So wait, is this information telling us that these gods are the ones appearing in BNG?
Also we know Iroas will be appearing too, so now we just need to know whether the 5th is like Pharika, Kruphix, Phenax, Xenagos, Keranos, or Athreos?
I doubt this will determine which gods are appearing in the set. If it did, then that would mean either:
A) We are getting a total of 8 gods in this set (Xenagos, Atheros, Kruphix, Iroas, and Phenax? to match the "Scry lands" from THS and Karametra, Ehpara, and Mogis to match the BNG "scrylands") and only 3 in Journy into Nyx.
OR
B) We are getting only 3 gods in this set and a total of 7 gods in Journey into Nyx.
Either way, I think it is much more likely that we are going to get 5 gods in Born of the Gods and the last 5 in Journey into Nyx.
Here's the obvious themes of Theros I see: 1. Aura/Devotion + Heroic
2. Black's self-mill 3. UR Scry
4. MonoB Devotion
5. Rx aggro
1) Devotion doesn't work as well with Heroic as you might think. Devotion cares about a mass of single colored permanents. Heroic cares about a mix of single permanents (the heroic cards) and spells that target them. You will probably be running only 1 or 2 colors during the pre-release anyways, but that doesn't mean that devotion and heroic work well together.
3) U/R Scry might become a good strategy in Draft formats, but in Limited, you will probably need a bunch of veryspecificcards for it to function well.
Sealock Monster versus a opponent who uses Nylea's Presence as fixing.
A Sealock Monster can be paired with a Nylea's Presence you control to avoid having to pay for Sealock's monstrosity in order to attack. Just make sure you only play it when your opponent already has all his/her colors.
I'd say +2/+2 vigi for 5 mana is pretty good (remember RTR?). Sure, it might not be as good as blue's nymph (which is one of the best commons in the entire set), but I'd say it's better than black and red nymphs.
Regarding the Eidolons, to me they're actually about the same because I'd rather have +1/+1 lifelink for 4mana than +1/+1 deathtouch for 5mana, but I prefer 2mana 1/1 deathtouch to 1mana 1/1 lifelink.
In this set, all black gets is a bear with a demerit. Actually, no other color besides green even gets a bear.
There's a general lack of good removals in Theros, not just for white, so that heroic and bestow can remain a powerful mechanic. Last Breath and especially Divine Verdict are both great removals that are hard to come by in other colors.
No other color gets a bear? What about Traveling Philosopher? That's the literal definition of a bear: a vanilla 2/2 for 1C. And Fleshmad Steed is totally a bear, even with its drawback. Also, Battlewise Hoplite and Tymaret, the Murder King are multicolored 2/2s for 2 so, while not applicable for only a single color, every color has access to at least 1 bear.
Seriously, it feels like you are just trying to start an argument when you say things so absurd, and since I have been on the side of not liking the way these were designed (ie the rarity of these lands) it makes me really embarrassed to be lumped in with such posts. Two color is not all that hard with just the shocks and a little thought (ie not too many heavy color cards and a good curve), and three color is probably perfectly possible with CIPT lands added to the mix. I would guess that mono-colored decks are probably less possible right now due to so much of the card pool being multi-colored, though Red and Green always seem to be able to pull together mono-colored strategies in most metagames.
Also, with Thoughtseize and a (possibly much) slower environment, Mono-Black Control might also see a rise in prominence. It's unlikely without a great B board wipe, but you never know. Some of those devotion creatures might even be good sideboard cards.
At the prerelease I'm attending, I think I will either choose blue or green for the solo sealed event and I will definitely choose black for the 2HG event.
For a solo event, I think blue has the best splash-able commons and removal if it ends up that I get no color help in any of the other 5 boosters. I don't want to not be able to play my "Hero's Path" color as that's probably the most disheartening thing to happen in a sealed event.
For a 2HG event, black has the greatest majority of cards that effect multiple opponents (Agent of the Fates, Gray Merchant of Asphodel, Tormented Hero) and, as demonstrated by Extort in Gatecrash Sealed, getting double the effect for the price of one can really take over a game. Coupled with some of the better removal should make a great permission strategy.
First of all, 3/3 is not remotely the same thing as 4/5. There's just a huge difference in how combat plays out with those stat lines.
Second, you're underselling how much of a downgrade "without reach" is. Despite White generally having fewer big creatures than Green, Pillarfield Ox has always been trash, while Giant Spider has fallen somewhere between "acceptable" and "very good" every one of the many times it's been reprinted (literally and functionally).
