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The World of Mirrodin II: Darksteel and the Fifth Dawn
 
The Magic Market Index Amonkhet Set Review
 
The Magic Market Index for April 21, 2017
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    posted a message on The Legacy Price Discussion Thread
    Quote from Impossible »
    It might dip a little, but I seriously doubt EDH was the reason he's so expensive. He's a mythic from a set that was hardly opened and he sees fairly regular play in eternal formats. I suspect he'll end up going higher before long, even if he drops a bit in the short term from the ban.
    I don't think he's going to tank and it's going to be impossible to separate the impact the EDH banning had from the metagame changes thanks to the top banning, but I wouldn't underestimate EDH's ability to impact prices. It's more widely played than legacy at this point (at least in my experience) and there is a sizable competitive contingent.

    Long term and barring a reprint, I definitely agree. That would be true regardless of banlist changes though.
    Posted in: Market Street Café
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    posted a message on The Legacy Price Discussion Thread
    Any thoughts on Leovold, Emissary of Trest's price movement post-commander ban? I'd like a third copy and have been unwilling to drop the money at the price he's currently commanding.
    Posted in: Market Street Café
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    posted a message on The Commander Price Discussion Thread
    Quote from SonofaBith »
    Can't find a foil anywhere. Shame, I could have used him in my foiled out Ezuri deck.

    Regular ones have gone from $3.50ish to $16 in the last 45 minutes.
    I checked for foils as soon as I saw the announcement, about 30 minutes after it went live, and they were already gone. If you weren't obsessively reloading the mtgcommander page or extremely lucky in your timing you were pretty much out of luck.
    Posted in: Market Street Café
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    posted a message on Protean Hulk - Now that it is unbanned, what are you going to do with it?
    I'll try it out as a non-combo value creature for a while. After a while I'll probably decide it's not pulling its weight as a 7-drop if I'm not cheating the cost on it and cut it.
    Posted in: Commander (EDH)
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    posted a message on Random Card of the Day - Brutalizer Exarch
    Quote from Xoth »
    It's decent in food tribal.
    5C foodstuff is probably the best place for it.
    Posted in: Commander (EDH)
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    posted a message on Banlist update: Leovold banned, Protean Hulk unbanned.
    Quote from Weebo »
    It's already pretty close to the point where you want to just wait for things to settle if you don't have one yet. As of about an hour after the announcement, I'm seeing them pop up in the $3-5 range occasionally, and they sell out almost as quickly as it happens. Looks like people are a little slower on the $7-8 ones. They're going to be high for a while while the EDH population devours supply.
    Follow up, roughly 30 minutes after the first post: cheap domestic options in the US look like a low price of $15 or so. If you didn't get it already, there's really no reason not to wait a couple weeks and hope the price falls.

    I was lucky enough to pick up a couple for $4 and change. Tried to get a couple spares from there and had no luck on about 10 attempts.
    Posted in: Commander (EDH)
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    posted a message on Banlist update: Leovold banned, Protean Hulk unbanned.
    Quote from Dunharrow »
    Is Protean Hulk's price likely to spike? I don't want to buy one online but I might have to to save money.
    Quote from bfrie »
    there are already very few copies left on tcgplayer. i reccomend just buying one now to not risk it
    Quote from cryogen »

    Most definitely. It's selling out very rapidly online.
    It's already pretty close to the point where you want to just wait for things to settle if you don't have one yet. As of about an hour after the announcement, I'm seeing them pop up in the $3-5 range occasionally, and they sell out almost as quickly as it happens. Looks like people are a little slower on the $7-8 ones. They're going to be high for a while while the EDH population devours supply.
    Posted in: Commander (EDH)
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    posted a message on The Commander Price Discussion Thread
    In what comes as a stunning surprise, Protean Hulk is drying up, particularly foils.
    Posted in: Market Street Café
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    posted a message on Random Card of the Day - Brutalizer Exarch
    Briefly made the cut for Tajic, Blade of the Legion. His biggest downside is a lack of evasion and this is perfect evasion with 0 downside on him. The downside is pretty minor in a lot of EDH metas in my experience. We're currently on a little bit of a burn kick here and it wouldn't be nearly as safe, but I don't pretend that my meta is representative of the broader game.
    Posted in: Commander (EDH)
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    posted a message on [Offtopic] Community Thread
    Quote from Life1ess »
    I'm having a good chuckle about the Gush restriction. How many times can they add and remove this poor guy from the Restricted list? I'm pretty sure when they unrestricted it they even said it would probably get restricted again. Wizards you're so coy.
    Isn't this the third time it's been restricted? Not a vintage player and don't keep track, but someone over at the source mentioned that.
    Posted in: Commander (EDH)
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    posted a message on Sensei Devine top going to become more budget now?
    Quote from Ryperior74 »
    And clearly the mox's from power nine over thron this in vintage due to proxy actually being legal in legacy/vintage
    I have no idea what this line is trying to say but Top is definitely going to get cheaper. Legacy demand was a price driver and there's a recent reprint.

    You can already find them around $11-12 easily. I'd expect a couple dollars cheaper over the next couple weeks as legacy players unload. While they're never going to be bulk rare[/uncommon] $5-6 isn't entirely out of the question.
    Posted in: Commander (EDH)
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    posted a message on Random Card of the Day - Brutalizer Exarch
    Run it in Jaya, which is a grindy, long game deck that wants to hit all its land drops. Basically the perfect home for this card. I haven't really used it anywhere else. I've always wanted to combo it with Stone-Seeder Hierophant for obvious reasons.
    Posted in: Commander (EDH)
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    posted a message on [Offtopic] Community Thread
    Didn't go to the prerelease, but that's par for the course for me and not an exception. Too much of a time commitment for something I'm not particularly interested in.

    Top getting banned in legacy is a huge shakeup for that format. Aside from the brief period with Treasure Cruise and Dig Through Time, miracles has been dominant for years.
    Posted in: Commander (EDH)
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    posted a message on Samut Beats
    I try and avoid repeatable tutors for the most part. I think Sisay is unquestionably a good card with plenty of targets here, but the deck will get stale very quickly if I get several tutors with Sisay (or Yisan) in a given game. Raw card advantage an redundant effects is generally good enough for my group and keeps me interested in the deck longer.

