MTG Salvation

Quote from UltraLunch »

And if control decks make a resurgence, you'd better believe that games will be won by Jace's ultimate. Control decks running him will only use his -2 in desperate situations (if they can't draw removal with his amazing +1)

Quote from Courier7 »

It is a shame that playing GRW will be significantly more difficult after rotation because Oath of Gideon to give her an extra loyalty counter means that she cannot get to her ultimate until turn 7. Even if we use Leaf Gilder and we get her out by turn 3 it is still turn 7 until she can ultimate. Still...a lot of inexpensive creatures being pumped by Nissa, Voice of Zendikar could result in keeping the board clear, should Arlinn, Embraced by the Moon be able to ultimate.

Quote from xenob8 »

Quote from Shardoon »

Quote from xenob8 »

yeah, because the last eldrazi deck are famous for their lategame and not their explosive problematic starts

You play 2-3 2 costing 2/2 creatures on turn 1 then you need a 'midgame' solution to keep them in play while drawing more cards to finish the game. That 'midgame' solution is a turn 2 TKS, which activates a 4/4 mimic and creates the trouble we have at this time. So . . . take away a temple and a TKS and we solve the 'midgame' problem, leaving other builds 2-3 turns to find the answer to a few 2/2 Eldrazi. Yes.

since when t2 is midgame?

and shouldn't i just replace tks and smasher with equivalent cmc eldrazis? we should ban every eldrazi then?

Quote from Vondrack »

If the match is over on turn 3, t2 is midgame

Quote from xenob8 »

yeah, because the last eldrazi deck are famous for their lategame and not their explosive problematic starts

Quote from Underused Cards »

Let's speculate the bans and what they would do if an individual piece got banned. Since Forescythe made it clear he doesn't want it to be obliterated. I'm going to be looking at the 5 staples. Eye, Temple, Mimic, TKS, and Smasher, which are the core pieces to the deck and in each variation. Keep in mind, banning any of the lands I think will see a rise in the Tron version.

1.Ban Eye of Ugin
If you ban Eye of Ugin, can the deck still be played? Yes. It'll still allow for Turn 2 TKS, Turn 3 Smasher, but at a very low consistency. Most likely, Eye will be replaced by Vesuva, to ramp, however, since it comes into play tapped, any godlike draws will be mitigated a turn later. It also absolutely hurts the R/G version as they either pack in 4 World Breakers, or don't bother at all, and just dig with Ancient Stirrings. Banning Eye will most likely make the deck tier 2, and usually that just means a FNM deck and no more. The loss of tutoring for anything is also a huge loss for the deck, and more than likely kill the Tron version as well.

2.Ban Temple of Eldrazi
Same deal with Eye of Ugin, however, at an even worse rate for consistency. The Turn 1, 2, 3, will effectively be destroyed. Since Eye has the Legendary rule, drawing two with the same hand or topdecking an Eye of Ugin is a bad thing. This hurts the U/W version much more than the G/R version because Displacer tricks now use much more lands and mana to tap around. Vesuva also wouldn't be bothered with since copying an Eye of Ugin is pointless. If they ban Temple of Eldrazi, I think the deck is done for, and it switches to a Urza Land version. And at that point, Conduit of Ruin will see more play.

3. Ban Eldrazi Mimic
There's no reason to ban this card. It's there, along with Endless One, and doesn't do much. It'll probably just get replaced by Matter Reshaper or Exploration Map.

4. Ban Thought-Knot Seer
Banning TKS is a way to make the Eldrazi deck still stick around, still be tier 1, but severely weaken the deck. Without TKS it makes Eldrazi even more vulnerable to various combo and control decks. There's no replacement for the card either. If TKS is banned, I think Eldrazi will return to the Processor version and pack in more removal, Thoughtseize, Duress, and other black control cards. The U/W version loses it's discard, and either plays counterspells, make it become Esper (essentially a 4 color deck), or dies. There's also that odd Turn 1 and 2 for the Eldrazi player to play something. They have to play color to get another piece or play removal, or they play another Eldrazi land to possibly get a 4/4 Endless One triggering 2 Eldrazi Mimics in play to deal the 12 damage. However, they won't be able to take away any removal. It still allows for the explosive start, but allows for more interaction from the other player. That said, banning TKS would open up Blight Herder or Matter Reshaper.

Would a Turn 1 Mimic, Turn 2 Reshaper, Turn 3 Smasher be that bad?

5 Reality Smasher
I personally don't think it does that much but it stops all the 15 damage in turn 3. Which is what makes Eldrazi, Eldrazi. It's a fair card and needs to have a really good draw and a good hand to be able to set up the huge bash to the face. Banning Reality Smasher wouldn't do too much to the consistency of the deck, and is clearly not the problem when it can be easily replaced by Endbringer, Bane of Gala Ged, Conduict, or Blight Herder.

Thoughts? I understand that Eye and Temple are the ones to go, but if Wizard is hellbent on keeping the deck around, what other alternatives can they have? I personally think if any of the lands go, it's going to switch to a Tron version of the deck, which is something I wouldn't like. Having another deck stuck in Tier 1 or 2 would already diversify the meta.