Are you town or scum?
If your response is town, tell me why you should be believed - how have you helped the town? As far as I can see, you have cast suspicion on yourself by lurking, not defending yourself, and only echoing others views and not putting forth your own. I reread each of your posts and found only two original ideas (and by original, I mean not just echoing someone else's comment nearly verbatim): kpaca's supersaint claim is not scummy, and that indomitablebug doesn't look scummy to you. That's not very much content given how long we have all been playing.
For an example of you doing this exactly, check out:
OK maybe i haven't helped the town yet with my posts, i've just put down who i think is right by agreeing with them and echoing their comments. my thoughts: kpaca's claim not scummy but i don't think he is a supersaint. like i said before im willing to believe he has a plan.
Sp: suspicious since the beginning im sure i've said that before.
ghost: maybe im wrong about him for now i'll unvote and see his posts again.
You are doing exactly what I claimed to be scummy behavior in my eyes.
So, if you want to defend yourself, tell me why my assessment of you is wrong or why this behavior is not scummy (or both).
If anything is unclear, let me know
I really do not like this at all.
Why do you want to get back to the soft claim, instead of pursuing scum, as we are now doing? I certainly know which one I would prefer.
This. Geez guys, stay on target...wait, I have an incoming transmission...it says..."Why not scumhunt AND organize a softclaim?" Wait, we can do both at the same time?
Yes, lets.
Quote from lrd »
I really do not care about the soft claim. I am happy to, as long as it doesn't distract the town from actually scum hunting.
This. For reelz.
Quote from lrd »
Speaking of which, where is SP?
It hasn't been that long (not even 3 full days); give him some time.
For or Against Humanoid/Non-Humanoid Softclaim: Silent Prophet -
Blue Ghost4 -
Cantripmancer - For
Zajnet -
Dracofaust -
Indomitablebug - For (Humanoid)
archae - For
TACKY - For
lrd - For
kpaca -
Falkonn -
OneMoreTime -
I really do not care about the soft claim. I am happy to, as long as it doesn't distract the town from actually scum hunting.
Sorry, took those posts (with emph. mine) as being "for," regardless of the qualifiers. If you would prefer:
For or Against Humanoid/Non-Humanoid Softclaim: Silent Prophet -
Blue Ghost4 -
Cantripmancer - For
Zajnet -
Dracofaust -
Indomitablebug - For (Humanoid)
archae - For
TACKY - Neutral, but will if people wanna
lrd - Is happy to
kpaca - Against
Falkonn -
OneMoreTime -
But I see the outcome as the same: If people agree to do it, you'll join in/won't oppose it.
I'm ok with the soft claim although I have never seen it actually help the town. The scum could just do the soft claim on whatever the false claim they are gonna use later right? All they would have to do is come up with their false claim a little sooner right? Am I missing something?
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I'm glad your feeling better SP. I am looking forward to your post when your done with it. More information is always good for the town imo.
On the claim. I don't know how smart it is to do it if everyone doesn't participate. Doesn't that make the claim sort of ineffective? I'll participate if the town decides to do it, but feel like it would be better if everyone participated.
Kpaca: Would you participate in the claim if we did it on D2 instead? I really don't understand why you feel like a soft claim D1 is bad for the town.
Im ok with a soft claim
@archae i don't know how to defend myself because i can see how you think my behaviour is scummy by agreeing with other people and not posting my own opinions. I'm not sure how not defending myself seems scummy though.
Glad SP is feeling better, waiting on his super-amazing post.
What does the recent approval for the soft-claim put us at? Is that majority?
And honestly, I don't care if Kpaca participates. It's his choice, whatev. I can't force the guy to type on his keyboard, so I shouldn't care too much.
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What does the recent approval for the soft-claim put us at? Is that majority?
For or Against Humanoid/Non-Humanoid Softclaim:
Silent Prophet - (Probably For, since he suggested it in the first place, but hasn't chimed in since.)
Blue Ghost4 - For
Cantripmancer - For
Zajnet - For
Dracofaust - For
Indomitablebug - For (Humanoid)
archae - For
TACKY - Neutral, but will if people wanna
lrd - Is happy to
kpaca - Against
Falkonn - Uncertain
OneMoreTime - For
Quote from TACKY »
And honestly, I don't care if Kpaca participates. It's his choice, whatev. I can't force the guy to type on his keyboard, so I shouldn't care too much.