    Boros Charm is probably showing up at some point. I like every mode there and it gives me protection and fits the burn as reach plan. Horizon Canopy is a good call too. Trying to shy away from too many colorless utility lands and keep basic count reasonable, but I think Canopy is a good call regardless of that.
    Posted in: Multiplayer Commander Decklists
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    posted a message on Samut Beats
    Still very, very rough. I want to have a basic idea dump to reference as I refine the idea a little bit, so here we go. Basic theme is hitting people. I'm trying to keep it a little smaller than the usual naya ramp-into-fatties deck because there are better ways to do that.

    DeckMagic OnlineOCTGN2ApprenticeBuy These Cards
    //Commander
    1 Samut, Voice of Dissent

    //Creature
    1 Angel of Jubilation
    1 Archangel of Thune
    1 Baneslayer Angel
    1 Champion of Lambholt
    1 Combat Celebrant
    1 Dong Zhou, the Tyrant
    1 Farhaven Elf
    1 Heartless Hidetsugu
    1 Hero of Bladehold
    1 Inferno Titan
    1 Iroas, God of Victory
    1 Kalonian Hydra
    1 Kamahl, Pit Fighter
    1 Knight of the Reliquary
    1 Legion Loyalist
    1 Linvala, Keeper of Silence
    1 Markov Blademaster
    1 Mirran Crusader
    1 Mother of Runes
    1 Odric, Lunarch Marshal
    1 Ogre Battledriver
    1 Sakura-Tribe Elder
    1 Stormbreath Dragon
    1 Tajic, Blade of the Legion
    1 Thalia, Heretic Cathar
    1 Verdurous Gearhulk
    1 Wild Beastmaster
    1 Wolfir Silverheart
    1 Wood Elves
    1 Xenagos, God of Revels
    1 Yuan Shao, the Indecisive

    //Enchantment
    1 Always Watching
    1 Beastmaster Ascension
    1 Gruul War Chant
    1 War Cadence

    //Instant
    1x Beast Within
    1x Gruul Charm
    1x Lightning Bolt
    1x Master Warcraft
    1x Naya Charm
    1x Order // Chaos
    1x Path to Exile
    1x Price of Progress
    1x Swords to Plowshares
    1x Wear // Tear

    //Sorcery
    1 Acidic Soil
    1 Chain Lightning
    1 Insult // Injury
    1 Farseek
    1 Nature's Lore
    1 Rampant Growth
    1 Three Visits
    1 Treacherous Terrain
    1 Waves of Aggression

    //Artifact
    1x Mage Slayer
    1x O-Naginata
    1x Sunforger

    //Planeswalker
    1x Arlinn Kord
    1x Elspeth, Knight-Errant

    //Land
    1 Arid Mesa
    1 Clifftop Retreat
    1 Command Tower
    1 Fire-Lit Thicket
    6 Forest
    1 Kessig Wolf Run
    6 Mountain
    5 Plains
    1 Plateau
    1 Reflecting Pool
    1 Rootbound Crag
    1 Rugged Prairie
    1 Sacred Foundry
    1 Savannah
    1 Skarrg, the Rage Pits
    1 Slayers' Stronghold
    1 Stomping Ground
    1 Strip Mine
    1 Sunhome, Fortress of the Legion
    1 Sunpetal Grove
    1 Taiga
    1 Temple Garden
    1 Wasteland
    1 Windswept Heath
    1 Wooded Bastion
    1 Wooded Foothills



    The themes are efficient creatures that are generally threatening on their own, burn for reach, and effects that make blocking difficult for my opponents. There are a few obvious problems right off the bat, notable a complete lack of card draw. I'll find a spot for some kind of mass removal (most likely Rolling Earthquake, so it can double as reach). I'm also going to want some kind of protection because I have a lot of threatening, vulnerable creatures. The creature base is largely put together from pet cards, old favorites, and cards I've been looking for excuses to play.
    Posted in: Multiplayer Commander Decklists
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    posted a message on [Offtopic] Community Thread
    Is there a resource for finding groups to play with online?
    I've found a couple people through the playgroup thread on here. Otherwise, a local facebook group or reddit is probably your best bet.
    Posted in: Commander (EDH)
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    posted a message on Samut Naya Human deck help.
    I'm planning on a not-tribal Samut list, but I think I can give some reasonable feedback. I cleaned up your formatting a little bit, because I have trouble following unsorted lists.
    DeckMagic OnlineOCTGN2ApprenticeBuy These Cards
    //Commander
    1 Samut, Voice of Dissent

    //Lands
    7 Forest
    3 Mountain
    7 Plains
    1 Canopy Vista
    1 Cinder Glade
    1 Command Tower
    1 Exotic Orchard
    1 Flooded Strand
    1 Game Trail
    1 Geier Reach Sanitarium
    1 Gruul Turf
    1 Hanweir Battlements
    1 Jungle Shrine
    1 Karplusan Forest
    1 Needle Spires
    1 Rootbound Crag
    1 Selesnya Sanctuary
    1 Sungrass Prairie
    1 Sunpetal Grove
    1 Temple Garden
    1 Temple of Plenty
    1 Temple of the False God
    1 Windbrisk Heights

    //Creatures
    1 Adaptive Automaton
    1 Angel of the Dire Hour
    1 Champion of Lambholt
    1 Champion of the Parish
    1 Containment Priest
    1 Emeria Shepherd
    1 Grand Abolisher
    1 Hanweir Garrison
    1 Hanweir Militia Captain
    1 Herald of War
    1 Heron's Grace Champion
    1 Imposing Sovereign
    1 Jazal Goldmane
    1 Karametra, God of Harvests
    1 Knight of the White Orchid
    1 Kytheon, Hero of Akros
    1 Mentor of the Meek
    1 Metallic Mimic
    1 Mikaeus, the Lunarch
    1 Mirran Crusader
    1 Odric, Lunarch Marshal
    1 Selfless Spirit
    1 Sigarda, Heron's Grace
    1 Sigarda, Host of Herons
    1 Sun Titan
    1 Thalia, Heretic Cathar
    1 Thalia's Lancers
    1 Thalia's Lieutenant
    1 Ulvenwald Tracker
    1 Wild Beastmaster

