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    posted a message on Cockatrice Tournament #2 - Modern
    Magic-League runs tournaments of varying size in all formats on a very consistent basis. Watch and learn.
    Posted in: Modern Archives
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    posted a message on [Discussion] Where are we now?
    Right now, if you can't beat the fastest Domain Zoo and Affinity/Tempered Steel lists, don't even bother.
    Posted in: Modern Archives
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    posted a message on Revision on Modern format banlist Discussion
    Quote from slipknot72102
    they need to add goyf,wild nactl,cloudpost, and bloodbraid elf to actually achieve this. All they did was take out decks that stood a chance against what is now the big 3


    Slipknot, I've liked a lot of what you've had to say about the format so far, browsing through the threads, but... ARE YOU KIDDING ME?

    Goyf and Nacatl are just efficient creatures that attack and block. That's it. They don't have any abilities like Dark Confidant does, and you have to build your deck around them (to a non-zero degree) just to make them playable. I'm sorry, but efficient Green creatures are not ban-worthy. That's just laughable.

    This is the problem I have with banning largely inoffensive cards like Ancestral Vision: It creates a slippery slope where the requirement to ban something is decreased with each action, and before you know it, we actually will have people calling for the banning of vanilla Green creatures (with subtle drawbacks, even)!

    I'm hoping that was just your snap-reaction to this, and not some calculated response.

    I do think that Cloudpost decks might prove to be a real problem, however.
    Posted in: Modern Archives
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    posted a message on Revision on Modern format banlist Discussion
    "Hey, guys, how should we optimize this banned list?"

    *GRUNT*
    Let It Go
    Posted in: Modern Archives
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    posted a message on No New modern tourney(read op)
    Oh man, can't believe I missed this.
    Posted in: Modern Archives
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    posted a message on Sunday Night Modern(plz read OP) 8-3-11
    Right, but simply knowing archetypes / seeing how people sideboard in-game should be enough (at first). Sharing 75s after a match is completely reasonable, but I think knowing your opponent's exact 75 before the match starts in such an otherwise-unknown format really causes inbreeding.

    If we really want to see how the meta might develop, we should have a mock tourney on Cockatrice that we set up here and run over the course of a week or a day or whatever.
    Posted in: Modern Archives
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    posted a message on Sunday Night Modern(plz read OP) 8-3-11
    Posting exact 75s before playing seems awk for testing (right now). The format is wide open; you're not really going to know the exact list any real opponent is playing, and knowing that can lead to really inbred results.

    (Not trying to be antagonistic; this format is sweet and I'm excited to start playing it.)
    Posted in: Modern Archives
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    posted a message on Sunday Night Modern(plz read OP) 8-3-11
    What is SNM, exactly? I'm assuming either a tournament or just a collective testing day...
    Posted in: Modern Archives
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    posted a message on Revision on Modern format banlist Discussion
    I think Jitte is fine. A Stoneforge control deck needs to have a lot of creatures to make Jitte useful, and even then, Batterskull is almost always preferred anyway. (In Legacy for example, I'd rather have 2 Batterskulls or 1 Batterskull and 1 SOFI before I pack Jittes.) I think the only reason Jitte was banned is that it's easy to put it into every deck that wants it in a Team Unified Constructed tournament (which lessens the variety necessary for such an event), which the Community Cup was.

    Jitte is just a card that is sweet for creature-on-creature battles, and not much more. That seems perfectly fair to me.

    I agree with you that trying to ban Elf Combo is a bit silly.
    Posted in: Modern Archives
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    posted a message on Revision on Modern format banlist Discussion
    After some re-consideration this is my suggested banned list:

    [CARD]Hypergenesis
    [/CARD][CARD]Narcomoeba
    [/CARD][CARD]Arcbound Ravager
    [/CARD][CARD]Sensei's Divining Top
    [/CARD][CARD]Skullclamp
    [/CARD][CARD]Sword of the Meek
    [/CARD]

    (I removed Glimpse of Nature.)

    Edit: RE: Nix
    If you think Nix is even close to playable, wouldn't you rather just be a Spellstutter Sprite deck like UW Faeries?
    Posted in: Modern Archives
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    posted a message on Revision on Modern format banlist Discussion
    There's nothing worse (in the context of banning cards) than banning cards from a deck to "fix" it, and having it still be "too good".
    Posted in: Modern Archives
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    posted a message on Revision on Modern format banlist Discussion
    My suggested Modern Banned List:

    Hypergenesis
    Narcomoeba
    Arcbound Ravager
    Sensei's Divining Top
    Skullclamp
    Sword of the Meek
    Glimpse of Nature

    Hypergenesis: Hypergenesis should not be a deck.
    Narcomoeba: Dredge should not be a deck, and I think this is a better banning than Bridge from Below.
    Arcbound Ravager: Affinity should not be a deck.
    Sensei's Divining Top: Tournaments have to finish on time.
    Skullclamp: Duh.
    Sword of the Meek: Thopter/Depths should not be a deck. I think it's only necessary to ban one half of that deck's combo, as Dark Depths on its own isn't unreasonable as a combo. i think it's possible that Thopter Combo might even be "okay" just because of how disadvantaged control is to begin with when you factor in fetch lands and shock lands, but they can't both exist together or we know what'll happen.
    Glimpse of Nature: Elf Combo probably shouldn't be a deck, but I'm not 100% certain.

    I do not think Umezawa's Jitte needs to be banned.
    I do not think Chrome Mox needs to be banned.
    I do not think Dark Depths needs to be banned.
    Posted in: Modern Archives
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    posted a message on [Modern] Dragonstorm
    4 Ponder
    4 Preordain
    4 Lotus Petal
    4 Rite of Flame
    4 Seething Song
    4 Dragonstorm
    4 Bogardan Hellkite
    1 Karrthus

    Most lists should be starting with that skeleton. From there, your disruption/protection package is customizable to what you plan on playing against, and any extra card filtering/drawing can be added. I like See Beyond personally.
    Posted in: Modern Archives
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    posted a message on [Modern] Dragonstorm
    Karrthus is better than every non-Bogardan Hellkite dragon in every situation where you're comboing off.

    Dragonstorm (4 dragons) -- You can kill them without Karrthus, but if you've drawn a Hellkite, you still win. You can kill them if they're higher than 20 life, and you can even win if they have a Leyline of Sanctity this turn; not possible with other combinations.

    Dragonstorm (3 dragons) -- Karrthus is the only way to win the turn you combo off with less than four dragons.

    Karrthus can even potentially win with just a single Dragonstorm for one dragon. This is likely only possible in the mirror match against another Non-Karrthus build that only has three dragons. Corner case? Absolutely, but if this deck is good, it will matter.

