Seems like you should let me finish forumulating the theories before you try and spit on them.
Well, considering that I know for certain that I'm town, obviously I'm not going to be able to put much weight into a theory that involves me being scum.
I've breadcrumbed the rape flavor several times. I linked a youtube video of the song Rape Me, and I've also posted lyrics of a web meme regarding rape.
I asked Guardman if he can confirm my target as scum since that target dies if I find the correct player. He said he can only confirm that my target is a rapist. I'm assuming this person is scum since we are in a mini, and I'm town. It would be bastard modding to include a townie role that kills other townies IMO.
I crumbed my action at the beginning of the day. I targeted malcolm last night with no success.
Let me know if you have any questions. Honestly I'm just lost in this game. I'm just following along to see if anyone pings my 'dar, but I haven't had the drive to hunt anyone in particular just yet.
I don't want to hang my hat completely on my target being definite scum because Guardman couldn't tell me for certain. However, betting on the modgame I'm actually quite useful to the town as a one-shot vig on whoever this person is + whatever that limit break may be.
I'm also completely cool with being lynched. It's my bad play and I deserve it. I just haven't gotten the spark from this game yet and I'm kind of discouraged to even try lately.
And now the pieces of the puzzle fall into place.
From my role PM:
One incident of particular note is when [my name] was accused of “improper and unsolicited” relations with a certain girl who remained nameless of her own accord.
It does not say anywhere that I actually raped her, but I'm guessing that I'm Zionite's target.
And this explains my ability. As I've said before, my ability is pretty much useless on town. I figured that this was simply a way of confusing role analysis in a game where all info will eventually be public, but it seemed kind of inelegant to have an ability that would very likely never be activated. But having scum (Zionite) inherit the ability from me is much more elegant.
It might also explain my limit breaker, since I have no idea how it charges and Guardman isn't being very helpful (it says what needs to happen to charge it, but I don't understand what it means).
We might as well wait for everyone else to check in, but Zionite is definitely scum.
The ability, as claimed, bothers me. So you first have to find the person, and THEN they also have to die, all for you to gain whatever their ability is? Which may or may not be actually useful.
I feel like parts of this claim are being left out. Also, I thought that there would be SOME kind of flavor reason for AI to need Zionite to stay alive, but as it stands I'm really not seeing it. It's also a concern, as LP said, that you don't even know the name of the person that raped you.
I think that Zionite is just a corpse eater, and is lying about the rape part. Vote Zionite
Umm. Hi. Is there any reason you completely ignored my response to you?
Not sure what you really think is gained here by waiting. I haven't responded to Calvin's response to me yet, and at this juncture I won't until tomorrow, but Zionite being town doesn't automatically make Calvin scum. I kind of agree with Calvin that having a scum require the death of a townie to gain some ability makes more sense than the reverse. The town already want all of the scum dead, now Zionite would just need to kill Calvin himself for an extra reason?
I still like Zionite as scum here.
And if Kpaca can vig someone, when Zionite dies, it should be AI(regardless of Zionite's alignment). If AI's WC changes and he just becomes mafia, it's not like he's going to tell us. And I really doubt he's just going to hang around the game with no WC.
Honestly, I don't think that explanation really helps you any. Seems much more likely for a scum to have an ability that requires somebody die(since they can actually make that person die) than for a townie to.
And giving this flavor to a scum seems like a good way to try and thwart modgaming.
Honestly, I don't think that explanation really helps you any. Seems much more likely for a scum to have an ability that requires somebody die(since they can actually make that person die) than for a townie to.
And giving this flavor to a scum seems like a good way to try and thwart modgaming.
I know thats what it seems like Cyan. I'm telling you what to take into account tomorrow or tonight when I'm confirmed town.
It's not WIFOM as Calvin had literally no obligation to reveal this information - not even as town. He is putting himself out there to add more, but largely unneeded, evidence to Zionite's case.
I would not be tearful if he dies in the unlikely event Zionite comes up town. He said his role is not useful to the town, and it is always good to keep all the corners clean. But I highly doubt he is actually scum.
