I lost in the top 4 of my Game Day going undefeated in Swiss beating BG Seasons Past, WR Eldrazi and Mardu control, and drawing with Bant Company for top seed. In the top 8 I beat another WR Eldrazi deck and lost to UW Humans in game 3 due to getting choked on black and having to fire off multiple Grasp of Darknesses with Llanowar Wastes. I ended up having to tap for black 3 times and those 3 life ended up being very crucial.
The deck is a lot of fun. GDD and Chandra are probably the best cards in the deck. GDD was an all-star for me with me and synergizes really well with Traverse and Mindwrack Demons, but this is obvious at this point.
Good luck to those of you playing in GP NY next week. I'll be jamming Legacy.
Yep LSV said that Kalitas main was a problem since the deck runs 0 removal main deck.
I feel pretty confident on keeping 2 Kalitas Main from now on since this deck will start popping out everywhere
Yeh, I was dithering on whether or not to keep Kalitas in but on seeing the sac dec be a thing again I'l most definitely be keeping him in.
People follow the Pro Tour. Kalitas wasn't that good against all the white based decks that popped up in the new format with Declaration in Stone and Reflector Mage, but he'll be an all-star again once the format slows down.
Something to think about, but the pilot of that Jund list that placed T32 at the Open said he would cut Mina and Denn in favor of upping to 4 Tireless Trackers.
How do you like Arlinn Kord? I haven't really been a fan. I love mindwrack demon plus languish however. I also personally love pulse/den protector. We now have some standard results and I think they are important in considering how to build a midrange list. After seeing how strong white is however, I wouldn't be surprised if people drop one of these colors for white.
I tried Arlinn and wasn't too impressed. On paper she's awesome, but there were too many situations where I wanted the bolt and she was on the human side and vice versa.
I'm pretty happy with the manabase. I currently have 15 R pips, 9 G pips and 26 B pips with 4 double R and 8 double B. Using Frank Karsten's formula of 4 Evolving Wilds = 3 mana sources of each color, I have 15 R sources, 12 G sources and 16 B sources. Lands will come in tapped, at some point. That's just something we have to accept when running a 3 color deck in this format. My approach is mainly focused on RB with G as the splash.
I honestly think Evolving Wilds of some number is a necessary evil with a 3 color deck, and I'm happy to run 4 Wilds since I'm running more Delirium cards than many of the lists posted in this thread.
Mindwrack Demon has been really good for me in testing. He feeds Delirium and makes Dark-Dwellers that much better. He also gives us a good answer to Planeswalkers without having to run Ruinous Path. He ignores Gideon's, Nissa's and Arlin's tokens and flies over to smack them in the face. Chandra can't kill him the turn she comes down. Sorin can come down, kill him and live at 1 loyalty, but you can't win them all.
Speaking of Delirium, it's really easy to achieve with this list. To the Slaughter almost always kills a PW at instant speed. Traverse the Ulvenwald has also been pretty good for me. In the early game it helps me fix mana untapped, if needed, and mid/late game it can find me a creature answer or a Hissing Quagmire if I need a manland. It also interacts very well with Dark-Dwellers. I've had games where we're at parity. I cast a Dark-Dwellers, flash back TtU, get another DD, next turn cast the DD, flash back Kolaghan's Command etc etc. Just your typical Jund stuff.
Moving forward, I want to have some number of Duress mainboard. Secure the Wastes is definitely a problem card, and I'd like to have a way to rip it out of the opponent's hand or force them to cast it much earlier than they'd like. I haven't built a sideboard yet. Still waiting to see how the meta shakes out at Baltimore.
It's a carry-over from before OGW to slow/stop 4C Rally. I have a feeling it will start to dry up as Kalitas, Traitor of Ghet seems to be viewed as a much better card vs Rally and others.
That's what I'm thinking. A 3/4 lifelinker that makes 2/2s when our deck is just full of removal seems way better than a 4/4. It might be worthwhile to run both against Rally because of Reflector Mage, though.
I lean on duress, infinite obliteration, flaying tendrils and kalitas.
Unfortunately, all of these cards aren't ideal. They can respond to the duress with coco and rally. Obliteration doesnt affect the board. Tendrils is bad if they have husk or ayli out. Kalitas is andwered vy reflector mage.