Thank you for the critique. I admit that I was using the Ill-Tempered Cyclops comparison hyberbollically, but I was thoroughly confused. I've heard comparissons between Nessian Asp and other rare spiders (yes, I know the Asp is a snake...) such as Silklash Spider. I understand that reach can make a good card great in Limited, but everyone's excitement seemed wildly in-congruent.
A lot of black's power comes from Read the Bones and Viper's Kiss though. Green has Nessian Asp and Nylea's Disciple to be excited about.
So I get Read the Bones/Viper's Kiss/Nylea's Disciple, but can someone explain to me why everyone is going ga-ga over Nessian Asp? I get that it's a giant fatty with Reach, but it's in the color known for having giant fatties. Why isn't anyone spouting about how amazing Ill-Tempered Cyclops is? It's essentially the same thing without reach for 1 less mana.
Sure, green is the color of ramp, so you can probably get the asp out before turn 5 reliably. But red is often the closest color associated with green, and at least one of the green "rampers" (Satyr Hedonist) is a common that produces red mana.
I'm sorry you get consistently beat by this card. I didn't have a problem playing against it last night at FNM.
But it's an unfair card against decks that aren't prepared to play against it. What about the players who don't adequately prepare? Or are just beaten by bad draws? WHAT ABOUT THEM?!?!?!? /sarcasm
Did you people read what MaRo said? Do you guys actually see the juggling act WotC has deal with when it comes to so many different formats? Clearly people never look at context.
Apparently not, but that was probably a rhetorical question...
People really only look at power level for the formats they play; I know I do. And since I really only play Standard, Casual, and EDH, I tend to dismiss cards more targeted towards Modern, Vintage, and Legacy. (although, to be fair, many of the cards good in those formats are good in standard...)
I also think everyone that is complaining about these cards should quit. I'm always buying cards, please feel free to message me.
Never gonna happen. If you don't like complaining, I think staying away from the internet in general would be the best course of action.
All of the gods are really rough to try to evaluate as they all have such a high variance due to devotion. Most of them strike me as getting more ahead cards and this one seems to fit that vein more so than the others.
In most situations he would probably be win more, true. Unless you are a B/X aggro deck and run up against a deck using extort or Sphinx's Revelation. But those are most likely corner cases anyway.
I don't feel this is a Blue effect, but I think as a flavorful card at rare it's okay. The problem is that this isn't going to stop, we're going to see more of these at common and uncommon, and eventually we'll see a tournament playable staple that's Blue removal (And let's be honest, this is removal in at least EDH, if not other formats).
The problem with trying to justify a mechanic with flavor is that you can do it for any color. Green can get direct damage through flying stinging insects, Red can blow up enchantments because Red hates order, Black can destroy artifacts with some life loss because Black can do anything at a cost, etc. Counterspells were an effective form of Blue removal because they fit the color's focus on spells instead of permanents, but those got nerfed because "Little Timmy hates counterspells countering his big fat creature", so now they're awkwardly shoving in retired Blue mechanics under the guise of "flavor".
This represents my thoughts. Colors aren't just defined by what they can do, they're defined by what they can't do. Unfortunately, because Blue has gotten hit by the nerf bat while cheap creatures keep getting stronger, what the color can do is reduced and weak, and instead of making Blue's strengths stronger, Wizards is removing its intentional disadvantages.
I think this kind of fits a mass Polymorph with a known outcome. Or a kind of fixed version of a mass Rapid Hybridization. Either way, I think this really does fit blueU. "I'm not getting rid of your things, I'm just turning them into miniature versions of you. PIGS!" -Baya Jallard, watermage.
Especially after Bile Blight was revealed...
I doubt this will determine which gods are appearing in the set. If it did, then that would mean either:
A) We are getting a total of 8 gods in this set (Xenagos, Atheros, Kruphix, Iroas, and Phenax? to match the "Scry lands" from THS and Karametra, Ehpara, and Mogis to match the BNG "scrylands") and only 3 in Journy into Nyx.
OR
B) We are getting only 3 gods in this set and a total of 7 gods in Journey into Nyx.
Either way, I think it is much more likely that we are going to get 5 gods in Born of the Gods and the last 5 in Journey into Nyx.