Either way, can we hammer Zionite now? Or is there still more we're waiting for?
Really sorry to have to make a post like this, but I'm about to go to bed. I'm going to make a good post tomorrow. If I don't, I'm going to have to ask you to lynch me. Please don't end the day before I have a chance.
LP is right. That post doesn't do anything for Calvin in any direct/meaningful sense. It's just one of those things that someone adds because they feel compelled to, not because they think it will help cause WIFOM.
I'm not sure what else we're still waiting on now, but Gigas post there just annoys me more than anything.
HOLY CRAP GUYS!!!!! ZIONITE JUST SAID HE'S NOT SCUM!!!! THIS IS GREAT NOW WE CAN ALL UNVOTE HIM BECAUSE HE JUST CONFIRMED THAT HE'S NOT SCUM!!!!! WHAT A GREAT DAY FOR THE TOWN!!!!!!!!
HOLY CRAP GUYS!!!!! ZIONITE JUST SAID HE'S NOT SCUM!!!! THIS IS GREAT NOW WE CAN ALL UNVOTE HIM BECAUSE HE JUST CONFIRMED THAT HE'S NOT SCUM!!!!! WHAT A GREAT DAY FOR THE TOWN!!!!!!!!
"I'm going to stab you in your left kidney."
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
MTG: The RPG Character: Zenith RIP Krensae Fluidtail: Sleep well with the fish
Just as an idea. Instead of posting completely useless posts that might as well be spam, you guys could just..not post anything.
Seriously. Coming into the game thread to read 'spam by poggydude, spam response by keifru, FURTHER spam response by poggydude' again is really irritating. This is a game thread, not a clan thread/community thread.
HOLY CRAP GUYS!!!!! ZIONITE JUST SAID HE'S NOT SCUM!!!! THIS IS GREAT NOW WE CAN ALL UNVOTE HIM BECAUSE HE JUST CONFIRMED THAT HE'S NOT SCUM!!!!! WHAT A GREAT DAY FOR THE TOWN!!!!!!!!
I'm kind of in agreement with the fishing, he presented a very sketchy win-con gave no other information and told us to discuss, i feel like he invited fishing for info, maybe a scum attempt to falsely catch newbies or a slayers gambit, but i sincerly doubt the veracity of AI's claim.
These statements are in direct contradiction. He says that he agrees with Falkon about the fishing being scummy, then says that the fishing is understandable.
With that said, i will hopefully have a nice, long, content filled post for you guys in the next 24 hours...I JUST GOT SUPER MEAT BOY AND THAT GAME IS FREAKING AMAZING.
So i promised a long post and then realized I suck ass at huge posts
So, in other words, it is too difficult to make a long post that sounds town enough, so he chooses not to. It isn't too difficult to make a large post as town, at least once you get down to start doing it. There isn't really a reason he shouldn't have done it as town; but that could reasonably be just lazy town.
I also sense inconsistancy,as there is really no reason (that i can see), in this inconstancy, i would like an reason for this until i get a good answer Unvote, Vote MandersHex
Of course once I get a good answer I will reconsider
This is clearly just him jumping on a scumbuddy's potential wagon, while giving himself an out so he can jump off later if bussing doesn't look like a good idea down the line.
Now, jumps off and waits for Cyan's response. This reads strongly to me like he's waiting to see whether a Cyan lynch is likely, or whether he should go back to bussing MH.
My "group affiliation" out of context makes me sound super scummy but I will still give it up with more information to put it into context. I would like to know from zionite if mander's ability makes him town or scum or impossible to tell. Because mander's flavor sounding scummy may mean that she's scum
This is an awful fence sit. Attempts to leave himself the option of jumping back on because of Mander's flavor, while hoping that Zionite will say his ability is pro town enough that he can avoid the lynch.
So I haven't seen a whole lot yet that warrants a serious analysis so I've decided to throw something at you guys, I'd like to know if you are a half vampire. You don't have to respond because this is hardcore fishing for info, but knowing this will help me(and the town). Once again feel free to not respond but I'd appreciate knowing.
Avoids doing any actual scumhunting, and asks for flavor, while attempting to make it seem like he is not scummy for him to fish by calling attention to it and the option to not answer.
