to "slowroll" it to see DRey's reactions?
Quote from DJ »
No, I got you the first time. I'm not misconstruing anything, because my point is that it's crazy to think Burst would admit seriously to trying to paint iLord as scummy like he did, and you're confirming here that this is exactly why you're after him.
This nicely sums up why Wessel's case against Burst is fallacious.
Wessel is attacking Burst for something the latter feels is completely unreasonable. As such, Burst refuses to defend himself in a manner and indeed is calling Wessel scum for pressing upon such a weak attack. The argument has already devolved to the mafia-equivalent of a shouting match.
Quote from Wessel »
It all starts with Burstinatrix asking iLord why he asked me, and not WoD. In my view, the only possible reason he would want to ask this is because he wants to smear iLord. In my view, that is not really a townie thing to do. I did not automatically see him as scum, but I didn't think it was helping the town either by smearing iLord. So I said, the only reason why you would want to do this, is to make iLord seem suspect. Instead of defending and saying 'NO! That isn't so!' he confirmed my suspicions. Now that might be a dumb play on the part of Burst, but in no way would I let him get off the hook after that comment. Since then, he keeps saying I'm scum because I say he's scum. Apart from being OMGUS, that's also a weak way of defending yourself. So I keep asking him questions to make him give a decent answer. I saw Burst's question to iLord as an attempt to smear him, and Burst still has not giving me an answer how I should see it differently. He says he took 'action', which is in his eyes a town trait, but I still see it as a scum action. But this exchange has moved far beyond my initial grudge against his question (which wasn't all that scummy TBH), but the way in which he then lacked to defend himself properly in a townie way.
Is it impossible that Burst genuinely wanted to know why I picked you to question as opposed to everyone else?
Quote from Wessel »
And then you chime in. The only thing you're doing is defending Burst because he is a 'townie under duress'. Your weak defence of him makes me believe that if Burst is indeed town, you can't be scum. Scum wouldn't defend a townie like this. However, if Burst is indeed scum, the way in which you took sides in this debate, and the weak attacks on me, signal to me in the way only a scum can.
This is all sorts of bad. Not only are the links that you drew weak, the whole paragraph smells like a deterrent to try and get DJ off of your case.
Of course, as I said, the question was not all that scummy. But I questioned him on it because I found it suspicious. Just as Burst has the right to do that to you, I have the right to question him. Although his question for you was the basis of my exchange with him, my main point against him has evolved to a more broad aspect of not wanting to defend his position, and instead going all OMGUS against me.
I thought your [Burst's] half-hearted attack was scummy, because the only reason I could see for you to do it was because you wanted to (defend me, which you deny, or) try to falsely depict iLord as a scum. Even if iLord is scum, the reason that he only chose to ask me does not make him scum by itself. That you attack him on it (so early day 1), made me very skeptical. You saw an opportunity to attack, and you took it. That is essentially why I think your action was suspicious.
Quote from Wessel »
Not at all. I questioned myself for my position on DJ Catchem. He weakly defends Burst in such a way I can't believe he's scum if Burst is town.
I agree with DJ. Am I magically scum if Burst flips scum now too?
I still don't see how your position is comparable to that of DJ Catchem in this debate. I doubted DJ Catchem since this post, for making a weak defence of Burst (wondered why he did that), and made a weak attack saying he could not understand the exchange, therefore I was the one who put up a smokescreen.
Your position is totally different. I don't see how this could have been a play by you two as scumbuddies. You could not know if I was going to attack Burst on his question. Therefore, I find it strange how you can imply I see you as scum because I think Burst is scum.
You think DJ's scum if Burst flips scum because of his weak defense, correct?
I happen to agree with his "defense" completely, and I am effectively "defending" Burst for the same reasons. Does that mean that I too am poorly defending Burst?
Effectively, I am asking you if you find DJ suspicious because you believe his #99 and #102 utilize weak/faulty reasoning. In that case, you'll find that several others agree with him.
However, you fail to see my point. It is his weak defence combined with his weak attack on me about smokescreens that made me suspect him. I don't completely discard his defence of Burst, but his point about smokescreens made me think he is doing this because they might be scumbuddies. Not in an OMGUS sense, because if he would have supported his view with arguments, that would have been... better. If he would have limited his post to a defence of Burst, there also would not have been reason for me to doubt his honestness. However, his unfounded attack on me made me question him.
Let me ask you this: Do you agree with DJ Catchem's claim that I was purposefully putting up a smokescreen?
I don't actually agree with #71 - from the looks of it, he's making that comment without having closely read the exchange. His most recent position is far more reasonable where he makes no further mention of "smokescreens' or the like.
That being said, I can understand you taking issue with #71. It's rather ill-formulated, although you should consider that it probably was made off of a vague impression rather than thorough analysis.
I can't believe you honestly think Burst is dumb enough to claim a bad gambit out in the open like this. In the same way that I don't believe Drey really thought Zaz was asking for a mass claim, and I don't really think Kpaca thinks that was a coaching attempt way back there.
I'm feeling like you're baiting Burst into an argument here, and smearing him with obvious crap. No wonder he's reacting the way he is.
