Graveborn Muse is sweet. It's competing in a much larger slot though. Simic is in a pretty good place with Edric, two decent Kioras and Shardless Agent. I'm presently happy with any three of those so I don't have room for Rashmi.
Looks like it'll be good fun in the Welder/Daretti shells. Also pretty decent with Recurring Nightmare.
It also plays nice with Revilark, Sun Titan, Birthing Pod, Braids/Black Sacrifice, UW blink, Tinker fodder, and helps stem bleeding in aggro decks. It is an unexciting card but I feel like it has enough utility that it will make it into my cube (600 unpowered). I can even see it getting played in some control decks that need a chump blocker (like a worse Baleful Strix).
Any discussion on Lingering Souls versions? Seems like with some tweaking to the mana base there is real potential.
I've been trying Lingering Souls (and Kommand) in Jeskai the last couple days and so far I am liking it. I do not run either visions. I did drop from 25 lands to 24, not sold on that change yet but altering the manabase wasn't too hard. My current manabase is:
3 Celestial Colonade (I hate drawing too many tapped lands)
1 Desolate Lighthouse
9 Fetches (4 Strand, 3 Tarns, 2 Mesa)
6 Shocks (1 of each)
4 Basics (2 Island, 1 Mountain, 1 Plains)
1 Sulfur Falls (I tried a swamp here but it was bad...I was also trying Inquisitions at the time though which I was not happy with)
I've been considering trying 2 copies of Mentor in the board. It triggers off of every card except for snapcaster and I feel like most people are boarding out their removal games 2 and 3 anyway.
I'm definitely guilty of doing that with quite a few cards. For example I have Avacyn's Pilgrim in green. That one I know is incorrect but GW is a strong guild and I see Pilgrim make green ramp decks that don't run white frequently enough that it feels fine.
Most of my hybrid cards are also in mono color sections unless their cost/effectiveness is restrictive to the point that they aren't really playable in a two color deck with one of the colors being off color (examples Nightveil Specter, Figure of Destiny, Boros Reckoner). Deathrite Shaman and Kitchen Finks are both green cards in my cube...Dryad Militant and Tattermunge Maniac are in White and Red as those colors want aggressive 1 drops more.
I guess I just view her differently, I've always viewed her first and foremost as a Llanowar Elf that trades 1 power for the exalted keyword. This to me always made her the 2nd best mana dork for monogreen after Joraga Treespeaker and placed her probably in my top 10 for mono green cards in my cube.
I still have issues considering Noble Hierarch a Bant card. No one puts Birds of Paradise in their gold sections and no one would ever not include Noble Hieararch from their mono green deck. Hell, I'll play Noble Hierarch in most Jund decks.
That said Bant is a fairly shallow Shard. The Archangel is the best option, IMO, but I'm not a huge fan of her so I actually use my Jund and Bant slots to bolster Gruul and Selesnya. Bloodbraid Elf and Mirari's Wake are my honorary Jund and Bant cards. Also, this way I don't feel bad about wasting precious guild spots on Kird Ape and Loam Lion which are necessary to keep Aggro a threat and also strengthen Wild Nacatl's inclusion in the Naya slot.
I've found Mardu Charm to be surprisingly good...especially in the Twin matchup. It looks overpriced (and it is if you look at the abilities separately) but it does everything you want a card to do in this type of deck. All three modes are relevant. In the Twin match up it can either kill the Exarch during your endstep or Duress away the Spinter Twin during your opponents draw step. Even if they can counter it (in Duress mode), it should buy you a turn as they have to tap mana. Two tokens with first strike at instant speed is also a valuable combat trick against fair decks.
However, its hidden fourth mode is its best mode. Because it is removal, a token generator or discard all in one it frees up a couple slots in your deck for other cards. While Inquisition and Thoughtseize are often horrible top decks late game I'm never unhappy to top deck a Mardu Charm. Similarly, against a combo deck like storm when you draw a terminate or path game one it is fairly awful but Mardu Charm will let you rip a combo piece from your opponents hand at instant speed.
That said, I think 1-2 copies in the correct amount in most decks as the three drop slot is competitive.
Nice write up! I agree this style of deck is great versus any type of creature based deck like affinity. Abzhan is rough, but do able. That match up tends to always go to game 3 when i play it.
I usually deal with storm by bringing in Slaughter Games, Wear // Tear and Rest in Peace. Our single target removal is useless so there are a lot of cards to take out, sweepers like Anger of the Gods or Zealous Persecution are great for cleaning up Goblins.
So far I have having the most problems with Mono Blue Tron. They have all the counters of UWR control but better threats that tend to come down earlier. Between Gifts and Academy Ruins their deck is built in such away that they don't even really care all that much about your discard.
