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  • posted a message on Derevi, the Prison Queen
    Most of the cards you mentioned don't make much sense in this deck, but let's dissect it one by one:

    1) Manglehorn is usually just a bad version of Reclamation Sage. Artifacts I can handle quite effectively already (Null Rod & Stony Silence, also Kataki) and the main reason I'm playing RecSage is getting rid of enchantments, which Manglehorn can't do.
    2) Quicksilver Fountain - I have no idea what this card could accomplish here. Seriously, either I'm blind or this has zero sense whatsoever.
    3) Shaman of Forgotten Ways costs a whopping three mana, which disqualifies him on the spot (producing creature-only mana doesn't help him either). Sure, Joraga Treespeaker is definitely the worst of my mana dorks and I wouldn't mind to upgrade him, but he's still better than a three-drop.
    4) Fatespinner is a bad card that doesn't do anything (90% of combo decks would just ignore it and kill you outside of combat), and Ethersworn Canonist hurts me more than most of my opponents. As for SotF/Shaman: I tried that already, this isn't the right deck for such cards (see elfric's post several pages back for explanation).

    The only card I could actually consider is Minamo, School at Water's Edge. Untapping Derevi or Sakashima isn't worth the hassle and I don't play Yisan anymore, but untapping Captain Sisay or Cradle sounds way more attractive. The thing is, my mana base is stretched pretty thin already (I'm thinking about replacing Hinterland Harbor with either Tarnished Citadel or Undiscovered Paradise) and I'm not sure if Minamo is actually worth it - I might test it someday though.
    Posted in: Multiplayer Commander Decklists
  • posted a message on Derevi, the Prison Queen
    Quote from umfta »
    would it fit to the most tight lockdown strategies?

    I don't think so.

    See, the whole point of fliers in my deck is that their purpose is twofold: they both affect the board (by taxing spells, hampering tutors, turning off activated abilities, drawing cards etc.) AND attack in the air, triggering Derevi ability. Nimble Obstructionist either affects the board (and even then only once) OR attacks in the air - it's never both. It's very narrow as a counterspell and very vanilla as a beater - I just don't see it fitting here.

    Back in the day, when Prophet of Kruphix was still legal, I ran a small Wizard package containing Patron Wizard and Vendilion Clique among others. If you're interested in this kind of card - a flying beater with one-shot disruption effect - I think the Clique would serve your purpose better.
    Posted in: Multiplayer Commander Decklists
  • posted a message on Derevi, the Prison Queen
    Quote from odirodi »
    my playgroup has consecrated sphinx as a banned card, any suggestions?

    Yeah, convince them to drop this ban and go back to normal... Seriously, there are at least four cards in my list that should be banned waaay before Consecrated Sphinx.
    Quote from odirodi »
    I have been testing Howling Mine (since I can tap it with my commander so I only get benefits). Maybe a cheap cost planeswalker I am not sure...

    Well, you definitely need another draw engine - Howling Mine is one option, you can also try Rhystic Study or Tamiyo, Field Researcher. Neither of these cards is on Sphinx level, but beggars can't be choosers, I guess.
    Posted in: Multiplayer Commander Decklists
  • posted a message on Derevi, the Prison Queen
    One small update: I finally removed Crop Rotation and put Mental Misstep in that spot (actually I made that move several weeks ago, but forgot to mention that). Crop Rotation was decent, but having only one and a half good targets was annoying - after drawing Cradle it was basically a dead card. Mental Misstep is never dead and saved me many times, so for now it stays.
    Posted in: Multiplayer Commander Decklists
  • posted a message on Derevi, the Prison Queen
    Quote from ErrorNight »
    Did you continue test Armageddon or both with Ravages of War?

    I did not, for similar reasons that I stopped playing planeswalkers in this deck (not tutorable, cost a ton under taxes, uncastable under Teeg).
    Quote from ErrorNight »
    Gaddock teeg will not defend you agains toxic deluge when the opponent have good ramp in deck.