FoS Wessel
I really don't think it's baiting. from the looks of it, you could paint a Turd yellow, shape it like a banana, and put it on the ground, and he'd go eat it.
Really though, It's burst who's responding to all this.
[/spoiler]I personally think that the discussion to be had on the few "points of interest" at that stage was very little.
Also, if Wessel wanted to "stay quiet", why did he merely not make a post (like all the other people who didn't post because of Christmas and all that)?
I feel that your post #41 is an exaggaration of the situation.
"Wessel's violation was by far the most flagrant." Those are some pretty fiery words. Were they denoting suspicion? How much suspicion?
I voted iLord because of the way he said things, not because of what he did. I often make votes for the former, not the latter. Good scum tend to only say scummy things, not do them.
There was no case against DRey. Niv's was the first vote. The important thing in Niv's case is that he acts otherwise.
I don't even see an obvious/terrible coach, merely an innocuous post.
At this stage slowrolling things can help. Sometimes, you want to see more reactions from the guy you're putting under scrutiny before they know they're under scrutiny.
[/spoiler]No they don't. Explain why those posts make DRey scum.[spoiler]
Strictly speaking, you didn't answer the question, but I don't care, because the answer should be pretty self-apparent. Moving on.
...
No real read on Burst vs Wessel as of yet.[/spoiler]
Well, I read his his first post as beyond forced. like, so forced that he felt he needed to specifically clarify that it was not an RVS vote. his next post he questions you as to whether or not you're taking him seriously. and then he asks Zas if he's bieng serious, but with a kicker question of how experenced he is, which does nothing. like, I don's see how it's relivant at all.
all in all, imo, all three posts were terrible. the case was forced, and the questioning useless.
No, I got you the first time. I'm not misconstruing anything, because my point is that it's crazy to think Burst would admit seriously to trying to paint iLord as scummy like he did, and you're confirming here that this is exactly why you're after him.
Because he's reacting like a frustrated townie under attack, and also for,the reason I stated above.
And again, if you're re onfirming the reason you're attacking him, then I'm not misconstruing you.
And if I answer 'yes' to your last (terrible) question, are you going to try to claim that I'm honestly claiming scum, like you are with Burst here?
--->DJ
why are you ignoreing the accusations of fence sitting by more than one person?
also, I don't see where you see frustrated town, just frustrated.
No. You have to understand this.
I don't think Burstinatrix is scum for the act of admitting he tried to make iLord look scum, I thought he was scum for the act of trying make iLord look scum. But then the fact that he doesn't deny trying to set iLord up makes me feel like he's either scum or stupid town. This is different from my feelings on DRey's position, where I think he's either town or stupid scum.
Post 45 really just was a minor part of why I believe Burst might be scum. That's why I find it strange that Niv and Yanni both jumped on this as the reason for voting for him.
when he answered that question as to why he was on iLord, I reread his posts, and that's exactally what he's doing to to iLord. when all he did was just admit to it was just a nail to me. he seriously just admitted to painting someone to look bad on page one. what good town not only does that, but then andmitts to it. So, he's either stupid, or scum. I also kept reading his posts, and they actually got worse. I did not vote for him untill the discussion went on. when he tried to paint you as scum for asking the question, I found that beyond terrible. then his posts from there on did not get better.
-----
Also, to the iLord V Wessel that just went down. I really think that DJ's deserving of suspissions for the fence sitting on muktiple occasions, regardless of how burst flips. I don't see how Wessel's trying to draw links was worth a vote.
Everyone thinks I'm stupid, but none explains exactly what's wrong with my posts, just "can't you see how bad his post was?" , "omg he's scummy", "he's either stupid town or scum, there's no other option".
I'm getting tired, can you guys elaborate what's so stupid with my reasoning?
@niv, there's was not a case. I was trying to gauge reactions from Zas, also his experience gives us plenty of information about his real intention with that post.
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The game is not being dumbed down. Control is doing fine; Draw-Go is not the only kind of control. Aggro is doing fine; Red Deck Wins is not the only kind of aggro. Creature combat is an important core concept and belongs in every color. Mythic rarity is not destroying the game. People whine too much for no good reason. Magic is more popular than ever, so keep calm, brew some decks and play some damn cards.
Well, aside from the fact that he seems to make posts like that as town (example), there's no incentive for a scum to make such a post. Not only could it look like fishing, it's not even useful fishing, and it doesn't help him blend in at all.
Just because he posts like that as town doesn't mean he can't post like it as scum. Incentive to make it as scum=appear more town, and look like he is participating more.
No, I got you the first time. I'm not misconstruing anything, because my point is that it's crazy to think Burst would admit seriously to trying to paint iLord as scummy like he did, and you're confirming here that this is exactly why you're after him.
Because he's reacting like a frustrated townie under attack, and also for,the reason I stated above.
And again, if you're re onfirming the reason you're attacking him, then I'm not misconstruing you.
And if I answer 'yes' to your last (terrible) question, are you going to try to claim that I'm honestly claiming scum, like you are with Burst here?
