• posted a message on Panoptic Mirror
    I can see reasons for and reasons against the mirror. In the end I dont think its competative as far as combos go but its very obvious. It probably does have a good chance to cause a lot of feel bad among newer or more casual groups if it were played so from that perspective I think its fine on the list.

    I dont think its good combo by any means though. Anyone who has played a bit more or tries to play a more competitive game would never resort to such a card. Being that it fits being a card that could and probably would be very unfun for a more casual game to experience I think its ok to be on the banned list.

    I guess I am somewhere in leaning like 60% towards keeping it banned and 40% towards removing it.
    Posted in: Commander Rules Discussion Forum
  • posted a message on [Offtopic] Community Thread
    I just ordered Nether Void + The Abyss in the same order...... now to make a deck to use them in lol.

    Ohhh cool Bur joined mod staff. Hi!

    4Lark: congrats. Good luck in the preparations. I just recently did that too. I / we have not looked at rings for me yet (to my knowledge)
    Posted in: Commander (EDH)
  • posted a message on Erayo, Soratami Ascendant
    Quote from Buffsam89 »
    While I pointed out in the Official Forum that there really is only one way to build him, I'll also add that his ability is pretty degenerate, specifically in a MP setting. I hate trying to argue against cards like this, simply because of the counter arguments that will follow, but, it's kind of counter-intuitive to what EDH is. Once flipped, the game just stalls until a player can trigger the ability on a "garbage" spell so they can get through on their removal. It doesn't help that he is in the color to best support his ability.

    All in all, I'm pretty much against all cards that punish players for playing the game. It is a great hoser against decks/players that get greedy and vomit their hands, but on the flip side, that's kind of the allure of EDH, being able to play a ton of stuff, while other players do the same.


    Hermit Druid has not been banned because technically he has other applications. While its likely that Erayo as a commander would be played in a deck full of cheap cantrips and such of that sort, you could just as equally point to other decks that there is really only one build to like Edric and ask why he has not been banned. Edric will win the game about as fast as you can lock a table with Erayo and they are both vulnerable to cheap spot removal. I am not trying to use Edric as the baseline but there are many similarities between him and Erayo in this case.

    You also dont accidentally build Erayo. Some of the other banned as a commander legends are that way because you could innocently play Refelos as a commander and break a more casual game unknowingly with his fast ramp. Erayo needs to be carefully put together by someone who knows how to build and how to play the game. In my mind the big thing with Erayo as a commander is the social expectations of a meta. If you are not playing MLD, Stax, Stasis why do you think someone would play Erayo? Its the same thing. If however you are a cutthrat meta playing fast combo and MLD / Stax / Stasis then how is he out of the norm. The banned list is made for the more casual players and its geared from the perspective of those not looking to break the game. Erayo takes a lot of good deckbuilding and gameplay to play correctly and I dont think he really falls into the category of what if someone accidentally stumbles into the commander because its not that kind of a commander.

    I am not going to argue against what Erayo "could do" so much as say that he does not fit the bill of what gets banned now and today. He has been on the banned list for long enough that when he was put on the list it was probably fine but if he was not on the banned list I have a strong feeling that he would not be put onto it under today's guidelines for why things get banned.
    Posted in: Commander Rules Discussion Forum
  • posted a message on Erayo, Soratami Ascendant
    Cryo wanted me to create a new thread discussion for Erayo as I brought it up in the general discussion. I am of the mindset that Erayo does not fit the mold of what is on the banned list and for what reason. You could argue that there is only one way to build Erayo but you could also say the same thing for a lot of other competative commanders as well. The social obligations of most metas would keep most players from playing Erayo as a commander anyways. Under these grounds I feel that the ban on Erayo has wiggle room to be discussed.

