MTG Salvation

I just received a Karn with the exact same issue, from a reputable trader who claims to have pulled it from a factory sealed set. I compared it to the other foil walkers I have from recent sets and none of them have a similar border issue. Unfortunately I do not have another foil Karn to compare it to.


EDIT: I spoke with the gentleman from whom I received the Karn. He informed me that it WAS from an MTGO redeemed set. He had several of them, and proceeded to post this:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RWHlteQrLD8


I believe the issue is resolved. The Karn is real, it has something to do with the MTGO redemption process.



Tiger

I don't think you're a dreamer at all Cassiov. I think Sage is by far the best mythic spoiled yet. He is a REPEATABLE source of extra turns. There are so few other ways to do that. None that I know of that remain on the board outside of Lighthouse Chronologist. This guy is way more abusable than LC. He doesn't even have to tap to sac those counters. I love that he works with Ajani, but I don't think that is where his power is. Not really. The Vorel synergy is pretty great. I think Archangel of Thune does some strong work there as well.

I agree that new players may not appreciate the power of this card. And I appreciate that its not Jace. But it IS value in the box. And considering where other cards that see use (even fringe use) in legacy and have only one foil version have gone *cough cough* GOBLIN MATRON *cough* I have to believe that this card is going to be worth some money.

How has no one talked about how awesome Hymn to Tourach is. First time foil. How is that not a huge deal?

I think this is what we are going to see. The Mythics will be about 50/50 value vs flop, but you'll see incredible value in the rare slots, with things like Thoughtseize, the idea being to get prices down some what. I doubt Thoughtseize was ever supposed to be a $60 card. If they make a card Mythic, they are essentially saying they are okay with it being expensive.

Lets break it down:

Flavor: From this perspective it could make sense for Walkers, as they traverse time and space. Maybe its two Jace's from different timelines, maybe it is two Jace's from different points on the same timeline? I can buy that. But its a stretch.

For the Legends though I agree that it makes no sense. Even the H in EDH doesn't make sense now, as apparently there can be only 2... or 3, or 4 or... any number as long as there is a player to support each. I think it was better before.

Difficulty of Play: I don't think this really changes. It is certainly going to decrease Blue's stock in terms of Commander and Legend-Removal. It is also going to raise Black's stock on edict effects. Its about the only way we have left to deal with a tron'ed out Zur, Uril, or Sigarda. But I see this more as a lateral shift.

Fun: Entirely format dependent. Personally, I liked the clone rule in EDH, I thought it added a great dimension to the game. But I can see in epic legendary matchups where people were effectively just countering eachother's Jace's with other Jaces. Probably another lateral move overall, with a "more-fun" tilt for the Eternal formats. Unlikely to be a huge difference unless like someone said we have another legendary block. *cough cough* Theros *cough*.

Story: This is the Vorthos stuff, not the "story" as it plays out in individual games. I don't think this is a benefit. I am a fan of NEW Planeswalekrs taking over, and some of the characters... you know... dying off. Rather than making new walkers and then killing them off, let Jace die. Let the curse kill Garruk. And give the spotlight to Tamiyo for a while until she bites the dust or retires. When that happens, give us new walkers. Holding on to the Lorwyn 5 seems pretty lazy in terms of storytelling. Especially considering the fact that Jace's flavor is absolutely terrible, and appeals to the very aspect of Magic player's personalities that make them grating and socially isolated. Anakin Skywalker (via Ep 1, 2 and 3) much? I don't know. Either way, lets see something original. This rule change effectively removes any pressure that was on R&D to have original ideas.


Tiger

Disagree. Rules are rules, favoritism hurts, and leads people to the favorite poster's continued abuse and pushing the rules, as well as a hostile environment for newer posters. It shrinks and isolates an internet community, and leads to trolling.

I agree with you Apocalypse that when warnings are handed out they are usually fair. The rules are subjective enough that one has a hard time arguing against them.

Where I think there is moderator abuse (and I believe it happens all the time) is in the moderators playing favorites and NOT handing out warnings. I have seen posts removed when someone posted on the borderline, only to watch another poster do the same thing 2-3 posts later and it sticks. When I looked into it, I find that the moderator regulating the forum frequents other forums where he/she chats frequently and in friendly manner with the person who gets away with it.

Mods here play favorites. And really, there are two kinds of bad cops. The first kind are those that profile and hand out tickets where none were deserved. The second kind of bad cop is the one that lets the criminal get away with it because they're friends. By far and away MTGS has a problem with the latter.