Playing dedicated finishers seems like a waste of slots in a deck like this, it's built to win through inevitability so playing cards that "just" end the game instead of interacting with your opponent doesn't really make sense. Winning with Hissing Quagmires and left over Den Protectors/Goblin Dark-Dwellers seems like the way this deck should play out.
Agreed. Rock style decks don't need a critical mass of finishers. We just 2 for 1 our opponent until they're top decking and we beat them down with value creatures and manlands.
I was able to get some great testing in against a local SCG grinder, and found that the lack of lifegain could be a major problem for the deck. I see why Kibler chose to go with 3 Kalitas in the main. Mardu Green decks get around this by running Soulfire Grandmaster. I'm thinking of adding in Siege Rhinos instead of Woodland Wanderer, but not sure about going into the fourth color.
For now I'm going to put Read the Bones into the board and Kalitas back into the main. Chandra has been pretty good, so I might look into bumping up to two.
Game 1 against atarka red is bad if they nut draw multiple token makers into command/bushwhacker. Id still rather not have a mainboard board wipe that is potentially dead against other decks.
If we make it to the midgame, woodland wanderer and buffed advocate will usually win the game.
Poastboard gets a lot better since I can bring in kalitas, tendrils and pulse while cutting awkward/uncastable stuff like ruinous path and read the bones.
Goblin Dark-Dwellers - Most of the lists posted already have this guy, but I want to reiterate that you need to be playing this guy if you are playing a red midrange deck. You haven't lived life until you've cast him while targeting Kolaghan's Command.
Sylvan Advocate - In the early game, he's a 2/3 that applies pressure while sitting on defense. In the late game, he's a Tarmogoyf that pumps our Hissing Quagmires.
Woodland Wanderer - Jund's Siege Rhino, but bigger. Like the Advocate, he applies a very real clock while holding back on defense. It's very easy to make him a turn 4 5/5, and it's not unheard of for him to be a 6/6 with the 1 Sunken Hollow.
Read the Bones - Painful Truths is a nonbo with Goblin Dark-Dwellers, so I'm running Read the Bones.
Sarkhan, the Dragonspeaker - His +1 reads "Destroy target Gideon".
Kalitas, Traitor of Ghet - I have Kalitas in the sideboard because he's fantastic against certain decks while mediocre against others.
Pulse of Murasa - Trying this over Feed the Clans. We won't always have ferocious, and gaining 6 life and getting back a Woodland Wanderer or Dark-Dwellers is sometimes enough to make the game unwinnable for Atarka Red.
I've been messing around with this deck since I've been wanting to see if Ulamog was Standard playable since he was spoiled. I have to say that this deck really misses Elvish Mystic. Like.. really misses Elvish Mystic.
Like it has been mentioned, I think red is fairly necessary for Radiant Flames. I originally had 0 dorks in the list, but I think we need early plays as a concession to Atarka Red.
I originally had 4 Hangarback Walkers, but decided to try splashing black for Catacomb Sifter like Ali Aintrazi did last week. I think he's pretty fantastic for gumming up the ground, as well as providing ramp and scrying. I still haven't decided if he's a good replacement for Hangarback or if I still want him in addition to them in the deck. Black also gives us access to Abzan Charm which is a way to interact with Temur Midrange since they go over Radiant Flames.
How do people feel about Oblivion Sower? He seems great on paper, but in practice he's just a big vanilla dude that puts ~2 lands into play. I'd be much more excited about him if he had reach since he pairs up really poorly against Mantis Rider and Thunderbreak Regent.
Some local players are trying to rekindle our modern scene, and since I've had both Jund and Pod built throughout the past few years, a GBW seems to be a good starting point.
Sorry if this is obvious, but what is the difference between this deck and the Abzan deck? I'm assuming it has to do with different styles of play, but the decklists posted on the last few pages of each page seem really similar.