I played in the MTGO daily yesterday and went 2-2. I beat Abzhan Liege and UWR Control, losing to Mono Blue Control and my own ability to draw lands (another Abzhan deck...I drew 2 lands the entire round). Counting the event as whole as a 2-1 record and I am considering a 24th land. Given that it was the first daily I have tried this deck in I was happy with the results. My opponents went 4-0 (Tron), 3-1 (2nd Abzhan), 2-2 (Abzhan Liege), 2-2 (UWR Control).
Im not sure if this the right place for this as my deck Im running is more control/token based than midrange...but it is Mardu and extremely fun so far.
While I'm not familiar with this archetype I'd consider replacing the bears with Ambush Viper, trading a toughness for deathtouch to trade with tarmogoyfs seems good.
So far I have liked Grenzo as a one of in traditional vial goblins in place of a Goblin Piledriver. While his ability is nice (but nowhere even close to as good a CA engine as Ringleader/Matron) and has one me some games, I mainly like him for his flexibility as a vanilla creature. A lot of people seem to like Krenko more...and while I like Krenko, he is only good if you already have a decent mass of goblins. Grenzo, unlike Krenko and Piledriver is great even on an empty board as a larger threat with the potential refuel you.
It is possible I am being greedy running 7 fetchlands with only 4 targets...but so far I haven't run into any issues. Against basic heavy decks I will often side out 2 Wastelands for the Plateau and Karakas. I am not 100% on the board yet I may make room for Pithing Needle, Mindbreak Trap and possibly Ensnaring Bridge.
I've always wanted to know how this deck actually plays out. Can somebody give me a typical series of plays till the deck wins, or a situation please?
I think that you didnt get a quick response because Goblins doesn't really have a set play order. Everything depends on the match but ideally you want a turn 1 goblin lackey or aether vial. The deck isn't actually an aggro deck even though it is capable of aggressive plays with goblin piledrivers. The game plan mainly focuses around two things a) mana denial via rishadan ports and wastelands and b) card advantage through goblin matron and goblin ringleader ( andmaybe Grenzo...still testing him). Hope this helps.
This thread is for cube. Grenzo in works in any Rakdos deck just as a regular vanilla creature at any point in the curve.
His ability is icing...but really delicious chocolate icing in the right deck. It is a great mana sink in aggressive decks once you've run out of gas or in any deck that wants to get cards in its graveyard.
Edit: I just noticed he is a Goblin...he might be good in Legacy goblin decks too but you would have to be mindful of when you use his ability as ringleader stuffs a lot of junk on the bottom of your library.
Ok I am clearly in the minority. I made room for a 5th land in each guild. I added Blackcleave Cliffs but I will swap dragonskull with lavaclaw reaches for a bit and see if it gets activated more often (previously that was very rare so it got cut). Colonade, Tarpit and Ravine all are picked highly and used frequently but stirring wildwood and lavaclaw were just etb tapped duals for us.
Mystic Snake never gets no love.
It also plays nice with Revilark, Sun Titan, Birthing Pod, Braids/Black Sacrifice, UW blink, Tinker fodder, and helps stem bleeding in aggro decks. It is an unexciting card but I feel like it has enough utility that it will make it into my cube (600 unpowered). I can even see it getting played in some control decks that need a chump blocker (like a worse Baleful Strix).
I've been trying Lingering Souls (and Kommand) in Jeskai the last couple days and so far I am liking it. I do not run either visions. I did drop from 25 lands to 24, not sold on that change yet but altering the manabase wasn't too hard. My current manabase is:
3 Celestial Colonade (I hate drawing too many tapped lands)
1 Desolate Lighthouse
9 Fetches (4 Strand, 3 Tarns, 2 Mesa)
6 Shocks (1 of each)
4 Basics (2 Island, 1 Mountain, 1 Plains)
1 Sulfur Falls (I tried a swamp here but it was bad...I was also trying Inquisitions at the time though which I was not happy with)
I've been considering trying 2 copies of Mentor in the board. It triggers off of every card except for snapcaster and I feel like most people are boarding out their removal games 2 and 3 anyway.
Most of my hybrid cards are also in mono color sections unless their cost/effectiveness is restrictive to the point that they aren't really playable in a two color deck with one of the colors being off color (examples Nightveil Specter, Figure of Destiny, Boros Reckoner). Deathrite Shaman and Kitchen Finks are both green cards in my cube...Dryad Militant and Tattermunge Maniac are in White and Red as those colors want aggressive 1 drops more.