Tiger

Not a bad idea Demonium. If I had the time I would, and I might have that time after the holidays. Work and a new kiddo keep me pretty busy though. Still, like I said earlier the response has actually been overwhelmingly positive. Just today I have received several PM's and Emails from alterers and readers with positive remarks, or questions on appraisal. Have no fear, I don't mind the trolls

Looking forward to your next alters!

Tiger

Merry Christmas everyone, lot to go over.

@Aeontropy: That is truly impressive. Awesome collection. On a side note, talk about a fun general and a fun deck to play, both visually and from a purely EDH standpoint. I think my favorite piece that you showed was your Boreal Shelf. The colors/contrast really make the piece "pop" out. Very Van Gogh-esque. COOL.


@fallet (Land extensions): Very well done. I wish the pictures were a little more straight on, sometimes that can give us a better idea on the detail. The backdrop work on the Swamp is really well done, the subtle wash out of the color does a great job of forcing the perspective, and drawing the eye naturally. I don't recall how much of this was part of the card to begin with, but your extension appears to be nearly indistinguishable.

@pochy (3rd/4th Delver): LOVE the wolves! I am curious, is there a reference here that I don't get? The subject is interesting for a delver, this isn't a critique so much as a curious question.

@Demonium (Rite of Replication): Once again, your work is fantastic. That you have bound the alter to PoT is really cool. At first I almost missed the subtle reflections behind her, that interpretation on the card is just so cool. I could see this being a signature series, like Claar's architect blueprints or Poxy's Duals.

@jenyang80272010 (Superman/Cap): Very fun work. Superman is one of my favorite characters and has instant recognition. Your work with the anatomy and his muscles is spot on. Its tough for me to tell without seeing the card in person whether some of the texture work around the card is intentional and stylistic or needs to be cleaned up. I would love to get ahold of these cards and look at them up close. Of the two, I think Supes has the better detail, structure, and works with Jace's face, but both are a ton of fun. I know I have seen this done before (with Captain, not Supe) but it might have been THIS work that I saw. Have you posted this anywhere else?

@wtwlf123: The virulence and vitriol of your response speaks of a deep anger that seems a mite unreasonable when directed towards someone who 1) You don't know, 2) Is trying to help people, and 3) Didn't actually direct any thoughts/concerns/questions/comments at you. Several (4+ as of this post) have now approached me in PM's asking for my opinions, valuations, and general perceptions on alterations. Including artists I have critiqued. The proof is in the pudding my friend. I posted my "qualifications" (in quotes because seriously, one can't be qualified for something like this, it isn't a field, there are no regulations or standards ) and I have already received more interest than with my previous feedback. Feel free to PM me if you want to continue the conversation. I recommend being more civil than your previous message or I'll just delete it.

@Zanny77: Hey thanks, I think? Misguided seems a little harsh, but I still appreciate it. Glad you have friends of the quality to be harsh. A lot of friends are afraid to do that. You're a lucky guy/gal. I look forward to seeing your alters soon!

@seesic (Desolation Angel): Wow, dark alter! Really fits subject well. I love the interplay on the anatomy. As someone who has had instruction in anatomy I can appreciate the detail around the neck/deltoids/traps/and upper arm. The muscle play is fantastic. Your text work is also better than some of your previous alters, which is always a plus.

@EvilNerdINC (Angels): In the middle Resto the feathers are AWESOME. That you made use of the natural card border to shade out the tips of feathers is really clever. You took what is a usually a challenging part of card alteration and turned it to your benefit. Again, your lines around the box could use some trimming, and the textures above the box still don't match the sky beneath, but this is a common difficulty, especially when you aren't able to fade to black. That you took this piece on at all is impressive. Well done!

@closetvictorian (Poison Ivy): First of all, thanks for the support! But on to the alter: First of all, cool subject. Comic alters have wide appeal, and your use of this particular villain on this particular card is pretty clever. Definitely made me smile. I am probably not telling you anything you didn't already think of yourself, but the bulk of the improvements can be made in improving realism. And this is hard. Really hard. Your shapes/proportions are well done, and I really like the leaf work. It really boils down to your textures on the body and with her hair. Sharpening these up, and adding some further detail can carry you far. Love the "come hither" look. Classic for P.I.!

