MTG Salvation

Wouldn't sphere of the suns from MBS + a few mox opals be better than 7+ borderposts? Borderposts are slow awkward accelerants and really take a hit against spellpierce.

Also on the subject of transformational decks etc, I was thinking about maybe having an inkwell leviathan in the deck with a couple polymorphs and a thopter foundry or two. ideas?

I think their argument is that any creature you can stick is going to be good for you for either shutting off luminarch, giving them another creature to counter for summoning trap, or perhaps putting them on a clock outside of valakut.

I noticed earlier in the thread that some people were talking about the quest deck and keeping people off quest. I just wanted to say that you need to LET them pop quest and get their argentum armor and THEN destroy it. If you blow up quest before they pop it they still have the ability to draw into the armor and cheat it into play with mystic. This way you make them put the effort into wasting their creatures to get the quest active and you 2 for 1 them after the use it. As long as youve got natures claim and pyroclasm somewhere in yuor 75 you really shouldnt have a problem with them, Aside the occasional dead draw

I know exaclty what you mean. I was playing against a BUG player on line a little bit ago and he hit a turn 4 memoricide for titan(I had 2 in hand) on the play and I was dropping a titan next turn. After that my hand was pretty dead against him and I top decked a summoning trap and cast it since he was tapped out and landed an Emrakul. I got some pretty nasty remarks after that.

I mean I do it from time to time myself like going against a B/RUG going t2 lotus cobra>t3 jace>t4 frost titan 2 games in a row and I'm having a pity party inside because thats virtually impossible to come back from.

Quote from Adam W

I would not consider 8-9 cards (4 Titans, 3 Eldrazi, and 1-2 Terastodons) to be a "high" threat density, but to each their own.

It depends on what you're running. I run 4 titans, 4 eldrazi(2x ulamog) 1 teratodon, 1 wurmcoil, 1 gaea's revenge, and 4x summoning traps. Plus eye of ugin. thats 16 "threats" that I have access too.

That probably depends on the matchup more than anything else. If you're playing UB control with no Grave Titans or Persecutors, it might be an ok keep - although there is a very good chance you never actually get to 15 mana. If you're playing RUG, Elves, Valakut, or RDW, then keeping a hand that slow means you're probably toast.

You have a point, that hand would most likely have a tough time against something like RUG or RDW, but you risk throwing away a good 6 for potentially worse. We've all had games where we mulligan a sketchy 7, and have a terrible 6 and have to go to 5 or 4 and you're kicking yourself in the ass for not keeping the 7 in the first place. Yes its judgement, but you never know how it'll pan out in the end. Some would keep it, some would mulligan it. Each has their merits.

Terastodon, All is Dust, Ratchet Bomb, Summoning Trap, and Ulamog are all ways of interacting with an opponent. If it's a post-board game, you probably have more.

Thats exactly what I said. You don't do anything really until you start dropping guys. Not every list runs AiD anymore, and I don't know a single person who runs ratchet bomb in the MD.

I mean if you literally mulligan every single hand with an eldrazi in it then I'd hate to see how often you go down to 4-5.

Quote from Adam W

I might keep if it was Ulamog, but still probably. That hand can't interact with anything, but you also can't ramp into your threat quickly enough.

You have to realize though that the threat density of the deck is very large. If you draw all mana sources and ramp then you still have a threat to play, even if it will take you a while. During that time you'll draw into something else to play along the way unless you have a bit of bad luck. And on the flip side, if you draw threats then you're good to go. Either way unless you draw nothing but lands you still have a shot at winning. This deck hardly interacts with others outside of tec edge and blocking until you get your dudes out anyway.

You also have to look at the other 6 and ask yourself "Is a random 6 going to be better than this?" And looking at it, I doubt it, unless you mulligan into the nuts which I don't think I'd risk in this case because you still have a solid 6.

I could just hardcast kozilek on turn 4 in mono green

Quote from Adam W

My biggest concern is whether I have something to ramp into or not. After that, I'll almost always mull away an Eldrazi in my opening hand unless I have the perfect six supporting cards.

I disagree. There are plenty of hands(7 card hands) that I'd keep with an eldrazi.