    Karrthus is harder to cast than Hellkite Charger, but so what? Your goal is to cast Dragonstorm, and if you happen to draw a Bogardan Hellkite or have insufficient Storm, you want to be able to still win in the most efficient manner possible.

    Again: Karrthus is better than every non-Bogardan Hellkite dragon in every situation where you're comboing off.
    Posted in: Modern Archives
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    posted a message on [Modern] Dragonstorm
    This isn't a contest to see which Dragon wins in a heads-up fight.

    Hellkite Overlord is more expensive (for hard-casting purposes) and prone to all the same removal as Karrthus, but Karrthus kills at a lower storm than Overlord.

    RE: "What if you draw Karrthus?"
    Then you just get four Bogardan Hellkites, as usual.

    Seriously guys, have you ever played this deck?
    Posted in: Modern Archives
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    posted a message on [Modern] Dragonstorm
    So what happens when you draw one Bogardan Hellkite and the opponent is playing Wrath of God? You're just going to concede? No, you're going to search out a Karrthus in addition to Bogardan Hellkites.
    Posted in: Modern Archives
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    posted a message on [Modern] Dragonstorm
    The answer to what?

    Karrthus is the best Bogardan Hellkite alternative, and this deck needs Bogardan Hellkite alternatives to function. That's all there is to it, really.
    Posted in: Modern Archives
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    posted a message on [Modern] Dragonstorm
    Karrthus is better than every Bogardan Hellkite alternative.

    Do you really think Hellkite Charger is better in this deck than Karthus? Come on now.
    Posted in: Modern Archives
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    posted a message on [Modern] Dragonstorm
    Karrthus Build:
    Spell, Spell, Dragonstorm - "Take 21"

    Non-Karrthus Build:
    Spell, Spell, Dragonstorm - "Take 10"

    Seems pretty easy to understand to me.
    Posted in: Modern Archives
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    posted a message on [Modern] Dragonstorm
    Your dragon set-up is bad. Karrthus lets you kill with a much smaller storm count.
    Posted in: Modern Archives
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    posted a message on [Deck] Pyromancer Ascension - Non Storm
    Quote from Malchelo
    Actually, this isn't true. Since the effects are not together, you get to choose which goes first. So Serum Visions is almost the same as Preordain.

    Saying that, Serum Visions is awkwardly better than Preordain, since you have a choice if you draw or scry first. Not that you'd want to do the draw first though.


    Sorry dude, but stop cheating your opponents Slant They're not triggered abilities, you don't get to reorder them how you please.

    RE: Whoever brought up Tarmogoyf, my sideboard has been packing 4 Goyf, 4 Quirion Dryad, 1 Breeding Pool lately and it's been kicking a lot of ass. Tarmogoyf is absolutely atrocious in the maindeck, however. He just turns all of your opponent's dead spells live, and then keeps them live throughout the match. Having the transformational SB plan is so much better because your opponent never has an adequate amount of live spells and you just get so many free wins off of that.
    Posted in: Modern Archives
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    posted a message on New format? Modern Magic
    RE: Reprinting FOW

    I'm pretty sure it'll be a Judge Promo within a year.
    Posted in: Rumor Mill Archive
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    posted a message on New format? Modern Magic
    Magnivore gets significantly worse when the opponent can play out fetch lands and do nothing with them until they can cast a spell.
    Posted in: Rumor Mill Archive
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    posted a message on [Modern] Supreme Blue Redux
    If I were playing Cobra, I would definitely be playing either some Sword of X and Y of some kind, or Plow Under (or both).

    Land, Visions
    Land, Lotus Cobra
    Fetch, Plow Under
    GG

    There are a lot of sick draws like that when you add Cobra to the deck. It's definitely not necessary, though.

    (Edit: Plow Under is a little bit worse now that fetches are legal, but it still gives you insane nut draws.)
    Posted in: Modern Archives
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    posted a message on [Modern] Supreme Blue Redux
    You know it doesn't die, right? If you were referencing it "doing nothing", then try Slagstorm. That can hit PW/players in non-creature match ups anyway.
    Posted in: Modern Archives
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    posted a message on [Modern] Death Cloud
    Jace v. Tezz: Why not play both?

    They both just win the game after a successful Death Cloud and are fantastic in their own right.

    I think Smallpox and Geth's Verdict would be better served as targeted removal spells. Tiny balances don't really help you out, and also prevent you from casting that late game Death Cloud, whereas a timely Go for the Throat or Smother or Doom Blade can be even more punishing (like in response to a Sword equipping) to the opponent without setting you back.

    Given the high amount of colored mana costs in the deck, I think Dimir Signet might be better than Everflowing Chalice. I'd also look into artifacts that help to lock down the board and protect your Planeswalkers, like Tumble Magnet or maybe Trip Noose.
    Posted in: Modern Archives
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    posted a message on [Modern] Supreme Blue Redux
    I agree that playing zero non-Cryptic Command counters hurts the combo match up, but not by that much. In game ones, I think the only combo match up where having Mana Leak is better than trying to Cascade into disruption or a clock is Hypergenesis, but even there, they can EOT cascade, untap and cascade again to successfully get around Mana Leak. In a BBE version of this deck against Hypergenesis, you can bring in X Chalice of the Void, X Trinket Mage, and X enchantment removal spell of your choice and lock them out completely. Cascading into or drawing Trinket or Chalice results in a Chalice locking them out. As long as you have one bounce spell or disenchant effect (or Clique) for their O-Ring, it's GG right there.
    Posted in: Modern Archives
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    posted a message on [Deck] Pyromancer Ascension - Non Storm
    Rite of Flame is terrible in this deck.

    Recollect is close to strictly better than Call to Mind, though, so thanks for reminding me of its existence.

    Magma Jet is definitely interesting, but it doesn't seem as good as Punishing Fire, and I don't want to cut a one-mana burn spell (Lightning Bolt) for a two-mana burn spell. This format is pretty fast, and that one mana can make all the difference in the world. I'll definitely add Magma Jet to my mental list of "Pyro Playables" though.

    Serum Visions is deceptively bad. You don't actually choose what you draw, so it's worse than Ponder, Preordain, and Sleight of Hand.
    Posted in: Modern Archives
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    posted a message on [Modern] Reliquary Command
    Quote from Yanni
    Glissa is a house in this deck.

    Saying something doesn't make it true. You can't even use her recursion abilities in game one, and you already have a better deathtouch creature in Vampire Nighthawk.

    Hierarch doesn't give us a turn 2 Nighthawk or Arena.

    Again, wrong. GB land, Hierarch, untap, any B land, 1BB to mana pool. The mana in this format is easy enough that this should not be a problem.

    Elspeth doesn't win us the game like Garruk does

    Yeah, because Garruk's overrun is so synergistic with your Wall of Omens. C'mon.