    Also, for what its worth, I have no interest in ever playing Erayo as a commander. I just felt that the ban on the card does not fit the mold of the banned list mentality. I simply wanted to point out my grounds for suggesting unbanning Erayo.
    Posted in: Commander Rules Discussion Forum
  • posted a message on Erayo, Soratami Ascendant

    I think it may be worth reevaluating the ban on Erayo, Soratami Ascendant. I was trying to explain the transition from banned as commander to banned outright and I had a hard time when I came to Erayo. I can totally understand the reasons to keep Braids and Refelos banned entirely because you could argue that its not very hard for a more casual meta to accidentally break the game with these commanders but Erayo is very much a fine tuned sort of commander to make it work properly. I got into thinking about how this card works as both a commander and a singleton.

    As a Commander: In a lot of ways it resembles a player playing stasis, MLD, or a fast deck like Edric, Spymaster of Trest or a stasis Derevi, Empyrial Tactician deck. I dont really want to draw edric as a baseline but edric is very fast but incredibly specific in how he needs to be built in order to function correctly which in my mind is exactly how Erayo is. When someone really spends the time and effort to make a well thought out list it can be very daunting but its not as if someone is going to play some sort of competative Erayo lock deck in a meta that was not ok with combo, MLD, and stasis effects. Its really just more or less the same kind of a deck mentality.

    As a Sigleton: there are very very few decks and they are usually few and far between that Erayo seems to fit into. His trigger is hard to pull off especially when not building around.

    I honestly dont really care either way but when I was explaining the transition of banned as a commander I could justify where the rest of the cards went but I could not really give a justification on why Erayo stayed banned entirely. I think it can be an oppressive deck but its also not something I overly expect someone to casually stumble into building. Its a very complex deck design and its using tactics that are generally moderated by social contracts of metas. It just feels like a bit of an odd outlier to me. That is just my $0.02 of the day.
    Posted in: Commander Rules Discussion Forum
  • posted a message on The Third Annual MTGSalvation Dream Ban List Poll
    Quote from cryogen »

    Yeah, there has been a lot more support for her ban as compared to previous years. The BaaC list is still very unpopular as well, it seems. Of course, the sample size is pretty small so far, so time will tell.


    The Banned as a Commander change is also something that was done primarily for cleaning up the rules and simplifying things for new players. Its an entirely negative change for those of us who have been playing for a long time. I understand why its there but the ones who it is going to be helping are also not the ones likely to be voting on a poll like this (newer players).
    Posted in: Commander (EDH)
  • posted a message on [[Official]] General Discussion of the Official Multiplayer Banlist
    I think it may be worth reevaluating the ban on Erayo, Soratami Ascendant. I was trying to explain the transition from banned as commander to banned outright and I had a hard time when I came to Erayo. I can totally understand the reasons to keep Braids and Refelos banned entirely because you could argue that its not very hard for a more casual meta to accidentally break the game with these commanders but Erayo is very much a fine tuned sort of commander to make it work properly. I got into thinking about how this card works as both a commander and a singleton.

    As a Commander: In a lot of ways it resembles a player playing stasis, MLD, or a fast deck like Edric, Spymaster of Trest. I dont really want to draw edric as a baseline but edric is very fast but incredibly specific in how he needs to be built in order to function correctly which in my mind is exactly how Erayo is. When someone really spends the time and effort to make a well thought out list it can be very daunting but its not as if someone is going to play some sort of competative Erayo lock deck in a meta that was not ok with combo, MLD, and stasis effects. Its really just more or less the same kind of a deck mentality.

    As a Sigleton: there are very very few decks and they are usually few and far between that Erayo seems to fit into. His trigger is hard to pull off especially when not building around.