(for example, just drawing random hands on the desk here)

• Emrakul
  
• Growth Spasm
  
• Explore
  
• Overgrown Battlement
  
• Eldrazi Temple
  
• Forest
  
• Khalni Garden
  

I'd definitely keep that, what about you guys? Toss out some example hands and we can discuss them

If he's playing heavy counters and heavy hand control your game will obviously be slowed down tremendously. On the plus side he really won't have that many threats. How many AiD's do you play in your 75? Those could potentially be very good against him barring a timely duress. Often times they'll basically cost 3 mana (2 temples and another land if you have an eye of ugin on the field) and you can cast something else to bait the counterspell(s).

Also heavy tec edge draws will probably be your best friend against him. If hes slowing your game down, slow his down too. If you can double tec edge on t4 then he just might flounder on 2-3 mana for a while if you get a little lucky.

I realize that all of this is dealing in optimal circumstances but those are the lines of play that have worked out decently for me.

P.S. Grave titan is a really hard card for this deck to deal with unless you can hit an ulamog in time(or the aforementioned AiD's)

Quote from ibob

curious, whats the idea behind harrow. i would assume that it would be a better choice then all? pay 1 land, get 2 off the bat. harrow is the combo of both these cards so how come we don't run it.

also, what is the feelings on ancient stirrings?

Harrow is generally bad against control decks as if it gets countered you're automatically down a land. Growth Spasm and cultivate are more solid options. Valakut gains more from using Harrow via the obvious synergy with valakut itself.

Ancient stirrings was one of my favorite cards in RoE limited but digging 5 cards doesn't really give you that many options. If you're looking for a specific eldrazi then you'd be better off just tutoring for it. Other than that just finding a land or a chalice doesn't seem good enough to warrant taking up spots in the deck.

really don't like it. Its too slow compared to growth spasm for us. Growth spasms token allows you to use that mana immediately for say, another spasm on t2, or hell you could go spasm into double explore on turn 3. Even though cultivate lets you hit your land drops that really shouldn't be an issue for you, its just too slow for my liking.

This is the list I'm currently running and its working out very well for me. Every matchup seems winnable and I rarely ever get flooded with ramp, which is a big problem I had before I switched to my current package.



A few things to note, the 2x Ulamog in the MD because I like to naturally draw them some times and hes usually the one I'm wanting. Even if I start with one in the opener unless the other 6 are terrible, it's usually pretty easy to get there. Kozilek is amazing in the mirror and against control decks because we tend to dump our hands fairly quickly getting as many resources on the table as we can. At first I really undervalued him because he didn't change the game state as much as the others but hes is situationally good like all of the rest of them.

I like the 1x Terastodon in the MD because hes a really solid trap target, and can just win you g1 against most control decks out of nowhere by blowing up their lands/jace/what have you. I obviously bring in the other one as well, but having a miser MD is truly fantastic.

The 1x AiD in my board is a meta choice.

I've been thinking about going -1 Baloth +1 revenge in the board but I'm still not sure.

Best of luck to you

I personally don't like cultivate at all. I only run 4x growth spasm, with 4x explore and 3x chalice because they give you more chance for a t3 titan which flat out wins games. I feel that if I ran more ramp spells than that I'd just get ramp flooded with not enough action. Chalices are so versatile in this deck and allow for some crazy early plays to ramp you up even more. I'd go with -4 cultivate, +1 chalice +1 ulamog and +1 terastodon in the MD(Hes really a great 1 of to trap into on occasion and really swings the board state and is generally unexpected). For the board I'd go -1 slime, -1 terastodon, +1 wurmcoil, and +1 ratchet bomb

KHE is a terrible topdeck lategame. worse than the other ramp spells. Its a lot better in valakut because of the actual "use" of the lands. drop a titan fetch 2 valakuts crack KHE and get some damage in

I personally find that Eldrazi Green is a very solid deck all around. Especially good against all of the control out there right now.

Quote from Redirus91

If your looking at 8 mana then why not platinum imperion? Even after casting don they can still burn you out.

I don't think I'd ever have more than 1 in my 75. And if I did I'd either have to search it up with Eye or just "have it" and that just doesn't seem consistant or fast enough for me.