    I don't have Dark confidants, however, I don't really see the big deal. IMO Arena is better in thsi deck.

    Sorry if you don't own them, but they're better. Because it costs less mana, and can attack the opponent (for five with an Elspeth) and carry your swords (that should be in the main deck anyway).
    Posted in: Modern Archives
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    posted a message on [Modern] Death Cloud
    Not playing any Planeswalkers seems so wrong. Garruk Wildspeaker + Death Cloud / Pernicious Deed, or Sensei's Divining Top + Death Cloud was the only reason Death Cloud was playable in Old Extended. Only one of those combinations is legal now. (Hint: it's the first one.)

    Definitely add some Planeswalkers.
    Posted in: Modern Archives
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    posted a message on [Modern] Bubble Hulk
    3 Rite of Flame seems really awkward. I'd try cutting a Simian Spirit Guide for one. I'd also try fitting the fourth the Lotus Bloom in there, for consistency's sake, since that's one of those "gotta have it on the first two turns" type of cards.
    Posted in: Modern Archives
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    posted a message on New format? Modern Magic
    Modern cannot possibly replace Legacy. Not for Legacy Players. If you're not a Legacy Player, it doesn't matter that you'd prefer to play Modern (due to not owning Legacy).

    Both can co-exist perfectly, and one happens to be more friendly to the viability of being a Pro Tour format (Modern).

    An unknown number of years from now, when it's literally impossible to acquire a Legacy deck, then sure, WOTC may stop promoting it (like they did Vintage), but there are still huge Vintage tournaments both in the US and Europe every year. Legacy will not be outmoded so easily.
    Posted in: Rumor Mill Archive
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    posted a message on [Modern] Reliquary Command
    So this is just a Junk deck? Why is it called Reliquary Command? I was expecting some Reliquary tower deck with a bunch of the Lorwyn Commands or something. Not Junk...

    Anyway.

    Thoughtseize>Inquisition of Kozilek>Duress>Distress
    Dark Confidant>Phyrexian Arena
    Elspeth, Knight-Errant>Garruk Wildspeaker
    Noble Hierarch>Birds of Paradise
    Wall of Omens seems really awkward here, and I don't think Glissa, the Traitor even does anything worthwhile.
    Posted in: Modern Archives
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    posted a message on New format? Modern Magic
    Quote from Sanduleak
    What if Grave Troll is banned from modern because Innistrad has a graveyard theme?


    Then Innistrad has a graveyard theme...
    Posted in: Rumor Mill Archive
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    posted a message on [Deck] Pyromancer Ascension - Non Storm
    Quote from nonamebob
    Play a one of red sun's zenith: kill card that you re-use.


    One Red Sun's Zenith is cute, but not really that good. If I'm adding more burn, it's going to be Lightning Bolts or Burst Lightnings.

    heck, the blue one is fine as well: you can use it to deck em.


    I guess, but we already just take infinite turns and casually kill them with Punishing Fire.

    consider repeal for defense as well: very heavy tempo play with an active ascension, great tempo without as well


    Repeal is definitely a consideration, and it might very well be better than Into the Roil. I'll have to test that out. The deciding factor is probably going to come down to what the average casting cost is of the permanent I'm bouncing. Also, when copying Repeal with Ascension, you must target another permanent with the same mana cost to draw the extra card, as Repeal does not read "X or less". This is what has me leaning towards ITR at the moment, but that could change.

    not sure about the time warp without any of the red mana accel's: this deck doesn't want to wait until 5 to get up to killing people.


    You cast Time Warp and just win. It gives you two free turns, one of which you can use to Call to Mind or Time Warp again or Noxious Revival (if you play this) and the other one you use to play the other Time Warp you CTMd. It's an infinite loop. They just never get a turn again. Or you've gained so much mana and tempo advantage that they can't recover from the multiple turns you've taken for free with an active Ascenion on the battlefield.

    seething song / rite of flame are auto plays imo.


    What do those cards do for you at all? They don't do anything. Manamorphose is playable because while Pyro is inactive, it's a "free" cycler that can also pull tricks, like holding up RR and then Mana Leaking their spell after Morphing into UU. Also, it cycles, so you do not lose card advantage, and it helps tick up your Ascension. Once Ascension is active, it draws you two cards and nets you two mana, for free. R1 Draw two cards, add U/R mana U/R mana U/R mana U/R mana to your mana pool is insane in this deck. Adding a bunch of red without drawing cards is not.

    ~

    Here's my current list



    This version can't literally go infinite, but a resolved (and copied) Time Warp will almost always result in the opponent not getting a turn. Even when they do, it usually doesn't matter anyway.
    Posted in: Modern Archives
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    posted a message on [Modern]Cruel Mishra Control
    2 Wurmcoil Engine, 4 Solemn Simulacrum, and 2 Courier's Capsules do not seem to be enough to warrant building around Mishra, in my opinion. Where are the Signets? Epochrasite? I think Mishra's a cool dude, and I'd love to see him really get abused with some of the cards that just weren't Standard legal when he was, but this list doesn't really do that.
    Posted in: Modern Archives
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    posted a message on New format? Modern Magic
    Quote from Kira-kun
    The deck I have already uses Simian Spirit Guide and Seething song and Footsteps. Rite might help a bit. Also doesn't help that Chrome Mox is banned.


    Have you tried Pentad Prism? I loved that card in old extended TEPS decks.

    You should make a thread for the Hulk Breach deck so we don't have to keep spamming people in here. I'd be interested in hearing others' views on it.
    Posted in: Rumor Mill Archive
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    posted a message on New format? Modern Magic
    Quote from Kirblar
    Cards were banned in Legacy when the ban list was made separate from the reserve list in large part due to price.


    Can you link me to that announcement? The current status quo conflicts with that archaic decision (and with good reason). They didn't ban Goyf when it was $90 in old Extended or Jace when he was $100. They didn't ban Candelabras in Legacy for being $300 or Tabernacles for being close to that.

    I find it almost impossible that they would ban Goyf now for being merely $60-70.
    Posted in: Rumor Mill Archive
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    posted a message on New format? Modern Magic
    Quote from Kira-kun
    Sorry I should have been more specific, I meant the mana-base. It's hard to find something close to Sulfur Vents and Tinder Farm. But Viscera Seer is a fantastic replacement for carrion feeder as a sac outlet, thanks.


    Simian Spirit Guide, Rite of Flame, Seething Song, Pentad Prism, Footsteps of the Goryo can help you ramp one out at a similar pace as the old mana-ramp-sac-lands-or-whatever-they're-called. It's not the same, obviously, though.