    I honestly dont really care either way but when I was explaining the transition of banned as a commander I could justify where the rest of the cards went but I could not really give a justification on why Erayo stayed banned entirely. I think it can be an oppressive deck but its also not something I overly expect someone to casually stumble into building. Its a very complex deck design and its using tactics that are generally moderated by social contracts of metas. It just feels like a bit of an odd outlier to me. That is just my $0.02 of the day.
    Posted in: Commander Rules Discussion Forum
  • posted a message on Gonti's World of Luxury
    Quote from BlackVise »
    With regards to Bog Witch - discarding a fatty to reanimate is a strong line of play, but in all honesty I have got more use out of her for just being a ritual on a stick. The card disadvantage isn't great but the ramp she provides can allow you to really take over a game.


    I like rituals a little more when moving faster in general. My overal gameplan with this kind of a deck is really just play it by ear which makes me less inclined to play cards that burn card advantage for tempo. It also has the problem that she is a 3 drop with a tap ability so she doesn't bring my commander in faster. I might be more interested in something like that with a more expensive commander. It just feels like it hits at an odd time. I feel like I would much rather have Dark Ritual offhand but I also feel like I need to have my card draw into a better spot to get away with that for now.

    Quote from Deep_Woods »
    Gild gives you a nice gold token to add to your luxury. Not a great card but flavorfull.

    Good flavor call. I probably wont get too deep on the on flavor picks but its cool to call them out for those interested in doing so.



    I am looking to do more games with this deck tonight. In an attempt to try some new things and adjust from last week I have some changes I was thinking about.

    DECK CHANGES:

    Massacre Wurm -> Wurmcoil Engine - part of this is that I was digging up more wraths than I had originally anticipated with my commander in part because getting access to the all non land based wraths is something I am almost always interested to pocket for this deck. I still like the ETB off of the massacre wurm but I was surprised how much more I got out of Demon of Dark Schemes than I did the wurm in part because I am not an aggressive deck so its hard to capitalize even if I do hit a token deck for 10-20 life. I also keep running into situations where it seems like the token decks have sac outlets which makes the wurm a lot worse.

    Phyrexian Reclamation -> Vampiric Rites - I sort of overlooked that I tend to favor Phyrexian Reclamation more in a rez light creature heavy deck which this turned out to not really be. Instead I will pick up another sac outlet + a little draw and lifegain.

    Cauldron of Souls -> Viscera Seer - Cauldron can only be used once per turn and its sort of expensive and requires a bit of setup. I have been hurting on my sac outlets and I like the seer so for now I will cut the cauldron and see if my sac outlet issue gets solved.

    Unstable Obelisk -> Night's Whisper - I dig a lot of spot removal and wraths with my commander so honestly the removal side of the oblisk is perhaps not as good as it could be. It also hits at the wrong time being a 3 mana stone it doesn't ramp me into my commander.

    Worn Powerstone -> Everflowing Chalice - its kind of odd having 3 mana ramp. I think moving to the chalice will give me the option of ramping into my game a little better and later I feel it will be better too. I have too many games where my gameplan is to just drop my commander when I can and then play it by ear so based on that I think that 3 mana ramp is a little awkward in that its not ramping me in time but its also not ramping me forward much. I feel like the chalice will give me much better control over this.

    Reanimate -> Sign in Blood - awkwardly I saw a lot of games where I almost never wanted any of my opponents creatures. I think that it has some good potential but I just dont really like sorcery speed + the life loss when I feel like I am not using it fully. I may consider going back to it later but for now I feel like there are too few valuable targets under my opponents because I am seeing too many niche decks and too little goodstuff from my opponents. I needed a little more draw and so the hope is that with a little more draw I can possibly hit some of my other rez as well as just move my hand a little better.
    Posted in: Multiplayer Commander Decklists
  • posted a message on Traverse the Ulvenwald
    I was really excited for it when it got spoiled but somehow I ended up never getting a copy or playing with or seeing anyone else play with it. It seems decent though....
    Posted in: Commander (EDH)
  • posted a message on The Third Annual MTGSalvation Dream Ban List Poll
    Thanks for doing this again cryo. I enjoy seeing the historic data and how perceptions and polling varies from year to year.
    Posted in: Commander (EDH)
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