@6jerfz: Lol, tell me about it. But have no fear Jerfz, I have had tons of interest by email and through PM. I was surprised really. Behind closed doors people have been really nice, and appreciative. I don't let the trolls get me down

@bobthefunny: You asked for critiques so here they come But first a compliment: you've done really well carrying lines through text, and onto the extensions. Alterers discover pretty quickly that this is tougher than it looks. Potential improvements abound however. A first is that your paint appears thick, and obvious on the card. Most people prefer a more seamless transition. It looks as if you could "feel" the difference between the natural art and the alter. As well, your color matching isn't spot on, another reason the border of the extension can be seen. If you were going for a stylistic change, that was accomplished but from what I have seen from buyers/sellers/traders is that a consistent style from natural card art to extension is preferred over a shift. There have been a few exceptions, but usually the rule stands. If you don't feel up to that, completely redesigning the art in your own style works well too. Some alterers ONLY do that, and do it well. Its also why lands make great subjects for new alterers, because a whole-scene alter can be easier than a form.

@Cardcandy (Force, etc): First, as a general response to your patronizing (matronizing?) response. Keep in mind that there are times when artists are not the ones you want critiquing or appraising works. For one, most artists I know overvalue or undervalue their work. The best determinant of a work's value is the free market. And people within the free market have (and still are) asking for me to appraise. I fully admitted that I don't know WHY they asked me, and I gave a disclaimer to that regard. But at this point its something they give me VALUE for ($5 store credit per appraisal) at some places and trade value (varying amounts) with individuals. If I can make value from appraising, there MUST be value in what I do. You can laugh all you want, doesn't change those facts

That said, your works: Force of Will was really interesting. Your choices of where/when/how you extended were interesting to me. I also love the use of the black outline around the flames, it stylistic, and helps with contrast. Very well done. Your Tormenta wasn't nearly of the same quality. The texture of the moon (?) was completely off above the lines, and was streaky. As a collector, a clear defect like that turns me away almost immediately because it draws the eye away from the good parts of the piece, mainly the contralateral extensions. The Resto looks great, with awesome work on the sky, and great feathering. Would look great in an EDH deck.

Thats all for now. Still taking emails/PM's over the holidays so keep them coming, responses might be a little slow

Tiger

Well, Galspanic, if you honestly want to know, I would say you are almost right on target with what you have charged me in the past. Your work is a lot of fun, and you have done some great extensions. I love that you use german-cards, and your subject choices are well marketed (EDH). An alter usually adds somewhere between $-x (detraction of value) and $60 to the value. There are exceptions but that is a good rule. Are you the best alterer in my binder? I wouldn't say so, and neither have others who have perused it. BUT, you're really good. Your lines are good, and your work has great detailed. there are just some rough color transitions, and a few areas where textures could be smoother. If you want any specific piece feedback, message me and I will do what I can. In general though, I would value your work at around $25-40 USD additional to the card value. This isn't perfect, or exact, and is obviously dependent on a given piece of work.

And I hear you about not getting a lot back for what I offer. And honestly I am not looking for much in return. I just hope it helps. If one or two artists take what I say and try to improve, thats great. If they don't, well fine. Can't please everyone.

Tiger

@Bristol: Honestly Bristol... I don't know. I have the largest and most varied collection that most people have ever seen? People just started asking me one day "is this good?" or "what is this worth?". I sort of try to go by how I think it would sell on eBay, but that only gets me so far. At first I was spitballing, but as it became more common I sort of devised a system.

Does the fact that I value your alters highly, and yours is one I use for an example of a "great alter" in my binder change your opinion

But seriously, no one has to listen.

The point was that this thread lacks consistent, systematic, constructive feedback. It is *mostly* people saying "I love this" or "That looks great". which is fine, and encouraging. But it doesn't affect change. Now, as you saw, I don't always have feedback to give. This is art, its subjective, and when certain criteria are met there doesn't need to be any feedback. But sometimes its helpful. There are a lot of really cool artists here who, if they improve, could make some amazing alters and maybe turn it into a profession. I'm just trying to help.

I gave what "qualifications" I had, simply so people wouldn't write off what I say out of habit. If they read what I wrote, and still write me off, thats fine. I don't really care that much.

@YamiJoey: Art Critic? What? No. I want to offer constructive criticism to help people get better. Not because I think I'm better than them, or you. A critic doesn't often offer advice on what could make a piece better. They are there to simply elevate, or belittle. Not the purpose of what I am doing. That you projected that opinion onto me speaks more about YOUR feelings on art than mine. I don't even make alters. I collect them. Lots of them. From many people. If wanting to help people through more than "I love this" lip service is not reason enough for my posts, feel free to ignore me. I wasn't trying to justify anything, merely provide a background. If you want to take offense at that, please feel free.