    Quote from Kirblar
    Barrier to Entry refers to a card's price. Since Goyf is on a quasi-reserved list (as it's almost impossible to see how you could logistically reprint him), his price, long-term is a significant concern, as almost any green-based deck will have to run four copies. Jace is probably the same way (a reprint would be difficult), but Jace is far, far more likely to be kept in check by other decks in the format.


    So we should auto-ban every playable card that crosses some imaginary price threshold? Don't be silly.
    Posted in: Rumor Mill Archive
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    posted a message on New format? Modern Magic
    Quote from Kirblar
    I think that a Tarmogoyf ban would probably be a good thing for the health of the format. He just makes too many other creatures irrelevant and would likely turn into a Jace-level barrier to entry in the format. Let him live on in Legacy.


    If your deck can't deal with a Tarmogoyf, you should not play that deck. A two-mana vanilla creature is nothing worth banning. Sorry guys.
    Posted in: Rumor Mill Archive
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    posted a message on New format? Modern Magic
    Protean Hulk->Body Double, Viscera Seer
    Body Double->Reveillark,Mogg Fanatic

    Edit: this is RE: Kira-Kun, not some random spam comment.
    Posted in: Rumor Mill Archive
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    posted a message on [Modern] BUG Rock
    There's no equipment in your Stoneforge Mystic deck.
    Posted in: Modern Archives
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    posted a message on New format? Modern Magic
    @P. Doughnought: Modern would not replace Extended. If it replaced any format, it would phase out Legacy as an Eternal format.


    That's honestly a ridiculous statement. WOTC would not shun the eternal players so badly as to remove Legacy as a relevant format. Extended is the least-loved format across the board, and is healthily overlapped by Modern. It's a beautiful solution, really.
    Posted in: Rumor Mill Archive
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    posted a message on [Modern] Supreme Blue Redux
    If you want to keep the Twin combo, I'd add more pieces or ways to find pieces.
    Posted in: Modern Archives
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    posted a message on New format? Modern Magic
    Limited:
    Sealed
    Draft

    Constructed:
    Legacy
    Modern
    Standard
    Block

    These are the only formats you need to know in order to compete at any event that puts pro tour points on the line. I didn't include Extended, as if we assume Modern is real then it will almost assuredly be phasing out Extended.

    So, you have Limited, and then four Constructed formats. That's really not so insane. Obviously there are even more casual variants, but there are home-brewed variants to almost every single game I've ever heard of--that's just the nature of games.
    Posted in: Rumor Mill Archive
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    posted a message on [Deck] Pyromancer Ascension - Non Storm


    If there were a tournament for this format tomorrow, this is 100% likely to be the 60 that I register.

    I really want to be playing a non-zero amount of Cryptic Command, but I don't want the curve to get too high. That said, CC will definitely be working its way into my build over time.

    Other cards I want to try:
    Noxious Revival, Sleight of Hand, Remand, Gigadrowse, Scapeshift
    Posted in: Modern Archives
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    posted a message on [Modern] Hypergenesis
    The land base can definitely be improved upon. I merely copied and pasted it, replacing 4 Tendo Ice Bridge with 4 City of Brass.

    Jin-G is just another creature that the opponent absolutely, positively must answer, now. Plop him, Blightsteel Colossus, and Chancellor of the Tangle onto the field on turn two, and the opponent is going to have to choose between killing BSC or Jin-G. Either way, you're going to win if they can only answer one, and that's the point.

    Chancellor of the Annex is interesting, and probably best in a build with other mana disruption, like AoD, Terastodon, and Sundering Titan.
    Posted in: Modern Archives
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    posted a message on [Modern] Supreme Blue Redux
    Unless my memory fails me, I could've sworn Supreme Blue was a Bant-colored Counterbalance deck. Regardless, I'm familiar with the RUG good-stuff builds from last season.

    No BBE? I understand you're playing counterspells, and Repeal, but I'm a much bigger fan of the tap-out, tempo-oriented RUG builds more than the slightly controlling ones. Plus, cascading into Ancestral Visions feels soooo good. I'd also probably run another playset of some cheap sorcery, likely preordain or ponder, to pump Goyfs more consistently. Grove of the Burnwillows/Punishing Fire combination is also something worth looking into here, in either version of the deck.
    Posted in: Modern Archives
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    posted a message on New format? Modern Magic
    Exactly, this is why it is not called Extended, which is good.
    Posted in: Rumor Mill Archive
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    posted a message on [Modern] Hypergenesis
    Blightsteel Colossus's absence was simply a memory lapse, but Akroma's Memorial is something I haven't even thought about playing. It seems interesting, though. The only potential problem I see is that it isn't a threat itself, meaning drawing multiples could be very awkward. I like the idea of dropping Memorial into play alongside an Emrakul or BSC, though. I like that that idea a lot...
    Posted in: Modern Archives
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    posted a message on [Modern] Hypergenesis
    Baddies like Sundering Titan, Angel of Despair, and Terastodon make it hard for them to Wrath of God. Comboing at instant speed also works.

    It's not my style, but I've seen some lists with Bogardan Hellkite, Sakashima the Impostor / Phyrexian Metamorph, and Karrthus, Tyrant of Jund to try and get the one-hit KO, even at sorcery speed.
    Posted in: Modern Archives
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    posted a message on New format? Modern Magic
    Extended has too many stigmas attached to it to really ever attract enough players to keep it healthy. Because of that, I'm pretty sure Modern is WOTC testing the waters to see if players are interested in a new format acting as a rebooted version of Extended, without having to call it Extended (a smart move).
    Posted in: Rumor Mill Archive
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    posted a message on New format? Modern Magic
    I made a Hypergenesis thread. Let's get some discussions going on this format.
    Posted in: Rumor Mill Archive
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    posted a message on [Modern] Hypergenesis
    (Don't know what the Modern format is? Read about it here.)




    Cast one of your ten cascade spells (as early as turn one), cascade into Hypergenesis (the only target), and put some baddies into play.



    This is a pretty direct port of the old Extended combo deck, as seen in the top eight of Pro Tour Austin in 2009. I basically just swapped in some new fatties I'd like to try in the deck. This creature configuration is currently untested.
    Posted in: Modern Archives
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    posted a message on New format? Modern Magic
    The link in the first post of the thread clearly states which sets are legal. "Modern Frames Format" is just a cute mental short-cut to help remember what's legal.

    Asking if Mishra's Factory is legal is like asking if Counterspell is legal in Standard because it was in Jace vs Chandra. It's obviously not.
    Posted in: Rumor Mill Archive
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    posted a message on New format? Modern Magic
    Can we get this format added to The Game forums? I'd love to see what people are doing with it.
    Posted in: Rumor Mill Archive
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    posted a message on What caused Sword of Fire and Ice to spike?
    EDH allowed SOFI's scarcity to slowly increase in secret, and then eventually everybody realized it. That, along with it starting to see a bit more Legacy play in SFM decks is what finally caused the jump.
    Posted in: Market Street Café
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    posted a message on [Development] Proliferate Red Destructive Force
    I was operating under the assumption that this was a stab at a new Machine Red deck anyway, so that might explain some of my suggestions.
    Posted in: Standard Archives
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    posted a message on Shape the Blightsteel Anew
    If people run Memoricide in the main, I will laugh at them and accept my free match wins. This isn't Kamigawa Block Constructed, and that card isn't good.