Brainstorm
Cabal Therapy
Chain Lightning
Jace, the Mind Sculptor
True-Name Nemesis
No:
Aether Vial
Imperial Recruiter
Sensei's Divining Top
Scalding Tarn (or Zen fetches fwiw)
Umezawa's Jitte
The deck is a lot of fun. GDD and Chandra are probably the best cards in the deck. GDD was an all-star for me with me and synergizes really well with Traverse and Mindwrack Demons, but this is obvious at this point.
Good luck to those of you playing in GP NY next week. I'll be jamming Legacy.
People follow the Pro Tour. Kalitas wasn't that good against all the white based decks that popped up in the new format with Declaration in Stone and Reflector Mage, but he'll be an all-star again once the format slows down.
I tried Arlinn and wasn't too impressed. On paper she's awesome, but there were too many situations where I wanted the bolt and she was on the human side and vice versa.
4 Sylvan Advocate
1 Nissa, Voice of Zendikar
2 Kalitas, Traitor of Ghet
3 Mindwrack Demon
3 Goblin Dark-Dwellers
Spells (19)
4 Traverse the Ulvenwald
3 Fiery Impulse
2 Ultimate Price
2 Transgress the Mind
2 Kolaghan's Command
2 Read the Bones
2 To the Slaughter
2 Dead Weight
1 Ob Nixilis, Reignited
2 Chandra, Flamecaller
Lands (25)
4 Evolving Wilds
2 Forest
3 Mountain
3 Swamp
3 Hissing Quagmire
3 Smoldering Marsh
1 Cinder Glade
3 Foreboding Ruins
2 Game Trail
1 Llanowar Wastes
I'm pretty happy with the manabase. I currently have 15 R pips, 9 G pips and 26 B pips with 4 double R and 8 double B. Using Frank Karsten's formula of 4 Evolving Wilds = 3 mana sources of each color, I have 15 R sources, 12 G sources and 16 B sources. Lands will come in tapped, at some point. That's just something we have to accept when running a 3 color deck in this format. My approach is mainly focused on RB with G as the splash.
I honestly think Evolving Wilds of some number is a necessary evil with a 3 color deck, and I'm happy to run 4 Wilds since I'm running more Delirium cards than many of the lists posted in this thread.
Mindwrack Demon has been really good for me in testing. He feeds Delirium and makes Dark-Dwellers that much better. He also gives us a good answer to Planeswalkers without having to run Ruinous Path. He ignores Gideon's, Nissa's and Arlin's tokens and flies over to smack them in the face. Chandra can't kill him the turn she comes down. Sorin can come down, kill him and live at 1 loyalty, but you can't win them all.
Speaking of Delirium, it's really easy to achieve with this list. To the Slaughter almost always kills a PW at instant speed. Traverse the Ulvenwald has also been pretty good for me. In the early game it helps me fix mana untapped, if needed, and mid/late game it can find me a creature answer or a Hissing Quagmire if I need a manland. It also interacts very well with Dark-Dwellers. I've had games where we're at parity. I cast a Dark-Dwellers, flash back TtU, get another DD, next turn cast the DD, flash back Kolaghan's Command etc etc. Just your typical Jund stuff.
Moving forward, I want to have some number of Duress mainboard. Secure the Wastes is definitely a problem card, and I'd like to have a way to rip it out of the opponent's hand or force them to cast it much earlier than they'd like. I haven't built a sideboard yet. Still waiting to see how the meta shakes out at Baltimore.
That's what I'm thinking. A 3/4 lifelinker that makes 2/2s when our deck is just full of removal seems way better than a 4/4. It might be worthwhile to run both against Rally because of Reflector Mage, though.
Unfortunately, all of these cards aren't ideal. They can respond to the duress with coco and rally. Obliteration doesnt affect the board. Tendrils is bad if they have husk or ayli out. Kalitas is andwered vy reflector mage.
Agreed. Rock style decks don't need a critical mass of finishers. We just 2 for 1 our opponent until they're top decking and we beat them down with value creatures and manlands.
I was able to get some great testing in against a local SCG grinder, and found that the lack of lifegain could be a major problem for the deck. I see why Kibler chose to go with 3 Kalitas in the main. Mardu Green decks get around this by running Soulfire Grandmaster. I'm thinking of adding in Siege Rhinos instead of Woodland Wanderer, but not sure about going into the fourth color.