This. And doing a partial softclaim is fine by me. Kpaca can continue being obstinate, and the rest of us will scumhunt. With a pretty solid majority onboard, I don't mind starting:
Everyone should stop claiming. Let me go ahead and ask everyone who is supporting this what are we going to accomplish. All we are going is letting the scum sort of narrow down what characters we are, with pretty much no benefit for us. Sure, we "lock" them into falseclaims, by making them choose human or non human. Yeah, there are enough humans/non humans not to lock them into anything really.
Also it is day 1.
Also I will apparently have to force you all to vote lrd.
* kpaca runs into the fray with banner drawn.
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Everyone should stop claiming. Let me go ahead and ask everyone who is supporting this what are we going to accomplish. All we are going is letting the scum sort of narrow down what characters we are, with pretty much no benefit for us. Sure, we "lock" them into falseclaims, by making them choose human or non human. Yeah, there are enough humans/non humans not to lock them into anything really.
Also it is day 1.
Also I will apparently have to force you all to vote lrd.
* kpaca runs into the fray with banner drawn.
So apparently there's enough characters that we won't be locking anyone into falseclaims, but there aren't enough characters that the scum will be able to get significant information towards figuring out who we are?
I think we all know that it is day 1.
Why are you trying to get us to vote for lrd when you aren't even voting for lrd?
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Everyone should stop claiming. Let me go ahead and ask everyone who is supporting this what are we going to accomplish. All we are going is letting the scum sort of narrow down what characters we are, with pretty much no benefit for us. Sure, we "lock" them into falseclaims, by making them choose human or non human. Yeah, there are enough humans/non humans not to lock them into anything really.
Also it is day 1.
Also I will apparently have to force you all to vote lrd.
* kpaca runs into the fray with banner drawn.
Even if the scum were able to get a read on someone's particular character, that would not imply if that role is a power role. Thus scum gain no knowledge, or am I missing something (other than making guesses based on knowledge of the Shrek world)? However, seeing as townies don't know who the other townies necessarily are, getting a possible read on a character (again with some deductions based on the world of Shrek) will help us narrow down who the scum are.
Yes, a scum could play at some (townie-type) character, but in theory s/he would choose a lesser known character for fear of doubling up on a real townie's role.
In all, there are concerns, but I believe that the advantages outweigh the drawbacks enough.
However, feel free to tell me what I am missing.
You could always impose a deadline. But perhaps after SP returns?
The game is moving right now so there's no real need for a deadline at this point. I just thought it was funny that I had already beaten Skander's game :p.
Im ok with a soft claim
@archae i don't know how to defend myself because i can see how you think my behaviour is scummy by agreeing with other people and not posting my own opinions. I'm not sure how not defending myself seems scummy though.
Do you think that not posting your own ideas is scummy as well, or is it only that you understand why I think so?
Either way, I find it suspicious, and you acknowledge that without complaint it seems. As such, you already appear scummy to me. By not defending yourself, you leave yourself looking scummy, and thus the act of not defending yourself becomes scummy as well.
I hope that helps.
Do you think that not posting your own ideas is scummy as well, or is it only that you understand why I think so?
Please answer this, dracofaust. Depending on the answer, my case on on you may get posted before the case on blue_ghost, rather than after.
I am going to wait until after dracofaust answers to post my case on anybody, but I saw a post from Cantripmancer that looked like a PBPA of me, so I'll respond to that in the mean time.
Well yeah. Isn't it customary to unvote and say you're getting caught up on the thread when you replace in?
Nitpicks and tosses out "certainties".
Continues to nitpick. This feels like the kind of item scum would bulldog onto and never let go.
Yup, bulldogging.
Not nitpicking or bulldogging. I just wanted a reason why jwn was scummy for lurking but other people weren't. I was curious why jwn was the only one he mentioned.
Lots of feelings here, no actual stance, but he does try to justify his initial accusations.
I am finding that I go off of feelings a lot.
Tries to dismiss any meta-reading on him.
Not trying to dismiss it at all. I am honestly interested in what others view my playstyle as. I can't objectively read my posts and pick it out. I thought it was a discussion best suited for post-game, but perhaps I was wrong?