--->DJ
It's not scummy to try to make other people think somebody is scum if you think they are scum. That's an important part of the game - The ability to make others agree with your reads.
I'm thinking Liquidity Crisis is the best lynch right now. Most of his posts have been rather poorly thought out defense of DRey.
Unvote, Vote: Liquidity Crisis
Sorry if this post is worded oddly, I rushed through it. If anything is hard to understand, just ask and I'll be happy to rephrase it for you.
you got to be kidding. vote: Zas (as you shall be known from now on)
this is not an rvs vote.
1)I don't think he was kidding at all. But while just a bad post certainly doesn't incriminate anyone, so I wanted to gauge his reaction from my instant vote.
2)His intention to me was to: try to push for a mass claim of sorts, fish for power roles and flavor game today's lynch. Terrible, just terrible.
3)I hate RVS, so I though that saying it was not an RVS vote hopefully will make people stop RVSing so the best part of mafia could start ASAP.
Ced's reaction to Zas was totally different from mine, I found it strange because Ced's a veteran player I would expect him to notice such blatant fishing.
@Zaz that proposal was serious? how experienced are you?
While I'm sure it was not a joke, I wanted to see if he would backtrack on it, because had he backtracked on it he would be pretty much confirmed scum. "hahahah, it was an RVS joke, I didn't really was suggesting lynching people because of flavor gaming no."
If this was his first game I could be more lenient with him just because new players are much more prone to fish and post scummy things even as town. Knowing he's experienced makes me much more wary of him though.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
The game is not being dumbed down. Control is doing fine; Draw-Go is not the only kind of control. Aggro is doing fine; Red Deck Wins is not the only kind of aggro. Creature combat is an important core concept and belongs in every color. Mythic rarity is not destroying the game. People whine too much for no good reason. Magic is more popular than ever, so keep calm, brew some decks and play some damn cards.
Why do you think scumLC is "poorly" defending DRey?
That's a nasty question. Bad bad boy.
Were you the one people were accusing of trying to bait people into saying scummy things?
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
The game is not being dumbed down. Control is doing fine; Draw-Go is not the only kind of control. Aggro is doing fine; Red Deck Wins is not the only kind of aggro. Creature combat is an important core concept and belongs in every color. Mythic rarity is not destroying the game. People whine too much for no good reason. Magic is more popular than ever, so keep calm, brew some decks and play some damn cards.
I don't really feel like multi-quoting right now, so I'll just generalize. If there's something someone wants me to answer that I don't cover, just let me know, and I'll gladly answer it.
@iLord stuff: The whole reason I did that was to see reactions. I tried to paint him and Wessel as scummy to see the responses. I think it's safe to say that a lot of useful discussion came (and is still coming) from it.
@Picking #2: I picked #2 because I knew it was an obvious attempt to try to give a reason for Wessel to vote me. Before that, he had no reason to, which proved it by him jumping at the opportunity to vote for me. Look back at Basic #49 where I was caught as scum when Tezz did something very similar. This is exactly the same.
@Me not defending myself well: Since when is not defending yourself well a scum tell? It's not, and it never has been.
Let me try to explain a few things here so that Wessel knows why I defended Burst, and why several of you missed my sarcasm as far as the "coaching" thing.
From the top:
Quote from Kpaca »
Lol both Drey and Zas are scum this game is going to be so ****ing easy.
vote: Zas.
I bolded the biggest display of coaching I've ever seen in my entire flipping life.
Quote from DJ »
unvote
If that's coaching, it's the worst scum-slip of all time. That said, looking for more from Zas here...
--->DJ
My Analysis:
That's not real coaching. I did not take that to be a serious statement at all, and knowing Kpaca and his usual game, I didn't honestly believe he thought this was coaching either. If he did, he sure as hell wouldn't have pointed it out like that.
As for "looking for more from Zaz"...as I said, I didn;t think that was coaching, so I wanted more content to get a read. At this point...null, but he does happen to be the only real active topic.
The Wessel Thing:
The reason I called Wessel out was that Burst posted a question to iLord:
Quote from Burst »
Is there any reason this wasn't also addressed to WoD?
...and Wessel decided to jump on it in the face of iLord calling him out. I said a misdirection by smokescreen. Here's why:
Quote from Wessel »
And your point being...?
Quote from Burst »
Why are you so defensive?
WoD posted no content around the same time you posted no content.
I'm calling an iLord and Wessel scum team.
Vote iLord.
Burst jumps on Wessel here for cutting in, but is still calling out iLord. It's a triangular standoff.
Wessel follows up by baiting Burst:
Quote from Wessel »
No. You posted that question because you felt the need to either 1) defend me, or 2) make iLord seem suspect because he only targeted me. Or maybe a third, to make WoD seem suspect.
And Burst replies with what I read as clearly a tongue-in-cheek response:
Quote from Burst »
I pick #2.
The very next post, Wessel jumps in and clearly cals out Burst for that reply.
Quote from Wessel »
Vote Burstinatrix
Why would you try to make someone deliberately suspect if you're not scum? So early on, as well.