    //Artifacts
    1 Boros Signet
    1 Commander's Sphere
    1 Door of Destinies
    1 Gruul Signet
    1 Lifecrafter's Bestiary
    1 Marble Diamond
    1 Sensei's Divining Top
    1 Skullclamp
    1 Sol Ring
    1 Sword of the Animist

    //Enchantments
    1 Always Watching
    1 Asceticism
    1 Burgeoning
    1 Cathars' Crusade
    1 Into the Wilds
    1 Shared Triumph

    //Planeswalkers
    1 Ajani Vengeant
    1 Ajani, Caller of the Pride

    //Instants
    1 Aura Mutation
    1 Fated Retribution
    1 Heroic Intervention
    1 Krosan Grip
    1 Signal the Clans
    1 Swords to Plowshares
    1 Sylvan Reclamation

    //Sorceries
    1 Creeping Renaissance
    1 Decimate
    1 Fumigate
    1 Increasing Devotion
    1 Rishkar's Expertise
    1 Terminus
    1 Wrath of God

    My immediate thought is that it looks like you'll have some trouble closing out games on a stalled board. You can swarm pretty well, but you have only one way to give that swarm evasion (Odric) and it's not even a sure thing. Consider something like Kamahl, Fist of Krosa, Iroas, God of Victory, Gruul War Chant, or even some single shot options like Naya Charm or Master Warcraft. The biggest tribal card you're missing in red for an aggressive deck is Shared Animosity, which takes some of the burden off of evasion for getting in damage. Kamahl, Pit Fighter isn't really a staple card and has some definite downsides, but he's a human who plays nicely with Samut's untap. Two free bolts a turn is nothing to scoff at.

    Manabase looks OK. You have a pretty good balance of colored sources. Be careful about how many lands you have coming in tapped. Tempo is important to more aggressive EDH decks because you want to get in some early hits and a start like cipt land → bounceland just murders that. You should have enough ramp to hit 1-2 pieces reliably on top of land drops, which is good. Maybe replace Marble Diamond with Selesnya Signet for additional color fixing. You can also run Farseek/Rampant Growth to good effect. If you want a better chance at quickly hitting your more expensive cards, Cultivate, Kodama's Reach, and the new Harvest Season are all solid cards.

    I would personally run a little more card draw, probably something that takes advantage of going wide like Shamanic Revelation or reliable like Harmonize. The draw you do have is solid, I just like having too many cards over too few cards.

    For cuts, I haven't had particular success with either Ajani or Into the Wilds. I might try and cut one of the 7 drops for something in the 4 range, otherwise your curve is pretty reasonable for an EDH deck. Burgeoning is a great card that you might not be able to support well without a little more draw. I think you can go down a wrath or two, seeing as you generally want to be the one applying creature pressure. Replacing a couple with spot removal (Beast Within is conspicuously absent) or burn like Comet Storm can help you be a little more selective in answering threats.

    Looks good overall. There are definitely some places you can tweak it, which is true of virtually every EDH deck out there.
    Posted in: Multiplayer Commander Decklists
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    posted a message on Midrange Naya beaters
    Quote from XeroxedFool »
    I like Aurelia, the Warleader. It kinda tops the curve but it obviously hits pretty hard.

    Stormbreath Dragon is a sweet beater with some built in reach and flood protection.

    Knight of the Reliquary is versatile and potentially huge in a deck like this. Goes well with Samut too.

    Titania, Protector of Argoth is one of my favorite midrange creatures in the format.

    I like Xenagos, God of Revels and Dragonlord Dromoka.
    I hadn't thought about KotR, despite it being a regular feature in the kinds of decks I'm using for inspiration. Plenty of good utility lands to grab for this type of deck too. How much are you supporting Titania? Anything beyond the usual suite of fetches and Strip Mines?

    Quote from Hungerstriker »
    I used to have a Gahiji, Honored One double strike tribal deck. Let's see...

    Voice of Resurgence has always been pretty excellent for me in commander.

    Prophetic Flamespeaker carries equipment well.

    Markov Blademaster is surprisingly deadly when you can give it evasion.

    Mother of Runes is great with any of these.

    Elspeth, Knight Errant isn't technically a creature, but the +3/+3 and flying is great with any double striker, especially Samut. Arlinn Kord and Ajani Steadfast have similar creature-buffing abilities.

    Rite of the Raging Storm, maybe?
    Blademaster is one of the ones that's for sure going in. She's a pet card that slips into most of my even marginally aggressive red decks. How often do you find yourself getting Voice tokens from spells and not death?

    Quote from Kisoji »
    Baneslayer Angel and though not a creature, Homeward Path for when people try to take your awesome beaters.
    Baneslayer would fit here and I don't take a whole lot of convincing. I'm not sure why I don't run her more often.
    Posted in: Commander (EDH)
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    posted a message on Midrange Naya beaters
    Years ago, I built a Naya beats deck with no particular theme aside from efficient creatures supported by equipment. It initially ran Mayael the Anima despite having almost 0 targets for her ability and later Johan, who was arguably the best choice at the time (there's an argument for Uril or Rith but they both look for particular things to be used effectively). We've gotten a couple better options since then, but Samut, Voice of Dissent fits the idea better than any of them and I want to revisit it.

    I'm looking for creatures in the 3-5 CMC range that are threatening on their own and game winning in multiples. Things like Hero of Bladehold, Archangel of Thune, or Kalonian Hydra that come down and are dangerous without a whole lot of other support. Think an EDH version of big zoo. Not having a particular theme makes it difficult to search and I'm sure there are some gems out there, so I'm coming to you all for ideas.
    Posted in: Commander (EDH)
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    posted a message on Staples Binder Guide
    I enjoy building more than tuning for the most part and don't really have strong connections to individual decks. That either means spending a ton of money on cards and sleeves or spending a ton of time deconstructing decks and resleeving cards. I use some of the same cards repeatedly, but they're typically pet cards more than staples (e.g. Markov Blademaster or Pristine Angel). Pooling my collection into a box saves time on deckbuilding, lets me build whenever I feel like it, and lets me pick up cards I otherwise wouldn't have. If I'm putting together a deck that really benefits from Yuan Shao, the Indecisive, it's a lot easier to justify if a) that's the only card I have to buy for the deck and b) I'll undoubtedly find another place for it sometime down the line.

