I'd say that the blue deck is still the second worst and that red has replaced green as the worst. (I think Green may have beaten white to first, though white may not have had much trouble beating the other colors initially.) This isn't to say that blue isn't better than its initial version, it's much better and has unique game play since it's the only deck that still uses Morph.
While the blue deck is still somewhat stally, the board states it generates remain interesting. Ixidron loops and hidden information give the deck some character. Being slow isn't necessarily a problem and I think that deck's play can be improved without gutting too much of its core. Certainly, if R&D ever revisits morph, I'll revisit some of my morph choices.
The problem with the red deck isn't that it stalls or even that it's too aggressive. It's that the game is a removal spamfest that ends during topdeck mode at which point someone ends up with an unkillable threat. The early and midgame are so incredibly uninteresting.
As far as I can tell, the core of the problem is the removal. I've addressed some of this in more recent changes with the inclusion of Wrack with Madness and Turn to Slag.
Here is the list as it stands today:
| Fires of the ForgeMagic OnlineOCTGN2ApprenticeBuy These Cards | |
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Creatures (21) 1x Goblin Sledder 1x Spikeshot Elder 1x Runed Servitor 1x Ashmouth Hound 1x Ember Hauler 1x Gruul Guildmage 1x Thick-Skinned Goblin 1x Fire-Belly Changeling 1x Torch Fiend 1x Spin Engine 1x Adaptive Automaton 1x Akki Coalflinger 1x Chandra's Phoenix 1x Ferrovore 1x Tuktuk, the Explorer 1x Peace Strider 1x Burning-Eye Zubera 1x Hematite Golem 1x Ingot Chewer 1x Fire Servant 1x Kuldotha Flamefiend | Lands (23) 4x Gruul Guildgate 1x Barbarian Ring 1x Keldon Megaliths 1x Buried Ruin 1x Gargoyle Castle 1x Haunted Fengraf 1x Stalking Stones 13 x Mountain Spells (16) 1x Flayer Husk 1x Mutagenic Growth 1x Burst Lightning 1x Assault // Battery 1x Guardian Idol 1x Fury Charm 1x Thunder Strike 1x Grifter's Blade 1x Brimstone Volley 1x Puncture Blast 1x Lightning Prowess 1x Wrack with Madness 1x Chandra's Outrage 1x Turn to Slag 1x Volcanic Submersion 1x Flame Javelin |
Red's removal is almost exclusively burn, this makes creature size incredibly important. This isn't a problem in and of itself; I don't mind bigger creatures being better, it's just dangerous when bigger creatures are immune to removal.
The green deck didn't have this problem. It had slightly smaller creatures, but it had some decent blockers, it had some cheap removal spells that took out creatures of any size with a drawback that affected the board state, and it had some more expensive options that removed large creatures entirely. Additionally, green has deathtouch which lets small threats trade up. This will be very difficult to reproduce with what red can do...
The other side of the coin is also a problem. Burn comes in a lot of different styles, which are all cool cards, but the smaller effects unduly punish small creatures. In environments where removal doesn't care about creature size, players will use creatures to block or trade off with the smaller creatures and save their removal for evasion and large threats. Having burn that is only good on small threats is going to be very dangerous here.
In the original version of the deck I put together, I made very strict decisions to avoid burn that dealt damage to players so that the permanents would be more relevant. I had relaxed my restrictions on this, but presently, burn is giving too much reach. Granted, I expect this will be dealt with as the removal is worsened.
Lastly, much of the present burn is in Instants. This makes combat tricks veeery risky. Combat tricks are one of the few ways red has to make small creatures relevant, so I really need to open this up as a respectable option. Conveniently, we've gotten some nice new options as of late.
I would have to say Ember Hauler is the poster child for problem cards in the deck. I really like the card, but it's ruining game play. Fire Servant + Brimstone Volley is similarly bad. Brimstone Volley was a cool addition to deal with the Tuktuk token, but it's causing more problems.
A related theme that had been touchy was pump effects. The only way to make burn even approach a semblence of interactivity that auras give to green, blue, and white was to have pump effects that would counter them. However this has a few problems. You had to interact with the burn spell when your opponent casts it, rather than any time thereafter. Secondly, the spell is countered immediately, allowing the target to block that turn. Finally, it made big creatures further important because you could protect them from burn and could do so more easily since you could use smaller pump effects. This also led to the requiring of non-obvious removal like Wrack with Madness and Puncture Blast to undo the interaction in some cases.