Burst calls out (correctly by my recap here - feel free to correct me if I missed an earlier post) Wessel for the OMGUS:
Quote from Burst »
@Everyone: I told you Wessel was scum. Look how he set me up to look scummy so he could vote for me.
I'm not deliberately trying to make him look scummy. It's pretty obvious I was just questioning something I found scummy.
...even pointing out that he wasn't honestly "picking #2".
From there, Wessel goes into a very verbose counter in post #50. This goes back and forth a few times before I call it out in post #71.
Strangely enough, Wessel's first counter is to attack me for the "fence-sitting" thing. I'm reading this as another misdirection; the hotter issue isn't Kpaca's comment, it's Wessel vs. Burst:
Quote from Wessel »
And why do you agree with kpaca? Why do you feel the need to say you agree with him? What does it add to the discussion? We suddenly have to believe you're not scum?
In concurrence with Niv, I believe you are fence sitting.
Point the attention elsewhere by reinforcing an attack on the attacker. There's no other mention of my post (#71) in here, until I reply and refuse to let him off the hook:
Quote from DJ »
I can't believe you honestly think Burst is dumb enough to claim a bad gambit out in the open like this. In the same way that I don't believe Drey really thought Zaz was asking for a mass claim, and I don't really think Kpaca thinks that was a coaching attempt way back there.
I'm feeling like you're baiting Burst into an argument here, and smearing him with obvious crap. No wonder he's reacting the way he is.
FoS Wessel
It picks up on post #100 from there. Hopefully this explains where I'm coming from. Wessel, this should better explain my situation, and why I am FoS-ing you. I do believe you were smokescreening here.
Oh...for the record-
@Niv-
Quote from Niv »
I really think that DJ's deserving of suspissions for the fence sitting on muktiple occasions, regardless of how burst flips. I don't see how Wessel's trying to draw links was worth a vote.
It wasn't a vote, just a FoS. And the fence-sitting is now explained. On that topic, it is worth noting that Zaz managed to slip quietly away under the cover of the Burst thing. Noted.
[QUOTE=Burstinatrix;7723272@iLord stuff: The whole reason I did that was to see reactions. I tried to paint him and Wessel as scummy to see the responses. I think it's safe to say that a lot of useful discussion came (and is still coming) from it.
@Picking #2: I picked #2 because I knew it was an obvious attempt to try to give a reason for Wessel to vote me. Before that, he had no reason to, which proved it by him jumping at the opportunity to vote for me. Look back at Basic #49 where I was caught as scum when Tezz did something very similar. This is exactly the same.
@Me not defending myself well: Since when is not defending yourself well a scum tell? It's not, and it never has been.[/QUOTE]Not good. I was ignoring you because I remember how prone you were to say scummy things as town. Now that you've just changed your defense to "trolololol I was just playing around guys! actually I didn't meant to say those scummy things, I was just trying to gauge reactions see? See how I defend myself badly? That means I'm newbie town!!" I'm gonna have to take a closer look at you.
Game is shaping well.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
The game is not being dumbed down. Control is doing fine; Draw-Go is not the only kind of control. Aggro is doing fine; Red Deck Wins is not the only kind of aggro. Creature combat is an important core concept and belongs in every color. Mythic rarity is not destroying the game. People whine too much for no good reason. Magic is more popular than ever, so keep calm, brew some decks and play some damn cards.
Not voting: Archmage_Eternal, DJ Catchem, dropkickdude, AsianInvasion, iLord, ZasZ234, Liquidity Crisis, vezokpiraka
There are some interesting pieces of information missing due to unvotes, so maybe you want to check whether I manipulated the data (no, srsly - I almost didn't record Yanni's vote correctly).
21 players accounted for though
@DJ Catchem: Would you please elaborate what information changed your mind between #27 and #38?
Can you please clarify? I mean... just read what you just posted.
EBWP: Yay, a new post! -.- Fortunately no vote...
Gotta continue reading despite tiredness...
Why did you felt the need to make an unnoficial votecount? It's not like anyone is near lynch you know.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
The game is not being dumbed down. Control is doing fine; Draw-Go is not the only kind of control. Aggro is doing fine; Red Deck Wins is not the only kind of aggro. Creature combat is an important core concept and belongs in every color. Mythic rarity is not destroying the game. People whine too much for no good reason. Magic is more popular than ever, so keep calm, brew some decks and play some damn cards.
@DJ Catchem: Would you please elaborate what information changed your mind between #27 and #38?
I don't follow? #27 was an RVS vote, and #38 was my first *actual* content post. I suppose the answer is, "Kpac posted something I didn't agree with, and I decided to comment on it"?
--->DJ
--->Not trying to be snarky...I just honestly don't understand why there should have been a change in there.
Could you rephrase this please? I'm a little confused.
In Post 15 DRey asked Zas if he was serious about his mass name claim proposal. Wessel thought he (DRey) wasn't serious in this request. I was asking him (Wessel), if he thought DRey wasn't being serious, why he (DRey) would ask ced if he (ced) wasn't taking him (Zas) seriously.