Huffy and snarky.
I agree. It pisses me off when people don't bother reading all of the posts.
So you don't have a typical play, but you "always" toss out some gut feelings within the first two posts and you work off your gut "a lot"? This isn't a tell, but it seems like a direct contradiction.
When I replace in, one of my first couple posts involves a strong statement of who I feel is town and scum, and some gut feelings. I don't really feel that one post made each time you replace is a playstyle. Phrased that way, I guess it'd be a part of a playstyle. I concede that point.
Still snarky, and still nitpicking.
Not nitpicking. Answering a question.
I agreed with this point-out...
Thank you.
But this feels conveniently lacking in content. Is Tacky as scummy as Unk was?
Not quite as scummy, but still felt scummy none-the-less.
Suggesting soft claim is good. Where did this go? Why haven't you pushed this?
Combination of it seeming like people weren't feeling it yet, and it was around that time I started paying less attention to the game due to the tooth/jaw issues and was losing sleep.
Clarification is good.
Thank you.
Vague scorn is bad.
Again, the answer wasn't too far back. Maybe 1/2 a page to a page? Why should I have to restate something that he should have read himself?
I'm not sure where he's going with this, makes me think that's his intent: to distract.
I forget where I was going with that as well. I may have to go back and try to figure that out.
Mocking. On-target, but mocking.
Thank you.
Good question.
Thank you.
For some reason, I believe this post is honest.
Thank you...Hey, wait.:mad:
Discourages a vig.
Yep. I still disagree with a vig.
Fearmongers and mistates about consequences of misvigging.
When I was calculating the second scenario, I totally missed a day somehow. Lack of sleep.
Archae, since you indicated you were for the softclaim, is there a reason why you have not softclaimed yet?
There is a reason, albeit not a very good one: I meant to during my last two posts, but got caught up in the subject matter and forgot to claim.
Apparently, I cannot both scumhunt and softclaim at the same time.
I am non-humanoid.
@Archae: I understand why you think so. I don't think that not posting your ideas make you instant scum (look at kpaca). People have different playstyles and I post my ideas if i feel like they can help the town or to show people who i think is right.
@Archae: I understand why you think so. I don't think that not posting your ideas make you instant scum (look at kpaca). People have different playstyles and I post my ideas if i feel like they can help the town or to show people who i think is right.
Bolded for emphasis. I agree that not posting your own ideas does not instantly make you scum, but it certainly makes you looks suspicious.
My very point was that you have not, prior to this conversation, been posting your own ideas; you have been copying others and (now apparently) trying to pass them off as your own.
Also, since you understand why I think you were acting scummy, why did you not know how to defend yourself?
I would think that understanding why someone sees you as scummy would be the best possible scenario for defending yourself. The other options would be 1. you agree you are acting scummy; or 2. you do not understand why someone thinks your behavior is scummy.
In case 1, it may be because you are scum or because you were playing town poorly, but that would be the end of it - there would be little to no way to cast off suspicion. In case 2, it would be reasonable to not know how to defend yourself, since you don't understand the reasoning behind the accusation.
But understanding the accusation seems like the ideal case to me.
So again: why did you not know how to defend yourself against claims that you fully understood, but did not agree with? And if it is just because you couldn't think of a good objection, why should I think you are town, and when would you ever defend yourself?
I'm starting to get a bad feeling that I'm just voting for a noob town.....
That's what I'm thinking is going on. If you feel that way, why is it that your still voting for him? edit while writing post: Ah, Zajnet already pointed this out.
Quote from Kpaca »
Everyone should stop claiming. Let me go ahead and ask everyone who is supporting this what are we going to accomplish. All we are going is letting the scum sort of narrow down what characters we are, with pretty much no benefit for us. Sure, we "lock" them into falseclaims, by making them choose human or non human. Yeah, there are enough humans/non humans not to lock them into anything really.
Also it is day 1.
I think this is solid reasoning. I'm going to follow his advice personally. So I will not be claiming humanoid/non-humanoid either.
Quote from Archae »
Even if the scum were able to get a read on someone's particular character, that would not imply if that role is a power role. Thus scum gain no knowledge, or am I missing something (other than making guesses based on knowledge of the Shrek world)? However, seeing as townies don't know who the other townies necessarily are, getting a possible read on a character (again with some deductions based on the world of Shrek) will help us narrow down who the scum are.