    It also takes a lot of the pressure off of deckbuilding in a way similar to proxies. I can build around stupid concepts and outlandish ideas without having to commit anything beyond time. If the deck doesn't work, I probably didn't buy anything for it. If it does work I'll either pick up a couple things to improve it and tune it a little, or I can pull it apart and keep it in mind for future deckbuilding. It's not a good system for everyone, but it was the smartest MtG choice I've made in years for what i want out of the game.
    Posted in: Commander (EDH)
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    posted a message on How des a dredge/Graveyard deck beat Leyline
    By sideboarding in Gemstone Caverns, and knowing that since you won game one, game two makes you second player so your trigger to put Caverns play goes on the stack but resolves before their trigger to put leylines into play and then you just stilfe or whatever. There's a Chancellor from NPH that gives you a green if you're feeling boring.
    Cute, but it doesn't work. Starting the game with something in play doesn't involve any triggered abilities. You just put cards into play (CR 103.5). There's the additional issue of no one getting priority before the game starts but it's kind of a moot point.
    Posted in: Legacy (Type 1.5)
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    posted a message on [[Official]] Unreleased and New Card Discussion
    That's the naya general I've been waiting for for years. Decent creature, doesn't force a particular strategy, and can still be built around. Keyword soup is more or less my favorite type of creature, too. I was thinking of building the minotaur and that's definitely being put on hold now.
    Posted in: Commander (EDH)
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    posted a message on Modern Amonket discussion
    Quote from sss123 »
    My understanding is Curator trigger ability(Scry 1) will trigger when you do the cycle (cycle a card other than Curator for sure), which means when you complete the whole cycle action(discard a cycleable card and draw a card).

    Therefore, yoh cannot put Curator trigger ability above the cycle on the stack.
    Then your understanding is incorrect. This is all well defined by the rules. Cycling is an activated ability. When you activate it, you pay costs and put it on the stack (CR 602.2). This causes Curator to trigger. Triggered abilities go on the stack the next time a player would get priority (CR 603.3). Objects on the stack resolve when each player has passed priority in succession (CR 405.5), which necessarily happens after any triggered abilities are placed on the stack. All of that means that Curator's scry 1 trigger always ends up on the stack above the card draw from cycling, resolving first.
    Posted in: Modern
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    posted a message on Modern Amonket discussion
    Quote from sss123 »
    Quote from thewrush »
    Curator of Mysteries Do you get to scry 1 before you draw from cycle?
    No.
    Cycle means "discard a card" + " draw a card".
    This is incorrect, assuming the question is about cycling something when Curator is on board and not about cycling Curator. Abilities triggering from cycling resolve before the card draw from cycling. You activate a cycling ability (paying costs), Curator triggers, and the scry 1 goes on the stack above the cycle.
    Posted in: Modern
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    posted a message on Battle for Zendikar duals vs Amonkhet duals?
    Depends heavily on basic counts and whether you have any way to interact with the cycling. If you're running heavy on cards like Tithe or are very basic light, cyclers are better. If you're just looking for fixing and running plenty of basics and/or basic ramp, tangos are better. I don't think either group is an autoinclude if you already have duals/shocks/fetches. I'd place them behind checks and filters as well, which means I'm only expecting to put them into lists that takes advantage of higher numbers of basic typed duals (3+ colored ramps decks) or lists that can take advantage of cycling lands with things like Life from the Loam packages. I'll probably revisit that if/when we get enemy colored versions.
    Posted in: Commander (EDH)
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    posted a message on [[Official]] Unreleased and New Card Discussion
    Quote from CTNC »
    I'm guessing that Soldier Tribal is the only kind of Token Commander that this is a new effect for.
    Artifact token strategies got a lot of love in the last block and this supports those. RW and BW swarm strategies frequently go token heavy. It's a decent pick for Daxos the Returned. Heliod, God of the Sun, Oketra the True, and Kemba, Kha Regent are all reasonable commander choices that use tokens heavily. While green has the best token support it's far from the only color that regularly uses tokens. This is a nice pickup for a lot of white decks.
    Posted in: Commander (EDH)
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    posted a message on What would you design?
    Quote from enigma_b »
    Not exactly true, nwo affects common and uncommon(of which the Tainted Cycle is uncommon).

    It is also known that since the start of his NWO, many strategies have been nurfed because Counters, Discards, Land Destruction and Prison cards are hardly ever printed at any rarity. If they are, it's usually at rare or with an over inflated cmc, sometimes both.
    For a policy that impacts as many cards as it does, NWO is widely misunderstood. NWO is about complexity at common and nothing else. Counterspell fits under NWO. Stone Rain fits under NWO. They don't use keywords, have a small amount of text, don't contribute to complicated board states, and are straightforward effects. The reason that those carsd aren't reprinted is power level and WotC market research showing that players don't enjoy the effect. It has nothing to do with NWO. NWO also doesn't affect uncommons, aside from allowing more complexity there. See this quote:
    The theory behind New World Order was this: we have to be very careful about what we put at common. We had to redraw the line for what level of complexity was acceptable. We were allowed some complexity at common, but less than we had used in the past, which meant it was a resource that had to be carefully managed.

    To offset the shift of complexity, New World Order allowed higher rarities, especially uncommon, to tick up in complexity. The goal wasn't to remove complexity, but to shift where it was positioned in the game. The idea was that by moving where it sat, we lessened it for the players who needed it lessened and kept it there for the experienced players who wanted it.
    Posted in: Custom Card Creation
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    posted a message on [[Official]] Unreleased and New Card Discussion
    Neheb, the Worthy seems like it's a few blocks out of place and is a nice new option. Minotaurs already have a ton of tribal support considering the number of creatures in the tribe. If there are a few decently playable ones here, I could see a fun aggressive discard deck. Warrior typing has some upside as well.