Along another axis, the deck has an artifact theme. I've been progressively toning down the quality of artifact removal. The original version had Shattering Spree, but that lead to too many blowouts, so I replaced it with Shattering Pulse, which was more expensive. However that led to too many grindy scenarios where it would just pile on card advantage and strand artifact cards in the opponent's hand. Additionally, I'd been having issues where the removal for artifacts was much less expensive than that for creatures, making artifacts prone to tempo hits. I want artifacts to be less vulnerable and less vulnerable to blowouts.
The first few changes I know I want ot make are as follows:
Keldon Megaliths -> Teetering Peaks
Barbarian Ring -> Smoldering Spires
Mountain -> Forgotten Cave
I'm trading two lands that punish small creatures for two lands that sometimes let small creatures attack through larger creatures.
Lightning Prowess -> Embersmith
It's been difficult to find a pinger that's both fair and powerful. This slot was originally Rod of Ruin and then Dragon Shard. Various creatures have been shuffled since the beginning, but Embersmith seems to be the fair version of this since it's not consistent and it's limited in the number of uses you get out of it and by your mana.
Ingot Chewer -> Wickerbough Elder
Ingot Chewer is a cool card. It's having a subtly problematic effect on game play though. The red deck never had a huge green subtheme, and I would like to expand it. The 2-for-1 artifact hater seems like a very good value slot for this to begin. As a splash, it gives you more options if you happen to have access to . I'm not 100% sure if this should be Indrik Stomphowler since the Treefolk can be have a larger (oppressive?) threat-of-activation in play.
It's worth noting here that the splash is going to be a problem. For the green deck, green was splashing powerful removal that pushed the deck to pairity. Red has an abundance of removal. Is there anything that green offers that red actually wants? Battery and Gruul Guildmage are very useful effects for green to offer, especially if the removal is getting worse/scarce.
Volcanic Submersion -> Scrap
Volcanic Submersion was mainly due to me not being able to find a copy of Scrap, but now with some relevant lands being removed, there little reason to make this change now.
Moving forward, I want to replace much of the Instant removal and a handful of creatures. The key threats are Hematite Golem, Tuktuk, the Explorer, Gargoyle Castle, Kultotha Flamefiend, and Wickerbough Elder. Aside from Tuktuk, the key toughness point will be 4 going forward. However, with the variety of equipment-like effects, it's often 5.
OUT Burst Lightning, Brimstone Volley, Inferno Trap, Chandra's Outrage
IN Icy Manipulator, Fatal Attraction, Fiery Fall, Contagion Clasp
It feels weird to remove Burst Lightning, because it's one of my favorite red cards. I don't like the idea that Fiery Fall won't always be castable, but it should help support the Green theme that I want to grow. Contagion Clasp might not have the effect I want since it hurts smaller creatures sooner, but I'm willing to test it. The best change here is the inclusion of Icy Manipulator, which has a much closer play pattern to auras, however it does die to removal that is intended for large artifact threats.
IN Needle Drop
This card plays the closest I can find to Lace with Moonglove. Crucially, it doesn't hurt small creatures at all and it makes their presence matter. It can also cycle, which is nice.
OUT Torch Fiend
IN Sylvok Replica
Torch Fiend was typically unsafe to play unless your opponent had an artifact and you could keep up the red since it dies to all burn/ping. While I suspect this would occur much less with the removal overhaul, I'm making this change anyway to make green more relevant and to create a larger variety of creature sizes. 1/3s can create a larger variety of blocking scenarios.
OUT Burning-Eye Zubera
IN Rubblebelt Maaka
This will require some testing to make sure that the replacement is suitable, but Burning-Eye Zubera varied from oppressive to irrelevant depending on the opponent's draws. The Maaka will allow small creatures to attack into large creatures, hopefully trading the 3/3 card for a 4/4. Unlike Brute Force, it can't be used to protect threats from removal. On the other hand, it could theoretically counter combat tricks used defensively.
OUT Thunder Strike, Mutagenic Growth
IN Weapon Surge, Slaughter Cry
The Thunder Strike slot used to be Slaughter Cry, but 3 mana was too expensive to be used defensively. The incoming tricks should be safer to use now with fewer Instants floating around. Unlike pure pump, these two don't bounce off each other, but instead kill all creatures involved. Weapon Surge has the added benefit of efficiently using all of your power in play in group blocks vs large creatures.