Yes, a scum could play at some (townie-type) character, but in theory s/he would choose a lesser known character for fear of doubling up on a real townie's role.
In all, there are concerns, but I believe that the advantages outweigh the drawbacks enough.
However, feel free to tell me what I am missing.
Basically my feelings are that the scum get a lot more out of this claim then the town does. The town will not be able to make as informed a decision as the scum.
Pretty sure the draco/archae thing going on right now is town vs. town.
Well yeah. Isn't it customary to unvote and say you're getting caught up on the thread when you replace in?
I wasn't quoting that to indicate scumminess, but to include each post. It is customary.
Quote from SP »
Not nitpicking or bulldogging. I just wanted a reason why jwn was scummy for lurking but other people weren't. I was curious why jwn was the only one he mentioned.
Perhaps not nitpicking, but you were very persistent on an attack that I didn't feel was significant.
Quote from SP »
I am finding that I go off of feelings a lot.
Again, I see that as a "playstyle".
Quote from SP »
Not trying to dismiss it at all. I am honestly interested in what others view my playstyle as. I can't objectively read my posts and pick it out. I thought it was a discussion best suited for post-game, but perhaps I was wrong?
? How many games have you played?
Quote from SP »
Not quite as scummy, but still felt scummy none-the-less.
Why? You haven't made any attacks or posts with suspicion against him since he replaced.
Quote from SP »
Combination of it seeming like people weren't feeling it yet, and it was around that time I started paying less attention to the game due to the tooth/jaw issues and was losing sleep.
I can accept the latter, but the former confuses me. Several people indicated they were open to the idea.
Quote from SP »
I forget where I was going with that as well. I may have to go back and try to figure that out.
Please do. "Oh, gee, that's odd" isn't an answer that sits well with me.
Quote from SP »
When I was calculating the second scenario, I totally missed a day somehow. Lack of sleep.
But you still feel like vigging (especially town-oriented (not town-specified) vigging) is detrimental? Why?
Quote from SP »
Facepalm all you want. I call 'em like I see 'em.
I still feel like SP is a good lynch choice, but Draco seems just as good. Every answer he responds with is circular in nature, and gets us nowhere. I would be ok with either, especially given that neither of them are on the other's wagon, despite several indications from Draco that SP is suspicious:
I'm not trying to play the predator. I reread some of bug's posts and i didn't find them scummy so I'm wondering what Kpaca found. I'm kinda suspicious of SP. I'd like him to explain why he's so sure Kpaca is town and Unkyuk is scum before we decide on the softclaim.
It's just that claiming to be supersaint like that would not benefit scum much. If he's town claiming supersaint would make scum less likely to kill him during the night. If he's scum then we wouldn't hesitate to lynch him just because he's supersaint. 1-1 trade is very good for town.
@SP The only thing i could find that makes unk seem scummy was his first post, voting for omt right after two other people voted for him. Then again he hasn't posted much.
I said it seemed good, but i know thats not an excuse. I read his post and at first i thought he had valid points but then i realised that most was just because bug fencesits and lurks. I have a tendency to agree with peoples opinions.:-/
Its the timing of when you posted that makes me suspicious. Before Tacky accused you of backing up bug you stated that his post is townie, then after he accused you, you stated another of his post as scum.
As for the scum list, nobody stands out as being definitely scum but if i had to pick i would say Sp and blueghost.
I'm still suspicious of you because of your voting and unvoting and your reasons didn't really win me over. I picked Sp because he's being cryptic and not explaining his thoughts. I think gigas is scummy if bug is because hes acting like bugs scumbuddy. but so far i dont think bug is scum.
OK maybe i haven't helped the town yet with my posts, i've just put down who i think is right by agreeing with them and echoing their comments. my thoughts: kpaca's claim not scummy but i don't think he is a supersaint. like i said before im willing to believe he has a plan. Sp: suspicious since the beginning im sure i've said that before.
ghost: maybe im wrong about him for now i'll unvote and see his posts again.
You have said that, but it wasn't "since the beginning". You didn't express suspicion of SP until after I expressed suspicion of him AND attacked you in the same post, at which point, you conveniently started suspecting him without voting. Even when you unvoted recently, you didn't vote SP, whom you've stated repeatedly you find suspicious.