    Even outside of minotaur tribal, the combat damage trigger is solid and scales nicely into multiplayer games. I don't think we've seen that particular take on a spectre yet.
    Posted in: Commander (EDH)
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    posted a message on [[Primer]] Mono-R Control with Jaya Ballard!
    I'm still optimistic about the possibility of something decent. There's a lot of cycling/ discard and GY support so far, which line up with Jaya much better than red does in most sets. Insult to Injury is borderline playable as a low risk damage doubler with some utility out of the GY. Oracle's Vault has some potential. Mono-R has gotten enough card advantage tools now that we no longer need to jam everything that even resembles it, so it's not a sure thing, but the upside of free casts later on isn't nothing.

    I do like Ensnaring Bridge for the reasons Zygous mentioned. Problem creatures for Jaya tend to be large. Between Jaya's Inferno and discard costs, there's a lot of natural synergy for Bridge. I wish the Stronghold version had a foil printing though. Masterpiece is alright, but not my favorite.
    Posted in: Multiplayer Commander Decklists
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    posted a message on Crazy Plays in EDH.
    You're not wrong, but Rafiq wasn't out at the time. People don't really like him staying on the table.
    Posted in: Commander (EDH)
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    posted a message on Crazy Plays in EDH.
    I swung for 42 and gained 84 life with a Birds of Paradise last night. Rafiq enchantress with a few lucky draws and Sovereigns of Lost Alara gave me Birds enchanted with Ancestral Mask, Sage's Reverie, Ethereal Armor, Armadillo Cloak, and Unflinching Courage. Add in a six other enchantments and a couple of exalted triggers for the most lethal mana dork I've ever played.
    Posted in: Commander (EDH)
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    posted a message on Bookkeeping problems
    Quote from Underhill83 »
    Maybe LouCypher used some other decks in the meanwhile, since he opened the thread 3 years ago.
    But thanks to richard_trollope for suggesting Excel or other software to keep track of the life total. I would probably settle with pen and paper...
    Pen and paper (or tablet, in my case) is the reason I would want more lumped numbers. Rolling a spindown around is quick. Marking 8 1-point increment life changes in a turn runs me out of space really quickly. I know from experience, because I really like grindy BWx decks with incremental life changes. It does get to be a pain.

    Quote from LouCypher »
    Yea, kinda fun to see a thread about a deck I retired about 2 years ago pop back up again. Gotta love it when that happens.
    It's always kind of interesting to see the old threads pop up and see how opinions have changed, especially when it's not just asking for deck feedback or the like.
    Posted in: Commander (EDH)
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    posted a message on [[Official]] Unreleased and New Card Discussion
    As Foretold looks like a fun card. Harder to abuse than some of the other cost cheating options, but definitely a powerful effect at 3 CMC.

    I really like Cut to Ribbons too. Early removal, late reach. That's a very powerful card.
    Posted in: Commander (EDH)
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    posted a message on [[Official]] Unreleased and New Card Discussion
    New Gideon is probably a regular feature in Kytheon, Hero of Akros lists. I'm not a big fan unless you're using the emblem to do something proactive.

    The trials in general are nice. Basically just alternate typed sorceries. I'll find room for those in decks from time to time.
    Posted in: Commander (EDH)
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    posted a message on Random Card of the Day - Brutalizer Exarch
    I got this guy out of whichever starter deck he was in in Urza's. I think it also had Rayne, Academy Chancellor. I've never found a place for him in EDH thanks to the usual issues with auras despite always liking the card. Rayne sees pretty regular use for me though.
    Posted in: Commander (EDH)
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    posted a message on [Offtopic] Community Thread
    Quote from Hermes_ »
    This what I currently see with the current set up and yeah we did lose the link at the bottom
    My main monitor is 1920x1080. Taskbar is on the right, so about 1860 pixels of that is chrome. About 330 pixels of that on on each side of the forum is empty space - over 1/3 of the window. I'm not anti-new things and already got rid of the article links I'll never click at the top of the page, but the wasted space bugs me a little. Losing the bottom link is the more egregious offense. Didn't they take that away and replace it once already?
    Posted in: Commander (EDH)
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    posted a message on Random Card of the Day - Brutalizer Exarch
    Five mana for four evasive bodies is respectable. Not being able to get that value and then recur it hurts it somewhat, especially in BW lists, which tend to be recursion heavy in my experience. It should still probably see more play than it does, honestly. I'm not sure why I don't consider it more often.
    Posted in: Commander (EDH)
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    posted a message on [Offtopic] Community Thread
    Current one shrinks everything by default which is worse in my opinion, but to each their own.

    edit: Did we lose a link to return to the current subforum at the bottom of the page, or am I just fondly remembering the times we did have that?
    Posted in: Commander (EDH)
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    posted a message on [Offtopic] Community Thread
    New MTGS layout wastes an impressive amount of screen space.
    Posted in: Commander (EDH)
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    posted a message on What got you started in EDH?
    Found it on the internet around Alara and put a deck together to have something in addition to standard and limited. Cashed out of standard when I moved after college, and the population in San Diego is big to support a lot of EDH only players, so I stuck with that. It fits a lot better with what I want out of the game, too. I've never been and will never been a grinder. Anything more competitive than legacy weeklies doesn't hold a whole lot of appeal to me and EDH fills that need nicely.
    Posted in: Commander (EDH)
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    posted a message on [[Official]] Unreleased and New Card Discussion
    Quote from Life1ess »
    I think they look ridiculous, but I'm not really the target market for chase cards like this.
    I'm part of the target market and I think they look atrocious.
    Posted in: Commander (EDH)
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    posted a message on [Offtopic] Community Thread
    Typically, yes. My deck is really weird though and can't activate abilities of permanents whenever it casts spells that need to not be countered. As such, it really needs the static ability.
    What are you doing with that kind of restriction?
    Posted in: Commander (EDH)
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    posted a message on Alternatives to expensive cards
    Quote from Schutzwald »
    Cryptic Command becomes Contradict!