Those are all the changes I've decide on thus far, but there remains some work to replace creatures and I'm not sure what I'm going to do with the slots.
REPLACE Goblin Sledder
It's no longer "interesting" to stop a burn spell. It's also not as interesting if you can upgrade Tuktuk whenever you like. Due to the creature size spread, it won't have any relevant effect on combat. If there were red Pacifisms, this might not be true, but there aren't, so it really ought to be replaced.
REPLACE Spikeshot Elder
Ping remains a scourge. I like this card since it's a mana sink, but I don't think I can have this running around anymore.
It's worth noting here that none of the 1-drops remain. Flayer Husk exists, but I'd like to have at least two actual red 1-drops. compared to other colors, red doesn't have any utility 1-drops. All red 1-drops are aggro-oriented. I want a red Drowned Rusalka or something to consider, but nothing exists.
REPLACE Ember Hauler
As alluded to earlier, it's a problem card. If this were a 2/2 with Deathtouch, it would remain. Maybe Ambush Viper is something red would splash? It doesn't care about removal...
REPLACE Ferrovore
I want artifacts to matter more, but this isn't good enough. It's a 2/2. On the other hand, it CAN theoretically trade up, but that's 2-for-1ing yourself. I'd like to sac an artifact to draw a card or loot or something, but that doesn't exist. This just isn't quite good enough.
REPLACE Peace Strider
Gaining life to stabilize is cool. This is probably the most solid of the cards I want to replace and it's definitely something red otherwise can't do. It just doesn't seem quite good enough, but it can stay while I'm changing the more relevant pieces.
REPLACE Fire Servant
I suppose with all the burn leaving, its ability isn't as relevant now, but if it's a vanilla 4/3 for , I'd rather replace it with something that does something. It's worth noting that 4/3 are pretty good stats for this slot, though, trading with most of the top-end threats.
Do you guys have any ideas?
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Posted Aug 1, 2013If the combat tricks and their increased relevance aren't enough to deal with Tuktuk and it IS cut, I can probably cut Scrap as well.
Keeping Tuktuk in would be similar to keeping Shivan Dragon in core set limited. Sometimes, you just need some players to get free wins. The dragon can be dealt with, but not easily. However, Tuktuk shows up far more often than a draft bomb, is cheaper to cast and has been rather swingy as to whether you could deal with it or not.
Needle Drop and Grifter's Blade only give +1 damage, so in a square stats world, for them to work out, the size spread would preferably be small. Most of the creatures don't have square stats, though, so I'm not sure how this will end up working out. Needle Drop could end up being irrelevant.
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Posted Aug 1, 2013Stonewright, while not having flying, is a bit more flexible in how it allows you to trade up.
I still want an evasive creature. I was tempted on Goblin Balloon Brigade, you have to pay mana for the flying. Goblin Fireslinger can't block fliers, so combat tricks don't work on it. I think I'm really going to just have to find space for Needlepeak Spider or Crested Craghorn.
Kird Ape is another possibility, and with 4 forests and Fiery Fall, won't be too inconsistent. However, as a 1/1, it doesn't do ANYTHING unlike Flinthoof Boar.
Tattermunge Duo is a card I looked at a while back, but it seemed too strong then. Without all the instant speed burn, it might be fine, though it's still very hard to block.
Gruul Keyrune was another card I considered, but I'm not sure about. I like that it's a green source that asks you to get another green source, but by itself it's not that impressive. The ramp isn't needed from 3->5. I like the 3/2 body though. Copper Myr was another possibility here, though unlike Guardian Idol, it doesn't trade with anything.
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Posted Jul 30, 2013Fatal Attraction was not the best top deck which I'm going to be keeping an eye on. However, if it's one of the few good removal spells that remain, it should still be something that you'd want to draw. A new interaction, though is that the new green cards allow the enchantment to be destroyed before your upkeep which can make it harder to kill larger creatures with it.
The first strike on Galvanic Arc made creature size too relevant. You had to play it on something that couldn't be burned in response and then that creature had to be dealt with using removal, which was harder based on its size.
I tried Flame Slash briefly, but it turns out that tempo is a thing. ^^; Requiring 3-5 mana for hard removal is something I look to do now.