    I know, Toxic Deluge is a pretty good way to deal with my deck and a legitimately scary card. However, decks that run Toxic Deluge tend to be spellslingers of either combo/control or just pure combo variety, which isn't that frightening - for example I'd rather face three different Toxic Deluge decks than one Yisan.
    Quote from ErrorNight »
    Think about it Shaman of forgotten ways

    It's waaay to slow. All my ramp cost either 0 or 1 mana - the only exception is Bloom Tender, which is ten times better than Shaman of Forgotten Ways and costs only two.
    Quote from ErrorNight »
    Another ideas for rescue table (no counterspell idea's):
    Selfless Spirit
    Dauntless Escort
    Heroic Intervention

    Dauntless Escort is just a dumb ground pounder with no evasion, Heroic Intervention is even worse - a very narrow spell that falls under all my taxes and requires keeping open mana. Selfless Spirit at least flies, so it's the best of these three, but it's such a narrow card that I don't see running it in a foreseeable future.
    And last but not least: neither of these three protects me from Toxic Deluge that you mentioned earlier (nor from Cyclonic Rift, Elesh Norn etc.).
    Quote from ErrorNight »
    Sanctum Prelate for 4 (most mass removal 4cmc or 6)

    Basically every mass removal I'm seeing in my meta costs about three mana - the most popular choices by far are Cyclonic Rift and Toxic Deluge, after that there's sometimes Anger of the Gods/Volcanic Fallout or Oblivion Stone. Once in a blue moon I see Supreme Verdict or Damnation, but that's very rare.
    Quote from ErrorNight »
    How can someone find an idea how to play Dismiss into Dream + Derevi = **** without condoms

    How can someone think that CMC7 enchantment is even close to playable in this deck is beyond me.
    Posted in: Multiplayer Commander Decklists
  • posted a message on Derevi, the Prison Queen
    Quote from odirodi »
    I find it difficult to deal with Blood Moon, Magus of the Moon, maybe it's just the Krenko in my play group getting that thing out around turn 1-2. But would you ever consider playing a Chromatic Lantern? In case you don't find a basic forest for rec sage//answer in this situation (Maybe I should just have a lantern on the side incase im up vs a potential blood moon matchup?)?

    Blood Moon is annoying, I agree. Fortunately I don't have to face it in my meta anymore, but I used to for quite a long time and it was quite irritating. The thing is, unless it comes down very early (turn 1-2), it's not that hurtful because by turn 3 you should have either some mana dorks or some disruption on the table, hopefully both. I used to run a basic Island along with a basic Forest - I cut it some time ago for Carpet of Flowers, but if your meta is less blue and more bloodmoony, feel free to put the Island back (especially if you're running 6CMC Sun Titan), which would open the door for Cyclonic Rift. You can also swap Aura of Silence for Aura Shards - both can serve as answers for Blood Moon, but WG is easier to generate than WW.
    Quote from odirodi »
    Another question, how has Sun Titan been for you/have you ever tested him? I recently added him to my list and I find him pretty strong, and it helps me bring back my stax effect cards (ex Stasis) while also giving me a way to reuse fetch lands for mana ramp or just answers. I'm guessing because he just costs 6 mana and you don't want to risk a dead draw in your hand early game?

    Basically I want all my creatures to be either mana, draw or disruption. Some time ago I decided to make an exception and put one piece of recursion into my list - the list of possibilities included Saffi Eriksdotter, Eternal Witness, Reveillark and Sun Titan. Ultimately I decided to run Llark: it flies, it brings back two things at once, it doesn't care about my Hushwing Gryff and it's a missing link in my Pod chain to Consecrated Sphinx (I almost never want to sacrifice Willbreaker, he's too good). I haven't tried Sun Titan personally, but on paper it seems pretty decent as well, so if it works for you, thumbs up.
    Quote from odirodi »
    Anyway great article! Smile

    Thank you, it's nice to hear that. Smile
    Posted in: Multiplayer Commander Decklists
  • posted a message on [[Official]] The Top 50 List (Indefinite Hiatus)
    I voted to remove Arcane Lighthouse, Tower of the Magistrate (both very narrow, I have never seen anybody playing any of these two IRL) and Tectonic Edge (c'mon, which deck - outside of maaaybe Titania - needs it while having access to Strip Mine, Wasteland and Dust Bowl?).

    I also support Inventor's Fair.
    Posted in: Commander (EDH)
  • posted a message on [[Official]] The Top 50 List (Indefinite Hiatus)
    Quote from ISBPathfinder »
    Support Mox Diamond

    I'll support Mox Diamond as well.
    Posted in: Commander (EDH)
  • posted a message on Derevi, the Prison Queen
    Would you guys be up for a little constructive criticism on what works for you, and what doesn't?
    I took out Static Orb and Stasis, but am considering adding them back in.

    http://tappedout.net/mtg-decks/derevi-so-heavy/

    Since you're clearly on a different build than mine (much heavier, with less stax and some combo instead), I'll chime in only on things that are glaringly wrong to me:

    1) I'm running 31 lands with 19 ramp pieces and the average CMC of my spells is 2.28 - I have two 5-drops and one 6-drop, the rest caps at four. You're running 30 lands with only 13 ramp pieces (Burgeoning doesn't count here) and the average CMC of your spells is 2.5 - you have three 5-drops, a 6-drop and a 7-drop. I could understand being that greedy with Paris mulligans, but under Vancouver this seems borderline suicidal.