    ... ok maybe not
    Maybe if Dismiss is still too expensive, somehow?
    Posted in: Commander (EDH)
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    posted a message on [Offtopic] Community Thread
    I'd have wanted it if it had made all spells uncounterable and not just creature spells. Currently, there's nothing in Magic that does that. There's a slew of cards that make only creature spells uncounterable (Gaea's Herald, Leyline of Lifeforce, Surrak Dragonclaw) and Sphinx of the Final Word makes instants and sorceries uncounterable, but that's it. The next closest cards are Determined, which makes spells uncounterable that turn only, and Vexing Shusher, which is an activated ability. There's just no permanent in Magic with the static ability "Spells you control can't be countered."
    Vexing Shusher might as well say that as long as you have a mana up. I've never seen someone play a counter into a live Shusher.
    Posted in: Commander (EDH)
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    posted a message on [[Official]] Unreleased and New Card Discussion
    Quote from Lithl »
    Always-etb-tapped makes me not-a-fan.
    I've run the single color cycling lands in a couple decks, usually for a Loam engine. These are strict upgrades over the Saga ones and kind of lateral to the Onslaught ones. I'm more likely to play one or two of these than a lot of the dual land cycles that get released.
    Posted in: Commander (EDH)
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    posted a message on Alternatives to expensive cards
    Quote from ConstantMists »
    Also if your deck really wants a land you can't afford, but others in your playgroup use try Thespian's Stage. It isn't expensive and at worst you probably get a Command Tower out of it. At best you get a Cavern of Souls or a Cabal Coffers or a Gaea's Cradle.
    Just be aware that copying Cavern of Souls with Thespian's Stage doesn't do anything but change the name of the land outside of a couple very, very fringe cases. Stage doesn't enter as a copy of Cavern so you never choose a creature type and the choice isn't a copiable value.

    Quote from blkh »
    Come on people, let it continue.
    Time Walk becomes Time Warp
    Walk is banned and Warp is only marginally less expensive than Damnation. Wouldn't Time WarpWalk the Aeons be a better one?
    Posted in: Commander (EDH)
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    posted a message on [[Official]] Unreleased and New Card Discussion
    Quote from Hermes_ »
    wow....Prowling Serpopard I foresee a discussion regarding banning it happening.....
    Seriously? It's basically a buffer, uncounterable Gaea's Herald - a card I don't think I've ever seen played, definitely not outside of elf tribal. Marginally improved stats are probably outweighed by the loss of elf typing and most decks that want this effect are probably not heavy on countermagic themselves, so the lack of symmetry isn't important. This isn't even as good as Vexing Shusher unless you play exclusively creatures.

    It's not a bad card but it's a far cry from a banworthy card. Maybe we try and get through the spoiler season without speculating about banning anything marginally playable?
    Posted in: Commander (EDH)
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    posted a message on [Offtopic] Community Thread
    Quote from Stax4Lyfe »
    Omg Weebo, your avatar is so cute
    Thanks! It's a coal weebo from Magi Nation (old card game). It's a variant on the original weebo, which was a little mushroom creature. There's another user on here named Weebos, so we both ended up with some variant of the original for avatars after people kept getting confused.
    Posted in: Commander (EDH)
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    posted a message on Are Invocations equal to gold borders in tourney play?
    Quote from Shea_0 »
    Since the gold leaf on the top of the invocations wraps around the edge of the card, the only means of making them "unidentifialble" or "unmarked" for play is by using a card sleeve.
    This is apparently not the case. See this tweet. We'll see if the general masses agree with this once the cards are in wider distribution, but this is the best source we have at this point.

    Quote from Shea_0 »
    Well if all it takes for invocations to be tourney legal is a card sleeve, then I ask why not apply this same logic and get rid of the requirement for black frames and just make the rules more specific about which sets exactly are not allowed for tournament play.
    The rules are already very specific about which cards are allowed for tournament play. Sets are listed pretty specifically and the list is updated with each new set release. See MTR 6.x.

    Here's the confirmation from Tabak that there will be a rules change to allow these in tournament play.
    Posted in: Magic General
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    posted a message on [Offtopic] Community Thread
    Quote from Stax4Lyfe »
    Sup peeps, kind of new here and just got into EDH, so I thought the best place to go was the one that was specifically NOT about EDH

    Hi
    That's definitely the right way to approach the format.
    Posted in: Commander (EDH)
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    posted a message on Are Invocations equal to gold borders in tourney play?
    From what we've seen, these don't have black or white borders and are currently illegal for tournament play (MTR 3.3). Like LimDul79 said above, there's certainly going to be some kind of update to allow these for tournament play.
    Posted in: Magic General
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    posted a message on [Offtopic] Community Thread
    Quote from Hermes_ »
    What's the issue about them being tournament legal?
    They don't have black or white borders.
    Posted in: Commander (EDH)
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    posted a message on [Offtopic] Community Thread
    Quote from Life1ess »
    Sweet Jesus those Amonkhet masterpiece edition Force of Wills are going to be expensive.
    They're still going to be significantly cheaper than EMA foils, if the legacy players I know are any indication.