    Sideboards exist, and using them is "tech".

    It's entirely possible to side out the entire Shape Anew combo and bring in a new strategy. In a UB Shape Anew deck, for example, you could:
    -4 Shape Anew, -1 Blightsteel
    +4 Grave Titan, + other cards

    If you build your deck with a control base -- counters, discard, draw, etc. -- you now function like a regular UB control deck against an opponent bringing in anti-artifact hate cards.
    Posted in: Standard Archives
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    posted a message on [Development] Proliferate Red Destructive Force
    What deck does DForce beat that the already on-table Titan/other threat doesn't? There isn't one, which is why three is a ridiculously high number of copies of that card.

    Just go play some games with the deck and actually analyze what is happening. Sure, maybe the DForce sped up your kill, but it most likely wasn't necessary. If you get to the point where you 1) have 5RR, 2) have an on-board kill that survives DForce, and 3) have DForce that will resolve, you don't actually need the DForce.

    With the artifacts, look at the synergies more carefully, as opposed to their lack of brute force. Throne would be better if you had sac outlets, yes, which is why Mox Opal is one of the suggestions. Voltaic Key is similarly synergistic with the Throne itself, and Clasp. Having KOTH's emblem is a game win. These all let you achieve it faster than anything else.

    The point of my list was to encourage thought, not to say "MDilthey, these are the only artifacts you're allowed to play." Shooting them down without trying them or even understanding why I suggested them leads me to think that there's not much point in posting further in this thread. If we cannot have real discussion, what are we here for? Our e-penises?
    Posted in: Standard Archives
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    posted a message on Everybody loves slow and disruptive wincons!
    1. "Whenever an opponent draws a card." RTFC.

    2. If your opponent is stupid enough to Brainstorm with Jace while you have a Sphinx, you could have won with Memnite. They're just going to bounce your Sphinx and then kill you in a few short swings when they drop their Titan, which does things even if it gets killed, and also kills you faster.
    Posted in: Standard Archives
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    posted a message on U/B Infect
    There's two ways to go with UB Infect, as I see it.

    Go with a low curve, featuing multiple artifact Infecters and New Tezz.

    The other way, and the one I like more, play UB Control that happens to play a few Infectors -- Phyrexian Crusader, Skithiryx, Inkmoth Nexus, and Corrupted Conscience are all fine cards in such a deck.
    Posted in: Standard Archives
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    posted a message on [Development] Proliferate Red Destructive Force
    3RR for a "free" Bolt is hardly paying for itself. It's only a 3/3. With no way to actively control the top cards of your library, he's pretty mediocre.

    Mox Opal
    Contagion Clasp
    Sphere of the Suns
    Everflowing Chalice
    Ratchet Bomb
    Phyrexian Revoker
    Tumble Magnet
    Throne of Geth
    Voltaic Key

    These are all potentially-playable artifacts in this deck. Even Wall of Tanglecord could see some SB action. I'd really encourage you to explore most or all of these options.

    Destructive Force is just okay. It's probably better in the sideboard, if it should be in your 75 at all.
    Posted in: Standard Archives
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    posted a message on [Standard] Competitive Venser Decks (All Archetypes)
    Phyrexian Revoker is something worth looking into for a Venser deck. Sphere of the Suns is a solid card in any slow deck as well, and could allow you to more easily splash another color. Spine of Ish Sah also has potential, though I'm even less a fan of this card than I am of Venser himself. That said, if you get that combo on the board, you're probably going to win.
    Posted in: Standard Archives
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    posted a message on [Development] Proliferate Red Destructive Force
    Now's a good time to try re-working one of the many Koth/Metalcraft/Proliferate Red decks.

    Galvanoth is bad in a deck that has no way to control what it reveals, and Chandra Ablaze is just bad. I would try lowering your curve a bit and experiment with artifacts that you haven't yet tried.
    Posted in: Standard Archives
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    posted a message on Shape the Blightsteel Anew
    Why would you play a Shape Anew deck that has the ability to target Darksteel Axe, and then get another Darksteel Axe?

    Controlling your "cascade" is the key to "breaking" cards like this and Polymorph.
    Posted in: Standard Archives
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    posted a message on Grixis Planeswalkers - (Mid-Range Planeswalker Control)
    Quote from mdilthey
    Oh my god. Really, guys?

    You counter ramp spells and DON'T counter Primeval Titan?

    You can't just remove Primeval Titan against Valakut. I don't care if it's instant speed.

    Valakut has such a high land density, it will guaranteed cast a Primeval Titan by turn 6 even if you counter every ramp spell. If the Primeval Titan tables, it gets:

    TWO VALAKUTS.

    For the rest of the game, they need to resolve one cultivate, one khalni heart expedition, or one harrow to deal you 12 points of damage. They win.

    Always counter Primeval Titan, or scoop.


    Whether or not you think we're all idiotic, retarded monkeys, throwing around a pouty attitude and acting offended doesn't prove your correctness.

    At this point, I'm doubting as to whether you've ever played against Valakut, and no, I don't count testing-it-in-your-mind as real testing.

    Let me get this straight: Your plan is to do nothing against a ramp deck, let it ramp, and then hope they're dumb enough to cast Primeval Titan without being able to pay for Mana Leak and without having a Summoning Trap in their hand. Seems solid.

    Using the decklist that you, yourself, proposed to the OP as an improved list, I decided to go hang out on MWS for a little while with the game title, "Looking to test new archetype against Valakut. SBs please."

    For others' ease of reference, I'll copy+paste the decklist now.



    ---

    Round X, Game 1:
    I was on the play. I kept a hand with Preordain, Mana Leak, Spell Pierce, and some lands. Keepable. On turn two, I Pierced his Spell. On my third turn I cast Preordain. He cast a Cultivte and I Leaked it. On turn four, I went for the throat with an Abyssal Persecutor. He played another land and passed. I only had IOK at this point for real gas, but didn't bother casting it, as he obviously didn't have anything 3cmc or lower he could cast. Swing in for six. Next turn I played SGO into SGO which dug me into either Jace or Preordain. I don't remember which, and it really doesn't matter. By the time my opponent was at zero, he had an active Titan, but couldn't even attack me profitably with it, because he would just lose the game. My life total wasn't 20, sure, but he was locked out. It only took a turn from there to draw Jace or Consume or the second Bolt or Sarkhan or whatever I used to sacrifice the Persecutor.