In particular, the question "are you not?" (the question DRey asked ced) usually implies the person asking is that thing (in this case, taking Zas seriously). This is why I'm skeptical of Wessel's theory about those posts.
Hope that makes more sense.
Now, here's a question: why did you want me to go first? Seems like you were happy to vote me without the above clarification, so answering iLord's question (to clarify that vote) should be unrelated to the above.
Can you please clarify? I mean... just read what you just posted.
Tezz baited me to vote for someone. I did. It was obviously scummy of me because I didn't really have a reason to vote for him before. Tezz gave me a reason. He called me out for it and caught me.
Fair enough.
Thanks to Nezumi for the banner!
No, I made an inference that you were scum before that.
Me asking the question happened in this thread.
Asking a question to see why someone's doing something scummy isn't always intended to make that person look scummy.
The part where you think I'm scum for asking iLord the question I asked him.
Thanks to Nezumi for the banner!
I disagree. Actually, I find your assertion completely ridiculous.
I think it's pretty clear who you're referring to in #20, but I'd like for you to commit all the same. I would also be most interested in an explanation of why you felt that you should still remain ambiguous at this juncture. It's fairly clear from your comments towards AI that you understand the importance of going "on record."
My Custom Set: Solescurio
Christmas is kinda bogging me down though, hopefully I'll have better reads tomorrow
scumbag
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You're disagreeing because it's terrible? Shouldn't you agree with me then? Are you scum number three?
a)I'm not stupid. I hate how people are interpreting my post one way or another without asking for clarification first.
b)I"m still waiting Zas to answer my other question, until he does so I'm not explaining my vote.
c)RVS is dead and buried.
Now things.
why?
Of course it will, do you think experience doesn't matter when evaluating things people say?
What did you notice?
Was that a second RVS or a serious vote? what "hitting all the bases" means?
Explain the smile.
Explain why I'm scum please mister kpaca. Also elaborate on the coaching stuff please.
Three things.
1)Why do you think we just need to follow Ced and everything will be fine?
2)You are a little overeager no? I don't remember Ced voting/accusing me of anything.
3)Looks like you are a gimmick, but can you tell us how much experience you have with mafia anyway?
Coaching? Scum-slip? can you clarify?
Three things.
1)what mmm means?
2)Who's giving me a pass here? I haven't even posted since yesterday. Why do you think I need to justify the "not a rvs vote" and not my vote per se?
3)Do you think you already discovered three scum so soon? Impressive, please share with us your scum list please.
Name those inexperienced players please sir.
---
Too many posts, more later.
Mythic rarity is not destroying the game. People whine too much for no good reason. Magic is more popular than ever, so keep calm, brew some decks and play some damn cards.
If you don't think 15 was serious, why would he ask ced first?
There is no reasonable way that you remaining vague can help the town. The original post in itself isn't concerning, but your insistence on refusing to elaborate is. You're either being intentionally difficult, or you've got the greatest fear of committal I've ever seen. My request stands, and I urge you to put this matter to a close if you're just wasting our time.
I don't quite follow your thought process here. How do his questions exclude him from being scum? Or even making him more likely town, for that matter?
My Custom Set: Solescurio
The incentive for most scum posts is to make it look like they're actually scumhunting.
My Custom Set: Solescurio
Okay, so there's the possibility that he's an idiot savant, but I think I'm going to go with normal idiot for now.
If you read my post what are you waiting for to answer my direct questions?
I know I'm town, but you clearing me because "he post like that as town" is unsatisfying/naive or as weak attempt to buddy up with me. If only I knew how much experience you have... that's why I hate gimmicks.
@Ced see why experience matters?
Anyway, you thinking scum is more prone to make "useful fishing" than town is telling. I just put you on my newbie pile.
Mythic rarity is not destroying the game. People whine too much for no good reason. Magic is more popular than ever, so keep calm, brew some decks and play some damn cards.
Do you have something against me? Looks like you are somewhat bitter, probably because I have defeated you on a battle of wits before. But I'm getting tired of you insults so let's focus on the game shall we?
What I have fished for?
What do you think about Zas first post? I don't remember you saying anything about it (or anything else for what matter) yet you voted me because of it.
Why my post was so bad from a scum standpoint I must be town?
Mythic rarity is not destroying the game. People whine too much for no good reason. Magic is more popular than ever, so keep calm, brew some decks and play some damn cards.
In part because I thought "I"m still waiting Zas to answer my other question, until he does so I'm not explaining my vote" was hilariously ironic, but sure, I'll bite.
The answer to the first two questions is you're missing the point, the scummy thing was looking for someone to cover your ass before you moved in. Answer to the third is quite a bit, I just felt like playing under a different name.
Well, I have no idea who you are, which makes me think I'm not the green one here.
First and third also missed the point. Go reread my post. Zas' first post was clearly facetious.
Mildly. Been in a few games. Actually, most have included Seppel, so the answer is probably closer to *yes*.
Was that a sarcastic vote you made in regard to it being bad coaching? In that case, I agree with you after all.
Second RVS. I tend to use my RVS votes as "shout outs" to players I've stepped into the ring with in the past.