    Amonkhet masterpieces are some truly ugly cardstock. The art is nice, but the border and the card name/type line font are atrocious. They're also going to have to force a rules change seeing as they're not currently legal for tournament play.
    Posted in: Commander (EDH)
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    posted a message on 5 Color Generals: Goodstuff or Legit?
    Quote from LouCypher »
    Yo, serious question, always wanted to know this. How did you find this topic, and once you did find it, how did you not see it hasn't seen posts in almost 6 years time?
    I usually assume google and new user respectively. Search for something, forum thread pops up, you have something to say, so you make an account and post. If you're not a forum regular, it's easy to miss the time stamp.
    Posted in: Commander (EDH)
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    posted a message on Well, how was YOUR box? (MM17 Edition)
    Drafted my box last night. Standouts were Snapcaster, Misty, Damnation, Goblin Guide, then a few more things in the $5-7 range. Other mythics were PiF and Entreat, foil rares were Wort, the Raidmother and Zealous Conscripts. One Path, one Inquisition. Lost value on it overall, but that's not really a surprise and the draft was a lot of fun.
    Posted in: Magic General
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    posted a message on [Offtopic] Community Thread
    Quote from JWK »
    Aside from potential value, MM 2017 is indeed a very fun set to draft. Up there with Innistrad, and just behind the first Conspiracy set in terms of being great to draft, in my opinion. They did good with this one.
    How did the second Conspiracy compare to the first? I drafted the first one a few times but never got around to the second. Half searching for another box for a draft night, because that was a nice change of pace from the usual EDH night.
    Posted in: Commander (EDH)
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    posted a message on [[Primer]] Mono-R Control with Jaya Ballard!
    "2, T: Draw a card (kind of)" is still a decent effect. It's not like the first ability is doing nothing for you. That kind of card advantage is what red has been getting for a few years now, and those cards have been in and out of the deck. Eventually turning into acceleration on top of card advantage is nice upside. It would have been a snap include a couple years ago. There may be enough good options to not need it by now.
    Posted in: Multiplayer Commander Decklists
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    posted a message on Magic Set Sales Statistics?
    They haven't released that information for many years. There's some information out there for sets maybe as far up as Urza's, but I haven't found anything more recent and even that wasn't officially confirmed by WotC.
    Posted in: Magic General
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    posted a message on [Offtopic] Community Thread
    Drafted my MM17 box. Notable pulls were Snapcaster, Misty, Damnation, Goblin Guide, and a few other assorted little things. Ended up with a super low to the ground naya build featuring 5x Avacyn's Pilgrim and 3x Fists of Ironwood. One game involved leading on Pilgrim, then following with Fists + Pilgrim for the next three turns. Tons of fun to draft.
    Posted in: Commander (EDH)
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    posted a message on Mazirek Theorycrafting
    Quote from Gashnaw »
    I think you need 2 persist creatures.
    -Sac
    -All crature get +1/+1
    -Perist takes effect.
    You're wrong. Both Mazirek and persist trigger at the same time. You control both triggers, so you stack them how you want. Put Mazirek on the stack followed by persist and your persist creature is back on board by the time Mazirek's trigger resolves.
    Posted in: Commander (EDH)
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    posted a message on Post your pimp decks here!
    That's fair. It's unusual to see any number of fetches besides 3 or 7 in a three color deck (aside from budget concerns, which are obviously not at play here) so I was curious.
    Posted in: Commander (EDH)
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    posted a message on Wanting to Build Golgari
    Quote from Gashnaw »
    While it is not a major question. Would Reyhan + Mickey + Sac outlet work? Undying brings creature back with a +1/+1. Sac. Move counter to another creature, no counters, undying brings it back. Or would it see the counter first prevnting undying from being amazing?
    Doesn't work for multiple reasons. Reyhan doesn't actually move counters around, even if that's how people are likely to play in practice. She sees a creature with counters die then her triggered ability puts an equal number of counters on a creature. In addition, the intervening if in undying's trigger just looks to see if an undying creature had one or more +1/+1 counters when it died, not whether it has any while in the GY (which is a feat on its own, seeing as Skullbriar is the only creature in the game that can currently do that). Even if you could somehow move the counters around, it would have to happen before the creature died.
    Posted in: Commander (EDH)
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    posted a message on [[Primer]] Mono-R Control with Jaya Ballard!
    Quote from MuzzleMuffin »
    Little off topic, but I am definitely excited for the enemy fetches reprint in MM17. Can finally grab that Arid Mesa and Scalding Tarn for the Crucible of Worlds synergy.
    That's one of those engines that feels so good when it gets going. Crucible is already really solid here, which maybe makes it easier to justify spending on fetches for a mono-colored deck?

    I'm optimistic about Amonkhet. We know cycling is coming back and there's already a spoiled card that triggers on discarding. That design space is definitely interesting for Jaya.
    Posted in: Multiplayer Commander Decklists
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    posted a message on Post your pimp decks here!
    Looks nice. I went top to bottom and was shaking my head about foiling without picking up duals, but your reserved/unfoilable section came through.

    Any reason for not including Polluted Delta or Flooded Strand?
    Posted in: Commander (EDH)
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    posted a message on [Offtopic] Community Thread
    Quote from Darcykun »
    Should probably stop while you're on a ahead, these boxes have been crazy high variance. Seems like yours was very good though, congrats.
    I got to draft two boxes my friends bought (the best way to play limited haha) and we saw 3 fetches total, no Goyf or Snappy. One guy got a Lilly and there were a smattering of ~$10 cards but that was it.
    Since I didn't have any investment I got to try some weird things with the limited format, I ended up with a deck with 5 Avacyn's Pilgrim that I really enjoyed. It was so all in that I either won on like, turn 4 or just straight lost the game. But it was a fun ride.
    I'm doing this with my box Tuesday. Everyone playing is primarily an EDH player who rarely drafts so I'm expecting it to be a bizarre collection of terrible decks. I'm looking forward to it a lot. I'm hoping for more value than either of those boxes, but I also already have everything of value in the set so it's just for trading/selling anyways.

    In the continuing saga of how I'm wasting my money this month, I've upgraded my computer's GPU and added a liquid cooling system so I can run the new Mass Effect better. This is what happens when you give a nerd who likes electronics and always wanted a really nice computer growing up a decent job a decent job.
    Posted in: Commander (EDH)
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    posted a message on Dispersal Shield
    Depends on your group. If you see games end with Tooth and Nail or Craterhoof Behemoth on a regular basis, this is not reliable enough to stop them. If you're just trying to protect a combo or win con from disruption/removal, this is probably solid.
    Posted in: Commander (EDH)
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    posted a message on Random Card of the Day - Brutalizer Exarch
    Decent cantrip for GY focused decks. Worse than other options basically everywhere else.

    Quote from LouCypher »
    Still can't talk. Still Andromeda.
    Me too.
    Posted in: Commander (EDH)
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    posted a message on Random Card of the Day - Brutalizer Exarch
    I'm sure there's a good place for it. It's fairly efficient and effectively gives tokens/weenies haste and a buff. That's not enough for most decks, but this is one of the vehicles I can see being played with some success.