    Game one is the only tough part about this match-up, but even then you get some hands that play out as well as the one above.

    Round X, Game 2:
    I bring in 2 Duress, 2 Consuming Vapors, 4 Spreading Seas, 3 Memoricide, and take out 3 Lightning Bolt, 2 Sarkhan, and 3 Doom Blade, 2 Sea Gate Oracle, and 1 Persecutor.

    I make him discard his only two-mana ramp spell, and follow that up with Preordain and with Spell Pierce open for his three-mana option. Countered. On my fourth turn I brainstorm with Jace, then do it again on turn five. I pass. He plays a Titan and I attempt a Mana Leak. I knew he had the Trap form the earlier discard spell, but am forced to pull the trigger anyway. He obviously traps into another Titan, and gets two Valakut. I Consume his Meek Titan, gain six, and start using a combination of Brainstorms and +2s (targeting me) to fix my draws and slowly inch Jace up to ultimate status. Eventually I just draw an Inferno Titan and kill him. (I forgot to mention there was a Spreading Seas in there somewhere on his Valakut)

    ---

    Basically every sideboarded match went similar to this, with results varying somewhat based on how I chose to sideboard. A combination of discard + counters on Ramp's early spells followed up by Jace, Memoricide, a Consumed Titan, or my own big fatty equaled a game win almost every single time. My first sideboarded game loss came to a triple Summoning Trap draw.

    The point of a control deck is to disallow the opponent's deck from operating on its own terms, from doing what it wants, from getting to its end game. Allowing a ramp deck to ramp --doing nothing-- unsurprisingly does nothing to prevent them from achieving their goals. You have to disrupt them.

    Overall, I'm not impressed with the Red spells in this deck. UB alone has the tools to fight basically everything, and Red doesn't really add much. Cutting Red lets you play Tectonic Edge, too, which is not something to really be shrugged off.
    Posted in: Standard Archives
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    posted a message on Grixis Planeswalkers - (Mid-Range Planeswalker Control)
    Quote from mdilthey
    You ended your post with a smiley face?

    Do I really have to explain what just happened? [/rhetoric]

    Countering "A later Cultivate" as OP said, is likely incorrect, but I do not know when "later" is. From the sounds of it, "later" is when Valakut already has five lands in play because his opponent untapped and just cast Titan anyway.

    Again, let us not assume one another to be dullards here.

    Quote from Phyrexian Doughnought »
    There is a threshold beyond which you do not counter the opponent's ramp spells, but before that threshold it is just so obviously correct to counter them.


    What is so dramatically incorrect about this statement?
    Posted in: Standard Archives
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    posted a message on Grixis Planeswalkers - (Mid-Range Planeswalker Control)
    Quote from mdilthey


    Not if you have no counter in hand for Primeval Titan OMG


    Let's deal with reality. There is a threshold beyond which you do not counter the opponent's ramp spells, but before that threshold it is just so obviously correct to counter them. Am I going to counter that turn two Explore? Every time. Turn three Cultivate? Every time. Turn three Harrow? Every time. Turn four Titan? No, because I'll have already countered his ramp spells and he won't yet have six lands. At this point I cast a Jace and he's dead. OMG

    I would appreciate a real response and not something sarcastic followed by a smug smiley face.
    Posted in: Standard Archives
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    posted a message on Grixis Planeswalkers - (Mid-Range Planeswalker Control)
    Quote from mdilthey

    You misplayed by not having a counter available for his primeval titan when he had 6 mana. It's much more relevant than trying to keep him off 6 mana. Don't counter the ramp unless you know you can keep him from getting to some point that he needs to get to.


    I've been following the rather entertaining debate in this thread, and I've been with you for most of it, MDilthey, but you're just dead wrong here. Countering the ramp spells is the easiest way to win this match-up, game one.
    Posted in: Standard Archives
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    posted a message on This deck CANNOT lose
    I appreciate your stab at satire, but this deck costs significantly less money than every other control deck, so it definitely can and will lose.

    At least play the full set of Jaces to get 100% of your free wins as opposed to merely 75%.

    Cut all the crappy commons, uncommons, and rares, and replace them with Mythics. You might run out of lands to add, but there are some expensive promotional lands you can use, like GURU or Summer Islands.

    See you at the Yacht Club tournament, and good luck.
    Posted in: Standard Archives
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    posted a message on Cryptic command obsession?
    It answers literally every threat. It even answers this question.
    Posted in: Extended (Type 1.X)
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    posted a message on [MBS] Hero of Bladehold
    Why is a knight wearing a bikini into battle?
    Posted in: Rumor Mill Archive
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    posted a message on U/B/R Proliferate Infect
    Necropede, Skithiryx, Trisk + Throne or Trisk with five counters, a Dforce in hand, 5RRBB, and all against an opponent with only five lands, but also a Titan. GG, indeed.

    You realize how ridiculous your response is, right?

    This deck has some good ideas, but is too scatterbrained to capitalize on any of them. If you really want help, you'd be good to listen instead of getting defensive and (apparently) offended.

    Have a merry day in Magical Christmas Land.
    Posted in: Standard Archives
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    posted a message on U/B/R Proliferate Infect
    So, are we supposed to critique it or not?
    Posted in: Standard Archives
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    posted a message on [DEV -- Official Thread] Cruel Control
    Quote from DaffydT
    It's ok, a 3 power flyer with pseudo thoughtsieze isn't too bad, but at the 3 cmc slot I'm not sold. If we are on the play, it's a bit better, but usually our opponant keeps mana leak open to counter an early Jace B. On the draw, they'd either have esper charm/counter mana open, or have laid Jace B.

    I would much rather just run thoughtsieze/duress on the play personally. Makes sure I hit their hand before they get a chance to flash me a 'leak or ambitions before I hit their jace/titan/counter


    You know it has Flash, right?
    Posted in: Extended Archives
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    posted a message on The forgotten archetypes
    Mythic Conscription is definitely being played. It's already won a GPT, and the maindeck is basically the same as Wrapter's Nationals build, but with a few Cryptic Command thrown in for obvious reasons.
    Posted in: Extended (Type 1.X)
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    posted a message on [Standard] Competitive Venser Decks (All Archetypes)
    I'd like to preface my response by saying that I am in agreement with Pointicus about one thing: You are using circular logic to justify a green splash, specifically Realms Uncharted.

    Circular Logic Example: You're splashing a color to fix your colors so you can cast a "tutor" that finds lands that you cut so you could make room for the color that you splashed so you can cast a "tutor" that finds lands that you cut so you could make room for the color that you splashed so you can cast a "tutor" that finds lands that you cut so you could make room for the color that you splashed so you.