For now I'm going to put Read the Bones into the board and Kalitas back into the main. Chandra has been pretty good, so I might look into bumping up to two.
If we make it to the midgame, woodland wanderer and buffed advocate will usually win the game.
Poastboard gets a lot better since I can bring in kalitas, tendrils and pulse while cutting awkward/uncastable stuff like ruinous path and read the bones.
4 Sylvan Advocate
2 Nissa, Vastwood Seer
2 Den Protector
4 Woodland Wanderer
3 Goblin Dark-Dwellers
Planeswalkers - 4
2 Sarkhan, the Dragonspeaker
1 Ob Nixilis, Reignited
1 Chandra, Flamecaller
Sorceries/Instants - 15
4 Fiery Impulse
1 Roast
2 Read the Bones
3 Kolaghan's Command
3 Ruinous Path
2 Murderous Cut
3 Swamp
3 Forest
2 Mountain
4 Wooded Foothills
4 Bloodstained Mire
4 Hissing Quagmire
3 Smoldering Marsh
2 Cinder Glade
1 Sunken Hollow
2 Kalitas, Traitor of Ghet
3 Flaying Tendrils
3 Duress
2 Infinite Obliteration
2 Pulse of Murasa
1 Greenwarden of Murasa
1 Roast
1 Read the Bones
I'll explain some of my card choices.
Goblin Dark-Dwellers - Most of the lists posted already have this guy, but I want to reiterate that you need to be playing this guy if you are playing a red midrange deck. You haven't lived life until you've cast him while targeting Kolaghan's Command.
Sylvan Advocate - In the early game, he's a 2/3 that applies pressure while sitting on defense. In the late game, he's a Tarmogoyf that pumps our Hissing Quagmires.
Woodland Wanderer - Jund's Siege Rhino, but bigger. Like the Advocate, he applies a very real clock while holding back on defense. It's very easy to make him a turn 4 5/5, and it's not unheard of for him to be a 6/6 with the 1 Sunken Hollow.
Read the Bones - Painful Truths is a nonbo with Goblin Dark-Dwellers, so I'm running Read the Bones.
Sarkhan, the Dragonspeaker - His +1 reads "Destroy target Gideon".
Kalitas, Traitor of Ghet - I have Kalitas in the sideboard because he's fantastic against certain decks while mediocre against others.
Pulse of Murasa - Trying this over Feed the Clans. We won't always have ferocious, and gaining 6 life and getting back a Woodland Wanderer or Dark-Dwellers is sometimes enough to make the game unwinnable for Atarka Red.
That being said, here's my deck:
4x Rattleclaw Mystic
4x Catacomb Sifter
2x Nissa, Vastwood Seer
4x Oblivion Sower
2x Dragonlord Dromoka
2x Dragonlord Atarka
2x Ulamog, the Ceaseless Hunger
3x Radiant Flames
2x Nissa's Pilgrimage
2x Explosive Vegetation
4x Hedron Archive
Lands
4x Wooded Foothills
2x Bloodstained Mire
2x Windswept Heath
2x Haven of the Spirit Dragon
3x Cinder Glade
2x Canopy Vista
2x Smoldering Marsh
6x Forest
1x Swamp
1x Plains
1x Mountain
Like it has been mentioned, I think red is fairly necessary for Radiant Flames. I originally had 0 dorks in the list, but I think we need early plays as a concession to Atarka Red.
I originally had 4 Hangarback Walkers, but decided to try splashing black for Catacomb Sifter like Ali Aintrazi did last week. I think he's pretty fantastic for gumming up the ground, as well as providing ramp and scrying. I still haven't decided if he's a good replacement for Hangarback or if I still want him in addition to them in the deck. Black also gives us access to Abzan Charm which is a way to interact with Temur Midrange since they go over Radiant Flames.
How do people feel about Oblivion Sower? He seems great on paper, but in practice he's just a big vanilla dude that puts ~2 lands into play. I'd be much more excited about him if he had reach since he pairs up really poorly against Mantis Rider and Thunderbreak Regent.
Sorry if this is obvious, but what is the difference between this deck and the Abzan deck? I'm assuming it has to do with different styles of play, but the decklists posted on the last few pages of each page seem really similar.