See my interaction with Kpaca on this one.
--->DJ
I will attempt to sort out this convoluted mess tomorrow.
Modern
WBR Mardu Midrange
UR Storm
Commander
WBR Queen Marchesa Stax
WUB Oloro, Ageless Ascetic Pillowfort
RRR Krenko, Mob Boss Chaos
I feel the posts speak for themselves?
I don't see how this sentance does anything to help the town. at best it's useless, at worst, you're communicating with a buddy in the game thread.
lol wut? you're responding to Zas, why are you putting him into the third person. lol. seriously though, this post is terrible.
lol.
I agree. not sure if you're calling Dray scum cause you think he's the one bieng coached, or cause of his terrible posting allreddy. either way, I really ho it's this easy.
Feels Fence sitting. makes a very abolute statement, and a very unsure action.
I don't get why you see this as suspect.
Wifom?
Really?
Really?
Why did you answer that question he posed to you? none of the above is always a valid answer to a question. so, it's his fault you answered a set up queston? no, it's on you for answering it.
this, in nearly every way.
[/spoiler]
[/spoiler]
UnVote, Vote Burstinatrix
I'm going to admit that after these couple posts, I'm having a hard time reading burst's posts. this is just so terrible. as the discussion goes on, he just keeps looking worse and worse.
this. lol.
but seriously, through this whole exchange, Burst has really done nothing to adequatally defend himself, other than trying to tell Wessel that he's scummy, cause of a question he decided to answer. really, my mind was made up right there.
Millionaires, I hear it's good Music (Disclaimer: lyrics not PG-13) Thanks, CC
I have read it, and it's melting my brain what's going on right now.
however I'm having a hard time finding a desire to respond to any of it
@ Dray:
I think I answered that question somewhere in the wall of quotes.
Millionaires, I hear it's good Music (Disclaimer: lyrics not PG-13) Thanks, CC
Finally done with festivities, but without reading yet I'll gt my RVS licks in with a Vote: Liquidity Crisis.
Because droughts are serious business.
Why was there so many posts over a holiday?
LOL
I can't believe you honestly think Burst is dumb enough to claim a bad gambit out in the open like this. In the same way that I don't believe Drey really thought Zaz was asking for a mass claim, and I don't really think Kpaca thinks that was a coaching attempt way back there.
I'm feeling like you're baiting Burst into an argument here, and smearing him with obvious crap. No wonder he's reacting the way he is.
FoS Wessel
No, I got you the first time. I'm not misconstruing anything, because my point is that it's crazy to think Burst would admit seriously to trying to paint iLord as scummy like he did, and you're confirming here that this is exactly why you're after him.
Because he's reacting like a frustrated townie under attack, and also for,the reason I stated above.
And again, if you're re onfirming the reason you're attacking him, then I'm not misconstruing you.
And if I answer 'yes' to your last (terrible) question, are you going to try to claim that I'm honestly claiming scum, like you are with Burst here?
--->DJ
u srs?
I don't think you are.
Trolol. You don't even let him defend himself before voting.
Way to jump on something that was obviously a joke.
Why does his experience matter in this situation?
Hint: It doesn't.
Unvote, Vote: Burstinatrix Unvote
:chuckle:
After my reread I think Drey is scum I'm not sure about ZasZ
Vote: Drey
You'd rather paint someone as sucm you don't think is scum?
Dieplease
Unvote
Vote: Burstinatrix
Lol stop deflecting.
true dat dawg
This doesn't even make sense.
Drey and Burst are scum buddies.
scumbag
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I think your misinterpreting the mindset that I postulated. Wessel would read the thread and respond to various points of interest. I found it suspicious that he deemed WoD's random vote worthy of a response, yet none of the serious votes were graced with his opinion. The scum mindset would be "I don't know what I should stay about this particular vote, so I'm not going to comment on it." It's not a damning tell, by any means, but when so many other topics of conversation are passed over in favor of RVS palaver, it certainly pushes you to investigate.
You'll forgive my language, then - I don't find those words "fiery" at all. I meant that Wessel's behavior was significantly more noticeable than that of the other players that Burst felt my question also applied to.
Of course, I agree with you that when fishing for reactions, it is often the best course of action to hold the net open for as long as possible. In this case, however, the opportunity for reactions has long passed.
It's also exceedingly difficult to get reactions from someone who doesn't know they're being poked in the first place. To what would they react to?
What if he wants to "slowroll" it to see DRey's reactions?
This nicely sums up why Wessel's case against Burst is fallacious.
Wessel is attacking Burst for something the latter feels is completely unreasonable. As such, Burst refuses to defend himself in a manner and indeed is calling Wessel scum for pressing upon such a weak attack. The argument has already devolved to the mafia-equivalent of a shouting match.
Is it impossible that Burst genuinely wanted to know why I picked you to question as opposed to everyone else?
This is all sorts of bad. Not only are the links that you drew weak, the whole paragraph smells like a deterrent to try and get DJ off of your case.