    There's also the obvious answer of King Macar, the Gold-Cursed, where a lot of the vehicles are snap includes.
    Posted in: Commander (EDH)
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    posted a message on [Offtopic] Community Thread
    Went to Target to buy toothpaste and parchment paper. Ended up impulse buying a 55" UHD TV.
    Posted in: Commander (EDH)
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    posted a message on What lands are people feeling/playing with?
    For legacy, some EDH, and the occasional foray into modern I use Euro lands, specifically these 5
    For my Jaya list, I currently use Snow-Covered Mountains but am considering jumping over to this (mostly so I can foil them out while keeping an art I like)
    Current:
    Planned:
    For other EDH decks, it's mostly Snow-Covered or ZEN full arts. I'm less picky about those because they don't stay around all that long.
    Posted in: Magic General
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    posted a message on Searching for Non-Basic Lands to ETB via Non-Creatures
    Much more color restrictive than most of the options mentioned so far, but Wargate is a solid land tutor (with many other uses).
    Posted in: Commander (EDH)
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    posted a message on Do high priced cards ever drop to reasonable prices?
    Quote from FTW1987 »
    The Reserved List protects against that too. Not only can these cards never be reprinted, but Wizards cannot print new cards that makes them obsolete, to prevent their market value from declining for collectors.
    Source? I've never heard that before and it's not part of the reprint policy. They won't print functionally identical cards and have doubled down on that, but I have seen anything that prohibits better cards. Not trying to call you out, trying to make sure I have a complete picture of WotC communications on the RL.

    Regardless of that particular policy, I can't see them ever printing something that obsoletes Workshop so I wouldn't hold your breath either way.
    Posted in: Casual & Related Formats
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    posted a message on What's the Point?/In It Just to Get A Win
    Quote from ArbitersHeir »
    There is a quote in Christopher Nolans The Dark Knight. In reference to the joker he says some men just want to see the world burn. That same saying applies to uber competetive types you seek to understand. They could care less who likes them or not. They simply want the whole table to be smashed as early as possible. The reasoning is simple they simply enjoy winning and doing it so quickly they get that shock factor. Now in my opinion they simply enjoy pissing other people off. I also believe that it may or may not be linked to that competition edge they have. I have played against many of these types. I have nothing against them anymore. I used to hate playing them even avoid it. Then I just realized if I want to play at LGS locally I need answers. So I streamlined my blue and white control deck to handle most threats. While its not topshelf it certainly can hold it owns against these types. These players aren't going to change its simply against there nature. They want the shock and awe. You can avoid them or simply beat them at there own game. As a long time EDH player I understand your questions. Though lately I've seen less of these decks and more a push to return to casual decks. So I hope it helps you see why they play that style. Good luck!
    You seem to be confusing competitive players and ********s, which can be found in the casual parts of the playerbase too. The general consensus that I've seen from competitive players is that stomping an unprepared table isn't fun for them either. You can find several posts in this thread saying as much.
    Posted in: Commander (EDH)
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    posted a message on What's the Point?/In It Just to Get A Win
    Quote from VaultTechy »
    There's kind of a convenient cycle that toxic EDH players get to spin through when it comes to stuff like this, and I actually just finished discussing it last night. If they get a quick, easy win then they're all "tch, nothin personnel kid.." but if they get blown out, they ride the high road of "you're such a tryhard!! EDH is meant to just be fun!" and thusly they get to dodge actually learning and developing as a player because they've got a 1-2 combo of "you're the problem here"

    Any cards that aren't on the banlist are legal for a reason - if they've got Armageddon or Winter Orb then you should have ample access to counters and removal to keep yourself in the game. Some games you won't draw into an answer and that's fine, but if a trend of losses establishes itself then it can't be blamed on luck, tryhards, cheese cards, RNGesus or the day of the week anymore - it's time to either get better or play tables that are of a similar skill level.

    Just as it would be toxic to bring Legacy Miracles down to a learn-to-play night and mop up kids, it's also toxic to take a casual deck and skillset, sit at a table with people who play competitively, and expect them to all slow down so you get to keep up. This guy bought the cards, studied the strats, wrote the list, practiced and earned every bit of the wins he's getting, but he's supposed to, what, keep Orb in his hand and take hits because you don't like losing?

    I know it's not a nice opinion but it's, in my opinion, a fair one.
    Equating what cards you like to play with skill is disingenuous and the "anything legal is fair" mindset has never been a universal one. It's possible to have a good understanding of the game, solid skills, and a deep card pool without playing competitively. That's doubly true for a format like EDH, which was created by a group of judges and remains a predominately casual format. Playing competitively is not wrong and neither is not wanting your EDH games to be full of prison elements, regardless of skill level or resources.

    As an aside, "bought the cards" has virtually nothing to do with skill. If your group is full of people playing draft chaff and you buy storm, you're probably going to win more. It doesn't magically make you better at the game. Having access to more cards != more skilled.
    Posted in: Commander (EDH)
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    posted a message on What's the Point?/In It Just to Get A Win
    Quote from Ashmit »
    Is this fun for some?
    Yes.

    I'm cutting your post way down because this is really what it boils down to. Some people enjoy playing very cutthroat games of EDH. Optimizing a 100 card singleton deck to consistently win quickly and through a multiplyer game's worth of disruption is a different kind of challenge than doing the same for a 60 card deck, either duel or multiplayer. Slow build ups to battlecruiser boardstates don't appeal to everyone just like trying to combo out through three players worth of disruption doesn't appeal to everyone. If they're enjoying those games and it's a social experience, that's as within the spirit of EDH as a game of smashing 7-drops together. It's only problematic when either of those groups is trying to force their playstyle on a group that sees it differently.

    I'm not part of that crowd so we don't play together. They wouldn't necessarily enjoy the kinds of games I'm looking for when I sit down to play EDH and I'm not interested in what they want. The format is big enough that both groups can coexist.
    Posted in: Commander (EDH)
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