Frankly I'm getting very annoyed with you talking about AI's win, in case you haven't noticed it wants you alive. So when you say things like I'll be pushing for your loss I expect to see you lynch yourself.
Implies Zionite's analysis is not valid because AI wants him alive. Interesting that this is the main person attacking him at this point in the game...
Zionite's point are less valid because he has very strong bias to follow through on AI's wincon, the whole being alive thing is nice.
Then backs that up, by saying that Zionite would rather be alive at the end of the game than help the town...
Quote from
I have a good guess but no, not solidly[/QUOTE »
Then, begins his horrible "The vampire is scum...no, the vampire is town... Nah, just kidding, he's scum."
[QUOTE=poggydude;/comments/10709353]@AI- All the important things about my character were explained in pretty reasonable detail. And my flavor part of my role pm was at least twice as long(at least it definitely seems that way) I am almost positive you left some stuff out(and almost certainly for a reason). I know this is gaming the mod but for my role(a pretty boring one) getting that much flavor, and yours (an extremely odd one) getting that little seems suspect
Yeah, awful modgaming about AI, already been beaten into the ground, but still valid.
So I have really been contradicting myself and here's why: I wanted to set a scum trap because i have an inkling that the half vampire is mafia. In retrosepct my "inkling" was based off of awful mod gaming and really i have no idea what the alignment he is, at all.
Then, finishes the vampire alignment thing by stating it was a trap. A trap which would make him look horribly scummy, likely not get anybody to fall into it, and even if it did, would provide know real way of discerning their alignment any better.
I'm half asleep tonight, I can't really finish the case. I do not believe Zionite is scum, but I don't expect the lynch to be turned to anybody else.
I agree w/ LP. If MH was going to attempt to bus Poggy yesterday, A)she probably would have put more effort into it and B)she probably wouldn't have tried to portray him as a cultist to do so. Her attitude toward him is exactly what you would expect a scum to say toward a townie, not toward another scum.
While clearing someone largely based upon their interaction with a scum is always a little dangerous/WIFOM, I am confident that this is correct here.
Any case against poggydude needs to address MandersHex's interactions with him before being considered.
...then what's the point of making this post?
I agree with this. Simply ignoring the confirmed scum interactions when they are ripe for picking is a terrible idea. I also don't like how you say my lynch is inevitable yet worked on a case anyway. There's no point in making a case no one is going to read, so if you legitimately thought I was a unavoidable lynch you wouldn't have bothered. The only explanation is if you're scum trying to score some points by not being on the mislynch and saying "no look I made a case you ignored".
I cant' kill calvin. I can only target him and take his limit breaker when he dies.
Notice he says his "ability" is good to scum. Not limit breaker.
This should be obvious that if I'm not scum then it makes it very likely calvin is scum.
Don't see how this changes anything. You originally claimed that you take my ability and limit breaker. Not just my limit breaker as you seem to be saying with this post (yet another example of your statements not matching up).
And besides, you're also twisting what I said. I said that my ability is good for scum but I also said that my limit breaker can be useful for me (depending on how the game is set up) but only if I can get it charged, which I have no idea how that happens. What I'm thinking is that I'm essentially vanilla and just serve as a holder to let a scum 'power-up'. I don't see why else my limit-breaker charge condition would be so vague otherwise.
--
Don't see the big case against Poggy. He seems to be from the far too common 'random, spazzy, confusing' mold. I don't think that it's a tell on his alignment. On the other hand, as was pointed out, we have a nice interaction with MH that points toward him being town.
look, if Calvin is town, I'm not killing him. I'm just taking his ability and limit breaker when he dies from a scum kill. If he's scum, I'll gain it on his lynch. This role is completely ambiguous to actual alignment, just like manders' role.
umm are you completely serious??? you just said "my cannot be determined from my role pm just like manders" i dont know if you got the memo but manders flipped scum, and now you are comparing yourself to him. What your doing isnt a scumtell it is just a horrible way to defend yourself, thought i'd point that out
umm are you completely serious??? you just said "my cannot be determined from my role pm just like manders" i dont know if you got the memo but manders flipped scum, and now you are comparing yourself to him. What your doing isnt a scumtell it is just a horrible way to defend yourself, thought i'd point that out
A) Manders is a 'she'.