1) Devotion doesn't work as well with Heroic as you might think. Devotion cares about a mass of single colored permanents. Heroic cares about a mix of single permanents (the heroic cards) and spells that target them. You will probably be running only 1 or 2 colors during the pre-release anyways, but that doesn't mean that devotion and heroic work well together.
3) U/R Scry might become a good strategy in Draft formats, but in Limited, you will probably need a bunch of very specific cards for it to function well.
A Sealock Monster can be paired with a Nylea's Presence you control to avoid having to pay for Sealock's monstrosity in order to attack. Just make sure you only play it when your opponent already has all his/her colors.
No other color gets a bear? What about Traveling Philosopher? That's the literal definition of a bear: a vanilla 2/2 for 1C. And Fleshmad Steed is totally a bear, even with its drawback. Also, Battlewise Hoplite and Tymaret, the Murder King are multicolored 2/2s for 2 so, while not applicable for only a single color, every color has access to at least 1 bear.
Also, with Thoughtseize and a (possibly much) slower environment, Mono-Black Control might also see a rise in prominence. It's unlikely without a great B board wipe, but you never know. Some of those devotion creatures might even be good sideboard cards.
For a solo event, I think blue has the best splash-able commons and removal if it ends up that I get no color help in any of the other 5 boosters. I don't want to not be able to play my "Hero's Path" color as that's probably the most disheartening thing to happen in a sealed event.
For a 2HG event, black has the greatest majority of cards that effect multiple opponents (Agent of the Fates, Gray Merchant of Asphodel, Tormented Hero) and, as demonstrated by Extort in Gatecrash Sealed, getting double the effect for the price of one can really take over a game. Coupled with some of the better removal should make a great permission strategy.
Dimir Aggro was "officially a thing" when cards were printed in U/B.
To paraphrase MaRo: "You can build a deck...the cards are there. It just might not be a good deck..."
Thank you for the critique. I admit that I was using the Ill-Tempered Cyclops comparison hyberbollically, but I was thoroughly confused. I've heard comparissons between Nessian Asp and other rare spiders (yes, I know the Asp is a snake...) such as Silklash Spider. I understand that reach can make a good card great in Limited, but everyone's excitement seemed wildly in-congruent.
So I get Read the Bones/Viper's Kiss/Nylea's Disciple, but can someone explain to me why everyone is going ga-ga over Nessian Asp? I get that it's a giant fatty with Reach, but it's in the color known for having giant fatties. Why isn't anyone spouting about how amazing Ill-Tempered Cyclops is? It's essentially the same thing without reach for 1 less mana.
Sure, green is the color of ramp, so you can probably get the asp out before turn 5 reliably. But red is often the closest color associated with green, and at least one of the green "rampers" (Satyr Hedonist) is a common that produces red mana.
Apparently not, but that was probably a rhetorical question...
People really only look at power level for the formats they play; I know I do. And since I really only play Standard, Casual, and EDH, I tend to dismiss cards more targeted towards Modern, Vintage, and Legacy. (although, to be fair, many of the cards good in those formats are good in standard...)
Never gonna happen. If you don't like complaining, I think staying away from the internet in general would be the best course of action.
Yes, because a GREEN creature with greater power/toughness than a vanilla test has never existed. Ever.
In most situations he would probably be win more, true. Unless you are a B/X aggro deck and run up against a deck using extort or Sphinx's Revelation. But those are most likely corner cases anyway.
Yeah, in a perfect world. In that world, they also wouldn't have cast any Burning-Tree Emissaries, Boros Reckoners, Dryad Militants, Rakdos Cacklers, Lotleth Trolls, or any number of other decent Gruul/Jund multicolored creatures before casting Xenagos.
*ahem* "Wizards sucks because they didn't do what I wanted by making a non-splashy overpowered card. WAAAAAHHH!"
How'd I do?
I think this kind of fits a mass Polymorph with a known outcome. Or a kind of fixed version of a mass Rapid Hybridization. Either way, I think this really does fit blueU. "I'm not getting rid of your things, I'm just turning them into miniature versions of you. PIGS!" -Baya Jallard, watermage.
On a side note, I think this card's unofficial name should have some connection to "Bacon." Bacon Within? Rapid Baconization? Baconmorph? Warp Bacon? ...okay, okay, I'll stop...
edit: Turn to Bacon? Baconform? Bacon Mutation? Trait Baconing? Baconify? Baconize? ..okay, really, how could I resist? They just keep coming...