    2) What's Trophy Mage for? Right now it gets only Tangle Wire and Trinisphere, neither of which seems crucial enough to justify running such narrow tutor.

    3) Sun Quan, Lord of Wu costs an awful lot - I'm pretty sure there are cheaper ways to achieve a similar effect. With Survival of the Fittest I would probably just run Wonder, but even without Survival I'd look at Concerted Effort or Odric, Lunarch Marshal before touching Sun Quan (actually even Archetype of Imagination looks slightly better to me, because being an enchantment makes it fetchable by Academy Rector).
    Posted in: Multiplayer Commander Decklists
  • posted a message on Derevi, the Prison Queen
    Excuse me if I'm being thick, but wouldn't removing your creature from combat negate any triggered ability afterwards?

    The combat phase has five steps:
    1) Beginning of combat
    2) Declare attackers
    3) Declare blockers
    4) Combat damage
    5) End of combat
    Your creatures deal damage (and thus trigger Derevi) in step 4, but they're treated as attacking through the whole phase. The Reconnaissance trick works by removing creatures from combat in step 5, when damage is already done and triggers already happened.
    Quote from adams_derevi »
    I also love abusing the latest combat ruling with Reconnaissance. You should definitively give it a try as it allow you to swing with all creatures, remove from combat those you are about to lose, then remove from combat those who dealt damage to your opponent after they dealt their damage.

    Then you use your Derevi's triggers to tap opponents land or untap your blue mana source in order to pay for stasis upkeep. One of my favorite card in Derevi.

    I know about this trick, but I haven't tried Reconnaissance yet for two reasons:
    1) Stasis locks do happen from time to time, but they're pretty rare. I already have three Stasis breakers while having only one Stasis itself - I'd rather have the second seesaw than the fourth way to break it.
    2) Outside Stasis locks Reconnaissance doesn't really solve any of my problems. I don't need it to break the usual Orb effect + taxes lock, because Derevi does that by herself. Against spellslingers it doesn't do much, because they don't have many creatures to block (and I have a good matchup against spellslingers anyway). I'd much rather have something to help me against creature decks - like a second Linvala or a second Willbreaker - than something as narrow as Reconnaissance.
    Posted in: Multiplayer Commander Decklists
  • posted a message on Derevi, the Prison Queen
    A couple updates:
    1) I removed a basic Island and put Carpet of Flowers in that spot. So far it plays well and looks like this change will stay.
    2) The more I play with Yisan, the more I don't like him - unless he's your commander (in which case he's great), he's slow as hell. Due to a recent surge in graveyard-based decks in my meta, I'm currently trying Rest in Peace in this slot.
    Posted in: Multiplayer Commander Decklists
  • posted a message on [[Official]] The Top 50 List (Indefinite Hiatus)
    I don't even remember when was the last time I saw Cultivate/Kodama's Reach being played... Every halfway decent green deck in my meta stops his ramp curve at two - there are some exceptions like Wood Elves in Zegana or Karametra's Acolyte in Yisan, but they're pretty rare. Actually I'm way more likely to see Elvish Spirit Guide being pitched than Cultivate being cast.
    Quote from ISBPathfinder »
    I personally think its better to hold this list to the standpoint of beginner to average player experience rather than try to tune the list to a high competitive meta.

    I think it's the other way around, for two reasons:
    1) Beginner to average players have this thread, which is way more useful for them.
    2) This Top 50 contains cards that are absurdly expensive (Timetwister, Bazaar of Baghdad, Mishra's Workshop, Imperial Seal etc.) as well as cards that are the polar opposite of what an average player considers fun (Winter Orb, Blood Moon, Contamination, Ruination, Armageddon, Moat etc.). I've said it in this thread before, but I'll repeat: if a new player that just heard about this casual format and wants to have some fun would read this list, he'd run away screaming, never to be seen again.
    Posted in: Commander (EDH)
  • posted a message on Derevi, the Prison Queen
    Quote from JacobG27 »
    Currently I am missing some key cards for this deck, such as thorn of amethyst, linvala Keeper Of Secrets, Noble hierarch and many fetch lands. I've been playing the deck over the last few weeks and it's done really well at my local shop. I have enough money to purchase about $200 in cards, in addition to the cards listed above I don't have any OG duels so my question is should I first purchase more of the tax effect/ramp/mana fixing or perhaps pick up a tropical island.