    Etc.

    I would also like to say that I do not think Realms is necessarily terrible, just that it does not fit into this particular deck, and that even more value can be extracted out of it through other card choices.

    Quote from mdilthey
    Firstly, Sun Titan gets lands back. My opponent throwing out a Tectonic Edge just means i'll get them later.


    At this point, both you and your opponent are likely in Stage III of the game. (This is a safe assumption considering you have cast and resolved a Sun Titan; if this isn't so, then you are likely winning anyway, as you are certainly in Stage III, but your opponent is not yet.) If this is so, then Tectonic Edge does not matter -- or at least matters less than it would have in Stages I or II.

    If you played four Tectonic Edge instead of playing Green, your Tectonic Edge would be much more reliable (as far as the Battlefield is concerned) and more effective. And you are still just as likely to soft-lock an opponent out of Stage III via Sun Titan.

    Secondly, with the exception of a few unbelievably powerful lands, I don't think standard has ever had access to BETTER lands. Not only do we have 6 manlands in the set, we have a wasteland effect, a maze, 10 ETB effect lands, and a set of fetches. THis card has never been more timely.


    Aside: I would give almost anything to have 10 Shock Lands/Bounce Lands back, or Charge Lands, or Urza Tron, or Academy Ruins -- we're in an artifact block! But I digress. Certainly, the power level of lands in Standard right now is through-the-roof awesome.

    Before I give counterpoints to your argument, I would like to first suggest that because literally every deck is playing at least some of these "unbelievably powerful lands", Realms Uncharted is already at a significant disadvantage. Getting a few more awesome lands matters less when your opponent has the same number of awesome lands that he can use each turn. What I mean by this is that even if you have four creature-lands in play to your opponent's two, you can each likely only activate one -- not to mention, your opponent probably has more Tec Edges in his deck than you do.

    What is the Realms package that gives you the best value, using all of these fancy lands? Tec Edge, Maze, Colonnade, Wildwood? You'll likely be handed Maze and Wildwood a majority of the time, as those are the worst of the group by a significant margin. Maybe you'll get handed Colonnade over Wildwood some of the time if the opponent is aggressive. With no way to abuse Realms Uncharted outside of Sun Titan, its most relevant indirect effect seems to be "Search your library for Tectonic Edge, hope your opponent is stupid, and then put it in your graveyard anyway." Now, that is a note-worthy ability, but simply playing four Tectonic Edge accomplishes the same thing, as I have stated above.

    Now, as for the synergy part, having lands in hand is amazing synergy with Emeria Angel because it keeps my opponents from making me sac creatures AND it keeps blockers on the field so Venser can go ultimate. By vensering fetch lands, I can give Emeria Angel 3 little friends in a single turn.


    Cultivate has more synergy with Emeria Angel than Realms Uncharted. It gives you two lands to feed Landfall, but both lands will be entering the battlefield that turn. Venser increases your Landfall count by the same amount no matter what your 2G spell is.

    Finally, I might run more fetches, but I really don't own any right now. I wouldn't run more than 3 more, though. I thought about Sylvan Ranger over BoP, but I like the speed the BoP provides and the color-fixing, which has been more than relevant with so much double green, white, and blue.


    If you can acquire fetch lands, I would say go for it.

    Sylvan Ranger and BOP are entirely different cards, much in the sense that Cultivate and Realms are different. One is ramp, one "draws" lands. There is a significant difference in these two abilities. This is ignoring their relative mana cost -- the difference between one and two is is more than simple arithmetic would lead you to believe. This makes them difficult, if not pointless, to compare. Outside of a 1-of in a Fauna Shaman deck maybe, nobody should really be playing Sylvan Ranger, but this isn't to say that I think BOP is the optimal ramp card for your deck.

    BOP provides some speed, yes, but what are you speeding into? I would argue that Explore or Cultivate do the same job, but more efficiently.

    Aside: Explore would be pretty awesome in this deck. It synergizes amazingly with Realms Uncharted. Not that I really think Realms is necessary or even good, but adding Explore would help make it playable. Explore also ramps in the same manner as BOP, but provides extra Landfall to Emeria in Stage III or later in Stage II that you're trying to top-deck out of.

    Color-fixing would not be necessary if you cut BOP and Realms, though it appears I will be unable to sway your opinion on this front.

    Thanks for the insight, though Grin A lot of people aren't fans of the Realms Uncharted, but I wouldn't be advocating it so heavily if I wasn't having outstanding results.


    Good Results are not necessarily The Best Results.

    I appreciate your attempt at innovation and desire to discover new, break-out cards, as I am constantly testing new ideas and strategies -- it's a long-forgotten practice in this hive mind world. The ability to differentiate between Actually Good and Good As In Not Terrible, Maybe Even Okay, But Mostly Just Different From The Hive seems to be the next skill you need to develop on your way to becoming a successful rogue deck-builder.

    ---

    Circular Logic Example: You're splashing a color to fix your colors so you can cast a "tutor" that finds lands that you cut so you could make room for the color that you splashed so you can cast a "tutor" that finds lands that you cut so you could make room for the color that you splashed so you can cast a "tutor" that finds lands that you cut so you could make room for the color that you splashed so you.


    (Edit: I see that I've been Sarnathed by Mdilthey. I'll refrain from adding even more to this post or double-posting just to respond. Instead, I'll respond to any future response.)
    Posted in: Standard Archives
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    posted a message on [Standard] Competitive Venser Decks (All Archetypes)
    Quote from SpookyDoom
    I double-checked the rulings, but when you bounce Domestication (enchant creature), the original owner gets his creature back. Its like paying 2 mana more for Journey to Nowhere.


    1. I enchant Some Dude with Domestication.
    2. You play a Sweet Dude.
    3. I blink Domestication with Venser, when it returns, I steal your Sweet Dude.
    4. I get to block with your Sweet Dude.
    5. Once I untap, I get to attack with your Sweet Dude, and then blink Domestication again so that the enchantment is not sacrificed, after which I just get the Sweet Dude back. I can even take Shrouded Dudes via Venser's blink ability.

    It's very different from Journey to Nowhere.

    That said, I do not think it is good -- merely a thought for the MTGS community to mull over.
    Posted in: Standard Archives
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    posted a message on [Standard] Competitive Venser Decks (All Archetypes)
    I have tried most of these choices out at one point or another in various decks. I even tried to make Realms Uncharted playable for a bit.

    The problem is that drawing real cards immediately (now with Oracle and Preordain) is just better than drawing lands with Realms Uncharted. If you're sticking with Realms, though, isn't Explore miles better than BOP? If your opponent isn't bolting your BOP, it's either because 1) your opponent is bad, or 2) BOP isn't as good in your deck as you think.