Vote: Wessel
My Custom Set: Solescurio
Bolded is a lie:
I agree with DJ. Am I magically scum if Burst flips scum now too?
My Custom Set: Solescurio
My Custom Set: Solescurio
From #104:
My Custom Set: Solescurio
You think DJ's scum if Burst flips scum because of his weak defense, correct?
I happen to agree with his "defense" completely, and I am effectively "defending" Burst for the same reasons. Does that mean that I too am poorly defending Burst?
Effectively, I am asking you if you find DJ suspicious because you believe his #99 and #102 utilize weak/faulty reasoning. In that case, you'll find that several others agree with him.
My Custom Set: Solescurio
I don't actually agree with #71 - from the looks of it, he's making that comment without having closely read the exchange. His most recent position is far more reasonable where he makes no further mention of "smokescreens' or the like.
That being said, I can understand you taking issue with #71. It's rather ill-formulated, although you should consider that it probably was made off of a vague impression rather than thorough analysis.
Unvote
My Custom Set: Solescurio
I really don't think it's baiting. from the looks of it, you could paint a Turd yellow, shape it like a banana, and put it on the ground, and he'd go eat it.
Really though, It's burst who's responding to all this.
Well, I read his his first post as beyond forced. like, so forced that he felt he needed to specifically clarify that it was not an RVS vote. his next post he questions you as to whether or not you're taking him seriously. and then he asks Zas if he's bieng serious, but with a kicker question of how experenced he is, which does nothing. like, I don's see how it's relivant at all.
all in all, imo, all three posts were terrible. the case was forced, and the questioning useless.
why are you ignoreing the accusations of fence sitting by more than one person?
also, I don't see where you see frustrated town, just frustrated.
when he answered that question as to why he was on iLord, I reread his posts, and that's exactally what he's doing to to iLord. when all he did was just admit to it was just a nail to me. he seriously just admitted to painting someone to look bad on page one. what good town not only does that, but then andmitts to it. So, he's either stupid, or scum. I also kept reading his posts, and they actually got worse. I did not vote for him untill the discussion went on. when he tried to paint you as scum for asking the question, I found that beyond terrible. then his posts from there on did not get better.
-----
Also, to the iLord V Wessel that just went down. I really think that DJ's deserving of suspissions for the fence sitting on muktiple occasions, regardless of how burst flips. I don't see how Wessel's trying to draw links was worth a vote.
Millionaires, I hear it's good Music (Disclaimer: lyrics not PG-13) Thanks, CC
I'm getting tired, can you guys elaborate what's so stupid with my reasoning?
@niv, there's was not a case. I was trying to gauge reactions from Zas, also his experience gives us plenty of information about his real intention with that post.
Mythic rarity is not destroying the game. People whine too much for no good reason. Magic is more popular than ever, so keep calm, brew some decks and play some damn cards.
Is this a random vote?
This is a pretty bad fencesit. Do you think it's coaching or not?
How is it defensive?
Gut says this is a scum post.
Well, do you think it's a coach or not? Just saying that if it was this, it would be indicative of scum is not helpful.
Could you rephrase this please? I'm a little confused.
Just because he posts like that as town doesn't mean he can't post like it as scum. Incentive to make it as scum=appear more town, and look like he is participating more.
Your evidence for thinking it's a town post is that it doesn't scream scum. Assuming he is incapable of playing scum at all is not a good idea.
I agree, that is a ridiculous number of posts over Christmas.
It's not scummy to try to make other people think somebody is scum if you think they are scum. That's an important part of the game - The ability to make others agree with your reads.
I'm thinking Liquidity Crisis is the best lynch right now. Most of his posts have been rather poorly thought out defense of DRey.
Unvote, Vote: Liquidity Crisis
Sorry if this post is worded oddly, I rushed through it. If anything is hard to understand, just ask and I'll be happy to rephrase it for you.
1)I don't think he was kidding at all. But while just a bad post certainly doesn't incriminate anyone, so I wanted to gauge his reaction from my instant vote.
2)His intention to me was to: try to push for a mass claim of sorts, fish for power roles and flavor game today's lynch. Terrible, just terrible.
3)I hate RVS, so I though that saying it was not an RVS vote hopefully will make people stop RVSing so the best part of mafia could start ASAP.
Ced's reaction to Zas was totally different from mine, I found it strange because Ced's a veteran player I would expect him to notice such blatant fishing.
While I'm sure it was not a joke, I wanted to see if he would backtrack on it, because had he backtracked on it he would be pretty much confirmed scum. "hahahah, it was an RVS joke, I didn't really was suggesting lynching people because of flavor gaming no."
If this was his first game I could be more lenient with him just because new players are much more prone to fish and post scummy things even as town. Knowing he's experienced makes me much more wary of him though.
Mythic rarity is not destroying the game. People whine too much for no good reason. Magic is more popular than ever, so keep calm, brew some decks and play some damn cards.
Why do you think scumLC is "poorly" defending DRey?
My Custom Set: Solescurio
Were you the one people were accusing of trying to bait people into saying scummy things?
Mythic rarity is not destroying the game. People whine too much for no good reason. Magic is more popular than ever, so keep calm, brew some decks and play some damn cards.