Yup, I'm ok with lynching SP or Draco.
Our softclaim is more or less as complete as we can expect it to be, with kpaca abstaining and falkonn not posting since we started the claim:
Basically my feelings are that the scum get a lot more out of this claim then the town does. The town will not be able to make as informed a decision as the scum.
Seriously, if there are just as many options for scum to hide behind, then scum aren't going to get more out of the claim than the town. They might get the same amount, which I personally feel = bupkus, since there's no real information there (unless, I suppose, SP or another of the scum can do something specifically nasty to humanoids/non-humanoids, which is why he suggested the claim). The point of a softclaim is not to gather information, but to establish every player as committed to an identity of some sort.
It's not info to be used now, it's info to be reviewed later, or info that will never be needed because the scum now have to play around it. The town don't have to play around it because we all told the truth and will continue to tell the truth, but now if the scum see an opportunity that requires them to lie about their identity, they're less likely to get away with it.
Basically my feelings are that the scum get a lot more out of this claim then the town does. The town will not be able to make as informed a decision as the scum.
Why? You responded to my reasons for a pro-claim with this; and this has no justification. I think neither group gets terribly much out of this soft-claim, in particular (since the world of Shrek depicts a lot of non-human characters as humanoid; cf the overwhelming humanoids), but I think it benefits the town more. Scum do not gain any new information, aside from guessing (and a role had already claimed), whereas the town gets some information that will potentially prove useful later on.
EBWODP: Wow. Beat to it by Cantripmancer. Still, though, why do you think it's better to not claim in this case?
Also, I posted this a while back, but no one responded: anyone care to explain why kpaca looks town to them, apart from the reasons I listed before?
And, kpaca: why do you think that this claim is a bad idea?
The answer to your question lies inside your very own post. I didn't want to say this out loud, but I suppose I'm going to have to. Most things are humanoid, so anyone that claims to be non-humanoid has very few character's for the scum to pick through. They will be able to figure out character's based off of this claim. Based on the idea that I feel like the two claimed non-humanoid are town, I don't think the town got the better end of this deal. I also bet that there's at least one non-humanoid in that bunch of humanoid claims.
The answer to your question lies inside your very own post. I didn't want to say this out loud, but I suppose I'm going to have to. Most things are humanoid, so anyone that claims to be non-humanoid has very few character's for the scum to pick through. They will be able to figure out character's based off of this claim. Based on the idea that I feel like the two claimed non-humanoid are town, I don't think the town got the better end of this deal. I also bet that there's at least one non-humanoid in that bunch of humanoid claims.
Um, just figuring out characters isn't going to reveal power-roles. I seriously doubt that Syrenz went "Oh, oh, I'll give an ability to anything that walks on four legs or flies!" I feel like your fears are groundless.
Sure, although it should be obvious, given that I posted this:
For an example of you doing this exactly, check out:
You are doing exactly what I claimed to be scummy behavior in my eyes.
This. Geez guys, stay on target...wait, I have an incoming transmission...it says..."Why not scumhunt AND organize a softclaim?" Wait, we can do both at the same time?
Yes, lets.
This. For reelz.
It hasn't been that long (not even 3 full days); give him some time.
For or Against Humanoid/Non-Humanoid Softclaim:
Silent Prophet -
Blue Ghost4 -
Cantripmancer - For
Zajnet -
Dracofaust -
Indomitablebug - For (Humanoid)
archae - For
TACKY - For
lrd - For
kpaca -
Falkonn -
OneMoreTime -
Wow...I forgot kpaca was in this game.
Will you participate in the post-softclaim discussion on possible reasons why some players won't softclaim?
Sure, but my answer will probably be "Because I am always against softclaims day 1 and I as usual don't care that you are threatening me with votes".
Sorry, took those posts (with emph. mine) as being "for," regardless of the qualifiers. If you would prefer:
For or Against Humanoid/Non-Humanoid Softclaim:
Silent Prophet -
Blue Ghost4 -
Cantripmancer - For
Zajnet -
Dracofaust -
Indomitablebug - For (Humanoid)
archae - For
TACKY - Neutral, but will if people wanna
lrd - Is happy to
kpaca - Against
Falkonn -
OneMoreTime -
But I see the outcome as the same: If people agree to do it, you'll join in/won't oppose it.