B) I assumed you wouldn't need a reminder: I thought manders was town based on her role. Instead I learned, as everyone else should have, that roles don't have any bearing on alignment. This is why we're allowed to quote our PMs.
"I do agree that role isn't as good of a determining factor than it would be in other games. From his latest posts, I'm beginning to feel better about Zionite. However, between the two, Calvin has a better chance of being town in my opinion.
I am interested in Pt 2 of Gigas's case. Because its nice to have some good stuff to look at Gigas on, and because I've mostly tuned Poggy's posts out.
I do find it odd its hard to know how to charge your limitbreaker, Calvin, but I guess its something to take your word on."
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
MTG: The RPG Character: Zenith RIP Krensae Fluidtail: Sleep well with the fish
It's certainly one of two avenues of possiblity. And I'll actually bet you if you want once I decide which fork in the road I'm going down.
I figure that Zionite is probably scum, but, I'm not really sure why Gigas needs to be scum with him.
Seriously though, probably not the best way to inspire confidence in your own theories.
Plus, if what you're saying is the case, this seems like something you would bring up after zionite's alignment is firmly established?
Seems like something else is going on here.
Seems like you should let me finish forumulating the theories before you try and spit on them.
nah, this has just been happening a lot lately. I've never been able to properly explain myself in this climate.
http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/blog.php?u=52729
Well, considering that I know for certain that I'm town, obviously I'm not going to be able to put much weight into a theory that involves me being scum.
And now the pieces of the puzzle fall into place.
From my role PM:
It does not say anywhere that I actually raped her, but I'm guessing that I'm Zionite's target.
And this explains my ability. As I've said before, my ability is pretty much useless on town. I figured that this was simply a way of confusing role analysis in a game where all info will eventually be public, but it seemed kind of inelegant to have an ability that would very likely never be activated. But having scum (Zionite) inherit the ability from me is much more elegant.
It might also explain my limit breaker, since I have no idea how it charges and Guardman isn't being very helpful (it says what needs to happen to charge it, but I don't understand what it means).
We might as well wait for everyone else to check in, but Zionite is definitely scum.
Umm. Hi. Is there any reason you completely ignored my response to you?
Basic #10-Town-Win
Sword of Truth-Town-Loss
LOTR II - Town-Loss
Indiana Jones - Town-Win
Manipulator - Town-Win
The Asphodel Meadows - Town-Win
Highlander - Neutral Survivor - Win
RIP Krensae Fluidtail: Sleep well with the fish
I still like Zionite as scum here.
And if Kpaca can vig someone, when Zionite dies, it should be AI(regardless of Zionite's alignment). If AI's WC changes and he just becomes mafia, it's not like he's going to tell us. And I really doubt he's just going to hang around the game with no WC.
Notice he says his "ability" is good to scum. Not limit breaker.
This should be obvious that if I'm not scum then it makes it very likely calvin is scum.
And giving this flavor to a scum seems like a good way to try and thwart modgaming.
I know thats what it seems like Cyan. I'm telling you what to take into account tomorrow or tonight when I'm confirmed town.
Updated: 05/24/11
[The Family]
Thank you.
WIFOM more please
I would not be tearful if he dies in the unlikely event Zionite comes up town. He said his role is not useful to the town, and it is always good to keep all the corners clean. But I highly doubt he is actually scum.
Either way, can we hammer Zionite now? Or is there still more we're waiting for?
Updated: 05/24/11
[The Family]
I'm not sure what else we're still waiting on now, but Gigas post there just annoys me more than anything.
I know you get mad when some jerk holds up your mislynch /sarcasm
Something you want to share w/ us?
What i've been trying to tell people for awhile. I'm not actually scum.
"I'm going to stab you in your left kidney."