That said Bant is a fairly shallow Shard. The Archangel is the best option, IMO, but I'm not a huge fan of her so I actually use my Jund and Bant slots to bolster Gruul and Selesnya. Bloodbraid Elf and Mirari's Wake are my honorary Jund and Bant cards. Also, this way I don't feel bad about wasting precious guild spots on Kird Ape and Loam Lion which are necessary to keep Aggro a threat and also strengthen Wild Nacatl's inclusion in the Naya slot.
However, its hidden fourth mode is its best mode. Because it is removal, a token generator or discard all in one it frees up a couple slots in your deck for other cards. While Inquisition and Thoughtseize are often horrible top decks late game I'm never unhappy to top deck a Mardu Charm. Similarly, against a combo deck like storm when you draw a terminate or path game one it is fairly awful but Mardu Charm will let you rip a combo piece from your opponents hand at instant speed.
That said, I think 1-2 copies in the correct amount in most decks as the three drop slot is competitive.
I usually deal with storm by bringing in Slaughter Games, Wear // Tear and Rest in Peace. Our single target removal is useless so there are a lot of cards to take out, sweepers like Anger of the Gods or Zealous Persecution are great for cleaning up Goblins.
So far I have having the most problems with Mono Blue Tron. They have all the counters of UWR control but better threats that tend to come down earlier. Between Gifts and Academy Ruins their deck is built in such away that they don't even really care all that much about your discard.
I played in the MTGO daily yesterday and went 2-2. I beat Abzhan Liege and UWR Control, losing to Mono Blue Control and my own ability to draw lands (another Abzhan deck...I drew 2 lands the entire round). Counting the event as whole as a 2-1 record and I am considering a 24th land. Given that it was the first daily I have tried this deck in I was happy with the results. My opponents went 4-0 (Tron), 3-1 (2nd Abzhan), 2-2 (Abzhan Liege), 2-2 (UWR Control).
4x Young Pyromancer
3x Monastery Mentor
Spells
2x Path to Exile
3x Inquisition of Kozilek
2x Thoughtseize
4x Lightning Bolt
1x Intangible Virtue
3x Night's Whisper
2x Terminate
1x Dreadbore
4x Lingering Souls
2x Mardu Charm
2x Crackling Doom
Planeswalkers
2x Sorin, Solemn Visitor
1x Chandra, Pyromaster
1x Ajani Vengeant
3x Bloodstained Mire
4x Marsh Flats
2x Swamp
2x Plains
1x Mountain
2x Blood Crypt
2x Sacred Foundry
2x Godless Shrine
1x Isolated Chapel
1x Dragonskull Summit
1x Clifftop Retreat
1x Vault of the Archangel
1x Blackcleave Cliffs
2x Rest in Peace
2x Stony Silence
2x Anger of the Gods
2x Slaughter Games
3x Molten Rain
2x Timely Reinforcements
1x Wear // Tear
1x Wrath of God
This is what I've been testing:
4 Wasteland
4 Rishadan Port
3 Bloodstained Mire
1 Scalding Tarn
1 Arid Mesa
2 Wooded Foothills
1 Taiga
1 Badlands
2 Mountains
4 Aether Vial
4 Goblin Lackey
1 Skirk Prospector
1 Grenzo, Dungeon Warden
2 Mogg War Marshal
2 Tin Street Hooligan
4 Gempalm Incinerator
4 Goblin Warchief
4 Goblin Matron
1 Goblin Chieftain
1 Goblin Sharpshooter
4 Goblin Ringleader
1 Krenko, Mob Boss
1 Siege-Gang Commander
3 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
3 Pyrokinesis
3 Red Elemental Blast
3 Relic of Progenitus
1 Goblin Piledriver
1 Plateau
1 Karakas
It is possible I am being greedy running 7 fetchlands with only 4 targets...but so far I haven't run into any issues. Against basic heavy decks I will often side out 2 Wastelands for the Plateau and Karakas. I am not 100% on the board yet I may make room for Pithing Needle, Mindbreak Trap and possibly Ensnaring Bridge.
I think that you didnt get a quick response because Goblins doesn't really have a set play order. Everything depends on the match but ideally you want a turn 1 goblin lackey or aether vial. The deck isn't actually an aggro deck even though it is capable of aggressive plays with goblin piledrivers. The game plan mainly focuses around two things a) mana denial via rishadan ports and wastelands and b) card advantage through goblin matron and goblin ringleader ( andmaybe Grenzo...still testing him). Hope this helps.
His ability is icing...but really delicious chocolate icing in the right deck. It is a great mana sink in aggressive decks once you've run out of gas or in any deck that wants to get cards in its graveyard.
Edit: I just noticed he is a Goblin...he might be good in Legacy goblin decks too but you would have to be mindful of when you use his ability as ringleader stuffs a lot of junk on the bottom of your library.
Back to Grenzo...I ordered mine this weekend!