Kpaca: Why are you against D1 softclaims?
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Nothing becomes all
Here you stand before me
So here shall you fall
Thanks to Damnation Studios and Darth Monkey
"Just One More Chance"
Incoming post in 12-16ish hours.
And by incoming post, I mean a post ya'll will actually be happy with for once, I think. There's enough information to do it now.
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On the claim. I don't know how smart it is to do it if everyone doesn't participate. Doesn't that make the claim sort of ineffective? I'll participate if the town decides to do it, but feel like it would be better if everyone participated.
Kpaca: Would you participate in the claim if we did it on D2 instead? I really don't understand why you feel like a soft claim D1 is bad for the town.
http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/blog.php?u=52729
@archae i don't know how to defend myself because i can see how you think my behaviour is scummy by agreeing with other people and not posting my own opinions. I'm not sure how not defending myself seems scummy though.
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Silent Prophet (3) - Cantripmancer, falkonn , OneMoreTime,
Dracofaust (3) - kpaca, TACKY, Blue Ghost4
falkonn (1) - Silent Prophet
Blue Ghost4 (1) - Zajnet
With 12 alive it takes 7 to lynch
Corrections are welcome.
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What does the recent approval for the soft-claim put us at? Is that majority?
And honestly, I don't care if Kpaca participates. It's his choice, whatev. I can't force the guy to type on his keyboard, so I shouldn't care too much.
Post is half-typed. I will get the rest done after the meeting, if there is enough time. If not, when I get home.
I could even just post the half-post I already have after the meeting, if there's not enough time to finish. We'll see.
Official Deschanel Stalker of The Called
You could always impose a deadline. But perhaps after SP returns?
For or Against Humanoid/Non-Humanoid Softclaim:
Silent Prophet - (Probably For, since he suggested it in the first place, but hasn't chimed in since.)
Blue Ghost4 - For
Cantripmancer - For
Zajnet - For
Dracofaust - For
Indomitablebug - For (Humanoid)
archae - For
TACKY - Neutral, but will if people wanna
lrd - Is happy to
kpaca - Against
Falkonn - Uncertain
OneMoreTime - For
This. And doing a partial softclaim is fine by me. Kpaca can continue being obstinate, and the rest of us will scumhunt. With a pretty solid majority onboard, I don't mind starting:
I'm humanoid.
@Blue Ghost: Why didn't you unvote then if you think you're voting for town. If I wasn't already voting you, I would vote for you because of this.
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Also it is day 1.
Also I will apparently have to force you all to vote lrd.
* kpaca runs into the fray with banner drawn.
So apparently there's enough characters that we won't be locking anyone into falseclaims, but there aren't enough characters that the scum will be able to get significant information towards figuring out who we are?
I think we all know that it is day 1.
Why are you trying to get us to vote for lrd when you aren't even voting for lrd?
EDH:
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Well I'm not completely sure...I was waiting to hear more from him. Maybe see some scum hunting. For now I'll keep it there, thank you.
Humanoid, I believe.
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Even if the scum were able to get a read on someone's particular character, that would not imply if that role is a power role. Thus scum gain no knowledge, or am I missing something (other than making guesses based on knowledge of the Shrek world)? However, seeing as townies don't know who the other townies necessarily are, getting a possible read on a character (again with some deductions based on the world of Shrek) will help us narrow down who the scum are.
Yes, a scum could play at some (townie-type) character, but in theory s/he would choose a lesser known character for fear of doubling up on a real townie's role.
In all, there are concerns, but I believe that the advantages outweigh the drawbacks enough.
However, feel free to tell me what I am missing.
The game is moving right now so there's no real need for a deadline at this point. I just thought it was funny that I had already beaten Skander's game :p.
Lair of the Cat (Mafia Stats)
And yet...still no action from you.
SP needs to post.
Silent Prophet -
Blue Ghost4 - Humanoid
Cantripmancer - Humanoid
Zajnet - Humanoid
Dracofaust -
Indomitablebug - Humanoid
archae -
TACKY -
lrd - Humanoid
kpaca - Poo-Flingin' Crazy
Falkonn -
OneMoreTime -
EWP: Syrenz, Skander's your brother?
yep
Lair of the Cat (Mafia Stats)
Do you think that not posting your own ideas is scummy as well, or is it only that you understand why I think so?