    The least important of those is definitely Noble Hierarch - it's just a mana dork, nice to have him, but not crucial by any means. Thorn and Linvala are much more important (especially the angel, more about her below).
    As for mana fixing: this deck is VERY color demanding. In many cases you want to have access to all your colors as early as turn two, turn three at the latest. I don't see how you can do that without fetchlands - you can skip an OG dual or two, but I wouldn't run this deck without at least 6-7 fetches.

    BTW: if you want to invest in OG duals, the order of importance goes like this: Tropical Island > Savannah >>> Tundra.
    Quote from JacobG27 »
    I want to hold off on buying linvala until we see what is in modern masters 2017, as it seems like a prime target for reprint.

    Unfortunately Linvala is very important in this deck for two reasons. First off, only three creatures aren't replaceable here with other similar cards - these three being Gaddock Teeg, Linvala and Willbreaker. But the second reason is even more important: Linvala is often a key to win your bad matchups.

    Basically your good matchups are various blue-based spellslinger decks and your bad matchups are various green-based creature decks (in reality it's way more complicated than that, but let's keep it simple for the sake of this discussion). Most creature decks (think Yisan, Prossh, Marath, Sisay, Ghave, Selvala, Zegana/Thrasios/UGwhatever etc.) have a hard time beating Linvala, so getting her onboard is often a high priority. If you don't have her in your deck... well, it will be an uphill battle.
    Quote from JacobG27 »
    Also I've found Elesh Norn to be very useful in a similar role as consecrated sphinx of getting back into games that seemed like they had completely slipped away, fortunately I have not encountered anyone in my meta playing control magic effects.

    As I've said many times before in this thread, Elesh Norn is a great card - no denying that. If you don't need to fear her turning against you (via Gilded Drake, Animate Dead or whatever), then sure, you could run her here. I've tried that and it always ended up badly, but it's mostly a meta call.
    Posted in: Multiplayer Commander Decklists
  • posted a message on Karador - Boonweaver Combo
    Quote from RivenVII »
    With how good decks like Yisan, Breya, Derevi (does that work against her 1WUG ability?), Scion, Tasigur, Thrasios, Kalemne, Captain Sisay, Ghave, Marath, Prossh, etc. are, it can outright turn a deck off.

    That's true, Linvala is pretty good against most of these decks. However, she doesn't stop Derevi 1WUG ability: Linvala's text says "creatures your opponents control" and that affects creatures on the board, not in the command zone. You need something like Pithing Needle or Phyrexian Revoker to stop the bird from flashing in. Smile
    Posted in: Multiplayer Commander Decklists
  • posted a message on Derevi, the Prison Queen
    Several weeks later I still have no idea what to put in that last slot...

    1) I tried Yisan and he's decent, but very mana hungry. Sure, if I have a Cradle or at least Bloom Tender going, he's pretty good, but if I don't, he slows to a glacial pace. Captain Sisay is somewhat similar, but I can find a Cradle with her first activation if need be, whereas Yisan can find me only a mana dork.

    2) I tried Smuggler's Copter and I'm still not sure what to make of it. At first I was amazed because he won me his debut game almost singlehandedly - one of my opponents dropped T1 Carpet of Flowers, which I had no answer for, but my T2 Copter churned through my deck, discarding Islands and finding non-Island blue sources. On paper it's very good: it flies, it loots, it makes good use of all tiny ground hatebears (Gaddock, Kataki, Glowrider etc.) and spare manadorks. In reality though it's kinda like Tamiyo: not a creature (so it falls under most of my taxes), doesn't work well with my other disruption (Gaddock in Tamiyo's case, Kataki, Null Rod and Stony Silence in Copter's case) and you never tutor for it (technically I can, but I always have better targets for my Enlightened Tutor), so in most of your games you just don't see it at all.

    3) For one week I decided to try something different and I put back Elesh Norn in this slot. My theory was that while it makes my good matchups a bit worse (read: blue and/or black spellslingers with things like Gilded Drake, Bribery, Reanimation, Animate Dead etc.), it makes my bad matchups better (read: creature decks like Prossh, Yisan, Marath or even Zegana), so it's worth a try. Well, my theory lasted about ten seconds: immediately after I cast Elesh Norn for the first time in over a year and passed the turn, Zegana pilot untapped, slammed Gilded Drake on the table and wiped my board. I obviously lost that game and promised myself to never play Elesh Norn in this deck again.

    For now I decided to go back to Yisan, but I'm still looking for better options.
    Posted in: Multiplayer Commander Decklists
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