    If opponents are letting you have Maze, then that's because it doesn't hinder them. If it is actually good against them, which is unlikely, then they just won't let you have it.

    I understand Lotus Cobra is not good in this deck, but you should still run the fetch lands. They work really well with Realms Uncharted in two ways: they give you more effective duals to search with it, and help to further thin your deck, which you seem to favor over actual card selection in Blue.

    The next time you test the deck, could you post some actual game-by-game analysis or commentary? I think seeing what is really happening turn-by-turn will help one of us see what the other is trying to say, and I don't mean that in a facetious "I'm-right-you're-wrong" attitude.
    Posted in: Standard Archives
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    posted a message on [Standard] Competitive Venser Decks (All Archetypes)
    There is more to the Magic community than a single website ;-0

    RE Your new decklist:

    The maindeck splash for Green seems misguided. Cultivate is probably just better than Realms Uncharted, and Birds of Paradise is likely not the cheap accelerator that you want -- ramping from one to three isn't super important in this deck.

    I've been a long-time fan of Emeria Angel, but your finisher suite of 2 Frosty, 2 Sunny, and 2 BSA seems very random.

    Venser even seems a bit weak in this deck, or at least jarring. The only cards he really combos with are ones that you'd want to cast on the same turn, which is rather awkward.

    Lastly, Mystifying Maze seems pretty weak.

    Seeing that you have a large number of less-than-four-ofs, I'd recommend adding some card selection in the form of Preordain, Wall of Omens, or Sea Gate Oracle. Your only non-land four-ofs are Birds, Realms, and Journey.
    Posted in: Standard Archives
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    posted a message on [Standard] Competitive Venser Decks (All Archetypes)
    Venser does almost literally nothing in a Machine-X deck like that. I would suggest cutting it, but then it wouldn't belong in this thread.

    Has anyone tried Stoneforge Mystic in any of these Venser decks? If it was maindecked, you'd likely be changing most of your strategy, but I could see it being a possible sideboard plan, both giving SFM a double dose of usefulness and also making sure something like Sword of Body and Mind connects with the opponent. Trying out maindeck Sword of Body and Mind in a build with Sea Gate Oracle doesn't really seem too crazy in the right meta; I've even been advocating Scroll Thief over Sea Gate Oracle lately for an incredibly -- like, 80-90% incredibly -- control-heavy metagame, or for those who need a reverse-handicap in control matchups.

    I would also like to point out an interaction that, as far as I can tell, has gone unnoticed by the Venser-ing community:
    Domestication

    Unless you drafted Rise of the Eldrazi a ton, you might have to read that one. I'll wait.

    . . .

    With an active Venser, Domestication is effectively a four-mana Mind Control. This might not be the most relevant of shortcuts, but if you're playing a slightly more tap-out version of UW, I could easily imagine a turn three Domestication off of Everflowing Chalice being very strong. If you land a Venser next turn, you get to take any dude you want, for as long as you want.

    The real question is whether the Venser community has ignored this interaction because 1) They didn't know about it or 2) It's just not good enough.

    What do you think?
    Posted in: Standard Archives
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    posted a message on Infinite mana
    This combo has been talked about since the Architect was previewed.

    There has been no real forward movement since then, however, and it's because having a three-card combo revolving around two easily-removed creatures is not the best direction to go. I've seen some builds that shove this combo into a deck with several other artifact-based combos to some decent results, but still nothing with the consistency I require from a real combo deck.

    I'm still keeping my fingers crossed and my mind open, though.
    Posted in: Extended (Type 1.X)
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    posted a message on Anyone else totally loving Extended right now?
    I'm absolutely loving it, buddy.
    Posted in: Extended (Type 1.X)
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    posted a message on [SCD] Sea Gate Oracle
    I still play Sea Gate Oracle myself, and would agree that -- probably 99% of the time -- SGO is the better-suited card.
    Posted in: Standard Archives
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    posted a message on Planeswalker Control Viable?
    I think sticking to Jace, Ajani V, and Elspeth, Knight-Errant is the best way to go. Gideon might be fine as a one-of.

    This format is still developing, so my snap-answer to any "Is X viable?" question is, "Go try it."

    Go try it.
    Posted in: Extended Archives
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    posted a message on [SCD] Sea Gate Oracle
    Quote from Gaia
    Yeah, Scroll Thief digs and blocks against aggro decks, forgot.

    Scroll Thief is less than great against aggro, as it's often a 1/3 with no abilities.

    Quote from gma
    How is Scroll Thief better than Sea Gate Oracle in ANY meta?

    Same cost. Same bodies. But...

    SGO gives you an instatnt bonus after playing it - whether it's worth a spot in MD or not. ST on the other hand gives you nothing, sits for a turn, luring op's removal, and to gain the benefit of drawing a single card with him takes two turns (the turn he was played and the next one).

    Please explain.


    Your comparison of SGO v. Scroll Thief is rather biased. If I had to compare them, this is how I would do it:
    Both cost 2U.
    Both are 1/3.
    SGO gives you an immediate card against aggro.
    Scroll Thief generally gives you 0-1 cards against aggro.
    Scroll Thief gives you multiple cards against control.
    SGO gives you one card against control.

    Yes, Scroll Thief is much, much weaker against aggressive decks. I'm merely saying that if for some reason you get The Sickest Read, and you know you're likely to face only or mostly other U/x control decks, that Scroll Thief is a surprisingly potent option.

    If, as you say, Scroll Thief draws out removal eventually, isn't that great? Then other, more expensive, and possibly more vulnerable (if only because you tap out, not necessarily because of its actual frailty) threats in your deck are a little bit more free to roam.

    Another possible outcome is that the opponent animates a Creeping Tar Pit or other creature-land to block. This usually gives you enough of a mana advantage to resolve any threat you'd like.

    Most of the time, Scroll Thief is (overall) worse than Sea Gate Oracle --but-- Scroll Thief can often shine in the control matchups, so if that is incredibly important to you, it is merely a choice to consider or try out in your next testing session.
    Posted in: Standard Archives
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    posted a message on Contaminated Vs. Spreading
    Drawing a card is more valuable than forcing life loss upon the opponent to a strategy like ours.

    Additionally, making lands tap for blue instead of black is actually relevant, as Spreading Seas is a solid card against Vampires, who have very few colorless mana requirements.
    Posted in: Standard Archives
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    posted a message on [SCD] Sea Gate Oracle
    If you play in a control-heavy metagame, or at least a metagame that would support the card, Scroll Thief is a million times better than Sea Gate Oracle (when it's any good at all).
    Posted in: Standard Archives
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    posted a message on Is a Loam strategy even worth considering?
    I happen to think this is not going to be a competitive strategy, but if it were, Realms Uncharted could very possibly be a piece of the puzzle.
    Posted in: Extended Archives
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