Either way, I find it suspicious, and you acknowledge that without complaint it seems. As such, you already appear scummy to me. By not defending yourself, you leave yourself looking scummy, and thus the act of not defending yourself becomes scummy as well.
I hope that helps.
Check wikipedia. They probably have you somewhere in the Shrek page/pages. "99% sure" gives you wiggle room that I am not comfortable with you having.
A card game about Presidents. Stabbing each other. With knives.
Nothing becomes all
Here you stand before me
So here shall you fall
Thanks to Damnation Studios and Darth Monkey
"Just One More Chance"
Right.
Humanoid/Non-humanoid Softclaim
Silent Prophet -
Blue Ghost4 - Humanoid
Cantripmancer - Humanoid
Zajnet - Humanoid
Dracofaust -
Indomitablebug - Humanoid
archae -
TACKY - Humanoid
lrd - Humanoid
kpaca - Poo-Flingin' Crazy
Falkonn -
OneMoreTime - Non-humanoid
Archae, since you indicated you were for the softclaim, is there a reason why you have not softclaimed yet?
Nothing becomes all
Here you stand before me
So here shall you fall
Thanks to Damnation Studios and Darth Monkey
"Just One More Chance"
...:o It wasn't?!?
Oh, then maybe I put that because Kpaca's refusing to participate ('cause he's a self-admitted poo-flingin' crazy).
Please answer this, dracofaust. Depending on the answer, my case on on you may get posted before the case on blue_ghost, rather than after.
I am going to wait until after dracofaust answers to post my case on anybody, but I saw a post from Cantripmancer that looked like a PBPA of me, so I'll respond to that in the mean time.
Official Deschanel Stalker of The Called
Well yeah. Isn't it customary to unvote and say you're getting caught up on the thread when you replace in?
Not nitpicking or bulldogging. I just wanted a reason why jwn was scummy for lurking but other people weren't. I was curious why jwn was the only one he mentioned.
I am finding that I go off of feelings a lot.
Not trying to dismiss it at all. I am honestly interested in what others view my playstyle as. I can't objectively read my posts and pick it out. I thought it was a discussion best suited for post-game, but perhaps I was wrong?
I agree. It pisses me off when people don't bother reading all of the posts.
When I replace in, one of my first couple posts involves a strong statement of who I feel is town and scum, and some gut feelings. I don't really feel that one post made each time you replace is a playstyle. Phrased that way, I guess it'd be a part of a playstyle. I concede that point.
Not nitpicking. Answering a question.
Thank you.
Not quite as scummy, but still felt scummy none-the-less.
Combination of it seeming like people weren't feeling it yet, and it was around that time I started paying less attention to the game due to the tooth/jaw issues and was losing sleep.
Thank you.
Again, the answer wasn't too far back. Maybe 1/2 a page to a page? Why should I have to restate something that he should have read himself?
I forget where I was going with that as well. I may have to go back and try to figure that out.
Thank you.
Thank you.
Thank you...Hey, wait.:mad:
Yep. I still disagree with a vig.
When I was calculating the second scenario, I totally missed a day somehow. Lack of sleep.
Official Deschanel Stalker of The Called
There is a reason, albeit not a very good one: I meant to during my last two posts, but got caught up in the subject matter and forgot to claim.
Apparently, I cannot both scumhunt and softclaim at the same time.
I am non-humanoid.
Bolded for emphasis. I agree that not posting your own ideas does not instantly make you scum, but it certainly makes you looks suspicious.
My very point was that you have not, prior to this conversation, been posting your own ideas; you have been copying others and (now apparently) trying to pass them off as your own.
Also, since you understand why I think you were acting scummy, why did you not know how to defend yourself?
I would think that understanding why someone sees you as scummy would be the best possible scenario for defending yourself. The other options would be 1. you agree you are acting scummy; or 2. you do not understand why someone thinks your behavior is scummy.
In case 1, it may be because you are scum or because you were playing town poorly, but that would be the end of it - there would be little to no way to cast off suspicion. In case 2, it would be reasonable to not know how to defend yourself, since you don't understand the reasoning behind the accusation.
