Sorry, yeah should have mentioned that I only play online. I've also been really busy lately so sort of out of the loop. I remembered that M11 is out on paper after my OP.
I also haven't read the set, so it's not really fair to judge it much before doing that. I'm reading it now...
From more experienced players, I would like to hear opinions of what you expect M11 draft to be like. I haven't really drafted a core set before, but I'm thinking of drafting this one. On the other hand, I'm also thinking of sticking to RoE. (I draft like once a week, and RoE is pretty fun, even though I wouldn't mind something new.)
It seems to me like it's very straightforward. Removal, evasion...I don't know, any other factors at work here? Probably a lot of looking to draw your bombs to make big impacts on the game. Not so much in the way of synergy outside of maybe "I just removed your creature, so now my creature can hit you." and I dunno, swamps synergizing with Corrupt maybe.
Is that accurate? Because if it is, it doesn't sound very interesting.
I can see Imp or Wilds. If it were just me I would be picking Imp based on my preference, but I think I may be undervaluing Wilds. I rarely end up with fixing in RoE drafts, and sometimes end up wishing I had it.
I don't want to enter blue for a (usually) defensive dude.
Nifty! I'm getting ready for a 2HG draft in a week or so and I've been thinking of maybe walling up behind Soulbound Guardians and casting huge Eldrazi.
not sure what comparison with gloomhunter is for...that card is a crap playable in many kinds of decks
Totally disagree. In my experience most of the black commons have trouble getting in. They usually hold back ground attackers but that's about it apart from Bloodthrone with support or max leveled levellers. When they attack they often just trade with something that took less of a mana investment. I think throwing up an inexpensive flyer is good for many black decks (or BG/BR).
I mean, sure it's not spectacular, but I think it's often very good, not just a "crap playable".
edit: anyway, the comparison was because Gloomhunter is a worse card with the same base numbers, but lately I've seen it affect games more than Dawnglare - a lot more. Probably just luck I guess. I agree with the assessments of Dawnglare above, esp. about how you can often save your removal against white.
My first 3 RoE drafts were all very largely affected by this guy, whether on my side or my opponents'. Lately, I haven't seen him(her?) do anything. I mean, she eats removal pretty quickly, which is a pretty good effect for a 3-drop, but it's often removal that you get pretty good value out of (Vendetta only does 1 damage, Forked Bolt can hit something else too, Staggershock rebounds, Last Kiss isn't a dead card, Spawning Breath makes you smile, etc.) I can't remember the last time I saw her ability activated.
On the contrary, Gloomhunter seems to always affect the game in a pretty significant way every time I see him, because no one wants to play removal on the guy. He almost always gets in 6 damage while ignoring the ground war, holds air attackers back or trades with them, or trades with an important ground attacker. He's great.
Is this profound, or just kind of the way things work? Are people still getting blown out by DG Invoker? Is part of it that draft decks are actually applying enough pressure now that a card that needs to wait for 8 mana in a color with no ramp is no longer that good, or are people being too protective of DG Invoker in combat, thus lessening it's effectiveness?
I mean, I think the other Invokers are at their best when their base stats create difficulties for the opponent. Dawnglare should be no different.
Just got smacked by one last night...I think I could have handled anything else he put out...but that thing is just nasty. Didn't realize how high people are picking them now - guess that explains why I never see them anymore.
he has NOT been good for me. I think I've drafted him twice, maybe 3 times. It's possible I'm not aggressive enough about levelling him, because I always have other things to do, when levelling would just eat up whole turns, and he just sits there as a 2/2 unless my opponent puts out an x/1. Now, if he's keeping my opponents from dropping x/1's, I suppose that's something, but it doesn't seem to be the case, and (probably somewhat incidentally) I have not done well most of the time when he's on my side of the board (I think I lost a majority of those games). The other situation is when he just eats removal, which has also happened quite a bit.
Still though, I think it's obviously not a straight-up weak card. It's a good card but not a very high pick for me. As has been said, there's a lot in the format that 1 damage just doesn't do much to, even in terms of topping off combat damage. Not that it doesn't change the game, it does, but just not enough really to be worth 2 whole turns to make him a 2/3 pinger (even more to make him 3 damage per turn).
I have passed it before but not picked it, due to the varying effectiveness mentioned above. To me, it's not a card to first pick or change your manabase/strategy to fit in.
edit: agreeing with Cardoc, with ramp I would feel better about it.
edit2: but with token ramp, I might actually rather play Shared Discovery due to the amazing cc, but I've never played that either.
Brood Birthing is the only one I think I don't think I would ever play
But then, you're trying to basically run your strategy around the tokens, whereas I usually use them to play stuff a turn or 2 early, keep mana open for instants, or chump block.
I also haven't read the set, so it's not really fair to judge it much before doing that. I'm reading it now...
It seems to me like it's very straightforward. Removal, evasion...I don't know, any other factors at work here? Probably a lot of looking to draw your bombs to make big impacts on the game. Not so much in the way of synergy outside of maybe "I just removed your creature, so now my creature can hit you." and I dunno, swamps synergizing with Corrupt maybe.
Is that accurate? Because if it is, it doesn't sound very interesting.
Poll results were Imp: 5, Wilds: 7 when I just checked, so someone is for it.
I don't want to enter blue for a (usually) defensive dude.
Totally disagree. In my experience most of the black commons have trouble getting in. They usually hold back ground attackers but that's about it apart from Bloodthrone with support or max leveled levellers. When they attack they often just trade with something that took less of a mana investment. I think throwing up an inexpensive flyer is good for many black decks (or BG/BR).
I mean, sure it's not spectacular, but I think it's often very good, not just a "crap playable".
edit: anyway, the comparison was because Gloomhunter is a worse card with the same base numbers, but lately I've seen it affect games more than Dawnglare - a lot more. Probably just luck I guess. I agree with the assessments of Dawnglare above, esp. about how you can often save your removal against white.
On the contrary, Gloomhunter seems to always affect the game in a pretty significant way every time I see him, because no one wants to play removal on the guy. He almost always gets in 6 damage while ignoring the ground war, holds air attackers back or trades with them, or trades with an important ground attacker. He's great.
Is this profound, or just kind of the way things work? Are people still getting blown out by DG Invoker? Is part of it that draft decks are actually applying enough pressure now that a card that needs to wait for 8 mana in a color with no ramp is no longer that good, or are people being too protective of DG Invoker in combat, thus lessening it's effectiveness?
I mean, I think the other Invokers are at their best when their base stats create difficulties for the opponent. Dawnglare should be no different.
I like Guard Duty and see what happens, but I'm not voting without further discussion.
edit: joining in a little late here and will disappear again. It's a busy time for me. I did read most of the other threads though.
Still though, I think it's obviously not a straight-up weak card. It's a good card but not a very high pick for me. As has been said, there's a lot in the format that 1 damage just doesn't do much to, even in terms of topping off combat damage. Not that it doesn't change the game, it does, but just not enough really to be worth 2 whole turns to make him a 2/3 pinger (even more to make him 3 damage per turn).
edit: agreeing with Cardoc, with ramp I would feel better about it.
edit2: but with token ramp, I might actually rather play Shared Discovery due to the amazing cc, but I've never played that either.
But then, you're trying to basically run your strategy around the tokens, whereas I usually use them to play stuff a turn or 2 early, keep mana open for instants, or chump block.