I'm interested in seeing what Gigas1 feels the scum mindset behind LC's defense would be.
My Custom Set: Solescurio
unvote vote Gigas1
I'm going to wait for him to rephrase that post I asked about first, if it's okay with you.
Ummm...okay? Any particular reason for that? Any thoughts on anything else that's happened so far?
@iLord stuff: The whole reason I did that was to see reactions. I tried to paint him and Wessel as scummy to see the responses. I think it's safe to say that a lot of useful discussion came (and is still coming) from it.
@Picking #2: I picked #2 because I knew it was an obvious attempt to try to give a reason for Wessel to vote me. Before that, he had no reason to, which proved it by him jumping at the opportunity to vote for me. Look back at Basic #49 where I was caught as scum when Tezz did something very similar. This is exactly the same.
@Me not defending myself well: Since when is not defending yourself well a scum tell? It's not, and it never has been.
Thanks to Nezumi for the banner!
They hate us cause they ain't us.
From the top:
My Analysis:
That's not real coaching. I did not take that to be a serious statement at all, and knowing Kpaca and his usual game, I didn't honestly believe he thought this was coaching either. If he did, he sure as hell wouldn't have pointed it out like that.
As for "looking for more from Zaz"...as I said, I didn;t think that was coaching, so I wanted more content to get a read. At this point...null, but he does happen to be the only real active topic.
The Wessel Thing:
The reason I called Wessel out was that Burst posted a question to iLord:
...and Wessel decided to jump on it in the face of iLord calling him out. I said a misdirection by smokescreen. Here's why:
Burst jumps on Wessel here for cutting in, but is still calling out iLord. It's a triangular standoff.
Wessel follows up by baiting Burst:
And Burst replies with what I read as clearly a tongue-in-cheek response:
The very next post, Wessel jumps in and clearly cals out Burst for that reply.
Burst calls out (correctly by my recap here - feel free to correct me if I missed an earlier post) Wessel for the OMGUS:
...even pointing out that he wasn't honestly "picking #2".
From there, Wessel goes into a very verbose counter in post #50. This goes back and forth a few times before I call it out in post #71.
Strangely enough, Wessel's first counter is to attack me for the "fence-sitting" thing. I'm reading this as another misdirection; the hotter issue isn't Kpaca's comment, it's Wessel vs. Burst:
Point the attention elsewhere by reinforcing an attack on the attacker. There's no other mention of my post (#71) in here, until I reply and refuse to let him off the hook:
It picks up on post #100 from there. Hopefully this explains where I'm coming from. Wessel, this should better explain my situation, and why I am FoS-ing you. I do believe you were smokescreening here.
Oh...for the record-
@Niv-
It wasn't a vote, just a FoS. And the fence-sitting is now explained. On that topic, it is worth noting that Zaz managed to slip quietly away under the cover of the Burst thing. Noted.
--->DJ
@Picking #2: I picked #2 because I knew it was an obvious attempt to try to give a reason for Wessel to vote me. Before that, he had no reason to, which proved it by him jumping at the opportunity to vote for me. Look back at Basic #49 where I was caught as scum when Tezz did something very similar. This is exactly the same.
@Me not defending myself well: Since when is not defending yourself well a scum tell? It's not, and it never has been.[/QUOTE]Not good. I was ignoring you because I remember how prone you were to say scummy things as town. Now that you've just changed your defense to "trolololol I was just playing around guys! actually I didn't meant to say those scummy things, I was just trying to gauge reactions see? See how I defend myself badly? That means I'm newbie town!!" I'm gonna have to take a closer look at you.
Game is shaping well.
Mythic rarity is not destroying the game. People whine too much for no good reason. Magic is more popular than ever, so keep calm, brew some decks and play some damn cards.
Mythic rarity is not destroying the game. People whine too much for no good reason. Magic is more popular than ever, so keep calm, brew some decks and play some damn cards.
I don't follow? #27 was an RVS vote, and #38 was my first *actual* content post. I suppose the answer is, "Kpac posted something I didn't agree with, and I decided to comment on it"?
--->DJ
--->Not trying to be snarky...I just honestly don't understand why there should have been a change in there.
In Post 15 DRey asked Zas if he was serious about his mass name claim proposal. Wessel thought he (DRey) wasn't serious in this request. I was asking him (Wessel), if he thought DRey wasn't being serious, why he (DRey) would ask ced if he (ced) wasn't taking him (Zas) seriously.
In particular, the question "are you not?" (the question DRey asked ced) usually implies the person asking is that thing (in this case, taking Zas seriously). This is why I'm skeptical of Wessel's theory about those posts.
Hope that makes more sense.
Now, here's a question: why did you want me to go first? Seems like you were happy to vote me without the above clarification, so answering iLord's question (to clarify that vote) should be unrelated to the above.
Tezz baited me to vote for someone. I did. It was obviously scummy of me because I didn't really have a reason to vote for him before. Tezz gave me a reason. He called me out for it and caught me.
Thanks to Nezumi for the banner!