But understanding the accusation seems like the ideal case to me.
So again: why did you not know how to defend yourself against claims that you fully understood, but did not agree with? And if it is just because you couldn't think of a good objection, why should I think you are town, and when would you ever defend yourself?
That's what I'm thinking is going on. If you feel that way, why is it that your still voting for him? edit while writing post: Ah, Zajnet already pointed this out.
I think this is solid reasoning. I'm going to follow his advice personally. So I will not be claiming humanoid/non-humanoid either.
Basically my feelings are that the scum get a lot more out of this claim then the town does. The town will not be able to make as informed a decision as the scum.
Pretty sure the draco/archae thing going on right now is town vs. town.
http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/blog.php?u=52729
I wasn't quoting that to indicate scumminess, but to include each post. It is customary.
Perhaps not nitpicking, but you were very persistent on an attack that I didn't feel was significant.
Again, I see that as a "playstyle".
? How many games have you played?
Why? You haven't made any attacks or posts with suspicion against him since he replaced.
I can accept the latter, but the former confuses me. Several people indicated they were open to the idea.
Please do. "Oh, gee, that's odd" isn't an answer that sits well with me.
But you still feel like vigging (especially town-oriented (not town-specified) vigging) is detrimental? Why?
Facepalm all you want. I call 'em like I see 'em.
I still feel like SP is a good lynch choice, but Draco seems just as good. Every answer he responds with is circular in nature, and gets us nowhere. I would be ok with either, especially given that neither of them are on the other's wagon, despite several indications from Draco that SP is suspicious:
Trying to justify SP's accusations for him?
You have said that, but it wasn't "since the beginning". You didn't express suspicion of SP until after I expressed suspicion of him AND attacked you in the same post, at which point, you conveniently started suspecting him without voting. Even when you unvoted recently, you didn't vote SP, whom you've stated repeatedly you find suspicious.
Yup, I'm ok with lynching SP or Draco.
Our softclaim is more or less as complete as we can expect it to be, with kpaca abstaining and falkonn not posting since we started the claim:
Humanoid/Non-humanoid Softclaim
Silent Prophet - Humanoid
Blue Ghost4 - Humanoid
Cantripmancer - Humanoid
Zajnet - Humanoid
Dracofaust - Humanoid
Indomitablebug - Humanoid
TACKY - Humanoid
lrd - Humanoid
OneMoreTime - Non-humanoid
archae - Non-humanoid
kpaca - Poo-Flingin' Crazy
Falkonn - Fence-Sittin' Crazy
Seriously, if there are just as many options for scum to hide behind, then scum aren't going to get more out of the claim than the town. They might get the same amount, which I personally feel = bupkus, since there's no real information there (unless, I suppose, SP or another of the scum can do something specifically nasty to humanoids/non-humanoids, which is why he suggested the claim). The point of a softclaim is not to gather information, but to establish every player as committed to an identity of some sort.
It's not info to be used now, it's info to be reviewed later, or info that will never be needed because the scum now have to play around it. The town don't have to play around it because we all told the truth and will continue to tell the truth, but now if the scum see an opportunity that requires them to lie about their identity, they're less likely to get away with it.
Why? You responded to my reasons for a pro-claim with this; and this has no justification. I think neither group gets terribly much out of this soft-claim, in particular (since the world of Shrek depicts a lot of non-human characters as humanoid; cf the overwhelming humanoids), but I think it benefits the town more. Scum do not gain any new information, aside from guessing (and a role had already claimed), whereas the town gets some information that will potentially prove useful later on.
Also, I posted this a while back, but no one responded: anyone care to explain why kpaca looks town to them, apart from the reasons I listed before?
And, kpaca: why do you think that this claim is a bad idea?
http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/blog.php?u=52729
I will explicitly state that while I believe kpaca to be town, I do not care to explain why at this time.
Um, just figuring out characters isn't going to reveal power-roles. I seriously doubt that Syrenz went "Oh, oh, I'll give an ability to anything that walks on four legs or flies!" I feel like your fears are groundless.
What are your feelings on Silent Prophet?
Is this to me? I'm voting for SP right now, so I felt like my feelings were known.
http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/blog.php?u=52729