Tiger

First, I want to let everyone know that I unofficially appraise alters for several dealers in my area, as well as players trading/buying/selling in the Illinois/Indiana/Wisconsin area. That is sort of a disclaimer. That said, I have no financial interests related specifically to these sites. I also guarantee that if I place a bid on an alter listed here on a third party auction site, or here on this site, it is because I value the alter. I will either have A) Not commented on it here yet, or will B) Have commented on it and praised the work. My posts are NOT intentioned to de-value an alter or artist's work before I purchase.


Why do I say this? Because while the praise on this thread is always very polite, and kind, I find the feedback lacking. There are great artists here, there are improving artists here, and there are beginning artists here. There are no "bad artists". There are certainly pieces I wouldn't want in my 150+ alter collection, but their artists still have the potential to do great work in the future.

So, I am going to start posting here for the purpose of offering constructive, but firm, feedback for newer artists, or artists that I know can do better work.

Starting with:

EvilNerdINC: ENI, I love that you have ambition. Tackling a dual land is something that a lot of artists simply don't have the guts to do. That said, your piece lacks polish. Your lines aren't as crisp as some other more experienced alterers. And it shows. Your lines have definitely improved, but they could get better. This kind of polish is one of the things that separates out the good from the great, and is one of the first things I look for in an alter. As well, your color transitions could use some work. I am not sure if you apply a base coat or not. If you don't, Eric Klug has given some great workshops on the value of a base coat. The dark outlines of what (I assume) were the borders around the edge of the card again show a lack of polish. This said, I do like the alter, and I especially like how well you have matched textures. I look forward to more work.

@Seesic: Amazing work on the counterspell. Your style is riveting, your lines are clean and hidden well, and your text-work is nearly flawless. I have bid on your alter online (disclaimer for the appraisal).

@Pochy: Similar to seesic your style is fantastic, and this is a fantastic alter.

@onewayletter13: Your lines are very crisp and clean, the mark of a polished alterer. However, your texture transitions take away from the piece. The wings of the dragons look... off. I am sure you noticed this as well, and it is clear the detail you have put into them. Unfortunately the detail doesn't match. It might be a texture difference, but it is hard to pinpoint. I also wanted to congratulate you on the color work, many alterers like to fade to darker colors on the lower borders when text boxes are left untouched, I love that you didn't do this. Again, the mark of a promising alterer.


Any with questions about alters or alterers please feel free to PM.

Tiger

As someone who has 150+ altered cards, from almost ever single "prominent" alterist, I can say a few things about this.

1) Make sure you are happy with the alter quality from a given artist. I love Cardkitty, and have... maybe 15-20 of them? I have acquired some by commission, some by Ebay. I used to be much happier with Derek's extensions but of late they haven't been as sharp. His anime work has been great. Two of my favorite alters are a Jace MA and Garruk PH that are altered to be Spike and Jet from Cowboy Bebop. I sure wish I had snagged the other 4 Bebop alters

2) Change it up. Get alters from several alterists. Try someone new. There are some great start up artists on the Altered Art thread. I have been really impressed with Blackbull. And while Demonium is now pretty firmly established this was definitely where he made a name for himself. Klug is of course fantastic. And if you can find his facebook page, Claarbar has a style all of his own which I love, as well as some marquee styles on artifacts.

3) Don't be afraid to go big. Altered duals are awesome. Altered power is awesome (even if not legal in EDH). Just because a card has a high price tag doesn't mean it shouldn't be altered. Just means you better know the alterist before you send it.

4) Get personal. Find themes that have personal meaning to you. Work combos or synergy, or funny stuff that is UNIQUE to you. Example here for me:

Yukon Cornelius

Bumble


Stuff like the above is going to Wow your meta, more so than a deck of extensions.

If you want a list of awesome alterers, feel free to msg me.

Tiger

The only think I would consider adding is a Garruk, Primal Hunter. You are almost guaranteed to get to cast him with that kind of ramp, and he is a fantastic draw engine. He also puts out defenders, and can work well as a win con later with whatever you are dropping with Omniscience. Just my opinion. Love the addition of Nicol Bolas, Planeswalker as a 1-of.

Tiger