RIP Krensae Fluidtail: Sleep well with the fish
Reasonable
Seriously. Coming into the game thread to read 'spam by poggydude, spam response by keifru, FURTHER spam response by poggydude' again is really irritating. This is a game thread, not a clan thread/community thread.
Overreacting scum.
But then his right one won't have a friend...
These statements are in direct contradiction. He says that he agrees with Falkon about the fishing being scummy, then says that the fishing is understandable.
This post never arrives. The reason?
So, in other words, it is too difficult to make a long post that sounds town enough, so he chooses not to. It isn't too difficult to make a large post as town, at least once you get down to start doing it. There isn't really a reason he shouldn't have done it as town; but that could reasonably be just lazy town.
This is clearly just him jumping on a scumbuddy's potential wagon, while giving himself an out so he can jump off later if bussing doesn't look like a good idea down the line.
Now, jumps off and waits for Cyan's response. This reads strongly to me like he's waiting to see whether a Cyan lynch is likely, or whether he should go back to bussing MH.
This is an awful fence sit. Attempts to leave himself the option of jumping back on because of Mander's flavor, while hoping that Zionite will say his ability is pro town enough that he can avoid the lynch.
Avoids doing any actual scumhunting, and asks for flavor, while attempting to make it seem like he is not scummy for him to fish by calling attention to it and the option to not answer.
Implies Zionite's analysis is not valid because AI wants him alive. Interesting that this is the main person attacking him at this point in the game...
Then backs that up, by saying that Zionite would rather be alive at the end of the game than help the town...
Yeah, awful modgaming about AI, already been beaten into the ground, but still valid.
Then, finishes the vampire alignment thing by stating it was a trap. A trap which would make him look horribly scummy, likely not get anybody to fall into it, and even if it did, would provide know real way of discerning their alignment any better.
I'm half asleep tonight, I can't really finish the case. I do not believe Zionite is scum, but I don't expect the lynch to be turned to anybody else.
...then what's the point of making this post?
Updated: 05/24/11
[The Family]
While clearing someone largely based upon their interaction with a scum is always a little dangerous/WIFOM, I am confident that this is correct here.
investigate gigas tomorrow yes?
Sorry, couldn't resist.
I already know who I'm investigating. Thanks for the input, though.
I agree with this. Simply ignoring the confirmed scum interactions when they are ripe for picking is a terrible idea. I also don't like how you say my lynch is inevitable yet worked on a case anyway. There's no point in making a case no one is going to read, so if you legitimately thought I was a unavoidable lynch you wouldn't have bothered. The only explanation is if you're scum trying to score some points by not being on the mislynch and saying "no look I made a case you ignored".
Don't see how this changes anything. You originally claimed that you take my ability and limit breaker. Not just my limit breaker as you seem to be saying with this post (yet another example of your statements not matching up).
And besides, you're also twisting what I said. I said that my ability is good for scum but I also said that my limit breaker can be useful for me (depending on how the game is set up) but only if I can get it charged, which I have no idea how that happens. What I'm thinking is that I'm essentially vanilla and just serve as a holder to let a scum 'power-up'. I don't see why else my limit-breaker charge condition would be so vague otherwise.
--
Don't see the big case against Poggy. He seems to be from the far too common 'random, spazzy, confusing' mold. I don't think that it's a tell on his alignment. On the other hand, as was pointed out, we have a nice interaction with MH that points toward him being town.
Are we waiting on anything?
Basic #10-Town-Win
Sword of Truth-Town-Loss
LOTR II - Town-Loss
Indiana Jones - Town-Win
Manipulator - Town-Win
The Asphodel Meadows - Town-Win
Highlander - Neutral Survivor - Win
A) Manders is a 'she'.
B) I assumed you wouldn't need a reminder: I thought manders was town based on her role. Instead I learned, as everyone else should have, that roles don't have any bearing on alignment. This is why we're allowed to quote our PMs.
I am interested in Pt 2 of Gigas's case. Because its nice to have some good stuff to look at Gigas on, and because I've mostly tuned Poggy's posts out.
I do find it odd its hard to know how to charge your limitbreaker, Calvin, but I guess its something to take your word on."
RIP Krensae Fluidtail: Sleep well with the fish